S20.E07: Caretaker

[preeya]

As soon as St. Olivia's phone rang at the end, I knew the mom (Sasha Alexander) killed herself.

An afterthought; Sasha should have hired Weatherly (Jason Bull) to manipulate the jury into all 3, not guilties.

 

I wonder if Noah will get that bed for Christmas?

Edited November 3, 2018 by preeya

[howiveaddict]

31 minutes ago, preeya said:

As soon as St. Olivia's phone rang at the end, I knew the mom (Sasha Alexander) killed herself.

An afterthought; Sasha should have hired Weatherly (Jason Bull) to manipulate the jury into all 3, not guilties.

 

I wonder if Noah will get that bed for Christmas?

Remember those phone calls from the mother ship and McCoy days.  Did not feel bad the mother killed herself, except she didn't get to rot in jail.

Olivia is more distraught  now, over a child murder, since she is a mother herself. Eye roll!

[NYCFree]

I remember the murder this was based on really well. I used to live one street over from the building where the murders occurred. The specific afternoon that they happened I was walking with my son (age ten at the time) home from the grocery store. It is a very safe neighborhood for NYC, and when he asked if he could run ahead home, I allowed him to do so. Later, I was completely freaked out that I let him run by the building just at the time the nanny was killing the poor kids upstairs.

I recently saw that Hargitay and her family lived in the same basic area and are sellling their family brownstone. I wonder if she was struck by the murders as well. It’s a weird bit of egocentricism, to be more horrified by an already horrific crime, such as child murder, because some details are closer to your own family. To be clear, I am including myself in this as well.

[llongori]

6 hours ago, Iguessnot said:

Why wouldn't you convict her? Just because she bought into the superwoman syndrome she gets to slaughter her family and walk free? Because she's a "mom" she can do no wrong?

I said, based on Stone's closing, I wouldn't convict her.  He phoned it in, no passion, no emphatic assertions of her guilt.  He sounded like he was bored and just wanted to be done.  I've heard more compelling arguments from a high school student trying to sell me 4 pounds of cookie dough.

 

I also said the whole trial part was pathetic.  Neither lawyer did a good job.  We saw no expert testimony, which should be key in a trial where the accused is asserting insanity.  We're left to our own devices to discern why she was not guilty for the deaths of the children but guilty for the husband.  As someone mentioned upstream, it's like they skimped on the trial so we could have more angst from Benson and Rollins.

[Xeliou66]

Benson’s overdramatic expressions have been a problem the last few seasons, but this episode was one of her worst, she’s been an SVU cop for 2 decades and yet she acted like she’s never seen anything like this, and I hate how she acts like mothers can do no wrong and it’s so shocking when women commit crimes, she has such a major bias towards females. And Benson’s line about getting the bed for Noah was just odd, Benson was at her over the top worst in this episode. The Benson/Rollins scenes were just awful, I’m so tired of them constantly being affected by cases because they are mothers and their scenes in this episode were so over the top and saccharine. I wish they had eliminated the Benson/Rollins crap and instead given us more trial scenes, but Mariska has to dominate the screen time. If they had eliminated the Benson/Rollins crap and given us more legal scenes, this would’ve been a great episode, instead it was just good, still the best of season 20 IMO.

[WineCheeseChocolat]

2 hours ago, incandescent said:

 

SVU is in DIRE need of a new detective to express shock and disbelief at the various depravities that the unit must investigate, because having Olivia Benson— who has herself investigated a family annihilator and various murderous mothers— react so naively was just bizarre.

 

Your comment made me think of Carisi in the Eric Gardner/Central Park Five/rapist dentist uncle episode some seasons back. “He raped his own niece?!” I gave Carisi a bit of a break since he was new but seriously he had never heard of such a thing before, in his musical chairs with different SVUs before Manhattan?

And the family annihilator episode was literally called “Annihilated.” Dylan Walsh character killed his whole family and his mistress but for a long time in the episode they thought the annihilator was the mom. It led to Eli because Stabler was so distraught he went to Kathy (who he was separated from) and they ended up having comfort sex.

[ForeverAlone]

I'm glad the show didn't go the route of the "Killer Nanny", which I assumed they were ripping that particular case from the headlines (though I could appreciate Amanda's aside about how she was glad the nanny wasn't the killer). It's a nice change of pace to see a female perpetrator.

While I generally liked this case, I do think it piled on the mommy talk a bit too much. Granted, I don't have children, so I don't have the same mindset as the women who do have children. If they were going that route, it might have been interesting (though admittedly uncomfortable) for the team to have an honest conversation about why (sane) women would kill their children. Instead there was just this continual shock about the idea of a woman killing her kids. Come on! These people have been in SVU for years. There is no way this was the first time they have run into a killer mother. And as a woman who doesn't feel any sort of pressure to live up to societal expectations, I had to roll my eyes a bit at the men who kept empathizing how hard it is to be a modern woman. I would have loved it if Peter had asked the mother why she had kids in the first place. I'm sure she would have just said more stuff about societal pressures and the like. 

I also would have preferred it if we had actually seen the psychologist testify in court, rather than hearing second hand from Olivia what she said. Yes, yes, this is the Olivia Benson show, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

And it would have been interesting if a character (likely Fin, because he keeps it real like that) had commented that the jury couldn't believe that the mom was guilty of killing her kids, only because they didn't want to think that an upper class white lady would knowingly and willingly kill her kids. Because come on, it would have been a completely different verdict if the mother was a different race and socioeconomic class. 

Again, I thought this was a pretty good episode for the most part. I just wish the storytelling had been a little bit tighter and little bit less commentary. 

[Fellaway]

On 11/2/2018 at 12:05 AM, ChristiKRN said:

This is nitpicky, but Rollins' facial expressions were distracting, especially in the 1st interview with the mother. I don't know if she was trying to convey disbelief, empathy, trying to stay awake, smelling something bad...  Not impressed with the acting.

 

I've always felt KG, sometimes, makes some truly odd acting choices, particularly in her facial expressions, and MH...  While no Meryl Streep, I've always thought her a competent actress, but since season 18 through now, I think her acting skills have degraded.  Either that or no one is behind the scenes anymore with pull enough to save her from herself.  Putting them together so much is kind of painful.

On 11/2/2018 at 7:42 AM, wknt3 said:

When it comes to her love life Amanda is much dumber than your average post.

And increasingly in her professional life, too.  Amanda has skills, but her judgement sucks.  After some of the things she's pulled, she shouldn't have her shield anymore. 

19 hours ago, cfinboston said:

Anna is inexplicably smart enough to be a lawyer and make millions of dollars yet she leaves blood spattered tennis shoes in her desk drawer? 

Maybe we were supposed to think she wanted to be caught?  And I'm not sure how many of her millions of dollars were legitimately earned.  She wasn't smart enough to cover her tracks at her law firm.

17 hours ago, SarahPrtr said:

I understand a parent empathising with other parents about children, but I absoutely cannot STAND it when they disregard anyone else's opinion just because they are not parents.  What does that mean?  That every single parent is a good person who loves children, but childless people are absolute dicks who are incapable of feeling sorrow and loss at the death/abuse of children???  I remember Olivia getting pissed off at Elliot for giving her the "You're not a parent, you wouldn't understand" line.  Oh, but NOW that she TOO is a mother, she's on The Same Level of other parents, so she could do her job better!  Not. 

Preach.  Unfortunately, I think it's endemic to our society that parents have more value and, as you say, empathy, than those without kids.  Thanks, SVU, for perpetuating that attitude.

17 hours ago, llongori said:

Overall, the trial part of this episode was lame.  The defense attorney was unpersuasive.  And even though I knew the mom was the killer, I wouldn't have convicted her based on Stone's closing argument.  It's a wonder they convicted her of the husband's murder.

At the risk of sounding like I hate Stone - I don't, but nor do I like him.  I think he's just kind of bland. - the court cases last season and this have been awful, poorly written, uncompelling, condensed versions of what they used to be on SVU, and rarely have much basis in actual law anymore.  This one was no different.

14 hours ago, Samantha84 said:

I don't expect these writers to have watched every single scene and episode but don't make broad statements that are easily refuted. Olivia has been on this job for more than 20 years; her not catching a mother killing babies case is crazy & sloppy writing  

And it would be so easy for them to deal with this.  I know the budget is tight, but get an intern to check continuity.  Hey, just get a volunteer from forums like this one.  The folks here know more about SVU's history than the current showrunners apparently ever will.

14 hours ago, SCS said:

I can't remember: is this the official final season of SVU (no idea where I think I read that)? Maybe last night was the first step in Olivia's turning in her retirement papers to spend more time with the kid.  

Nothing's been said to that effect.  MH has said she's not ready to hang it up yet, and the network has said as long as she wants to continue, they're behind her.  (Though I don't know if I'd put much stock in that latter.  NBC is a business, after all.)  I'd be surprised if the show doesn't get a Season 21, at least, to break the record.

13 hours ago, BunchOMalarkey said:

And as far as her suicide at the end, that could have been because she was caught and actually had to pay for her crimes. 

I was expecting to hear she'd been killed by her fellow inmates.  It was kind of surprising to me that she killed herself.  Aren't family annihilators arrogant in their belief in their own place in the world (thinking back to the case from the mothership)?  Maybe her suicide proves she wasn't a family annihilator.

12 hours ago, incandescent said:

SVU is in DIRE need of a new detective to express shock and disbelief at the various depravities that the unit must investigate, because having Olivia Benson— who has herself investigated a family annihilator and various murderous mothers— react so naively was just bizarre.

I don't disagree - I still miss Mike Dodds. - but this show wants to have it both ways with Benson - she has the prestige and power of being the lieutenant, but she's always front and center on cases.  Hence the "we're shorthanded" excuse.  Add another detective, and I doubt they have the budget anymore for that, there goes the excuse for her working cases and they want her working cases.  I don't think it's just MH's ego dictating that.  Me, I don't trust them to not take Carisi's precious little screentime away from him if they added another detective.  The current showrunners don't seem to get balance between characters like Leight did.  Personally, I resent how much time we've had on Stone's personal life since he's been on, not even a full season yet, in comparison to the decided lack of anything about him in the going on five seasons Carisi's been on.

Edited November 3, 2018 by Fellaway

[Ms Blue Jay]

16 hours ago, cfinboston said:

Plus the defense attorney sounded like he was auditioning for a remake of Fargo.

I couldn't take anything he said seriously.

[Bexx88]

If they're going to insist on crossovers with a cancelled show no one cares about any more, can they at least work in an Iron Fist crossover? That'd be fun. Same city, at least.

Edited November 3, 2018 by Bexx88

[UNOSEZ]

Did SVU's area of operations change to the part of Manhattan where its 95% white Lady victims and 3% horrible white guys?.. It sure feels like  it.. I'll be honest my viewing has tailed off the last 1.5 seasons but the last time I remembered victims of color were those kids that got fondled or raped by their dentist or something and and they hat episode was more about the white copper  they thought killed the guy

[hookedontv]

On 11/1/2018 at 11:18 PM, MissL said:

And Olivia is surprised a mom killed her kids? Hasn't she been in SVU like forever? This can't be the first she's seen that.

Exactly. And while it’s not common, it happens. You just need to watch the news, you don’t even need to be on the SVU squad. Silly that Olivia was so shocked. 

[Samantha84]

No offense but I wish they'd get rid of Rollins and bring in another actress/character. Maybe two. One to be paired with Carsi and other w Fin and Olivia. 

[wknt3]

On 11/3/2018 at 2:38 AM, Fellaway said:

Add another detective, and I doubt they have the budget anymore for that

 

I don't know about that I'm sure that for what they spent on Brooke Shields they could have found a younger actor willing to book a recurring gig with the potential to become part of the Dick Wolf repertory. I've said before that money is an issue with the same few characters doing everything and much of the non-police investigative personnel being eliminated and only referenced instead of shown, but if TPTB really wanted to they could do it instead of say making Rollins scumbag doctor baby daddy recurring...
 

20 hours ago, Bexx88 said:

If they're going to insist on crossovers with a cancelled show no one cares about any more, can they at least work in an Iron Fist crossover? That'd be fun. Same city, at least.

 

Yeah a white billionaire tech company owner who claims to have found enlightenment in Eastern religion and have a magic hand. I'm sure Marvel would approve the SVU writers take on that concept!
 

17 hours ago, Samantha84 said:

No offense but I wish they'd get rid of Rollins and bring in another actress/character. Maybe two. One to be paired with Carsi and other w Fin and Olivia. 

I'm sure most of us here would not take offense. Although the problem is in the writing more than the character or the actress. I think Giddish has great chemistry with most of the cast and they did find a way to make her interesting and likeable before pissing that hard work away. Used properly as someone who has worked with Liv long enough not to be as impressed as Carisi and is not as loyal as Fin and is the member of the squad in whom Benson sees most of the positive and negative traits of both herself and Stabler they could do some great stuff that simply isn't feasible with someone new. But if they are going to make her an unprofessional idiot who can't stop getting knocked up in bad relationships than yes getting rid of her and bringing in some fresh blood to get us across the finish line is certainly a better choice.

Edited November 4, 2018 by wknt3

[kicotan]

25 minutes ago, wknt3 said:

Although the problem is in the writing more than the character or the actress.

I couldn’t agree more.

I’m disappointed once again by this episode’s writing, even more than Hargitay & Giddish’s (over)acting.

The dialogue was, with the exception of anything that came out of Fin’s mouth, cringeworthy.  Olivia’s feigned shock was puzzling~surely she’d have at the very least heard of mother’s who have killed their children.  I’m not even a NYPD lieutenant and I’ve heard of such an awful thing.  Too bad Huang isn’t hanging around the squad room anymore.

I continue to watch in the hope that it will surprise me before it is all over and not just end up being a disappointment, I just wonder how long it can go on with such horrendous writing.

[UNOSEZ]

3 hours ago, Samantha84 said:

No offense but I wish they'd get rid of Rollins and bring in another actress/character. Maybe two. One to be paired with Carsi and other w Fin and Olivia. 

They should bring back Kylie bunbury's character from last season.. I mean she wouldn't stay  so anti svu obviously but I liked all her push back  to Olivia.. And as someone who grew up with Olivia Benson... I wouldnt mind seeing the character ive been missing these last few years and a pushy young detective who doesn't fall at her feet may bring Olivia back from St.  Olivia land and could shake up the rest of the squad

[Fellaway]

2 hours ago, wknt3 said:

I don't know about that I'm sure that for what they spent on Brooke Shields they could have found a younger actor willing to book a recurring gig with the potential to become part of the Dick Wolf repertory. I've said before that money is an issue with the same few characters doing everything and much of the non-police investigative personnel being eliminated and only referenced instead of shown, but if TPTB really wanted to they could do it instead of say making Rollins scumbag doctor baby daddy recurring...

Yeah, the money is obviously tighter, but I don't dispute they could use what they have more wisely.  With the current climate on the show, though, it doesn't surprise me that they spent money on BS.  That was a storyline that serviced MH/Benson, who has become the be all to end all of the show, and the Noah drama.  And Rollins seems to be taking second position, lately.  Honestly, you could write novels about what we know of Olivia's and Amanda's and, soon, Stone's personal lives, while what we know of Fin's and Carisi's wouldn't fill a comic book.

I don't like to rag on MH or KG too much because I do like both of them, and Benson and Rollins, but I think maybe we're seeing the limitations of their acting abilities with the bad writing we've been subjected to since 18.

1 hour ago, kicotan said:

I’m disappointed once again by this episode’s writing, even more than Hargitay & Giddish’s (over)acting.

This ep had an interesting premise and SA was up to the task of acting it, but, ye gads, the writing!  But it seemed bad in a different way than usual to me.  It seemed like the writers had no idea who these characters are, not even the post season 17 versions.

[ChristiKRN]

1 hour ago, UNOSEZ said:

They should bring back Kylie bunbury's character from last season.. I mean she wouldn't stay  so anti svu obviously but I liked all her push back  to Olivia.. And as someone who grew up with Olivia Benson... I wouldnt mind seeing the character ive been missing these last few years and a pushy young detective who doesn't fall at her feet may bring Olivia back from St.  Olivia land and could shake up the rest of the squad

I couldn't agree more... SVU is in dire need of some fresh blood and perspective.  I used to love Benson for her strength and commitment (which she obviously still has), but I think it started to change for me around the end of the William Lewis saga, when she was ridiculously stupid enough to offer herself up to him in exchange for the little girl.  To me, it seems that she doesn't have confidence in the rest of the squad to solve the case as evidenced by her continual push to be the lead in all cases when she should be delegating more.  Then, she complains about not having enough time with Noah.  She's developed a martyr complex of mythical proportions, which has made her a less likable character for me.  

This could have been a great episode.  Good case, good investigation, but then it started to fall flat.  They could have fleshed out the trial more but instead we were subjected to multiple scenes of Benson and Rollins' shock and horror (which were horribly acted by both actresses) followed by roses and baby-bump cradling. Whoever wrote and directed those scenes should be fired. 

[Fellaway]

3 minutes ago, ChristiKRN said:

SVU is in dire need of some fresh blood and perspective. 

The problem is they'd get rid of or reduce the onscreen time of the wrong people.  No way are they taking anything away from MH, not unless she wants them to.  Likewise, I don't think they would from KG either.  They seem to be bumping her up in status on the show, actually.

3 minutes ago, ChristiKRN said:

This could have been a great episode. 

What's sad is they probably thought it was a great episode that portrayed the travails of modern women with depth and nuance and showed how strong women, like Benson and Rollins, do it.  Um, no.

[Iguessnot]

23 hours ago, llongori said:

I said, based on Stone's closing, I wouldn't convict her.  He phoned it in, no passion, no emphatic assertions of her guilt.  He sounded like he was bored and just wanted to be done.  I've heard more compelling arguments from a high school student trying to sell me 4 pounds of cookie dough.

 

I also said the whole trial part was pathetic.  Neither lawyer did a good job.  We saw no expert testimony, which should be key in a trial where the accused is asserting insanity.  We're left to our own devices to discern why she was not guilty for the deaths of the children but guilty for the husband.  As someone mentioned upstream, it's like they skimped on the trial so we could have more angst from Benson and Rollins.

Yes, the trial was pathetic. Maybe if this was the 1930's I could understand why the show would think the audience would accept that a mommy couldn't kill her kids, thus she must be insane. I was seriously so spitting mad at the premise I could barely pay attention to the trial. Did her lawyer explain how the wee weak little insane mommy managed to set up that scam organization in her husband's name just for her benefit?

[DangerousMinds]

5 minutes ago, Iguessnot said:

Yes, the trial was pathetic. Maybe if this was the 1930's I could understand why the show would think the audience would accept that a mommy couldn't kill her kids, thus she must be insane. I was seriously so spitting mad at the premise I could barely pay attention to the trial. Did her lawyer explain how the wee weak little insane mommy managed to set up that scam organization in her husband's name just for her benefit?

Yeah, I was incredibly pissed off too. 

[Xeliou66]

I didn’t find the writing bad, other than the Benson/Rollins scenes. Benson’s lines were awful, as was Mariska’s overacting, it was absurd how Benson was acting so shocked at a mom killing her children, like she had never heard of anything like it. She thinks all women, especially mothers, are angels that can do no wrong, and her overdramatic expressions at every turn in the case are just insane. Other than the Benson/Rollins mommy drama, the episode was good.

We definitely have room to add in another character, but that would take screen time and focus off of Mariska/Benson, and that won’t happen because Mariska has such major influence over the show, and Rollins has become the number 2 character, this show should just be renamed the super single mommies show.

[SarahPrtr]

They want to make Olivia and Amanda out to be tough, working Supermothers, but then they turn the women pathetic by making them incapable of carrying out good decisions for themselves and staying rational.  You don't need to be an SVU detective to know that there are vile, evil people in the world, committing the most repugnant, unspeakable crimes.  Has Olivia not ever heard of Munchausen's by proxy?  Almost all the perpetrators are women, mostly mothers.  How could any police officer in the US not know of Diane Downs, Andrea Yates, Mary Beth Tinning or Susan Smith???  It's not just being naive when as a detective, you believe that a mother is incapable of killing her children - you sound downright stupid and incompetent.

 

There are so many Asians who live in New York, but apart from some gang-related plotlines, there have been very very small number of special victims of Asian background in TWENTY SEASONS.  There are lots of children/teenagers who have been victims of violent abuse by their parents (mostly fathers) but it's very much swept under the rug and not discussed (I'm from one of those families).  The mothers tend to just accept it and turn a blind eye and deny that it's happening or that "it's not that bad." or that the kids actually deserved it (like my mother).  It would be great if they could write something on that.  Many of my generation (GenX) and I have shared similar stories, especially the first generation Asians.  Even a tiger-mum story would be something.

Edited November 4, 2018 by SarahPrtr
typo

[Ms Blue Jay]

20 hours ago, Samantha84 said:

No offense but I wish they'd get rid of Rollins and bring in another actress/character. Maybe two. One to be paired with Carsi and other w Fin and Olivia. 

I'm not offended.  I'm totally 100% on board with this idea.  I'm good with more Carisi and Fin at all points.

17 hours ago, UNOSEZ said:

They should bring back Kylie bunbury's character from last season.. I mean she wouldn't stay  so anti svu obviously but I liked all her push back  to Olivia.. And as someone who grew up with Olivia Benson... I wouldnt mind seeing the character ive been missing these last few years and a pushy young detective who doesn't fall at her feet may bring Olivia back from St.  Olivia land and could shake up the rest of the squad

Great idea.

[shksabelle]

Jesus H. Christ, why don’t Liv and Amanda make play dates for their kids, have sleepovers, braid each other”s hair, and leave the police work to the menz. 

Hargitay’s acting gets worse every week. 

On the plus side, good to see Sasha Alexander. 

[SarahPrtr]

1 hour ago, shksabelle said:

Jesus H. Christ, why don’t Liv and Amanda make play dates for their kids, have sleepovers, braid each other”s hair, and leave the police work to the menz. 

Hargitay’s acting gets worse every week. 

 

I think her ego got blown up by the Golden Globes award and she thinks that she could do no wrong, or even need direction with regards to acting.

[TV Diva Queen]

On 11/2/2018 at 3:43 PM, cfinboston said:

Plus the defense attorney sounded like he was auditioning for a remake of Fargo.

Ugh - I'm from Chicago and I was LIVID at that accent.  

[wknt3]

On 11/4/2018 at 3:12 PM, shksabelle said:

Hargitay’s acting gets worse every week.

Let show some respect here and use her full name please. People's Choice Nominee Mariska Hargitay's acting get worse every week. Is that really so hard?

[dttruman]

16 minutes ago, wknt3 said:

People's Choice Nominee Mariska Hargitay's acting get worse every week. Is that really so hard?

Do they hand out Raspberry Awards for television performances?  I think I might have a couple of names in mind for nominees

[CrystalBlue]

Last things first:  The term is hanged not hung.  Hey Mariska, remember when your teachers used to say, "Pictures are hung, people are hanged"?  Mrs. Mill hanged herself in her jail cell.

This case didn't really fall into the purview of SVU; it was a family homicide with no sexual aspects to it.  Nevertheless, Benson acting like this was her first time at the rodeo was ridic.  Never in the history of her 20-year career did she ever see a mother kill her children?  I guess back then it was NBD cuz Saint Olivia hadn't adopted Noah yet, not during the Stabler years for sure.

Enough of the Super Mommies Bonding Scenes.  Thanks for reminding us that Rollins is knocked up with the belly cradling.

The trial definitely needed Dr. Abernathy on the stand testifying about the insanity of the defendant, not Just A Cop Benson doing the honors.

Ice-T was right on as always:  A black cop not buying the poor beleaguered brown man syndrome angle.  Fin and Carisi make a good team and are way more watchable than Saint O & Her Apostle Amanda.

I would have enjoyed an SVUverse defense attorney as the lawyer for Mrs. Mill, and that CJ cross-over was lost on me.

[Ions Earring]

"The audience wont remember this episode. Hell, let's cast Dylan Walsh as a completely different character in S20's premiere." Excerpt from the writers room.

[Xeliou66]

1 hour ago, Ions Earring said:

"The audience wont remember this episode. Hell, let's cast Dylan Walsh as a completely different character in S20's premiere." Excerpt from the writers room.

Wrong episode.

[wknt3]

On 11/7/2018 at 1:31 AM, CrystalBlue said:

Last things first:  The term is hanged not hung ... "Pictures are hung, people are hanged"? 

 

 

Edited November 15, 2018 by wknt3

[WendyCR72]

5 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

"The audience wont remember this episode. Hell, let's cast Dylan Walsh as a completely different character in S20's premiere." Excerpt from the writers room.

Yeah, but if the franchise could "recycle" the likes of Jerry Orbach on the Mothership (he didn't only play Lennie!) and S. Epatha Merkerson or Jay O. Sanders on CI for its final season after a memorable turn in S2, this is just par for the course.

[Fellaway]

39 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Yeah, but if the franchise could "recycle" the likes of Jerry Orbach on the Mothership (he didn't only play Lennie!) and S. Epata Merkerson or Jay O. Sanders on CI for its final season after a memorable turn in S2, this is just par for the course.

Yep, L&O has done this a lot.  Peter Scanavino, too, played a perp just a couple seasons before he became a regular.

[WendyCR72]

7 minutes ago, Fellaway said:

Yep, L&O has done this a lot.  Peter Scanavino, too, played a perp just a couple seasons before he became a regular.

Yep, Peter Scanavino was a perp on Logan/Barek's first episode of their partnership on Criminal Intent in S5. And Kelli Giddish was also on that show as part of an investigation involving treasure hunting and murder in S7.

So, yeah, Dick Wolf and his people do love to recycle.

[illdoc]

Jeremy Sisto was a defense attorney in the Season 17 finale (mothership) and became a regular (as a cop) in the Season 18 premiere.

[WendyCR72]

25 minutes ago, illdoc said:

Jeremy Sisto was a defense attorney in the Season 17 finale (mothership) and became a regular (as a cop) in the Season 18 premiere.

I can't remember, did he play Lupo in S17, though? (Since Lupo was in law school/something with law besides being a cop)?

[illdoc]

1 minute ago, WendyCR72 said:

I can't remember, did he play Lupo in S17, though?

No. Completely different character. Generally, people probably didn't notice then, but now that L&O is in reruns on ION (13 or so episodes in a row every Friday), it's more noticable. The ION showings only cover seasons 13-20, so with half a season per week, it doesn't take long for an episode to come around again (and at around the same time of day, too).

[wknt3]

1 hour ago, WendyCR72 said:

I can't remember, did he play Lupo in S17, though? (Since Lupo was in law school/something with law besides being a cop)?

 

1 hour ago, illdoc said:

No. Completely different character. Generally, people probably didn't notice then, but now that L&O is in reruns on ION (13 or so episodes in a row every Friday), it's more noticable. The ION showings only cover seasons 13-20, so with half a season per week, it doesn't take long for an episode to come around again (and at around the same time of day, too).

Yeah at that point in time Lupo was out of the country chasing terrorists with NYPD intel. I don't remember if I noticed or not back then - it was pretty much established by that point that you auditioned for a lead role by playing a perp or a defense attorney and that the franchise pretty much had a stock company and unless you were in the opening credits or recurring there was a pretty good chance you would come back as another character. I pretty much agree with @WendyCR72 here - this is just the way things are. Heck if a guest star playing a different role bothers you how did you make it through the Novak years?

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎02‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 3:49 AM, SuzieQ said:

Why was this even an SVU case?  They shouldn't have even been involved.

They deal with vulnerable child victims who need expert interviewing, originally they thought the son was going to survive. After he died they should have turned it over to homicide. 

On ‎02‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 5:18 AM, Mystery Author said:

That was my question. To which Mr. Author replied, "Damned if I know."

Maybe I'm wrong, I've been wrong before, but I'd think they'd put Ms. I'm Not Perfect on suicide watch (tsk-tsk).

SVU deal with vulnerable kids who need expert interviewing. And yes, I could see that coming and surely everyone else should to?

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎02‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 11:56 PM, dttruman said:

Considering the evidence against her that Fin found, the shoe with her daughter's blood on it and her finger print on the bed or by the bed. I thought both of those could be explained, but when she confessed that took the whole episode in another direction.

The more and more I think about it, I am starting to believe that the writers come up with certain plots and then they are abruptly changed. I.E. this episode. I think your rendition is probably similar to the writers original, but when someone unexpectedly puts in the confession it suddenly changes it to a "crazy" defense which allows Hargitay to go into her soap opera mode.

Absolutely, all she needed to say was 'Oh, that was from when she had a nosebleed'.  '

On ‎02‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 11:19 PM, SCS said:

 

Among Olivia's many breathy murmurings to Amanda was something like, "We're doing this wrong." I can't remember: is this the official final season of SVU (no idea where I think I read that)? Maybe last night was the first step in Olivia's turning in her retirement papers to spend more time with the kid.  

She's going to stick with it until season 21 at least, for good or ill SVU is MH's life work (and she has done a lot of good).

On ‎02‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 5:27 AM, MrsRafaelBarba said:

At least there wasn't a monkey in a basketball.

That should be the SVU emblem. Some fan should make those,, I'd buy one. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎02‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 11:06 AM, Fellaway said:

This started out a promising ep, kind of old school but...  ::shrug::  It went from promising to meh by the time they got to court.  I was really zoning out at that point.  So the gist is the mother was essentially embezzling money from her law firm, unbeknownst to her husband, which triggered an audit which would reveal her theft so... she killed her family because they wouldn't be able to do without her if she went to prison?  'Mkay.

Things I liked:  Carisi and Fin, as is becoming a common refrain here in the forum.  Loved Fin's "Look who you're talking to, dude."  Classic Fin.  I loved they confirmed Carisi speaks Spanish.  (I've been arguing that with a friend for a few seasons now based on a couple brief scenes in earlier eps.)  I liked that Carisi went to talk to the mother first, but then...

Things I didn't like:  ...Once they're back at the precinct, Benson and Rollins take over because, I guess, Carisi is incapable of talking to victims/victims' families.  Benson and Rollins seem to always do it lately, but they are so not a dream team.  And I absolutely hate their "we're single, working mothers bonding over all the tragedy" thing they've got going on this season.  Enough.  We've seen it.  Move on, Show.  And what's up with Benson's "a nanny couldn't just wake up one day and kill a family" and "mothers don't kill their babies" thing?  She's never heard of family annihilators? It's like she hasn't been a detective with SVU for 20 years.

Enough, too, with the CJ crossovers.  This was, what, the third, counting Stone?  Geez, showrunners, I didn't watch CJ when it was on, why would I want to watch it now on SVU?  I'm sure it had its viewers, but the show did fail in less than a season, and it failed for reasons.  I'd bet money the majority of SVU's viewers don't miss it nor even watched it, and these characters aren't likely to help SVU's ratings.  I've noticed the lack of our regular roster of defense attorneys this season, too.  I'd rather see them.

Why didn't the defense attorney call a psychologist to the stand?  The jury thought she was insane when she killed her kids, but... not insane when she killed her husband?  'Mkay.  Why did Olivia go to see the nanny after she'd been released, instead of one of the detectives?  (We'll probably never get another detective on the squad because, then, they wouldn't have the "we're shorthanded" excuse to send Benson into the field.)  Doesn't she ever have administrative things to do?  It was refreshing to not see her in the gallery after she testified, but I guess that was only because there was no victim there for her to be the rock for.

Oh!  And Amanda is dumb as a post if she's back with "Al."  I'd tell him what he could do with his flowers.

In fairness with Amanda stuck in the precinct whilst sprog dropping dealing with the families and working the computer is all she can do. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎02‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 6:19 PM, cfinboston said:

I can't with this show anymore.

Liv was supposed to be a hardened SVU detective. Now she literally can't look at a crime scene without mentioning Noah. "I was going to buy that bed for Noah" is hands down the shittiest quip offered by a detective when finding a body. The entire episode you'd have thought she was Dani Beck discovering she can not emotionally cope with SVU.  

Whatever writer came up with "Keep the flowers, sometimes you just need a little pretty" needs to be fired yesterday. 

She and Stabler investigated a family annihilation case. Why the hell is she screeching about how it must be some made up psychobabble?

Anna is inexplicably smart enough to be a lawyer and make millions of dollars yet she leaves blood spattered tennis shoes in her desk drawer? 

I bought that, the prisons are full or people with genius IQs and rafts of educational qualifications who made the simplest mistakes and got caught. The Leopold and Loeb case springs to mind;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_and_Loeb

Besides she wasn't in her right mind?

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎04‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 8:12 PM, shksabelle said:

Jesus H. Christ, why don’t Liv and Amanda make play dates for their kids, have sleepovers, braid each other”s hair, and leave the police work to the menz. 

Hargitay’s acting gets worse every week. 

On the plus side, good to see Sasha Alexander. 

If they did get it on that would be a great plot twist and probably a massive boost to the ratings. 

[Joe Hellandback]

1.  Just walk into the still active crime scene with no booties or other protective clothing? So much for forensics but I guess they wouldn't look so cool if they did that?

2. I like the new psychiatrist and crime scene tech, hope they recur. 

3.  Boy, the Benson/Rollins bonding is just going overboard!

4.  I liked the flowers though, as Benson says, you need some pretty in this dark world. 

5.  Good turn around, genuinely thought it was the nanny but stupid that Benson struggles to believe in a female family annihilator, they've occurred time and again. I was thinking that this would be the parents mistreating the maid or the dad having an affair/raping her or the parents abusing the kids and the maid killing them to 'save' them. 

6.  Loved Finn and Carisi at the brother's door, didn't take any bull off him. But their search of the apartment is ludicrous, didn't even look under the bed or in the cupboards? Also why don't we keep our guns out searching for a triple murderer with a knife.  

7. Really liked the head of the law firm, we're so used to them being the villains but he's the victim, love him cautioning Finn and Carisi that they need a warrant, don't want any fruit of the poisoned tree for the vital evidence (and going up against an accused lawyer who'd understand the concept).

8. No, no, no, we don't TELL the traumatised grieving mother 'You killed them didn't you?', that's how you get false confessions or true confessions thrown out for duress. 

9. Like the judge telling the accused it's their problem when they can't raise $2million bail, so often it's the poor who get stuck at Rikers whilst the rich waltz off. 

10. Jeez, hell of a crime scene, the stabbed little girl especially disturbing.

11. Why is Benson on the stand? What does she add? She didn't even speak to the accused until hours afterwards. Why doesn't the defence or judge shut her up? Although I liked the way the defence lawyer cut her down and she was left speechless at the end, pretty rare these days.  

12. So do we get any comeback for Stone, telling a woman to kill herself who then does?

[Norma Desmond]

Saint Olivia's pearls of wisdom were at their funniest this episode. "Sometimes life just sucks", "Sometimes you need a little pretty". DEEP.

 

I also thought it was funny how she didn't really believe the nanny was guily and told them to keep digging  but had no trouble believing instantly that the mother had killed the kids.

 

Anyway, Anna was mentally ill, after all, and Benson and her bitchy ways were wrong.

 

It's curious how she was so quick to think the sex trafficked woman from last season was mentally ill when she cracked open the head of a man who had nothing to do with what happened to her; yet a woman who killed her family wasn't insane in St. Olivia's view. I see a pattern here....

Edited December 2, 2018 by Norma Desmond

[SarahPrtr]

On 11/3/2018 at 7:43 AM, cfinboston said:

Plus the defense attorney sounded like he was auditioning for a remake of Fargo.

Oh, yaa, yaaaa, ya betchaa, ya.