Lisa Vanderpump: Pink is her Favorite Color

[Lura]

Interesting theories on LVP and Mohamed.  Her reply sounds gracious to me, and his sounds encouraging and hopeful.  In addition to that, they both know the value of publicity, no matter how minor the issue.

[ryebread]

This is random.  David Charvet?

Best friends?

[kokapetl]

Everyone is his best friend. Yolanda, Lisa, David Foster, David Charvet. 

[RHJunkie]

If one truly believes that their friendship is one that's been built on business and convenience, why would either of them jeopardize a friendship long term that is mutually benefit to both parties? LVP and Mohamed's comments seem similar enough - suggesting that they'll always be friends, but they're not always friends that like each other all of the time. Who cares what Shiva's body language is in a short TMZ clip. It's not about her. Besides, she's like wife/gf #??? LVP's friendship has lasted longer than all of Mohamed's romantic relationships so I'm not inclined to consider Shiva in the equation here. His children's opinions on LVP are the only opinions that I would give any credence to when weighing in on his current and future friendship with LVP.

[ryebread]

Aaaand here we go again...

http://www.realitytea.com/2016/05/04/lisa-vanderpump-not-sure-return-rhobh-feels-attacked-lisa-rinna/

Where have we heard this before? Pinky may not be back next season.  Twitter tears will start flowing in 3...2...1....

Quick!  Someone at Bravo start throwing more money at her.

[zoeysmom]

34 minutes ago, ryebread said:

Aaaand here we go again...

http://www.realitytea.com/2016/05/04/lisa-vanderpump-not-sure-return-rhobh-feels-attacked-lisa-rinna/

Where have we heard this before? Pinky may not be back next season.  Twitter tears will start flowing in 3...2...1....

Quick!  Someone at Bravo start throwing more money at her.

I think she was being honest and may want to see what is coming down the pike.  For example maybe she doesn't want to so the show if Brandi is brought back.  Maybe she doesn't want to go 10 episodes and then being forced to have a sit down with Rinna. (Season 5 it was 10 episodes before she cleared the air with Brandi.)  This doesn't ring of the-I am only returning because I am under contract that going into Season 5.

[WireWrap]

14 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

I think she was being honest and may want to see what is coming down the pike.  For example maybe she doesn't want to so the show if Brandi is brought back.  Maybe she doesn't want to go 10 episodes and then being forced to have a sit down with Rinna. (Season 5 it was 10 episodes before she cleared the air with Brandi.)  This doesn't ring of the-I am only returning because I am under contract that going into Season 5.

Not to mention that it is too early for Bravo to send out the HW contracts. No one knows if they will be asked back at this point, no one.

[ryebread]

24 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Not to mention that it is too early for Bravo to send out the HW contracts. No one knows if they will be asked back at this point, no one.

True but she says almost the exact thing every time, always before contracts are out:

2104:  http://www.examiner.com/article/lisa-vanderpump-says-that-she-does-not-want-to-return-to-rhobh-as-of-now

2015:  http://www.etonline.com/news/165732_will_lisa_vanderpump_return_to_the_real_housewives_of_beverly_hills/

2016:  http://www.realitytea.com/2016/05/04/lisa-vanderpump-not-sure-return-rhobh-feels-attacked-lisa-rinna/

[zoeysmom]

The 2015 wasn't a claim that she would not return-just that offers had not been made.  She said she had enjoyed the experience.

I look at LVP differently.  She sits down as an EP on Vanderpump Rules and bangs out a contract with the same people who produce RHOBH.  It is not as if it is a whole new world from show to show.  It really isn't a mystery if she will be asked to stay on-it is all about terms.  LVP has a perfect out next year-she is building a new restaurant.  We all know how they love to recycle storylines.

[jinjer]

Are any of them on year to year contracts or are they at the election of the production company?

[ryebread]

It wasn't a claim but she was certainly coy.

I only went back as far as 2014 but TamaraTattles printed this about the years prior to 2014:

http://tamaratattles.com/2014/06/20/lisa-vanderpump-finally-stops-pretending-she-might-not-return-to-rhobh/

Quote

                                          Lisa Vanderpump Finally Stops Pretending She Might Not Return To RHOBH

Every fucking season Lisa Vanderpump spends weeks on end toying with her fans acting as if she might not come back to RHOBH. Every.Fucking.Season. But she always does. So tonight, she finally told the truth to her clamoring fans. So um, Yippee?  {snip something Pandora tweeted}

Raise your hand if you are shocked by this news? 

[WireWrap]

8 minutes ago, jinjer said:

Are any of them on year to year contracts or are they at the election of the production company?

According to the leaked contract info, none of them are guaranteed to be asked back for the next season, none of them. Bravo may give them a "3 year" contract but it only means that if Bravo wants them back they agree to come back or face penalties such as not being allowed to appear on any other reality show and it doesn't guarantee they will be asked back.  

7 minutes ago, ryebread said:

It wasn't a claim but she was certainly coy.

I only went back as far as 2014 but TamaraTattles printed this about the years prior to 2014:

http://tamaratattles.com/2014/06/20/lisa-vanderpump-finally-stops-pretending-she-might-not-return-to-rhobh/

Lisa isn't the only HW that is "coy" about returning each season, most of them are. None of them, despite their contracts, are guaranteed that Bravo will ask them back, None. Of. Them. LOL

[ElDosEquis]

About the flowers and the 'immigrant laborers'?

Those flowers will die, look under most trees and you won't see anything growing at the base, the soil around the base of an olive tree isn't conducive to anything growing in it. During the 60-70s most of the gardening work in the Southern Cal area was done by people of Japanese descent. Now? most of the gardening is done by people who immigrate from the San Fernando Valley.

[ryebread]

Just now, WireWrap said:

According to the leaked contract info, none of them are guaranteed to be asked back for the next season, none of them. Bravo may give them a "3 year" contract but it only means that if Bravo wants them back they agree to come back or face penalties such as not being allowed to appear on any other reality show and it doesn't guarantee they will be asked back.  

I would agree with this. Termination without cause seems to be the clause of the century.  Unless they are protected by a union. 

As omniscient as Bravo would like to think they are, and how readily and easily they can steer the narrative and a HWs popularity, even they can be surprised about how the wind will blow on occasion. They like to keep their options open and their HWs twisting in the wind, I would imagine.

[zoeysmom]

17 minutes ago, jinjer said:

Are any of them on year to year contracts or are they at the election of the production company?

Supposedly they sign three year contract making them exclusive to Evolution Media/Bravo. The RH serve year to year at the pleasure of Evolution/Bravo.  So if say LVP has two years left on her contract and decides not to go back for two years she would not be able to do another reality show unless she was waived by Bravo.  If Bravo decides to cut her loose she can do anything she wants. 

[jinjer]

So LVP has to come back or she can't film VDR? 

[WireWrap]

52 minutes ago, jinjer said:

So LVP has to come back or she can't film VDR? 

Not necessarily. If Lisa doesn't want to be on the HW show and Bravo/production/Andy agree that she can leave she can leave the BH show and only do the VPR show, especially since VPR has higher ratings than the BH HW show.

[motorcitymom65]

3 hours ago, jinjer said:

Are any of them on year to year contracts or are they at the election of the production company?

They all serve at the pleasure of Bravo. They might sign a 2 or 3 year contract, but Bravo has the option of picking up the contract each year. For instance after S4 LVP went on and on and on and on for months about how she didn't know whether or not she could bare to return to the show because everyone had been so mean to her. She threatened to quit over on Twitter day after day. The fact was, she was actually under contract with Bravo, so she didn't have any choice in whether or not she returned, but Bravo did. The other girls could be as mean to her as they wanted, and she had absolutely nothing to say about it, but she manipulated her fans into thinking she was considering this.  By getting her fans all crazy about her plight, she had them tweeting Andy and Bravo about how they wouldn't watch the show without her. About how she was critical to the show. The things they were tweeting to the other girls was sick. Some were literally in tears over the prospect. Of course, had Andy and Bravo been considering whether or not to pick up her contract, the fact that LVP had her fans hysterical might factor into their decision as to whether or not she was asked back.

The fact is, if she was miserable and this was all terrible, she would just quit. Why act this way? Why get people who clearly love you all upset? Why would you want to upset people that love you this much? Why not pull a Heather if you are unhappy and just walk away? Make a statement about how much you appreciated the opportunity and go do the other things you want to do? No badmouthing the others because you are unhappy or think you have been treated poorly. If you aren't trying to work people into a frenzy, or trying to get people to beg you to stay because that is what your ego requires, you just go. 

[glowbug]

1 hour ago, motorcitymom65 said:

They all serve at the pleasure of Bravo. They might sign a 2 or 3 year contract, but Bravo has the option of picking up the contract each year. For instance after S4 LVP went on and on and on and on for months about how she didn't know whether or not she could bare to return to the show because everyone had been so mean to her. She threatened to quit over on Twitter day after day. The fact was, she was actually under contract with Bravo, so she didn't have any choice in whether or not she returned, but Bravo did. The other girls could be as mean to her as they wanted, and she had absolutely nothing to say about it, but she manipulated her fans into thinking she was considering this.  

This is not exactly true. LVP did have a choice whether or not she would return. Bravo can't force them to come back, however, had she chosen not to return she would not have been allowed to do any other television show/movie/etc. without Bravo's permission. Of course Bravo would give their consent for her to appear on Vanderpump Rules, her only other prospect at the time, so she may not have seen it as much of loss if she didn't comeback, although I'm sure she didn't want to lose the paycheck. I'm not saying she was truly contemplating not coming back (I have no idea) but it's certainly possible she decided that she would only do Vanderpump Rules and not pursue any other acting/hosting/reality TV gigs until her contract allowed. One reason I think this is a possibility is that it was reported that Andy convinced her to come back, something Andy confirmed himself when he was interviewed by Brandi on WWHL. 

[KFC]

7 hours ago, WireWrap said:

Not to mention that it is too early for Bravo to send out the HW contracts. No one knows if they will be asked back at this point, no one.

With a big hitter like LVP, I'm guessing they've already been in negotiations for a while. I know for a fact that Potomoc was renewed months ago even before it was officially announced, and they were already firming up contracts as early as February, so it wouldn't shock me if the key players like Lisa and Kyle were already in talks about the next season well before the reunion aired.

I suspect the casting is more like assembling the lineup for a team. You have your key players who are in the can long before everyone else, and then it's just a matter of filling in the remaining holes.

[motorcitymom65]

58 minutes ago, glowbug said:

This is not exactly true. LVP did have a choice whether or not she would return. Bravo can't force them to come back, however, had she chosen not to return she would not have been allowed to do any other television show/movie/etc. without Bravo's permission. Of course Bravo would give their consent for her to appear on Vanderpump Rules, her only other prospect at the time, so she may not have seen it as much of loss if she didn't comeback, although I'm sure she didn't want to lose the paycheck. I'm not saying she was truly contemplating not coming back (I have no idea) but it's certainly possible she decided that she would only do Vanderpump Rules and not pursue any other acting/hosting/reality TV gigs until her contract allowed. One reason I think this is a possibility is that it was reported that Andy convinced her to come back, something Andy confirmed himself when he was interviewed by Brandi on WWHL. 

All I know is she was saying she might not come back because it was all so hard, and then said she only came back because she was under contract to do so (article attached below). I've no idea what her contract looks like, but she had signed one that said she had to return. Funny how she left that out while her fans were literally crying about her situation. Why string people along like that? Because she is the ultimate victim. Stuff like that is why it must suck to have to work with her. They are no doubt aware of who has contracts and who doesn't. To have to listen to her go on and on, begging her fans to fight for her, when the other HW's know that she isn't going anywhere must be beyond annoying. And the reason they rightly think she is so manipulating. She lies, or conveniently leaves out facts, so very easily. 

http://www.realitytea.com/2014/07/24/lisa-vanderpump-opens-up-about-her-awful-last-season-and-possible-new-castmembers/

[WireWrap]

41 minutes ago, KFC said:

With a big hitter like LVP, I'm guessing they've already been in negotiations for a while. I know for a fact that Potomoc was renewed months ago even before it was officially announced, and they were already firming up contracts as early as February, so it wouldn't shock me if the key players like Lisa and Kyle were already in talks about the next season well before the reunion aired.

I suspect the casting is more like assembling the lineup for a team. You have your key players who are in the can long before everyone else, and then it's just a matter of filling in the remaining holes.

It is always possible but Andy has even said that contracts don't go out until after the reunion has aired and they get viewer feedback. Oh, and that has been backed up by Alex (NY) and several other HWs, including Kyle that contracts are not done until after the reunion is seen.

29 minutes ago, motorcitymom65 said:

All I know is she was saying she might not come back because it was all so hard, and then said she only came back because she was under contract to do so (article attached below). I've no idea what her contract looks like, but she had signed one that said she had to return. Funny how she left that out while her fans were literally crying about her situation. Why string people along like that? Because she is the ultimate victim. Stuff like that is why it must suck to have to work with her. They are no doubt aware of who has contracts and who doesn't. To have to listen to her go on and on, begging her fans to fight for her, when the other HW's know that she isn't going anywhere must be beyond annoying. And the reason they rightly think she is so manipulating. She lies, or conveniently leaves out facts, so very easily. 

http://www.realitytea.com/2014/07/24/lisa-vanderpump-opens-up-about-her-awful-last-season-and-possible-new-castmembers/

None of them "have" to return if they are willing to face/pay the penalties Bravo puts in their contracts to discourage them quitting. I believe Andy, that he had to talk Lisa into returning because she didn't want to. Maybe they threatened to drop VPR if she quit the HW show or made sure she got an easy edit the next season, who knows but I do believe she was serious about not wanting to come back. I have no idea what she will do about next season but I hope she is back and that there is more focus on Rinna's/Eileen's lives/skeletons and less on Lisa/Kyle and please, very little of Yolanda. LOL

 

Oh....and NO Brandi or Kim, even as FOH ever again. LOL

[zoeysmom]

6 hours ago, jinjer said:

So LVP has to come back or she can't film VDR? 

No she has a separate contract for that show and she is an Executive Producer, not talent.  She and Ken essentially own a percentage of the show. 

[glowbug]

1 hour ago, motorcitymom65 said:

All I know is she was saying she might not come back because it was all so hard, and then said she only came back because she was under contract to do so (article attached below). I've no idea what her contract looks like, but she had signed one that said she had to return. Funny how she left that out while her fans were literally crying about her situation. Why string people along like that? Because she is the ultimate victim. Stuff like that is why it must suck to have to work with her. They are no doubt aware of who has contracts and who doesn't. To have to listen to her go on and on, begging her fans to fight for her, when the other HW's know that she isn't going anywhere must be beyond annoying. And the reason they rightly think she is so manipulating. She lies, or conveniently leaves out facts, so very easily. 

http://www.realitytea.com/2014/07/24/lisa-vanderpump-opens-up-about-her-awful-last-season-and-possible-new-castmembers/

She was correct in saying she was under contract, which meant there would be penalties for quitting but you can't force someone to work. The penalty in the entertainment industry is usually that they aren't allowed to take other work for a certain period of time and I want to say one of the leaked housewives contracts had that in there as a penalty. There may be other penalties as well but this one is largely acknowledged. Ultimately it sounds like she decided not to quit and one of the reasons for that was because she was under contract and would have to face penalties for doing so and another was that she had reconnected with Kyle. Here are her exact quotes from the article you posted:

Quote

“I was under contract with Bravo…Will I regret it? I don’t know.”

“Yes, last season was awful and I think the viewers were very uncomfortable about that and I did feel like quitting after that,” she told E! News. “But time is a great healer and after six months, I kind of reconnected with a couple of them and I thought, ‘OK, I’ll go back in.'”

Again, she may never have had any intention of quitting and facing the penalties but the fact that she lists her contract as one reason she came back doesn't prove that. 

[zoeysmom]

Kim Zolciak walked out in the middle of her RHOA contract and claims she lost (not paid) seven figures.  She continues to have a show on Bravo.  It is pretty basic-if you don't work you don't get paid.  I believe Aviva was teetering on the brink of breach of contract and they removed her from a couple of show introductions.  No idea if she also had her pay docked. 

[RHJunkie]

11 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

Kim Zolciak walked out in the middle of her RHOA contract and claims she lost (not paid) seven figures.  She continues to have a show on Bravo.  It is pretty basic-if you don't work you don't get paid.  I believe Aviva was teetering on the brink of breach of contract and they removed her from a couple of show introductions.  No idea if she also had her pay docked. 

Did she already have her spinoff while filming RHOA? I can't remember. If one of the penalties of breach of contract is no work for a specific period of time, how does that affect her role with Vanderpump Rules?

[ryebread]

If Lisa broke her RHoBH contract, she probably has a non-compete clause which means she can't work for another network for a specific period of time.  She likely could still work for Bravo.  IF they decided to keep her working.  Which in the case of Vanderpump Rules, they would because the ratings are (were?) good.  It's all about the money.

[kokapetl]

Here's the leaked RHOC contract. They seem to contract for a single season, however it does specify that written permission from the producer is required to participate in any other reality tv show up until at least 12 months after the last episode of the season has aired. 

Bravo would be cutting off their nose to spite their face if they withheld permission for Lisa to appear on Vanderpump Rules.

Edited May 6, 2016 by ingenting

[zoeysmom]

Here is a touching Time Magazine letter from LVP to her children.  http://time.com/4313144/mothers-day-letter-lisa-vanderpump/?xid=tcoshare  Happy Mothers Day!!

3 hours ago, RHJunkie said:

Did she already have her spinoff while filming RHOA? I can't remember. If one of the penalties of breach of contract is no work for a specific period of time, how does that affect her role with Vanderpump Rules?

Yes.  because when she quit RHOA she was pregnant with Kash, and the initial season of her show was about her getting married-one of the few times she wasn't pregnant. 

[kokapetl]

23 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Here is a touching Time Magazine letter from LVP to her children.  http://time.com/4313144/mothers-day-letter-lisa-vanderpump/?xid=tcoshare  Happy Mothers Day!!

Yes.  because when she quit RHOA she was pregnant with Kash, and the initial season of her show was about her getting married-one of the few times she wasn't pregnant. 

Doesn't Mother's Day work in the opposite manner?

[WireWrap]

3 hours ago, ingenting said:

Doesn't Mother's Day work in the opposite manner?

Well, I thank my son and my husband on MD as well. LOL

[ryebread]

7 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

Here is a touching Time Magazine letter from LVP to her children.  http://time.com/4313144/mothers-day-letter-lisa-vanderpump/?xid=tcoshare 

Quote

"My happiness will always depend on yours."

Way to put pressure on the kids, Yolanda Lisa. ^^  

Quote

Max has shown us that biology has little to do with a mother’s bond

  What a weird, weird thing to write to one of your kids (Pandora) about the other kid.  Especially as the third line in a love letter to both.   Poor non-Pandi.

[MatildaMoody]

On 5/7/2016 at 8:50 PM, ryebread said:

Way to put pressure on the kids, Yolanda Lisa. ^^  

 

How is it pressure to want your kids to be happy and to be unhappy if they are unhappy? I thought that was a parental norm. I mean, just today after being with my family for Mother's day, my mother told me that she is only happy when all of her children are happy. I didn't realize that I was supposed to feel some sort of pressure from that statement as her child. 

All throughout my life, any time me or my siblings were unhappy, my parents were also unhappy on our behalf. I never considered it pressure and neither did they (my siblings). I guess I need to tell them that we have been it doing wrong. I will wait until next Sunday though, since my dad's birthday is next Saturday. I don't want to rain on his birthday when he tells us that his happiness stems from knowing his children are happy. 

Edited May 8, 2016 by MatildaMoody
Clarity.

[zoeysmom]

I don't think Vanderpump is begging for attention when she expresses a lack of certainty about returning, I think part of it is she plays the role differently than say, Kyle or especially Rinna who was planning for next year by throwing a BBQ.  Kyle seems to read from the rule book about when they are notified and every year she has to subjected to rumors she and her sister are a package deal.  (They aren't.)

Eileen and Erika seem pretty confident they can return as a package deal.  I am doubting they will give Yolanda the latitude they did this year as far as her filming whenever she feels likes it.  Although I do see her cutting a sweet deal so she can hang with her kids over the summer.  Who knows maybe the trip next year will be Fashion Week in Europe. 

[This2getsold]

On 5/2/2016 at 9:44 AM, Lura said:

Ryebread, that picture of the olive tree with flowers is one of the most stunning pictures I've seen in a long time.  I kept going back and looking at it.  Thanks for posting it.  Also, those flowers around the base of the tree don't resemble any mums I've ever seen, and I think they're another of the species that grow in clumps near the soil.  I disagree that they're fake for several reasons that I won't get into here.  But what a picture!  I'd really love to have a tour of his home and grounds!

The garden centers in CA are full of these from about March on. They are a variety of different types of flowers, some tiny daisies (not mums) that do well in CA. They didn't grow out of the ground like these, they were replanted there or just set there in the pot they came in. Not the first time this has been seen in CA. 

They are gorgeous!  

Edited May 9, 2016 by This2getsold
add

[ryebread]

2 hours ago, MatildaMoody said:

How is it pressure to want your kids to be happy and to be unhappy if they are unhappy? I thought that was a parental norm. I mean, just today after being with my family for Mother's day, my mother told me that she is only happy when all of her children are happy. I didn't realize that I was supposed to feel some sort of pressure from that statement as her child. 

All throughout my life, any time me or my siblings were unhappy, my parents were also unhappy on our behalf. I never considered it pressure and neither did they (my siblings). I guess I need to tell them that we have been it doing wrong. I will wait until next Sunday though, since my dad's birthday is next Saturday. I don't want to rain on his birthday when he tells us that his happiness stems from knowing his children are happy. 

I was being a bit sarcastic because many were upset by the pressure Yo put on her kids when she said that if it weren't for her kids she wouldn't want to live anymore.  Similar to Lisa saying to Pandi and non-Pandi, "My happiness depends on yours." That's pressure, too. Yes?  I didn't understand why Yo saying that was such a horrible thing.  Like I really don't take offense to what LVP said either.  Just one more way I see such a double standard between the two.

[Midnight Cheese]

On 5/6/2016 at 8:42 PM, motorcitymom65 said:

All I know is she was saying she might not come back because it was all so hard, and then said she only came back because she was under contract to do so (article attached below). I've no idea what her contract looks like, but she had signed one that said she had to return. Funny how she left that out while her fans were literally crying about her situation. Why string people along like that? Because she is the ultimate victim. Stuff like that is why it must suck to have to work with her. They are no doubt aware of who has contracts and who doesn't. To have to listen to her go on and on, begging her fans to fight for her, when the other HW's know that she isn't going anywhere must be beyond annoying. And the reason they rightly think she is so manipulating. She lies, or conveniently leaves out facts, so very easily. 

http://www.realitytea.com/2014/07/24/lisa-vanderpump-opens-up-about-her-awful-last-season-and-possible-new-castmembers/

All of the LVPisms about will I, won't I? return, crack me up!  She's done it so often, and I read those kinds of social media messages in her accent and encourage all snarkers to do the same.  It gets hilarious to think of her with her 2-pound lashes on, whispering, 'Shall I endeavah to retuhn?'  She is traditionally the most dramatical of drama llamas when it comes time to re-up.  We know her satin-covered rumpy will be sitting in a velvet chair for her THs next season every season that this show exists.

[jaync]

I think adhering to the adage "'You're only as happy as your least happy child" is quite different than saying you want to kill yourself, but you can't because you have to find a cure for an invisible disease. That may not be pressuring, but it has to be upsetting, as is having unnecessary thoughts of your death put in your children's minds before having routine surgery.

Edited May 9, 2016 by jaync

[PhilMarlowe2]

FWIW, I think both sentiments are kind of creepy and self-serving. It's like, way to make it all about you. Why not just say, I want you to be happy?

[ryebread]

9 hours ago, PhilMarlowe2 said:

FWIW, I think both sentiments are kind of creepy and self-serving. It's like, way to make it all about you. Why not just say, I want you to be happy?

In her letter she says,

Quote

Despite the liberties I took as I raised you both—kissing every inch of chubby baby fat I could find, ridiculously naming your teddy “Paws,” your feathers, pork-chops, and endless lists, our games—I have been comforted by the fact that you indulging me really filled a gap in my life.

First of all, WTH?  Had Yo written that mess we'd be wondering if her brain function had slipped to 40%

The second part, about the kids filling a gap in her life by letting them indulge her? - again, I get it - but had Yo written that - holy hell.  

[Higgins]

11 hours ago, PhilMarlowe2 said:

FWIW, I think both sentiments are kind of creepy and self-serving. It's like, way to make it all about you. Why not just say, I want you to be happy?

Except that it is true. As a mother to grown children, I feel their pain and there is nothing I can do to change that. When they are sad, I am sad. No way around it , it is built into my DNA.

Edited May 9, 2016 by Higgins

[WireWrap]

14 hours ago, ryebread said:

50 minutes ago, ryebread said:

In her letter she says,

First of all, WTH?  Had Yo written that mess we'd be wondering if her brain function had slipped to 40%

The second part, about the kids filling a gap in her life by letting them indulge her? - again, I get it - but had Yo written that - holy hell.  

I was being a bit sarcastic because many were upset by the pressure Yo put on her kids when she said that if it weren't for her kids she wouldn't want to live anymore.  Similar to Lisa saying to Pandi and non-Pandi, "My happiness depends on yours." That's pressure, too. Yes?  I didn't understand why Yo saying that was such a horrible thing.  Like I really don't take offense to what LVP said either.  Just one more way I see such a double standard between the two.

 

As to the other, I think she means that they, Pandora/Max, played silly games with Lisa, goofy games she made up, therefore indulging "her". And Yes, I get what she means about her children filling a gap in her life. Yolanda has said something similar on the show about playing with her kids when they were little and I didn't think twice about it. I think both women, Lisa/Yolanda love their children and were good Moms.

  I'm not so sure they are comparable. 1 says a mom finds happiness in her children's happiness, whereas the other says I would have killed myself were it not for my kids. I just don't find a child happiness and a mothers possible suicide comparable.

[Jel]

Same here -- my kid's happiness is my happiness. I wish it wasn't always that way, but it is.

I also see a difference between what Lisa said and what Yolanda said. As a teenager, I'd rather have heard that my mom's happiness or unhappiness is dependent on mine, vs. she might be suffering so much that she wants to kill herself. 

[ryebread]

8 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

I'm not so sure they are comparable. 1 says a mom finds happiness in her children's happiness, whereas the other says I would have killed myself were it not for my kids. I just don't find a child happiness and a mothers possible suicide comparable.

Well, what she said was:

"My happiness will always depend on yours."  In other words:  If you're unhappy, I will always be unhappy.  That = pressure

Now, Yolanda was talking about how she was in so much pain and so hopeless that if she didn't have her children to live for, she wouldn't want to live anymore.  I actually understand more what Yolanda was saying.  Although neither one of their statements bugged me. 

My point was more about the double standard of what Lisa gets away with vs. what Yo does.  I understand that Yo is infinitely less liked than Lisa but still.  I highly doubt Yolanda could get away with "My happiness will always depend on yours" in a letter to the kids without backlash.

[ryebread]

25 minutes ago, Jel said:

Same here -- my kid's happiness is my happiness. I wish it wasn't always that way, but it is.

I also see a difference between what Lisa said and what Yolanda said. As a teenager, I'd rather have heard that my mom's happiness or unhappiness is dependent on mine, vs. she might be suffering so much that she wants to kill herself. 

I understand that and I fully agree. 

But can you (general you) also imagine being so depressed, sick and hopeless that you might think, "If I didn't have these children to live for, I wouldn't want to live like this anymore."

I kept miscarrying babies.  A full term loss.  One IVF after another.  Was so hormonal and depressed I remember thinking, "If I didn't have a 3-year-old at home I don't think I could handle this pain anymore."  And my god, if I had been going through a divorce at the same time! I wasn't thinking rationally, obviously.  And I have to give the benefit of the doubt to Yo that she wasn't either. But if you (general you) think Yo was faking her illnesses, than yeah, I can see why that seemed like such a horrific statement from her.

But, I agree with PhilMarlowe.  All either of them had to say was either nothing or "I just want you all to be happy." Period.  No pressures.

[Higgins]

I can imagine thinking it but not sharing either sentiment. I share it with my husband that I am only as happy as my saddest child but I try to not let them feel the true weight of it. If they are luck enough to become mothers (parents) they will feel it too along with the joy of their children's joy.

Edited May 9, 2016 by Higgins

[ryebread]

So Lil Ryebread is now a senior in high school.

We've talked honestly about his conception (Hello, Mr. Petrie Dish!) and about the loss of his siblings.  I've actually said to him as a teen, that had it not been for his sweet little 3-year-old self when we were in the heat of all that, I don't know if I could've gone on. And I stand by that even now. It felt that bad.

IYO, is that so horrible to say? Because as I thought it, way back when - and as I said it recently, I was just expressing how deeply, deeply grateful I am for my little man.  Then and now.  

I don't think he takes it any other way than the spirit in which it is meant.  Hmm.  I'll have to ask him when he gets home from school.  I don't think Gigi, Bella and Anwar took offense or felt pressure.  It's such a head scratcher to me.

[PhilMarlowe2]

Yes, I think there is a huge difference between thinking and expressing it. I am coming from a background of having a very sweet mother who loved me very much, but who was also incredibly emotionally manipulative and boundary-less with her emotional needs. Every situation is different, but I know full well how, well, gross it can feel when you have a mother saying things like, "My happiness depends on you" or "If you're unhappy, I'm unhappy," or "If it weren't for my kids, I would kill myself." It's too much (for me, anyway). I think the greatest gift a parent can give their son or daughter is the complete freedom to live their lives without any sense that they are in any way "responsible" for their parents' happiness. I have sensed emotional manipulation in both LVP and Yolanda (and don't even get me started on what poor Brandi's and Taylor's and Kim's kids go through - I really feel so much compassion for the burden those kids take on). As much as I often don't like her, Kyle is really the standout for me on this show as a mother who seems to genuinely love her kids and also seems to give them the space they need to be simply be themselves. I don't think I've ever heard Kyle say or do anything remotely emotionally dependent - and yet you can see how invested she is in their happiness. Even her tears in sending them off to college felt like it was about her own sadness, and not applying some covert pressure on her daughter or trying to make it all about her. This is all my opinion, of course.

Edited May 9, 2016 by PhilMarlowe2

[Jel]

1 hour ago, ryebread said:

I understand that and I fully agree. 

But can you (general you) also imagine being so depressed, sick and hopeless that you might think, "If I didn't have these children to live for, I wouldn't want to live like this anymore."

I kept miscarrying babies.  A full term loss.  One IVF after another.  Was so hormonal and depressed I remember thinking, "If I didn't have a 3-year-old at home I don't think I could handle this pain anymore."  And my god, if I had been going through a divorce at the same time! I wasn't thinking rationally, obviously.  And I have to give the benefit of the doubt to Yo that she wasn't either. But if you (general you) think Yo was faking her illnesses, than yeah, I can see why that seemed like such a horrific statement from her.

But, I agree with PhilMarlowe.  All either of them had to say was either nothing or "I just want you all to be happy." Period.  No pressures.

Sorry you went though all of that Ryebread.

To answer your question, yes, I can completely understand that feeling;  and if that is how she felt, she has nothing but sympathy and compassion from me. Period. I think the thing that takes me aback  is the saying it. If I felt that, would I say it out loud, within (virtual) earshot of my kids? I would not because I wouldn't want them to worry. I guess that's why I see a difference -- do understand the feeling, don't understand the actually saying it.  Maybe the kids didn't give it a second thought though, I don't know.

I'm digging way too deep here, but depression messes with your head and causes you to think things like people would be better off without me. That's why I tend to think that in addition to Lyme, Yo also has a clinical depression that she might not be willing to look at (for whatever reason -- might take away from her genuine efforts to bring attention to Lyme disease, for example.)  But just pure speckolatin' on my part.

Adding a PS -- I think LVP gets away with it because so many of us can relate. I know I have said words to the effect of "I'm only happy if you're happy" more than once. It never occurred to me that that was pressure, but now that you mention it, I can see how it could be. I'm going to ask!

Edited May 9, 2016 by Jel

[ryebread]

11 minutes ago, Jel said:

Sorry you went though all of that Ryebread.

I know I have said words to the effect of "I'm only happy if you're happy" more than once. It never occurred to me that that was pressure, but now that you mention it, I can see how it could be. I'm going to ask!

Thanks, Jel. 

Our poor kids are in for it.  They thought they were going to have light conversation with mom, today. I have utmost confidence, though, that mine will look at me after I ask, like I'm weird but with such understanding and adoration. LOL  He'll look at me like that because he's confident that I am, and always have been, crazy in love with him just like Gigi, Bella and Anwar know how Yo feels about them. That's why these sayings don't really get me hepped up (can you tell HA!)  unless someone is being held to a higher standard for saying them.