Supernatural Ending

[Lastcall]

40 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Dang, I didn't think they would be that forthright about it. It really makes me wonder if they considered trying a new showrunner. I mean Steve Yockey had a handle on all the characters IMO. Hmmm.

ETA..Jensen is wearing Dean's murder shirt combo. LOL

I’m sure Jensen talked to Pedowitz about the options but it isn’t realistic at this point. The CW is in turmoil right now, the just replaced show runners on Flash and Charmed, Arrow is ending and there are rumors that legends and Supergirl are going next year. On top of that, it’s not just Dabb. They need to get rid of Berrens, Perez, the Duo and Singer to get the show back on track. All the old talent are running there own shows so that leaves Yockey. I don’t know if J2 would like another first time show runner after Gamble and Dabb. Then there is the perception that the show is on its last legs. I can’t see J2 agreeing to sign anything longer then two years at a time so it would be hard to get quality talent that have better chances of long term employment on younger shows.

The time to save the show was 12b when it was obvious what Dabbs intentions were. Everyone just took for granted that the show would go on with good ratings no matter how bad the writing was. The real sad part is the show is ending not because of the fans, the ratings or even J2 wanting to leave. The show is ending from creative bankruptcy.

[PAForrest]

9 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

More proof they aren't happy with the writing this season.   They said they've already been invited to storyboard with the writers.

This is what I wanted to hear, that they would be actively involved in the creative process this last season. In other words, they want to see their characters go out on a high note and they're not even a little confident in the showrunning/writing as it stands now to deliver that endgame without their input. Good for them. I feel a little more positive after hearing this.

As for everything else, from 'the writing's on the wall' to 'putting down a beloved dog', wow. That last one from Jared is particularly harsh. I'm amazed they went for the writing jugular and didn't simply pay the standard, 'more time with family, yada, yada, yada,' lip service. I think they want the fans to know they haven't been happy, and if they were happy, there might be another season or two.

I never had any doubt that it was their decision and not the CW's. Yes, the CW is in a world of hurt right now, and I'm sure losing Supernatural is the very last thing they wanted or needed.

[ILoveReading]

9 minutes ago, PAForrest said:

This is what I wanted to hear, that they would be actively involved in the creative process this last season. In other words, they want to see their characters go out on a high note and they're not even a little confident in the showrunning/writing as it stands now to deliver that endgame without their input. Good for them. I feel a little more positive after hearing this.

As for everything else, from 'the writing's on the wall' to 'putting down a beloved dog', wow. That last one from Jared is particularly harsh. I'm amazed they went for the writing jugular and didn't simply pay the standard, 'more time with family, yada, yada, yada,' lip service. I think they want the fans to know they haven't been happy, and if they were happy, there might be another season or two.

I never had any doubt that it was their decision and not the CW's. Yes, the CW is in a world of hurt right now, and I'm sure losing Supernatural is the very last thing they wanted or needed.

I think its also telling that Jensen said, "I don't know if they'll listen and we're prepared for that."

They don't seem to have much confidence in Dabb,

Edited March 31, 2019 by ILoveReading

[Lastcall]

1 minute ago, ILoveReading said:

I think its also telling that Jensen said, "I don't know if they'll listen and we're prepared for that."

They don't seem to have much confidence in Dabb,

This was literally everything I wanted from this con and more. I had hopes that Jensen’s little comments of hope were leading somewhere and this is more then I could have asked for. It’s amazing, after YEARS, I have real hope for this show. It would be hilarious if this was why Dabb didn’t show at the 300th party. His worst nightmare, Jensen with script approval.

[gonzosgirrl]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

ETA..Jensen is wearing Dean's murder shirt combo. LOL

Appropriate since he just drove a bus over Dabb (IMO of course).

I'm not proud of how much schadenfreude I'm feeling at the moment.

[SueB]

I’m so proud of those boys!   And pleased with how they handled this.  It’s clear they think the writing is running out of gas.  And good on them for simultaneously not belittling anyone while also not covering.  

Of course I don’t see there comments as being spoken at the same level of viciousness others do, but good on them for not leaving this up to a bunch of random speculation.   They’ve always said that when they felt the quality was slipping, they’d call the end.  

So, no secret other career moves.  No threats of someone breaking their contract early.  They saw the show’s trajectory and decided they couldn’t see a path where they’d sign on for two more years.  And again, timing was driven by the boys to give the show sufficient time to wrap it up.  

The leadership these guys are exhibiting is just outstanding.  I feel very lucky to be in the fandom.  And I’m also very glad they have been invited to storyboard.  This is THEIR show and they should have a strong voice in how it ends.  

ETA: Compare this ending with Arrow.  Clearly they didn’t have the cast contracts in place for Arrow to have the same level of exit control.

Spoiler

 And now Arrow lost their lead female character.

Rough exit for that show compared to what we are facing. 

Edited April 1, 2019 by SueB
Comparison add

[Bergamot]

1 hour ago, PAForrest said:

This is what I wanted to hear, that they would be actively involved in the creative process this last season. In other words, they want to see their characters go out on a high note and they're not even a little confident in the showrunning/writing as it stands now to deliver that endgame without their input. Good for them. I feel a little more positive after hearing this.

I agree! Good for them! I think after all these years, with all the work they've put into their characters, they have earned the right to ask for this kind of input. I am glad to hear this.

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

I think its also telling that Jensen said, "I don't know if they'll listen and we're prepared for that."

They don't seem to have much confidence in Dabb

The thought that they might not even be listened to, on the other hand, makes me angry. What possible excuse could Dabb et al. have for refusing to listen? Because their ideas might not be any good? Sorry, but I don't think they could be any worse than some of the ideas that the writers themselves have come up with. Because Dabb wants the final season to focus only on Jack and Nickifer? Oh, yeah, it certainly would be a shame if that didn't happen.

And yes, I agree that it is very telling that Jensen would even say this, because I don't believe he would have mentioned it unless he thought it was a possibility, and I cannot think of a single good excuse for it to happen.

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, SueB said:

So, no secret other career moves.

Oh you'll not convince he doesn't have something else in mind.  I'm a lost cause on this point LOL

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, SueB said:

Rough exit for that show compared to what we are facing. 

Spoiler

Big difference with EBR. She signed on for a play expecting s7 to be the final season.  I don't think it's anything shady on Arrow at all. 

[Lastcall]

1 hour ago, Bergamot said:

And yes, I agree that it is very telling that Jensen would even say this, because I don't believe he would have mentioned it unless he thought it was a possibility, and I cannot think of a single good excuse for it to happen.

There is no bigger Dean fan than Jensen. Not only does he see what is happening behind the scenes but I’m sure he has gotten an earful from the fandom. He knows how upset some of us are and he found a way to let us know that he is stepping in and he will not let them screw over Dean. That’s all I needed to hear. I trust Jensen and for the first time, in a long time, I’m excited about the new season.

[PAForrest]

8 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Oh you'll not convince he doesn't have something else in mind.  I'm a lost cause on this point LOL

There's no reason to believe Jensen isn't looking toward future projects, because it would be foolish for him not to be if he wants to keep acting. And he's always indicated that he does. In fact, he can start looking a lot more actively sooner than later.

[SueB]

59 minutes ago, PAForrest said:

There's no reason to believe Jensen isn't looking toward future projects, because it would be foolish for him not to be if he wants to keep acting. And he's always indicated that he does. In fact, he can start looking a lot more actively sooner than later.

I absolutely believe he is looking for future projects — I just don’t think he has one lined up as a motivation to end at S15.  

[gonzosgirrl]

10 minutes ago, SueB said:

I absolutely believe he is looking for future projects — I just don’t think he has one lined up as a motivation to end at S15.

I think the odds are better that he does than that he doesn't. He seems to be a pretty thoughtful and forward thinking guy.  I'd bet money he's got some irons in the fire before taking that left turn. 

And if he doesn't, it's even more telling of just how frustrating the writing has been and how very little faith they had in it getting better, that they would choose to end it rather than go on with the status quo. 

[Myrelle]

6 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I think the odds are better that he does than that he doesn't. He seems to be a pretty thoughtful and forward thinking guy.  I'd bet money he's got some irons in the fire before taking that left turn

IA.

[SueB]

1 hour ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I think the odds are better that he does than that he doesn't. He seems to be a pretty thoughtful and forward thinking guy.  I'd bet money he's got some irons in the fire before taking that left turn. 

And if he doesn't, it's even more telling of just how frustrating the writing has been and how very little faith they had in it getting better, that they would choose to end it rather than go on with the status quo. 

I guess we're splitting hairs -- so I just want to be clear - I don't think another specific project CAUSED him to want to stop.  I think it IS the writing and a desire to see what gas he has in his own career tank.  And I fully expect him to look.  Just that he didn't go to Jared and say "I want to take X project, let's end at S15." or equivalent conversation.  I could be wrong, but I think it was a 'family decision' (i.e. Padackles plue Misha).

[Pondlass1]

I would think there are plenty of casting agents ready to sign up Jensen.  Hope he gets something marvellous and worthy of his talents.  I think many of us here have ideas for his next character. LOL

I won't be surprised if Jared decides to take a year or two off with his family.

But Jensen has the thirst and will be looking for a challenge  I'd think.  His management will be busy taking and making  calls.

Season 15 will be interesting.  The Js will have a lot more pull it seems.  I wonder how Dabb feels about that?  He's not gonna like it I fear. Will he stick around? Too bad Kripke isn't available.  He has the passion and would work with the Js for a  sensational goodbye year.

 I really want this series to go out on a memorable high.

[catrox14]

42 minutes ago, SueB said:

Just that he didn't go to Jared and say "I want to take X project, let's end at S15." or equivalent conversation.  I could be wrong, but I think it was a 'family decision' (i.e. Padackles plue Misha). 

  If he had the opportunity to do something big again, like Deadpool, which he couldn't do because of scheduling, (IMO a bit he was disappointed over it)...and he had no faith that the writing would be better for Dean and the show in general, at the beginning of this season, then i could see him going to Jared and Misha, and saying this is an opportunity I can't pass up, they wouldn't say no to him. And if they also have been unhappy with the writing and want to do other things, then it could easily be called a community decision. Especially if whatever role he got has to he kept quiet for reasons.

So it's really not that outlandish a theory as you seem to be suggesting. And I could be totally wrong which still doesn't make the speculation and theorizing unreasonable.

Edited April 1, 2019 by catrox14

[Myrelle]

2 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

  If he had the opportunity to do something big again, like Deadpool, which he couldn't do because of scheduling, (IMO a bit he was disappointed over it)...and he had no faith that the writing would be better for Dean and the show in general, at the beginning of this season, then i could see him going to Jared and Misha, and saying this is an opportunity I can't pass up, they wouldn't say no to him. And if they also have been unhappy with the writing and want to do other things, then it could easily be called a community decision. Especially if whatever role he got has to he kept quiet for reasons.

So it's really not that outlandish a theory as you seem to think.

Yeah, I'm going to agree with you wholeheartedly on this very theory catrox. And I'm actually thinking that some kind of an announcement might possibly be forthcoming in the near future concerning it.

Time will tell, but *fingers crossed* for it right along with you. 😉

[catrox14]

40 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

Season 15 will be interesting.  The Js will have a lot more pull it seems.  I wonder how Dabb feels about that?  He's not gonna like it I fear. Will he stick around? Too bad Kripke isn't available.  He has the passion and would work with the Js for a  sensational goodbye year.

If Steve Yockey is around I would he okay with him being head writer. His episodes in general were well crafted minus a couple of missteps.

[sarthaz]

24 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

If Steve Yockey is around I would he okay with him being head writer. His episodes in general were well crafted minus a couple of missteps.

At this point, I'd take anyone over Dabb. He's displayed an almost dislike for the characters, like he's intentionally trying to break everything, and the last thing I want to see is him auditioning for his next job. I'll take any human* willing to do the job.

* Buckleming are monsters, likely one of Eve's experiments

[SueB]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

  If he had the opportunity to do something big again, like Deadpool, which he couldn't do because of scheduling, (IMO a bit he was disappointed over it)...and he had no faith that the writing would be better for Dean and the show in general, at the beginning of this season, then i could see him going to Jared and Misha, and saying this is an opportunity I can't pass up, they wouldn't say no to him. And if they also have been unhappy with the writing and want to do other things, then it could easily be called a community decision. Especially if whatever role he got has to he kept quiet for reasons.

So it's really not that outlandish a theory as you seem to be suggesting. And I could be totally wrong which still doesn't make the speculation and theorizing unreasonable.

I never said it was?  Not sure why you think "no secret career move" = outlandish or unreasonable.  But if you do, please add the silent "IMO" in front of my statement.  As it was IMO. 

Edited April 1, 2019 by SueB

[Jonesy]

I just think J2M as a group have been thinking about a good exit for a while--why they were mentioning 300 as possible.   Don't think it's an axe against the show--it's just time after a very long 15 years...an amazingly long time to do a TV show.

[ukgirl71]

Sorry for being thick, but what role was Jensen offered in Deadpool?

[Myrelle]

Ajax. The Villain, I believe. 

And he wanted to do it, but they couldn't get around the conflicted filming schedules for the movie and his role in Supernatural.

[gonzosgirrl]

2 hours ago, Jakes said:

I just think J2M as a group have been thinking about a good exit for a while--why they were mentioning 300 as possible.   Don't think it's an axe against the show--it's just time after a very long 15 years...an amazingly long time to do a TV show.

I won't argue they may have been thinking about it for a while, but I think if that were all it was there would not have been any mention of needing to be involved in the creative side for the last season. IMO there is more than enough reason to believe that their, or at least Jensen's, decision wasn't hurried along by the results of Dabb's tenure. In my opinion, the guy who tweeted his excitement about Michael and and new challenge last spring had no intention of ending things just a few months later. And there is evidence that it might very well have ended with this season, so I believe that some creative control is the reason there is going to be a full S15.

[FlickChick]

1 hour ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I won't argue they may have been thinking about it for a while, but I think if that were all it was there would not have been any mention of needing to be involved in the creative side for the last season. IMO there is more than enough reason to believe that their, or at least Jensen's, decision wasn't hurried along by the results of Dabb's tenure. In my opinion, the guy who tweeted his excitement about Michael and and new challenge last spring had no intention of ending things just a few months later. And there is evidence that it might very well have ended with this season, so I believe that some creative control is the reason there is going to be a full S15.

Regarding bolded. Jensen has said that they want story input in next season, but he also said that he wasn't sure that they would listen and that he and Jared were prepared for that possibility. So based on that, I'm not sure what creative control they really have. They haven't mentioned "producers' credit", just that they've been invited to the story-boarding. Frankly, I'm more concerned about even more retaliation from Dabb after what's been said to the public so far. There has to be a real reason why the MichaelDean storyline was never developed, that Dabb didn't show for the 300th party, and why (IMO) he has given less and less to Jensen/Dean this season. Don't get me wrong, I love what's coming out of Vegas, everyone's enthusiasm about next season with what's been said, I'm just afraid that if Dabb stays as showrunner, and the guys don't get "producer" status, that despite their best efforts, in won't matter in the end. And Dabb will stick it to them (and the fans) for one last time. Oh Chuck, I hope I'm wrong.

[Lemuria]

41 minutes ago, FlickChick said:

Jensen has said that they want story input in next season, but he also said that he wasn't sure that they would listen and that he and Jared were prepared for that possibility. So based on that, I'm not sure what creative control they really have. They haven't mentioned "producers' credit", just that they've been invited to the story-boarding.

I'm fairly sure they weren't invited to the storyboarding by Dabb.  Which suggests to me it was by Pedowitz.

As for JA and JP being "prepared for 'they' [READ: Dabb] not listening," well, that could mean they know they could end up out in the cold and ignored, and they'll accept it. 

Or, it could mean, that they "prepared" for it by putting Pedowitz on speed dial!  I don't think they're going to have any problem going right over Dabb's head next season.  

Edited April 1, 2019 by Lemuria

[Lastcall]

38 minutes ago, Lemuria said:

I'm fairly sure they weren't invited to the storyboarding by Dabb.  Which suggests to me it was by Pedowitz.

As for JA and JP being "prepared for 'they' [READ: Dabb] not listening," well, that could mean they know they could end up out in the cold and ignored, and they'll accept it. 

Or, it could mean, that they "prepared" for it by putting Pedowitz on speed dial!  I don't think they're going to have any problem going right over Dabb's head next season.  

I took it as they were prepared for Dabb to blow them off and when he does, they will take care of it. I bet they have already talked to Pedowitz about this which is why they are so optimistic and we barely hear anything from Dabb anymore. 

[Casseiopeia]

3 hours ago, FlickChick said:

Regarding bolded. Jensen has said that they want story input in next season, but he also said that he wasn't sure that they would listen and that he and Jared were prepared for that possibility. So based on that, I'm not sure what creative control they really have. They haven't mentioned "producers' credit", just that they've been invited to the story-boarding. Frankly, I'm more concerned about even more retaliation from Dabb after what's been said to the public so far. There has to be a real reason why the MichaelDean storyline was never developed, that Dabb didn't show for the 300th party, and why (IMO) he has given less and less to Jensen/Dean this season. Don't get me wrong, I love what's coming out of Vegas, everyone's enthusiasm about next season with what's been said, I'm just afraid that if Dabb stays as showrunner, and the guys don't get "producer" status, that despite their best efforts, in won't matter in the end. And Dabb will stick it to them (and the fans) for one last time. Oh Chuck, I hope I'm wrong.

I'm not sure the guys have any leverage now.  They are ending the show.  They are the ones walking away.  I don't know why anyone (Pedowitz or Roth and certainly not Dabb) would really care about any input from the J's into the final season.  The CW will continue on without Supernatural as will Warner Brothers.  I can't see any financial benefit for either the network or the studio to make sure the stars are happy anymore.

In three and half years Dabb hasn't given a rat's ass about anything Jared and Jensen might want.  They just put him out of a job, why would he listen to them now.

[DeeDee79]

6 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

They just put him out of a job, why would he listen to them now.

At least I have this to comfort me. From what Jensen has said before ( Andrew does what he wants ) it's not anything that they're not used to.

[Lastcall]

9 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

I'm not sure the guys have any leverage now.  They are ending the show.  They are the ones walking away.  I don't know why anyone (Pedowitz or Roth and certainly not Dabb) would really care about any input from the J's into the final season.  The CW will continue on without Supernatural as will Warner Brothers.  I can't see any financial benefit for either the network or the studio to make sure the stars are happy anymore.

In three and half years Dabb hasn't given a rat's ass about anything Jared and Jensen might want.  They just put him out of a job, why would he listen to them now.

Dabb will do what he wants but J2 do have leverage. They have expressed interest in movies down the road. There is even potential for limited series in the future (Jensen still brings up his dream of doing a supernatural road show in different states). It is in the WB’s interest to keep them both happy. They are about to launch a new streaming service and I’m sure they would love to bring over SPN fans with new content. I believe Jensen’s “Supernatural never truly ends does it...wink” comment was a clue that there will be something beyond the finale. Jensen seems energized and excited about next year, Dabb not so much. I think J2 got enough power from Pedowitz to keep 15 from becoming the train wreck 14 is. Remember Jensen took ownership for next season, he wouldn’t do that if he didn’t know something.

[S Cook Productions]

8 hours ago, Jakes said:

I just think J2M as a group have been thinking about a good exit for a while--why they were mentioning 300 as possible.   Don't think it's an axe against the show--it's just time after a very long 15 years...an amazingly long time to do a TV show.

I did a meet and greet with Misha at the middle of season 11, and he didn’t display any sort of willingness to end the show then. In fact, he almost seemed afraid they might kill him off against his wishes. We briefly discussed it over scotch. Now granted, that was like 3 or 4 years ago and things could have changed...but IMO he has the best of both worlds: a lot of time off and a steady gig. I don’t understand why he would want it to end. However, I do think he would totally go along with the Js if they wanted to (which I believe they did, obviously). Misha would definitely support them. 

[gonzosgirrl]

16 hours ago, FlickChick said:

Regarding bolded. Jensen has said that they want story input in next season, but he also said that he wasn't sure that they would listen and that he and Jared were prepared for that possibility. So based on that, I'm not sure what creative control they really have. They haven't mentioned "producers' credit", just that they've been invited to the story-boarding. Frankly, I'm more concerned about even more retaliation from Dabb after what's been said to the public so far. There has to be a real reason why the MichaelDean storyline was never developed, that Dabb didn't show for the 300th party, and why (IMO) he has given less and less to Jensen/Dean this season. Don't get me wrong, I love what's coming out of Vegas, everyone's enthusiasm about next season with what's been said, I'm just afraid that if Dabb stays as showrunner, and the guys don't get "producer" status, that despite their best efforts, in won't matter in the end. And Dabb will stick it to them (and the fans) for one last time. Oh Chuck, I hope I'm wrong.

I probably should have used the word input rather than control. However, Jensen's enthusiasm about the season gives me hope. After being burned so bad this season, I just can't see him putting it out there like this again if he wasn't sure. Seriously,  there would be no place Dabb could hide if it were me. 

Edited April 2, 2019 by gonzosgirrl

[Jonesy]

18 hours ago, FlickChick said:

Regarding bolded. Jensen has said that they want story input in next season, but he also said that he wasn't sure that they would listen and that he and Jared were prepared for that possibility. So based on that, I'm not sure what creative control they really have. They haven't mentioned "producers' credit", just that they've been invited to the story-boarding. Frankly, I'm more concerned about even more retaliation from Dabb after what's been said to the public so far. There has to be a real reason why the MichaelDean storyline was never developed, that Dabb didn't show for the 300th party, and why (IMO) he has given less and less to Jensen/Dean this season. Don't get me wrong, I love what's coming out of Vegas, everyone's enthusiasm about next season with what's been said, I'm just afraid that if Dabb stays as showrunner, and the guys don't get "producer" status, that despite their best efforts, in won't matter in the end. And Dabb will stick it to them (and the fans) for one last time. Oh Chuck, I hope I'm wrong.

Don't think this perspective is true--don't think there is any animus between Dabb and the J's at all.  

[tessathereaper]

16 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

I'm not sure the guys have any leverage now.  They are ending the show.  They are the ones walking away.  I don't know why anyone (Pedowitz or Roth and certainly not Dabb) would really care about any input from the J's into the final season.  The CW will continue on without Supernatural as will Warner Brothers.  I can't see any financial benefit for either the network or the studio to make sure the stars are happy anymore.

In three and half years Dabb hasn't given a rat's ass about anything Jared and Jensen might want.  They just put him out of a job, why would he listen to them now.

I've seen no evidence that Pedowicz and Roth have anything against the J's, for all we know they may be more pissed at Dabb for being an ass as a show runner and basically forcing out the leads of their most consistent performer.  I would imagine they got Season 15 because of that, "If we do such and such a thing, will you, Jensen and Jared, at least give us a full final Season 15".  They really have no reason NOT to make their two stars happy in their final season.  They certainly have no reason to back Dabb.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

I'm not sure the guys have any leverage now.  They are ending the show.  They are the ones walking away.  I don't know why anyone (Pedowitz or Roth and certainly not Dabb) would really care about any input from the J's into the final season.  The CW will continue on without Supernatural as will Warner Brothers.  I can't see any financial benefit for either the network or the studio to make sure the stars are happy anymore.

In three and half years Dabb hasn't given a rat's ass about anything Jared and Jensen might want.  They just put him out of a job, why would he listen to them now.

I think WB would have an interest in maybe not the entire Season 15 but the Series Finale to be well received. If you got a Finale like "How I met your mother" where the internet burned it down in effigy, you won`t sell too many "complete series box sets", the potential spin-off idea gets quickly scrapped and rewatch-potential on syndication goes way down.  

Arrow is currently facing some of those same problems. At least the Series Finale should leave fans with some sense of contentment. I see the input there as possibly the greatest. Now of course that posits Dabb and Singer haven`t driven the story so against the wall at that point, you can`t get out of it in one episode.

[FlickChick]

18 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I probably should have used the word input rather than control. However, Jensen's enthusiasm about the season gives me hope. After being burned so bad this season, I just can't see him putting it out there like this again if he wasn't sure. Seriously,  there would be no place Dabb could hide if it were me. 

I so hope you are right about this. I agree that Jensen is showing enthusiasm about the final season. Let's pray he's got some information about how that will happen. I really wish they could get Dabb out and have Kripke or Carver come back for the send-off. Or even Singer as budget/production overseer and Yockey as head writer/story-boarder.

[Casseiopeia]

5 hours ago, tessathereaper said:

I've seen no evidence that Pedowicz and Roth have anything against the J's, for all we know they may be more pissed at Dabb for being an ass as a show runner and basically forcing out the leads of their most consistent performer.  I would imagine they got Season 15 because of that, "If we do such and such a thing, will you, Jensen and Jared, at least give us a full final Season 15".  They really have no reason NOT to make their two stars happy in their final season.  They certainly have no reason to back Dabb.

I don't think that Pedowitz or Roth have anything against the J's either.  But they also don't have any reason to interfere with Dabb and his writers on behalf of the stars.  The CW has other projects in the works to replace that time slot and the WB isn't worried about fans not following Supernatural wherever it ends up...either on it's own live streaming service, Netflix,  TNT, YouTube or whatever.  Fans haven't given up on the show yet.  A mediocre final season isn't going to affect it's profitability.

 The show is over.  I might be wrong but I just can't see either Roth or Pedowitz going to bat for the J's at this point.  What would be the profit.

[tessathereaper]

1 hour ago, Casseiopeia said:

I don't think that Pedowitz or Roth have anything against the J's either.  But they also don't have any reason to interfere with Dabb and his writers on behalf of the stars.  The CW has other projects in the works to replace that time slot and the WB isn't worried about fans not following Supernatural wherever it ends up...either on it's own live streaming service, Netflix,  TNT, YouTube or whatever.  Fans haven't given up on the show yet.  A mediocre final season isn't going to affect it's profitability.

 The show is over.  I might be wrong but I just can't see either Roth or Pedowitz going to bat for the J's at this point.  What would be the profit.

But as someone pointed out above, yes a bad final season CAN affect the profit.  It can affect how many people will re-watch the show in syndication or who will watch it anew after hearing all the complaints and a bad finale episode can really destroy a show's future in those terms.  If it ends badly, fans don't want to re-watch, there is bad word of mouth that affects new fans who might have picked up the show on netflix or in syndication, etc.

How do you know the WB isn't worried about fans not following it to whereever it ends up?  Fans are often where future fans comes from.  They have far more reason to keep the stars happy than to keep Dabb happy.

[Casseiopeia]

3 minutes ago, tessathereaper said:

But as someone pointed out above, yes a bad final season CAN affect the profit.  It can affect how many people will re-watch the show in syndication or who will watch it anew after hearing all the complaints and a bad finale episode can really destroy a show's future in those terms.  If it ends badly, fans don't want to re-watch, there is bad word of mouth that affects new fans who might have picked up the show on netflix or in syndication, etc.

How do you know the WB isn't worried about fans not following it to wherever it ends up?  Fans are often where future fans comes from.  They have far more reason to keep the stars happy than to keep Dabb happy.

I honestly hope you are right.  I want the final season to be epic.  Having Jensen and Jared physically in the writers room is the next best thing to having Kripke come back.  Finger crossed that Dabb isn't petty about it all.

[Myrelle]

And if WB ever wants to do a movie, it would behoove them greatly to keep their stars happy until the end-not the guy who killed the series prematurely for them. 

I honestly can't even see why they would keep Dabb on except for the fact that he likely has a contract they'd have to pay him for anyway.

[AwesomO4000]

6 hours ago, FlickChick said:

I really wish they could get Dabb out and have Kripke or Carver come back for the send-off. Or even Singer as budget/production overseer and Yockey as head writer/story-boarder.

I'm sorry, FlickChick, but for me, please no Carver. For me, he was too fond of the soap opera moments and manufactured brother angst. As a compromise, I won't ask for Gamble back ; ).

I would be fine with Yockey or Kripke. Or even Edlund. (I miss the dark humor.) Where is he right now anyway?

[tessathereaper]

1 hour ago, AwesomO4000 said:

I'm sorry, FlickChick, but for me, please no Carver. For me, he was too fond of the soap opera moments and manufactured brother angst. As a compromise, I won't ask for Gamble back ; ).

I would be fine with Yockey or Kripke. Or even Edlund. (I miss the dark humor.) Where is he right now anyway?

He's working on The Tick, he also worked on Revolution(with Kripke) and Gotham.  He was with the original version of The Tick in the early 2000s so clearly that is a show which would be his priority.  

Edited April 3, 2019 by tessathereaper

[DeeDee79]

6 hours ago, FlickChick said:

I so hope you are right about this. I agree that Jensen is showing enthusiasm about the final season. Let's pray he's got some information about how that will happen. I really wish they could get Dabb out and have Kripke or Carver come back for the send-off. Or even Singer as budget/production overseer and Yockey as head writer/story-boarder.

All of these sound good to me. Kripke would be ideal with Yockey a close second and Carver gave us MOC Dean which I greatly enjoyed. 

[ZennyKenny]

No! Carver is the showrunner for Doom Patrol and that's where he stays! That's right, I'm claiming him now. Because he's doing such an amazing job bringing my favorite comic book series to life.

There should be a mutiny and the main cast takes over as co-showrunners! 

(And Dabb should be, like, tied up in the building's basement or something. Gagged.)

Edited April 3, 2019 by ZennyKenny
For funsies

[Lastcall]

Sadly, no one is available. Kripke has The Boys, Gamble has Magicians, Carver is on Doom Patrol and Edlund is working on his passion project The Tick. Guess what, all are very successful (I’m betting Boys will be) and the show runners are energized and passionate. Best we can hope for is they may throw a few scripts our way. That’s what caused the fizzle, lack of talent. Considering everyone that’s left, they should just turn it over to Yockey and let J2M direct him. If J2 have been given the power we hope then they should be able to give us the ending they are promising.

[gonzosgirrl]

I wonder if Jensen will direct next season,  it being his last chance for SPN. Hope someone asks at an upcoming con. 

If they (generic they) come up with a great storyline for the final season, I don't see why they couldn't invite the greats of the past to each contribute an episode or two. They already know the characters and the cast. And then bring Kripke in for the final few. I know he has another show, but it is a limited series I believe not a 23 episode affair. Supernatural is his baby, his legacy just as much as it is Jensen and Jared's. If it were me I would want to make sure it has a fitting book end, regardless of the missteps of the past few seasons.

[SueB]

I'm thrilled with J2 being invited to engage in storyboards and involved in the last season.  They 'own' the show IMO.  Kripke, Gamble, Carve, Dabb -- all have come and gone.  And Bob Singer has been there since EP2 but even he stepped back for a year with a lighter touch.  I'll take my comments to TPTB thread regarding the current dynamic, but I have no problem with Dabb staying on in charge of showruning.  I think he's generally better than what has been expressed here. 

[gonzosgirrl]

16 hours ago, FlickChick said:

I so hope you are right about this. I agree that Jensen is showing enthusiasm about the final season. Let's pray he's got some information about how that will happen. I really wish they could get Dabb out and have Kripke or Carver come back for the send-off. Or even Singer as budget/production overseer and Yockey as head writer/story-boarder.

Full disclosure: Now that I have actually watched the panels for myself, I'm not quite as convinced as I was that they have control over much, if anything. Hearing and seeing them speak left a different impression than reading the words. That said, I do still believe Jensen is very optimistic and enthused, and after the Michael debacle, I don't think he'd put himself out there like this without some guarantees. I don't expect we'll ever know the true, full details - and it's probably better that way.

Speaking of seeing things differently after watching though... I definitely feel like there was more to the story with his response to the 'Batman' question. Maybe not that role, per se, but he most certainly had a cat-that-ate-the-canary vibe about him, for me of course, JMO and YMMV and all that jazz. :)

[Myrelle]

2 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Speaking of seeing things differently after watching though... I definitely feel like there was more to the story with his response to the 'Batman' question. Maybe not that role, per se, but he most certainly had a cat-that-ate-the-canary vibe about him, for me of course, JMO and YMMV and all that jazz

MTE.