You're The Worst - General Discussion

[tennisgurl]

THIS IS SO STRESSFUL! WE ARE SO CLOSE TO THAT WEDDING BUT I FEEL LIKE WE WONT CROSS THAT FINISH LINE! YES, THIS IS A CAPS-LOCK SITUATION!

[scrb]

Jimmy being worried about money seems weird.

Doesn't he own that home free and clear from previous book?

So for years, he was writing this book which also netted him a $700k check and also a movie is being developed.  He didn't get to write the screenplay but he'll still get money from the movie and they mentioned that he has a deal to deliver two more books?

How much income was he counting on from Gretchen's job?

Seems if money becomes a concern and both of them start worrying or maybe arguing about it, seems like kind of out of left field.  

Money is a source of conflict in a lot of relationships but they've never shown it being a thing between these two.

[possibilities]

I think Gretchen's inability to do anything for the wedding is much more worrying than their financial situation.

[oldCJ]

2 hours ago, scrb said:

Seems if money becomes a concern and both of them start worrying or maybe arguing about it, seems like kind of out of left field.  

Money is a source of conflict in a lot of relationships but they've never shown it being a thing between these two.

It was an issue for Jimmy in the episode where Gretchen confessed her credit card debt and how she doesn’t think it’s “real money”, but like most problems Jimmy has with Gretchen, he didn’t confront it. 

[wendyg]

I think they're piling every marital problem from MAD ABOUT YOU into this final season. 🙂

[Ottis]

Oh goody. All of my least favorite things about this show. Jimmy overreacts to something even he says is so common it is a cliche, and Gretchen lies and avoids being an adult. And come on, Gretchen, you weren’t failing you were doing great. Until for some reason you couldn’t make a simple and obvious decision.

Meanwhile, Lyndsey is a fool. Only Edgar provides any redeeming qualities. Blech to this week. 

[Jade Foxx]

5 hours ago, Ottis said:

Only Edgar provides any redeeming qualities.

I've mentioned this before - Edgar has always been the heart and soul of this show. I'm lightweight in love with him lol

[Jade Foxx]

AV Club review: https://tv.avclub.com/lies-damn-lies-and-romance-star-in-youre-the-worsts-a-1833443294

[festivus]

Am l the only one who dosen't care that they probably won't end up together? I'll watch the show to the end but IMO it hasn't been funny this season except for when Lyndsy was pretending to be Gretchen's mom. I only care about Edgar and it looks like he's doing pretty well. He stands up for himself now and expects Jimmy to treat him as an equal.

[tennisgurl]

That was really a pretty nice set up Jimmy made. Of course Jimmy will freak out and not deal with things, but Gretchen is the one who is more worrying. She is not doing anything for the wedding at all, and while she does love Jimmy, I dont know if she can just make that kind of commitment to a "real" life.

Edgar is doing so well, I am super proud of him. He even wore the Jimmy fake mustache when he was tailing Gretchen! 

[Jade Foxx]

6 hours ago, festivus said:

Am l the only one who dosen't care that they probably won't end up together? I'll watch the show to the end but IMO it hasn't been funny this season except for when Lyndsy was pretending to be Gretchen's mom. I only care about Edgar and it looks like he's doing pretty well. He stands up for himself now and expects Jimmy to treat him as an equal.

I care, because they seem compatible on so many levels.  It’s a rare connection.  But just because you love/are compatible someone, doesn’t mean you’re meant to be together long term. At this point it’s toxic, mainly because of Gretchen. Jimmy has shown emotional growth, but he can only mitigate so much in this relationship. 

His reaction at the end of the ep was like “oh shit, this is so much bigger than me, is this how I want to live my life” 

I want them healthy even if it means they’re apart. 😔

PS: Edgar is the MVP!

[arc]

Killian's latest situation is pretty sad for Killian IMO. Sure he's not homeless and hungry anymore, but he's pretty clearly getting hooked into Scientology.

Did Edgar have a fake mustache when he was following Gretchen? Aw, I love Edgar so much.

[Irlandesa]

32 minutes ago, arc said:

Did Edgar have a fake mustache when he was following Gretchen? Aw, I love Edgar so much.

I loved everything about that.  It reminded me of movies from maybe the 60s where someone would be following someone and we'd get these camera angles where we get a close up on the person being followed and then the camera pulls way back and you see the person following in the distance.  Or a movie structures itself where you follow one person, the camera pulls back and you see someone else in the background and then the movie follows them.  I wish I could think of a good example but it gave it such a retro feel.

But yes, this show is brutal.  With Gretchen, Jimmy should always know there is more. 

[arc]

It's also a callback to S1E08's long zoom in to Jimmy from a distance with binoculars and a fake mustache! And all the other times he used a fake mustache.

[Blakeston]

I just got caught up on this season, and I'm finding the characters' behavior to be inexplicable.

First of all, why on earth did Gretchen tell Sam that Nock Nock's verse was so much better than his? Everything would have been fine if she hadn't brought that to his attention.

And since when is Gretchen dumb enough to think that turning on the sprinkler was an appropriate solution? I could see Lindsay being that clueless, but not Gretchen. (And I get that Gretchen was overwhelmed, and high, but she'd been handling things well up until that point.)

Have they explained why Gretchen wanted those papers from the office so badly?

And count me in as someone who was irritated that they're acting as though Jimmy won't be getting any more money from his books.

[scrb]

I've been rewatching Catastrophe.

Kind of similar to this show, except the male lead is American.

The couple in Catastrophe also started with a random, causal hookup and were both unwilling at first to admit they were interested in a relationship.

Well more accurately, Sharon was standoffish as Gretchen was.  But she admitted that she couldn't do it herself -- raise a kid.

Over the years Rob and Sharon have said horrible things to each other while Jimmy and Gretchen have done horrible things to each other.

But in Catastrophe, the dialogue is brutal yet brilliant.  The wit is fiery, which is something that the dialogue in YTW rarely attains if ever.

The supporting characters are also better too, really well-drawn.  Despite only having 4 seasons of 6 episodes each season, they gave the supporting character a lot as far as showing their own journeys.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

PENULTIMATE EPISODE!

S5.E12: We Were Having Such A Nice Day

Quote

The day before the wedding, Gretchen's mom comes to town and Edgar takes Jimmy on an epic best-man date.

Promo:

Clips:

Mommy's here:

Jimmy and Edgar heart to heart:

Original air date: 3/27/19

Edited April 10, 2019 by ElectricBoogaloo

[iMonrey]

Quote

Am l the only one who dosen't care that they probably won't end up together?

I don't want them to end up together. They were both relatively awful at the start of this series but now Gretchen isn't even functional. At least Jimmy is a functional human being capable of making a living and supporting himself. But since Season 2 they have dialed up Gretchen's dysfunctions to eleven. I get that it's supposed to be edgy to deal with actual mental issues like serious depression but the characters are no longer on equal footing in terms of awfulness. Jimmy is just rude and narcissistic, whereas Gretchen is mentally ill. That's not comparable. 

And I really hated Lindsay's foray into lesbianism. There's no worse cliche on TV than women turning gay after getting burned by a man. It's one thing if a character is presented all along as fluid or bi, but it's more of a porn fantasy that any woman will turn to another woman after a series of unsuccessful relationships with men.

[kieyra]

Spoilering because I’m not sure where/how this has aired yet ...

Spoiler

After she looked happily at the pictures of her and Jimmy, and drained her wine glass, I really thought Gretchen was going to pull a Dualla on us.

[whiporee]

Damn, he loves her. 

Damn, Edgar loves him.  

And damn, poor Gretchen never had a chance.  

As ive tried to sleep, I keep hearing “When a Man Loves a Woman,” running through my head. I know Bolton made it cheesy, but if you listen to the pain in the original, everything Jimmy’s done makes sense.  She’s awful for him, and they’ll wipe each other out, but he just can’t stop. 

On the plus side, Paul and Becca made a cute kid.  

[scrb]

I’ll probably have to rewatch to see if there’s a consistent and believable progression to this point, where Jimmy puts Gretchen above everyone else.

Sure he better feel that way if he’s going to marry her.

But it’s not clear to me when and where they got so romantic.  Even the importance they attach to the actual wedding seems alien to what they’ve said in the past.

Didn’t they say they were going through with the wedding planning as ironic hipsters?  But looks like it’s going to be somewhat elaborate bougie wedding.

Or have they always been romantics but were unwilling or unable to admit it to themselves, much less each other?

Of course this isn’t some conventional love story because of Gretchen’s emotional issues.  But that just makes Jimmy banishing of Edgar an even grander romantic gesture?

Great to see Paul turn the tables on Vernon and Becca, owning them at the end.  Then win back Lindsay as the show ends?  But Lindsay is scatter-brained lately so not a big deal.

Still no guarantee of a Hollywood happy ending from the Brit showrunner.

[biakbiak]

20 minutes ago, scrb said:

Still no guarantee of a Hollywood happy ending from the Brit showrunner.

Stephen is from Oakland.

[scrb]

Hmm, I don't know why I thought Falk was a Brit then.

[biakbiak]

5 minutes ago, scrb said:

Hmm, I don't know why I thought Falk was a Brit then.

 A gazillion years ago he used to write recaps for TWOP! 

[ruby24]

No idea where it's going, but I'm guessing Jimmy and Gretchen can't end up together after all this. 

I'm also not sure that I buy JImmy's reaction to Edgar's speech. Would he really be that offended by that? He knows it's true. I do buy that Edgar would say it, after everything he's witnessed this season between them. He's right, whenever they do tell the truth, they then do nothing about it.

The only thing I don't buy is all the significance and symbolism being attached to the marriage part of it, as if "there's no turning back after this one day," blah, blah, blah. Edgar could have (and should have) said all this stuff to Jimmy years ago, or when they got engaged in the first place. Let's say they don't get married and just live together for years. All that same stuff about them being bad for each other and destroying each other still applies.

And oh great, here we go with Paul and Lindsay again? I mean...I guess. Paul's kinda gross and weird, but I honestly always thought Lindsay probably was better off staying with him, because she can't do anything on her own and at least he's responsible enough to take care of her. Unfortunately I do think she's one of those people who needs to be taken care of. The only thing was that they made it pretty clear for seasons in a row now that Lindsay does not love him, so I'm not totally sure how that's a happy ending for her, but sure, whatever.

Edited March 28, 2019 by ruby24

[Ottis]

6 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I'm also not sure that I buy JImmy's reaction to Edgar's speech. Would he really be that offended by that? He knows it's true. I do buy that Edgar would say it, after everything he's witnessed this season between them. He's right, whenever they do tell the truth, they then do nothing about it.

Agree. This was Grand Drama for the sake of the show. I would buy Jimmy being upset, and being forced to consider the point, but not banishing Edgar forever.

I found most fascinating the perspective the show raised through Gretchen's mother, who clearly settled in her life, is miserable because of it, *realizes* it and yet still can't change anything because she doesn't want to be viewed a fool. It's the opposite of Gretchen, who is a mess, and let's everyone know it, unapologetically. So which way is better? I'd say Gretchen's way, except she is so nonfunctional that she can't really get anywhere in life.. Something to ponder.

[Deanie87]

Ugh that was a gut punch.  Now I want Jimmy and Edgar to get married.  Their final scene was one of my favorites of the entire series, and both actors did an incredible job.  I loved every second of Jimmy and Edgar's together and I was so glad to hear Jimmy finally give Edgar credit for what a true friend his is.  And Edgar is a true friend, although I kind of wished he hadn't waited until the day before the wedding to lay all of this on Jimmy.  I know that he has been trying to tell him for a long time, but ugh.  So often, what is good for Gretchen seems to be of the utmost importance on the show, so I was so happy for someone to finally seem to care about what will be good for Jimmy.  I think I will be more devastated if Jimmy and Edgar don't get back together than I will be about anything else.  For me, the entire series has been building up to a scene like that and it was well and truly earned. 

Unlike Gretchen and her mother, unfortunately.  I feel like we have always known that Gretchen's mother was overbearing and judgmental, but she was so over the top in this episode that I feel a little bit manipulated and their scenes didn't really work for me.  Also because Gretchen has never really done much to treat her mental illness, her being offended that her mother never took it seriously just kind of annoys me.  Gretchen just wants someone to save her and her saying that now she can do whatever she wants because Jimmy will never leave is so beyond shitty that I thought it served her right when she stepped on the glass (which was a very heavy-handed metaphor, but it got me nevertheless).  So congrats to the show on making me basically okay with whatever happens in the next episode.  I still root for Jimmy and Gretchen, but I am hoping that they don't get married.  My ideal would be Gretchen leaving Jimmy, rather than the other way around, but them finding each other again sometime in the future after Gretchen is finally able to get her life together.  But if that doesn't happen, then I hope they both find happiness, either on their own or with someone else (and by that I mean I want Edgar and Jimmy to fall in love and be together 🙂 .  Or just be best friends for life and hang out at the Members Only Club and go curling on the weekends.)

On the other hand, "There is no way I'd rather go..."  AAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

Edited March 28, 2019 by Deanie87

[tennisgurl]

Now I think I am way more invested in Jimmy and Edgar getting back together than Jimmy and Gretchen actually making something work! I mean, I've been team Gretchen/Jimmy since day one, but Jimmy and Edgar have come so far as besties, and it was so sweet to see them hanging out and celebrating how far they have both come in both their friendship and as people, and I need them to make up right now!

I mean, Edgar cares so much about Jimmy, he has so clearly thought so hard about this and he seemed so truly scared about the idea of Jimmy and Gretchen destroying each other and wallowing in their own self destructive patterns, it was honestly really heartbreaking. I mean, he really should have brought this up earlier if he was so worried, but maybe he was assuming that Jimmy and Gretchen would call it off on their own, or their own issues would cause the whole thing to implode on their own. He has clearly put thought and even preparation into this. I do think that Jimmy really does love Gretchen and vice versa, but is love enough? 

Gretchen has become such a mess, especially the last few episodes, that its looking like she will be the one who pulls a runaway bride. Her mom is so awful, its almost too over the top to believe. She is just so cold and uncaring, basically just telling Gretchen to her face that having her was a mistake, and Gretchen has become such a mess, especially after she did actually seem to be growing a bit, that it almost seems like a different, weirder show. 

Before the super angsty ending and the sad and depressing Gretchen plot, I really loved the plot with Jimmy and Edgar and his day out for Jimmy. The curling especially cracked me up. No athletes are more hair trigger defensive!

[kieyra]

Having slept on it, I still don't know what to make of this penultimate episode. 

Gretchen's (final?) showdown with her mother wasn't visceral enough, and just sort of fizzled rather than delivering any big gut punch or catharsis (except for making us worry more that Gretchen will try to kill herself).

I'm sad that the show's message has increasingly been that Jimmy is the semi-functional adult, and Gretchen is the 'problem'.  

I'm not sure why they decided to transform Lindsey into a completely different person for the show's outro. (I have a bad feeling we're leading up to: Paul doesn't really need a kid, he just needs someone to take care of, and Lindsey is like a perpetual toddler, so ... match made in heaven?) 

I don't buy that Edgar waited until the last possible minute to try to stop the marriage. 

I was not sold on Jimmy's dream evening being that weird secret club of ... intellectual snobs? That all felt like satire/some kind of dream sequence.

Oh well, here goes my (optimistic) bid for how it plays out:

In the first episode of the season, Jimmy and Gretchen's fictional alter-egos (the video-store couple) come together briefly, then split. Only to find each other years later after making lots of personal progress. So maybe Jimmy and Gretchen will split on the wedding day, only to reunite in the culmination of the 'flash forwards' we're seeing. After Gretchen has gotten a lot of therapy and quit drinking* or whatever. 

*I know she ends up drinking in the flash forwards. Which brings us to my alternate theory: the flash forwards are some sort of fakeout, and Gretchen going around without a wedding ring and pretending to be sober is some sort of roleplaying thing she and Jimmy are up to, and they will later meet in that hotel bar and bang afterwards. No, this doesn't explain Mariah/flower vendor chick, or whose future wedding everyone is attending, etc. Although I have a (another) bad feeling that the flash-forward wedding is Paul and Lindsey's re-wedding. 

Edited March 28, 2019 by kieyra

[Traveller519]

5 hours ago, Ottis said:

Agree. This was Grand Drama for the sake of the show. I would buy Jimmy being upset, and being forced to consider the point, but not banishing Edgar forever.

I found most fascinating the perspective the show raised through Gretchen's mother, who clearly settled in her life, is miserable because of it, *realizes* it and yet still can't change anything because she doesn't want to be viewed a fool. It's the opposite of Gretchen, who is a mess, and let's everyone know it, unapologetically. So which way is better? I'd say Gretchen's way, except she is so nonfunctional that she can't really get anywhere in life.. Something to ponder.

I think I have to disagree with you both here. I completely buy that reaction from someone on the eve of their wedding day, who has been through so much to come to terms with the fact that this is the right decision. The scene with him hugging his Dad, was one of release of his personal demons and of what lay ahead. 

And as much as I love Edgar, and am happy to have him be the stable force that he has been this season, that was such an incredible dick move for him to pull. He litteraly started off the morning publicly encouraging them to kiss with Lindsay. If he's come to this realization, even if he's hoped Jimmy or Gretchen would realize it themselves, dropping that bomb in the manner he did is earth-shattering for anyone. In Jimmy's perception it's as much a betrayal as he previously pulled on Gretchen, which he's only recently come to acknowledge.

I know Edgars been expressing his concern, but two episodes ago he was actively trying to help Jimmy be there for her, if his perceptions in the past 2-3 weeks (show time) have changed so much, I hate to say it, but I think he has to swallow it and let Jimmy and Gretchen take the leap for themselves, but be willing to be there to pick up the pieces if he needs to (just realizing the metaphor back to the broken glass...unintentional). 

22 minutes ago, kieyra said:

Gretchen's (final?) showdown with her mother wasn't visceral enough, and just sort of fizzled rather than delivering any big gut punch or catharsis (except for making us worry more that Gretchen will try to kill herself).

I'm sad that the show's message has increasingly been that Jimmy is the semi-functional adult, and Gretchen is the 'problem'.  

I'm not sure why they decided to transform Lindsey into a completely different person for the show's outro. (I have a bad feeling we're leading up to: Paul doesn't really need a kid, he just needs someone to take care of, and Lindsey is like a perpetual toddler, so ... match made in heaven?) 

I don't buy that Edgar waited until the last possible minute to try to stop the marriage. 

I kind of dug the Gretchen and her mother moments, because by the time it boils over we (like Gretchen) are hoping to get the carthasis, but her mother is unwilling, or unable, to afford it to her. It wraps up the emotion that much more.

I really don't want Paul and Lindsey back together. I like the space they've been in from the latter half of the previous season through the bachelor/ette party. They love and care about one another, and are respectful to each other willing to help one another out, but they've been through it twice and know that they don't work as a married couple because they can't give each other what they want.

Overall I thought this episode was fantastic. Every scene with Edgar and Jimmy was exquisitely shot, whether it was the montages or the tight shot final discussion. The emotion in Gretchen's scenes were palpable. The comic relief was a bit of a letdown, but nice to see Paul not just cave to Vernon and Becca, and the over the shoulder of the contract was hilarious.

Excited, but nervous as hell for next week.

[scrb]

Yeah what was that club all about?

Men in tuxedos with drinks and cigars, with young women around them laughing at their lame jokes?

It's like a beer commercial or whatever that "most interesting man" commercials are about.

What is the point of being captivating to young women if he's not trying to sleep with them?  Because he just wants to hold court?  

I guess they have a codependency now.  Jimmy has alternatives, like the florist or these young women at the club.

But he can't quit Gretchen, even though he did.  But he came back so ...

[Deanie87]

1 hour ago, kieyra said:

I'm sad that the show's message has increasingly been that Jimmy is the semi-functional adult, and Gretchen is the 'problem'.  

I would argue that Jimmy has always been the semi-functional one.  He had the focus and determination to finish a novel, owns a house, has been in a semi-serious relationship previously (with Becca, but still), was able to sustain friendly relationships in the old folks trailer park, and has for the most part been a decent partner to Gretchen.  He obviously has his own issues and doesn't deal with problems well (clearly), but I remember him doing lots of little, loving things for her (the YouTube animal cruise, the murder crime spree and generally fighting really hard for her when he fucked up (and yes, he fucked up hugely).  I haven't re-watched any of the seasons since they aired, but as far as I remember, the one time Jimmy needed Gretchen for real support when his father died, she freaked out and got him drunk.

1 hour ago, kieyra said:

n the first episode of the season, Jimmy and Gretchen's fictional alter-egos (the video-store couple) come together briefly, then split. Only to find each other years later after making lots of personal progress. So maybe Jimmy and Gretchen will split on the wedding day, only to reunite in the culmination of the 'flash forwards' we're seeing. After Gretchen has gotten a lot of therapy and quit drinking* or whatever. 

This is my prediction for what happens and my hope for what happens.  I would be very happy with that.

Quote

Yeah what was that club all about?

I thought it was perfect!  Jimmy is a narcissistic snob who feels like he doesn't get the acclaim and recognition that he deserves.  Now he gets to be part of some exclusive club so that he can look down on other people, and yes, hold court.  And while I think he would be happy to hold court with anyone who would be willing to listen to him, beautiful women and other snobs is probably the best case scenario for him.

I don't like where Paul and Lindsay are going either and I really, really hope its a misdirection. 

[Evie]

54 minutes ago, Traveller519 said:

And as much as I love Edgar, and am happy to have him be the stable force that he has been this season, that was such an incredible dick move for him to pull. He litteraly started off the morning publicly encouraging them to kiss with Lindsay. If he's come to this realization, even if he's hoped Jimmy or Gretchen would realize it themselves, dropping that bomb in the manner he did is earth-shattering for anyone. In Jimmy's perception it's as much a betrayal as he previously pulled on Gretchen, which he's only recently come to acknowledge.

I agree. In any other episode of the series, I might not have bought Jimmy's reaction, but I did here because it came after Jimmy had finally opened himself up emotionally to Edgar. He's spent the whole series refusing to acknowledge Edgar as a friend and shutting down Edgar's attempts to deepen their relationship. So for Edgar to drop that bomb after Jimmy had opened up had to be a gut punch. It made perfect sense to me that Jimmy would react by banishing Edgar. 

[Ottis]

2 hours ago, Evie said:

I agree. In any other episode of the series, I might not have bought Jimmy's reaction, but I did here because it came after Jimmy had finally opened himself up emotionally to Edgar. He's spent the whole series refusing to acknowledge Edgar as a friend and shutting down Edgar's attempts to deepen their relationship. So for Edgar to drop that bomb after Jimmy had opened up had to be a gut punch. It made perfect sense to me that Jimmy would react by banishing Edgar. 

I guess YMMV. Having a close friend who loves you, and recognizing such, is priceless. What comes along with that is respecting their opinion. I think Edgar did hope it would all implode before he had to do it, that Jimmy would realize, at some point, that marrying G is a bad idea. But Jimmy didn’t, and Edgar has not been afraid to say difficult things. Jimmy’s reaction in the moment was anger, but if he meant what he said about banishing Edgar, then Jimmy is as messed up as G. I would be disappointed in that Jimmy. 

[StrictTime]

The actor who plays Edgar did a fantastic job in the final scene at the bar. He hit the right note of almost panicked concern (he had tears!), but in a very “bro” way. What a joy it must have been for those two to do that scene.

I thought Gretchen’s mom was too cartoonish and over the top. But I guess they are showing that the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree—neither Gretchen or her mother have any sense of when to keep their mouths shut and just be nice to people.

[arc]

Edgar wasn’t wrong, but I guess I’m with Jimmy: a doomed romance isn’t something to run from.

that said, I wish they actively sought therapy and otherwise tried to fix themselves.

[festivus]

Wow. That was a really fucking great episode. I loved the Edgar & Jimmy scene. I've been there in Edgar's position and I actually had to back down or lose my best friend. It's so hard to do what he did and both actors just nailed it. My friend finally saw the light but it took 23 years for her to do so.

[Irlandesa]

23 hours ago, Traveller519 said:

I know Edgars been expressing his concern, but two episodes ago he was actively trying to help Jimmy be there for her, if his perceptions in the past 2-3 weeks (show time) have changed so much,

I thought Edgar was wrong to encourage Jimmy to go to Gretchen's event a few weeks ago.  It was a business thing she was running.  It'd be one thing if attending events were unusual for her but that's kind of her job.  She was going to be busy the whole time and didn't need a plus one. I'm pretty sure Jimmy doesn't expect her to be at his book readings. 

But he did encourage Jimmy to go.  And he did encourage Jimmy and Gretchen to kiss earlier in this episode.  Edgar's concerns have been obvious yet, at the same time, he has been supportive of the relationship.  I can understand why Jimmy felt blindsided.  And his reaction made sense.  There's a reason it's a cliche that the person who exposes an affair is often the one cut out.  The situation here isn't an affair but it's similar.  Jimmy is all in on this relationship and likely wants nothing to do with Edgar because he know Edgar is right.  If he thought Edgar were wrong, I don't think he would have cut him out.

BTW, their day was great.  Edgar spinning Jimmy around on the ice is friendship goals.  They looked so handsome in their tuxes.  And this is the relationship I need to survive more than Gretchen and Jimmy (although I love them too but it's hard to see them work out).

[Traveller519]

There's one little throw-away bit from the episode that I thought was exeptionally well done. Thomas Middleditch's character at the Private Club. The cameo works on any level no matter how familiar you are with the show.

If you’ve been watching the whole way through and remember his character from the First Sunday Funday in Season 1 (5 years ago), it obviously works on that level because he plays it similarly.

If you forget the character (or haven't seen the episode) but just recognize Thomas Middleditch the actor/comedian, you could easily place this club as a place where the "real" Middleditch visits (the show exists in a universe with a "real" Ben Folds, Doug Benson, Paul F. Tompkins, and hell Tony Shaloub, after all).

If you have no idea who the character or the is he’s just a guy pissed off these new guys are grabbing the attention in his club.

I only started watching in Season 2 and then found the Season 1 episodes afterward. I admit that I recalled Middleditch had played a character on the show, but I had to look it up to who it was, which episode, and the nature of his character. But the scene still worked for me even though he doesn't speak. I kind of enjoy viewing it through all three lenses.

[possibilities]

Edgar should not have done that the night before the wedding. If he really thought that, he should have said it much sooner. Also, he should have encouraged Jimmy to deal with the pill stealing and other red flags, not just acted like he supported them and looked the other way until the last minute.

It's callous to suggest Jimmy leave her the night before the wedding. He should encourage them to work out their problems, after the wedding if necessary. But you don't just wait til the last minute and then suggest dropping a bomb is the best course. Look how hard Jimmy worked to get her back after the last time he proposed and then ditched her! He's capable of working on things when he realized he needs to.

I do agree their relationship is a mess, and I think Jimmy has been showing with his facial expressions that he's a bit freaked out by some of Gretchen's continued behaviors. But look how compatible they are in other ways. Who else would have loved that staged massacre a few eps ago?

I thought the scene with Gretchen and her mom-- and how Lindsay totally bailed the second it got tough-- made a really stark contrast with Jimmy and Edgar having fun all day. Gretchen is a mess, and she does drive people away. But when she tries to be healthy and real, she's totally striking out and abandoned. You can see how Jimmy's family was unsupportive, but they weren't totally unloving and relentlessly cruel, either. Gretchen seems to have NO experience at all, to draw on, when it comes to being treated with any kind of care.

I do not at all think Jimmy should rescue her or enable her in her dysfunctions. But it's not like he's actually tried to address it, he's always tried to ignore it and just hope it goes away, including when she was severely depressed and could hardly get off the couch. He is doing the same thing now. That time, she did eventually pull herself out of it and try to get help, almost against his objections. She could do it again, and ditching her the night before the wedding after making zero effort to address things head on is not really the healthy choice for Jimmy, either.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Chris Geere discusses the final season:

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Kether Donohue discusses You're the Worst

[ElectricBoogaloo]

SERIES FINALE!

S5.E13: Pancakes

Quote

On the day of their wedding, Jimmy and Gretchen grapple with the meaning of marriage. Written by Stephen Falk; Directed by Stephen Falk.

Promo:

Original air date: 4/3/19

Edited April 10, 2019 by ElectricBoogaloo

[wendyg]

Jimmy's family...one sister was utterly absorbed in her flying career at "the good Tesco's" until her dreams were smashed in the supermarket; the other was relentlessly mean ("Shitty Jimmy") both to Jimmy and to their sister Lily. His father was more mixed, but mostly dismissive of a son he showed no interest in understanding. In a way, I'd rather have Gretchen's mother. At least you'd *know* there was no point in pursuing a relationship because she has no human parts.

[maggiegil]

I hated when it was revealed the flash forwards were fake outs but the montage and the ending was so satisfying and I forgive everything. A well done finale that tied up the vast majority of loose ends and still felt true to the series.

Although I still don't get Paul and Lindsay getting back together after everything thats gone down.

[Irlandesa]

I would have been happy with Jimmy getting in the car with Edgar.  But I was also happy at the fake out.  I did like the montage where it looked like most of the sex-looking acts actually involved comforting the baby.

[scrb]

So Jimmy has to affirm each day that he loves Gretchen and wants to be with her.

Why does it matter whether they marry or not in that case?  If they marry, it would be harder to extricate themselves from each other if one or both of them decide that they’re out.  But millions of people leave marriages all the time, though maybe married people try harder to hold things together.

Instead they could argue over the phone bill and break up over it.

And they’re both okay with Edgar since they didn’t marry, which means in a sense, Jimmy followed the advice?  I think Edgar was saying that she will make him miserable or break his heart if they’re together, married or not.

In the end, this is a pretty romantic anti-romance. Many of the things they put each other through would be dealbreakers for many people.   Yet these characters stick together like barnacles to ship hulls.

Not only Jimmy and Gretchen but Paul and Lindsay.  She made him live out the most gnarly cuckold porn and he wants to remarry her?

Come on ...

[tennisgurl]

So it begins the way it ends: Jimmy and Gretchen running away from a wedding, grabbing as many gifts as they come to take with them. 

I am actually really satisfied with this ending, at least partially because it follows what I always found to be the basic ideas of the show, both a twisted (but still sincere) romantic comedy, and the idea that everyone, even narcissistic self destructive assholes, have someone out there for them. Really, the whole show plays out like a long term romantic comedy. Couple meets, flirt, deny their feelings, fall in love, theres a conflict that keeps them apart for awhile, they get back together, and eventually have their happily ever after. Add in a few wacky best friend characters, and an ending at a wedding of a Beta Couple, and you have a classic rom com, just with a lot of madcap hijinks and dark turns. This is how I admit to wanting the show to end, and I am really happy with it. 

I am almost as happy about Edgar and Jimmy making up eventually than Jimmy and Gretchen making it work and having a cute kid together, even if they never get married. 

"Shit Stain had his first article published in the New York Times when he was 19!" I will miss all of the supporting cast, I was glad most of them showed up again for the wedding. 

[ruby24]

Awww, I liked it! I think it was the perfect ending for them. I never found their planning this whole extravagant wedding thing to be in character for either of them. I think Jimmy's speech about how phony weddings are and how it's absurd to promise to love someone forever to be absolutely dead on. And accurate, to be honest. And it makes sense to me that these two both inherently understand that. And people like Paul and Lindsay wouldn't, of course.

Although I really don't get why Lindsay would suddenly NOW be happy with Paul- they were on and off for quite a while over the years and they kept circling back to the conclusion that Lindsay just does NOT LOVE him. And neither of them have changed at all, so why does she love him now? I don't mind them being together, because even in the early seasons, I really thought Lindsay was better off staying with Paul, because she's like a toddler and she does need to be taken care of (which he always will) and she also WANTS to be taken care of, so her continuing to wander around senselessly seemed pointless. I think maybe if they had just dropped some sort of extra hint in there that Lindsay felt pressure from other people to try to be independent or something, in spite of her genuinely wanting to just stay with Paul, that would at least have made sense.

I liked the twist on the Edgar thing, and how his advice sort of worked out for them. Although, what he said to him was more about just being in a relationship at all with her, I would think. And having a kid is a MUCH bigger commitment (for life) than marriage, imo. And that's also the thing that changes your relationship 100% permanently, so I'm not sure that's a great route for them to go down, if they want it to just be about each other every day. That baby will change that for good.

And frankly, it's also risky given Gretchen's acceptance of her constant mood swings that she'll always have over the years. So, the whole thing really could end in tragedy with a kid involved.

[arc]

The flashforwards were fake-outs* after all! Fine, I'm way happier that they ended up together. And that Jimmy and Edgar reconciled. I did have to go back several times to compare Jimmy's groom's black bow tie to his wedding guest striped bow tie to be convinced about the time jump though.

* played without real cheating though. Gretchen really didn't get married, and Gretchen really was potentially mad about seeing "him" again, but turns out the person she would have reason to be mad about was Edgar. Jimmy did sell the house. Jimmy did have reason to know Mariah's coffee order, and it wasn't because they were dating/married/cheating ("Afflecking").

I said it overall wasn't cheating, but it was kinda cheap for the Jillian re-wedding to book the same venue years later so the time jump would be confusing.

Shitstainz' wife Jaclyn was the same actress from before. She didn't even have a line. They also brought back the fro-yo guy from season 1, and Ben Folds (delightful as he was the first time). Off the top of my head I don't recall any other deep cut recurring characters who came back for the finale. Killian is definitely a Scientologist; I did crack up at him earnestly insisting Tom Cruise is 6'1".

I like that the "Peach" trilogy is "Width", "Height", and "Depth".

Jimmy took pancakes and they didn't make a big deal of it, but Gretchen got eggs at the diner. Nice little callback to the Peter Gabriel/Phil Collins eggs/pancakes dilemma from S1's Sunday Funday ep.