S05.E10: Moments of Vision

[becauseIsaidso]

17 hours ago, Steph J said:

Ever since the Seer told her that she'd be killed by a son of Ragnar, I've always assumed that she'd go out after being accidentally killed by Bjorn (because irony). After this episode I'm thinking Bjorn might end up mercy killing her because she won't be in any shape to flee and he's not going to risk her falling into Ivar's clutches without her wits about her.

Or, as I have felt for some time, it'll be the son of Ragnar and princesscrazypants who seems to be forgotton, who will, in some unsuspecting and unforetold way, end up killing Largetha....BOO!

[becauseIsaidso]

17 hours ago, mcjen said:

That's an interesting idea.  The preview for the next half-season seemed to imply Ivar was going to make a sacrifice of her; I don't want to see that.  Actually, almost every time we saw Lagertha pause and stare off meaningfully in the midst of the battle, I expected to see her P.O.V. shot of a young farmer/warrior Ragnar, smiling and striding down a hillside toward her, untouched by all the mayhem around him.  That would have been the one "vision" - and the one cameo - that would have had some significance for me.  Just as a viewer. 

Can't stand Ivor so i'm hoping it's anyone but him who kills Lagertha...I read somewhere that remains were found that could, in an archeological sense, be Ivar, so I hope he went elsewhere, but this entire episode let me completely confused...why have Lagertha kill Astrid? She/Lagertha was never the petty sort, why start now? I did like the short, very short shot of Lagertha's childhood, wished it had shown us more...

[becauseIsaidso]

I haven't liked Floki for a long time, but this season, I do, and his offering of himself as the sacrifice was not in any way a grand gesture, but more of an acknowledgement and continuation of the systems and rituals he grew up with ...I remember the first depictions of the revels at Upsala...and how Athelston was to have been a sacrifice....remembering all that help me make sense of Athelston's murder by Floki as being  somehow actually not murder but rather an action that was expected within the sense and expectations of a particle community  in a particular set of circumstances...somehow, I now like Floki and want to see how this turns out. I was, however, rather upset to see the Seer in such a weak posture.l  That just isn't how I have come to see him.

[Haleth]

I didn't care for the nonlinear story telling and I thought the moments when every character was having a sort of out of body experience was kind of hokey.  

RIP Halfdan.  I really liked him with Bjorn was sorry to see him killed.  I like Harald too and wish Bjorn or Ubbe had half of his charisma so I could care about them.

I'm still amazed at the chaos of these battles.  With hundreds or thousands of people slashing and chopping and everyone covered with blood, how the heck did they know who was friend and who was foe?

And where the hell did Ivar the Not So Boneless Anymore get all those fighters?  Did he recruit all of Skandinavia?  Why would they fight for him?  What's in it for them?

This battle after battle is reminding me of this season of TWD.  All fighting, all the time just for the gee whiz isn't it cool fanboy reaction.  I quit watching TWD and am this [] close to quitting Vikings too unless we see something other than the neverending battle that I care nothing about.

On 1/24/2018 at 10:30 PM, nodorothyparker said:

Someone might want to clue Hirst in that lots and lots of artsy confusing nonlinear storytelling in place of anything resembling a coherent narrative is where The Walking Dead really went off the rails.

Ha!  So I'm not the only one who makes the comparison!

[PityFree]

23 hours ago, benteen said:

I honestly didn't realize that was Lagertha at the end.

 Me either.  She looked so small and frail in that ending shot I almost thought that it was a child — like one of Bjorn’s kids.

 I’m extremely tired of Ivar. I sincerely do not understand why someone that’s just kill him. The fact that he apparently has the ability to walk around now is annoying. Did he tell Hvitserk that he *could* have kids?? Did they make him a metal frame for his penis, too?

Edited January 26, 2018 by PityFree

[MaggieG]

Well Margrete sure is crazy pants. I was hoping Torvi would kill her.

I really hope that when Lagertha does go, she meets Ragnar in Valhalla, only because I want to see Travis Fimmel come back for a cameo.

[Steph J]

18 hours ago, becauseIsaidso said:

Or, as I have felt for some time, it'll be the son of Ragnar and princesscrazypants who seems to be forgotton, who will, in some unsuspecting and unforetold way, end up killing Largetha....BOO!

Magnus isn't actually Ragnar's son, though. When Ragnar came back to England and Ecbert introduced him to Magnus, Ragnar told them that he'd never had sex with Kwenthrith and that she'd only peed on him (and Magnus was promptly sent out into the wild because Ecbert no longer had any reason to keep him as a ward).

[magdalene]

Early on when Ivar was first introduced as an adult I thought the actor and the character were an exciting presence.  The feeling didn't last for me.  The actor has turned out to be a one trick pony. All he does is either look crazy or evil - or a combination of both.  And his invincibility in battle is ridiculous.

For me the best moments in the episode all involved Halfdan and his death.

Most of the other scenes that the writing wanted to sell me as profound - like Heahmund's and Lagertha's epic love and Princess reindeer balls dying fell flat for me because none of that was earned at all.   Bjorn knew reindeer balls for all of two seconds. I didn't give a damn about her and I have yet to care about Heahmund.

[UNOSEZ]

I thought the episode was about the futility and waste of revenge.. How it only perpetuates more killing and how many lives can be destroyed by it in a large way like the heathen army civil war ir in a smaller way with floki.. Princess RDB dying shows how quick something promising can be snuffed out and in such an ignoble way.. I mean did we even really see who killed her some nobody who probably got killed soon after.. Like halfdan alluded to there is more than pointless glory

[Babalooie]

I erroneously posted this in the wrong thread yesterday.   Just one more good article to share...interesting comments (to me) from Michael Hirst regarding Floki and Rollo.  What from Season 1 is he referring to regarding Rollo?

http://www.tvguide.com/news/vikings-season-5-finale-lagertha-floki/

[green]

3 hours ago, UNOSEZ said:

I thought the episode was about the futility and waste of revenge.. How it only perpetuates more killing and how many lives can be destroyed by it in a large way like the heathen army civil war ir in a smaller way with floki.. Princess RDB dying shows how quick something promising can be snuffed out and in such an ignoble way.. I mean did we even really see who killed her some nobody who probably got killed soon after.. Like halfdan alluded to there is more than pointless glory

Yep you are totally right.  That was the main theme.  And it should always be the main theme not for just Vikings but all mankind forever and ever.  Alas we humans fail to grasp it and make the same mistake generation after generation in country after country down through century after century.  We as a species should be put in the special needs class I think because wow are we slow learners.

Edited January 26, 2018 by green

[thuganomics85]

That was an... interesting approach to filming this episode.  But once I figured out what was going on, I was able to follow it.  At least not as many major deaths as I feared, but still a few losses.

Sure enough, Halfdan dies as the hands (er, weapon) of none other then Harald himself.  There was no way in hell it wasn't going end like this.  I'm still surprised that this show has gotten me to the point that I actually felt sad about it.  Both of the actors really sold it as well.  Fare well, Halfdan.  You were a bit of a ball of crazy, but you had your great moments as well!

We also lose Sami/Bjorn's new squeeze, Jarl Borg's son (Guthurm?), and, yep, Astrid by Lagertha's own sword.  Which seems to have broken Lagertha now.  This isn't good!

Other then that, the battle basically seem to be a bloody standstill with both sides doing damage, only for Ivar to then send in the French Army, causing Team Lagertha to understandably scramble.  All while Ivar stand from afar and smirks.  Hard to see you as a badass when your avoiding the action like that, buddy.  But love him or hate him, that is Ivar.  He might not dive into the fray himself, but he knows how to plot from afar to great results.

I love that The Seer was basically "I may be blind, I can clearly see that you are crazy!!" to Margrethe.  She is getting creepier by the minute.  I was really worried she was going to stab Torvi in the back.

Meanwhile on Floki's Fantasy Island, nothing changes, as he begs Viking Dyson to not take revenge for the loss of his son, but he ignores him and kills Viking Edge's son anyway.  So, now Floki is going to sacrifice.... himself?  What is he up too?

Rollo!  They actually got Clive Standen back for a bit!

[UNOSEZ]

9 minutes ago, thuganomics85 said:

Meanwhile on Floki's Fantasy Island, nothing changes, as he begs Viking Dyson to not take revenge for the loss of his son, but he ignores him and kills Viking Edge's son anyway.  So, now Floki is going to sacrifice.... himself?  What is he up too?

Well somebody call up Vikings Christian and gangrel.. And to be safe is Rachel skaarsten.. Doing anything.  She's been a Valkyrie before

[magdalene]

5 hours ago, Babalooie said:

I erroneously posted this in the wrong thread yesterday.   Just one more good article to share...interesting comments (to me) from Michael Hirst regarding Floki and Rollo.  What from Season 1 is he referring to regarding Rollo?

http://www.tvguide.com/news/vikings-season-5-finale-lagertha-floki/

I shudder to think what Hirst has in mind for Rollo. I don't know what Hirst is talking about there.

I'll admit I am curious and interested in the things he said about Ubbe.  He isn't flashy but I like him because he isn't a sociopath and has a sense of .....basic decency.

[whoknowswho]

On 1/24/2018 at 11:08 PM, Solace247 said:

Just realized that was the mid-season finale. Random ending shots. I am so over Floki. The colony storyline sucks the momentum out of every episode. I think I just realized that I don't care about anyone on this show. I mean, Ragnar always annoyed me, but I realize it was, and probably continues to be, my sensibilities at odds with the culture. Now though, everyone ranks up there with him.

I came to this conclusion last year when Ragnar died, he annoyed me but he was such a neat character. No one else has his screen capturing ability. I don't like anyone left, except crazy ole' Floki and looks like he'll be hanging upside down soon.  I decided a couple episodes before, I was just going to hope for the Saxons, and then they killed off the barely tolerable Aethelwulf. 

Did Hvitserk survive? I sort of lost track during all the artsy fartsiness...I was really hoping he'd bite it, but somehow missed what happened with him. Bye- Annoying Astrid, and HalfDan. Don't let the door hit you on the way to Valhalla.

[tessathereaper]

On 1/25/2018 at 11:09 AM, Lady A said:

Rollo pulling up like a boss lol.    I’m not even mad at Rollo either.  He spent his whole life living in Ragnar’s shadow as a second banana/side kick.

 The French were like “Hey we’ll make ya a noble lord and offer you a smoking hot wife and you’ll be wealthy and important.  We just need you to protect us from your brother.”  Rollo: “ say no more new fam, I got you” and he wasn’t even vicious about it.  He didn’t try to kill or capture Ragnar, he just wanted to repel him from France like “sorry Bro it’s my turn to shine and have you seen my new wife and these ballin threads, that’s gold bruh that’s gold.”

Lagertha is broken and a shadow of her former self.  Can He-man help pick up the pieces and help her heal?

Was starting to like Harald but then he killed his brother *womp womp wommm*. No more comedic buddy adventures with Bjorn ?.  My favorite episode is still when they were cruising the med.  Halfdan smashed and Bjorn was ok with that lol ?.

Floki done went from cult leader to first sacrifice of the new world...maybe?  Who knew starting a new world could be so hard, guess Vikings gonna Viking.

LOL I love that take on Rollo.  I have to say I never really blamed him.  He maybe could have gone about some things in a better way to say the least but Ragnar wasn't an innocent in that relationship.   Ragnar was nearly always shown treating him in a way where he not only made sure Rollo never forgot he was "second banana" but he tended to make it clear he wasn't really going to let Rollo seriously contribute beyond brute force(I remember a couple times in Season 1, Rollo asked about Ragnar's plans and Ragnar's response was basically "yeah whatever, just watch" with a smug smirk on his face), if Rollo doesn't know what the plan is, well then he has no chance to contribute, he is basically just expected to blindly follow.  Which in turn gives him little chance gain any true glory of his own.  Ragnar was a bit of a spotlight hog. :D

The proof is in the pudding - clearly Rollo was capable of much more than that(I mean the guy successfully defended Paris against Ragnar, he learned to live in a completely foreign culture, learned to read and write in a totally new language and writing system-- I don't even know if he knew the Norse runish writing that well but they never really showed any of them reading or writing anything--did they even show any of them carving runes, I can't remember--in any case, clearly Rollo is no dummy) so it's no wonder he felt stifled in that kind of situation, esp when even his parents showed heavy favoritism towards Ragnar(at least according to what he told the Seer).

[Son of the Norse]

Son of the Norse's Recap:

 

While you sit back and relax and enjoy the thoughts of this guy; I invite the guys to pop open a top of their favorite brewsky; and the ladies to "get a little comfortable", and relax with a short glass of their favorite Hennessy.  To everyone; please click on the video below and listen to SotN's death song (Helvegen), as you read my thoughtful thoughts of the last episode of this seasons first half show:

 

 

 

The tale of separate visions and blah blah blah.... AKA; The report to Odin as told by Huginn & Muninn:.......The visions of many, as told by the birds of a few.... 

 

 

Huginn and Muninn lay witness - 

 

First we see Huginn as he watches the slow drift of fog fall over the soon to be valley of battle and death.  Even he gives note to the "song of the brothers" at the beginning of this saga.  The song is carried by the mist, similar to sounds heard over vast still waters...and it is quite breath taking.  Both HtB and FH sing out to each other.  Their song is beautiful, sweet, and sad at the same time.  Most of the major characters stand in awe of the beautiful song, While Huginn just sits and bares witness to it all, as he plans his report to the Al-Father (Odin) later that day.  For those of you that do not speak "Old Norse", I have translated what they sang below:

HtB: Is our love so fragile, and the heart so hallow, shatter with the words, impossible to follow.  You're saying I'm fragile, I try not to be, I search only for something I can't see.

FH:  I have my own life, and I am stronger than you know; but I carry this feeling, When you walked into my house, that you won't be walking out the door. 

HtB & FH together: Brothers forever, face to face, my city your mountains, stay with me stay. I need you to kill me, I need it today.  Give to me your hatred, take from me, my mace....

 

It made me drop a tear if I must admit...

 

Visions of...Bishop Bad Actor - 

Thank goodness, that no visions were originated from this dude!  He reminds me of my forum BFF when he gets all melodramatic!

 

Visions of...Lagertha -

Face paint like a ninja (or Arnold in the first Conan movie).  Pull's sword slowly and you hear her first son yell; "Loose"!  Vision of the small Mjolnir that her pappy gave her.  Laggy says to BBA that; "you will be in heaven...I think I may die this day".  As you watch this sequence, all you of knowledgeable viewers have realized by now that she is not talking to him, but instead, to the 2nd love of her life..SH (Astrid).  After she kisses BBA (aka Astrid in her mind), she states; "Now I can die". Later, she see's Astrid on the battlefield and cries out; "I know you love me"!  Astrid replies; "I cannot have this child".  Our minds flash back at that moment to the puggy virgin, whale blubber boy that lost his virginity that day in the rape shack, but also impregnated the "queen" of Whaleville.  Laggy runs her sword straight through the 1st trimester baby (2nd trimester?), and winds up killing her 2nd true love in the process.  She kisses her lover goodbye; "Sweet Astrid".  Laggy dies right then; you may not realize it, but she just died in this show (RIP Laggy).  Her body is now devoid of life, and it rises with a look of; "I don't give a F*&^", and charges back in the battle!

 

Visions of...BoyBand aka BB (Hvitserk) - 

BB kicking ass on the battlefield like he never has.  The rage of his father is released through the strokes of his sword.  Will he finally be interesting at last? ... prob not...

His vision takes him on a flash back to the ship and him and Ivar talking about his change of sides.  BB stupidly brings up not having kids and relates that to Ivar as well, and quickly finds a blade to his throat.  He cries out for Ivar to stop, and he does. Back on the battle field, BB gets his butt kicked by a blow!  He lays there and we wonder if he is off to visit snake eyes.  He realizes he is still alive and jumps up and kicks ass and deals death like only a son of Ragnar ever could!  Ubbe confronts him and when he goes for the death stroke, BB just glares at him and smirks...you know then that he is already dead inside.  BB's demise is anti-climatic...who shall mourn him?

 

Interlude of Torvi - 

Kicking ass and takin' names is her game...reuniting with her kiddies is her game.  "Where are my children"?!!!!  Draws sword and advances on Crazy "M".  Crazy M steps aside...kids are okay...now that's a shock!

 

Bjorn has a vision? - 

Battle, holding Sami Reindeer nut luver, kisses and hugs.... Later, battle and flashbacks.  Finds dead step son, aka ugly step son, rocky D. of vikings, Borg's son (beauty is futile)!  We see him weak and stunned to the core for the first time and he watches Ivar become invulnerable as not even one arrow touches him.  He hears; "Charge"!  Calls a retreat as the Francs to come in to mop up the sloppy seconds. Later, finds his 'true love' (of like 2 shows) dead, along with her ninja pappy.  Good Riddance! Later still..."We must leave K! Sees his mom, who is already dead....grey (white) hair and all...

 

Sami Chick no Vision -

Rock on string, swing swing swing.

Dad is dead, blood is red red red

Chop to the neck, she is a wreck wreck wreck

good bye bye bye

 

Halfdan the Black (HtB), visions of sand - 

One of the better current actors on the show, holds his last scoop of sand. "You took me on a great adventure"!  Did he experience something we didn't get to see on PG 13 TV??  He kicks ass like a true Viking on the battle field.  His crayysee eyes forever etched into our memories.  Sand through his fingers (and so are the days of our life), from empty battle field, to 10 miles outside of Mecca he is alone.  I weep for him and he disregards his chance to kill FH as he walks up behind him.  Instead he faces his deliverer from the waste of the dunes of life.  His throat opens at the merciful quick strike of the only man that loved him.."this is life...this is death" are his parting sorrows.  FH respects him as he kisses his battle ax... "I will see you in Valhalla"!  As he dies, his bro truly mourns...

 

The crazy, mad, psychopath journey of "M" - 

She sees a vision of the ugly step son (Borg's son) dead in the wa wa. Turns out it is just some drift wood...but not to her.  She confronts the strong lil' children of Bj and Torvi and tells them another dreadful babysitter tale.  She later visits the seer, who is near his end. "Ubbe will not be king of "K", but he also said that she will not be Queen (I think he meant ever).  She finally leaves the seer instead of digging him up still from "the wet earth".  He may be already dead.  After talking to her he will be.

 

Fair Hair and Skank Hair, one last conversation - 

"Cut my hair...would not cut my hair until I found my true queen", (believe that is supposed to be, not comb or wash my hair until king of all Norway).

SH thinks she might die...knows she will. We see a flash to Laggy as she knocks out MutherF&&er's with a severed head. Meanwhile it flashes to ugly son as he gets killed by BB. Torvi goes mad as she see's her dead son. Laggy continues to have flash backs of her dad and the lil' Mjolnir gift........"Tor will take care of you always"!

 

Ivar the polio-less?

Walking and talking?  Did this cat have Polio instead and just pulled off a F. Gump move?  Regardless, he is still the current most polarizing character on the show. People love him, hate him.....doesn't matter.  They still "something" him.  That is what makes a powerful character!

"How could you ever love me"!?  He says this to BB (but in my heart he says this to many of the CVFs here on this forum at the same time).

Back to Ivar, much later we see him as the Viking age Patton.  "a true leader does not have to lead, but motivates the men to follow".....look it up!!!!!!!!

Fearless in the storm of arrows

"Don't be a coward, come fight me"!  I think many will be terrified when they see the wrath that he can unleash. 

 

Meanwhile Muninn sees - 

Iceland, funeral grieving. A trouble maker spits on the most beautiful hand in Iceland.  Promises for the promotion to 'lawgiver' (which is very similar to the title held by the lawgiver on this forum aka my BFF).  Edge Jr, dead in da hottub!  Flok's see's the future of war and strife...time to kiss the knife for the God's...fade to black...

 

Overall - 

Head nailed to the tree with arrow, cool.  Hanging girl dancing in the tree, cool too.  Here comes Rollo...is he full of chocolate and caramel? LOL

I really like the non-linear flow of the last show.  I sat on my $800,000 honey badger, leather love seat in nothing but the beautiful skin and bod that the Gods gave me as I watched this show.  Silent as a church mouse, my BFF Greeny watched me as I watched the show via our SKYPE connection.  We did not talk, nor did I gaze upon him as we watched the final episode of the first half of the season together......but his heat and passion for me radiated through our internet connection...and I knew the world as we know it would be okay for another few brief moments in time, until the 2nd half of the season premiered....

 

Farewell for now my fans and devote devotees... I am available to answer all your fan mail in my private message box if you wish.  If this post gets enough likes, I will post my journey that I start next week, as I Kayak across the most dangerous stretch of ocean that the world has to offer, as I make my way to Iceland to watch the satellite feed of the super bowl with my good friends there.... as we eat Lutefisk and drink mead in the shadow of the God's temple.

 

BTW; Greeny, I got your PM; and no, you cannot come with! LOL

Edited January 27, 2018 by Son of the Norse

[tessathereaper]

2 hours ago, magdalene said:

I shudder to think what Hirst has in mind for Rollo. I don't know what Hirst is talking about there.

I'll admit I am curious and interested in the things he said about Ubbe.  He isn't flashy but I like him because he isn't a sociopath and has a sense of .....basic decency.

I like Ubbe for that reason as well.  Honestly he kind of seems like the sort of ruler you'd want to have, given the choices between the others - he doesn't seem overly ambitious, seems like he'd be concerned on at least a basic level for the well being of his people.  He may not be flashy but you know, you'd probably live a fairly decent life under him. :D

Yeah I have to admit, I'm not hopeful for Hirst's plans because Hirst doesn't seem to be good at complexity, at all.  Now I think there are some very interesting possibilitues both personally AND politically for what Rollo is doing but it seems Hirst is going for the absolute lowest common denominator unless he just didn't bother mentioning the rest of the storyline.   Personally I think this is a good way to get Rollo to bring a lot of Norse settlers to northwestern Frankia, to really make it Normandy and to build his own power base of people who have no particular reason to be loyal to any of the Frankish nobles or Emperor(if Gisla's father is dead, in history Rollo was apparently loyal to his original emperor and when he was deposed, he attacked Paris again, it ended up being a draw but Rollo retained his position and lands, and may even have increased them a bit) in this way Rollo can either attack Paris again, even if it is a draw OR what I think would be easier for Hirst to pull off - this is a way to try and insure Rollo's children retain the land and title.  The Frankish nobles didn't like the Norsemen having that prime real estate, they wanted it back and following Rollo's death, there was quite a bit of fighting over it, but his children and grandchildren managed to keep a hold of it, no doubt helped by having families who had originally come from Norse lands as they had and were loyal to them, even if they'd assimilated into Frankish culture, they were still Normans and not quite just French. :)  Well right now, that we know of, there are no Norsemen in Normandy, only Rollo.  This is a way to bring people who would be loyal to him, give them good fertile land(essentially to fulfil Ragnar's promises that never have turned out, which is a bit of irony I'd love, Rollo the former Berserker is the one who brings to his people the opportunity to farm good land and a relatively stable life)

But I don't know if Hirst is that smart quite honestly.  I think he's going to go for soap opera central with this whole thing he's talking about between Rollo, Lagertha and Bjorn.

Now what that is is from Season 1 there have been these very subtle suggestions that there is more to Rollo and Lagertha's past than meets the eye.  We've always known from Season 1 that Rollo had a thing for Lagertha.  

Spoiler

Obviously it's not quite canon but a couple year ago I read the preview Comic book that was released at Comic Con prior to the series starting to air in 2013(or whenever Season 1 first aired) - now plenty has changed, for example Rollo is no longer the older brother, but the younger one(this is per interviews from Season 3 and 4 where both Hirst and Clive Standen refer to Rollo as the younger brother so clearly they changed that background after Season 1, although who knows maybe they'll change it back again LOL).  However one thing I think they've kept at least on a very basic level is that Rollo fell in love with Lagertha first, from a bit of a distance, in the comic book he was quite uncertain about what to do, talked to his brother Ragnar about it, because hey that's what you do, you want advise so you ask someone you love and trust right?  And so Ragnar snuck out in the middle of the night to impress Lagertha first by getting through her "guardians". 

Which you know yes of course it's Lagertha's choice but hey, that's just not cool bro, not cool at all to purposely go after the girl your brother has just told he really likes.  Obviously this did not help when it came to Rollo's resentment of Ragnar.  

 

Now in Season 3, at Ecbert's party, the one where Kwentrith poisons her brother, Rollo and Lagertha have a little chat and Lagertha says something to Rollo about how well he's always treated Bjorn, like he was his own son.  Now that makes Rollo go, "Wait what? What do you mean by that?" And Lagertha's like "ohh nothing..."  This clearly puts a thought in Rollo's head.  Now the thing is, Rollo couldn't possibly have that thought unless at some point within a reasonable time before Bjorn's birth, but not so obvious that Rollo would have seriously questioned it initially, Rollo and Lagertha had sex.

So I assume this is the unfinished business Hirst is talking about.  I want to hope Hirst can actually manage to do both, have his little soap opera paternity storyline AND the more interesting political one which involves allowing Rollo to actually show some forethought and planning for his own Dukedom.  But I don't have a lot of faith in that. :)

[green]

"Rollo is no longer the older brother, but the younger one(this is per interviews from Season 3 and 4 where both Hirst and Clive Standen refer to Rollo as the younger brother so clearly they changed that background after Season 1"

This is from the hidden contents above but has nothing to do about some past spoiler so no need to hide it.  Just wanted to say that Rollo was always the younger brother from the very beginning of season 1, episode 1 onward.  It was clear from the beginning Ragnar was older and in charge.  Rollo was never even remotely hinted at being the older brother ever because he wasn't.

And since Viking history went from mythic to historic with the coming of Ragnar (argued by non-Scandinavian historians to be half-mythic but perhaps partially historic as well) on the scene how could Ragnar NOT be the first born.

[tessathereaper]

@green, OK I wasn't sure if it would be considered spoilery because it wasn't about the TV show specifically.  Thanks.  

Actually I do believe that  they were originally going to go with that idea in Season One as they had in the prelude comic book.  There is even a line in Season 1 where Rollo calls Ragnar "little brother",  plus there was at least one interview in Season 1 where it was referenced that Rollo is the older brother(and season two as well, while trying to find the season 1 interview I came upon one from Season two where Clive Standen mentions Rollo was the older brother which was supposedly one of the reasons he was so angry about Ragnar getting all the glory).   But again by Season 3 this changed and they started referring to Rollo as the younger brother, including the History Channel book released related about the show which was called something like The World of Vikings)

But their birth order was never stressed within the show itself so the change isn't that big of a deal but IMO they took a little while to settle on which they wanted it to go.  Which I agree makes more sense for him to be the younger brother anyway.

Edited January 27, 2018 by tessathereaper

[ctlady]

11 hours ago, tessathereaper said:

The French were like “Hey we’ll make ya a noble lord and offer you a smoking hot wife and you’ll be wealthy and important.  We just need you to protect us from your brother.”  Rollo: “ say no more new fam, I got you” and he wasn’t even vicious about it.  He didn’t try to kill or capture Ragnar, he just wanted to repel him from France like “sorry Bro it’s my turn to shine and have you seen my new wife and these ballin threads, that’s gold bruh that’s gold.”

That just totally made my day!

[Haleth]

9 hours ago, tessathereaper said:

eah I have to admit, I'm not hopeful for Hirst's plans because Hirst doesn't seem to be good at complexity, at all.  Now I think there are some very interesting possibilitues both personally AND politically for what Rollo is doing but it seems Hirst is going for the absolute lowest common denominator unless he just didn't bother mentioning the rest of the storyline.   Personally I think this is a good way to get Rollo to bring a lot of Norse settlers to northwestern Frankia, to really make it Normandy and to build his own power base of people who have no particular reason to be loyal to any of the Frankish nobles or Emperor(if Gisla's father is dead, in history Rollo was apparently loyal to his original emperor and when he was deposed, he attacked Paris again, it ended up being a draw but Rollo retained his position and lands, and may even have increased them a bit) in this way Rollo can either attack Paris again, even if it is a draw OR what I think would be easier for Hirst to pull off - this is a way to try and insure Rollo's children retain the land and title.  The Frankish nobles didn't like the Norsemen having that prime real estate, they wanted it back and following Rollo's death, there was quite a bit of fighting over it, but his children and grandchildren managed to keep a hold of it, no doubt helped by having families who had originally come from Norse lands as they had and were loyal to them, even if they'd assimilated into Frankish culture, they were still Normans and not quite just French. :)  Well right now, that we know of, there are no Norsemen in Normandy, only Rollo.  This is a way to bring people who would be loyal to him, give them good fertile land(essentially to fulfil Ragnar's promises that never have turned out, which is a bit of irony I'd love, Rollo the former Berserker is the one who brings to his people the opportunity to farm good land and a relatively stable life)

I'd love for this to be Rollo's plan.  Maybe he's coming to invite Lagertha and Bjorn to resettle on his lands.  Let Ivar have rocky, freezing cold, mountainous Kattagat.

[tennisgurl]

RIP Halfdan, was sad to see him go. I will miss any future buddy comedy travel adventures he would have with Bjorn. And Astrid died, which...sucks I guess. I never really cared for her either way, but it sucks that she had such a crappy final few weeks. 

Torvi is totally going to kill crazy ass Margarete soon, mark my words. I mean, Torvi could kick her ass and ram a sword down her throat without breaking a sweat, I wouldn't be so cocky Margarete. Nor would Ubbe approve of killing his nephews.

Rollo sure does look regal these days, doesn't he? 

[Ohwell]

I forgot to add that the thing I didn't understand about the Lagertha/Astrid faceoff is that they seemed to be all alone.  Where were all the other fighters?  Granted, at times I wasn't paying full attention but did I miss something?  Did Lagertha really kill her or was she dreaming?

[nodorothyparker]

Lagertha killed Astrid.  It was framed as yet another artsy POV to make it seem like everything that happened between them on the battlefield was happening in isolation.

[Ohwell]

Ok thanks.  I couldn't tell what was real and what wasn't.  Artsy POV, indeed.

[Captanne]

Saw it Friday and meant to write immediately.  Life got in the way.  Just wanted to say I loved it.  Thought it was terrific.  (People who were clamoring for Lagertha to look aged finally got their wish.  Not sure that's what they meant, though.)

[nitrofishblue]

I thought Torvi was killed

[PatsyandEddie]

Not yet. She made it back and had a confrontation with Margarete about where her two youngest children with Bjørn were. It made it look as if M. had killed them in her attempt to have Ubbe be made king when Lagertha dies instead of Bjørn. 

[green]

5 hours ago, nitrofishblue said:

I thought Torvi was killed

 

5 hours ago, PatsyandEddie said:

Not yet. She made it back and had a confrontation with Margarete about where her two youngest children with Bjørn were. It made it look as if M. had killed them in her attempt to have Ubbe be made king when Lagertha dies instead of Bjørn. 

Yes.  Also, nitrofishblue, you may have thought she got killed because we were shown her witnessing her son's Guthrum's death by that stupid twerp, Hvitserk.  She tried to run there in time but was too late.  So there was a lot of cross cutting between the three of them and even Lagertha who saw it from further away during Guthrum's death scene.

And yes to what PatsyandEddie said.  Most viewers most likely wanted Torvi to run M-Something through at the end too.  Alas she was a true mother rushing to her children first when she found them alive allowing M-Something to live in the process.

[Juliegirlj]

So Ivar can walk now?! 

The Priest has Stockholm Syndrome and now devotes his life to fighting for Lagertha . 

So much potential for this show, but what an epic fail. 

[Babalooie]

5 hours ago, Juliegirlj said:

So Ivar can walk now?! 

This was one of the visions that they were all having, seeing themselves in a different place and time.

[SingleMaltBlonde]

I imagine the Rollo call back is that he's always had a thing for Lagertha.  

[green]

13 hours ago, Juliegirlj said:

So Ivar can walk now?! 

The Priest has Stockholm Syndrome and now devotes his life to fighting for Lagertha . 

So much potential for this show, but what an epic fail. 

More like hots that don't stop for the ladies coupled with Lagertha'a warrior ways.  Those two things top Ivar's warrior ways only, heh.  Athelstan had more of this syndrome stuff than Bishop BadActor I'd say.  The latter has just found a culture that suits his uncontrollable lust and bloody battle anger better.

I took Ivar standing briefly in that scene in front of his troops more as a temporary adrenaline rush thing in the middle of the battle.  Or Babalooie may be right and it was part of his vision though I didn't see that myself but I haven't re-watched it so I don't know for sure.  Anyway, either way I assume he will back to "normal" by next episode meaning outside of using his iron legging he will be crawling around and hissing like a snake again.

[Captanne]

I think the most telling conversation Warrior Queen (lest we forget her status) Lagertha had with Bishop BadActor was the one about sex and sin.  We have known since the teaser of his presence that BBA is a sexual man.  (Remember that short image we got of him in bed at the end of the season as an "introduction to the character"?  So, the show has been honest about his proclivities from the very start.)  What Lagertha offers to him -- with her pagan ways -- is sinless sex.  She also offers the authority and courage of a warrior queen -- whether she comports herself that way or not (or whether the actress gets the gravity of that role off the screen and into our minds) is another thing entirely.  The fact is that she is a warrior queen who has pagan beliefs which remove the sin from sex.  What more could BBA want?

[TodayBot]

On 1/26/2018 at 9:59 AM, Steph J said:

Magnus isn't actually Ragnar's son, though. When Ragnar came back to England and Ecbert introduced him to Magnus, Ragnar told them that he'd never had sex with Kwenthrith and that she'd only peed on him (and Magnus was promptly sent out into the wild because Ecbert no longer had any reason to keep him as a ward).

I was under the impression that it wasn't actually true, that Ragnar new he'd come to his death and didn't want the boy being used as some sort of pawn after he was gone.  Ragnar made several faces that suggested he was telling a lie.

[green]

On 2/16/2018 at 5:24 PM, TodayBot said:

I was under the impression that it wasn't actually true, that Ragnar new he'd come to his death and didn't want the boy being used as some sort of pawn after he was gone.  Ragnar made several faces that suggested he was telling a lie.

I don't know about that because I for one never saw Princess Crazy pants do anything but pee on his wound so I don't think he was lying at all.  Ragnar was in bad physical shape and not in the romantic mood at that point anyway.  To me Kwenthrith made the whole thing up because, you know, she was pretty crazy.  And because Hirst wouldn't pass up a chance to have yet another sex scene thrown into his show if it actually happened.

And because maybe in her craziness she thought she got some sort of leverage from all that or, more likely, make her look "cool" all 800's style in her mind.  The only main members of the cast we every saw her bed were the Wessex kings -- both Ecbert and even Aethelwulf when he went on that mission Ecbert sent him on to her tent-like HQ that time.  So maybe one of them was the real father.  It was Aethelwulf who saved the kid by taking him out to the forest and saving his life after Ecbert was going to have him killed so my money is on it being Aethelwulf's son or at least Aethelwulf may have thought so.

But Magnus is long ago forgotten now.  Another Hirst-written dead end like Guthrum turned out to be.  And Sigurd.  But at least those two got to be killed on screen.  Magnus is a long lost might have been storyline that Hirst let die on the vine.  Though I guess he could always have him brought back for drama later on with Magnus believing all along he was Ragnar's long lost son.  And there are no living "suspects" (Ragnar, Ecbert or Aethelwulf) to counter his claim.

Edited February 19, 2018 by green

[Captanne]

The forgotten ones are all partying with Ragnar in Valhalla (and Aethelstan is next door in Heaven asking them politely to keep the noise down.)

[pinkglove]

I liked the way the episode was filmed but this plot is so extremely dumb. It makes zero sense that so many people, including Rollo, sided with the creep and sticked around, specifically that Harald was so ready to kill his brother over it. Someone could have just approached and killed him. 

I don't think Season 5 was a good idea. 

[One Tough Cookie]

On 1/24/2018 at 10:15 PM, ihartcoffee said:

I think that's it.  Lagertha looks broken,  she may go out Ragnar style,  all defeated.  

If only...