Season 1 Discussion

[SadieT]

 

 

 

 

3

7 hours ago, chaifan said:

I may not be remembering this right (good reason for a rewatch of the first 2 episodes) but I thought Judy was surprised to find out Jen's husband was the guy she hit on the road.  I didn't think Judy was intentionally stalking Jen at the grief meeting, I thought them meeting was purely weird chance.  Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, or let me know if I'm right.

There was a brief flashback to Judy lurking in the background at Ted's funeral in episode 3, so it seems likely that Judy was keeping tabs on Jen after the accident and followed her to the grief group meeting. I think she even tells Steve in that same episode that she purposely befriended Jen in hopes of helping her. 

[Ilovepie]

On 5/23/2019 at 10:14 AM, Jillybean said:

This series was interesting...it's billed as a black comedy, but there were very few comedic moments. One problem for me: as with certain other shows, there was really no one to root for because they're all shitty people (with the exception of Henry).  Christina Applegate was fantastic, though.

I agree with both statements! I thought this was just ok -definitely not at the top of my favorite Netflix series, for sure. I think Jen and Judy are both horrible. Jen is just straight up unlikeable. I have a hard time with shows where everyone (or at least the main characters) is kind of awful. 

And I don’t see this as a comedy in any way. I can’t think of one thing in this show that was funny.

I’m obviously in the minority here, but I just didn’t love it. 

[Blue Plastic]

On 5/4/2019 at 9:47 AM, Peace 47 said:

I’m not sure how I feel about the twist that Ted was such a villain (he cheated, AND he told his mistress that his wife was dead of the disease that Jen was actually facing (so it was like wishful think) AND he turned on Jen completely after her double mastectomy AND he got into a horrible fight with her about it that led to his death)...

I kind of liked that Steve was just a minor douche (aside from being the instigator of leaving the scene of the accident), before he turned into an arch villain at the end.  Like, when he and Judy would get into it, and he would grab her (like you see on lots of dramas where someone grabs someone’s arm to keep them from walking away), and Judy would say, don’t do that, I liked that he apologized immediately, that he seemed to be grieving the miscarriages, too...

That detective handling Ted’s case was low key hilarious in the last couple episodes there, but I didn’t know if it was at all feasible that she was just telling Jen that Judy’s outright confession couldn’t accomplish anything.  (There was all the circumstantial evidence that Nick connected, too.)  Is that because the FBI wouldn’t want their money-laundering witness charged with manslaughter going into a potential trial?  They feared losing Judy’s cooperation?

(Shortened a bit for space.)  I agree with all of this!  Ted turned out to be a major creep and it was kind of disappointing.  I don't mind if their marriage was falling apart when he was killed and that neither one of them was perfect.  It still makes sense that Jen would grieve him, even with his cheating.  He could still have had a "good" side.  But it doesn't sound like he really had one since he was apparently totally unsympathetic about her mastectomies and cancer risk and told the waitress his wife was dead.  Also not sure where he was going on foot in the middle of the night.  Even if he was fed up with Jen's angry outbursts, why didn't he drive away?  Why didn't he try to take the kids?  It was pointed out that he was such a good dad.

Steve did seem to genuinely grieve the miscarriages but then turned out to be more than a minor creep, that's for sure.

It doesn't make much sense to me that they would let Judy still run around but whatever.  Not sure if there is any actual legal reality to that.

I do love the show though and don't mind the ending.  I just hope that Netflix doesn't screw it over like they did to "Santa Clarita Diet."  If they're going to leave cliffhangers, they need to FINISH it.  😞

[bilgistic]

@Blue Plastic, I (also) thought the plot point about Ted being out on a random road on foot at 1am wasn't resolved. It was established that he wasn't "running" because of the shoes he was wearing. So was he just blowing off steam? Walking to his girlfriend's place? I don't remember it being established that the road was close to his/Jen's house, which also bugged me.

Otherwise, I really, really liked the show. There are extremely few shows that show women leads being friends and supporting one another. The relationship was obviously far more layered than that, but it was so refreshing to watch. I would have liked to see some (any) diversity in the cast, so here's hoping for better representation next season.

[Peace 47]

16 hours ago, Blue Plastic said:

ng.  I don't mind if their marriage was falling apart when he was killed and that neither one of them was perfect.  It still makes sense that Jen would grieve him, even with his cheating.  He could still have had a "good" side. 

Yeah, that’s exactly what I wanted to say: it was too much.  Let him have had an affair but not been such an ass about her surgery or vice versa.  He also apparently had that drug problem, given the sheer volume of pills that their son found, and not that a drug problem makes him a bad person, but it’s just a lot.

14 hours ago, bilgistic said:

Otherwise, I really, really liked the show. There are extremely few shows that show women leads being friends and supporting one another. 

I liked so many things about their friendship.  I liked that Jen shared that she liked to blast hard rock in her car when she was stressed (I do that too!) and that Judy accepted little quirks like that without any judgment (not that she has room to judge, but it seemed genuine).  And even though it was way back in episode 1, I loved that Judy stayed on the line until Jen fell asleep.  That was great.  I also like that Jen retrieved Judy’s baby blanket because that was the only thing of Judy’s in the house and Jen knew that Judy would want it. It was the friendship moments that had the most resonance for me.

And I just want to edit to add that women on TV in that age range (which I am approaching) are often defined by their relationship as a wife or girlfriend (because a lot of shows put the romantic relationship front and center), and I really liked that their friendship is the central relationship.  I’ve been watching a lot of male-dominated shows lately, so this was a breath of fresh air.

Edited May 27, 2019 by Peace 47

[Anela]

15 minutes ago, LucindaWalsh said:

I just keep going back to Steve saying that wherever Judy goes, chaos follows. I think he got sucked into something just like Jen is getting sucked into something. There has to be more to her friendship with Ed Asner also. 

I miss Steve already, ridiculous. 

No, I think Steve got into trouble all by himself. He was all douche. 

[Anela]

12 minutes ago, LucindaWalsh said:

Douche isn't a word I use to describe men. 

We were shown a lot of peeling back of layers for all of the characters on the show so I look forward seeing what happens next season. I don't know enough of the backstory of Judy and Steve and look forward to finding more out. I would rather it be that Judy causes chaos being the reason for has happened and what will happen. It can't just be ZOMG!evulSteve! for it to be interesting. 

But it wouldn't be interesting if Judy caused the chaos. She was shown as wanting to take responsibility, not wanting to leave a man to die on the side of the road. She showed the records in storage, to the police, to stop Steve's money laundering (it seems obvious that he was going to use laundered money to buy the two places through Jen, since he was suddenly panicking over about $500,000. And I use the word douche to describe him, because his only redeeming value was that he seemed to mourn the loss of his baby - until, wait - Judy thought she was pregnant, and it was no longer convenient for him to be a father. My mother was engaged to a man like that. They do exist. 

The interesting part was the friendship and the family. Women over 40 being featured. They weren't perfect, either. I don't miss Steve at all. 

[bilgistic]

11 minutes ago, Anela said:

And I use the word douche to describe him, because his only redeeming value was that he seemed to mourn the loss of his baby - until, wait - Judy thought she was pregnant, and it was no longer convenient for him to be a father. My mother was engaged to a man like that. They do exist.

Forty-one years ago, my father wanted my mother to abort what became my youngest sister because my father was already cheating on my mother, and it was no longer convenient for him to be a father to the two kids he already had with my mother. You're damn right that those men exist.

[Anela]

1 hour ago, LucindaWalsh said:

My distaste for the word douche to describe a man doesn't mean I am a pollyanna who thinks there are no bad men. Just like my not liking the word cunt to describe a woman doesn't mean I think there are no bad women.  I am hoping that in the next season there is more to the story than Steve is the only reason for Judy's duplicity in her life. To me, her being a a whackadoo because...she's a whackadoo, is more interesting than it being because of Steve. Maybe it is because I watched Fargo and loved the Ed and Peggy plot that I can see it from a different angle and want more than. I hope DTM is a bit deeper than the sleezy man causes woman to go bonkers trope.

If Ed and Peggy were Kirsten Dunst and her fiancé, then I know who you mean, and she was hilarious.  I just don’t think that’s the case here. 🙂 we saw Steve doing what he could to scare Judy out of doing the right thing.  He was perfectly fine going on with his life, knowing the truth.  I think Judy is better off without him. 

Edited May 27, 2019 by Anela

[bilgistic]

A douche is unnecessary and potentially dangerous for a woman or person with a vagina. "Unnecessary and potentially dangerous" is a description befitting Steve.

[CarpeFelis]

3 hours ago, Anela said:

... his only redeeming value was that he seemed to mourn the loss of his baby - until, wait - Judy thought she was pregnant, and it was no longer convenient for him to be a father. My mother was engaged to a man like that. They do exist. 

Do they ever! I was married to one. We were trying to get pregnant, then decided to wait another year or two, and wouldn’t you just know it - I found out I was already pregnant. He was mad as hell and wanted me to have an abortion, which I refused to do, and wanted nothing to do with our daughter until she was 18 (at which point she quite rightly told him where to go, as I’d long since predicted). He went out of his way to punish me as much as possible, and I divorced him. I refer to this creep as Evil Starter Husband.

[The Companion]

On 5/10/2019 at 4:42 PM, SoMuchTV said:

All this Steve discussion is reminding me - what kind of criminal mastermind keeps ALL his ill-gotten money in a joint account with his ex?  I guess the story wouldn't work otherwise, and it does serve to make him look like more of an idiot.

On 5/10/2019 at 5:04 PM, Anela said:

Given his lifestyle, I couldn't believe that was all he had. I wonder if the house he lived in, was  bought with the money he laundered. It seems that's how he was going to pay for the two houses/apartments he was going to buy, that Jen showed him. 

He alluded to frozen/watched accounts on the phone with his clients. My guess is he intentionally had the account in her name too so it would be harder to find. I don't think that was all his money. I think that was his bug out money. 

[dubbel zout]

I thought the joint account was the marital account; e.g., it was legal and what they paid their bills from. If it wasn't a joint account, having it in a wife's name is hardly the way to hide money. You make it an LLC or shell corporation or something much less obvious.

[ShadowHunter]

It was nice watching James Marsden do something a bit different. He was great at being a jerk. On Westworld he is so boring it is his character not him. Minus the movie Gossip I always seem him play a nice guy.

Happy to see Christina Applegate she was great as well. I know she did not become a major star after Married with Children but she still shows up and it is always nice to see her.  

Ted telling the girl he was having an affair with that Jen died of Cancer was messed up. Plus that happened to Jane's mom so double messed up. Wow. 

Loved Jen and Judy watching The Facts of Life.  The friendship between them was wonderful even though lies were thrown in it. 

[JoeyCrown]

On 5/11/2019 at 12:24 AM, SadieT said:

I don't know how similar these are to Dead to Me, but I also loved Big Little Lies and The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel and would recommend them to anyone who hasn't already seen them.  

Killing Eve

Sneaky Pete

Succession

Rectify

[JoeyCrown]

Why did Judy rat out Steve? Was she hoping for a lighter sentence for herself ?

[biakbiak]

3 hours ago, JoeyCrown said:

Why did Judy rat out Steve? Was she hoping for a lighter sentence for herself ?

I was thinking she was just hoping that he would get some sort of punishment. :

[talktoomuch]

Why didn't Steve want to stop when Judy hit Ted? It never made any sense. Judy wasn't DUI and she was a licensed driver so why the obfuscation? 

[SadieT]

2 hours ago, talktoomuch said:

Why didn't Steve want to stop when Judy hit Ted? It never made any sense. Judy wasn't DUI and she was a licensed driver so why the obfuscation? 

My assumption is because the car Judy was driving was registered to Steve's shell company and he didn't want the authorities poking around in his business for fear they might uncover his financial crimes. 

[talktoomuch]

Really @SadieT? Thanks. That is so stupid, show. Why would the police care if a car was registered to your business?

Edited May 29, 2019 by talktoomuch

[dubbel zout]

2 hours ago, talktoomuch said:

Really @SadieT? Thanks. That is so stupid, show. Why would the police care if a car was registered to your business?

Depending on how long Steve's business dealings were on their radar, it might ping a deeper look.

Also: Steve is kind of a garbage person. Leaving the scene of a hit-and-run seems in character for him.

[SadieT]

6 hours ago, talktoomuch said:

Really @SadieT? Thanks. That is so stupid, show. Why would the police care if a car was registered to your business?

I mean that’s just my best guess because the show doesn’t actually explain it, but Steve trying to cover his ass seems likely. He could have also been afraid of what Judy might reveal about him if she were to be questioned by the cops. Or it could simply be another thing for him to lord over Judy’s head and use to control her. Whatever the reason, it seems Steve’s intent was entirely self-serving and not actually about protecting Judy. 

[biakbiak]

The business being tied to the car would also be a big issue if there was a wrongful death civil lawsuit which can happen even in accidents.

[bilgistic]

I handwave that the car being in the business's name was probably a way to dodge (personal) taxes.

[littlecatsfeet]

Speaking of cars, I have a handwave there myself regarding how Judy got around during the course of this series. I don't see that she got a car to replace the Mustang, and for a portion of the story she was afraid to drive. Yet she managed to go to work, to the support group, get back quickly to Jen after wandering on deserted road in the last episode, etc. I'm guessing she used ridesharing, public transportation, etc. It was a point that bugged me a little, but it's a minor infraction considering how much I enjoyed the series overall. 

[biakbiak]

23 minutes ago, littlecatsfeet said:

Speaking of cars, I have a handwave there myself regarding how Judy got around during the course of this series. I don't see that she got a car to replace the Mustang, and for a portion of the story she was afraid to drive. Yet she managed to go to work, to the support group, get back quickly to Jen after wandering on deserted road in the last episode, etc. I'm guessing she used ridesharing, public transportation, etc. It was a point that bugged me a little, but it's a minor infraction considering how much I enjoyed the series overall. 

I know so many people that use UbEr/Lyft so much even if they have a car that it didn’t even register.

[talktoomuch]

5 hours ago, biakbiak said:

The business being tied to the car would also be a big issue if there was a wrongful death civil lawsuit which can happen even in accidents.

Excellent point. Now I feel dumB for not thinking of that. 

Edited May 30, 2019 by talktoomuch
cuz duh

[JoeyCrown]

Did it seem that there were never any repercussions for Julie confessing to the vandalism of that guys car?Did it seem that there were never any repercussions for Julie confessing to the vandalism of that guys car?

[Lamima]

Just binged this and LOVED it. Yes, some holes in the writing for me...but silly little ones IMO. The evil Steve at the end...I don't think that is what the show was going for. I think Steve was a douche and manipulative and a fraud. He WAS the one who didn't care to go back to the dying Ted. And I think Jen understood that and then remembered the neighbor telling her she could shoot someone who won't leave her home when she tells them to. So I think Jen just wanted to kill him because of his involvement with Ted's death (I still wonder if we will find out that Steve was driving that night).

Something someone else here said made it dawn on me that maybe Judy is also a little evil and not as sweet and innocent as portrayed. We see the old guy in the home tell her the truth will set her free and then we see her go to the police to 'confess' but she tells them about Steve's money laundering. Then the police don't seek any charges for her hit and run. As mentioned in this thread...was it because they prefer her to be the witness in a trail against Steve. If so, maybe a calculated move by Judy, no? Wonder now what it means for Judy, now that Steve is dead?

Also, Judy telling police about Steve's money laundering leads to his not buying those properties from with Jen so that hurts Jen. Then Jen killing Steve will hurt Judy. It's a back and forth.

Edited May 30, 2019 by Lamima

[littlecatsfeet]

I'm also wondering what will happen with Detective Nick. Judy was crazy to dump him, and now I think he's a little bitter (can't blame him!), since he went to Det. Perez with the scoop about TKG Arts owning the Mustang (and IIRC he also linked Judy with Ted's death). Perez definitely knows that Judy is involved now, and now there'll be no trial for Steve so DUN DUN DUN. 

Hope if there's a Season Two it'll be as good as this was, plot holes and all. 

[talktoomuch]

On 5/29/2019 at 9:06 PM, Lamima said:

Something someone else here said made it dawn on me that maybe Judy is also a little evil and not as sweet and innocent as portrayed. We see the old guy in the home tell her the truth will set her free and then we see her go to the police to 'confess' but she tells them about Steve's money laundering. Then the police don't seek any charges for her hit and run.

Judy gets the sympathy edit because she is very sweet and loving and guilty about killing Ted. But she has also shown herself to be a calculating liar.

First of all, everybody hates Evil Steve, but Judy is the one who was driving the car. And no matter what Steve wanted to do, Judy chose not to stop nor call the police. I still think that's a plot flaw because there was no real reason for them to flee the scene.

Judy joined the grief group on a total lie, but Jen was the one the group was mad at when she got (rightfully) angry about it. And it's not like Judy was forthcoming with the lie. Jen found her out. Anyway, Judy entered Jen's life on a lie and IMO was only somewhat remorseful. She was upset about getting caught, but also full of justifications. That the grief group bought. 🙄

Then, it was clear that Judy turned in Steve mot because she felt that what he was doing was wrong, but because she found out he had played her. Sweet, tortured, self-loathing Judy turned in Steve for money laundering instead of herself for the hit and run. 

I know this is coming across like I don't like Judy. But I really do love characters with flaws. I just think there was a bit too much hand waving and justifications with Judy's flaws that none of the other characters got.

Edited May 31, 2019 by talktoomuch

[Anela]

6 hours ago, talktoomuch said:

Judy gets the sympathy edit because she is very sweet and loving and guilty about killing Ted. But she has also shown herself to be a calculating liar.

First of all, everybody hates Evil Steve, but Judy is the one who was driving the car. And no matter what Steve wanted to do, Judy chose not to stop nor call the police. I still think that's a plot flaw because there was no real reason for them to flee the scene.

Judy joined the grief group on a total lie, but Jen was the one the group was mad at when she got (rightfully) angry about it. And it's not like Judy was forthcoming with the lie. Jen found her out. Anyway, Judy entered Jen's life on a lie and IMO was only somewhat remorseful. She was upset about getting caught, but also full of justifications. That the grief group bought. 🙄

Then, it was clear that Judy turned in Steve mot because she felt that what he was doing was wrong, but because she found out he had played her. Sweet, tortured, self-loathing Judy turned in Steve for money laundering instead of herself for the hit and run. 

I know this is coming across like I don't like Judy. But I really do love characters with flaws. I just think there was a bit too much hand waving and justifications with Judy's flaws that none of the other characters got.

No hand-waving at all. I was going to point out that the final straw for Judy, was that he didn't want the baby she thought she was pregnant with. I actually DID point that out the other day. 

She was going to kill herself. That was going to be her punishment. You could say that Jen only told her to "come home" because she'd just killed Ted, not because she forgave her. Ted worked on her after she got arrested for taking the blame for what Jen did to that car. "It's almost like you want to get caught". Then he's suddenly in love with her, all over again - to control her. To keep her from doing the right thing. He never does the right thing, but it's all her fault, because she's a mess? Nope. 

I somehow put the rest of my response in a quote box below.

1 minute ago, Anela said:

I think she wasn't in her right mind, after having yet another miscarriage, and then Ted told her what would happen if they went back. She was protecting him, too.

Edited May 31, 2019 by Anela

[dubbel zout]

6 hours ago, talktoomuch said:

I still think that's a plot flaw because there was no real reason for them to flee the scene.

I thought it was pretty realistic that they panicked and fled. There are countless news stories about hit-and-run drivers leaving the scene. (IRL I find it incredibly selfish and dumb, but for a plot point it's not outrageous.)

[Scratches19]

Watched it ALL in one sitting last night. I liked quite a lot. Strangeness in these things keeps it interesting. Plenty of that.

I didn’t buy the ending. And it was badly telegraphed (which made it inevitable, but not good plotting).

Spoiler

The gun shows up throughout. As the old adage goes for writers, “don’t show me a gun in act 1 or 2 if it isn’t going to be used in act 3”. Well, we were clubbed over the head with that damned gun multiple times. Then again in act 3 just before the final scene.  Duh. 

Spoiler

But it sets up the next season I suppose. Despite that, I did enjoy the series and many of the characters.  

[Squirrely]

I also didn't care for the Bambi storyline. I know she was dim, but who gets ghosted for 3 months and then sends a message saying "I miss your cock"? It didn't bug me so much until she said they'd been in a relationship for 1.5 years. 

And the turn signal glass. Where do I even begin? First, there's no chain of custody. Why would that mom not take that to the police? Sure, it gave them something to use to investigate on their own, but it would never be admissible in court! 

And they magically know it's from a '66 Mustang the same day? That was a partial piece of glass or plastic. If it was original, it's very unlikely that it had a part ID stamped into it, and it could have also come from a '65, and possible other years (I only know for sure about the '65). If it was aftermarket, it could have also been used on a '65 at the very least, or on a zillion other vehicle models if they struck someone's fancy for a project. 

I was also quite bothered by the older son's move to Grandma's, where he had recently pilfered a gun! Wtf? He's a minor and Jen had every right and reason to stop that from happening. I gave her the benefit of the doubt as a mom up to that point. Good lord. 

It probably sounds like I hated this show, but it's quite the opposite. I binged it today and hope there is a season 2. The writers just need to restrain themselves a bit and trust the stellar acting to carry the story. 

Edited June 1, 2019 by Squirrely

[SadieT]

Netflix's Dead to Me renewed for season 2 with Linda Cardellini, Christina Applegate returning

[dubbel zout]

Good news!

[Valny]

11 hours ago, SadieT said:

Netflix's Dead to Me renewed for season 2 with Linda Cardellini, Christina Applegate returning

I was very happy to see that news yesterday, it was a no brainer really. I would  have been shocked if they didn't renew.

[SadieT]

5 hours ago, Valny said:

I was very happy to see that news yesterday, it was a no brainer really. I would  have been shocked if they didn't renew.

Me too. I figured it’d be a lock for renewal considering how much attention it received but you never really know how well it did because Netflix doesn’t release numbers. I’m happy though, I’ve been hungry for season 2 since the credits rolled on the season 1 finale. 

[tennisgurl]

Great news about season two!

[ramonaflowers]

Quote

Guys, if you really liked this show, do you have any other recommendations? Doesn't necessarily have to be like this show.  Just another one you're addicted to I guess.  It's been ages since I've liked a new show THIS much.

If you haven't seen the Amazon Prime show Forever with Maya Rudolph, give that a shot. It's a slow burn but there's some dark comedy in there and the cast is so great. 

[chaifan]

On 5/29/2019 at 10:06 PM, Lamima said:

Something someone else here said made it dawn on me that maybe Judy is also a little evil and not as sweet and innocent as portrayed. We see the old guy in the home tell her the truth will set her free and then we see her go to the police to 'confess' but she tells them about Steve's money laundering. Then the police don't seek any charges for her hit and run. As mentioned in this thread...was it because they prefer her to be the witness in a trail against Steve. If so, maybe a calculated move by Judy, no? Wonder now what it means for Judy, now that Steve is dead?

I also had assumed the Judy made an immunity deal with the police when she turned herself in - she gets off for Ted's murder in exchange for turning in Steve with the money laundering.  Otherwise, Judy would be in jail for manslaughter and there would be no season 2.  Jen could easily claim self defense for killing Steve, so no story there.

But, if Judy was in the process of making an immunity deal that wasn't yet finalized, then it could set up an interesting plot line for Season 2 - Jen & Judy have to hide Steve's murder because if Steve is dead Judy's "deal" is off the table.  So they have to make it look like he fled and keep that pursuit alive, at least until Judy's immunity for Ted's death is guaranteed.

Of course, I was wrong in every other prediction I had during the show, so don't put too much into this theory.

[mcgkgm]

I kept expecting them to spell out at some point that the accident had caused Judy's most recent miscarriage.  Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but with her being so far along this time, it's where my mind went.  I thought that made the connection between J&J even more poignant. They both really did suffer a loss that night, and one that connected them to each other in yet another way.

[deSchenke]

19 hours ago, chaifan said:

 Jen could easily claim self defense for killing Steve, so no story there.

1

But he was shot in the back.  It would be pretty hard to claim self-defense.  I rewatched the last pool scene to see if there was any trace of a bullet entry from the front and there wasn't.

[truebluesmoky]

I just finished this last night. I had originally gotten an episode and a half in and then wasn’t sure if I could continue. It stressed me out so much. Many of my friends urged me to see it through, so I binge watched it Wednesday and Thursday. I think the creators/writers did a great job of making everybody complicated enough that you could come out of it still rooting for Jen and Judy as the protagonists. They almost had to make everyone else pretty bad in order to make it okay to like Judy. Steve was an abusive, manipulative, criminal asshole. Ted was Charlie and Henry’s dad and a good one, certainly never deserving of death, but he was a cheater, a pill abuser, and a horrible husband in terms of how he treated Jen after her mastectomy. Jen was dealing with the trauma of losing her mom at a young age, having a preventative mastectomy, and then losing her husband, but she was also prone to angry rages and outbursts and even became physically violent with her husband. Judy hit Ted by accident and then went along with Steve’s plan to just drive away and then cover it up, but she’s shown to be in an emotionally and borderline physically abusive relationship, mourning the loss of all her pregnancies, and a kind, giving person in all other aspects of her life. None of that excuses what she did, but it allows the viewer to want her to be okay. We see both her and Jen’s imperfections and bad choices and wind up rooting for their friendship. I was impressed.

Edited June 7, 2019 by truebluesmoky

[MsJamieDornan]

In my wandering mind, I was thinking Steve might have had something to do with Ed Asner's death. Wacky , I know.

[Calamity Jane]

My daughter-in-law strongly encouraged me to watch this.  It had me at the first scene - brought back the memories of being inundated with meals from well-meaning friends after my husband passed away 25 years ago, people who just wanted to do something to show they cared but brought food my kids wouldn't eat, in pans they wanted back, stayed a little too long.  You can't be mad, but it can be maddening all the same. Keeping track of the pans was overwhelming in the chaos you go through right after a death - so many things to take care of: funeral arrangements, flowers for it, accounts to close or change the name on, life insurance to think about, social security to deal with, etc., etc., etc., and remembering whose pan was whose was a nightmare.  

Anyway, watched it all in one day.  Well-written, two of my favorite actors, twisty plot - what more could one ask for?  I really think those two could easily have switched roles and been convincing, too.  Linda Cardellini can play a character with sharp edges, and Christina Applegate could easily be the softer (still with hidden depths) of the two.  I'll be interested to see what they do with a second season.  

[chaifan]

On 6/8/2019 at 2:11 AM, MsJamieDornan said:

In my wandering mind, I was thinking Steve might have had something to do with Ed Asner's death. Wacky , I know.

Not that wacky, as I had the same thought.  It was weird to have made such a point out of Asner's character overhearing Steve & Judy's conversation, then do nothing with it. 

[MsJamieDornan]

45 minutes ago, chaifan said:

It was weird to have made such a point out of Asner's character overhearing Steve & Judy's conversation, then do nothing with it. 

Yes! And, if Steve wanted to make Judy miserable for screwing him over, that would be the way to do it.

[SadieT]

I don't think there was anything suspicious about Abe's death. I think Abe served as a sort of family figure for Judy and someone who eventually did know her deepest secret but didn't think less of her for it. I think Abe's death was more about getting Judy to her lowest point. She loses not only Jen and the boys once the truth unravels, but then finds out she's lost Abe as well and as we see becomes truly despondent and ready to end her life.