S05.E18: Spaghetti Sauce and a Dumpster Fire

[paulvdb]

Christy considers getting a new sponsor, Nora, after witnessing Marjorie have a major meltdown in a grocery store, and Bonnie tries her hand at being a supportive friend.

[bichonblitz]

I really liked this episode. I agree with Marjorie. Getting older is a bitch, especially in this society. 

[Spunkygal]

I enjoyed this episode. As a woman of a certain age, I sometimes feel like Marjorie does that people look through me, not at me. I've never had a strong enough urge to go bonkers in a store, but I have calmly spoken up that "I was next." I loved when Bonnie went to Marjorie's and was so concerned. I howled when the cat hissed at Bonnie! I also thought Jill was particularly funny this episode with her goofy laughing. I think I will enjoy Nora and am glad Christy is staying with her as sponsor. 

Finally, if the writing does start going to Doo Doo, I am still watching for Adam's precious puppy! Squee! I think this was my favorite episode this season. Up to now, I've been "meh" on it. 

Forgot to add: When Christy saw Marjorie's meltdown in the store, I kinda wish she had waited for Marjorie to get her order and walk away from the counter so she (C) could walk up, say hi, and ask if she wanted to go for coffee. She should have addressed it with M then rather than sneaking out and telling everyone else about it. She acknowledged that this was out of character for a good friend and knew M needed help. It would have shown a new level of growth for C to help her sponsor. 

Edited April 20, 2018 by Spunkygal

[funky-rat]

My sponsor lives over an hour away, so the chances of running in to her in a store are slim to none.  Depending on the meltdown, and how out-of-character I felt it was, I might hang around and ask if she was OK, but I might also go seek out advice from someone else, as Christy did.  I am not sure about AA, but in Al-Anon, gossip is a big no-no (I would assume it is in AA as well) but that's one of those fine lines where it's technically gossip, but if she's genuinely concerned, and not breaking her anonymity by talking about her to people outside the group, then I think she'd not be violating rules.

I tend to get wishy-washy like Christy does - asking for advice, then not taking it at times, but my bigger issue is that I shut down.  I'm an only child, and in the time I was raised, I was encouraged to try to find solutions myself (because the school of wisdom then was that I had no siblings to rely on, so I should learn early on to fend for myself), so it's weird to me to reach out to help from someone else, and I've been neglecting my step work and my weekly check-ins because I've been trying to find solutions to my problems (which have multiplied this year), plus I'm also kind-of sick of talking about it, and would just rather shut down (which I know is dangerous).  I've resolved that I'm resuming my step work this weekend, and will let her know via e-mail that I'll be checking in on my usual day and time this week because not working the program is not working for me.  We had someone in our group this week mention that she had started to slack off, and found that things were getting chaotic again, and that was a nudge.  The 2nd nudge came from the show this week, when the new sponsor asked Christy "How's that working out for you?" (at least I think it was the new sponsor).  That's something that my sponsor says to me so much that I made an embroidery sampler for her for Christmas with that on it.

I also think Christy will benefit from having a sponsor closer to her own age.

[MaryMitch]

I really like Marjorie, so I was really glad to see that she wasn't on the verge of losing her sobriety. She's sure under a lot of stress!  I also like that Bonnie reached out to her.  Great episode!

[monakane]

Quote

I enjoyed this episode. As a woman of a certain age, I sometimes feel like Marjorie does that people look through me, not at me. I've never had a strong enough urge to go bonkers in a store, but I have calmly spoken up that "I was next." 

I had something similar happen to me at a bar last year.  The bartender ignored me and my friends several times.  I leaned over and asked him if we were invisible.  He was very attentive after that.  I was happy that the show addressed being an older woman in our society.  It was also nice to see Saint Marjorie with some flaws other than too many cats.

[hnygrl]

I was extremely relieved when Bonnie went to check on Marjorie. Up to that point I was getting angrier and angrier at these idiots. It was obvious to anybody on EARTH that something was wrong with her, and nobody, not one of those so-called "friends" thought to just ASK HER? NOBODY? Damn. Y'all some stinky friends....then Bonnie invaded her turf and insisted she talk. Thank. GOD for Bonnie. Her and Adam's little Fist-bump instead of a kiss was cute as hell (as was Adam talking to the puppy). I'm warming to them this season. They make sense.

Right before Christy said she's staying with the new sponsor I was saying to myself "I like this new sponsor, she's harder on her than Marjorie ever was. I think she needs to stay with her."

I'm also glad my prayer was answered about Jill. Next (last week's) episode she's back. Been to rehab and gotten clean. 'Nuff said. That's exactly how I wanted them to handle her situation. I hope she either gets to adopt a baby or she finally meets a man who appreciates the 'beautiful mess' she is. She's quickly becoming my favorite.

[Blakeston]

25 minutes ago, hnygrl said:

I was extremely relieved when Bonnie went to check on Marjorie. Up to that point I was getting angrier and angrier at these idiots. It was obvious to anybody on EARTH that something was wrong with her, and nobody, not one of those so-called "friends" thought to just ASK HER? NOBODY? Damn. 

Christy tried to talk to Marjorie about it, but Marjorie wasn't having it. She kept insisting that everything was fine.

I have to wonder - would it be normal for a sponsor to say "Don't call me after eight?" I get the need for sponsors to set boundaries, but I'd think after 8 PM would be when a lot of alcoholics would have the strongest urges to drink. 

[funky-rat]

28 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

Christy tried to talk to Marjorie about it, but Marjorie wasn't having it. She kept insisting that everything was fine.

I have to wonder - would it be normal for a sponsor to say "Don't call me after eight?" I get the need for sponsors to set boundaries, but I'd think after 8 PM would be when a lot of alcoholics would have the strongest urges to drink. 

When we have newcomers at our meetings, we tell them when we give them a phone list that of someone is not available, go to the next number until you find someone who is, because many of us have jobs, etc.  I don't think it's completely unreasonable to tell her to call during certain times, but I have a feeling if she were to call and say it was an emergency, her new sponsor would take the call.

[iMonrey]

Quote

Up to that point I was getting angrier and angrier at these idiots. It was obvious to anybody on EARTH that something was wrong with her, and nobody, not one of those so-called "friends" thought to just ASK HER? NOBODY? 

They tried to confront her at the Bistro and should wouldn't admit to anything being wrong.

I do think Marjorie's friends fail to realize how much stress she's under having to take care of Victor 24/7 and that they don't really appreciate her, but some of that is on her. If she shuts down and doesn't share her feelings she can't expect her friends to read her mind. I'm glad she finally opened up to them.

That said, it was strange her issue turned out to be something else entirely. I just figured it was the stress she was going through because of her husband's illness. (Did he have a stroke? I can't remember what happened to him.)

[SunnyBeBe]

That storyline with Marjorie's husband just lying in the bed 24/7and needing around the clock care....it's just so bogus.  People like that need to be in a rehab facility, getting physical therapy, getting counseling, learning to be mobile again.  Just laying in a bed? That's for people on Hospice who are terminally ill or in a coma.  I wish they'd get real with that story.  It's so frustrating.  

Dose anyone know if in AA you are required to apologize to people in your life that you have harmed, hurt, etc.  Like Bonnie did last week to the woman in prison?  And if you don't do it, what happens to you?

[illdoc]

45 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Dose anyone know if in AA you are required to apologize to people in your life that you have harmed, hurt, etc.  Like Bonnie did last week to the woman in prison?  And if you don't do it, what happens to you?

I believe "making amends to people harmed by your drinking" is one of the 12 steps. I don't know which number (I think 7 or 9---my reference is an episode of Seinfeld).

[hnygrl]

You're right Sunnybee.

My Grandfather had a massive stroke when I was in my early 20's. He could only blink. And breathe. That 's all. Seeing him like that broke my heart. And BROKE my mother. She told us she would routinely need to pull over to the side of the road after visiting him because she was crying so hard.

If Marjorie's husband is that bad? He should be at HOME. He needs to be in a rehab facility. If he can't eat, can't poop or pee, cant even move or blink? Marjorie or whatever respite care she's getting ain't enough. Not nearly.

 

As you said, BOGUS.

[qtpye]

13 hours ago, Spunkygal said:

I enjoyed this episode. As a woman of a certain age, I sometimes feel like Marjorie does that people look through me, not at me. I've never had a strong enough urge to go bonkers in a store, but I have calmly spoken up that "I was next." I loved when Bonnie went to Marjorie's and was so concerned. I howled when the cat hissed at Bonnie! I also thought Jill was particularly funny this episode with her goofy laughing. I think I will enjoy Nora and am glad Christy is staying with her as sponsor. 

Finally, if the writing does start going to Doo Doo, I am still watching for Adam's precious puppy! Squee! I think this was my favorite episode this season. Up to now, I've been "meh" on it. 

Forgot to add: When Christy saw Marjorie's meltdown in the store, I kinda wish she had waited for Marjorie to get her order and walk away from the counter so she (C) could walk up, say hi, and ask if she wanted to go for coffee. She should have addressed it with M then rather than sneaking out and telling everyone else about it. She acknowledged that this was out of character for a good friend and knew M needed help. It would have shown a new level of growth for C to help her sponsor. 

As a woman of color, I am used to not being seen, so I am sure it will even be worse as I get older, which should be fun (sarcasm).

[Nordly Beaumont]

Mimi Kennedy reminds me of Frances McDormand so her flipping out at the deli counter reminded me of Frances McD flipping out at Old Navy (for the same reason) in the movie Friends With Money.

I thought Allison Janney looked so pretty when she stopped at Marjorie's. I think it was the soft lip color. I mean, she's always pretty but even more so in that scene.

[Maharincess]

3 hours ago, hnygrl said:

You're right Sunnybee.

My Grandfather had a massive stroke when I was in my early 20's. He could only blink. And breathe. That 's all. Seeing him like that broke my heart. And BROKE my mother. She told us she would routinely need to pull over to the side of the road after visiting him because she was crying so hard.

If Marjorie's husband is that bad? He should be at HOME. He needs to be in a rehab facility. If he can't eat, can't poop or pee, cant even move or blink? Marjorie or whatever respite care she's getting ain't enough. Not nearly.

 

As you said, BOGUS.

He is at home. 

[MissLucas]

Great episode - what I would really like to know though is if that cat hissing at Bonnie was a feline ad-lib?

[msrachelj]

1 hour ago, MissLucas said:

Great episode - what I would really like to know though is if that cat hissing at Bonnie was a feline ad-lib?

cat person here. i was wondering the same thing! love the cats and love that marjorie is an unapologetic cat lady.

[Blakeston]

I'd like to hear more about what happened to Marjorie's former sponsor.

We know she fell off the wagon after something like 52 years (!) of sobriety, after some minor incident (I think it was her hedge being cut down.) Now we know that she stopped being Marjorie's sponsor, even though she'd been her sponsor for thirty-something years.

Did the woman decide that once she'd fallen off the wagon, she couldn't be a sponsor anymore? Or did Marjorie decide that someone who'd fallen off the wagon couldn't be her sponsor? Or did the woman abandon AA and keep drinking? 

I shouldn't care this much about a fictional character we haven't seen, but I think it would be an interesting issue to explore.

[Tosia]

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I'd like to hear more about what happened to Marjorie's former sponsor.

We know she fell off the wagon after something like 52 years (!) of sobriety, after some minor incident (I think it was her hedge being cut down.) Now we know that she stopped being Marjorie's sponsor, even though she'd been her sponsor for thirty-something years.

Did the woman decide that once she'd fallen off the wagon, she couldn't be a sponsor anymore? Or did Marjorie decide that someone who'd fallen off the wagon couldn't be her sponsor? Or did the woman abandon AA and keep drinking? 

I shouldn't care this much about a fictional character we haven't seen, but I think it would be an interesting issue to explore.

Me too!!!! I would love to see another older person portrayed on this site.   I loved the actress Marjorie, Mimi Kennedy, from back in the day, so I would enjoy more of her,  also. Her Maine (?) accent is really cute, too. 

I'm almost 64, so getting the flyover looks now. Although since  I put a pink streak in my light blonde hair, I get a slight hesitation, and/or frequent compliments from all ages and service staff.  I shudda done it years ago.  

[funky-rat]

14 hours ago, illdoc said:

I believe "making amends to people harmed by your drinking" is one of the 12 steps. I don't know which number (I think 7 or 9---my reference is an episode of Seinfeld).

It's step 8: Made a list of persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all

And step 9: Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others

And somewhat step 10: Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it

[Packerbrewerbadger]

Grace and Frankie had a great episode about being ignored as older women.  Jane Fonda went ballistic at the clerk like Majorie but when they got back in the car, Lily Tomlin had helped herself to the cigarettes they had been there to buy saying “ if they can’t see us, they can’t catch us”.?. As they drive off , one of them says “ maybe we should stop at the bank......”

[sugarbaker design]

On 4/20/2018 at 8:44 AM, Spunkygal said:

I kinda wish she had waited for Marjorie to get her order and walk away from the counter so she (C) could walk up, say hi, and ask if she wanted to go for coffee.

If Christie was a friend first and not a sponsee, I could see that happening, but it seems that part of Christie and Marjorie's particular sponsor/sponsee dynamic is that Christie's first reaction isn't to help Marjorie but to process her own feelings about the situation.  I wonder if Christie would've approached Jill or Wendy if they were having a moment at the deli counter.

20 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I do think Marjorie's friends fail to realize how much stress she's under having to take care of Victor 24/7 and that they don't really appreciate her,

Bingo!  A friend of mine is sober 30+ years, didn't make his home group for over 5 weeks due to work, sickness, vacation etc.  Not one person in his home group called or texted him because they thought, because of his considerable sober time, he didn't need any special attention.  I'm fairly certain Marjorie falls into that category.  

[illdoc]

6 hours ago, Blakeston said:

Did the woman decide that once she'd fallen off the wagon, she couldn't be a sponsor anymore? Or did Marjorie decide that someone who'd fallen off the wagon couldn't be her sponsor? Or did the woman abandon AA and keep drinking? 

Like Jill, since the sponsor fell off the wagon, she must start at the beginning as a newcomer. Since she is technically a newcomer, she can't be someone's sponsor (you probably have to be sober X amount of time before you can be a sponsor, just like you are supposed to be sober 6 months before getting in a relationship). As to whether the sponsor got back on the wagon or kept drinking, that is another question. (and I believe the sponsor had been sober for 36 years--I think Marjorie has only been sober for 20-something).

[Blakeston]

On 4/21/2018 at 2:14 PM, illdoc said:

Like Jill, since the sponsor fell off the wagon, she must start at the beginning as a newcomer. Since she is technically a newcomer, she can't be someone's sponsor (you probably have to be sober X amount of time before you can be a sponsor, just like you are supposed to be sober 6 months before getting in a relationship). As to whether the sponsor got back on the wagon or kept drinking, that is another question. (and I believe the sponsor had been sober for 36 years--I think Marjorie has only been sober for 20-something).

Marjorie has been sober for more than 30 years. In the first season, I think they said she had 32 years of sobriety.

The 36 year-figure was for how long Marjorie's sponsor had been her sponsor. The sponsor had been sober for a huge amount of time - at least 50 years.

That's interesting that you can no longer be a sponsor after you've lost your sobriety. I wish they had clarified that on the show.

[sugarbaker design]

16 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

 

That's interesting that you can no longer be a sponsor after you've lost your sobriety. I wish they had clarified that on the show.

AA has no rules on sponsorship or how many consecutive days of sobriety one needs to sponsor anyone.

I'm certain that when Marjorie's sponsor drank either she or Marjorie ended the relationship.  No one forced it upon them.

A sponsor is a friend who walks you through the 12 steps of AA.  If someone relapses they should focus on their own recovery and not someone else's.

[Judi Sunshine]

On 4/20/2018 at 11:18 AM, hnygrl said:

That's exactly how I wanted them to handle her situation. I hope she either gets to adopt a baby or she finally meets a man who appreciates the 'beautiful mess' she is. She's quickly becoming my favorite.

I adore Jill and Jaime Pressly's portrayal of her, and hope the same. Of all the characters on the show, I think she's gone through the most in front of us and even though she's fictional, I feel very protective of her! Also I feel a kinship because for one week, she and I both were on the same chip <3 My husband's been watching the show with me since I started going to meetings, and I'll be like "It's another Jill's sad in bed ep, those are always good." Because as hilarious as she is, JP can do some really heavy emotional lifting, acting-wise. But after all the hard times she's been through, I'd LOVE to see her emotional life flourish, whether with a man, a child, or both! Not because every woman wants or needs those things, but because she does. Still, I think she needs a few more chips before having a new person enter her life in a major way.

 

On 4/20/2018 at 8:43 AM, funky-rat said:

I tend to get wishy-washy like Christy does - asking for advice, then not taking it at times, but my bigger issue is that I shut down.  I'm an only child, and in the time I was raised, I was encouraged to try to find solutions myself (because the school of wisdom then was that I had no siblings to rely on, so I should learn early on to fend for myself), so it's weird to me to reach out to help from someone else, and I've been neglecting my step work and my weekly check-ins because I've been trying to find solutions to my problems (which have multiplied this year), plus I'm also kind-of sick of talking about it, and would just rather shut down (which I know is dangerous).  I've resolved that I'm resuming my step work this weekend, and will let her know via e-mail that I'll be checking in on my usual day and time this week because not working the program is not working for me.  We had someone in our group this week mention that she had started to slack off, and found that things were getting chaotic again, and that was a nudge.  The 2nd nudge came from the show this week, when the new sponsor asked Christy "How's that working out for you?" (at least I think it was the new sponsor).  That's something that my sponsor says to me so much that I made an embroidery sampler for her for Christmas with that on it.

I also think Christy will benefit from having a sponsor closer to her own age.

 

You're not alone, and whether you meant to or not, you did AA work just by sharing that, because you helped a fellow struggling alcoholic! I hope that you get back in the flow and while being firm with yourself, don't beat yourself up either. And I agree about Christy's having a sponsor closer to her own age, and also think it's good that she has one established strong boundaries and made it clear that her role was as Christy's sponsor, not friend. Marjorie showed that she can set boundaries, like that time when she tried to help Christy learn to turn off her phone. But their relationship is also very personal and we saw that Marjorie is very attached to her, sometimes selfishly, like when she pretended to be the murderous man in the raincoat. I think it will be healthy for both of them to continue with the evolution of their friendship as equals in the program, rather than have a sponsor/sponsee relationship. 

[Rockstar99435]

On 4/20/2018 at 10:18 AM, hnygrl said:

Her and Adam's little Fist-bump instead of a kiss was cute as hell (as was Adam talking to the puppy).

The "Now we try to figure out what they're fighting about...I figured it out. Did you?" part cracked me up. 

Bonnie is growing! I loved that she went to see Marjorie even though she didn't want to.

[Kid]

I love this show!!!   I was in overeaters anonymous, and a 12 step program for adult children of alcoholics. Since I was not an alcoholic, I could only go to open AA meetings which I loved because I think like an alcoholic. Since alcohol  was never my drug of choice (I don’t drink at all), I could not attend closed meetings.  But I attended every open meeting I could because I learned more from those meetings than I did in OA or in my adult children meetings.  And that is one of the reasons why I love this show!!! Is almost like attending a meeting.

And, I thought this episode was especially good. Recovering  alcoholics like Marjorie and Nora, who I just loved, are some of the healthiest people I’ve ever encountered.  They have their struggles but, for the most part, they deal with them in a healthy way.

I also like the fact that this episode addressed aging. Marjorie is absolutely correct. People simply do not even see you.   The other thing about the episode to which I very strongly related was Nora’s comments to Christie about the kind of man that she picks. Let me tell you, I suffered from the same disorder!

Anyway, I really look forward to the show and I’m glad Christie’s children are no longer on it because those storylines did not work. And I love Gus and Adam!

Edited April 28, 2018 by Kid

[ButterQueen]

On 4/21/2018 at 5:12 AM, MissLucas said:

Great episode - what I would really like to know though is if that cat hissing at Bonnie was a feline ad-lib?

That was hilarious!  Looked like Bonnie was startled by it.  ?

[kelslamu]

On 4/20/2018 at 10:43 AM, funky-rat said:

My sponsor lives over an hour away, so the chances of running in to her in a store are slim to none.  Depending on the meltdown, and how out-of-character I felt it was, I might hang around and ask if she was OK, but I might also go seek out advice from someone else, as Christy did.  I am not sure about AA, but in Al-Anon, gossip is a big no-no (I would assume it is in AA as well) but that's one of those fine lines where it's technically gossip, but if she's genuinely concerned, and not breaking her anonymity by talking about her to people outside the group, then I think she'd not be violating rules.

I tend to get wishy-washy like Christy does - asking for advice, then not taking it at times, but my bigger issue is that I shut down.  I'm an only child, and in the time I was raised, I was encouraged to try to find solutions myself (because the school of wisdom then was that I had no siblings to rely on, so I should learn early on to fend for myself), so it's weird to me to reach out to help from someone else, and I've been neglecting my step work and my weekly check-ins because I've been trying to find solutions to my problems (which have multiplied this year), plus I'm also kind-of sick of talking about it, and would just rather shut down (which I know is dangerous).  I've resolved that I'm resuming my step work this weekend, and will let her know via e-mail that I'll be checking in on my usual day and time this week because not working the program is not working for me.  We had someone in our group this week mention that she had started to slack off, and found that things were getting chaotic again, and that was a nudge.  The 2nd nudge came from the show this week, when the new sponsor asked Christy "How's that working out for you?" (at least I think it was the new sponsor).  That's something that my sponsor says to me so much that I made an embroidery sampler for her for Christmas with that on it.

I also think Christy will benefit from having a sponsor closer to her own age.

I'm not in al-anon or anything, but I can relate to not wanting to reach out to people.  I was the youngest by a few years and didn't have much of a sibling relationship.  I tend to try to solve my issues myself.  Or, if I do reach out about anything, I feel stupid or like a burden.  It's so much harder that way, though.  I've gotten better at reaching out, but still want to go into my shell about stuff.  I just want to say you should be proud that you are reaching out again.  That's what a sponsor is there for and maybe one day you will be the one someone reaches out to.  I hope this didn't sound corny or anything, it's just that your post spoke to me.

[funky-rat]

On ‎5‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 4:05 AM, kelslamu said:

I'm not in al-anon or anything, but I can relate to not wanting to reach out to people.  I was the youngest by a few years and didn't have much of a sibling relationship.  I tend to try to solve my issues myself.  Or, if I do reach out about anything, I feel stupid or like a burden.  It's so much harder that way, though.  I've gotten better at reaching out, but still want to go into my shell about stuff.  I just want to say you should be proud that you are reaching out again.  That's what a sponsor is there for and maybe one day you will be the one someone reaches out to.  I hope this didn't sound corny or anything, it's just that your post spoke to me.

Thanks.  We missed our check-in last week because she worked late.  That's also the day we got some bad news, and back in to my shell I went.  But I will be sure to reach out to her tomorrow, regardless.  I just need some stuff to go our way for once.  I'm really sick of being tested.....if someone is trying to teach me a lesson....lesson learned, and we can stop now.