S02.E04: SAFE ROOM

[smartymarty]

3 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

She was very pleased

[Just have to say -- I've been a fan of Magpie's comments since TWOP. Am flattered just to have you comment on my comment, even if it is to correct me.]

 

57 minutes ago, luckylou said:

Am I the only one who thinks Tom’s using a human footstool and throwing water bottles is a step too far?  Greg’s cowardly freak out ... OK... but he also noticed all the deficiencies in that “safe room” that Tom failed to see.

Yeah, Tom is a bully. Gee, just what the person who committed suicide was upset about.

Greg however is smarter than he knows, and possibly smarter than Tom. If he actually had confidence in himself, he wouldn't have stumbled through his attempted break-up: "Tom, I think it's time that I varied my experience in this company. I also am uncomfortable working for ATN. Therefore I am going to put in for a transfer [better yet, have the transfer already lined up]. If you don't like that, then can I interest you in some blackmail?" Because Greg really wanted out, not a promotion, money, and office.

[luckylou]

@smartymarty  Obviously Tom is a bully.  We have seen that since his earliest scenes with Greg.  My point is that using employees as human footstools and throwing full water bottles is so extreme it is hard to believe; Tom has become a caricature.  

On the other hand, Greg is at the same time almost ridiculously cowardly but still observant of the deficiencies of the safe room, probably because of his fear.  In spite of his decision to use his hidden documents to leverage his way out of ATN, he still finds himself controlled by Tom.  This characterization seems more subtle and interesting to me.

I find the writing on this show vacillates from the heavy handed, as on the depiction of Boar on the Floor game in the previous episode, to incidents requiring more careful observation.

[sistermagpie]

37 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

[Just have to say -- I've been a fan of Magpie's comments since TWOP. Am flattered just to have you comment on my comment, even if it is to correct me.]

Whoa! Thanks! That's...incredibly flattering!

37 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

Yeah, Tom is a bully. Gee, just what the person who committed suicide was upset about.

Greg however is smarter than he knows, and possibly smarter than Tom. If he actually had confidence in himself, he wouldn't have stumbled through his attempted break-up: "Tom, I think it's time that I varied my experience in this company. I also am uncomfortable working for ATN. Therefore I am going to put in for a transfer [better yet, have the transfer already lined up]. If you don't like that, then can I interest you in some blackmail?" Because Greg really wanted out, not a promotion, money, and office.

18 minutes ago, luckylou said:

@smartymarty  Obviously Tom is a bully.  We have seen that since his earliest scenes with Greg.  My point is that using employees as human footstools and throwing full water bottles is so extreme it is hard to believe; Tom has become a caricature.  

I wonder if Tom was upping his bully game in response to Boar on the Floor where he got humiliated. Like now he's taking it out on someone else and also trying to be more like Logan.

What I love about Greg is how he's always the person who points out that a lot of the stuff they do that they think is so important is terrible. I would have been right there with him wanting to know when we could leave that nightmarish bachelor party, I'd rather live in Staten Island in a small loft than have my big apartment full off a loud party when I wanted to sleep, etc. He wants to keep a job, but doesn't envy the people at the top. 

[Dminches]

1 hour ago, sistermagpie said:

What I love about Greg is how he's always the person who points out that a lot of the stuff they do that they think is so important is terrible. I would have been right there with him wanting to know when we could leave that nightmarish bachelor party, I'd rather live in Staten Island in a small loft than have my big apartment full off a loud party when I wanted to sleep, etc. He wants to keep a job, but doesn't envy the people at the top. 

I view Greg as the "Marilyn" to the Roys "Munsters".  They all live in the fantasy world of power and wealth while Greg is relatively normal and grounded.

[Dminches]

11 hours ago, CouchTater said:

I could see Shiv poisoning Logan, once he's done with whatever rottenness he has planned for her.  She was really interested in the fact that Kendall was managing Logan's meds.

I think Shiv thinks that whomever Logan trusts with his meds must also be at the top of the pecking order with respect to being the next CEO.  She still views Kendall is her competition for the job and, thus, analyzes everything he does with respect to Logan.

[sistermagpie]

38 minutes ago, Dminches said:

I view Greg as the "Marilyn" to the Roys "Munsters".  They all live in the fantasy world of power and wealth while Greg is relatively normal and grounded.

Yes! He's not good, exactly. Like it's not like he's going to defend his "anti-racism" principles to the point of refusing the job, but he's so far not seduced by all the stuff Tom says he's supposed to like. I was especially happy to see him snort cocaine and not immediately become an addict.

[Athena5217]

7 hours ago, luckylou said:

Am I the only one who thinks Tom’s using a human footstool and throwing water bottles is a step too far?  Greg’s cowardly freak out ... OK... but he also noticed all the deficiencies in that “safe room” that Tom failed to see.

Are you saying that isn’t totally normal behavior at your workplace? Yeah, I think it’s a safe bet that most people think Tom’s treatment of his co-workers is horrible. It’s especially awful how Tom is bullied by Logan, then he does the same thing to others.

As soon as they went in that room I realized it was just a regular office space that had been designated a safe room. It had windows. In addition to the breakable factor, if someone trying to shoot people can tell you are in a room by looking through a window, that is not a safe room. If Tom were less self-absorbed, he might notice things like this.

[RealReality]

8 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Whoa! Thanks! That's...incredibly flattering!

I wonder if Tom was upping his bully game in response to Boar on the Floor where he got humiliated. Like now he's taking it out on someone else and also trying to be more like Logan.

Didn't Tom just get that job at ATN?  It sounds like there was already an atmosphere of bullying at ATN and that could have brought out the very worst in Tom.

He has been given a power position with more people to abuse in an atmosphere that allows for bullying and shiv is still constantly reminding him of how powerless he is.  

Add to that that Tom is a self serving opportunist, the.chances of him going overboard im order to gain "respect" were pretty high. 

I think him pelting Greg with the water bottles will come back to bite him.  Especially if foot stool guy was the one who committed suicide.

  I wasn't sure if footstool was the guy in the budget panic room crunching pretzels.....but if that wasn't him I'm almost sure footstool guy will be the one who killed himself.  

[smartymarty]

23 hours ago, luckylou said:

My point is that using employees as human footstools and throwing full water bottles is so extreme it is hard to believe; Tom has become a caricature.

Didn't Tom say that the footstool guy had lost a bet between them? Not that I like the prize for winning, but it puts it in a better context.

[sistermagpie]

9 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

Didn't Tom say that the footstool guy had lost a bet between them? Not that I like the prize for winning, but it puts it in a better context.

Yeah, I thought he did say that. He wasn't just forcing him to do something as the boss. In a way it sort of shows that this is the kind of culture where nobody understands anything but humiliation. Even when they're "having fun" with each other there has to be some type of humiliation involved. It gets them ready for the sort of thing that happened at the retreat, I guess.

[luckylou]

1 hour ago, smartymarty said:

Didn't Tom say that the footstool guy had lost a bet between them? Not that I like the prize for winning, but it puts it in a better context.

Ah, I missed that line.  That makes things somewhat better...

[terrymct]

On 9/4/2019 at 4:37 PM, luckylou said:

@smartymarty  Obviously Tom is a bully.  We have seen that since his earliest scenes with Greg.  My point is that using employees as human footstools and throwing full water bottles is so extreme it is hard to believe; Tom has become a caricature.  

I think it’s a sign that Tom is at a breaking point related to Shiv and how she treats him and the treatment he gets at work.  He's can’t lash out at Shiv or Logan so it spews out in inappropriate ways and at convenient targets. 

[Aja]

It has been so long since I loved a show this much. There is SO MUCH GOING ON ALL THE TIME. Thank goodness for these forums. I definitely noticed the difference in the height of the glass wall at the end, but I didn't even think of the significance!

I have no idea what anyone's motives are. It's so fascinating. I'm not even sure about Greg anymore. He seemed pretty happy to readily accept a cushy job at the network he had such a moral problem with up until that point. Was that his whole aim in the first place? Was that what he was saving that document leverage for all along? Greg and Tom are quite a pair. I have to confess, I was glad to see them "make up" at the end, even though it was twisted. They're much better together. "I accept your blackmail!" HAW!

This was the first time in a while that I've seen Kendall express anything. He was so heartbreaking with Shiv. He's been so cold and zombie-like, especially in the Vaulter episode. He's really broken inside. What the hell is Logan's motive there? Payback? It seems so cruel.

Roman must have a thing for older women. He said something about wanting to nail Marcia in the last season. So he only gets off on humiliation? I REALLY want to know what their childhoods were like.

I am SO ON BOARD for Connor's presidential run. Yes, I do believe they're going there. I'M ALL IN. That is all.

[cardigirl]

 

 

 

1

23 hours ago, Aja said:

I am SO ON BOARD for Connor's presidential run. Yes, I do believe they're going there. I'M ALL IN. That is all.

Me too, and given that some of the writers on the show also wrote for VEEP, I think we will see more of the presidential run plot. Because it is a gold mine and fun.  

[preeya]

CONNOR'S "EULOGY" MADE IT TO TVLine 'QUOTES OF THE WEEK'

“I am here as a fellow human, to acknowledge that Lester has passed on. Lester was a man. And when a man dies, it is sad. All of us will die one day; in this case, it is Lester who has done so. Lester was alive for 78 years, but no more. Now he is dead. Lester’s wife is Maria, they were married for 15 years. Now she is sad.”

With Willa’s help, Connor (Alan Ruck) delivers a eulogy that won’t come back to haunt him

[TimWil]

On 9/5/2019 at 3:47 PM, smartymarty said:

Didn't Tom say that the footstool guy had lost a bet between them? Not that I like the prize for winning, but it puts it in a better context.

I don’t think the footstool guy is the one who committed suicide. The guy who committed suicide was a segment producer and I don’t think the footstool guy had a very prominent job.

[Princess Sparkle]

I must admit, I ended up crying at the actual sweet sibling moment between Kendall and Shiv. From her face going from "What is this?" to "Oh, my brother is really hurting" in two seconds, to his "I don't know what I would be for", they broke my damn heart.

[RealReality]

On 9/8/2019 at 2:14 PM, TimWil said:

I don’t think the footstool guy is the one who committed suicide. The guy who committed suicide was a segment producer and I don’t think the footstool guy had a very prominent job.

Ahhhh, okay.  Sometimes all guys in suits look alike to me 😒

[ridethemaverick]

I'm so ashamed for laughing at "Lester touched all of us."

This show is amazing.

[Earmuffs Mom]

On 9/4/2019 at 4:00 PM, sistermagpie said:

I wonder if Tom was upping his bully game in response to Boar on the Floor where he got humiliated. Like now he's taking it out on someone else and also trying to be more like Logan.

On 9/5/2019 at 8:22 PM, terrymct said:

I think it’s a sign that Tom is at a breaking point related to Shiv and how she treats him and the treatment he gets at work.  He's can’t lash out at Shiv or Logan so it spews out in inappropriate ways and at convenient targets. 

Totally agree with this.  My immediate reaction to seeing the human footstool was Tom's need to humiliate someone as much as Logan humiliated him with Boar on the Floor and when Shiv basically said she screwed someone else while he was gone for the weekend.  Then cut to being so triggered by Greg's proposal of an open business relationship that Tom pelted him with the water bottles.  Tom has no handle on the two areas of his life he desperately wishes to control, so he has to take that frustration out somewhere else.  I think it also makes him feel like a Roy because they all treat anyone below their status level like crap.

[ladle]

My favorite scene in the episode was when Roman was watching the training video and he appeared onscreen, looking like he was about to say something, and then... it cut out.  My husband and I literally had tears in our eyes from laughing so hard! 

I guess I still don't really understand the leverage Logan has over Kendall.  Would he really turn in his own son?  Send him to prison?  Regardless of whether he actually loves and cares about his son (I honestly can't tell if he does or not), wouldn't that be terrible publicity for Waystar?  Or maybe he wouldn't but Kendall is just too broken right now to think logically and see that?

[Milburn Stone]

I'm fascinated by Cyd. (But then I always am fascinated by anyone Jeannie Berlin plays. She was amazing in The Night Of.) Clearly, we're meant to understand that ATN is a horrible cancer on the body politic. Yet she, who runs it, seems like a serious television news executive with actual journalistic ideals. 

Also, it's apparent Gerri is genuinely into the phone sex with Roman. He was not putting her into a position she was uncomfortable with.

So great that these characters have dimension to them.

[Jordan Baker]

When Tom knocked the woman (and maybe others) out of the way (what did he say--"Executives coming through"?), I couldn't help thinking of George Costanza at the birthday party.

This might have been my favorite episode yet. 

[Kel Varnsen]

Great episode. I think Willa might now be my favourite character.

On 10/18/2019 at 6:13 PM, ladle said:

I guess I still don't really understand the leverage Logan has over Kendall.  Would he really turn in his own son?  Send him to prison? 

I don't think it is really leverage. He just knows Kendall is completely broken and is loyal because of that. And like Kendall said without the business he has nothing.

[Macbeth]

I loved that there was a class difference in the panic rooms.  

Logan and his children got the actual panic room.

Logan's ancillary family got herded into an office. 

Everyone else was left to their own resources.

[KittyQ]

On 8/30/2019 at 9:33 PM, scrb said:

Then Kendall goes out again to a high ledge to stare down at the street hundreds of feet below.

This made me think about the Mad Men opening credit sequence, with the man falling from the roof. I really hope Kendall doesn't do himself in.

[Scatterbrained]

I’m beginning to think the blonde woman in the show’s opening is Gerri.  Always sort of there, and around, observing, knowing.  

[SoMuchTV]

On 9/1/2019 at 10:22 PM, TimWil said:

Yes, that was the significance of us first seeing the CCTV POV of Kendall walking up to the roof and then at the end of the episode Kendall returned to the roof and a high glass wall had already been installed.

Just now watching, and I came here to see if anyone else noticed the taller glass wall at the end. My thought was that it was in response to the employee suicide (don’t change the culture of bullying, just make it harder to commit suicide) but I guess y’all have convinced me that it was more to do with Kendall.