S38.E08: I'm the Puppet Master

[blackwing]

4 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

The "negotiating" was not having any impact on Victoria, it was only embarrassing Aurora.  Under normal circumstances, I would just think she was an annoying idiot.  But, with the medical team dealing with an emergency a few feet away, it was callous and shows a lack of normal, human empathy. 

I'd use the analogy of a football game, where a player get carried off the field on a board, with a possible spinal injury.  They resume the game and the players continue to play to win.  But, the players and fans are not going into engage in the same sort of trash talk, that they normally would, for the remainder of the game. and they are especially not going to do that while the player is still lying motionless on the field, being attended to by the doctors.  

I don't think I agree... in this case the game didn't stop to cart the player off the field, and in fact, Jeff told them to keep going.  If the emergency was so dire that it was disrespectful to keep playing the game, Jeff should have stopped the game and then resumed later.  He didn't.  So I don't see why it is unempathic of Aurora to keep playing and trying her best to win.

[ProfCrash]

I refuse to use the stupid nicknames and last names that Jeff so loves. If the people in the tribe give someone a nick name, fine, but to assign yourself a nickname and insist on being called it is ridiculous. You are a grown ass adult, go by your freaking name. So Ben is Ben and not Coach. Dan is Dan. Russell H is troll because that is what Sandra called him and it fits. 

Rick is Rick because no one on the original Manu tribe called him by his last name. The only reason why the Kama tribe is calling Rick by his last name is because it is all they knew from challenges. 

And this season I am annoyed that Probst decided to call the men by their self appointed nicknames but not Wendy, never mind that she had a freaking necklace with her nick name on it.

And Dan further annoyed me with his use of the third person and gnerally being an ass in how he talks to people. Dan is no where near Russell Hantz in terms of being an asshole but he is a self centered twit. 

So yeah, there you have it. Either Probst agrees to call everyone by their self appointed nick name or calls people by their first names. 

I can’t help it that I refuse to give credeance to the men who seem to have self esteem issues and insist on going by nicknames that are suppose to make them sound strong and authoritative. Especially one who throws worse then my son did when he was 4.

[Bryce Lynch]

9 minutes ago, Calamity Jane said:

Oh, jeez, I just caught on that Ron is THAT Ron "Essential 55" Clark, one of the relentless self-promoters always being held up to us teachers as what we should aspire to be, even though most of them teach only a few years and then make a living selling their "wisdom" at teacher workshops.  This guy may have taught  a bit longer, and he did in fact take on inner-city education, so I give him that, but over the years I came to see that many if not most of the people we were supposed to emulate were big, fat phonies.  Knee-jerk rejection of whatever they say is my response until I see evidence of authenticity, not ego/bankroll building.  This guy is not making me think any different of him, sad to say.  

Meanwhile, I always lose track of contestants because I spend a good deal of my time at my kids' houses, where I can't watch, but this season I'm more bewildered than usual.  After this week, though, I think I know who they all are, but I would not place any bets on it.  That blindside was one of the most satisfying I can remember, just pure Survivor gold.

I think he has now been teaching for about 20 years, so I'm not sure he is a phony and a profiteer.  

I wouldn't judge him too much based upon Survivor.  He really hasn't done anything horrible, just run of the mill manipulation and deception, which is standard Survivor play.    

[ljenkins782]

24 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Quote

As for Wardog, he's on the official CBS cast page as Dan "The Wardog" DaSilva so I have no issue with people calling him Dan.  That's his name.

I had no idea his name was Dan until just now. I have never heard him called anything but Wardog on the show. And I was baffled by all the references to "Devin" a couple weeks ago too. There is way too much confusion this season because with two exceptions nobody has gone home yet and we're eight episodes in! Hard enough to keep track of all these people when you use one name for each person let alone two.

I would never have known his name was Dan either since they call him Wardog and the caption says Wardog on the TV when he's speaking. People shouldn't have to go visit the cast page at CBS or each contestant's personal thread to make the connection when it's just as easy to use the name that's used on the TV. 

Especially in this season where there's an unusually high number of "Huh? There's an [Aurora/Ron/Gavin/Julia/etc]" reactions, throwing one more name into the mix is just needlessly confusing. 

The Rick/Devens thing seems to be his own/the show's fault. Apparently he asked Probst to call him by his last name, but didn't do the same for the contestants so, unlike Wardog, Rick/Devens seem to get used interchangeably.

Quote

Agree with all of this.  I don't understand why Julie thought it was so disgusting that Aurora was negotiating.  Because it was Aurora or just in general?  I agreed with everything Aurora said, this isn't the first time we have heard contestants pleading with others to drop out.  As far as Lauren passed out, so what?  Jeff said to keep playing and that the game wasn't stopping.  What were Aurora and Victoria supposed to do?  They couldn't afford to look at her lest they lose their concentration or balance.  She was tiring and wanted to come to an agreement with Victoria.  I don't understand why it was so bad to still be playing the game.

Because she's Julie, who was shocked and disgusted at the mere suggestion of voting Rick back onto EOE, as if they were sending him off to die. She seems to have a low threshold for awful behavior, she's lucky she's not on a season with a Hantz or a Colton or any of the other really awful contestants in Survivor history. 

I think she was also the one who remarked in wonder "this is what it's like to lose a challenge, huh?" to a team of starving, perennial reward challenge losers. She's an excellent example of one who hasn't really had to play the game yet when they're 20-some days in, the fact that she was one of the 4 on the wrong side of the vote this time should be a real wake up call. Based on her over the top reactions to everything mildly unpleasant, I don't think she's going to adjust well to the new dynamics of the "Kama Strong" group.

[Bryce Lynch]

1 minute ago, ProfCrash said:

And this season I am annoyed that Probst decided to call the men by their self appointed nicknames but not Wendy, never mind that she had a freaking necklace with her nick name on it.

In defense of Probst, a) He calls Wentworth by  her last name. b) It was explained by both players and media members who were there that Lil Wendy asked to be called "Big Wendy" after Warthog and Devens asked to be called those names, and refused, saying there were too many nicknames already.   

[nutty1]

14 hours ago, HappyDancex2 said:

Is EOE so big that Aubrey can be somewhere where no one will stumble upon her and how long does she get to practice the tangled ropes?  Does that mean everyone else is still hunting around for the clue?  And nobody is missing her while she is out there practicing?

I was wondering that too?? They don't notice she is missing for big chunks of time?? And how big is EOE? Do they have guards around the practice area, LOL!

Edited April 4, 2019 by nutty1

[Nashville]

21 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

The "negotiating" was not having any impact on Victoria, it was only embarrassing Aurora.  

Well... an up-to-that-point rock-solid Vic ended up dropping first, so that appraisal might be a tad off...?  😉 

21 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I'd use the analogy of a football game, where a player get carried off the field on a board, with a possible spinal injury.  They resume the game and the players continue to play to win.  But, the players and fans are not going into engage in the same sort of trash talk, that they normally would, for the remainder of the game. and they are especially not going to do that while the player is still lying motionless on the field, being attended to by the doctors.  

Bad analogy: when Medical is evaluating a football player down on the field, all play stops and the other players take a knee - neither of which was an option in this case.  Probst specifically told both Vic and Aurora the competition was still active, and neither was given the opportunity for a break without invalidating their participation.  In football terms, play was still commencing and the game clock was still running.

[Special K]

I think that Aurora and Victoria were at a disadvantage regarding the situation since they couldn't turn their heads and look over.  They had to take Probst's word for whatever was happening.  I give Aurora a pass. She was pretty artless in her pleas and it was awkward, but I don't think she committed any grave sin.

[ljenkins782]

10 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Well... an up-to-that-point rock-solid Vic ended up dropping first, so that appraisal might be a tad off...?  😉 

I have to agree. Victoria had her eyes closed and was clearly in her own world until the screaming and scrambling started. Aurora's hamfisted attempt at negotiating was also a factor in breaking Victoria's concentration, but I would think that the medical situation was also a huge distraction.

Quote

In defense of Probst, a) He calls Wentworth by  her last name. b) It was explained by both players and media members who were there that Lil Wendy asked to be called "Big Wendy" after Warthog and Devens asked to be called those names, and refused, saying there were too many nicknames already.  

The "too many nicknames" thing rings a little hollow, especially when Wendy's nickname only involved adding "Big" to her first name. Given Probst's general track record, I have to suspect that if had been a beefy alpha male who wanted to be called Big [Something], Probst would have suddenly found some room on his busy nickname card. 

As for Wentworth, that started on Second Chances when there were 2 Kelly Ws and she went deep enough in that season that it had time to stick. Without that history, I think she'd be Kelley.

Edited April 4, 2019 by ljenkins782

[Nashville]

48 minutes ago, ByaNose said:

I'm more in the desperate camp. She was on the bottom and was the last two standing. Jeff said Lauren was okay and Dr. Joe was right there. If it had been more serious they would have called off the challenge. Game on!

Frankly, I think a lot of the ire directed at Aurora might be more accurately directed at Probst.  Due to the nature of the comp, neither Vic nor Aurora had the ability to look over and appraise the situation for themselves - so when Jiffy Pop tells them “Keep playing!” as he trots over to Lauren, neither had any initial reason to expect Lauren did anything worse than drop and maybe skin her knee in the process.  

If the situation WAS that serious - then maybe, just maybe, Jeff should’ve hit the Pause button on the gameplay until things were sorted out...?  😛

[Rachel RSL]

55 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I didn't get why they were hoping the chickens would magically come to their camp offering themselves up so she can have some food.  Go find them yourself.

They were clearly joking about that.

[Eolivet]

2 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

In terms of why I thought Lauren was kind of a bad ass last episode, the majority of the cast quickly dropped out of that challenge but, despite feeling dizzy and weak, she refused to quit until she literally passed out.  Then, when she woke up, her first thought was how pissed she was that she was out of the challenge.  To me, that's bad ass.

Was it just me or when Probst was there by Lauren's side when she woke up and was like, "That's the sign of a warrior," did it kind of have a " ... and wife #3" tone to it?

Edited April 4, 2019 by Eolivet

[violet and green]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

A selfish ass, or a desperate ass?  Sure, the “polite” thing to do would be to pipe down until the medical situation is resolved; “polite” may not be the immediate priority for someone who’s been standing tippytoe with a damn block on their head for a half hour, however, especially when they have absolutely no idea how long the medical situation may take to resolve vs. how much longer they can hold out.  

If Aurora felt she was on the edge of giving out and negotiating a deal with Vic might be her only hope - a feeling which would no doubt be reinforced by the Kama shouts of encouragement for Vic, but none for her - can Aurora still be faulted?

Exactly. The poor woman has been on the bottom of the Karma tribe ever since she had the temerity to like and align with Joe and Aubrey, the dastdardly returnees, in episode one. She can hardly have been unaware of her tenuous position all these weeks.

Victoria is safely and deeply in with the in crowd on Karma and didn't need the immunity this vote in the way that Aurora felt and had reason to feel she did - she may have handled it more gracefully, especially given the astonishing and lucky grace of Lauren's fall, but she was on her freaking toes for almost half an hour and desperate.

1 hour ago, Bryce Lynch said:

The "negotiating" was not having any impact on Victoria, it was only embarrassing Aurora.  Under normal circumstances, I would just think she was an annoying idiot.  But, with the medical team dealing with an emergency a few feet away, it was callous and shows a lack of normal, human empathy. 

Negotiate: "obtain or bring about by discussion." Or in my Concise Oxford: "Confer (with another) with view to compromise or agreement; arrange (affair), bring about (desired object)".

Her manner may not have been perfect boardroom, or her attitude entirely sporting, but she was doing her best to get her desired result. It's not unusual for someone hanging by a thread in an endurance challenge to beg, plead, wheedle, or weep onto the remaining player to drop out and give them the win - and it's not unusual for the other player to refuse and hang on in.

Speaking of lack of empathy, I thought Julie was unnecessarily carpish about it, and doubt she would have been so critical if it was her ally Victoria who was for whatever reason pleading her case up there.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

I'm still annoyed at Julie for being so easily offended about not playing what might be considered polite in the real world, but not in an "I'm competing for a million dollars, I'm hangry, I'm desperate, I've been standing on my toes for half an hour" world. Go home to your NYC apartment and knit an Etsy-handmade beanie for Victoria. She probably also gets offended when people lick their fingers after a food rewards challenge. Honestly what game does she think she's playing? 

[nutty1]

11 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

I passed out in spin class. The room was hot, 77 degrees is what the cute Fire Fighter said. I felt myself getting sick, went to get off the bike and when I came too there was someone calling 911 while one of the other people in the class kept me sitting and rubbed my back. It was kind of embarrassing.

I read a book that started out with a lady fainting in spin class. She woke up with amnesia for the previous 10 years. If that happened to you, you could forget the awfulness of some of the past 20 seasons!! 

[blackwing]

1 hour ago, Rachel RSL said:

They were clearly joking about that.

Oh I know they were joking in the sense that they didn't actually think the chickens would wander into their camp.  But Lauren was talking about how hungry she was, and my observation was that I find it strange that they all talk about how hungry they are but then nobody actually tries to obtain any food.  We saw Ron just shovelling rice into his mouth.  Nobody even talked about looking for the Wendyfreed chickens (I still am unclear as to why none of them have made any concerted effort to catch them) or trying to catch fish.  I don't understand why they all complain about being hungry but then make zero effort.

[piewarmer]

19 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

What did Reem say?  "Don't get too excited."  Right before my DVR cut off.  😂😂😂

She is hysterical!!!!!!!!

One of my friends couldn't remember the name of the show "Curb Your Enthusiasm" and she called it "Don't get too excited."  Reem is the Larry David of Survivor.  Hahahahahhahahahahaha.

A friend and I were joking the other day that next season might be Menopause Island. All rage and tears, but nobody will fight over the blankets.

*we are mostly poking fun at ourselves

[iMonrey]

Quote

  IMO, the begging for immunity is pretty bush league under any circumstances.  But, during a medical emergency is was very crass, to me.  

Crass? On Survivor? Surely you jest. Everyone knows that Survivor is the gold standard for class and propriety. 

[Rachel RSL]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

Oh I know they were joking in the sense that they didn't actually think the chickens would wander into their camp.  But Lauren was talking about how hungry she was, and my observation was that I find it strange that they all talk about how hungry they are but then nobody actually tries to obtain any food.  We saw Ron just shovelling rice into his mouth.  Nobody even talked about looking for the Wendyfreed chickens (I still am unclear as to why none of them have made any concerted effort to catch them) or trying to catch fish.  I don't understand why they all complain about being hungry but then make zero effort.

I’ve been wondering if they made any effort to catch the chickens or if they decided it took too much energy. I seem to recall some chicken-chasing shenanigans in past seasons. I hope that didn’t happen this season and the editors deprived us of that footage, I love rooting for the chickens!

[Ms Blue Jay]

9 hours ago, ByaNose said:

BTW! I'm amazed how badly David is doing in puzzle challenges. I'm also doubly amazed that he is still doing them. No wonder Kelley looked pissed. I'm assuming he's the only one volunteering to do them? What other explanation is there?

I WONDERED THAT MYSELF.

Lauren loves to be in the peanut gallery screaming at the person making the puzzle saying that they're doing it wrong in EVERY. SINGLE. challenge.  Why is she never doing the puzzle?  I assume because her and Kelley are the only athletes that former Lessu had so they always had to do the athletic stuff.  Clearly, Lauren is a hell of an athlete and Wardog is likely not.

[Ms Blue Jay]

9 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

I'm already over Joe and his man pain.

Are you referencing this famous tweet?🤣

[Ms Blue Jay]

@ljenkins782 Loved your post.  I'm a fan of David's too, but I always have been, just in a very subtle way.  I'm not crazy for him and I kind of forget about him, but I've always liked him.

Edited April 5, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[Ms Blue Jay]

6 hours ago, HurricaneVal said:

After all these episodes in, I only know one thing about Aurora:  She can't read a room to save her life.

I hope they continue to have reason to spend more time on her now, because she seems so weird (like, as a Survivor contestant) and I think it could make for fascinating TV.

I know you guys like misspellings, so I must bring up this episode of The Bachelorette.  They had a spelling bee.  They asked the male contestants to spell "Facade".  And this guy Eric spelled it "Physde".   By the way, people wanted this guy to be the next Bachelor.

I will never forget the Physde.  (It's very close to Phys Ed.)

Edited April 5, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[EllenB]

5 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

I would never have known his name was Dan either since they call him Wardog and the caption says Wardog on the TV when he's speaking. People shouldn't have to go visit the cast page at CBS or each contestant's personal thread to make the connection when it's just as easy to use the name that's used on the TV. 

Especially in this season where there's an unusually high number of "Huh? There's an [Aurora/Ron/Gavin/Julia/etc]" reactions, throwing one more name into the mix is just needlessly confusing. 

The Rick/Devens thing seems to be his own/the show's fault. Apparently he asked Probst to call him by his last name, but didn't do the same for the contestants so, unlike Wardog, Rick/Devens seem to get used interchangeably.

Because she's Julie, who was shocked and disgusted at the mere suggestion of voting Rick back onto EOE, as if they were sending him off to die. She seems to have a low threshold for awful behavior, she's lucky she's not on a season with a Hantz or a Colton or any of the other really awful contestants in Survivor history. 

I think she was also the one who remarked in wonder "this is what it's like to lose a challenge, huh?" to a team of starving, perennial reward challenge losers. She's an excellent example of one who hasn't really had to play the game yet when they're 20-some days in, the fact that she was one of the 4 on the wrong side of the vote this time should be a real wake up call. Based on her over the top reactions to everything mildly unpleasant, I don't think she's going to adjust well to the new dynamics of the "Kama Strong" group.

I can't tell if she's trying to make it to the end with no one mad at her, or if she thinks there's a Miss Kumbayah Congeniality Award.  Either way, I think she's on the wrong show.  It'll bite her in the butt if she hangs on until it's down to her or one of her buddies.  Bet she won't be so mooshy then.

[dstann]

7 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

And this season I am annoyed that Probst decided to call the men by their self appointed nicknames but not Wendy, never mind that she had a freaking necklace with her nick name on it.

I am confused by this.  At the tribal when Wendy was voted out she asked Jeff to call her Big Wendy and he does.  So when was he refusing to call her Big Wendy?

[violet and green]

32 minutes ago, dstann said:

I am confused by this.  At the tribal when Wendy was voted out she asked Jeff to call her Big Wendy and he does.  So when was he refusing to call her Big Wendy?

The rest of the season, prior.

[KimberStormer]

I forgot to mention the other reason Lauren's kind of a badass: she has had the nerve to hang tight on that idol so many times when in danger.  Stone cold.  There's no way anyone could suspect her of having it, considering how many times a lesser person would have chickened out and wasted one.

[dstann]

1 hour ago, violet and green said:

The rest of the season, prior.

When did she previously ask to be called Big Wendy by Jeff?  I don't recall anyone calling her Big Wendy around camp so it is not like it was what everyone else was calling her Big Wendy and Jeff refused.

[violet and green]

1 hour ago, dstann said:

When did she previously ask to be called Big Wendy by Jeff?  I don't recall anyone calling her Big Wendy around camp so it is not like it was what everyone else was calling her Big Wendy and Jeff refused.

It happened offscreen, apparently. Whenever it was that Rick Devens asked to be called  his full name, I think, and Jif settled for "Devens", and Dan asked to be referred to as "The Wardog"... Then Wendy piped up and asked if Jif would call her "Big Wendy" and he said, nope. So at the start of the season, I forget when or who told it where - but "Devens" and "Wardog" were on the chyrons, and "Big Wendy" wasn't uttered, until she asked Jif to say it as a favor as she left.

[dstann]

2 hours ago, violet and green said:

It happened offscreen, apparently. Whenever it was that Rick Devens asked to be called  his full name, I think, and Jif settled for "Devens", and Dan asked to be referred to as "The Wardog"... Then Wendy piped up and asked if Jif would call her "Big Wendy" and he said, nope. So at the start of the season, I forget when or who told it where - but "Devens" and "Wardog" were on the chyrons, and "Big Wendy" wasn't uttered, until she asked Jif to say it as a favor as she left.

To me unless it happens on screen then is 50/50 as to whether it is true or not.

[Haleth]

You know who could really have used a nickname?  Either Julie or Julia.  It's very confusing having two women with such similar names.

I'm trying to remember who voted for Kelley/Lauren.  Ron, Eric, Rick... and Julie?  Everyone else voted for Eric, right?

[Destiny74]

7 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

I forgot to mention the other reason Lauren's kind of a badass: she has had the nerve to hang tight on that idol so many times when in danger.  Stone cold.  There's no way anyone could suspect her of having it, considering how many times a lesser person would have chickened out and wasted one.

She may not have used it yet but I think that has more to do with Wentworth than Lauren.  They have shown her glancing at Wentworth at the end of every TC waiting for a sign to use the HII.  Now, it is editing, and those editors are sneaky guys, but she glances at Wentworth during Jeff's "if anyone has a HII..." speech.  I don't call it bad ass to effectively keep a HII if you are always looking to someone to make that choice for you.  I would maintain she would've used her HII already if not for Wentworth.

It's not like I dislike Lauren.  I just don't get bad ass or great gameplay from her whatsoever.  It seems without Wentworth and WarDog, she'd be lost.  She seems a good enough physical player, but a basic follower at strategic moves.

[Bryce Lynch]

1 hour ago, dstann said:

To me unless it happens on screen then is 50/50 as to whether it is true or not.

Multiple players and Josh Wiggler from RHAP have told the same story about the nicknames.   

Victoria tells the story in this twitter thread.

[peachmangosteen]

12 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

I’ve been wondering if they made any effort to catch the chickens or if they decided it took too much energy. I seem to recall some chicken-chasing shenanigans in past seasons. I hope that didn’t happen this season and the editors deprived us of that footage, I love rooting for the chickens!

They definitely showed like 2 scenes of them chasing the chickens. They were brief, but they were there. I think it was in 2 different eps, too.

1 hour ago, Haleth said:

I'm trying to remember who voted for Kelley/Lauren.  Ron, Eric, Rick... and Julie?  Everyone else voted for Eric, right?

That's correct.

15 minutes ago, Destiny74 said:

It's not like I dislike Lauren.  I just don't get bad ass or great gameplay from her whatsoever.  It seems without Wentworth and WarDog, she'd be lost.  She seems a good enough physical player, but a basic follower at strategic moves.

Yea, this. I like Lauren, but I'm not really getting 'bad ass player' from her. She isn't eating and yet is still performing in challenges, so I'll give her 'bad ass competitor,' but she seemingly has no game to speak of. I agree with you that it seems like her not paying the idol is more because Kelley is assuring her she doesn't need to. I would actually like to see Kelley eliminated so we could see if Lauren really is just a Kelley follower or not.

[blackwing]

1 hour ago, Destiny74 said:

She may not have used it yet but I think that has more to do with Wentworth than Lauren.  They have shown her glancing at Wentworth at the end of every TC waiting for a sign to use the HII.  Now, it is editing, and those editors are sneaky guys, but she glances at Wentworth during Jeff's "if anyone has a HII..." speech.  I don't call it bad ass to effectively keep a HII if you are always looking to someone to make that choice for you.  I would maintain she would've used her HII already if not for Wentworth.

It's not like I dislike Lauren.  I just don't get bad ass or great gameplay from her whatsoever.  It seems without Wentworth and WarDog, she'd be lost.  She seems a good enough physical player, but a basic follower at strategic moves.

I agree, she seems to be getting credit for being a badass because she fainted and got up.  I don't see anything "bad ass" about that at all.  She put herself in this situation because she isn't eating.  She's not taking care of herself.  She just sits there in camp with tears in her eyes talking about how hungry she is and how hard it is.  She's decent in the challenges, way more so than someone like Dan the Warthog, but nothing special.  And as you said, she doesn't seem to have any strategic game.  She just sits there and waits for one of her two alliance mates to tell her what to do.

Julie acted like the girl died.  She fainted, it's not unexpected when she was in the heat and dehydrated and not eating.  She got medical attention and got up.  Good for her.  But nothing that makes her into a hero for "persevering".

I would like her a lot better if she wasn't constantly whining about having no food.  The people on Edge of Extinction have even less food.  She seems to think that the only way she can get food is if she is on the winning reward team.  There are certainly sources of food on the island and in the ocean, it's just that for some reason she doesn't seem to think those are options.

[ProfCrash]

20 hours ago, HurricaneVal said:

Way upthread someone (I forget who, sorry!) said that when he-who-shall-not-be-named-because-he-turned-into-an-asshole fell into the fire in the second season, the camera people and producers just let him do it and didn't rush to help.  That's not really what I understand happened.  They actually don't have any footage of he-who-shall-not-be-named-because-he-turned-into-an-asshole falling into the fire because they didn't have a camera on him at the time--they thought it was just all boring stuff going on at camp so they were following someone else as they were doing something nearby.  Just think, if they had the footage of he-who-shall-not-be-named-because-he-turned-into-an-asshole falling into the fire, they would have shown that over and over and over and over again instead of showing the footage they did get of this horrible scream off camera, and views of he-who-shall-not-be-named-because-he-turned-into-an-asshole out in the pond screaming some more with the skin dripping off his hands that they showed over and over and over and over again.  After that experience, production increased the number of cameras and they keep those cameras on the castaways all the time.

I don't think Jeff was aware that Lauren was in trouble, because it seemed to me that she was only kind of muttering "I'm getting dizzy.........I'm getting really dizzy..........I can't see anything........" mostly to herself and not really announcing it to everyone there.  Certainly the camera person and the sound person knew, and they did nothing.  But I guess you never know if it is a strategic ploy or not.  Lauren was absolutely rock solid up there on her perch until....she wasn't.   And she did fall so gracefully I can imagine at first there was a bit of disbelief, like "wow, that was cinematic!"  Jeff certainly sounded panicked when he called for the medics, and when he rushed up to Lauren, did you catch how his hand was trembling when he was reaching out to her? 

After all these episodes in, I only know one thing about Aurora:  She can't read a room to save her life.

That was me. They might not have had a camera on him but the cameras that were there, and close enough to catch what was happening, did not stop rolling. Production stayed out of what was happening. So while it might have led to more cameras being added that was to make sure the next time someone falls in a fire they get it on film and not to make sure that they have people to help in case of an emergency.

As for Lauren, I think she is playing a good game. I don't think she is all that special in the challenges. She has had her moments but she also is one of the few people with any skill on her tribe. Kelly and Dan are awful at the physical challenges and are about the only two, outside of Chris and Wendy who they voted out, have a physical appearance that makes you think they would be good at physical challenges. I appreciate that she showed a good deal of fortitude with staying in the challenge until she fainted but that was a really risky call. If she falls wrong or hits her head hard enough, she is out of the game.

[kikaha]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

I would like her a lot better if she wasn't constantly whining about having no food.  The people on Edge of Extinction have even less food.  She seems to think that the only way she can get food is if she is on the winning reward team.  There are certainly sources of food on the island and in the ocean, it's just that for some reason she doesn't seem to think those are options.

Lauren is just 21.  She's tall, lean, a college athlete.  At that age, with that physique and activity level, her metabolism must race at a thousand miles per hour.  It's easy for me to believe she suffered more than the others in her tribe, who were older.  I know when I was 21 (also lean and a college athlete) if I didn't eat three big meals a day I was a very unhappy camper.  This is one big advantage older folks have on Survivor: they can handle the food privation better than the youngsters. 

As for the ones on EoE, I'm not sure they were getting less food than Lauren's tribe.  Actually, with Chris' fishing, the EoE'ers might have eaten more.  Also, they didn't have to take part in immunity and reward challenges. 

It's easy to say other food sources exist out there  But getting that food requires a skill set few have.  That is why so many people lose so many pounds on Survivor. 

[Rachel RSL]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

I agree, she seems to be getting credit for being a badass because she fainted and got up.  I don't see anything "bad ass" about that at all. 

I don't think I ever said I thought she was badass because she got up after fainting.  I also don't think I ever said that she was a badass player in general.   I said that I thought she was kind of badass in this specific situation because the only thing she was upset about was not winning the challenge.  And she didn't whine about it or try to milk it for attention, which I appreciate.

10 hours ago, dstann said:

I don't recall anyone calling her Big Wendy around camp so it is not like it was what everyone else was calling her Big Wendy and Jeff refused.

I heard quite a few of her tribemates call her Big Wendy.

[HurricaneVal]

2 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

So while it might have led to more cameras being added that was to make sure the next time someone falls in a fire they get it on film and not to make sure that they have people to help in case of an emergency.

To be clear, this was what I was trying to say in my post.  I think I read an interview with Mark Burnett after that incident where he clearly regretted not having the footage of he-who-shall-not-be-named-because-he-turned-into-an-asshole falling into the fire, and it was clearly not because he regretted not having help on site faster, but because he regretted not having the incredible footage.  He-who-shall-not-be-named-because-he-turned-into-an-asshole really did have good survivor skills, because he did the best thing he could to do stop the burning:  immerse himself in cool water, and he did that about as immediately as he could.  HE didn't wait around for production. 

Now that they have more cameras so as to capture every awful moment, I do like to think that after they get the footage, production might spare a moment of the cameraperson's time to reach for a radio to call in help, and since they're right there, that might happen faster than when they have to run in from the jungle, film the aftermath, then phone it in.

On another thought, Warthog was destined to fail at that challenge.  His bald, pointy, sweaty head had no way to grip on that block, and exerting more pressure by tippy-toeing harder would only hurt and probably wouldn't be successful.  Joe, of the luxurious locks would have excelled here.  Come to think of it, it seems to me that the women who have the thickest hair--Victoria, Aurora, and Lauren--lasted the longest.  I do not think this was a coincidence.  How long did David last?  He's also pretty bald, but I think he went relatively deep, right?  He must have really wanted it.

[Bryce Lynch]

1 hour ago, HurricaneVal said:

On another thought, Warthog was destined to fail at that challenge.  His bald, pointy, sweaty head had no way to grip on that block, and exerting more pressure by tippy-toeing harder would only hurt and probably wouldn't be successful.  Joe, of the luxurious locks would have excelled here.  Come to think of it, it seems to me that the women who have the thickest hair--Victoria, Aurora, and Lauren--lasted the longest.  I do not think this was a coincidence.  How long did David last?  He's also pretty bald, but I think he went relatively deep, right?  He must have really wanted it.

Flat heads and thick hair would have been an advantage in both of the first two ICs.

BTW, Victoria was joking around on Twitter about how her sunburned scalp was a liability in both of those ICs.  

[ByaNose]

31 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Flat heads and thick hair would have been an advantage in both of the first two ICs.

BTW, Victoria was joking around on Twitter about how her sunburned scalp was a liability in both of those ICs.  

Her twitter is really funny. She seems to be having a really good time with the show. I have her in my Final 3. I don't if she could win or not but I think she has a great head on her shoulders and seems like a nice person. She even played Aubry like a pro. Impressive.

[EllenB]

6 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Multiple players and Josh Wiggler from RHAP have told the same story about the nicknames.   

Victoria tells the story in this twitter thread.

Okay, now I have someone to cheer for.  She's funny.

[blackwing]

3 hours ago, kikaha said:

Lauren is just 21.  She's tall, lean, a college athlete.  At that age, with that physique and activity level, her metabolism must race at a thousand miles per hour.  It's easy for me to believe she suffered more than the others in her tribe, who were older.  I know when I was 21 (also lean and a college athlete) if I didn't eat three big meals a day I was a very unhappy camper.  This is one big advantage older folks have on Survivor: they can handle the food privation better than the youngsters. 

As for the ones on EoE, I'm not sure they were getting less food than Lauren's tribe.  Actually, with Chris' fishing, the EoE'ers might have eaten more.  Also, they didn't have to take part in immunity and reward challenges. 

It's easy to say other food sources exist out there  But getting that food requires a skill set few have.  That is why so many people lose so many pounds on Survivor. 

I dunno, I don't think "being young" is reason enough to give her an excuse to seemingly whine more than others about the lack of food.  Didn't she have a confessional where she said it was way harder than she ever thought it was going to be?  That's just naivete.  I find it hard to believe that after so many seasons, that potential contestants don't have any idea at all what it is going to be like.  Some contestants actually try to eat a ton and pack on the pounds before they go on the show in a "winter hibernation" kind of way, like Malcolm.  I think Jonathan Penner was like that too.  And the fat version of JT in his second appearance.

I agree that others are suffering as well, I'm just not sure why "I'm hungry" seems to be her primary edit and hers alone.

I also agree that it is not easy to get those other food sources but my frustration is that we haven't even seen anyone try.  There's still fishing equipment there, and I don't think we have seen anyone even try to fish since Chris was booted.

For Lauren to just sit there and whine about how she doesn't get food because she's cursed and always on the losing tribe, but then not even take even the smallest of steps to try and obtain any other food (clams, crabs, fish, fruit, etc) just really smacks of entitlement to me.  And that I suppose is where the 21 year old personality is coming in.  She would have been perfect on the Millennial vs. Gen X theme since she seems to expect everything to be handed to her.

[Rachel RSL]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

I agree that others are suffering as well, I'm just not sure why "I'm hungry" seems to be her primary edit and hers alone.

I'm guessing the editors have made that her primary edit because they wanted a big lead up to her passing out. 

[Bryce Lynch]

59 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I dunno, I don't think "being young" is reason enough to give her an excuse to seemingly whine more than others about the lack of food.  Didn't she have a confessional where she said it was way harder than she ever thought it was going to be?  That's just naivete.  I find it hard to believe that after so many seasons, that potential contestants don't have any idea at all what it is going to be like.  Some contestants actually try to eat a ton and pack on the pounds before they go on the show in a "winter hibernation" kind of way, like Malcolm.  I think Jonathan Penner was like that too.  And the fat version of JT in his second appearance.

I agree that others are suffering as well, I'm just not sure why "I'm hungry" seems to be her primary edit and hers alone.

I also agree that it is not easy to get those other food sources but my frustration is that we haven't even seen anyone try.  There's still fishing equipment there, and I don't think we have seen anyone even try to fish since Chris was booted.

For Lauren to just sit there and whine about how she doesn't get food because she's cursed and always on the losing tribe, but then not even take even the smallest of steps to try and obtain any other food (clams, crabs, fish, fruit, etc) just really smacks of entitlement to me.  And that I suppose is where the 21 year old personality is coming in.  She would have been perfect on the Millennial vs. Gen X theme since she seems to expect everything to be handed to her.

She has whined a little, but I don't think it has been that bad.  I think a big part of it is that the rice apparently makes her feel sick, so she misses out on the one consistent source of food.  That said, I really think she should force it down to get the nutrition.  

She has also been on the losing end of the reward challenges. so she hasn't won any food rewards, except for the feathered ones that the green haired sociopath wouldn't let them eat.     

As for saying it was way harder than she thought it would be ("That's what she said!"), pretty much every castaway says that.  I think viewers, in theory, know it is very hard, but I don't think sitting on our couches snacking (I like to imagine the hungry castaways can see me eating) and watching the show can really make us understand what it does to their bodies and minds.  

1 minute ago, Rachel RSL said:

I'm guessing the editors have made that her primary edit because they wanted a big lead up to her passing out. 

Good point.  I'd be willing to bet that nearly every castaway has whined, "I'm hungry!" at some point.  But, the editors are more likely to show it when it is relevant to the game.  

[peachmangosteen]

4 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

I heard quite a few of her tribemates call her Big Wendy.

People seemed to call her 'Big Wendy' much more than anyone calls Rick 'Devens.' It's clear to me that Big Wendy is an actual nickname of her's that people in her real life use. She wore a 'Big Wendy" necklace. And it's just as obvious that Rick just wanted to be called 'Devens' because he thinks it's cool to have a Survivor nickname and that it somehow would make him cool and that Probst/the audience would love him. I really hate Rick lol.

6 hours ago, blackwing said:

I agree, she seems to be getting credit for being a badass because she fainted and got up.  I don't see anything "bad ass" about that at all.  She put herself in this situation because she isn't eating.  She's not taking care of herself. 

+1

Edited April 5, 2019 by peachmangosteen

[Ms Blue Jay]

Lauren is so innocuous to me.  I don't find somebody hungry or fainting annoying.  LOL.  That's just part of Survivor.  

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

For Lauren to just sit there and whine about how she doesn't get food because she's cursed and always on the losing tribe, but then not even take even the smallest of steps to try and obtain any other food (clams, crabs, fish, fruit, etc) just really smacks of entitlement to me.  And that I suppose is where the 21 year old personality is coming in.  She would have been perfect on the Millennial vs. Gen X theme since she seems to expect everything to be handed to her.

Yeah!  Those Millennials who need food for nourishment.  That's definitely a true stereotype.

[peachmangosteen]

7 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Lauren is so innocuous to me.

Yea, that's definitely it. There's nothing all that special about her as a player imo. I do like her though lol.

[Ms Blue Jay]

Really?  I loved her finding the idol and keeping it a secret for so long.  Her and Kelley have played this game incredibly well.  They were in one of the worst tribes of all time and somehow never voted out.  I think she's a pretty good player.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

2 hours ago, blackwing said:

For Lauren to just sit there and whine about how she doesn't get food because she's cursed and always on the losing tribe, but then not even take even the smallest of steps to try and obtain any other food (clams, crabs, fish, fruit, etc) just really smacks of entitlement to me.  And that I suppose is where the 21 year old personality is coming in.  She would have been perfect on the Millennial vs. Gen X theme since she seems to expect everything to be handed to her.

How dare she be a starving 21-year-old who doesn’t know how to fish and can’t even be bothered to not throw up her rice! Only millennials are entitled about nourishment, obviously.