All Episodes Talk: Small World, Big Lives

[all4mom2]

According to this article, two kinds of surgery to correct bowing are available to children, one an outpatient procedure (sorry; can't get link to copy): 

Surgery for Achondroplasia in Children | NYU Langone Health

 

2 minutes ago, Foghorn Leghorn said:

Will on The Little Couple had one very bowed leg too very similar to Jackson’s.  I see pics of him as late as last week at a swim meet on Instagram and his legs look good.  I don’t think he had surgery as Jen is posting pics of the kids quite often and they are quite active.

Maybe he had the less-invasive procedure; outpatient and on crutches for two weeks.

[babyhouseman]

8 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

According to this article, two kinds of surgery to correct bowing are available to children, one an outpatient procedure (sorry; can't get link to copy): 

Surgery for Achondroplasia in Children | NYU Langone Health

 

Maybe he had the less-invasive procedure; outpatient and on crutches for two weeks.

It was awhile since Zach's surgery show. They probably have better techniques now.

[EllaWycliffe]

13 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

Maybe he had the less-invasive procedure; outpatient and on crutches for two weeks.

Absolutely no reports of it, and they do report Zoey having ear tubes replaced so its not like the press doesn't pay attention. I even took a look on Jen's instagram and while Will did break his arm a few months ago, no mention of any surgery.

[watcherwoman]

Caryn is a perfect choice to decorate a double wide trailer!  The first time I saw her, I thought she screamed trailer park!!  When she decorated Matt's double wide with her furniture from Kohl's, I could tell she has done this before.  They say water always finds it level, well Matt found his level with Caryn.   They make a really nice couple.   He found a woman that doesn't mind his drinking, lying and cheating, and she found a man dumb enough to think she really loves him.  I guess it's true,  there is a match for everyone out there.   As long as Matt keeps bringing in the Benjamins,  Caryn will make that double wide shine.  

[floridamom]

Perhaps Zach and Tori need to consult Dr. Jen Arnold of The Little Couple for advice for their son's legs.

[EllaWycliffe]

Dr. Arnold is a neonatal doctor, so I don't think that would be helpful.

[Irate Panda]

It’s possible Zach and Tori just aren’t sharing everything about their kids’ health or plans for everything they will be doing for treatment. If they are keeping some information to themselves, it would be refreshing, since it’s not like their kids’ can consent to any of this or even their appearance on the show.  It’s also possible, the producers, are editing some things out because they think Amy and Chris fighting over rocks is super exciting 😂

[floridamom]

Dr. Arnold is also a little person so perhaps she may be able to offer some advice to Jackson's parents.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

1 minute ago, floridamom said:

Dr. Arnold is also a little person so perhaps she may be able to offer some advice to Jackson's parents.

Jackson has already seen a doctor and had xrays done.  Why are we discounting what this doctor has recommended as a course of treatment which is to leave it until he gets a bit older?  

[all4mom2]

13 minutes ago, Foghorn Leghorn said:

Jackson has already seen a doctor and had xrays done.  Why are we discounting what this doctor has recommended as a course of treatment which is to leave it until he gets a bit older?  

According to Zach and Tori.

I'm really curious what happened to Zach's severe spinal stenosis...  That doctor (two doctors, I think) advised him that surgery could be delayed, but not avoided; the steroid injections he received were just a temporary fix.  Both Z&T seemed absolutely gob-smacked by this news and clueless about his (common) condition.

[EllaWycliffe]

Yeah, not ready to accuse anyone on this show of medical negligence. 

If you go back to the old episodes, Matt was told he needed neck surgery in season 8 or 9 and put it off for a good eight years and no one was bitching that Matt was clueless and ignoring medical advice. Why shouldn't Matt leap at the thought of spinal surgery... since Zach is supposed to jump and have it done as soon as a doctor mentions it or be deemed clueless?

For the record I don't really care that Matt put off surgery for years,  its just the same situation Zach is being deemed clueless over. 

Edited July 31, 2021 by EllaWycliffe

[ginger90]

🤦‍♀️

[Foghorn Leghorn]

52 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

According to Zach and Tori.

I'm really curious what happened to Zach's severe spinal stenosis...  That doctor (two doctors, I think) advised him that surgery could be delayed, but not avoided; the steroid injections he received were just a temporary fix.  Both Z&T seemed absolutely gob-smacked by this news and clueless about his (common) condition.

I am only talking about Jackson.  Zach is another story and I am not up to date with his past medical.  If you choose not to believe Zach and Tori then so be it.  Do we need to hear it from a doctor’s mouth in order for it to be deemed legitimate?

Edited July 31, 2021 by Foghorn Leghorn

[Joan of Argh]

In my opinion and the only reason I was like wtf???  Is because of the way TLC handled it…

TLC made it seem like Z and T had their heads stuck in the sand like a couple ostriches….the very first time Z and T address the subject of Jackson’s legs on the show it’s a conversation where they are “wondering IF Jackson’s legs  are beginning to bow a little bit”…. meanwhile we’ve all been watching him run around for two years looking like he’s straddling a large horse and one side looked like he was walking on the side of his ankle…. And they’re WONDERING IF HIS LEGS ARE STARTING TO BOW A LITTLE?!?!?? 😳

If TLC had presented it as a condition that Z and T were monitoring and well aware of and his doctor was keeping a close eye on the progression of the bowing I really don’t think anyone would have been concerned and or bewildered at all.

of course that isn’t as dramatic as Z and T seemingly clueless and not sure if there’s a problem that might need attention so TLC goes with the dramatic version.

 

Edited July 31, 2021 by Joan of Argh
Clarity

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Will on The Little Couple had a badly bowed leg as did Alex on 7 Little J’s when they were much younger but both never had the surgery and the delay worked in their favour.  Will it also work out that way for Jackson?  Who is to say.  Delaying surgery on a rambunctious still growing boy who has no issues with pain or discomfort right now seems like a prudent thing to do.  It certainly isn’t slowing him down!  Lol  

It is hard for the viewers to watch though and TLC does like the drama .

[LucyEth]

2 hours ago, Joan of Argh said:

wondering IF Jackson’s legs  are beginning to bow a little bit”…

LOL!  What an understatement.  I am on the side of not giving a shit what they do, not my kid, don’t even know them.  

[all4mom2]

Not sure what Matt has to do with any of this, but I'm not suggesting ANYONE get an unnecessary surgery, especially since intubation is difficult for dwarfs.  I don't blame Matt for putting it off as long as possible, nor would I blame Zach (except that his carrying his children up and down stairs is potentially dangerous with the symptoms spinal stenosis presents).  I'm just curious why it no longer seems to bother him if he "needed" surgery and also amazed that apparently neither he nor Tori seemed familiar with or informed about a condition that is very common among dwarfs considering that Zach is one and they had, at the time, one child with the condition (and now two). 

As for bowed legs, if they are miraculously self-correcting given enough time, one wonders why they perform corrective surgery on ANY children, and yet they do, per the article I shared...

Hopefully Z&T have a handle on this and are making the best decisions for J.

No one here really has any way of knowing one way or the other.

Edited July 31, 2021 by all4mom2

[Absolom]

I would expect that if Zach and Tori do anything similar to what I do they would get a second and possibly a third opinion from pediatric orthopedic surgeons before doing any surgery for Jackson.  I wouldn't expect that to be on the show as it would be repetitive and quite likely not all the doctors would agree to filming.  IIRC Matt went to a specialist in Oakland for his surgery and possibly Zach did for his leg also.  I wouldn't be surprised if we don't hear all the details unless/until actual surgery is scheduled.

Edited August 1, 2021 by Absolom

[EllaWycliffe]

2 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

nor would I blame Zach (except that his carrying his children up and down stairs is potentially dangerous with the symptoms spinal stenosis presents).

You were the one stating Zach was ignoring the doctor telling him he needed surgery , that he was clueless about his common condition. 

4 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

Not sure what Matt has to do with any of this,

The relevance is that 1) Matt has indeed put off necessary needed surgery for a lengthy period of time and not been taken to task for ignoring medical advise and being clueless, 2) Zach has been chided for ignoring his spinal stenois and not having surgery sooner than later even though its spinal surgery and a lot of people will wait until they absolutely have to since the risks are so high - being deemed "clueless" isn't a compliment, and 3) Zach and Tory are being chided for not insisting on a second opinion to get surgery sooner than later for Jackson's leg and are deemed "clueless" because they aren't loudly insisting their son go under the knife as soon as possible. Despite, you know, the risks.

 

9 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

As for bowed legs, if they are miraculously self-correcting given enough time, one wonders why they perform corrective surgery on ANY children,

I don't think all bowed legs magically self correct but this isn't an all or nothing situation - either ALL bowed legs self correct or ALL bowed legs need surgery. Considering the risks of surgery in general, and specifically to dwarfs, if Jackson isn't in pain or having difficulty getting around, waiting a little bit doesn't seem like a clueless stupid decision, it seems pretty reasonable. Tory and Zach seem to agree that there is indeed a good possibility he'll need surgery. He's not being denied care. 

[LucyEth]

15 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

Not sure what Matt has to do with any of this,

LOL!  All roads lead to Matt!!!😂

[pdlinda]

5 minutes ago, EllaWycliffe said:

Zach and Tory are being chided for not insisting on a second opinion to get surgery sooner than later for Jackson's leg and are deemed "clueless" because they aren't loudly insisting their son go under the knife as soon as possible.

I think I recall from one of the "Little Couple" episodes that surgery can't be performed until the full growth of the child is reached as if the child is still growing when the surgery is done it would have to be performed again??  If anyone knows differently, I'd be interested in hearing what he/she has to say😊

[all4mom2]

2 minutes ago, pdlinda said:

I think I recall from one of the "Little Couple" episodes that surgery can't be performed until the full growth of the child is reached as if the child is still growing when the surgery is done it would have to be performed again??  If anyone knows differently, I'd be interested in hearing what he/she has to say😊

Surgery for Achondroplasia in Children | NYU Langone Health

[EllaWycliffe]

1 minute ago, pdlinda said:

I think I recall from one of the "Little Couple" episodes that surgery can't be performed until the full growth of the child is reached as if the child is still growing when the surgery is done it would have to be performed again?? 

I think thats what Zach described when he was discussing how he had surgery twice on his right leg, once as a child and once as a teen to correct things that the first surgery failed to accomplish since he was still growing.

[ginger90]

When Zach was around 9, he had surgery on both legs at once , he had a cast on each. Then years later, while in high school, he had a second surgery, only on his right leg, pins were added in that surgery.

Edited August 1, 2021 by ginger90

[pdlinda]

2 hours ago, ginger90 said:

When Zach was around 9, he had surgery on both legs at once , he had a cast on each. Then years later, while in high school, he had a second surgery, only on his right leg, pins were added in that surgery.

So, if Zach had the first surgery at 9 that would mean that Jackson still has about 5 more years of growth to accommodate the condition until surgery could be done.  I wonder at what age Zach reached his ultimate height and whether the ultimate height is reached differently for men and women.  

I think I recall that Matt is a different category of dwarf than Amy and Zach?

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, pdlinda said:

So, if Zach had the first surgery at 9 that would mean that Jackson still has about 5 more years of growth to accommodate the condition until surgery could be done.  I wonder at what age Zach reached his ultimate height and whether the ultimate height is reached differently for men and women.  

I think I recall that Matt is a different category of dwarf than Amy and Zach?

Amy & Zach (as well as Lilah and Jackson) have achondroplasia dwarfism. Matt has diastrophic dysplasia.  

[seasons]

What I noticed from the last episode was that the leg bowing was seeming to cause J to walk on the inside of both feet. So I'm guessing that is factored in as well - the feet can't be developing normally with that kind of step. Ugh poor kid.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Tori did a lengthy video of her and Lilah on Instagram and she answers viewer questions.  She said she is working doing photography for friends/family/word of mouth clients.  She talked about Lilah’s eyes not getting worse nor getting better so far.  Lilah walked a few steps on the video.  She also talked about Jackson’s legs and how they are dreading the surgery when it happens.  

 

[all4mom2]

Jackson isn't necessarily going to have the same surgery Zach had; as was noted, there have no doubt been advances since then.  They now do surgeries involving the growth plate at younger ages, as anyone could learn by reading the article I've referenced twice now (or just Googling the subject).  My only point was that Z&T historically haven't exactly been up on conditions affecting dwarfs such as spinal stenosis and Tori, in particular, seems to be in denial re: what she "dreads."

[EllaWycliffe]

I just see no evidence that Zach and Tory are ignoring the situation, not taking him to see a doctor, or ignoring medical advice for urgent surgery. I've read the cited article, frankly I don't see it as evidence that Zach and Tory are making a bad choice. It also makes no claims as to whether earlier surgery is better, it's merely outlining procedures that are sometimes necessary on people with achondroplasia, including children. 

I don't know many parents who smile with glee and joy at the idea their children will need a serious medical operation. Tory saying she dreads it seems like a pretty normal response. 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Spinal stenosis can affect anyone.  Surgery is the last resort ahead of many other treatments and surgery is not always possible if someone has the condition.  

I don’t know anyone who would not dread surgery either for themselves or a small child.

[all4mom2]

I didn't say the article "proved Z&T are making a bad decision."  It simply proves that those insisting leg-straightening surgery isn't performed on younger children are misinformed.

[stoppro]

maybe since TLC  pay the medical they will decide what best and tv worthy.I'm only partly kidding.

[LucyEth]

9 hours ago, Foghorn Leghorn said:

She said she is working doing photography for friends/family/word of mouth clients.

Apparently she took photos of Caryn's son and his pregnant wife.  Caryn posted on instagram and thanked Tori

[EllaWycliffe]

New episode! About the Bride! Yeah, so not into weddings here....

We're at a wedding place for dresses. There's wedding dresses everywhere. Lisa and Deb are there and apparently both have had second weddings. Amy natters about how she's a little person and wants to look nice but there's dwarfism issues. They like Dress 1 but Amy thinks its billowy. Dress  2 looks nice. Honestly I have no idea, they're all white dresses with sparkly stuff. Amy notes that Chris would probably like her to wear Hawaiian themed stuff.  Dress 4 looks nice too. This goes on and on. I'm like Mark Zuckerberg, I can wear the same outfit every day happily.  Of course there's no decision on this. 

Out on the farm, Matt and Chris are checking out the saw mill. Chris apparently wants to build a bar for the wedding. This feels like a very contrived storyline. Chris does a little monologue on how he and Matt are besties now. They do a confessional together and discuss how Matt wants to be Chris's spinner. Wait... that didn't happen but they did just about kiss and declare themselves boyfriends. Meanwhile theres an extensive tour of the farm. We finally see the interior of the log cabin and its not a palace. The producers kid about whether Amy would like to have Chris take her to the cabin and Chris is all "No".

Now to Zach and Tory's. Jackson is being cute in the backyard. Amy wanders in and asks him to be the ring bearer. Personally, because I don't like small children, I wouldn't pick a child that was too young to really be trusted to follow instructions. But then I don't like children. Then Amy and Tory go on about the wedding and the planning and how Chris wants to be a part of it. Tory has a good voice over to the effect of "its not your wedding, its our wedding, you have to share". There's more talk of the dress. God, I don't care. Tory says Jackson will be "frakking adorable" and I am like "Is Tory into Battlestar?"

Back at the farm, the wildflower idea that no one really cares about is apparently having problems. Apparently this will involve everyone since Matt and Caryn can't do it themselves. Then Zach shows off the "cleaned up forest" and there's reminiscing about olden days.

Amy and Chris's place - they have picked best man and maid of honor and are having the two over to try the specialty drinks. But they've lost the recipes for the Seabreeze and the Cosmo and like, I think those are on Wikipedia. The producers are all "does Amy hoard cheese?" and the answer is yes. They discuss the dress. Chris thinks she'll pick something that she can twirl in. Chris doesn't want to get a new suit. 

Now Amy is touring the farm with Lisa and Deb. The barn is filled with dinosaur statues. Amy has a problem with the guests wandering thru the barn with dinosaurs everywhere. Amy doesn't know whether Matt will be building. Honestly this is so boring. Again, I hate the idea of an outdoor wedding anyway, but Roloff Farms isn't so awesome either. 

Now back at Amy's house, they're getting drinks ready for Rick and Lisa and their spouses help pick the signature drink.  Watching people drink makes me want to drink. This goes on and on and god no one cares. 

Back to the farm. Everyone is planting petunias in planters. By everyone, I mean Chris and Amy, Caryn and Matt, Tory Zach and the kids. The plant talk is as interesting as the dress talk. Apparently there's 2000 plants to be potted. Matt of course has to say in the confessional that he's certain arguing will happen.  Jackson hilariously brings Amy petunia plants by grabbing some already done, and yanking them out. 

Chris praises Amy for doing well with the flowers. Amy notes that usually such chores are done by the farm hands but the cameras needed something to film. And now we're back to Jackson doing cute things. Everyone praises Jackson to where I kinda sorta hate him. Amy natters on about how this is a new way to relate to Matt. Zach notes that Chris is good for his mom. Note - Amy says mostly nice things about Matt and then adds "I hope this can last". 

New week appears to be a whole lotta forced interactions on the farm. 

[all4mom2]

Actually, Amy said that the poofy dress was "bellowing."  Also that seeing so many wedding dresses at once was a "worldwind."  Never change, Amy!

[ginger90]

 

Clip:

 

 

[babyhouseman]

1 hour ago, all4mom2 said:

Actually, Amy said that the poofy dress was "bellowing." 

A bellowing wedding dress sounds scary. Maybe that should be for Halloween.

[SunnyBeBe]

Omg, Matt thinks that when a man marries an ex wife, you become related!  🤣 He seems ecstatic to welcome Chris aboard!  Though, they won’t technically be related.  This has to bother Amy…..although, she may be laughing all the way to the bank.  

[VioletNevermind]

They’re discussing their signature wedding cocktail.  Whatever it is, it had better be served ON THE ROCKS.  And with pome-granite.  

(Please forgive me. I’m in a boulder mood than usual.)

[all4mom2]

33 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Omg, Matt thinks that when a man marries an ex wife, you become related!  🤣 He seems ecstatic to welcome Chris aboard!  Though, they won’t technically be related.  This has to bother Amy…..although, she may be laughing all the way to the bank.  

Chris and Matt's first talking head!

Well, they ARE all one big family (almost).

I admire how they worked the words "spin" and "twirl" into this episode.

16 minutes ago, Suzy Rhapsody said:

They’re discussing their signature wedding cocktail.  Whatever it is, it had better be served ON THE ROCKS.  And with pome-granite.  

(Please forgive me. I’m in a boulder mood than usual.)

If they go with that last strong vodka drink, all the guests will be stoned.

[SunnyBeBe]

Is it just me or shouldn’t you be careful serving grapefruit juice?  You can’t drink it with some meds.  I’m assuming they’ll serve wine and champagne too.  

[chenoa333]

9 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

I admire how they worked the words "spin" and "twirl" into this episode.

25 minutes ago, Suzy Rhapsody said:

Yes!! 😄 I wasn't even sitting down watching this episode but I heard the "spin" and "twirl" words!

Enough with Tori thinking she has the cutest kids EVER and they do and say the cutest things EVER.

Too bad Jeremy didn't get asked to photograph the event since female photographers are not respected in the industry. Just ask Anne Geddes.  

[Joan of Argh]

1 minute ago, chenoa333 said:

 

Too bad Jeremy didn't get asked to photograph the event since female photographers are not respected in the industry. Just ask Anne Geddes.  

Or Annie Liebovitz… one of the highest paid and celebrated photographers in the world

[Irate Panda]

In case anyone was confused, the wedding is about AMY 😂. I guess Tori didn’t get the memo.

[Joan of Argh]

6 minutes ago, chenoa333 said:

Yes!! 😄 I wasn't even sitting down watching this episode but I heard the "spin" and "twirl" words

Sure seems like “spinning” and “twirling” are on their minds a lot 😂

[BusyOctober]

WTF with all those sculptures in Matt’s barn??? A few episodes back, he bought a horse(?) and the Bigfoot thing.  Now he has amassed every metal sculpture in the Pacific Northwest? Is he opening a Roloff version of Jurassic Park on the farm?

Amy and Chris, two people who spend A LOT of time on the Internet for their livelihoods, were like two ships adrift on a turbulent ocean when the recipes for Cosmopolitans and Sea Breezes were lost.  Umm, both of those “recipes” can be found all over Google FFS. 

I love how Tori and Zach are so over Amy’s immature, Bridezilla attitude toward this wedding.  I could feel Tori trying to not eye roll over all Amy’s “MY a wedding” BS.

The wedding dresses were very pretty, but all very similar IMO.  One had a ridiculously long train to be considered for a farm/barn wedding, but otherwise, the bodices were all the same to my eyes.  Just curious about how much the alterations would cost for re-sizing a gown for a little person.  To cut down a dress with 3 to 4 feet of skirt length to be proportional to Amy’s height seems like a big waste of money.  Why not get a custom made gown designed for a little person?  Then all the delicate details of the hem, embroidery, buttons, etc. wouldn’t be lopped off and wasted.
 

[Absolom]

If you order early enough, you can special order a shortened skirt so no detail is lost.  I have a short daughter who needed that done.  Amy could order a customized version of an available dress.  I'm not sure about the cost on a fully custom dress vs a customized dress.   I'm guessing that would completely depend on who was selected for each option.

[Joan of Argh]

22 minutes ago, BusyOctober said:

WTF with all those sculptures in Matt’s barn??? A few episodes back, he bought a horse(?) and the Bigfoot thing.  Now he has amassed every metal sculpture in the Pacific Northwest? Is he opening a Roloff version of Jurassic Park on the farm?

Amy and Chris, two people who spend A LOT of time on the Internet for their livelihoods, were like two ships adrift on a turbulent ocean when the recipes for Cosmopolitans and Sea Breezes were lost.  Umm, both of those “recipes” can be found all over Google FFS. 

I love how Tori and Zach are so over Amy’s immature, Bridezilla attitude toward this wedding.  I could feel Tori trying to not eye roll over all Amy’s “MY a wedding” BS.

The wedding dresses were very pretty, but all very similar IMO.  One had a ridiculously long train to be considered for a farm/barn wedding, but otherwise, the bodices were all the same to my eyes.  Just curious about how much the alterations would cost for re-sizing a gown for a little person.  To cut down a dress with 3 to 4 feet of skirt length to be proportional to Amy’s height seems like a big waste of money.  Why not get a custom made gown designed for a little person?  Then all the delicate details of the hem, embroidery, buttons, etc. wouldn’t be lopped off and wasted.
 

Matt bought the dinosaurs at the same time as the horse and Bigfoot and had them on display last pumpkin season but unlike the horse and Bigfoot they hadn’t found a perfect spot to display them and just had them standing by a fence like farm animals…. since then finding a better spot was discussed and they were put in the barn waiting to be moved to a permanent home on the farm that would suit them better.

[Irate Panda]

I know Matt is usually into making stools but maybe he could make something like this 

for his and Chris’ next talking head together.  I could feel the love LOL.

I thought most of Amy’s dresses looked very similar. I think she would look nice in most of them if they are tailored correctly.  The only one I didn’t really care for was the one where she was patting her boobs down.  
 

Lisa kind of got on my nerves tonight maybe because she was talking more than normal.  However, I think when she spoke about Amy initially saying she was going to be alone for the rest of her life, it really made me think that it was one of the main reasons Amy and Matt initially got married.  I really think they didn’t think they could do better than each other. I think they grew to love each other, but were never really compatible.  Amy and Matt both seemed to have better partners now, not perfect , but better-suited to them.

I wonder how much Chris sees Matt when the cameras aren’t around.  I actually enjoyed the family flower thing except how they basically had Jackson “walk in like he owned the place”.  I don’t mind Jackson or Lilah, but between the talking heads and everyone pretending to be Jackson’s helper, it was a bit much. 

Has Amy decreed, “LET THEM EAT COBBLER!” for the wedding or is that still up in the air?  I was looking forward to a cake tasting scene, but I’m not sure Chris would be invited.  

On a side note, how could Amy lose those run of the mill  one-of-a-kind drink recipes?  Why weren’t they securely fastened in her TOP SECRET WEDDING BINDER?