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S06.E09: Break the String


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While Daddy buys time with Barb, Daya looks for new ways to bring in oxy. Black Cindy's guilt takes a toll on her body. Red acquires a powerful ally.

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I do think Caputo is trying to do what he can for T out of a genuine feeling of wanting to help her. 

Realistically she was kind of a riot leader and there's a lot on her. She actually got the win and threw it away. So she is on the hook for that. I hope she beats the murder charge. But I could see if she gets the extra 10 years. 

I think it's interesting we're only seeing her side of it and just a slice of what's going on outside. 

Her Storky friend is some bull. It's not like T is making anything up. 

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7 minutes ago, Armchair Critic said:

How did they fix Red's hair, it doesn't seem like she had that much hair to be able to comb over where she got scalped?

Yeah I’d like to know too!  She had no hair at all for a large area of her scalp!  Unless they performed surgery or gave her a wig, how did she get such a full head of hair again in minutes?  I want that magic treatment!!

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I knew as soon as Daya asked her mom about Cesar's contacts that she would get roped back in. Damn it. I root for these people to stay out once they're out. But her needing money, her own place, the kids, recidivism, etc.

I cackle whenever Carol shuts Badison down. It gives me life.

"I'll call it 'Badison News Bears.'"

"That's stupid."

  • Love 16
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1 hour ago, ShortyMac said:

I knew as soon as Daya asked her mom about Cesar's contacts that she would get roped back in. Damn it. I root for these people to stay out once they're out. But her needing money, her own place, the kids, recidivism, etc.

I get that it's hard to find a job when you're a convicted felon, as well as difficulties in keeping and caring for your children. That's a hardship you bring upon yourself when you choose to egregiously break the law, it's not something you're entitled to whine about like you're some kind of victim. And it certainly doesn't justify choosing to continue your criminal ways... the ends do not justfy the means. Yes, I know the show was trying to make out like the kids were in a worse place with the foster parents than they would have been with Aleida, but I honestly didn't see that to be the case. They appeared to be housed, clothed, and well fed. They did not appear to be abused or neglected in any way, and the older kids didn't even want to leave there and return to a life with their mother. That's telling.

I know many felons, including some who have been to prison. and there are plenty of second-chance employment opportunities. There are tons of resources to find those places when you go to the unemployment office. There is no excuse for Aleida, or anyone else in her situation, to not find a regular job or two that pays enough for an apartment and living expenses, even if they start off at minimum wage, as long as you live within your means.

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Poor Gloria looks like she’s in for some trouble, and for what?  Zirconia really thinks Gloria is stealing Luschek from her? I wonder how many inmates are in jail/prison because they’re just delusional and have no skills for coping when things don’t go their way. 

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15 hours ago, Globegrl said:

As a convicted felon who could not find a job to save my life after my conviction I am compelled to tell you that your sweeping generalizations about employment for felons is wrong.  You have no idea what it is like.  I do.

I conceded that it is more difficult... but it definitely is not impossible. As I mentioned, I have had many close-up experiences with this situation**, and seen what is possible, so I certainly do know what it is like. Finding second-chance employment opportunities is as simple as googling "companies that hire felons", and the unemployment offices of each state have numerous resources available.

**The friends and roommates that I've known were convicted on felonious drug charges, sex charges, and assault, nothing involving robbery or a death, so I can't speak to whether that makes a difference.

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4 hours ago, axlmadonna said:

I conceded that it is more difficult... but it definitely is not impossible. As I mentioned, I have had many close-up experiences with this situation**, and seen what is possible, so I certainly do know what it is like. Finding second-chance employment opportunities is as simple as googling "companies that hire felons", and the unemployment offices of each state have numerous resources available.

**The friends and roommates that I've known were convicted on felonious drug charges, sex charges, and assault, nothing involving robbery or a death, so I can't speak to whether that makes a difference.

I can tell you that the "companies that hire felons" and the offices that purport to help convicts find jobs are often useless.  Some male ex-cons can find construction and factory jobs but there is little available for women, and moreso less in white collar employment.

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Carol putting Badison in charge of her “teams” kickball is going to spell trouble or a place to actually have the gang war erupt. I’m also to see where the relationship between Carol and Red goes to. 

I guess Red no longer has access to the hair dye as she was mostly gray and her patch seemed to have disappeared after her haircut. 

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On 7/30/2018 at 6:14 PM, DietCokeJunkie said:

I wonder how many inmates are in jail/prison because they’re just delusional and have no skills for coping when things don’t go their way

I remember when Taystee was released she couldn't handle life on the outside which made the whole prison riot and her list of demands kind of ironic since she wouldn't have had to even deal with prison if she would have stayed out.

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On 7/29/2018 at 10:00 PM, Armchair Critic said:

How did they fix Red's hair, it doesn't seem like she had that much hair to be able to comb over where she got scalped?

 Trump needs to hire these ladies to do his hair because they really fixed her up!!

 

 

Regarding people being able to find numerous resources after being released from prison/county jail I disagree.  I have worked with plenty of people living on the streets that have had very little opportunity.  They have no phone, and are supposed to call a number to check in and then the directory is confusing as hell.  That post seems very victim blaming and poor shaming. We know the statistics of who are imprisoned and it is often a system based on class.  Which is why Piper Kerman, an educated white woman, is the only one who was able to write and get a book to be published in mainstream media and have a TV show created out of it.  There was one organization in Washington State called Conviction Careers (they have now since closed unfortunately) which was one of the only organizations in the US like it's kind where they would provide transportation, interview coaching, clothing and connections to places in local areas that would hire people not utilizing the "Box" on job applications.  Winco is a great example of a place that would hire people with convictions that would actually give someone a little bit of a head start because they could actually buy stock in the company.  Other than that the system is shit, WorkSource is shit and so is the foster care system.  Aleida would be recognized as literally homeless and would have a hell of a time getting her kids back.  

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On 7/29/2018 at 8:56 PM, Brn2bwild said:

I can see how Carol got control of C Block, but how on earth did Barb get control of D Block?  She seems like a basket case who would have been pushed out of the way long ago.

 

On 7/29/2018 at 10:00 PM, Armchair Critic said:

How did they fix Red's hair, it doesn't seem like she had that much hair to be able to comb over where she got scalped?

The two major questions of the episode for me and I'm not sure which one bothered me more.  Probably the Barb question.  I just can't see how it is that people would continue to take orders from her/let her be in charge in the state we've seen her in so far (which it sounds like is the state that she's been in for decades), or how it is that some enterprising prisoner wouldn't have successfully staged a coup and taken her place by now.

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On 8/4/2018 at 10:38 PM, rippleintime17 said:

Part of the issue with Aleida also is that she appears to have not a single redeeming quality of any kind.

Yeah. They've kind of painted themselves into a corner with her. We've seen her back story. We've seen how she treated her kids at visits. It just sucks that the kids are the ones suffering, whether they're in that over crowded foster home or if they end up back with her. She's a terrible mother, and a pretty terrible human overall. My opinion has absolutely nothing to do with her status as a convicted felon, though I do appreciate that the show is spotlighting a tragic issue. They just didn't pick a sympathetic character for the storyline. 

 

Red's hair has me baffled as well. The roots were still red (how?) right before that styling. Now it's 90% grey and longer than it could possibly be. Was she wearing some sort of wig before (and where did she get it?) to achieve the red roots? Is it a wig now? I spent way too much time pondering this! 

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On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2018 at 3:13 PM, Globegrl said:

I can tell you that the "companies that hire felons" and the offices that purport to help convicts find jobs are often useless.  Some male ex-cons can find construction and factory jobs but there is little available for women, and moreso less in white collar employment.

It's true that you won't find many white collar job opportunities when you're a convicted criminal. But that's a far cry from implying that there are *no* job opportunities in that situation, apart from some MLM scheme. That's just not true, and as I was saying in my original post, there are plenty of jobs, albeit mostly retail related, available at second-chance employment companies. And you can make enough to live on, even with kids, doing a job (or two) like that. Furthermore, if you work hard, are reliable, and have a good attitude, you can even move up in those companies. I've seen it first-hand, so I know it can be done. The catch is living within your means. But there is no excuse for returning to criminal activity and trying to justify it by saying you can't get a job anywhere and you can't afford to take care of your kids.

Aleida really bugged me this season. Not only did she engage in the above, but she treated that guard who was trying to woo her like crap. Yes, I know, the show threw in a line about him expecting her to cook dinner for the household; but, for the most part, he was very sweet with her and she was very rude in return. I do think he should have asked her to cook, rather than assuming she would, but I also think that she should have offered to do it without even being asked. It's the least she can do to show appreciation for his letting her live in his house after being evicted, considering they barely knew each other. I imagine most people would balk at that, even without the convicted criminal element. 

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On ‎8‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 6:56 AM, IDreamofJoaquin said:

Regarding people being able to find numerous resources after being released from prison/county jail I disagree.  I have worked with plenty of people living on the streets that have had very little opportunity.  They have no phone, and are supposed to call a number to check in and then the directory is confusing as hell.  That post seems very victim blaming and poor shaming. We know the statistics of who are imprisoned and it is often a system based on class.  Which is why Piper Kerman, an educated white woman, is the only one who was able to write and get a book to be published in mainstream media and have a TV show created out of it.  There was one organization in Washington State called Conviction Careers (they have now since closed unfortunately) which was one of the only organizations in the US like it's kind where they would provide transportation, interview coaching, clothing and connections to places in local areas that would hire people not utilizing the "Box" on job applications.  Winco is a great example of a place that would hire people with convictions that would actually give someone a little bit of a head start because they could actually buy stock in the company.  Other than that the system is shit, WorkSource is shit and so is the foster care system.  Aleida would be recognized as literally homeless and would have a hell of a time getting her kids back.  

There is a big difference between not taking advantage of opportunities and not having opportunities. When you choose to break the law, especially to a large degree and/or multiple times, you are choosing to make life more difficult for yourself and to limit the opportunities available to you. The more you take responsibility for yourself, the better off you will be. That doesn't mean that life will ever be easy or that you won't go through rough times. But it does make a huge difference overall. I strongly believe that it is this attitude, rather than a "system built on class" that determines our destiny. YMMV

We know that Piper Kerman wrote a book about her prison experiences and it was published and turned into a TV show, but do we know that she is the only one who was "able" to do so? How many people have attempted to do it and were denied?

Conviction Careers did good work, but it sounds like a lot of what they did are resources that are also available at the state workforce commision (at least, that's the case here in Texas. I don't know if it's the same in every state). They help you navigate the unemployment directory, they offer one-on-one assistance in writing a resume, they have numerous classes on how to interview and how to look for and keep a job, they offer assistance with clothes and transportation, they help with job searches, all of that. They have a whole building full of computers and internet access that they offer for free (something that can also be found at any library). The opportunities and resources are there, if you are willing to do your part.

 

 

On ‎8‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 7:20 PM, possibilities said:

I also object to the idea that once you serve your time, you deserve whatever additional hardships come your way. Even leaving aside the utter injustice of who gets adequate defense and who gets convicted vs who gets away with things, a life sentence is not supposed to be the result in all but the most serious instances.

If we want to punish people for the rest of their lives and destroy them completely, instead of holding them accountable or attempting to rehabilitate them, we should at least be honest about what we're doing and not pretend otherwise and then blame them further for not finding a way out of that maze.

The fact that life is harder for you once you've been convicted of a felony is not an additional punishment for your crime, it's a consequence of it. That's why it's a good idea to choose not to commit crimes. If you do something harmful to others and to society as a whole, you do deserve the consequences of your actions, and it is on you to overcome the obstacles that you put in your own way. The point about unfairness in the justice system is a different discussion, and one that is absolutely fair to have. I don't believe that you should spend the rest of your life paying for a crime for which you have already paid your debt to society, and there are most certainly flaws in the justice system as a whole. But I also understand why a lot of business owners would have an issue trusting a potential employee who chose to commit serious crimes. That's not a black and white issue.

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3 hours ago, axlmadonna said:

It's true that you won't find many white collar job opportunities when you're a convicted criminal. But that's a far cry from implying that there are *no* job opportunities in that situation, apart from some MLM scheme. That's just not true, and as I was saying in my original post, there are plenty of jobs, albeit mostly retail related, available at second-chance employment companies. And you can make enough to live on, even with kids, doing a job (or two) like that. Furthermore, if you work hard, are reliable, and have a good attitude, you can even move up in those companies. I've seen it first-hand, so I know it can be done. The catch is living within your means. But there is no excuse for returning to criminal activity and trying to justify it by saying you can't get a job anywhere and you can't afford to take care of your kids.

Aleida really bugged me this season. Not only did she engage in the above, but she treated that guard who was trying to woo her like crap. Yes, I know, the show threw in a line about him expecting her to cook dinner for the household; but, for the most part, he was very sweet with her and she was very rude in return. I do think he should have asked her to cook, rather than assuming she would, but I also think that she should have offered to do it without even being asked. It's the least she can do to show appreciation for his letting her live in his house after being evicted, considering they barely knew each other. I imagine most people would balk at that, even without the convicted criminal element. 

Retail jobs are NOT available to those who have financial crime convictions.  That is a fact.

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1 hour ago, Globegrl said:

Retail jobs are NOT available to those who have financial crime convictions.  That is a fact.

That is NOT a fact. I have a financial crime conviction, and I have gotten retail jobs**. Yes, your options are more limited, and the ones you have are not ideal, but there are still options available, and they all pay at least minimum wage. Furthermore, you can get a telemarketing job almost anywhere. That's just off the top of my head, I'm sure I could find more if I looked around. There are also some places of employment who only ask about the last five to seven years of criminal history; so, the longer you go without recidivism, the more opportunities you'll find.

**To clarify, you can't get a retail job that requires you to handle money, such as cashiering. But you can get jobs like stocking inventory, working in the bakery or deli, dishwashing / busing in a restaurant, etc.

Edited by axlmadonna
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6 hours ago, DangerousMinds said:

How would Aleida possibly afford an apartment in NYC with her kids on a retail salary?

How would anyone? Does no one living in New York work retail? And, even if that were the case, she could move to New Jersey where the cost of living is significantly less expensive. 

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18 hours ago, axlmadonna said:

There is a big difference between not taking advantage of opportunities and not having opportunities. When you choose to break the law, especially to a large degree and/or multiple times, you are choosing to make life more difficult for yourself and to limit the opportunities available to you. The more you take responsibility for yourself, the better off you will be. That doesn't mean that life will ever be easy or that you won't go through rough times. But it does make a huge difference overall. I strongly believe that it is this attitude, rather than a "system built on class" that determines our destiny. YMMV

We know that Piper Kerman wrote a book about her prison experiences and it was published and turned into a TV show, but do we know that she is the only one who was "able" to do so? How many people have attempted to do it and were denied?

Conviction Careers did good work, but it sounds like a lot of what they did are resources that are also available at the state workforce commision (at least, that's the case here in Texas. I don't know if it's the same in every state). They help you navigate the unemployment directory, they offer one-on-one assistance in writing a resume, they have numerous classes on how to interview and how to look for and keep a job, they offer assistance with clothes and transportation, they help with job searches, all of that. They have a whole building full of computers and internet access that they offer for free (something that can also be found at any library). The opportunities and resources are there, if you are willing to do your part.

This sounds an awful lot like the "pull up your bootstraps" sentiment. It's hard to get out from underneath generational poverty   Even Piper Kerman acknowledged the fact that a lot of the women in the system with her were leaving to absolutely nothing with absolutely nothing.  People on this board keep pointing out these facts to you and you keep doubling down on your argument that people just don't work hard enough. BYE.

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5 hours ago, IDreamofJoaquin said:

This sounds an awful lot like the "pull up your bootstraps" sentiment. It's hard to get out from underneath generational poverty   Even Piper Kerman acknowledged the fact that a lot of the women in the system with her were leaving to absolutely nothing with absolutely nothing.  People on this board keep pointing out these facts to you and you keep doubling down on your argument that people just don't work hard enough. BYE.

"Pull up your bootstraps" is a fantastic sentiment, and one that works when people actually do it instead of making a bunch of excuses for their poor choices and bad attitude. Neither you, nor anyone else here, is obligated to agree with that, but there is plenty of evidence to support it. Yes, it is hard to move up in life when you start out at the bottom. Life is hard, in different ways, for most people...especially when you put even more obstacles in your own way by choosing to break the law. And, yes, sometimes you get dealt a tough hand in life, but that doesn't mean that you can't do it if you make a real effort. There are numerous examples of people who started off with nothing and worked their way up to a better life. That's my opinion, just as you have your own.

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14 hours ago, axlmadonna said:

How would anyone? Does no one living in New York work retail? And, even if that were the case, she could move to New Jersey where the cost of living is significantly less expensive. 

Yeah, teenagers, college kids, people just getting out of college or who are new to the city work retail jobs in NYC -- aka people with roommates (sometimes multiple) or help from their parents. I've lived in NYC for 16 years, worked a variety of blue-collar / white-collar jobs, have a college degree and no criminal record whatsoever. I arrived with some money and with a job already, and it still took 11 years before I could afford a 1-bedroom apartment here without a roommate, and the rent situation is not getting any better. I also am very lucky in that I now get an extra 10k/yr from a trust my grandfather set up for me. I live in Queens by the way, not even Manhattan or Brooklyn (where the rents are absolutely ridiculous). There is simply no way Aleida would realistically be able to afford her own place, pay her bills, care for her children (financially and even just being present in their lives) by working 1 or 2 minimum wage jobs here. That is laughable.

Realistically, I feel a person in her situation probably would turn back to something she knows how to do, and something that is going to make her much more money while it lasts, even if there is a risk she ends up back in prison. New Jersey is slightly more affordable, but do we know if she is on parole or not?  What are the rules about moving out of state when on parole? She would have to move pretty far out of the NYC environs before it would be realistic for her to afford a place on her own, that could also fit her four kids, on a couple of minimum wage jobs. Not saying it's entirely not do-able, but it would be extremely difficult in NYC without some assistance. 
That being said, I have no idea what kind of social programs might be in place here to help out with that. Whatever they are, we are not being shown them this season on OITNB.

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On 7/29/2018 at 11:56 PM, Brn2bwild said:

I can see how Carol got control of C Block, but how on earth did Barb get control of D Block?  She seems like a basket case who would have been pushed out of the way long ago.

Carol is the kind of crazy you can see up front. Barb’s kind of crazy you never see coming and is more dangerous. 

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On 8/7/2018 at 10:34 AM, axlmadonna said:

"Pull up your bootstraps" is a fantastic sentiment, and one that works when people actually do it instead of making a bunch of excuses for their poor choices and bad attitude. Neither you, nor anyone else here, is obligated to agree with that, but there is plenty of evidence to support it. Yes, it is hard to move up in life when you start out at the bottom. Life is hard, in different ways, for most people...especially when you put even more obstacles in your own way by choosing to break the law. And, yes, sometimes you get dealt a tough hand in life, but that doesn't mean that you can't do it if you make a real effort. There are numerous examples of people who started off with nothing and worked their way up to a better life. That's my opinion, just as you have your own.

A  lot of people started out without boots.

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It really is tragic thinking back to season one, and how Taystee actually did manage to get out of jail, but deliberately got sent back in because she was struggling on the outside. If she had just stuck it out on the outside, none of this would be happening. Maybe the riot itself wouldn't have happened? While the riot was definitely the result of a huge number of abuses by Sadist Guards Inc., she was the one who lead the charge, and she was the one who was more or less running things, and, most notably, she was the one who turned down a great offer to make things better for everyone, because she didnt think it was enough to get justice for her dead bestie. I get her wanting justice for Pouseys senseless death. But, maybe because I just generally disliked last season, I just found myself being over it. Maybe because I had a year to mourn, and the characters had only about an hour? These long breaks between seasons SUCK. 

Still, I hope the she beats the murder charge. She might, by legal definition, deserve extra time for the riot, but not for a murder that not only did she not commit, but was done by the very guys who are supposed to be upholding the law. 

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I think the riot still would have happened. I don't think they would have gotten all their demands met though. Caputo went into the prison because he had a good relationship with her iirc. 

That's my favorite scene of the series - when Fig tells her that they'll meet all the conditions and he looks at T and says "You did it!" 

But it is tragic because she actually served her time and got out, and now even if she appeals, she'll still likely have 10 more years. 

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In a way it doesn’t make sense to worry if she will get another 10 years because she really doesn’t want to get out.  She’s already been out and didn’t like it and the longer you stay in the harder it is to adjust to the outside.  Caputo really tried to help her and she didn’t care what happened to him during the riot.  Also they really need to address Reds hair.  You can’t just fix something like that especially in prison.

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On 8/29/2018 at 9:16 AM, Juniebaby said:

In a way it doesn’t make sense to worry if she will get another 10 years because she really doesn’t want to get out.  She’s already been out and didn’t like it and the longer you stay in the harder it is to adjust to the outside.  Caputo really tried to help her and she didn’t care what happened to him during the riot.  Also they really need to address Reds hair.  You can’t just fix something like that especially in prison.

I thought part of the reason Taystee had problems on the outside was that she missed her friend, Poussey so much.  Maybe Taystee would do better now, because she really doesn't want to return to what it is now.  I agree that its not easy for convicted felons to find new employment.  not only their history, but usually the lack of a phone and reliable transportation.  Family support is a huge help, but many ex-cons do not have that.  But in a city like NYC, I would think Alieda could find something.  Working in a restaurant kitchen, washing dishes at least.  I also heard that Starbucks hires ex-cons.

I thought Caputo could have answered the prosecutor's questions better, how yes he was "threatened" with the nail board, but he never really believed Taystee would actually do it, she acted that way because of other prisoners.

Who would pack their phone?

My best guess as to Red's hair, was that part of it started to grow back in, albiet as grey, and the hairdresser arranged a better 'comb over' to help until the rest of her hair grows back.

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