benteen February 8, 2015 Share February 8, 2015 I thought I had already posted this, but I guess not - I've quoted a few excerpts below, but the entire review is worth reading... Arrow S03E12: What worked, what didn't, and what needs to happen next Laura Hurley February 7, 2015 http://www.examiner.com/article/arrow-s03e12-what-worked-what-didn-t-and-what-needs-to-happen-next The review is excellent and perfectly sums up a lot of the stuff with the show at the moment. Link to comment
SmallScreenDiva February 8, 2015 Share February 8, 2015 (edited) Deleted because topic is already being discussed on Quiver. Edited February 8, 2015 by SmallScreenDiva Link to comment
Morrigan2575 February 8, 2015 Share February 8, 2015 (edited) We've been discussing it in the quiver thread. Might be best to keep everything in one thread. Edited February 8, 2015 by Morrigan2575 1 Link to comment
statsgirl February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 From a tweet by MG: Two Romance Authors on Arrow in USA Today Lavinia Kent: (P.S. Amell was the man I had in mind for my hero when I wrote my coming release, Bound by Bliss. I wanted a hero who could look so commanding and strict, but when he smiled ...) Gushy. And believing that the OTP can only get together at the end of the series. MG must love it. Ra's is one of the best villains on television today, Link to comment
calliope1975 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Ra's is one of the best villains on television today Wha?? Dude's done nothing. Killing Oliver after a half-assed fight doesn't constitute best villain to me. He could be but he's not there yet. However, I'm sure MG thinks as written Ra's rivals Vader. 3 Link to comment
jay741982 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 From a tweet by MG: Two Romance Authors on Arrow in USA Today Gushy. And believing that the OTP can only get together at the end of the series. MG must love it. Ugh she's so wrong about the OTP only getting together at the end of the series run. That does not need to happen there are shows where the OTP is together long before the show ends 1 Link to comment
catrox14 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Well, I'm glad a romance novelist's opinion is important in a superhero show..... I mean there is a place but it shouldn't be the most important thing. 1 Link to comment
Chiny11 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Ugh she's so wrong about the OTP only getting together at the end of the series run. That does not need to happen there are shows where the OTP is together long before the show endsWell... Maybe in Arrows case the writers' OTP are Arrow and BC. *Dodges flying stones*Just kidding... I think :( Link to comment
Angel12d February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Ra's is one of the best villains on television today, Um, what show are they watching? He lacks any sort of screen presence (unlike Slade) and I can barely remember anything he's said or done apart from sticking a sword through Oliver's chest. With Slade you really felt like he was this lingering threat in the background and could come up at any moment. With Ra's I just don't care. 4 Link to comment
BkWurm1 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 I honestly think that Arrow could stand to be more influenced by a skilled romance novelist, 'cause the one really big thing about romance novels, it the characters in the romance actually get to interact meaningfully more than once every three or four months. And romance writers have to be great when it comes to developing characters and creating emotional beats. Character over plot always is a winning combo IMO. 12 Link to comment
kismet February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 (edited) Um, what show are they watching? He lacks any sort of screen presence (unlike Slade) and I can barely remember anything he's said or done apart from sticking a sword through Oliver's chest. With Slade you really felt like he was this lingering threat in the background and could come up at any moment. With Ra's I just don't care. Its another execution error again I think. The myth of Ras, previous incarnations of Ras in comics/tv/movies all depict him as scary force of evil. But so far this season of Arrow have been light on showing us just why Ras should be so feared. They keep on telling us, but again they are not showing us. Brick wasn't a great villain, but I did feel that if you crossed him it, you would likely die by that gun of his. So if their big plan is to make Ras this great villainous force - they need to up their game. But I do have faith that they will do that in the back part of the season - otherwise I am gonna be disappointed that they kept on telling us he's the big bad and failing to deliver. Of course, if someone else is the big bad, and Ras was just used as the media distraction I would be ok with that too. So far the biggest villian this season has been people's psychological issues and frankly unless they all get some serious attempts at therapy another season of people trying to strong arm their emotional traumas does not seem like a fun or interesting show to watch. Edited February 9, 2015 by kismet 3 Link to comment
loki567 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Well... Maybe in Arrows case the writers' OTP are Arrow and BC. *Dodges flying stones* Just kidding... I think :( Considering MG's adoration of the comics and Laurel Lance in particular, there's no way they're not going back to Oliver and Laurel at some point in the show's run. I'm not sure it'll be a OTP-situation, but it'll happen. 1 Link to comment
Serena February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 The problem with Ra's "evilness" is that he's more reasonable than most of the good guys. Malcom Merlyn kills 500 people? Kill him. Someone murders Sara? Find out who it is and kill them. None of this "he saved his daughter once so he's really good deep down" nonsense. 2 Link to comment
poetgirl925 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 (edited) Eh I don't know. It seems to me that they took great pains to nail that ship shut. I mean, nothing says over like lunging at each other while the BFF/ex watches to the tune of 'Radioactive' - unless it's having that guy die saving you, or having your ex and little sister hook up again without telling you. If they do circle back to it it would probably be some massively bad storytelling lol. Even for a comic show, 'because comics' shouldn't be used to excuse bad narrative and characterization. They've satisfied canon - he was involved with both Canaries - smarter to move on. I disagree with their take on OTPs only getting together in the end. What works for a book or movie doesn't work the same way for a TV show, especially when you don't know how many seasons to plan for. That's when you end up with manufactured relationship drama in the form of plot contrivances or OOC behavior. On a show like this, with so much more story to tell, they'd be better off not making the romance a big drama. Ra's definitely does not feel like much of a threat at this point. Malcolm seems like the one to watch based on his actions so far this season. Or maybe Nyssa. This is part of where they're losing me this season. Nothing seems very epic, and there's no clear threat. It really is kind of boring. Edited February 9, 2015 by poetgirl925 7 Link to comment
tv echo February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 (edited) The Bleeding Cool review (I've listed the six moments below)... The Six Important Moments From This Week’s Arrow Posted February 5, 2015 by by Dan Wickline http://www.bleedingcool.com/2015/02/05/six-important-moments-weeks-arrow/ I guess this is the real Bleeding Cool review of "Uprising" (it's somewhat snarky, so good read)... ‘Only The Student Can Defeat The Master’ – Recapping Arrow 3.12: ‘Uprising’ By Rich Epstein Posted February 7, 2015 http://www.bleedingcool.com/2015/02/07/student-can-defeat-master-recapping-arrow-3-12-uprising/ For some reason, once again, John Diggle (David Ramsey) is nowhere to be found despite being easily the best fighter of the three. Instead, he and Felicity Smoak (Emily Bett Rickards) are monitoring the unanswered 911 calls and directing the junior crimefighters. I think my rant last week was enough on the subject, but I really hope we see a lot less Laurel and a lot more Diggle this week.* * * Felicity cuts the power, and Laurel and Roy go in alone, again. There are lots and lots of bad guys, but that doesn’t matter because Laurel has been training for months. * * * At Verdant, Roy has a heart to heart with Thea. Please explain to me why she is keeping her club open in the heart of the Glades? Are people really going clubbing in between all the robbing and killing? * * * Roy is suddently on team Merlyn after talking to Thea, claiming that Merlyn cares about Thea and this city. Someone seems to have forgotten that Merlyn had Thea kill Sara in an elaborate scheme to save his own neck with Ra’s al Ghul. Doesn’t the fact that he was willing to put Thea in harm’s way kind of prove he doesn’t care all that much? * * * Brick sends his men in against them. They are all holding machine guns, but for some reason they decide to charge in with their fists. Lets see, they’re outnumbered, but they have the guns. So they decide not to use the guns. Makes perfect sense. * * * Meanwhile, Roy is saved by an arrow, which he and Laurel assume means Oliver is back. Except that everyone in Starling City seems to use a bow and arrow, but whatever. * * * Wow. That was a great little speech by Felicity to end the episode, and Emily Bett Rickards was terrific. Something about that last line, “I don’t want to be a woman that you love” just killed me. In just a couple of statements she was able to point out just how much Oliver is betraying by working with Merlyn. Edited February 9, 2015 by tv echo 8 Link to comment
Password February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 That thing about Thea having the club open is exactly what I thought. The police abandoned The Glades because reasons, so why would anyone feel safe to go clubbing at night in an unsafe, abandoned by police area, that is crawling with dangerous men working for someone named Brick? 1 Link to comment
tv echo February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 (edited) Podcast with a bunch of guys talking about TV shows. They talk about the headline that Arrow destroyed its fanbase this week starting at around 37 minutes - unsurprisingly, they scoff at the O/F scene, shippers, and don't like Olicity. However, one guy makes this snarky, spot-on comment (although Felicity never said she hated Oliver): "This is a CW show. If the love interest doesn't say she hates you at some point, it's not going to last." http://www.spoilertv.com/2015/02/stv-podcast-86-person-of-interest.html Edited February 9, 2015 by tv echo Link to comment
tv echo February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Short article that basically outlines the reasons not to trust Malcolm... ‘Arrow': Should Oliver trust Malcolm Merlyn?Caitlin Kelly 1:00 pm, February 8, 2015http://www.hypable.com/arrow-season-3-trust-malcolm-merlyn/ Link to comment
tv echo February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 (edited) I found myself nodding my head in agreement while reading this article. The writer opines that the producers need to do four things to fix Arrow: (1) reduce Team Arrow to Oliver, Diggle and Felicity again and move them to a secret location, and send away Roy and Laurel; (2) have Oliver get back Queen Consolidated; (3) stop copying Batman; and (4) allow Oliver Queen to exist outside of Team Arrow. However, I disagree with the writer's opinion that Felicity doesn't understand Oliver's desire to fight injustice. Broken Arrowby Keith E. Jefferson ⋅ Posted on February 5th, 2015 at 7:17pmhttp://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/02/06/broken-arrow-2664280?lt_source=external,manual Edited February 9, 2015 by tv echo 1 Link to comment
tv echo February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Moved from Relationships thread... This "stroll down memory lane", complete with animated gifts, is cute... unless you hate Olicity: 24 Times Olicity Almost Happened On ‘Arrow’ And Made You Lose Your MindMay they never not make out again.by josh wigler 1/21/2015http://www.mtv.com/news/2054941/arrow-olicity-oliver-felicity/ 3 Link to comment
statsgirl February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 24 Times Olicity Almost Happened On ‘Arrow’ And Made You Lose Your Mind May they never not make out again. by josh wigler 1/21/2015 Fun. (And a bonus when it's a male reviewer who likes them.) 1 Link to comment
poetgirl925 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 I think there are probably more Olicity fanboys than people realize. Both of my brothers watch the show, and they're both comic fanboys. They both love Felicity, and I don't think I've ever heard them complain about her - not like they do about Laurel or about Iris on The Flash. Felicity being such an important part of the team probably helps, though 5 Link to comment
Angel12d February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 I know plenty of Olicity fanboys and most of them are big comic fans too. There's more than people think. 2 Link to comment
poetgirl925 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 I think one of my brothers liked Sara and Oliver as Canary/Arrow, but he says Canary's dead now and Laurel doesn't count, so... he's still griping about Sara's death, actually. He thinks it's the dumbest thing the show's ever done, though we both agreed this Brick arc is probably the worst group of episodes we've ever seen. He's still mostly raging about Laurel, but I find the sudden Malcolm whitewashing more problematic tbh. I have to agree with that one reviewer who said Laurel was the least offensive thing about Uprising, and all things considered that's saying something 3 Link to comment
wonderwall February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 I've gotten about 6 guys in my family to watch the show and bless their hearts they're still watching it even though they dread it. Color me surprised when I found out they all loved olicity (Idk why I was surprised). I thought it was sort of telling that the male population on the Internet who seem to be opposed to shipping olicity may seem to be the minority? Idk about 2 people in my family want felicity to get with Ray for a few episodes. I'm side eyeing them like crazy. But ultimately they all want what Oliver wants. Felicity to be happy. Alsooooo another big male olicity shipper is the dude who runs superherofeed. When asked what he looks like he said "felicitys husband" lol 6 Link to comment
KenyaJ February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 He has a lot of interesting things to say here about the structure of the story this season in general. I especially appreciated his comments about the "And then" storytelling. It's so true. 1 Link to comment
dtissagirl February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 He has a lot of interesting things to say here about the structure of the story this season in general. But one thing that made me laugh is that he took Felicity's "woman you love" speech the wrong way, as did many, many other people. He heard it as her saying, "Look at what happens to women you love, no thanks," rather than "If this is how you honor the women you love, I don't want to be one of them." That misunderstanding is responsible for about 50% of his problems with the ending (the pacing, rushing, and characters acting for plot are responsible for the rest). And that's what happens when terribly clunky lines happen to great characters. People don't understand its meaning because it's purple prose instead of actual clear dialog. Forever ashamed of that line. Yikes. 3 Link to comment
BkWurm1 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 Not that it would matter, but if I could bring myself to interact with MG on social media, I would prompt him to correct that misunderstanding for people who took it wrong, because it's kind of a big difference. He seems rather taken with the "Let everyone have their own interpretation" plan right now. I don't think he should feel that way about that line since it makes no sense for her to suddenly be afraid of what happens to women he loves when she'd been there right along with Oliver as they found out these bad things and never for a second did that become a part of her reasons for being upset with Oliver. Also never had protecting Felicity been a part of Oliver's reason for not being with her, but you'll find lots of people and articles that claim it was/is. Brick sends his men in against them. They are all holding machine guns, but for some reason they decide to charge in with their fists. Lets see, they’re outnumbered, but they have the guns. So they decide not to use the guns. Makes perfect sense. My fanwank is most of them weren't hardened killers, certainly not executioners which spraying machine gun bullets into a crowd of civilians would have amounted to and also a lot of them were more afraid of working for Brick the rest of their lives than getting sent back to jail, hence, half letting the crowd win. 4 Link to comment
poetgirl925 February 9, 2015 Share February 9, 2015 What's funny (okay not really) is the sheer amount of fanwank necessary this season. And by the time we all get done fanwanking the episodes in order to reason through what we think is happening, and more importantly why, we've basically rewritten the narrative in our heads. Worse, I think the actors have resorted to this as well in the past, and sometimes that head narrative still has to be thrown out when yet more WTF situations happen that contradict it. I've been taking classes on writing for serialized dramas since last year, so I usually love reasoning through plot, but Arrow is just giving me a headache this season. I've actually never said WTF so many times in a half-season span since that Mulder-less season of the X-Files. It's kind of comforting to read these reviews and realize I'm not in a minority in thinking that the quality is way off this season. 17 Link to comment
Velocity23 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 http://www.tvovermind.com/arrow/role-identity-arrow-season-3-made-show-characters-better-250382 And then there’s Felicity. After the final scene of last Wednesday’s episode of Arrow, “Uprising,” I’ve seen and heard comments from fans claiming that Felicity was too whiny or self-righteous when she got upset with Oliver and his decision to work with Malcolm; some are even saying that her words to Oliver were too mean and cruel. To anyone and everyone saying that, I have only one thing to say: you’re missing what’s happening in that scene. When Felicity says “I don’t want to be a woman you love” to Oliver, it’s not simply another roadblock on their way to possibly becoming a couple. This moment isn’t about “Olicity,” and it’s not about how Oliver feels (although Stephen Amell absolutely nailed Oliver’s devastation at hearing those words). No, this moment is Felicity declaring who she is; it is claiming and reaffirming her identity.Felicity has always been the moral center of Arrow and, especially during the show’s past two seasons, has acted as Oliver’s conscience, always pushing and urging him to do the right thing. She recognizes the immorality (not to the mention the stupidity) of trusting Malcolm and ensures that she won’t be a part of it. Felicity will not surrender her integrity in order to simply stand by Oliver; she will not compromise who she is, no matter how much she loves him, illustrating just how far she has come from the awkward, babbling IT girl we met back in Season 1 and showing that she has transformed into a woman that has no problem announcing her strength, honor, and conviction.So, yes, it is true that Arrow Season 3 has not been as great as Season 2 so far, but I wouldn’t change anything about it (well, except for maybe the DJ working undercover for the League of Assassins). Because, ultimately, everything that has happened has led us to where we are now, with characters that are more rich and fully defined than ever, guaranteeing that we have not just one but several heroes to root for, whether they’re a costume or not.Read more at http://www.tvovermind.com/arrow/role-identity-arrow-season-3-made-show-characters-better-250382#bs70jeJRFKaKQb7Y.99 3 Link to comment
Danny Franks February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 I don't see why it would be a surprise that plenty of guys like Olicity (for myself, I hate cutesy portmanteaus, so I do my best not to use them). But ultimately, I see most 'shipping as a form of vicarious enjoyment. That you identify with a character and their wants, and if there is something or someone desirable, you want them to have it. So when you've got Felicity, who is smart and funny and cute and hot, you've got a girl who most guys would love to meet and date, and it's a natural extension to wanting Oliver to be with her on the show. From all I've heard about Felicity's speech in the last episode though, I find it rather one sided. Oliver isn't siding with Merlyn because he wants to, it's because he sees no alternative in his need to keep Thea safe. Sure, the reasoning is bullshit and stupid, but it's the reasoning of the writers, rather than the characters. They want to write that Oliver believes he needs Merlyn to defeat Ra's, then that's the way Oliver has to think. But once he does think that, I don't see what's so utterly reprehensible about balancing Sara's death against Thea's life. Felicity seems to be dealing in moral absolutes that don't really fit into this show's rationale. Yes, Merlyn is evil, but is he a bigger threat than Ra's? And perhaps if the writers allowed Oliver to tell his friends what happened with him and Ra's, that he was defeated and left for dead, they might appreciate his need for the assistance of Merlyn a little more. But Oliver's not allowed to be right. Ever. 2 Link to comment
Password February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) It's more than him being wrong, MG straight up said they like making him a dumbass. So everything that happens I handwave because MG told me to. Edited February 10, 2015 by Limbo 1 Link to comment
dtissagirl February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) Yeah, from MG's comments, and Stephen *correcting* the fan at the Dallas con panel, to say Felicity dropped a truth bomb, I'm now thinking Oliver's suffering from MidSeason Dumbdities, to be cured around episode 318 with no complications or side effects. Edited February 10, 2015 by dancingnancy 7 Link to comment
Danny Franks February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 Yeah, from MG's comments, and Stephen *correcting* the fan at the Dallas con panel, to say Felicity dropped a truth bomb, I'm now thinking Oliver's suffering from MidSeason Dumbdities, to be cured around episode 318 with no complications or side effects. But the easiest and most convincing truth should be, 'why do you think Merlyn is any help at all, when he's so petrified of Ra's that he's willing to go to these lengths to keep away from him?' If the writers don't allow any character to ask that question, then it seems to me that they either haven't considered it, or don't view it as being one of the things Oliver is wrong about. Is he wrong in his moral choice? Arguably. Is he wrong from a common sense point of view? Definitely. But the writers don't deal in common sense. Especially not when they can focus on moral grandstanding. 2 Link to comment
dtissagirl February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 In theory I totally agree with you, but this season it's been pretty impossible for me to consider only what's in text. The mental gymnastics are just too much, especially when we're aware of the writers' reasonings behind the scenes. Sigh. 4 Link to comment
poetgirl925 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 MG actually said they like making Oliver a dumbass? Lol good grief. You know, that's fine if you can make it fit characterization and narrative that have come before, but it's not so great if it leaves the audience confused, pissed off, or apathetic. And if you have to constantly clarify narrative via interviews, you are most definitely doing something wrong. I don't know why I'm surprised - he was one of the people behind that embarrassing Green Lantern movie. Not even my love of Ryan Reynolds would ever compel me to watch that movie again lol. 4 Link to comment
Sakura12 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 So they are purposely making Oliver act like a dumbass, actively trying to make their show the most depressing ever and admitted to forcing a scene just so they can get drama out of it. Do they really think that making all your characters stupid to make forced drama and trauma makes a good show? I keep thinking that maybe they'll do something to make me come back to this show, so far I have even less interest in it now then I did before. Ra's al Ghul is the less threatening version of the character I've ever seen, the Black Canary is a joke, Oliver's acting more like an idiot then ever before and Felicity and Diggle stand around in the lair waiting for their one episode a season to do something outside of it. 6 Link to comment
Morrigan2575 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) MG actually said they like making Oliver a dumbass? Lol good grief. You know, that's fine if you can make it fit characterization and narrative that have come before, but it's not so great if it leaves the audience confused, pissed off, or apathetic. And if you have to constantly clarify narrative via interviews, you are most definitely doing something wrong. I don't know why I'm surprised - he was one of the people behind that embarrassing Green Lantern movie. Not even my love of Ryan Reynolds would ever compel me to watch that movie again lol. Pretty sure these aren't spoilers at this point from MG's tumblr. -- Asked why Oliver isn't fighting for Felicity, MG says: "You’ve watched the show. His head is up his ass." -- Asked if Oliver will ever get his head out of his ass when it comes to Felicity, and thanking him for the good work on the show, MG says: "Thanks so much for the kind words. To answer your question, we’ve gotten a lot of mileage out of Oliver having his head up his ass regarding a great many things…" Edited February 10, 2015 by Morrigan2575 1 Link to comment
tv echo February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) And here's the EPs' target demo right here... This week on DC TV; Firestorm on Flash, Canaries on Arrow, Scarecrow on Gotham, and Constantine's finale, & lots more news!by Darth TARDIS. ⋅ Posted on February 10th, 2015 at 7:12amhttp://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/02/10/this-week-on-dc-tv-firestorm-on-flash-canaries-on-arrow-scarecrow-on-gotham-and-constantine-s-finale-lots-more-news-2655380?lt_source=external,manual Some words I didn't think I'd say- dear Grodd (loved him too), Laurel is so awesome. I didn't think it was possible for her character to come as far as she has.... Caity Lotz will make her return as Sara Lance after Laurel's whacked with Vertigo in what is sure to be an epic fight scene.... And Laurel, again, is awesome. I'm sorry I ever doubted her.* * *Oh, and for fans of the source material: this marks the first time Dinah Laurel Lance and Oliver Queen will suit up as Black Canary and Green Arrow together. Awesome stuff. Edited February 10, 2015 by tv echo Link to comment
SonofaBiscuit February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) Who is this Dinah Laurel Lance person they speak of? Seriously, like nobody ever calls her that. In the history of the show, I think that Tommy has called her that twice maybe? It bugs. Edited February 10, 2015 by SonofaBiscuit 11 Link to comment
poetgirl925 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 Some viewers are perfectly happy with run-of-the-mill comic tropes, even when they don't make narrative sense. I'm assuming that guy tunes in to watch people in costume and that's about it. There's nothing wrong with that since people watch for different reasons. However, I get the impression that the EPs would like to rise above average. They're not going to do that with the kind of storytelling going on this season. Link to comment
writersblock51 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 For every glowing, over the top review there's a review that comes in at the other end of the scale of negativity, it seems. And then there are the reviews that make me wonder if they watched the same episode that I did. 2 details that the review by Death TARDIS overlooks - or assumes - for whatever reasons: - Laurel is known on the show as Laurel Lance. She's not Dinah. She's never been Dinah. Her mother's name is DInah and she's not BC either - Oliver isn't being called Green Arrow yet, though I don't know why. So no, Dinah Lance and Green Arrow aren't fighting alongside each other because neither exist on the show These are nitty gritty details, to be sure. But I think the reviewer is overlooking them out of bias and/or enthusiasm. And it's affects my takeaway from the review itself. 9 Link to comment
Chiny11 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) Moved to spoiler discussion thread Edited February 10, 2015 by Chiny11 Link to comment
Starfish35 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) Never mind. Edited February 10, 2015 by Starfish35 Link to comment
SmallScreenDiva February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 (edited) For every glowing, over the top review there's a review that comes in at the other end of the scale of negativity, it seems. And then there are the reviews that make me wonder if they watched the same episode that I did. 2 details that the review by Death TARDIS overlooks - or assumes - for whatever reasons: - Laurel is known on the show as Laurel Lance. She's not Dinah. She's never been Dinah. Her mother's name is DInah and she's not BC either - Oliver isn't being called Green Arrow yet, though I don't know why. So no, Dinah Lance and Green Arrow aren't fighting alongside each other because neither exist on the show These are nitty gritty details, to be sure. But I think the reviewer is overlooking them out of bias and/or enthusiasm. And it's affects my takeaway from the review itself. Whenever a reviewer mentions something that is just factually incorrect about a show, any show, I strike that reviewer off my mental list. I mean, I understand interpreting quotes/scenes differently but damn, son (or daughter), facts are facts! OK, this is not really about "Arrow" but I thought it was interesting and certainly something that could be fodder for more discussion on this forum: AV Club's "Won't they? The power (and pitfalls) of 'shipping" Edited February 10, 2015 by SmallScreenDiva 3 Link to comment
lemotomato February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 Some viewers are perfectly happy with run-of-the-mill comic tropes, even when they don't make narrative sense. I'm assuming that guy tunes in to watch people in costume and that's about it. There's nothing wrong with that since people watch for different reasons. However, I get the impression that the EPs would like to rise above average. They're not going to do that with the kind of storytelling going on this season.In season 2 it felt like the EPs wanted to rise above the average. This season it feels like they just want to introduce as many comic book characters as they can and film scenes that "just look cool" no matter how illogically they have to twist their characters and plots to do so. 5 Link to comment
Delphi February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 For every glowing, over the top review there's a review that comes in at the other end of the scale of negativity, it seems. And then there are the reviews that make me wonder if they watched the same episode that I did. 2 details that the review by Death TARDIS overlooks - or assumes - for whatever reasons: - Laurel is known on the show as Laurel Lance. She's not Dinah. She's never been Dinah. Her mother's name is DInah and she's not BC either - Oliver isn't being called Green Arrow yet, though I don't know why. So no, Dinah Lance and Green Arrow aren't fighting alongside each other because neither exist on the show These are nitty gritty details, to be sure. But I think the reviewer is overlooking them out of bias and/or enthusiasm. And it's affects my takeaway from the review itself. Not trying to be contrary, but to be fair, Laurels name is Dinah. I'd imagine she goes by her middle name to avoid confusion with her mother back when the Lances were a family. But when Laurel is in court, or filing formal charges she goes by Dinah Laurel Lance. Link to comment
poetgirl925 February 10, 2015 Share February 10, 2015 Yeah, but when a reviewer invokes the name Dinah Laurel Lance in the way this one did, it's with the subtext of "Comics, man!" I find it difficult to take those kinds of fanboy reviews seriously because anyone who is familiar with Dinah in comics knows the show has done an extreme disservice to the character. Then again, Green Arrow comics often did a disservice to the character as well - she was usually at her best away from Oliver. Regardless of her name, Laurel is definitely not a Dinah Drake, a Dinah Lance, or a Dinah Laurel Lance. And this Canary playing sidekick to fracking Arsenal is no Black Canary. I kind of hate hearing her full name for that reason. But that's just me. 16 Link to comment
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