S01.E08: My Name Is Ruby

[Drogo]

Quote

In the Season 1 finale, expansion fever hits Frankie and Bobby, but Vincent balks at getting in deeper with Rudy. Meanwhile, Candy gets a taste of directing, and enjoys the red-carpet perks of a major premiere; Alston finds himself in limbo at his precinct; Abby changes the Hi-Hat's clientele; Sandra faces editorial and legal hurdles; Barbara and Ruby connect with the wrong kind of clients; and C.C. encourages a former pimp to get back in the game.

 

[Primetimer]

You'll never look a Danish without smirking again.

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[laprin]

Bye, Ruby. You will be missed.  This episode brought it home. Now that drugs have been introduced to the pimp game, I’m looking forward to where David and George takes that storyline. Whatever happens, I hope it ends badly for CC.  Can’t stand him.  I hope to see less of Abby next season and more of Darlene as she embraces being a pornstar. I love the chemistry between Eileen and Harvey. 

Edited October 30, 2017 by laprin

[Rinaldo]

36 minutes ago, laprin said:

I love the chemistry between Eileen and Harvey.

Me too! Their evolving relationship has been one of the most delightful bit-by-bit developments in this season. (The excellent writing aided, of course, by two terrific actors.) Her analysis of the appeal of various porn kinks was also beautifully delivered (in character).

And we got at least some insight into Eileen's situation: a father who expels the daughter who got pregnant, and by his determination to de-gay his son through electroshock therapy and God knows what else has rendered him a pitiful shell. That still doesn't quite answer how Eileen decided that prostitution was her best route, but it's a start.

I'm worried for Alston's future in the precinct now.

I still love the "three pimps hanging out in the diner" scenes. That could be a series right there, starting with movie reviews.

The attention to historical detail remains gratifying. I saw Buck and the Preacher playing on one of the 42nd St. marquees (being a Western with black stars -- Sidney Poitier and Harry Belafonte -- it hit two of the key demographics to play the old movie palaces on the Deuce). Hair was indeed still running in spring 1972 (it would close that summer, after a 4-year run). And the next big title in the brief surge of "porn chic" after Boys in the Sand was indeed Deep Throat.

How long do we have to wait for a second season now?

Edited October 30, 2017 by Rinaldo

[Milburn Stone]

I didn't know it was gonna be the season finale. When Mr. HBO (who is that guy, anyway?) said "And now, the season finale of The Deuce," I went "NOOOOOOOOO."

So, I guess we know for sure now that the supposedly straight-arrow commander is as dirty as the rest of them?

[Traveller519]

I can't help but feel a little unfulfilled by the finale and the season. The closing montages summarized the new places many of our characters found themselves, and maybe it's a bit of that Vicky Christina Barcelona, "we've been through all of this and still feel the same" but it didn't have that climax, even if ultimately less than what we wanted. I found that surprising since a second season wasn't guaranteed, but it's obvious that's how they wanted it to play out. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

So that space ended up being a bright and shiny x-rated video store and peep show arcade? We'll see how long it stays bright and shiny.

The reference to "guitar hero" seemed like a pretty blatant anachronism to me. Was there a band or a song called Guitar Hero back then? It's pretty much pointless to google that phrase now because the first eleventy thousand references are to the video game.

Candy's brother got put in a mental hospital for being gay or was he just into cross-dressing? Either way, that's horrible.

Can't wait until the next season.

[thuganomics85]

Clarke Peters!!  I'm glad they got to him to show up (as the retired pimp C.C. was talking with at the bar.)  Even if he never returns, I'm glad they got here at least once.  I will certainly not be opposed to David Simon getting all The Wire actors back here at least once!

Glad Candy finally got her shot at directing some features and it apparently doing a good job at it.  Nice that Harvey seems to be supportive now.  Those two together can probably be a force in the porn industry, I imagine.

Had a bad feeling something bad was going to happen between Chris and Cassandra.  He basically had to refuse to go on record, because he would likely get booted out by the new captain if he did.  Also, it sounded like his partner ratted him out?  He may still be on the force, but he probably doesn't have any allies now.

Lori realizes that just because she's finding success at porn, it doesn't mean she's got all the power, as she and C.C. weren't allowed to go to the VIP section with the likes of Candy and Harvey.  I'm curious to see what is going to happen to those two next season.  Also Darlene, who seems to be finding success here too.

Frankie and Bobby are living it up, and Bobby's even stepping out on his wife now.  Kind of feels like they're being set up for an eventual fall.

Can't see Vincent and Abby lasting long even if they are moving it.  Not necessarily sure if Vincent truly still has feelings for his wife still, but both seem to be clashing in ways that I don't see them getting over.

Will Larry's "girl" stay loyal in prison or turn on him?  Perhaps both: she'll service time but be turned into an informant.

Overall, love the season and can't wait for the next one.  I know David Simon shows tend to get overlooked in the award ceremonies, but I'm hoping the bigger names might be able to get this some kind of recognition.  I definitely think Maggie Gyllenhaal has a good shot at some nominations.

[Milburn Stone]

5 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Had a bad feeling something bad was going to happen between Chris and Cassandra.  He basically had to refuse to go on record, because he would likely get booted out by the new captain if he did.  Also, it sounded like his partner ratted him out?  He may still be on the force, but he probably doesn't have any allies now.

Interested in others' views on this. As I wrote, I assume we're now supposed to realize the commander is dirty--but I'm not sure of it. It could be that after Chris's partner went to the commander with his suspicions that Chris is "turning," the commander, wanting to clean up the district and convinced that the best way to do it is to continue his investigation internally, and also needing to be sure of Chris's loyalty so that he can be sure Chris himself is not dirty, sent the message he did to Chris. Jesus, it's starting to be a John Le Carré novel. Or is it, on the other hand, Occam's Razor?

[Rinaldo]

2 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

I assume we're now supposed to realize the commander is dirty

That never occurred to me, and it still hasn't, after reading the idea.

For now, my assumption is how it appears on the surface: that the the new captain is sincere about wanting to clean things up but wants to do it from the inside, not with a public exposé or outcry. To that end, he wants Alston to keep quiet (in return, it's implicitly promised, for eventual promotion)... and Alston did, to the extent that he could at this late date (wouldn't go on the record). So the prostitution story in the paper didn't say anything about police corruption. But still, Alston's been fingered by his partner as someone who's been talking to the press, and he looks to be shunned at work; so it remains to be seen how he'll fare on the job if and when any clean-up happens. Does his boss see even the amount of talking-to-the-press that did happen (mostly before his arrival) as disloyalty?

[pasdetrois]

I heard the anvils clanking for Ruby and thought "please no." She will be missed.

I hope the series is renewed.

The reporter's storyline is weak for me, maybe because the other characters are so colorful.

The singer in the black and white face was supposed to be from the band ? and the Mysterians; the song was "96 Tears." I felt like they were trying to say that Abby discovered the band - she said "I saw them at a party." But their song was a hit in the mid-60s.

Maggie G and Dominique Fishback (Darlene) are outstanding. All the tough guys in leather jackets, running around opening massage parlors and counting money, and with their thick accents and corny expressions, are a bit of a cliche.

[Milburn Stone]

52 minutes ago, pasdetrois said:

All the tough guys in leather jackets, running around opening massage parlors and counting money, and with their thick accents and corny expressions, are a bit of a cliche.

I have to differ with you there. IMO Michael Rispoli as Rudy Pipilo is giving a refreshingly uncliched performance. A core of monstrousness must be in there somewhere (otherwise he couldn't maintain his position) but we haven't seen it. He's a man of his word, a man who values honesty, a man who actually projects humanity--a mensch. Could it be he actually survives in his world on integrity alone, relying on his underling to handle the unpleasantries? Seems unlikely, but so far, I've never seen a mob character portrayal as absent of menace as this one.

Edited October 30, 2017 by Milburn Stone

[Rinaldo]

38 minutes ago, pasdetrois said:

I hope the series is renewed.

? It was renewed for a second season over a month ago.

The plan is for three seasons, with a time jump between each. So we'll pick things up in 1979 or thereabouts.

41 minutes ago, pasdetrois said:

The singer in the black and white face was supposed to be from the band ? and the Mysterians; the song was "96 Tears." I felt like they were trying to say that Abby discovered the band - she said "I saw them at a party." But their song was a hit in the mid-60s.

No, according to Pelecanos, it's a new band covering the song, with a then-new aesthetic. I quote from the producers' interview on Uproxx: "It’s Garland Jeffreys. He was covering that song in the early 70s, and he’d sometimes performed it in blackface, though he’s half-black himself. When punk started in the ’70s, they were covering a lot of garage band songs in the ’60s that were punk before punk, and that was one of them."

[Dminches]

7 hours ago, pasdetrois said:

... with their thick accents and corny expressions, are a bit of a cliche.

I was a teenager in NYC during that time period.  While I wasn't in the sex industry I can tell you that's how people sounded.

[LoveLeigh]

On 10/30/2017 at 0:32 AM, Traveller519 said:

I can't help but feel a little unfulfilled by the finale and the season. 

I thought this season was crap. It was short on plot, heavy on character development, it was just cheesy and pretty trashy. Real crap. 

Oh, and when they paraded in on that "red carpet" to see Deep Throat... while it was supposed to be an inside look into what was "groundbreaking" it came across as embarrassing and so cliche. 

Edited November 1, 2017 by DakotaLavender

[planet17]

My gaydar was right. Eileen's brother is indeed gay, but wow, what a hell of a story. I'd never imagine that he was getting shock treatment for being gay. We haven't seen exactly all about why Eileen ended up in the business, but... do we need it? After this episode I realized I was more interested in understaning her relationship with her father than why she became a prostitute. And I'm honestly satisfied with what I got. We now know how disgusting her father is and I think we can put to rest the idea (and cliche) that she was sexually abused. I think we can interpret the rest.

For me, I think she was interested in sex and the sex business and she wanted to work and empower that. I think her father played a big part in that, but not being the reason she became a prostitute, but being what "pushed" her. Like an anger she had towards him was a fuel to persue what she wanted.

And my god, I'm gonna miss Thunder Thighs. Simon has this amazing way of making us feel for the characters, even the small ones. I was super sad to see her go.

I also hope to god they make more than 3 seasons. It doesn't sound enough. At least five would be ok. I hope the show make success enough to make that happen.

PS.: Clarke Peters! Man, when I saw him I was freaking out "Leeeeeeester!" And yes, I would love if they could bring the entire cast of The Wire in The Deuce in a way or another.

Edited October 31, 2017 by planet17

[Kierstyn]

When the Commander asked Chris "where do you want to end up?" (or something to that effect), my mind immediately flashed back to the Wire.  I'm pretty sure it was Lester Freeman (and it was a delight to see that actor in this episode) who told McNulty that he knows he is in trouble if he get asked where we wants to land.  Lester just wanted to be a beat cop, but since he expressed that, as a punishment he got stuck in that evidence room for a dozen years.  And McNulty used that wisdom from Lester to get his job on the boat, when he got tossed out of Homicide and Major Crimes.

So now I am terrified for poor Chris - without a Lester to give him advice, did he just lose any chance of ever becoming a detective?  Is this a call back?  Or am I reading too deeply into it?

[txhorns79]

Quote

My gaydar was right. Eileen's brother is indeed gay, but wow, what a hell of a story. I'd never imagine that he was getting shock treatment for being gay. We haven't seen exactly all about why Eileen ended up in the business, but... do we need it? After this episode I realized I was more interested in understaning her relationship with her father than why she became a prostitute. And I'm honestly satisfied with what I got. We now know how disgusting her father is and I think we can put to rest the idea (and cliche) that she was sexually abused. I think we can interpret the rest.

Can someone give me a better idea of the situation with Eileen's brother?  I can believe he could have parents who put him through the ringer in terms of being gay, in that they forced him to undergo all types of terrible psych treatment.   I just was surprised at the idea that he would be permanently institutionalized over the issue, or was the suggestion more he had been institutionalized because the treatment had permanently damaged him?  I did see his hand tremors, but I didn't get the impression from his conversation with Eileen that he was incapable of functioning outside a controlled environment like the hospital.      

[Rinaldo]

3 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I didn't get the impression from his conversation with Eileen that he was incapable of functioning outside a controlled environment like the hospital. 

We're all just guessing here, on the basis of one scene, but my read is that he's been convinced that he's incapable of functioning outside the hospital, just as he's parroting the "I am not a homosexual" line that he knows will keep him on his keepers' good side. Maybe Eileen has hopes of getting him out eventually.

That said, the hand tremors and his general frailty suggest that the EST may have done more physical damage than was (!) planned, and he might indeed have trouble on his own.

After the seven-year time jump for season two, it'd be lovely to see that his sister did get him released, and gotten him more caring therapy (as I did in that period), and he's now happily functioning in the gay community. But that's all wishful thinking on my part, and not how it's most likely to go.

[PamelaMaeSnap]

Where to begin??? 

I knew things could not end well for Ruby (RIP) based solely on the name of the episode ("My Name Is Ruby") ... it could have either been a huge empowerment scene or a tragic one. And though one of the true and many delights of this show is that it has been incredibly realistic and gritty (coming from one who was in their tweens/teens living in Manhattan at the time it takes place, though not turning tricks on the Deuce or anything) without veering into "dum dum dum ... hit you over head with anvil" dramatic, I suspected a season finale would lean more towards tragedy than empowerment.

Really bummed there was NO mention of Leon at all ... in jail? In jail and out on bail? Just gone gone gone? Hoping that whatever time jump is made in S2 he'll be back. 

I absolutely SQUEEEEEEEED when they showed "Ace" at the bar. I posted somewhere (here?) early on that I was sorely missing the great Clarke Peters somewhere somehow in the project. As a diehard fan of Simon's work from The Wire, Treme, Show Me A Hero (which I think is the first time we saw the divine Dominique Fishback) et al, Peters is my favorite and he seemed to be such an integral part of Simon's "inner circle" that his absence was glaring to me. Hoping he's part of S2. 

I couldn't tell, and couldn't figure out from credits but did anyone notice who played his wife, who comes to the door of the bar to remind him they have to go to the Rexall (LOVED that)? Was wondering if perhaps that was another Wire regular in a cameo.

I have always been a fan of David Krumholtz and think he's been absolutely a gem on this show ... love the relationship between Harvey and Eileen. Hope that also continues. 

And I guess I'm just glad that Chris came out of this S1 alive, which is more than I can say for most of the roles played by the awesome Lawrence Gilliard Jr. (S1 of The Wire, RIP D'Angelo, and in most of the shows/films he's been in.) He's just so sweet and trusting ... 

Do we know ANYTHING about S2 ... has anyone confirmed a time jump or is that wishful thinking/speculation? Do we know WHEN it's coming back (I'm old enough to miss the good old days of 22 episodes of a show in winter, 22 more in spring, a summer hiatus, and it's back again before forgetful people like me forget the ENTIRE plot line and get distracted by shiny objects. I hate having to wait. Maybe a Wire/Treme reboot would fill the time.

BTW, thanks to whoever figured out Garland Jeffreys on the bar band. I'd thought for a moment it could be David Johannsen (I can never spell that right) but Jeffreys makes so much sense (especially since Abby said something about him being half black) ... My first associated memory of him is "Ghostwriter" and "I May Not Be Your Kind" from 1977 but I learned retroactively of his LP from 1973 which was amazing and quite a staff of musicians backing him so of course their finding him in a Village bar tracks perfectly and subtly. 

Edited October 31, 2017 by PamelaMaeSnap
BECAUSE I FORGOT TO MENTION LEON!!!!!

[sadie]

I thought this was well done. This is how you tell a story in a linear fashion with characters that are nuanced, not all good or all bad and how you get invested in what happens next. When a scene where a hooker gets pushed out a window makes me tear up, well done. Maybe I’ve been watching too much Walking Dead that they’ve just made a mess of it that something quiet and compelling like this really stands out. Can’t wait for S2! 

[sugarbaker design]

1 hour ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

I'm old enough to miss the good old days of 22 episodes of a show in winter, 22 more in spring, a summer hiatus,

There's only 52 weeks in a year!  Don't you mean a season's worth of 22 episodes that ran from September to May with the occasional rerun/sports event/award show/live news happening preemption?  St. Elsewhere, my own personal golden age of television show, ran 22 episodes a season.

Edited October 31, 2017 by sugarbaker design

[Pop Tart]

Quote

I knew things could not end well for Ruby (RIP) based solely on the name of the episode ("My Name Is Ruby") ... it could have either been a huge empowerment scene or a tragic one. And though one of the true and many delights of this show is that it has been incredibly realistic and gritty (coming from one who was in their tweens/teens living in Manhattan at the time it takes place, though not turning tricks on the Deuce or anything) without veering into "dum dum dum ... hit you over head with anvil" dramatic, I suspected a season finale would lean more towards tragedy than empowerment.

Had we seen the guy who killed Ruby before? When she saw him taking money out of her purse at first she turned and told him to put it back. He said he wasn't satisfied so he wasn't going to pay, so she told him she'd sic her "man" (meaning pimp) on him and he said something that made her back off totally (like she suddenly realized something about him or knew him or something). It was only when he called her thunder thighs that she got angry enough to talk back again and then he shoved her out the window. What was the backing off about? Did she have some realization of who he was, who he was connected to?

That question aside I had mixed feelings about the finale and the series in general. It works well as a series of character explorations, but doesn't really seem to go anywhere. As I watched each episode I loved the actors and acting and was engrossed by them, but ended each one thinking 'what's the point?' And though it makes me happy that Megan Abbott and Lisa Lutz are on the writing team, I do still have some issues with the absolute degradation of the women within the show, and yes I realize it's about prostitution and the porn industry so degradation is part of the deal.

Will have to mull it some more.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Pop Tart

[txhorns79]

Quote

Had we seen the guy who killed Ruby before? When she saw him taking money out of her purse at first she turned and told him to put it back. He said he wasn't satisfied so he wasn't going to pay, so she told him she'd sic her "man" (meaning pimp) on him and he said something that made her back off totally (like she suddenly realized something about him or knew him or something). It was only when he called her thunder thighs that she got angry enough to talk back again and then he shoved her out the window. What was the backing off about? Did she have some realization of who he was, who he was connected to?

I think he said something that indicated he knew who her pimp was, and that seemed to scare Ruby. 

[sugarbaker design]

47 minutes ago, Pop Tart said:

Had we seen the guy who killed Ruby before?

I thought it was the same guy who beat the shit out of Candy.  

[luna1122]

23 minutes ago, sugarbaker design said:

I thought it was the same guy who beat the shit out of Candy.  

I thought so too, at first, then wasn't sure.

I was so sad for Ruby. What a terrible end.  And then the douchebag pimp joking about her taking the stairs. Ugh. I want all the pimps to die.

I really wanted to know what happened to Leon.

It's incredibly stupid of me, and I hate violence, but when Vincent was stalking thru the pool hall, picking up various cues to find the best one for a beat down...um, mrrrroowwww. That was disturbingly sexy AF.

I hate Vincent's bro in law. What a douchebag.

[teddysmom]

They really did telegraph that something was going to happen to Ruby. 

Did Candy's brother have shock treatment because he was gay? WTF

[SoothingDave]

2 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

There's only 52 weeks in a year!  Don't you mean a season's worth of 22 episodes that ran from September to May with the occasional rerun/sports event/award show/live news happening preemption?  St. Elsewhere, my own personal golden age of television show, ran 22 episodes a season.

Yes, something like that.  Used to be 26 episodes in a season.  Of course, they often cheated and did "clip show" episodes.  

[Totale]

1 hour ago, teddysmom said:

Did Candy's brother have shock treatment because he was gay? WTF

Yes, he did - as did Lou Reed in 1959 before he went to Syracuse and met Garland Jeffries.

[teddysmom]

1 hour ago, SoothingDave said:

There's only 52 weeks in a year!  Don't you mean a season's worth of 22 episodes that ran from September to May with the occasional rerun/sports event/award show/live news happening preemption?  St. Elsewhere, my own personal golden age of television show, ran 22 episodes a season.

West Wing had 22 for seven seasons I think. 

[Rinaldo]

Actually if we really look back to the 1960s, popular scripted shows (hourlong ones, at that) managed 39 episodes a season. On a cursory search, I see that many for Gunsmoke, 30 for The Big Valley, 32 for Burke's Law. 28 for Mission: Impossible, 30 to 32 for The Dick Van Dyke Show. In the 1970s, 24 episodes a season seems to have become more or less the norm, and that or 22 seems to have stuck since then for a "full" network season. But the cable networks like HBO have always gone for shorter seasons for their original programming.

4 hours ago, Pop Tart said:

Had we seen the guy who killed Ruby before?

Others here are sharper than I am apparently; so maybe we have. But he made perfect sense to me as "just another guy" with no significance. Part of the horrible hazards of the job. Have the wrong kind of interaction (totally not your fault) on a given day, and that's the end for you. The randomness being part of the horror.

6 hours ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

Do we know ANYTHING about S2 ... has anyone confirmed a time jump or is that wishful thinking/speculation?

We know a fair amount, and yes the time jump has been confirmed, both things being featured in that same interview with Alan Sepinwall that I already linked to on this page. Here's the relevant bit about the time jump, but I suggest clicking the link and reading the whole thing for the other information. 

Quote

James Franco has talked publicly recently about the idea that you intend to do three seasons of the show, with a big-time jump between each. Is that, in fact, the plan?

Simon: Yes, that is the plan.... We’re still figuring out explicitly where we want to drop in and where we want to come out, but it will be in the late 70s. And the third season, should it be approved, and go forward, would be in the mid-1980s.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Rinaldo

[PamelaMaeSnap]

5 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

There's only 52 weeks in a year!  Don't you mean a season's worth of 22 episodes that ran from September to May with the occasional rerun/sports event/award show/live news happening preemption?  St. Elsewhere, my own personal golden age of television show, ran 22 episodes a season.

Math class is hard, said Teen Barbie.

3 hours ago, luna1122 said:

It's incredibly stupid of me, and I hate violence, but when Vincent was stalking thru the pool hall, picking up various cues to find the best one for a beat down...um, mrrrroowwww. That was disturbingly sexy AF.

I was a little confused and wondered if it was random but Mr. Snappy said he was looking for (and found) the guy who beat up his (ex) wife. Which now will have him in trouble with the mob in S2 ...

[Brooklynista]

How does pimp protection work? When the John took Ruby's earnings, she threatened to call Rodney on him. How?

Where is Rodney stationed while Ruby is working? It never seems like the pimps are nearby. They're at the barber shop or getting their shoes shined.  How can pimps reasonable protect their girls from behind closed doors?

[planet17]

1 hour ago, Rinaldo said:

We know a fair amount, and yes the time jump has been confirmed, both things being featured in that same interview with Alan Sepinwall that I already linked to on this page. Here's the relevant bit about the time jump, but I suggest clicking the link and reading the whole thing for the other information. 

Simon indeed said the plan was three seasons, but they planned that before the show premiered. In one interview he said that was the plan if the show find its own audience and the critics don't shit on them. So far the show found both it's own audience and critical acclaim. David Simon's shows are not massively popular like other HBO shows and they tend to be overlooked by the Emmys and other awards. Hopefully The Deuce can break this pattern and find some Emmy recognition. Gyllenhal in my opinion has a lot of chances. I think Franco has some too. The show as a drama not so much, but I'll keep my hopes up.

Anyway, I think they can change their plans after knowing how the show was in terms of sucess. I can only hope for more than 3 seasons. And 12 episode seasons like The Wire was. There are too much characters for only 8 episodes. It's criminal.

[Rinaldo]

55 minutes ago, planet17 said:

Anyway, I think they can change their plans after knowing how the show was in terms of sucess.

That would be unlike them though; they tend to stick to their plan (though they've certainly had to manage with less resources than ideal when that was the only way). If it enjoys some success, that would give us the third season, just as the initial wave of critical enthusiasm for the pilot got us the second season. From what they've said (the change in the face of porn with the coming of the internet), three is as far as their story goes. More is not always better.

Or of course I could be totally out to lunch on all this, and they'd jump at the chance to expand. (I still think the offer would be unlikely, though.)

Edited November 1, 2017 by Rinaldo

[txhorns79]

Quote

Yes, something like that.  Used to be 26 episodes in a season.  Of course, they often cheated and did "clip show" episodes.  

In the 50s and 60s, shows could have up to 36 episodes a season.  In the mid-60s, Peyton Place aired in primetime twice a week and ended after five seasons and over 500 episodes.  Just imagine the insanity of that (it had a huge cast).  Though as a more recent example, 90210 and Melrose Place both regularly had seasons of 30 plus episodes.   

Quote

Where is Rodney stationed while Ruby is working? It never seems like the pimps are nearby. They're at the barber shop or getting their shoes shined.  How can pimps reasonable protect their girls from behind closed doors?

In the episode where the fake cop arrested Lori, and likely was going to take her to her death, her pimp was watching from across the street, I think? 

Edited November 1, 2017 by txhorns79

[planet17]

1 hour ago, Rinaldo said:

That would be unlike them though; they tend to stick to their plan (though they've certainly had to manage with less resources than ideal when that was the only way). If it enjoys some success, that would give us the third season, just as the initial wave of critical enthusiasm for the pilot got us the second season. From what they've said (the change in the face of porn with the coming of the internet), three is as far as their story goes. More is not always better.

Or of course I could be totally out to lunch on all this, and they'd jump at the chance to expand. (I still think the offer would be unlikely, though.)

For me is hard not to compare The Deuce and The Wire, and they have been compared . It's almost inevitable. I understand and I can see that, despite the many similarities, both shows were structured differently. The Wire was about the drug business, but every seasons was focused and explored a different side of it: the public school, the legalization, the media, etc. The Deuce will focus on time periods, but I only found that out recently. And I'm not a big fan of the idea. It seems that the show will be more historical than social. Not that it's not providing a social study, it is. But the themes here seems to not have the same relevance and focus as in The Wire. So I fear the social themes might be delt not in a superficial way, but in an insuficient way.

The rape culture, how the violence against women drive pornography, the rise of gay porn and LGBT issues, the relation between pornography and boys growing up and how that affects their vision of sex and women, are all themes I'd be highly interested in. Not only that but The Deuce, just like The Wire, has a huge amount of (interesting) characters that I want to continue to watch their journey.

So yeah, I trust Simon. But for me, only three seasons consisting of only eight episodes, when there are so many themes and no many characters to explore, so many possibilities, sounds a little disappointing.

Edited November 1, 2017 by planet17

[PamelaMaeSnap]

I'll take a guess that if indeed it does jump ahead, then among other key plot advancements, Candy will officially be Candida Royale and we'll see the business from her POV. 

[Drogo]

9 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

I thought it was the same guy who beat the shit out of Candy.  

The actor hasn't appeared in any other episodes. 

[buttercupia]

Ruby just saw that he was seriously unhinged and decided to leave well enough alone.

I'm pissed as hell that they sacrificed a woman of color with a non-standard body type. couldn't they have killed off one of the 20 interchangeable skinny white girls on the show? it had to be Ruby? smh.

[Deanie87]

22 hours ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

absolutely SQUEEEEEEEED when they showed "Ace" at the bar. I posted somewhere (here?) early on that I was sorely missing the great Clarke Peters somewhere somehow in the project. As a diehard fan of Simon's work from The Wire, Treme, Show Me A Hero (which I think is the first time we saw the divine Dominique Fishback) et al, Peters is my favorite and he seemed to be such an integral part of Simon's "inner circle" that his absence was glaring to me. Hoping he's part of S2. 

At first I thought the woman was Melissa Leo from Homicide, but with the tiny closer look I don't think it was. Clarke Peters has been showing up on a lot of the British shows that I watch.

[Milburn Stone]

1 hour ago, buttercupia said:

I'm pissed as hell that they sacrificed a woman of color with a non-standard body type. couldn't they have killed off one of the 20 interchangeable skinny white girls on the show? it had to be Ruby? smh.

My take? Ruby was special. While we have learned enough about the various women to appreciate their humanity, I felt a special affection (if that's the word) for Ruby. Maybe it was her pride in herself despite having a non-standard body type. At any rate, I felt more sadness and loss, and perceived more tragedy, than if any of the other prostitutes fell to their death. Which means that, for me, dramatically, she was a good choice.

[sugarbaker design]

1 hour ago, buttercupia said:

I'm pissed as hell that they sacrificed a woman of color with a non-standard body type.

Wasn't that the point though?  The 20 interchangeable skinny white girls were in the relative safety of the brothel.  Women like Ruby didn't have that luxury.

[PamelaMaeSnap]

1 hour ago, buttercupia said:

Ruby just saw that he was seriously unhinged and decided to leave well enough alone.

I'm pissed as hell that they sacrificed a woman of color with a non-standard body type. couldn't they have killed off one of the 20 interchangeable skinny white girls on the show? it had to be Ruby? smh.

Agree BUT I think they set that up when Chris was asking her why she hadn't gone off the street into a parlor and she said that she wasn't getting any business that way because no one was choosing her (I inferred over the skinny white and black girls) and her "body type" attracted a particular clientele that I guess wasn't going to the parlors. I guess that was setting up her lack of pimp protection and the dangers to which she was exposing herself. But damn, that guy looked like he was just dressing up early for Halloween with those eyes. I wish she had been a  position where she could have been choosy or protected from the get-go. 

ETA: Sorry to have been department of redundancy department in my answer, because others have said it in fewer words. 

ETAA: I wish they'd gotten Wendy Grantham in that cameo as Ace's wife waiting to go to Rexall's. She has not worked since The Wire, apparently. I bet she's still lovely. 

Edited November 1, 2017 by PamelaMaeSnap
Redundancy plus a pic of Shardene and Lester

[planet17]

3 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

Wasn't that the point though?  The 20 interchangeable skinny white girls were in the relative safety of the brothel.  Women like Ruby didn't have that luxury.

Yeah, for me it was. My Name Is Ruby was an episode about violence against women and the oppression of patriarchy. Ruby was killed by a man who was not satisfied with her. Barbara was arrested because of Larry. Sandra couldn't publish her story because of Alston and her male boss. Vincent wife was beaten up. Lori couldn't stay at the party because she is CC's "property" and he didn't want her to stay. Darlene and other prostitutes were working on a place built by men for their profit. And even male characters like Eillen's brother was shown as a victim of this oppression.

[sugarbaker design]

12 minutes ago, planet17 said:

Yeah, for me it was. My Name Is Ruby was an episode about violence against women and the oppression of patriarchy. Ruby was killed by a man who was not satisfied with her. Barbara was arrested because of Larry. Sandra couldn't publish her story because of Alston and her male boss. Vincent wife was beaten up. Lori couldn't stay at the party because she is CC's "property" and he didn't want her to stay. Darlene and other prostitutes were working on a place built by men for their profit. And even male characters like Eillen's brother was shown as a victim of this oppression.

Word, and so well said.

[Gobi]

22 hours ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

Math class is hard, said Teen Barbie.

I was a little confused and wondered if it was random but Mr. Snappy said he was looking for (and found) the guy who beat up his (ex) wife. Which now will have him in trouble with the mob in S2 ...

Vincent cleared that with his mob contact, who told him that none of the pool hall guys were made men, and therefore he could beat one without fear of mob reprisal.

[buttercupia]

I just feel like they could have provided the same story without sacrificing one of the most interesting, human, women on the show.

[Rinaldo]

I certainly agree about

29 minutes ago, buttercupia said:

one of the most interesting, human, women on the show

but I suspect many/most of the girls will be out of the picture in 1979 (or whatever exactly is the year in season 2) in any case. It's a young woman's game, and 7 years will have taken its toll on the workforce, one way or another. 

[PamelaMaeSnap]

3 hours ago, Gobi said:

Vincent cleared that with his mob contact, who told him that none of the pool hall guys were made men, and therefore he could beat one without fear of mob reprisal.

Thank you for clarification! All I knew was that the mob branch that had been involved in the beating of his wife (Twisty??? Something like that) was not the same as Rudy Mr. Pipolo's branch.