S07.E20: Confessions

[Lady Calypso]

Quote

ARSENAL RETURNS TO HELP THE TEAM — When they learn of an upcoming attack on the city, Team Arrow calls Roy Harper (Colton Haynes) to help them stop the Ninth Circle. However, things go awry and there is massive collateral damage. As Captain of the SCPD, Dinah (Juliana Harkavy) investigates what happened in an episode that takes on a true crime narrative and tone. Tara Miele directed the episode written by Onalee Hunter Hughes & Emilio Ortega Aldrich (#720). Original airdate 4/29/2019.

[jay741982]

GOD I HATE EMIKO. NOT OLIVERS FAULT ROBERT WAS HORRIBLE!! Hope she dies painfully. 

[insomniadreams88]

I can't believe they wasted an entire episode on that this late in the season. There are only 2 episodes left after this one, and this is what we get? For an entire episode? Really?

We already figured out about Roy and the Lazarus Pit earlier with that FF. They should've just worked that into a B or C plot of another episode. 

They probably want us to think, oh, look, Dinah's so good, covering for Roy, risking her job, blah, blah, blah. But I still found her annoying, even assuming it was all an act. The damage was done a long time ago.

Did like Felicity reminding Dinah of how awful she was last year.

Cannot believe that Rene, Dinah, and Roy don't pick up on Felicity's pregnancy. It's ridiculous. They're supposed to notice things as vigilantes/police captain/etc. I think Felicity could go into labor in front of them and Arrow would have them not notice.

Liked Roy's reunion with OTA. Wish we'd gotten Felicity/Roy scenes instead of everything Rene in this episode. And half of Dinah's lines.

Oh, don't even get me started on the "cliffhanger." That was just stupid. 

[KenyaJ]

If the writers were trying to make me be glad that there are only two more episodes before I stop watching this show, they did a fantastic job.

[BkWurm1]

The writers of that episode must have totally not realized pretty much everyone figured out Roy and the pit madness ages ago.  

I guess I'm happy this ends working with the cops but hard to care when the show is this close to being over.  

I think this was the case of the writers and producers thinking they were being more clever than they actually were.  They could have gotten to dropping a building on the team in like 15 minutes if they'd not drawn the cover up and Roy reveal out so freaking long.  Also, how did the team NOT wipe that pipe.  And I honestly can't believe that Felicity wouldn't have taken care of the camera before they ever left.  WHy would the cops be on scene so fast that she couldn't get to it?  

This episode has too many plot holes.  And they drew it out way too long and there was no real Olicity and DInah was TERRIBLE while faking it but she was also pretty awful after the reveal, ready to turn on Roy even after all they'd just gone through.  

But yeah, worst sin is when we got this episode.  I'd just shrug otherwise like last week.  

Edited April 30, 2019 by BkWurm1

[JamieLynn832002]

They couldn't have found a less hate inducing way to reveal Roy's blood lust? The fact it was an act doesn't make Dinah retroactively less obnoxious. How is this how you choose to spend one of your last 13 episodes? It was 50 kinds of annoying for a questionable payoff.

Edited April 30, 2019 by JamieLynn832002

[apinknightmare]

I guess if the city was going to turn on the vigilantes for anything, covering up a murder to protect Roy is one of the least stupid ways they could do it, but it's still stupid. Emiko just magically happens to get to the security footage before Felicity? Sure, okay. 

I'm glad Oliver's not being a dumbass about his awful sister - that's a pleasant surprise. 

Loved Roy. Loved Roy and Oliver's talk. Shame about the other 50-ish minutes. 

[Lantern7]

Those pillars Oliver was trapped between? Kinda looked cozy. Like being in a faux concrete sleeping bag. Also, you can show that to fans to Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, and I bet four out of five scream "CAESAR!" So, that's not nothing, I guess.

Present Day Roy returns . . . aaaaaaaaaand he's got Lazarus Pit madness. Or it could be a mix of that and Mirakuru remnants. Hey, why not?

At this point, I want things to wrap up . . . this season and the next. Emiko being the Big Bad is flimsy. I mean, she's no Diaz, and we should be happy she roasted his punk ass, but she's on the bottom tier of Arrow bad guys.

[jay741982]

Emiko puts me in a rage. I'm sorry. Shes almost the Cersei of this show except for the fact that Lena Headey acts huge circles around this Actress. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

Oh BOO-FUCKING HOO! Robert decided to stay with the wife and family he already had instead of his side-piece and bastard. There. I SAID it, because I HATE Emiko that much. She killed Duncan! She’s going to make “The Queens pay” for her miserable life? As if any of them except Robert had anything to do with spawning her ass. What the Fuck Ever. I’m so over her self-pitying ass. 🤬🤬🤬

And I don’t care that Dinah’s “questioning” was all fake. I hate her smug superior hypocritical ASS. So I guess she’s the ONLY non uniform cop? They don’t have detectives-you know, the ones who actually are supposed to ask the questions? Can’t have that. And no UNI does any questioning. That asshole should have been sitting on his fat ass answering the phones. And I guess due process is out the window this week? Why the FUCK didn’t any of them ask for a lawyer? To make it more authentic?

Good stuff?

Felicity stuffing her face while snarking at Dinah and Uni.

Scenes with Roy and Oliver; hug with Felicity and Roy. Just happy that Thea is still alive.

This Show SUCKS SO HARD. 🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬

[tennisgurl]

God, nothing about Emiko makes any sense. Why is she so pissed at Oliver, who literally did nothing to her. Why is she acting like he has lived some charmed life, his life is AWFUL, terrible things happen to him all of the time, and at least some of that misery is public record. How is she the one in charge of this ancient organization? Why was her mom still chilling in the Glades if her daughter was some kind of super villain? Why does she suck the energy out of every room she enters?!

[quarks]

Oh, Arrow.

1. Allo, Allo! got away with outright saying in the script that they were repeating storylines because it was a comedy show. 

When you do it, it just reminds me that we've already seen this plot, with the same character. I mean, I suppose I should feel thankful for the reminder but instead it makes me feel that this show is exhausted.

2. These people are supposedly vigilantes and yet they run around picking up murder weapons with their bare hands? 

Oh, wait.

By people in this case, I meant Rene. Never mind.

(though I can't help but think that someone would have wiped off that pipe before hand.)

3. The idea here wasn't bad. The execution....not great. But the real problem is that you failed to convince me that Dinah and Rene are invested enough in Roy and Roy's future and in protecting this idea of Team Arrow working with the city to make me believe that either one of them would go along with this.

Because, once again, the focus was on the twist, not on giving us enough setup for the twist. It's not a new problem, of course, but unfortunately, with just 12 episodes left, I'm not convinced it's a problem that will ever get solved.

[apinknightmare]

5 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

So I guess she’s the ONLY non uniform cop? They don’t have detectives-you know, the ones who actually are supposed to ask the questions?

She had to be the one asking the questions here so that there's taped evidence of her covering up for Roy murdering those two cops. It was a plot personnel decision!

[JamieLynn832002]

9 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

God, nothing about Emiko makes any sense. Why is she so pissed at Oliver, who literally did nothing to her. Why is she acting like he has lived some charmed life, his life is AWFUL, terrible things happen to him all of the time, and at least some of that misery is public record. 

I could almost understand if she'd launched her revenge plan while he was mayor. It still wouldn't have actually worked because his life still had documented suckage and he hasn't done anything to her but who looks at her half-brother in supermax prison and forcibly separated from his wife and child and thinks  "his life is too perfect, I must have my revenge?" And how the hell was destroying his legacy by wearing his suit to do questionable while he was in prison supposed to work anyway? It's insane.

Edited April 30, 2019 by JamieLynn832002

[GHScorpiosRule]

4 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

She had to be the one asking the questions here so that there's taped evidence of her covering up for Roy murdering those two cops. It was a plot personnel decision!

Stop using logic! Let me wallow in my rage and sarcasm!

[apinknightmare]

I'm sad that poor Roy is going to enter into a Mark of 4 agreement with two assholes who didn't want to have his back and thought they were more important in the pecking order than someone who was there before they were. 

Roy has more honor in a singular parkour flip than Dinah and Rene do in their entire bodies.  Remember when he went to jail for Oliver? They could/would never. 😭

[BkWurm1]

4 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I'm sad that poor Roy is going to enter into a Mark of 4 agreement with two assholes who didn't want to have his back and thought they were more important in the pecking order than someone who was there before they were. 

Roy has more honor in a singular parkour flip than Dinah and Rene do in their entire bodies.  Remember when he went to jail for Oliver? They could/would never. 😭

I've decided the Mark of four was supposed to just be Oliver, Diggle, Felicity and Roy but Rene and Dinah crashed the party and whined until they let them have tattoos too.  

[tennisgurl]

During this whole episode, I just kept thinking of other things we could be watching. Oliver cooking a dinner for Felicity, and them snuggling together watching a movie. Future William bonding with future Felicity and Mia. Felicity and Roy hanging out. Diggle and Lyla and Olicity on a double date. The whole cast doing the cha cha slide. Just about anything honestly, because this was boring. I mean, we only have two episodes left, and they waste it on this?!

It was great to see Roy again at least, even with his pit rage. His unnecessary flips and his "your worst nightmare" sense of drama is very much missed. God, I miss when we had Roy/Thea/Sin as a kind of junior Team Arrow, it just made so much more sense, and they were so much less annoying than NTA and their eternal smugness. 

Shut up Rene, you knew Emiko for like two weeks, and you can already tell she isnt so bad? And that it isnt her fault, its because of her childhood and her dad ditching her? And Dinah, even faking being an asshole, still comes across as so smug and annoying. Oh yeah, covering up for Roy, who was out of his mind at the time, is such a moral quandary, but covering up for Black Siren, who just kills because she feels like it, is something to laugh about with the girls?! 

The talk between Roy and Oliver at the end was really good, and a nice touchstone of their years of friendship and all they have been through together. Too bad I had to wade through 50 minutes of boring to get there first. 

[Guest]

So I only saw about 20 or so minutes of this (fussy baby problems!) but the main thing I took from this is why the hell do OTA and Roy get a Mark of Four tattoo with Rene and Dinah when they're clearly not on board with helping Roy? I now understand why Olicity don't tell them about baby Mia because I feel like there's still very much a team divide issue and a lack of trust/loyalty but they really get tattoos with these assholes? Makes no sense at all. 

[popgoesculture]

This was such a bad episode. What was even the point??? 

[Mellowyellow]

So I sat through this while juicing 1/3 of my calamansi tree. After vaguely watching the same trash yet again next week I might sit through Rachel Ray trying to cook instead ( and I dislike Rachel Ray). 

Seriously what a disappointment Beth turned out to be. I'm not sure she has any idea what she's doing and thinks herself far too clever than she really is.  This entire season has waffled around with no point. I'm not even sure they are setting up the spin off or crossover since I don't even see that happening in all this irrelevant content. One of the last 3 eps with Felicity and we get this garbage. 

Since when did our lead couple no longer have proper scenes together but are reduced to standing next to each other? IN THE 3RD LAST EP BEFORE SHE LEAVES.

I'm honestly so cross with myself that I invested my time in this show to have it end in such a garbage way. It's not even juicy fun garbage. It doesn't know it's garbage!!!!!! 

Run Emily run and don't come back. I'll watch your talents on another show/movie/medium. 

That is the only good thing about this bullsh@t. If they're trying to console fans into feeling better about Emily leaving this is certainly one way to do it! I was so desperate for her to return. Now I'm like "Fly free from this trash sweetie."

[JamieLynn832002]

The fact I even sort of care about this annoys me but did the lotus elixir cure the 'must kill or the original wound will kill you' part of the bloodlust and just leave the murdery, ragemonster part? Because if didn't, how was Roy still alive on Lian Yu? He seemed to have been there awhile and Thea was near death about five months after her last kill (and that's with the Damien Darhk temp cure.) Was he on Lian Yu because that place attracts psychos like moths to a flame and he just picked them off? Or are we supposed to forget that element of the bloodlust?

[kes0704]

I don’t understand Emiko’s relentless anger towards Oliver. She wants to destroy Oliver’s legacy but I don’t really know why? 

The show established that Oliver knew nothing about Emiko’s existence. His father and mother both lied and kept secrets but how and why is Oliver to blame for the actions they took?

Emiko bluntly tells Oliver she knew about the Gambit and could’ve prevented it. Oliver suffered five years in hell, became the Green Arrow and spent time in prison and she still wants him to suffer more because...Robert was an awful father?

I haven’t been paying close attention for the last few episodes so am I missing something here? 

There are two episodes left. They’re running out of time, and I’m running out of patience, for this plot to make sense. I feel like the season will end as miserably as it began and I don’t know how they’ll wrap everything up without rushing through. 

[cambridgeguy]

I think they overdid it with Felicity deciding to eat everything she could get her hands on during the interrogation.  Isn't she the one who wants to keep this under wraps for now?  Suddenly stuffing your face with junk food seems like suspicious behavior.

Oh no, Oliver is trapped!  Will he be OK?  I guess it depends on whether or not SA wants an episode or two without any fight scenes for him. 

[JamieLynn832002]

2 minutes ago, kes0704 said:

I don’t understand Emiko’s relentless anger towards Oliver. She wants to destroy Oliver’s legacy but I don’t really know why? 

The show established that Oliver knew nothing about Emiko’s existence. His father and mother both lied and kept secrets but how and why is Oliver to blame for the actions they took?

Emiko bluntly tells Oliver she knew about the Gambit and could’ve prevented it. Oliver suffered five years in hell, became the Green Arrow and spent time in prison and she still wants him to suffer more because...Robert was an awful father?

I haven’t been paying close attention for the last few episodes so am I missing something here? 

I don't think you're missing anything, Emiko's vendetta against Oliver just makes zero sense. She doesn't even seem to falsely believe he knew about her which would at least give her some motive. It would make much more sense if she were after Thea who got the benefits of being Robert's child while not actually being so. It would still be fucking nuts since it's not Thea's fault either but I could at least sort of see where her anger is coming from. This incredibly childish/insane vendetta against a largely innocent party makes it hard to believe she could ever have taken control of the Ninth Circle. I mean, Malcolm's psychotic vendetta against The Glades looks like a rational thought process compared to Emiko's against Oliver and that's not good.

[insomniadreams88]

26 minutes ago, cambridgeguy said:

I think they overdid it with Felicity deciding to eat everything she could get her hands on during the interrogation.  Isn't she the one who wants to keep this under wraps for now?  Suddenly stuffing your face with junk food seems like suspicious behavior.

Yeah, I think they just wanted to remind us Felicity’s pregnant, but didn’t actually think about the fact that their way of doing so makes Rene, Roy and especially Dinah look like idiots.

Seriously, how has Dinah at least not put 2 and 2 together and gotten “pregnant”? And she’s the SCPD police captain? That other cop could’ve said to Felicity, “what are you, pregnant?” Felicity could’ve babbled her way through a “no, of course not,” and Donah would’ve remained 100% focused on the cover up and not picked up on it. 

Or was that part of the plan?

Felicity: “I’ll just keep asking for foods I’m craving!”

Dinah: “Why?”

Felicity: “Trust me, it’ll help with the cover up.”

Oliver: nods

[thuganomics85]

So, this basically felt like about 45 minutes of time wasting until they get to the obvious reveal where Oliver and Team Arrow are once again set-up and made to look like bad guys (which SCPD will no doubt go with since they're chumps), and that Emiko's grand plan is to destroy Oliver's legacy because of what Robert did.  Which, again, Oliver had squat to do with.  Way to place the sins of the father squarely on the son who was completely innocent, Emiko.  I wouldn't mind too much if the idea was Emiko is just purely insane, but I still got a weird sense I'm suppose to find her more complicated than she is.  Which, nope.  If anything, it feels like the show is trying to do their own version of Marvel's Thor/Loki of all things, but are... well, coming up short on almost every level.

Besides of all that, I'm just tired of another variation of the "lets flip back and forth between something that happen hours ago" schick that I feel television in general has done to death now, and this just didn't bring anything new to the table.  So, all in all, this was not going to one of my favorites any time soon.

Cool seeing Roy again, even if it just made me wish we got a spin-off of him, Thea, and Nyssa traveling around the world and destroying Lazarus pits!

I haven't even bothered to learn the name of Emiko's Irish lackey, but I swear the actor was going full-blown leprechaun tonight.  I kept waiting for him to mention his "Lucky Charms."

Yeah, the fact that no one apparently knew Felicity was pregnant despite the obvious signs, really doesn't speak highly of their observation skills.

Rene's bizarre obsession with Emiko and him "helping" her continues to be, well, bizarre.

The best part of the episode was easily Oliver shutting Rene and Dinah down when they started crapping on Roy.  Even if this was admittedly not his best night (to put it mildly), he's still done way more on his worst day than those two knuckleheads can do on their best.

Emily Bett Rickards might be the one leaving this season, but I honestly think David Ramsey wants to check out as well.  Unless he's opposite of EBR or Stephen Amell, he just seems over it.  But I guess the paycheck is nice.

[Trisha]

24 minutes ago, thuganomics85 said:

Emily Bett Rickards might be the one leaving this season, but I honestly think David Ramsey wants to check out as well.  Unless he's opposite of EBR or Stephen Amell, he just seems over it.  But I guess the paycheck is nice.

DR is usually so solid but there were a couple of times in this episode were he really seemed to be phoning it in. Particularly in his interrogation scene - the part were he says “ventilation shaft and ventilation room” really slowly like he was tired of screwing it up was really sloppy.

The fact that this show suddenly is suddenly concerned about security guards dying is hilarious, especially this late in the game. Didn’t a bunch get blown up just last week?

It was obvious that Dinah was in on it (the fact that the camera’s red light was over her shoulder in nearly every scene of the interrogation gave it away pretty early), but I’m not convinced that having a character who seems universally hated by the audience spend the first 40 minutes badgering our faves is a good way to get us on her side.

And I can’t believe they didn’t take one small beat following Emiko’s rant against Robert for Oliver to yell “I was on that boat too!”

[apinknightmare]

2 hours ago, JamieLynn832002 said:

This incredibly childish/insane vendetta against a largely innocent party makes it hard to believe she could ever have taken control of the Ninth Circle.

Right? She's such a petulant baby, I'm surprised she wasn't making rash emotional decisions that ruined things for her a long time ago. 

I rewatched the bunker scene to see if it was as awful as I thought it was initially and it's actually somehow worse? I've decided Dinah looking 20 years older than she should is karmic payback for being terrible.

[shantown]

1 hour ago, Trisha said:

The fact that this show suddenly is suddenly concerned about security guards dying is hilarious, especially this late in the game. Didn’t a bunch get blown up just last week?

I thought for sure the twist was going to be that the dead body was actually someone else - it was ridiculous to me that they were going through this whole charade for a no-name security guard??

[ladylaw99]

I don't even know what to say.  I have been so disappointment the last few episodes.

This is not creative.  They have run out of story.

[tv echo]

Tedious, boring, and too much annoying Dinah (even if she was pretending). THIS is what they give us for the third to last episode with Felicity?!  Beth Schwartz, you have failed this show!

By the time the twist was revealed, it was too late. I just didn't care anymore.

Edited April 30, 2019 by tv echo

[jay741982]

3 hours ago, Trisha said:

DR is usually so solid but there were a couple of times in this episode were he really seemed to be phoning it in. Particularly in his interrogation scene - the part were he says “ventilation shaft and ventilation room” really slowly like he was tired of screwing it up was really sloppy.

The fact that this show suddenly is suddenly concerned about security guards dying is hilarious, especially this late in the game. Didn’t a bunch get blown up just last week?

It was obvious that Dinah was in on it (the fact that the camera’s red light was over her shoulder in nearly every scene of the interrogation gave it away pretty early), but I’m not convinced that having a character who seems universally hated by the audience spend the first 40 minutes badgering our faves is a good way to get us on her side.

And I can’t believe they didn’t take one small beat following Emiko’s rant against Robert for Oliver to yell “I was on that boat too!”

That's what enrages me about This Show and Emiko. God forbid they have Oliver point the obvious and yell "I WAS ON THE BOAT TOO THEA AND I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW YOU ETC. Cause that's showing how stupid Ridiculous and Insane this is. I swear I hate this Character so much. I actually yelled " ITS NOT HIS FAULT YOU PYSCHO BITCH. 

[calliope1975]

1 hour ago, ladylaw99 said:

I don't even know what to say.  I have been so disappointment the last few episodes.

This is not creative.  They have run out of story.

This is me. I haven't commented in the past few episode threads because I get all my WTF and frustrations out in the live thread and all there is left to say is that was bad. That was dull. Why are you punishing me, Show? 

Emiko is such a boring Big Bad that she makes Diaz look...ok, he still sucks, I can't go that far, but I'm pretty sure the Starling City Windows and Doors guy would be a better villain. He's been working non-stop for the past 7 years that while he's amassed a small fortune, he missed his kid's piano recital, and he has it out for Team Arrow. Makes as much sense as Emiko's vendetta.

[Writing Wrongs]

14 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

And I don’t care that Dinah’s “questioning” was all fake. I hate her smug superior hypocritical ASS.

YES. I was raging at the tv even after it was revealed they were "acting". I cannot stand Dinah. And why was an "officer" even questioning them?

I hate Emiko as a character and the actress isn't very good.

I kind of wish they would've ended the show in Season 5 when the flashbacks came full circle.

[kes0704]

7 hours ago, ladylaw99 said:

I don't even know what to say.  I have been so disappointment the last few episodes.

This is not creative.  They have run out of story.

This is me. I’ve stopped caring about the show and 90% of the characters. Waiting through 19 episodes for Roy to finally get a plot and it’s something that could’ve been dealt with in a few scenes much earlier in the season.  

For the episode to work Roy had to choose to withhold vital information from Oliver. Roy really didn’t think to tell Oliver that he’d been Lazarus pitted and could be unexpectedly ragey? Seriously? Even though he’d seen what happened to Thea in the same situation? It makes no sense, much like Emiko’s anger at Oliver over something he had no knowledge about. 

It’s the run up to the season finale and it should be ramping up the excitement level not leave me feeling like they’re wasting time with so few episodes left. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by kes0704

[statsgirl]

The good:

Oliver's talk with Roy and convincing the team to cover up for him.  Lots of good stuff between SA and CH, Felicity eating everything she can get her hands on at the police station.  That's it.

Okay, so they needed to set up Emiko as the Big Bad for the season. But not only did Beth follow the midsesason swerve of good Big Bad (Cayden James, Dante) to bad Big Bad (Diaz, Emiko), Emiko is even worse that Diaz was.

But three  episodes in a row of essentially filler in the final stretch? Not a good idea.

I can understand why Emiko displaces her rage on to Oliver, because Oliver was heir and got the  QC job and Robert wouldn't let Emiko even have money for her own start up. BUT

10 hours ago, JamieLynn832002 said:

This incredibly childish/insane vendetta against a largely innocent party makes it hard to believe she could ever have taken control of the Ninth Circle. I mean, Malcolm's psychotic vendetta against The Glades looks like a rational thought process compared to Emiko's against Oliver and that's not good.

This.  Why would Dante even want such a crazy person in his organization? much less let her take it over?

11 hours ago, JamieLynn832002 said:

The fact I even sort of care about this annoys me but did the lotus elixir cure the 'must kill or the original wound will kill you' part of the bloodlust and just leave the murdery, ragemonster part? Because if didn't, how was Roy still alive on Lian Yu? He seemed to have been there awhile and Thea was near death about five months after her last kill (and that's with the Damien Darhk temp cure.) Was he on Lian Yu because that place attracts psychos like moths to a flame and he just picked them off? Or are we supposed to forget that element of the bloodlust?

Roy said that there was an interaction with the mirakuru that he had been dosed with before. I'm not sure I buy it but it is a clever way to explain the differences between Thea and Roy.

[tennisgurl]

Emiko is especially frustrating, as she is basically a crappy pale imitation of the much more successful Adrian Chase story. She is also a figure from Oliver's past who has a vendetta against him despite him not knowing they existed, both pretend to be an ally to Team Arrow before they unveil their true colors, they both want to destroy Oliver's reputation and legacy, they can both go against Oliver in combat and with their considerable money and influence, and they both have essentially darker versions on his green arrow motif. 

Of course, the similarities are all cosmetic. While you could understand why Adrian hated Oliver, in a supervillain kind of way, Emiko hating him just seems stupid, Emiko has been inconsistent in her wants and goals since day one, so much that the writers seemed to change course with her at least twice, what Emiko actually wants makes no sense, and while Chase was played by a talented and charismatic actor who sold Chase as being just THAT smart that he could so often get the drop on Team Arrow, the Emiko actress just seems bland, whether she is playing good or evil, and never really seems like a credible threat, physically or mentally. Its like they saw how well the Chase story was received, and decided to go it again, but decided to make it suck this time. 

[Trisha]

Oof, the replies on this tweet. I hope the writers read every one.

[statsgirl]

2 hours ago, Trisha said:

Oof, the replies on this tweet. I hope the writers read every one. 

Yikes, those comments are bad.

Not undeserved but very, very bad.

[BkWurm1]

14 hours ago, Trisha said:

And I can’t believe they didn’t take one small beat following Emiko’s rant against Robert for Oliver to yell “I was on that boat too!”

That and all the other innocent people.  I can almost understand in a DRAMA over the top revenge way not saving the man that abandoned you as a child but to let everyone else die makes you a psycho and a monster.  

I think they flubbed how Emiko was used on the show.  They should have stuck closer to who she seemed to be.  Angry because of the past and out for revenge for her mother's death.  They should have let her and Oliver genuinely bond and then let the conflict be that while she does now not hate him, she has no plans on not carrying out her plans for the Ninth Circle and be completely loyal to them.  Then the conflict could be nuanced because while she really isn't interested in killing him, she will if he gets in the way too much.  Nothing personal, just business, ya know?  Lol.  Of course to carry that off they'd have needed to give her a much more cheeky personality.  There were the makings of just that person in the flashback to when she was a kid.  She could have been the frenemy they couldn't control or predict that Oliver refuses to kill. 

Then Rene's friendship would make sense and we in the audience might have given a crap about her or Oliver's feels and we wouldn't have this nonsense about her blaming Oliver once she realized he was innocent of it all.  And it wouldn't have had to be boring to watch.  

She could have still framed Laurel for the one murder she actually didn't commit.  Could still have exposed Team Arrow's latest cover up.  Still gone after the horrible weapons.  Still could have killed Dante.  But she'd at least be a more interesting character and more relatable.  Layered.   

I wonder if maybe there was a change of plans in how she was used.  There seems to be no payoff to Rene being her buddy if this was how it was always supposed to go down.  

Edited May 1, 2019 by BkWurm1

[apinknightmare]

3 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I wonder if maybe there was a change of plans in how she was used.  There seems to be no payoff to Rene being her buddy if this was how it was always supposed to go down.  

Maybe being her buddy is why he was able to become mayor of his lil walled off metropolis while everyone else had to go into hiding?

[Mellowyellow]

35 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Yikes, those comments are bad.

Not undeserved but very, very bad.

 Were they mean? I skimmed through a few and they didn't sound vicious or anything. 

Hard to put it any other way when you have to tell them that they suck. 😂 

[quarks]

17 hours ago, JamieLynn832002 said:

The fact I even sort of care about this annoys me but did the lotus elixir cure the 'must kill or the original wound will kill you' part of the bloodlust and just leave the murdery, ragemonster part? Because if didn't, how was Roy still alive on Lian Yu? He seemed to have been there awhile and Thea was near death about five months after her last kill (and that's with the Damien Darhk temp cure.) Was he on Lian Yu because that place attracts psychos like moths to a flame and he just picked them off? Or are we supposed to forget that element of the bloodlust?

I find that just blaming Malcolm Merlyn for everything, including nonsensical and contradictory plot points like this one, is the wisest and easiest choice.

[BkWurm1]

5 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

 Were they mean? I skimmed through a few and they didn't sound vicious or anything. 

Hard to put it any other way when you have to tell them that they suck. 😂 

Even the few that said nice things said it was out of place at the end of the season and felt like filler. 

[statsgirl]

Most of the comments were what we've been saying, that it felt like filler and that with only 3 episodes of Emily left, they wasted OTA. A lot of complaints about Dinah.

While no one was rude, pretty much nothing said was positive even from non-Olicity fans. Writers like to be appreciated. 😉

[Mellowyellow]

3 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Most of the comments were what we've been saying, that it felt like filler and that with only 3 episodes of Emily left, they wasted OTA. A lot of complaints about Dinah.

While no one was rude, pretty much nothing said was positive even from non-Olicity fans. Writers like to be appreciated. 😉

Dumbass move on their part to solicit opinions. 

Unless they thought the audience was going to love this? Not entirely out of character for this lot who can't seem to read their audience.

I swear though how hard is it to predict reception to something? Even in my limited experience there is stuff that's not going to be popular and don't go soliciting praise if that's what you delivered. Dumbasses.

[kes0704]

I was surprised that they even asked what fans thought but they were very proud of their “true crime” storytelling technique so maybe they expected praise. They’re often caught off guard by the response they get from the audience. 

The problem is that fans are more invested in the characters and the story being told than the method in which it’s delivered. They must know by now that Dinah is a divisive character and at this point in the season, and with the countdown underway to Emily’s departure, fan expectations were high about where the focus would be. 

[catrox14]

I really enjoyed this episode. 

LOVE Roy and happy to see him back.  I totally thought he was having a Mirakuru problem.  Didn't even occur to me that he had been resurrected by the Lazarus Pit.  That was a fantastic twist. 

And now I'm thinking Oliver dies and they might try to resurrect him with a Lazarus Pit but maybe not and that was all just to service Roy's story.   I liked that part quite a bit.

I did wonder if Dinah was in on it right before the reveal that she was, but I thought she was the one that killed them. 

I actually don't hate Rene anymore, or maybe it's that I think Rick has gotten much better in his performance so that helps. 

Whilst Sea Shimooka just doesn't have the acting chops to pull of this role IMO, I didn't see her knowing about the Gambit much less letting it happen.  

Anyway, really wondering how they are going to deal with Oliver and looking forward to next episode. Which is weird! LOL

[Cthulhudrew]

The best part of this episode was Felicity's comment about Emiko's hideout having been used for just about everything under the sun at some point in its history. Meta-commentary on Arrow designers constant re-use of the same set? Magic 8-ball says yes.