S07.E11: State of the Union

[KateHearts]

Tristan and Mia are a fascinating study in body language.  Every move he makes belies his words "I'm in it for the long run; I trust Mia; I'm falling more and more in love." Meanwhile he bundles himself in blankets to wall himself off from her within his plush fabric fortress.  She ducks her head and looks to the side when she talks to or about him and hugs him with her head down and averted. She uses words like "safe" and "protected" when describing how she feels with Tristan. She is totally using him as her shield- from her stupid past, from her strange personality, from having to deal with the real world.  And for some reason, he has assigned himself her protector- even though in reality, he doesn't want to take that role on and is simmering with anger under the surface that this is what he has to deal with- all playing out on TV, no less.

Amber's vocal fry is seriously driving me crazy.  And while I'm sure the insecurity game is being accentuated here, she needs to be confident in herself before getting into a serious, committed relationship. The proverbial Biological Clock is not enough to sustain or justify a marriage; rather, having a baby would certainly lead her to the brink of breakdown and destroy whatever semblance of a relationship they have.

While I'm happy for Danielle and Bobby, I'm not sure that this blissful situation will continue.  Let's face it- a month into a new relationship with shiny new sex and lots of presents and surprises is not enough time to really let reality settle in.  I love my husband, but I would not want a relationship based on one of us constantly catering to the other's every whim and need while the other is receiving very little in return.  "Bobby is so kind and considerate" is not the same as "Bobby and I have a true working partnership."  And I am really not sure why she has, in one month, introduced two young foster dogs into HIS house. Is she, perhaps, pushing the limit to see if he passes muster?  Love me, love all my quirky excessive interests? And if she (admittedly) does not cook, then automatically she is in a situation where her spouse has bent to accommodate three dogs, is cooking all the meals, and from what we've seen, does all the household chores and has bitten his tongue about her debt and possibly questionable spending/budgetary habits.  Bobby is kind, but I think there's only so much any one person will shoulder unilaterally.

Edited September 13, 2018 by KateHearts

[Ilovepie]

2 hours ago, seacliffsal said:

I also don't think she was making a joke when she said she was excited about when a baby would turn 5.

I don't think she was joking either. She is absolutely delusional if she thinks kids are a piece of cake after turning five - news flash Amber: kids are work at ALL ages. School age kids are a major pain because of school and extra-curricular activities - your time is really not your own at that point. Talk about being extra! This woman should NOT have children, she has no idea what she is asking for.

The freak out over the garlic was very telling to me. It was the way a young child would act. She needed everyone to turn around and reassure her. I mean, Mia set a freaking towel on fire and didn't even freak out this bad. I think Dave is just over it at this point. Can you imagine having to coddle someone like that every day for the rest of your life? Especially when you are used to having your own shit together and are not especially nurturing to begin with. What a nightmare. Extreme mismatch here, and Amber needs major therapeutic help, and I'm not talking any of the "experts" either.

I really wish Danielle and Bobby had told Dr. Pepper where she could stick her "check in" and tantric session. I really hope Danielle actually reciprocated on the I love you when the camera was not rolling, because if not, ouch! It reminded me of Star Wars when Princess Leia tells Han Solo "I love you" and he says "I know".......

I don't care about Tristan and Mia. That is all.

[LuvMyShows]

On 9/12/2018 at 1:35 AM, DrewPaul2010 said:

*********Amber Alert**********

I agree with most other comments here I don't believe she is suitable for marriage and wanting to have children before its too late is a terrible reason to marry and a terrible reason to have kids. I believe her desire to have children is for her fulfillment not theirs and I believe she will be in for a terrible rude awakening.

Exactly!

On 9/12/2018 at 6:50 AM, Waterlilly said:

Why didn’t Amber have any clean socks if she does her own laundry?  Who exactly was she mad enough at to throw a temper tantrum?  Amber, when you have babies, you don’t always have clean socks, get a shower, get any sleep, get your roots done ( or even wash your hair), get to go to the gym, etc.  She makes me tired, bless her heart. 

The socks thing was so bizarre, and really gives insight into the special hell Dave must be living in.  If she can't even keep up with her OWN laundry, to the point that she runs out of clean socks (when it's a task she has been responsible for already in her adult life), there is NO WAY IN HELL that she is going to be keeping up with doing his as well (which was apparently what they agreed on).  And if she already isn't even keeping up with a task that is so fundamental to the happiness of her own life, then she's undoubtedly not doing other lesser joint tasks that she has agreed to do.

On 9/12/2018 at 7:40 AM, humbleopinion said:

The tantric couch skeeves me out too.

The whole tantric thing was odd, because when they asked the woman about how much action the couch had seen (or something like that), she replied something like, "I don't really know."  I took that to mean that this was not her place of business, and was just a rented Airbnb (like they do on Catfish sometimes), so she'd never used that couch before.  

[Jeanne222]

If Bobby and Danielle decide to stay together I have some advice for them.   Sell the house and move closer to her job.  Then she can foster all the dogs she wants.  Clean up after them since it is HER passion and fix breakfast and pack a lunch for Bobby.

That's a plan Sam!

Personally I think all that dog poo would be a huge turnoff to sex.  Just saying....

[Waterlilly]

Danielle and Henry are going to be lost when duck season comes;(. That’s all I have for now. 

[CousinOliver]

Amber seems to want to be a pampered princess, to be the prettiest in the land [preferably the only beautiful woman alive], reminded of such often, with no responsibilities, and everyone happily catering to her.  I'd say she's delusional, but apparently Danielle found exactly that. Amber comes off as so entitled that I rather hope she doesn't find her Bobby and grows up instead. 

Bobby might just be a service-minded submissive guy who is naturally happy in a female led relationship. He wouldn't be the first guy who got pleasure from that, while not really making it clear to all for fear of being cast as "whipped" or unmanly.  But, if that's not his jam, the dog thing will come to a head.  The rest I don't see as such a big issue, since it's all stuff he already likely did for himself; now it's 2 lunches instead of one, etc. 

[Ctotsy]

Amber and Dave have completely different love languages. Amber's love language is clearly words of affirmation, and Dave's is service. Since Amber is getting literally no words of affirmation, it's bringing out her insecurities and makes her feel like she isn't good enough. Dave is critical, but in his mind he is helping her because service is his love language. He is frustrated she doesn't help around the house more. She's frustrated he's too critical and feels he points out her flaws. 

Unfortunately in situations like this where one person is more insecure, it gives the other person more power and makes them lose respect for the other person. I feel Dave has lost respect for Amber and doesn't treat her at all like he really WANTS to be with her. 

[qtpye]

1 hour ago, CousinOliver said:

Amber seems to want to be a pampered princess, to be the prettiest in the land [preferably the only beautiful woman alive], reminded of such often, with no responsibilities, and everyone happily catering to her.  I'd say she's delusional, but apparently Danielle found exactly that. Amber comes off as so entitled that I rather hope she doesn't find her Bobby and grows up instead. 

Bobby might just be a service-minded submissive guy who is naturally happy in a female led relationship. He wouldn't be the first guy who got pleasure from that, while not really making it clear to all for fear of being cast as "whipped" or unmanly.  But, if that's not his jam, the dog thing will come to a head.  The rest I don't see as such a big issue, since it's all stuff he already likely did for himself; now it's 2 lunches instead of one, etc. 

I remember an episode of Wife Swap that I watched a long time ago (please don't judge me) where a husband literally did everything in the house including take care of the children and he had a full-time job. The wife did not work and would sleep in late every day. She was a former Miss New Jersey and looked a lot like Marcia Brady, kind of like Danielle with much better eyebrows. He was also kind of cute in a boyish type of way. The surprising thing was the guy LOVED waiting on his wife and treating her like a princess. He was walking around like HE was the luckiest guy in the world...so you never know with couple dynamics.

[humbleopinion]

The manufactured drama between Bobby and Danielle is so ham handed that we stopped buying what the producers are selling.

Being a voyeur of a man in infatuation wooing a woman he knows nothing about is facinating and is very Truman Show-esque.

Bobby is charming in his earnestness.

He protects Danielle  and will not let her be portrayed in a poor light.

Dave gives Amber a slack rope and the poor girl keeps hanging herself.

Dave is not interested in saving her from herself.

He and the camera crew are in cahoots to make her look and sound idiotic at every turn.

Amber is getting the Chicken Little edit...The sky is falling...The sky is falling....

Footage of Henry running around the backyard is preferable to Mia ducking into yet another one of her blanket forts

[gonecrackers]

3 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Dave gives Amber a slack rope and the poor girl keeps hanging herself.

Dave is not interested in saving her from herself.

He and the camera crew are in cahoots to make her look and sound idiotic at every turn.

Amber is getting the Chicken Little edit...The sky is falling...The sky is falling....

THIS completely. She was fucked with this season & knows it- now. Just look at her face during Unfiltered; she seems to be having a very hard time pretending she wants to be there & actually looks really PISSED sometimes.

[Yeah No]

On 9/13/2018 at 11:48 AM, Marsh said:

I think you're looking waaaay too far into this.  If it was the other way around a cooking lesson could still be suggested.  A lot of couples take a cooking lesson because it's a fun, interactive dinner date.  Interactive dates build chemistry.

As Danielle once stated she doesn't enjoy cooking and probably won't do it much.  And lobster boxers is OK with that.  No one is forcing anyone to be a stay at home mom and cook.

 

Perhaps, but judging from the reaction here and on Reddit, people are simply flabbergasted that the 3 grown women this season don't seem to know anything about cooking at all.  I am sure that on other seasons there were husbands that didn't know how to cook but a big deal wasn't made about it by the show and the viewers and we probably didn't even know about it in most cases, like it's no biggie if a man doesn't know how to cook.  Amber brought some of the public reaction on herself by pushing herself to cook to impress Dave (which i'm not even convinced was her idea, because it smells like producer manipulation if you ask me).  Then just watching her bumble around the kitchen she reveals to the world (and Dave) that she knows nothing about cooking.  I'm sure that cooking lesson wasn't dreamed up just for a "bonding exercise".  They could have chosen any other activity but that.  I think the show wanted to increase drama by making Amber even more stressed out about her lack of cooking ability.  And yes, I still think it may also have been motivated by some sexism on the part of the producers.  Feel free to disagree!

Edited September 14, 2018 by Yeah No
correction.

[Yeah No]

22 hours ago, KateHearts said:

Tristan and Mia are a fascinating study in body language.  Every move he makes belies his words "I'm in it for the long run; I trust Mia; I'm falling more and more in love." Meanwhile he bundles himself in blankets to wall himself off from her within his plush fabric fortress.  She ducks her head and looks to the side when she talks to or about him and hugs him with her head down and averted. She uses words like "safe" and "protected" when describing how she feels with Tristan. She is totally using him as her shield- from her stupid past, from her strange personality, from having to deal with the real world.  And for some reason, he has assigned himself her protector- even though in reality, he doesn't want to take that role on and is simmering with anger under the surface that this is what he has to deal with- all playing out on TV, no less.

Amber's vocal fry is seriously driving me crazy.  And while I'm sure the insecurity game is being accentuated here, she needs to be confident in herself before getting into a serious, committed relationship. The proverbial Biological Clock is not enough to sustain or justify a marriage; rather, having a baby would certainly lead her to the brink of breakdown and destroy whatever semblance of a relationship they have.

While I'm happy for Danielle and Bobby, I'm not sure that this blissful situation will continue.  Let's face it- a month into a new relationship with shiny new sex and lots of presents and surprises is not enough time to really let reality settle in.  I love my husband, but I would not want a relationship based on one of us constantly catering to the other's every whim and need while the other is receiving very little in return.  "Bobby is so kind and considerate" is not the same as "Bobby and I have a true working partnership."  And I am really not sure why she has, in one month, introduced two young foster dogs into HIS house. Is she, perhaps, pushing the limit to see if he passes muster?  Love me, love all my quirky excessive interests? And if she (admittedly) does not cook, then automatically she is in a situation where her spouse has bent to accommodate three dogs, is cooking all the meals, and from what we've seen, does all the household chores and has bitten his tongue about her debt and possibly questionable spending/budgetary habits.  Bobby is kind, but I think there's only so much any one person will shoulder unilaterally.

Yeah, what YOU said!  I wish I could double like this post!  I've been recovering from having my gallbladder removed on Tuesday, so I haven't had the energy to formulate these thoughts so well, but this is everything I wanted to say much better than I could have this week!  The only thing I have to add is that it wasn't just Amber's vocal fry that drove me crazy in this episode, but all the women, especially Danielle.  And then when they have a gaggle of them on "Unfiltered" it's even worse because Jamie Otis is another one not only with vocal fry, but a weird way of swallowing (gargling?) her words and using diction I've never heard before in my life (thankfully).

Tristan is acting like he had his contract waved in front of his face and was told he had to stick it out for the rest of the season and look convincing, too.  I think both he and Mia are acting a part at this point.  There's absolutely nothing genuine about their relationship and like you said, the body language is incongruent with the words they utter, which proves it.

[StatisticalOutlier]

On 9/12/2018 at 8:49 PM, ECM1231 said:

I know Danielle has said before that she commutes 1 1/2 hours each way to her job but last night she specifically said that it is a 50 mile commute each way.  My son lives in Austin. When my hubs and I visited for the first time we were shocked that the speed limit was 80 mph. NYC parkways have a speed limit of 50 mph.  So unless Dallas/Fort Worth traffic is pretty awful, I'm not sure why it takes her 90 minutes to travel 50 miles.  If traffic is as bad in Dallas as it is the tristate NY area, then I can believe it.  

Believe it.  As others have noted, traffic in Dallas is terrible, and 90 minutes to go 50 miles is definitely within the realm of possibility.

FWIW, the 80 mph speed limit you noticed is on a toll road near Austin but way east of town.  It's a bypass around Austin, to get traffic off I-35 through town, and isn't really an option for commuters.

 

23 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

I mean, Mia set a freaking towel on fire and didn't even freak out this bad.

Caveat:  I barely cook.  But I've always thought of using a towel as a potholder as an advanced move.  I know chefs do it, but it seems awkward and slippery every time I try it, and I couldn't believe he was making a total novice do it.  I know it's a cooking school, but don't they have pans that have handles that don't get hot?

[princelina]

3 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Perhaps, but judging from the reaction here and on Reddit, people are simply flabbergasted that the 3 grown women this season don't seem to know anything about cooking at all.  I am sure that on other seasons there were husbands that didn't know how to cook but a big deal wasn't made about it by the show and the viewers and we probably didn't even know about it in most cases, like it's no biggie if a man doesn't know how to cook.  Amber brought some of the public reaction on herself by pushing herself to cook to impress Dave (which i'm not even convinced was her idea, because it smells like producer manipulation if you ask me).  Then just watching her bumble around the kitchen she reveals to the world (and Dave) that she knows nothing about cooking.  I'm sure that cooking lesson wasn't dreamed up just for a "bonding exercise".  They could have chosen any other activity but that.  I think the show wanted to increase drama by making Amber even more stressed out about her lack of cooking ability.  And yes, I still think it may also have been motivated by some sexism on the part of the producers.  Feel free to disagree!

I am only flabbergasted by Amber's complete incompetence, and particularly her touching everything with her salmonella hands.  Danielle may not enjoy cooking, but she had her "company meal" ready to cook for and serve her husband.  (Mr P's was chicken with rice and corn, and homemade cheesecake - that was our 3rd or 4th date :). Do we know anything about Mia's skill level, or has she spent too much time in the slammer for us to find out?  And yes - if the producers are sick of Amber and screwing with her, they did a good job with this date!

[Jeanne222]

17 hours ago, qtpye said:

I remember an episode of Wife Swap that I watched a long time ago (please don't judge me) where a husband literally did everything in the house including take care of the children and he had a full-time job. The wife did not work and would sleep in late every day. She was a former Miss New Jersey and looked a lot like Marcia Brady, kind of like Danielle with much better eyebrows. He was also kind of cute in a boyish type of way. The surprising thing was the guy LOVED waiting on his wife and treating her like a princess. He was walking around like HE was the luckiest guy in the world...so you never know with couple dynamics.

Every woman wants a Bobby.  Sigh.

4 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Perhaps, but judging from the reaction here and on Reddit, people are simply flabbergasted that the 3 grown women this season don't seem to know anything about cooking at all.  I am sure that on other seasons there were husbands that didn't know how to cook but a big deal wasn't made about it by the show and the viewers and we probably didn't even know about it in most cases, like it's no biggie if a man doesn't know how to cook.  Amber brought some of the public reaction on herself by pushing herself to cook to impress Dave (which i'm not even convinced was her idea, because it smells like producer manipulation if you ask me).  Then just watching her bumble around the kitchen she reveals to the world (and Dave) that she knows nothing about cooking.  I'm sure that cooking lesson wasn't dreamed up just for a "bonding exercise".  They could have chosen any other activity but that.  I think the show wanted to increase drama by making Amber even more stressed out about her lack of cooking ability.  And yes, I still think it may also have been motivated by some sexism on the part of the producers.  Feel free to disagree!

I wish I didn't know how to cook.  As we leave the home and join the job market it seems like we woman gained nothing but adding on more stress and work for ourselves.  We are still in charge of 'everything'.  Dammit!

[Meowwww]

Dog poop is no joke. When our lab was young, she had an accident of the poop variety.  Diarrhea.  The SMELL. I ran out of the house gagging.  Hubby cleaned it up.  It took a day for that stench to go away. 

I love animals more than people.  But the dog poop smell....

[gonecrackers]

17 minutes ago, Meowwww said:

Dog poop is no joke. When our lab was young, she had an accident of the poop variety.  Diarrhea.  The SMELL. I ran out of the house gagging.  Hubby cleaned it up.  It took a day for that stench to go away. 

Truth...  I guess Bobby can handle the mess & smell because he's cleaning diarrhea for luuuuuuuuuve.  ❤️  ?

[qtpye]

1 hour ago, Jeanne222 said:

Every woman wants a Bobby.  Sigh.

I wish I didn't know how to cook.  As we leave the home and join the job market it seems like we woman gained nothing but adding on more stress and work for ourselves.  We are still in charge of 'everything'.  Dammit!

 

I should add I saw many more episodes of Wife Swap where the woman did everything including bringing home the bacon while the husband basically did nothing. I think one truism that has largely been ignored is that most girls today do not have the option of being a stay at home mother. They are going to have to work to financially support themselves and their families like men supposedly have been doing for previous generations. Working is no longer a feminist statement for the middle and upper middle class (poor women have always had to work so no change there). The problem is that it is expected that women have to now "contribute to the family financially" and do all the household chores and cooking.

Now, of course, many posters have pointed out that the traditional gender roles for women and men were not the standard in every household.  In my house, my mother cooked amazing meals and worked full time, however, my father did his own laundry and ironing and I did my own laundry from the age of 12. My father was also the one who cleaned the toilets as my mother would not go near them. When I got married I worked full time and was more than happy to do the cooking, though my meals were not quite as fabulous as my mother's meals. Imagine my surprise when my husband began telling me how he liked his shirts starched. I looked at him sort of like "Why don't you do that yourself"? He was quite taken back ( I like my mother before me handled all the other household chores and thought, "Surely, I do not have to do everything"?). My husband had grown up in a household where he never did any chores beyond running errands, yard work, and taking out the trash. His mother might have even done all his laundry when he was in college. Anyway, some people are still of the mindset that a woman still needs to prove her worth in order to have the "privilege" of a man marrying her.

That being said, Amber's attitude that she did not think to be in a marriage would require extra effort on her part was flabbergasting particularly because nothing takes more work than having and raising children.

[humbleopinion]

The tease:

I’ve been wondering when they were going to bring Amber’s friend Ashley into the show.

Ashley got a line of dialogue on the wedding episode and seemed too too into Dave...

Jealous Amber pulling the fire alarm brings Dr. Jessica to come a‘knocking.....

Danielle is called out as a stone cold beyotch  by Dr Jessica with her emotionless “hmm hmm” reaction to Bobby’s outpouring of declarations of love when pitching woo. 

Danielle....Bobby needs to hear you smush on him hard....

Party at Ma and Pa Dodd....CHEERS!

Tristan dramatically leaves the room in tears...again....(say it in your best Forrest Gump voice)

[gonecrackers]

Just a guess but I think Amber's idea of marriage was she does her own chores, he does his, & that's what she meant by 'not doing extra'. She never cooked for herself so probably had no real kitchen clean up, & wouldn't even think to take that over. She didn't expect to even do his laundry because she probably assumed they would each do their own, etc.

Then they made the agreement that she would do laundry, but at least in part due to her husband adding to her insecurities rather than alleviating them, she may have thought 'fuck that he might as well do it himself since I can't do anything right for him, & that's the way I envisioned this going anyway'.

And there would be nothing wrong with that IF she were up front with him & they agreed to it. He's obviously not happy with her anyway so it's no loss for her. I wouldn't do his laundry either given the circumstances (maybe he & gym guy can do their laundry together).

That wouldn't work with having kids, but I think these two are already over each other & it's all fake now. The show is beating her insecurity issue into the ground; it's annoying AF & I don't think it's all on the couple anymore as they are probably having discussions & issues set up for them to earn their last few weeks on the show.

[Empress1]

And in fairness, there are couples who do their own laundry. I was out with a married friend last night and she and her husband do their own laundry because neither of them likes the way the other does it. (We were talking to a third guy whose wife does the laundry because he messed it up one too many times, and now he's banned.) So if that's what they want to do, that's fine - it's just that it's expressly not what Amber and Dave said they would do.

[Waterlilly]

Dave probably has his work clothes dry cleaned and he only has one pair of pants and two shirt. How hard would it be for Amber to throw those in with her socks?

[Tvcrit]

Every time my husband and I watch this show we are convinced that Amber looks like the Green Goblin’s child. A mix between William Dafoe and Denis Leary. 

[love2lovebadtv]

2 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

Just a guess but I think Amber's idea of marriage was she does her own chores, he does his, & that's what she meant by 'not doing extra'. She never cooked for herself so probably had no real kitchen clean up, & wouldn't even think to take that over. She didn't expect to even do his laundry because she probably assumed they would each do their own, etc.

Then they made the agreement that she would do laundry, but at least in part due to her husband adding to her insecurities rather than alleviating them, she may have thought 'fuck that he might as well do it himself since I can't do anything right for him, & that's the way I envisioned this going anyway'.

And there would be nothing wrong with that IF she were up front with him & they agreed to it. He's obviously not happy with her anyway so it's no loss for her. I wouldn't do his laundry either given the circumstances (maybe he & gym guy can do their laundry together).

That wouldn't work with having kids, but I think these two are already over each other & it's all fake now. The show is beating her insecurity issue into the ground; it's annoying AF & I don't think it's all on the couple anymore as they are probably having discussions & issues set up for them to earn their last few weeks on the show.

I get the sense that Amber didn't have many ideas about marriage beyond someone who thought she was good enough to marry not leaving her over something small and having a baby before she "loses" all her eggs. I don't think she gave much thought to childrearing, finances, household chores, or any other issues. 

And I think Dave was not  honest with himself aor the experts about his ideals. 

[princelina]

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

And in fairness, there are couples who do their own laundry. I was out with a married friend last night and she and her husband do their own laundry because neither of them likes the way the other does it. (We were talking to a third guy whose wife does the laundry because he messed it up one too many times, and now he's banned.) So if that's what they want to do, that's fine - it's just that it's expressly not what Amber and Dave said they would do.

Haha the best thing that ever happened in my marriage was me breaking my foot and unable to do stairs for 6 weeks - Mr. P discovered his love for doing laundry!  (we had been married about 2 years and every time I heard about him needing his "whites" I wanted to scream "How many times a day do you change your fucking underwear?!"  So now he does his laundry all week long - I'm not sure what he's even doing down there - and once a week I sneak in with my own load :). Also, my brother, who's no prize, admitted to me that he screwed up the laundry right after getting married so he'd be forbidden from it.  Maybe because she's such a train wreck she went along with what he said because she was afraid to disagree, and didn't choose chores she would prefer.  In our (childless) household, I do the daily chores like shopping, cooking and cleanup, and Mr P does the bigger, less often ones like floors and bathrooms.  And we are both happy with that arrangement.  But I guess if Amber was used to just coming home from the gym and popping a lean cuisine in the microwave, it's all new to her.

21 minutes ago, love2lovebadtv said:

I get the sense that Amber didn't have many ideas about marriage beyond someone who thought she was good enough to marry not leaving her over something small and having a baby before she "loses" all her eggs. I don't think she gave much thought to childrearing, finances, household chores, or any other issues. 

And I think Dave was not  honest with himself aor the experts about his ideals. 

I don't see where Dave was dishonest about anything - he had the right to expect to marry an adult woman and not a complete basket case.

[love2lovebadtv]

40 minutes ago, princelina said:

Haha the best thing that ever happened in my marriage was me breaking my foot and unable to do stairs for 6 weeks - Mr. P discovered his love for doing laundry!  (we had been married about 2 years and every time I heard about him needing his "whites" I wanted to scream "How many times a day do you change your fucking underwear?!"  So now he does his laundry all week long - I'm not sure what he's even doing down there - and once a week I sneak in with my own load :). Also, my brother, who's no prize, admitted to me that he screwed up the laundry right after getting married so he'd be forbidden from it.  Maybe because she's such a train wreck she went along with what he said because she was afraid to disagree, and didn't choose chores she would prefer.  In our (childless) household, I do the daily chores like shopping, cooking and cleanup, and Mr P does the bigger, less often ones like floors and bathrooms.  And we are both happy with that arrangement.  But I guess if Amber was used to just coming home from the gym and popping a lean cuisine in the microwave, it's all new to her.

I don't see where Dave was dishonest about anything - he had the right to expect to marry an adult woman and not a complete basket case.

I was thinking about Dave's religious preference that he neglected to share when asked. Also, he and Amber could very well be matched on paper in terms of age, career stability, and desire to have kids. But there are other areas where they're mismatched. I agree Amber's insecurity is a huge issue. But that is heightened by the fact that she's not Dave's type. And by type, I don't mean brunette because yeah, that whole thing is just nuts. I've learned that there are lots of men who don't care about a lot of the stuff Amber is struggling with. I don't think Amber is a good fit for this show but she may have been a better fit with someone who is impressed by her. Like the way we think Danielle's brows are scary but Bobby works them into the budget and is so into Danielle that he cleans up poop all night and preps her meals. Or the way we think Mia is an average-looking woman with a shady past but Tristan is proud of her lighter-than-a-brown-paper- bag complexion and/or believes she's God's choice for him. 

I haven't completely given up on Amber and Dave yet because I know people don't always know what they think or feel about a situation until they're in it. Dave expected certain things in a wife that he assumed were a given until he married someone without those qualities. And Amber doesn't seem to have given much thought to what having a family entails. 

[psychoticstate]

Amber clearly went the MAFS route, not just because she wants (or thinks she wants) kids, but because she feels that if she's "safely" married, all the insecurities she has will magically vanish.  They likely wouldn't, even if she had someone like Bobby.  I don't believe Dave is a bad person but he's obviously not the type to hold Amber's hand and soothe her 24/7, which is what she wants.  If it weren't for her hair, she'd find something else to panic over because the problem is within her.  She truly needs a good therapist or counselor who can help her work on her self-esteem and make her realize that she's worthy whether she has a man or not, or is married or not, or whether she has kids or not.  I have no doubt that if she had a child or children, she'd still have the same needy issues.  She wants Dave to "complete her" (for lack of better terminology) and she'll expect the same out of motherhood.   It's a recipe for a clusterfuck.

I'm puzzled as to how the show managed to cast 3 women who have no idea how to cook, clean or have any concept of basic homemaking skills, and all of them in their thirties.

[Yeah No]

On 9/13/2018 at 10:56 PM, Ctotsy said:

Amber and Dave have completely different love languages. Amber's love language is clearly words of affirmation, and Dave's is service. Since Amber is getting literally no words of affirmation, it's bringing out her insecurities and makes her feel like she isn't good enough. Dave is critical, but in his mind he is helping her because service is his love language. He is frustrated she doesn't help around the house more. She's frustrated he's too critical and feels he points out her flaws. 

Unfortunately in situations like this where one person is more insecure, it gives the other person more power and makes them lose respect for the other person. I feel Dave has lost respect for Amber and doesn't treat her at all like he really WANTS to be with her. 

Here is another great post I had to come back to today.  I hate how this show makes women look insecure and needy when they'e matched with guys that aren't into them or that speak different love languages, like you say above.  When I was young I once dated a guy that said he liked me a lot but there was a gnawing insecurity in the pit of my gut that wouldn't go away.  Somehow I didn't trust him.  He kept telling me that I was too "needy" and insecure.  I told him I was not needy and insecure, it was that I didn't trust him completely.  I found out later that he was cheating on me the entire time, and that I was actually his "sidepiece", while the other woman was his longtime "true love" that had moved away and then came back.  He had never broken up with her, but while she was away for several months he needed a "stand in", hence me.  Of course he never told me about my true status, but lead me on into thinking we had a future together.  Just because a woman acts insecure it doesn't mean she's the one with the issues.  Sometimes insecurity is an accurate reaction to what is going on in the relationship.  I personally think Bobby is more insecure than Amber.  All that desperate doting he does on Danielle is what we would label as "insecurity" if a woman did it.  But because he's a man and knows how to hide it better, he somehow flies under the radar.  That really chaps my hyde.

Edited September 15, 2018 by Yeah No

[humbleopinion]

Bobby is getting no cues from Danielle that he is  no more than her shit shoveler, cook, yard man, dog walker, landlord, plumber, financial manager, barista,  and willing houseboy.

Even so, Bobby would not have the last 4 weeks any other way.

This is who Bobby is ....a giver.

Danielle is a taker.

If she is kicked to the curb then Bobby will have a line of Potential MILs/FILs wanting to match Bobby with their daughters.

Especially the FILs...he is an outdoorsman and good shot with his double barrel, fan of Ranger baseball, takes care of his truck...his family...his business....the Unsung everyday guy of a country western song....

Edited September 15, 2018 by humbleopinion

[Drogo]

Spoilers don't belong in the episode threads. This is not a difficult rule. 

If you see a spoiler, don't reply to it. Don't quote it, don't discuss it. Just report it using the flag icon on the spoilery post. 

[Ilovepie]

1 hour ago, Yeah No said:

Here is another great post I had to come back to today.  I hate how this show makes women look insecure and needy when they'e matched with guys that aren't into them or that speak different love languages, like you say above.  When I was young I once dated a guy that said he liked me a lot but there was a gnawing insecurity in the pit of my gut that wouldn't go away.  Somehow I didn't trust him.  He kept telling me that I was too "needy" and insecure.  I told him I was not needy and insecure, it was that I didn't trust him completely.  I found out later that he was cheating on me the entire time, and that I was actually his "sidepiece", while the other woman was his longtime "true love" that had moved away and then came back.  He had never broken up with her, but while she was away for several months he needed a "stand in", hence me.  Of course he never told me about my true status, but lead me on into thinking we had a future together.  Just because a woman acts insecure it doesn't mean she's the one with the issues.  Sometimes insecurity is an accurate reaction to what is going on in the relationship.  I personally think Bobby is more insecure than Amber.  All that desperate doting he does on Danielle is what we would label as "insecurity" if a woman did it.  But because he's a man and knows how to hide it better, he somehow flies under the radar.  That really chaps my hyde.

I agree that there are times this show has absolutely been edited to fit whatever story the producers want played out, but in Amber’s case I don’t see how that can be chalked up to producer manipulation when she has admitted to being insecure. I do think “the experts” were waaaaay off when they matched Dave and Amber- they cite things like being older and wanting to start a family, but it’s like they didn’t even take basic personalities into consideration when putting them together.

i think Bobby is arguably the nicest most well adjusted person ever to be on this show. When he’s talking on Unfiltered and when he was talking to Dr Pepper he just comes across as knowing his own mind and being confident about what he is saying. Does he like cleaning up dog crap? No, of course not, but he has decided to do it, and he is not complaining because he wants to help Danielle out. Danielle does seem somewhat emotionally closed off, but she has been very positive and complimentary about Bobby in the THs, and maybe she just doesn’t like the cameras. She has said repeatedly that their relationship is private in reference to sharing with the other couples, so maybe that also goes for the production crew as well. 

[Yeah No]

3 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

I agree that there are times this show has absolutely been edited to fit whatever story the producers want played out, but in Amber’s case I don’t see how that can be chalked up to producer manipulation when she has admitted to being insecure. I do think “the experts” were waaaaay off when they matched Dave and Amber- they cite things like being older and wanting to start a family, but it’s like they didn’t even take basic personalities into consideration when putting them together.

Everyone is a little insecure at the beginning of a relationship, love songs can attest to that.  Amber admitting that doesn't tell me she has more issues with insecurity than average, especially when paired with a guy like Dave that would probably make most women feel more insecure than they normally would in a new relationship.  And she has admitted to getting involved with the wrong guys, which would make anyone hyper-insecure at the beginning of any relationship.  She's anticipating getting dumped......again.  I don't blame her.  Dave isn't exactly acting that much different from those guys.  Even his attempts at "romance" or whatever seem forced to me.  She can't miss that.

3 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

i think Bobby is arguably the nicest most well adjusted person ever to be on this show. When he’s talking on Unfiltered and when he was talking to Dr Pepper he just comes across as knowing his own mind and being confident about what he is saying. Does he like cleaning up dog crap? No, of course not, but he has decided to do it, and he is not complaining because he wants to help Danielle out. Danielle does seem somewhat emotionally closed off, but she has been very positive and complimentary about Bobby in the THs, and maybe she just doesn’t like the cameras. She has said repeatedly that their relationship is private in reference to sharing with the other couples, so maybe that also goes for the production crew as well. 

I agree that Bobby is a nice, well adjusted guy, but his yellow flags include being a relationship novice plus overdoing it with pleasing Danielle at his own expense, then acting like "it's nothing" and he enjoys it.  It's not nothing and if he were more mature he would realize that.  One day he will, hopefully.  I don't buy his confidence - a lot of young people today project false confidence and "knowing their minds" but it doesn't always convince me.  If he didn't have other yellow flags I might be more inclined to believe it.  I don't see Bobby keeping up this level of self sacrifice forever.  One day it will get to him down the road, if not within the 8 weeks, then sometime thereafter, and the two of them will have to make some changes.  It won't necessarily end the relationship but it might cause some issues that won't be easy for them to face.  I don't trust relationships where the couple NEVER fights.  Either they are living in denial and shoving their problems under the rug or they aren't being fully intimate with each other enough to face those issues.  Everyone healthy person has a disagreement with their spouse now and then.  It doesn't have to be a full-on row, but at least some kind of issue that they'll need to work out together constructively.  I just think Danielle and Bobby are living in a "love bubble" that they are afraid to burst lest things turn sour for any number of reality-based reasons.  I am almost holding my breath thinking that at any minute the bubble will burst and the genie will be let out of the bottle.  The more "perfect" things are at the beginning of a relationship, the more I suspect they will crash and burn one day when either or neither party can continue their charade.  I'm sure there are rare couples that never disagree and everything is always wonderful, but I just don't see that happening in most cases, including this one.

[CousinOliver]

9 hours ago, psychoticstate said:

 

I'm puzzled as to how the show managed to cast 3 women who have no idea how to cook, clean or have any concept of basic homemaking skills, and all of them in their thirties.

While the ladies don't cook, I've seen no indication that they don't have basic homemaking skills.  Amber does her laundry, she just doesn't want to do anything, at all, for Dave.  Apparently even mixing his darks and lights with her own is too much of a burden.

Both Mia and Danielle had clean, organized homes when they did the house visits early on (although Amber's closet made me think she was pretty slovenly).  

I don't like cooking (I'm competent at it, but it's not enjoyable), but I actually like cleaning and laundry (but won't iron). Just because cooking isn't important to someone doesn't mean s/he has no idea how to keep a clean and safe house. 

[Ilovepie]

6 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Amber admitting that doesn't tell me she has more issues with insecurity than average,

I think there are many examples that point to her being overly sensitive, all of which have been discussed ad naseum on this forum. Dave is critical but I think if she would have told him in a mature manner that his criticism was hurtful and not helpful and not made a big deal out of every.little.thing. they might be in a better place. He is never going to coddle anyone. Of course, ymmv, but I relate better to Dave because I am more like him personality-wise. She would drive me crazy. 

6 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I don't see Bobby keeping up this level of self sacrifice forever.

I don’t either, but they have both have said that he is shouldering more of the household workload because she is spending 3 hours a day commuting. I would think this is because of the show and if they stay together long term things will change, but that is true in all relationships. There are times in life where one person takes care of more than the other depending on circumstances, and then things change and it shifts again. A good relationship is where people can be flexible and compromise and work together for the betterment of the household, and sometimes you have to be the one carrying the heavier weight. I think this is what Bobby is trying to do.

[humbleopinion]

Amber is once again self sabatoging by rambling on and on about the untrustworthiness of the men in her past.

Dave’s thought cloud....

If Amber started dating at 16 years old, how can someone with 20 years of dating history still be so bad at picking men?

She is really a train wreck, crossing tracks.

I am not the guy to save her from herself...

I need to text Bobby and see he wants to spend some time with me on Tuesday at the driving range...

[Kareem]

Beginning to wonder if anyone actually talked to this girl before they signed her up. Surprising since they did such a good job with Mia...  ;)

[humbleopinion]

On paper, Amber should be the poster girl for MAFS....

-long history at failed dating...wrong men-untrustworthy and cads

-independent...made bizarre comments about having to do more work caring for another person as a reason for avoiding marriage in the past...

-well paying job...dinged by undisclosed personal debt, high maintance costs in potions, lotions, hair, nails, clothing,SHOES, miscellaneous 

-telegenic...she changed her look to Tragic Blond at the 11th hour surprising the production crew and drawing more than her share of mean attention

-strong storyline...biological clocking ticking(do your best Marisa Tomei as Mona Lisa Vito in My Cousin Vinny)

-expressive...over emoting has been more of a negative than positive for Dave who gets overwhelmed with what comes out of her.

Amber and Dave have been the over sharing villains (mostly to each other) contrasting to Danielle’s and Bobby’s sunshine and rainbows life.

[ChiMama]

On 9/12/2018 at 8:13 AM, islandgal140 said:

Aint no way Amber was joking about their baby going from newborn to being 5 years old. Dave had every reason to side eye her for that comment.

Amber doesnt want to cook nor do her husband's laundry because that is extra shit but thinks she can care for a baby???

Ding, ding, ding. My thought too. Maybe Amber should adopt an older kid as a single mom. She has good income, etc. She doesn't seem suited to marriage or babies. Don't try to make yourself something you're not -- work with your strengths and make them work for you.

Edited September 16, 2018 by ChiMama

[gonecrackers]

I honestly thought she was joking because I've heard others say they'd have another if they could skip to (whatever age), who value motherhood in the early years, but also value their sleep & sanity. That said, in a word - teenagers.  If Amber doesn't want extra work or stress, kids (at any age), are probably not the way to go.

However, unless something about her changes, I couldn't see her wanting more than one kid, if anything just to say she fulfilled that part of her. Having kids can change people (for better & worse), but I don't think she'd be a bad mother, especially if she has enough help.

From what we've seen she's quite patient & sweet with Paisley -  & before I get slammed I know it's not the same thing as a kid.

Thing is, I haven't seen enough patience from fussy Dave (I remember the toilet paper roll 'incident', Dave, & I still find it "concerning").  If he doesn't lighten up the first time the kid messes up a rug or knocks something down etc. might send him into a tizzy.

Also, if she (or they, if together) makes good enough money she could afford a nanny; I could totally see Amber with a nanny. That could at least take a lot of the grunt work out of it for her, giving her free time to work & shop, & a professional cleaning service would satisfy Dave.

But I'm very doubtful this will happen for them, not together anyway.

[Crazy Bird Lady]

2 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

I honestly thought she was joking because I've heard others say they'd have another if they could skip to (whatever age), who value motherhood in the early years, but also value their sleep & sanity. That said, in a word - teenagers.  If Amber doesn't want extra work or stress, kids (at any age), are probably not the way to go.

I still think she was joking. I've heard quite a few moms (who adore their kids!) make similar remarks. Considering her age, I'm sure Amber has, too...

Quote

From what we've seen she's quite patient & sweet with Paisley -  & before I get slammed I know it's not the same thing as a kid.

Thing is, I haven't seen enough patience from fussy Dave (I remember the toilet paper roll 'incident', Dave, & I still find it "concerning").  If he doesn't lighten up the first time the kid messes up a rug or knocks something down etc. might send him into a tizzy.

Yes! Exactly that! Why is Amber the only one deemed 'unsuitable for parenthood' when Dave seems very easily annoyed, highly critical of even very small things (sometimes), and would rather spend time hanging out with his "bros" than with his family?!

Quote

Also, if she (or they, if together) make good enough money they could afford a nanny; I could totally see Amber with a nanny. That could at least take a lot of the grunt work out of it for her, giving her free time to work & shop, & a professional cleaning service would satisfy Dave.

That's the obvious solution. They'd need child care, in any case, since they both work. 

Quote

But I'm very doubtful this will happen for them, not together anyway.

No way. Dave has  just been "putting in his time" until Decision Day since (at least) the 2nd week into this.

Edited September 16, 2018 by Crazy Bird Lady

[Yeah No]

7 hours ago, Crazy Bird Lady said:

10 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

I honestly thought she was joking because I've heard others say they'd have another if they could skip to (whatever age), who value motherhood in the early years, but also value their sleep & sanity. That said, in a word - teenagers.  If Amber doesn't want extra work or stress, kids (at any age), are probably not the way to go.

I still think she was joking. I've heard quite a few moms (who adore their kids!) make similar remarks. Considering her age, I'm sure Amber has, too...

I don't know if I think she was joking.  I didn't take it that way and I'm usually pretty sensitive to humor.  I think Amber is her own worst enemy about a lot of things.  Why would anyone who says having children such a priority want to sabotage her image with the one guy that just might be in a position to consider giving them to her?  Even if she was joking he might not receive it that way.  He might think there's a little truth in every joke.  She should know better.

[LuvMyShows]

Somehow it has become OK to consider it "judgmental" if you think (or even worse, if you say) anything that is not 100% positive about someone else.  There is nothing wrong with two partners or spouses not liking something about the other person, and saying something about it.  The important part is how they say it and what happens next.  Dave could have been legitimately concerned about Amber's decision-making processes, since by her own admission, she has over and over again dated men she couldn't trust.  If I were Dave, I would want to understand it better...did she see red flags but choose to ignore them?  Did she think the person would change?   Did they seem trustworthy at first but then revealed their true selves?  Understanding things like this makes a partnership soooo much better in terms of knowing what might be behind someone's actions and how you can help.  But it seems like Amber's deep insecurity makes her want to run from any genuine discussion of her faults so she turns it around on Dave and accuses him of being judgmental.  He certainly could have been more caring and inquisitive in how he mentioned it to her, but now the conversation is adversarial and won't go anywhere positive.  But I am pretty darn sure that there are things she doesn't like about Dave, which she is perfectly entitled to as well, and she wouldn't consider it judgmental if she mentioned them to him.  These two are just so mismatched!!!

[Crazy Bird Lady]

On 9/17/2018 at 12:23 AM, LuvMyShows said:

Somehow it has become OK to consider it "judgmental" if you think (or even worse, if you say) anything that is not 100% positive about someone else.  There is nothing wrong with two partners or spouses not liking something about the other person, and saying something about it. 

There is certainly nothing wrong with private discussion between two partners/spouses about things that bother them about each other. (Of course, there is nothing 'private' about discussing these issues in front of cameras, knowing it can be aired on national TV. That's an inherent flaw in the MAFS format, and almost certainly one of the reasons so many of their couples are spectacularly unsuccessful.)

Anyone who is at all insecure or shy about being confronted or criticized publicly should be immediately rejected as a candidate for the show.  

Quote

The important part is how they say it and what happens next.

Agreed. 

Quote

Dave could have been legitimately concerned about Amber's decision-making processes, since by her own admission, she has over and over again dated men she couldn't trust. 

He could have been, but I think that was Dave's panic and/or embarrassment talking. Amber had just told him that she trusted him, and he was the only man she had ever really trusted. It seems like that should have been a tender moment between them, if Dave cared about her and trusted her, too.

Quote

If I were Dave, I would want to understand it better...Did she think the person would change?   Did they seem trustworthy at first but then revealed their true selves?  Understanding things like this makes a partnership soooo much better in terms of knowing what might be behind someone's actions and how you can help. 

If Dave were seriously trying to be helpful by gaining an understanding of Amber's past relationships & why they failed --wouldn't he have asked those questions more like the way you did?  

Amber has admitted to being very insecure, and has said that she often feels 'judged' --which makes the insecurity worse. Knowing that to be the case: if Dave were really trying to be helpful, wouldn't he be extra careful how (and when) he 'mentioned' his questions about her failed relationships? Dave could have brought that up in private.

Quote

...Amber's deep insecurity makes her want to run from any genuine discussion of her faults so she turns it around on Dave and accuses him of being judgmental. He certainly could have been more caring and inquisitive in how he mentioned it to her, but now the conversation is adversarial and won't go anywhere positive. 

I think they reached the point where their relationship wouldn't "go anywhere positive" a couple of weeks ago.

With his questions about Amber's 'exes:  Dave may have focused on the "gym bro" who had dated Amber, concerned how many other people in his social group may have heard whatever the man said about her. Remember, he told Amber he would never have married her if he'd known she had dated that guy at the gym. I think it's legitimate to consider the possibility Dave was deliberately throwing those past failures in Amber's face as justification for why he doesn't consider her a suitable wife.

Quote

But I am pretty darn sure that there are things she doesn't like about Dave, which she is perfectly entitled to as well, and she wouldn't consider it judgmental if she mentioned them to him.  These two are just so mismatched!!!

Obviously, there are things she doesn't like about Dave. She mentions things sometimes on the 'diary cam'. But I think she's afraid to criticize him to his face. Often, Amber stays silent when she's hurt by something Dave says. But then her hurt and anger and frustration build up, and she blurts out something to try to hurt him -usually something she doesn't really mean. That's not a good way to handle disagreements, obviously, but it happens when a person keeps their feelings bottled up.

You are right that this couple is so mismatched! It's gotten to the point that it's stressful to even watch them together. 

Edited September 18, 2018 by Crazy Bird Lady

[sasha206]

Danielle and those ridiculous eyebrows.  The darkness and thickness not only makes her look ridiculous but it ages her.  

[Kareem]

Agree. All she needs is dark red lipstick and she'll look like Bette Davis in Baby Jane.  

[humbleopinion]

Holy cow, that is a vintage movie reference...bet only Kareem and humbo have seen this movie...

[Gem 10]

On 9/12/2018 at 10:18 AM, DrewPaul2010 said:

What does Amber do for a living? It must be about the only thing she is successful at. Did she BS her way through all the endless forms and questionnaires? These people who agree to do this show put faith in the counselors to match them with someone who is marriage material and in this case mother material and she is neither. Dave should get a refund immediately. I wish we could have seen the sock episode...did she have a total melt down over socks?

Actually babies don't have to keep you up at night...let them cry about three nights in a row and they will give up crying at night (since it does no good). 

Edited September 18, 2018 by Gem 10
Wrong thread.

[NoWhammies]

2 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Holy cow, that is a vintage movie reference...bet only Kareem and humbo have seen this movie...

saw it. :) But then I'm "vintage."

[humbleopinion]

Gonna bust out the oldie movie references now that there is at least an audience of 2...so many great movies made in the 60's.

[Ilovepie]

18 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Holy cow, that is a vintage movie reference...bet only Kareem and humbo have seen this movie...

 

7 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Gonna bust out the oldie movie references now that there is at least an audience of 2...so many great movies made in the 60's.

Bust them out! I am only in my 40's but I love old movies, the older the better. TCM is my favorite channel! Perhaps people don't realize they are actually referencing a classic every time they say someone is "gaslighting" their partner ;-p