Season 8: Speculation and Spoilers Discussion

[GraceK]

4 minutes ago, Callista said:

I'm really more interested in Episode 4 at the moment than all these new "leaks." For instance, do you guys think the Golden Company will appear in this episode and attack...I don't know, Dany's fleet? Winterfell? And is Euron proposing marriage to Cersei in that scene in the trailer? Or just being his usual pseudo-romantic self?  Am also wondering if Euron will betray Cersei at some point, or Cersei betray him.

Me too. I can’t help but feel that Euron has to get more interesting. I would love if Euron marries her and then betrays her.  He’s been here since season 6 and has done nothing of much value, and yet he’s still around. What if he finds out she’s pregnant and it’s Jaimes? What if he hears that Danys  forces won, and he rather be King alone in KL so he can offer himself to Daenerys? 

If they really want to establish Daenerys as a force against the Starks, rather  than go the mad queen route, wouldn’t it make more sense if Euron deposes Cersei, and offers himself in marriage ? If Jon decides to detach himself from Dany for incest reasons, and Sam starts pushing him to stake his claim, it’s much more reasonable that Dany needs to recoup her losses and aligns herself with Euron. Especially if Cersei is dead or she thinks the Starks are moving against her.

[Callista]

1 minute ago, tvduser93 said:

Just like the death of NK was necessary to get rid of the ice side of magic, maybe Dany's death is necessary to get rid of the dragons/fire side of magic.

Perhaps Jon's final purpose is to 'convince' her to sacrifice themselves for the greater magic-less good.

In that case, Jon should also sacrifice himself--he's only alive because of his magical resurrection. 

[GraceK]

I would much rather see a real political struggle, then some stupid Jon kills dany cause “ evils Queen “ thing . If Sam or Sansa are trying to push Jon to stake his claim and Dany gets paranoid or feels betrays, it could be interesting if Euron becomes an ally and kills Cersei.

[GraceK]

8 minutes ago, tvduser93 said:

Just like the death of NK was necessary to get rid of the ice side of magic, maybe Dany's death is necessary to get rid of the dragons/fire side of magic.

Perhaps Jon's final purpose is to 'convince' her to sacrifice themselves for the greater magic-less good.

Except Danys dragons are more like puppies. Drogon and Rhaegal have done nothing bad. They have taken out Slavers, and war enemies, but pretty much mind their own business like Ghost does. They also have proved instrumental in the battle of Winterfell and saved Jon’s life. murdering  them for being dragons means that Bran and Ghost and Nymeria should also die.  

Edited April 30, 2019 by GraceK

[Callista]

10 minutes ago, GraceK said:

Me too. I can’t help but feel that Euron has to get more interesting. I would love if Euron marries her and then betrays her.  He’s been here since season 6 and has done nothing of much value, and yet he’s still around. What if he finds out she’s pregnant and it’s Jaimes? What if he hears that Danys  forces won, and he rather be King alone in KL so he can offer himself to Daenerys? 

If they really want to establish Daenerys as a force against the Starks, rather  than go the mad queen route, wouldn’t it make more sense if Euron deposes Cersei, and offers himself in marriage ? If Jon decides to detach himself from Dany for incest reasons, and Sam starts pushing him to stake his claim, it’s much more reasonable that Dany needs to recoup her losses and aligns herself with Euron. Especially if Cersei is dead or she thinks the Starks are moving against her.

That sounds really interesting. Wasn't Victarion in the books interested in marrying/joining forces with Dany? So D&D might have adapted that for the show in the character of Euron. And that would certainly give more story material for the last three episodes to develop.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Callista

[Morrigan2575]

13 minutes ago, GraceK said:

they really want to establish Daenerys as a force against the Starks, rather  than go the mad queen route, wouldn’t it make more sense if Euron deposes Cersei, and offers himself in marriage ?

Didn't the Euron actor give an interview as such? 

[GraceK]

1 minute ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Didn't the Euron actor give an interview as such? 

He gave conflicting interviews. In a couple be said he genuinely loves Cersei and that she’s sexy, and then he said until he sees Daenarys and loves her...he has great taste he said 🙄 basically he plays every scene sincerely . 🤷🏻‍♀️

[Eyes High]

1 hour ago, Morrigan2575 said:

there were a few things in that crypt scene that make me question what the hell is going on with Sansa/Tyrion.  I can't tell if it was just acting choices on Dinklage's part or something being hinted at.  There were the obvious moments, Tyrion brought up their marriage (again), the hand kissing, before going to face the Wights.  There was one thing that i might have imagined which was when Tyrion was talking about going up there to fight, he was arguing with Varys but, kept turning to look at Sansa, almost felt like he was posturing to get her attention.  Although, it could have been that Sansa and Varys were the only two in the crypt that were at the Battle of Blackwater so he could have just been trying to get her to take his side.

As I said upthread, Tyrion's in love with Sansa. Even in earlier seasons, Tyrion would look at Sansa like she hung the moon. In S8, he made a beeline for her at Winterfell, he feels he can no longer visit prostitutes for a mysterious reason he won't disclose even to Jaime, he brings up his marriage to Sansa at the worst possible time, and he kisses her hand in what he thinks are their last moments? I really don't think it's some great puzzle at this point. 

As someone who has shipped many different couples over many different shows and has a pretty good understanding of the particular romantic storyline beats, I can say that if this were any other show, the writing for 8x03 would indicate that Sansa/Tyrion is endgame and 8x03 is the writers hastily trying to tee it up so it's not completely out of nowhere. Writing a scene where the actors have to do all the work with wordless glances is a cheap way of doing it, in my opinion, but D&D are allergic to writing any scene of substance where characters actually talk at length about their feelings, so here we are. And of course, GOT isn't any other show, and for all we know this setup is setting the table for some sort of horrible reversal or heel turn down the line, so we'll have to see.

Quote

The other thing that confuses the hell out of me about Tyrion is the looks repeatedly exchanged between him and Bran.  Something happened in that Tyrion/Bran talk that we didn't see.  It will most likely be revealed in a flashback after whatever is supposed to happen, happens but, i don't know what the hell it means?  

Yeah, no idea, although Tyrion didn't seem disturbed by whatever Bran told him. 

[GraceK]

It would be really sad actually because she genuinely loves Jon I think and she’s given everything to him. Her whole heart . Everything she has. And I think she would marry him and combine claims no problem. But if he steps away from her, and his family and Sam starts plotting against her and she feels betrayed, it would be really tragic for her to align with Euron, who is much more villainous and would really bring out a much darker tendency. Can you imagine Euron feeding that ruthless streak? This could be a really interesting climax to the story if they went that way . 

[Morrigan2575]

5 minutes ago, GraceK said:

He gave conflicting interviews. In a couple be said he genuinely loves Cersei and that she’s sexy, and then he said until he sees Daenarys and loves her...he has great taste he said 🙄 basically he plays every scene sincerely . 🤷🏻‍♀️

That's the one I was thinking of. That he loves Cersei until he sees Dany

[Callista]

2 minutes ago, GraceK said:

He gave conflicting interviews. In a couple be said he genuinely loves Cersei and that she’s sexy, and then he said until he sees Daenarys and loves her...he has great taste he said 🙄 basically he plays every scene sincerely . 🤷🏻‍♀️

Maybe he wants both of them as his queens. 🙂 Anyway, I would love it if Daenerys's storyline gets more involved with Euron's and Cersei's storylines first, instead of her simply attacking KL outright.  Also, do any of you think Yara will make an appearance in Episode 4 or 5? It would be rather disappointing if she only resurfaces in Ep. 6 to confirm that she reclaimed the Iron Islands.

[Morrigan2575]

7 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

As I said upthread, Tyrion's in love with Sansa. Even in earlier seasons, Tyrion would look at Sansa like she hung the moon. In S8, he made a beeline for her at Winterfell, he feels he can no longer visit prostitutes for a mysterious reason he won't disclose even to Jaime, he brings up his marriage to Sansa at the worst possible time, and he kisses her hand in what he thinks are their last moments? I really don't think it's some great puzzle at this point. 

I agree, all signs point to it. I think I just have that trial leak stuck in my head so I keep looking for possible hidden/shady motives.

And you're right, any other show in it's final season I would take this as a sign that they're trying to rush the reunion/ending. Maybe they are? I swore Gendry was dead in 803 after the Arya sex (which also qualified as a rushed reunion/wrap up) but, that didn't happen so maybe this is what D&D are doing. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by Morrigan2575

[Solace247]

2 hours ago, SimoneS said:

No hard evidence, but the first leaker got Viserion's neck injury correct and it was posted months ago. The other one feels credible given the first one.

Doesn’t anyone feel that ten months is a long time ago to have seen cgi viserion with his neck wound? Or even if it was someone at the original filming, they’d just have witnessed bucking broncos, green screen and tennis balls. I mean I may be reaching, but I would assume that dragons with mere feet and wings would only have foot/wing tumbling and mouth on neck options at their disposal—it could be a good guess.

[YaddaYadda]

16 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

That's the one I was thinking of. That he loves Cersei until he sees Dany

He's already seen Dany, even spoke to her.

[MarySNJ]

14 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

That's the one I was thinking of. That he loves Cersei until he sees Dany

Hasn’t Euron already seen Dany? Is he secretly in love with her even while seducing Cersei? 

I wonder if what Yara said in 8.1 will come into play: “you chose the wrong side.” Euron basically says he’ll take his fleet and go somewhere else if that happens. Maybe he gets word that Dany’s alliance destroyed the NK and ended the apocalypse and he figures  he’d better join forces with her... after fucking Cersei because he said he would.

[Callista]

3 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

He's already seen Dany, even spoke to her.

So perhaps he fell "in love" with her when he saw her in Season 7, but of course he would not reveal this to Cersei. Seriously, though, I don't believe he's in love with either of them. He's really more interested in how he can use them and their power.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Callista

[Happy Harpy]

I thought I wouldn't have to deal with troll fleakers after the beginning of the season.

Sigh.

Every so-called "leak" this season was bullshit. Every single one of them, including coming from people who had otherwise intel, gave it and could prove it (WoMB saying that he saw Jaime die in Brienne's arms during the BoW is debunked). There was yet another fleaker again last week, supposedly backed-up by some admin retaliation on FF, about wight Gendry running after Arya. Many of them had some details rights in a sea of pure cow crap.

Seriously, enough with this shit. There are no leaks, there were no leaks from anonymous sources this season, only wishful thinking and fanfiction; because HBO struck down the hammer and the NDAs from Hell. Unless Frikidoctor -who seems quite very silent lately, did he get a follow-up on his Tyrion betrayal?- or the subtitle sheets leaker strike again, or unless another blunder from the broadcasters happens, there will be no leaks.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Happy Harpy

[GraceK]

5 minutes ago, Callista said:

So perhaps he fell "in love" with her when he saw her in Season 7, but of course he would not reveal this to Cersei. Seriously, though, I don't believe he's in love with either of them. He's really more interested in how he can use them and their power.

Honestly, the younger queen with dragons is always the winner IMO. 😂 if he’s serious about being King, and conquering the world and creating a dynasty, the one with Dragons, armies and a historic name, as well as youth is the smart move. He doesn’t know she’s “ barren”. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by GraceK

[Jextella]

1 hour ago, WindyNights said:

Explained in the books. 

1 in 1,000 people is born warg. 

And only one in 1,000 wargs is born a greenseer. 

And Bran is an exceptionally powerful greenseer. It's noted even within the show that Bran is the first person to control a human being.

Its like having the Force and Bran is Anakin Skywalker.

Thanks.  I had read this but still, why Bran...why Anakin?

Just luck of the draw?

[YaddaYadda]

4 minutes ago, Callista said:

So perhaps he fell "in love" with her when he saw her in Season 7, but of course he would not reveal this to Cersei. Seriously, though, I don't believe he's in love with either of them. He's really more interested in how he can use them and their power.

Euron is in love with himself, what Cersei can give him and Dany's dragons that would make his power absolute.

The show version is a low rent Jack Sparrow, so who knows.

[Callista]

12 minutes ago, Happy Harpy said:

I thought I wouldn't have to deal with troll fleakers after the beginning of the season.

Sigh.Seriously, enough with this shit. There are no leaks, there were no leaks from anonymous sources this season, only wishful thinking and fanfiction; because HBO struck down the hammer and the NDAs from Hell. Unless Frikidoctor -who seems quite very silent lately, did he get a follow-up on his Tyrion betrayal?- or the subtitle sheets leaker strike again, or unless another blunder from the broadcasters happens, there will be no leaks.

Forget about those leakers, they're all just attention-seekers. Come and share your speculations on Episode 4 instead. 🙂

[glowbug]

I’m going to try not to freak out about these leaks. They read like fake leaks not just in terms of the actual storyline but also just the way they’re written. The leaker claims to have proof but can’t show it, another typical fleaker move. He also got it wrong that Jon kills Viseryon. People are excusing that because Viseryon falling apart was CGI but so was the fire coming out of Viseryon’s neck. If he knew about that, wouldn’t he also have known that Viseryon falls apart while Jon stands there yelling at him (what was the point of that anyway?). Some fleakers get things right that seem impossible to guess and they turn out to be wrong. I’m reminded of that fleak that came out in November 2017 (or around then) that predicted Melissandre on horseback (but at the wrong battle) and also that Jaqen would show up in King’s Landing. No one was predicting Jaqen in King’s Landing and then the actor showed up for the Seville filming. I kept waiting for a filming spoiler to disprove the leak and nothing did. It still turned out to be 100% fake. 

[Happy Harpy]

Interesting interview from Joe Dempsie (which made me more hopeful he'd make it last episode, because none of this has happened yet):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUaVzzMoFtg

At 4:20 "He seems like the straight man in a world of kinda crazy people. Gendry is an everyman and he's getting increasingly wheeled in the political games of privileged people, and seeing him navigate that is always fun."

Give me Team Fleabottom, show!

Edited April 30, 2019 by Happy Harpy

[Callista]

17 minutes ago, GraceK said:

Honestly, the younger queen with dragons is always the winner IMO. 😂 if he’s serious about being King, and conquering the world and creating a dynasty, the one with Dragons, armies and a historic name, as well as youth is the smart move. He doesn’t know she’s “ barren”. 

I'm now getting more interested in this possible Dany-Euron-Cersei plotline than in all the drama back at Winterfell. 🙂

Edited April 30, 2019 by Callista

[MadameKillerB]

Not sure if this is correct forum for this: where are Jon and Davos going on horseback in the Episode 4 preview?

[Eyes High]

53 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I agree, all signs point to it. I think I just have that trial leak stuck in my head so I keep looking for possible hidden/shady motives.

And you're right, any other show in it's final season I would take this as a sign that they're trying to rush the reunion/ending. Maybe they are? I swore Gendry was dead in 803 after the Arya sex (which also qualified as a rushed reunion/wrap up) but, that didn't happen so maybe this is what D&D are doing. 

Right. I mean, I thought Gendry was a goner, too, but he's very much alive and paired off with Arya in 8x04, so I guess that pairing's endgame and they just wanted to move it along.

I don't know what significance Tyrion falling in love with Sansa at this late date could have unless he really is going to end up with her, but maybe I lack imagination. It seems like Tyrion knows he's in love with Sansa but doesn't have any intention of doing anything about it other than a single hand kiss (even when the world is about to end), which doesn't exactly align with some sort of huge plot development. There are only three episodes left, one of which will be mostly epilogue as far as I can tell. There really isn't all that much time for anything at this point unless it has some endgame significance, and I don't see how Tyrion having an unrequited thing for Sansa that he never intends to articulate qualifies.

Whether I'm wrong or I'm right, I really don't understand the complete bafflement of certain fans at the prospect of Tyrion and Sansa being endgame. Tyrion's the aspirational GRRM author avatar, GRRM explained all the redheads in ASOIAF by saying that he married two redheads, and the idea of Tyrion ending up married to the character he's already married to who happens to be a beautiful redhead is completely unfathomable and completely beyond anyone's comprehension? Seriously? Not liking the idea is fine, but claiming not to understand it is another thing altogether.

31 minutes ago, Happy Harpy said:

Unless Frikidoctor -who seems quite very silent lately, did he get a follow-up on his Tyrion betrayal?- or the subtitle sheets leaker strike again, or unless another blunder from the broadcasters happens, there will be no leaks.

Friki admitted that his spoiler about Jaime dying in 8x04 was wrong. He sticks by the Tyrion trial, although that's looking less and less likely to me given this Tyrion/Sansa subplot (unless it goes in some really weird directions). Javi's been wrong multiple times, too. They both claimed that the Unsullied marched to Castle Black, and this of course never happened.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Eyes High

[Morrigan2575]

28 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

He's already seen Dany, even spoke to her.

I understand that I was just referring to the jist of the actor's interview. Which was basically like Euron is all about Cersei until Dany. The guy could have just been joking around or hinting about a switch in plans.

[LadyChaos]

5 minutes ago, MadameKillerB said:

Not sure if this is correct forum for this: where are Jon and Davos going on horseback in the Episode 4 preview?

one of the dragons is injured, I think Drogon is the one with the hole in his wing.  So Im sure Dany is on the other one, making Jon ride the horse.  My guess is thats why we see Dany trying to bond with Rhaegal. She has always ridden Drogon, and always favored Drogon over Rhaegal and Viserion. So may try riding Rhaegel for the first time.

4 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

I don't know what significance Tyrion falling in love with Sansa at this late date could have unless he really is going to end up with her, but maybe I lack imagination. It seems like Tyrion knows he's in love with Sansa but doesn't have any intention of doing anything about it other than a single hand kiss (even when the world is about to end), which doesn't exactly align with some sort of huge plot development. There are only three episodes left, one of which will be mostly epilogue as far as I can tell. There really isn't all that much time for anything at this point unless it has some endgame significance, and I don't see how Tyrion having an unrequited thing for Sansa that he never intends to articulate qualifies.

I honestly don't see Tyrion and Sansa falling in love.  I think they were just trying to reconnect as friends.  Tyrion never made any indication that he had feelings for her.  Just the oppposide he considered her a child, and mostly just tried to protect her from his family's cruelty; then towards the end they sort of became friends.

[GraceK]

6 minutes ago, LadyChaos said:

one of the dragons is injured, I think Drogon is the one with the hole in his wing.  So Im sure Dany is on the other one, making Jon ride the horse.  My guess is thats why we see Dany trying to bond with Rhaegal. She has always ridden Drogon, and always favored Drogon over Rhaegal and Viserion. So may try riding Rhaegel for the first time

Rhaegal is injured. That’s Rhaegal she’s nuzzling in the preview. Rhaegal is the one who fell in battle with Viserion , he has the hole in his wing. She may have favored Drogon but she’s loves them both . 

Edited April 30, 2019 by GraceK

[MadameKillerB]

but where are Jon and Davos going? To Kings Landing already? Seems like they'd need to lick their wounds for a bit, so to speak. Drum up more support, let people know they defeated the Night King to get people to back Dany's claim to the throne.

[Eyes High]

18 minutes ago, LadyChaos said:

I honestly don't see Tyrion and Sansa falling in love.  I think they were just trying to reconnect as friends.  

I guess we'll find out if the subject comes up again in 8x04. The writers and cast had nothing to say about that particular moment in the crypts in any of the BTS interviews, the Inside the Episode or the Game Revealed segments, which is very odd, given all they had to say about important character interactions in 8x02 like Brienne's knighting and the Gendrya hookup. It could be spoilery for something down the road. We'll see.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Eyes High

[Minneapple]

42 minutes ago, Happy Harpy said:

Every so-called "leak" this season was bullshit. Every single one of them, including coming from people who had otherwise intel, gave it and could prove it (WoMB saying that he saw Jaime die in Brienne's arms during the BoW is debunked). There was yet another fleaker again last week, supposedly backed-up by some admin retaliation on FF, about wight Gendry running after Arya. Many of them had some details rights in a sea of pure cow crap.

Seriously, enough with this shit. There are no leaks, there were no leaks from anonymous sources this season, only wishful thinking and fanfiction; because HBO struck down the hammer and the NDAs from Hell. Unless Frikidoctor -who seems quite very silent lately, did he get a follow-up on his Tyrion betrayal?- or the subtitle sheets leaker strike again, or unless another blunder from the broadcasters happens, there will be no leaks.

The post about Arya killing the Night King from several months ago was legit. It even had Lyanna becoming a White Walker and Theon dying as he charged the Night King. The same poster has said that Jon kills Dany, though he didn't see the scene himself, only heard about it from a friend. 

[aprilbabe]

6 minutes ago, MadameKillerB said:

but where are Jon and Davos going? To Kings Landing already? Seems like they'd need to lick their wounds for a bit, so to speak. Drum up more support, let people know they defeated the Night King to get people to back Dany's claim to the throne.

Dragonstone. There is a scene from one of the previews that show Jon and Dany there.

[Happy Harpy]

29 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

Friki admitted that his spoiler about Jaime dying in 8x04 was wrong. He sticks by the Tyrion trial, although that's looking less and less likely to me given this Tyrion/Sansa subplot (unless it goes in some really weird directions).

Weird? Like he and Sansa being on it together? Or he taking the fall for Sansa?

Sophie T's word is always to take with a giganormous grain of salt, but IIRC she isn't the only one who mentioned Sansa's motivation being her "deep desire to rule" this season. It struck me as weird how the writers stressed her antagonism and her irrational hostility towards Dany in 8x03; while Dany was risking her life outside so Sansa could only look petty. On top of it, they allowed another character to verbally smack her down about it. Not the usual butt-kissing writing.

Sansa learned from Cersei and Littlefinger, she didn't get one decent role model as a young adult. Nurture counts as much as nature; while some people expect the eeevulz Targ genes to change Dany into an antagonist, bad influences in life could do the same. It could be that she goes behind everyone's back, it backfires horribly. Either Tyrion helped her and takes the rep for both of them; either he just takes the rep. If she gets away with it, it could be the "not everything is made right" that Gwendolyn Christie talked about.

I mean, after Arya killing the Night King and saving the world, which no one saw coming, who knows? Cersei Junior could "come out of left field", too. 

How do you like them apples?🤣

34 minutes ago, Callista said:

Come and share your speculations on Episode 4 instead. 🙂

I've been sharing my speculations in this thread for two years, thank you 😊

Edited April 30, 2019 by Happy Harpy

[BadAssRobinArryn]

9 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

The post about Arya killing the Night King from several months ago was legit. It even had Lyanna becoming a White Walker and Theon dying as he charged the Night King. The same poster has said that Jon kills Dany, though he didn't see the scene himself, only heard about it from a friend. 

And he said that they may have shot fake scenes. And Emilia Clarke openly stated that she shot a fake scene. In fact, she said that the last scene she shot was a fake one, meaning that it must have happened during the Shooting of a very late episode. She may have lied, of Course. But did she really have a reason? At that point no Major spoiler regarding Dany was out?

And the part of the fake scenes is indirectly confirmed by the polnish actor who is quoted in the newspaper article, that they shot three different versions of Jamie in the BoW: One where he survives, one where he is wounded and the fate unclear and one where he dies. In combination with the leaks from Watchersonmyballs, who otherwise gave correct information but claimed that Jaime died in Brienne's arms, this is very believable.

[Wouter]

16 hours ago, Umbelina said:

I DO think it was foreshadowed that Arya would kill the NK, certainly in the books, and in many ways in the show as well. 

As others have stated, the NK doesn't exist in the books. There are only Others (White Walkers for freefolk, and in the show) and Wights. There is some talk about "the Great Other", but it is only Melisandre who mentions him as a satanic/godly counterpart to the lord of light. The Night King in the books is a (semi-)mythical figure, a lord commander of the NW who was enthralled by the Others to essentially fight for them. He was killed by the then Lord Stark, a looooong time ago.

Now, in the show there has been subtle foreshadowing of Arya killing the NK. But in the books? Even if there would be a similar figure who would take the entire undead army with him if he was killed, Arya's book strengths are primarly excellent observation skills, resourcefullnes (for killing, among other uses) and "water dancing". I don't see her as part of a pitched battle against the undead, which seems to call for heavily armoured knights, another style of fighting. I think Arya is much more useful against human enemies, in the books. Wights are different in the books as well, far slower but also without a vulnerability to an instant-kill weapon (dragonglass works on Others in the books, but is only a sharp glass against wights), except fire.

11 hours ago, Oscirus said:

No idea why people don't believe that Jon could kill Dany when this season has been all about setting up Jon vs Dany hell that's all the previews have been about.

If the trial were to happen ( and that's a big if) I see Tyrion being put up for treason for backing Dany over Jon, not really betraying anybody. That being said, Tyrion has had quite a few stare downs not just with Bran but even with a red priestess 

for me to believe that he's just summarily caught and executed. I just think there's a bigger plan for  him than that. Still think theres something to Tyrion and Sansa , way too many hints from not just this season but previous for it not to be a smokescreen.

That meeting stood out to me as well. There's still no explanation why the Red Priestess focused (in a Bran-like way) on Tyrion. In the books, one of the Red Priests (Moqorro) also takes a keen interest in Tyrion, for reasons not yet known.

2 among many possibilities: Tyrion has dragonblood, or Tyrion will betray their saviour (Dany).

Tyrion was already instrumental in bringing Jon and Dany together, which could also count for something, I suppose.

7 hours ago, Eyes High said:

I don't know what's going to happen with Tyrion/Sansa, but there's definitely something going on. The only storyline they have apart from Dany drama in S8 is each other. It seems to me that the whole point of that 8x03 subplot was to get Sansa and Tyrion to a place where they would have that capital-m Moment in the crypts.  There were a thousand ways to write the crypts sequence--and Tyrion didn't even strictly need to be down there in the first place--and that's the way they picked: a whole minute of Sansa and Tyrion gazing into each other's eyes, holding hands, and Tyrion kissing Sansa's hand. 

None of the BTS videos or cast interviews said anything about Tyrion and Sansa's little moment in the crypts, even though it's one of the most dramatic scenes of the episode. That may mean that it's too spoilery to talk about, and I find that very interesting. We'll see if there's any follow up in 8x04, or whether the characters just act as if it never happened. To be fair, Theon and Sansa had a sweet moment in 8x02, and that certainly didn't last, either. 

On another note, it looks like there's going to be a big, drunken "We didn't die!" party in 8x04: there's a shot of Dany in a red outfit raising her cup and being cheered by a hall full of rowdy Northerners at night. (Lord Royce is one of the people leaping to his feet to cheer Dany, notably.) Interestingly, the chairs next to her at the head table (which in previous episodes were occupied by Jon and Sansa) are empty.

Seems like the North and the Valemen are accepting Dany. One wonders where all the survivors (like lord Royce) are coming from, that corner or tower of the castle must have been the actual safest place to be while everything else was swarmed with wights (which nevertheless failed to kill named characters). AFAIK, the crypts were breached by attacking wights (from the NK's original army) rather than by corpses pre-buried there.

Hannay Murray probably did reference this Tyrion-Sansa scene when she mentioned she liked them as a couple. She was there to witness it, after all, and she may not know what happens after.

So, maybe Friki is right and all this is part of the betrayal plot (with Sansa and Tyrion turning on one another), or GRRM has a reason to revive the marriage. It's hard to imagine book-Sansa ever feeling the same for book-Tyrion, though.

4 hours ago, Eyes High said:

Even assuming that these leaks are bullshit, we know that KL gets roasted by dragonfire judging from the type of burns we saw on the KL exterior set (from the top, as opposed to wildfire burns which would be from the bottom), and we now know that it ain't Viserion dragonfire...so unless the dragons go berserk, it is all but confirmed that Dany unleashes Drogon on KL, and the implications of that are really not good.

We also "knew" that Winterfell would get burned to the ground, until a couple of days ago. KL certainly takes fire damage, but are we really sure if will burn completely? Or will Dany simply burn/destroy the walls and watchtowers to allow her troops to march in while demoralising the enemy forces? That might well cause a catastrophic fire (it should, I guess, in a city so full of burnable material), but then Cersei blew up the sept of Baelor and most of KL survived.

4 hours ago, Eyes High said:

I think the leaker also posted on another account under a throwaway (not sure if it's the same leaker) that Sansa and Tyrion scheme together against Dany, that Sansa strings Tyrion along with promises of ruling together and then doublecrosses him to claim it all. (On the other hand, I thought this leaker said that Tyrion ends up on Bran's council, so...?) There's something important for the plot about that Sansa/Tyrion moment in the crypts, so who knows? I don't think Sansa was playing Tyrion with her talk about his divided loyalties and dangling their marriage as a carrot to get Tyrion to switch sides, but you never know.

Both Sansa and Tyrion had every reason to believe they were going to die, very shortly. Not the time and place to plot and scheme for a future you don't think you have anymore.

2 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

These leaks sound like bullshit.  We've had too many bullshit ones this year already...

I agree, I don't know why so many people take them as gospel ATM. One detail about Viserion may be a lucky guess or some involvement in the CGI, without more knowledge.

1 hour ago, WindyNights said:

Arya single-handedly made the dragons almost irrelevant to the White Walkers' defeat.

Also made all this Prince That Was Promised stuff into a red herring. 

I didn't find it bad but felt it was anti-climatic.

It did feel anti-climatic, especially with regards to Bran ("only you can defeat the NK" - Jojen), Jon (he was brought back to life, only to come up short and late for the NK) and the dragons (who were merely a mild speedbump for the NK, as everything in Winterfell short of Bran-the-target and Arya). If only Bran, Arya and a handfull of northern soldiers had been manning Winterfell, the outcome could easily have been the same, especially if Arya would have simply hid in the trees beforehand.

At the bright side, I think it is fitting that the WW get defeated at Winterfell, the castle that was seemingly constructed for that reason (and has the name to go with it). Winterfell has fallen enough to human enemies.

I don't think it's Martin's intention to have the Others go all the way to KL. Stopping them at Winterfell does not mean the threat was trivial, especially given that the undead army gets stronger with each battle.

In the show, the north may well be relatively spared if the NK marched more or less straigth from Eastwatch over Last Hearth to Winterfell. No reason for him to have attacked lord Glovers holding if this wasn't on his way (he could do at his leisure after winning at Winterfell). White Harbor probably survived unscathed, as well. The Umbers and the Mormonts were not so lucky, however.

1 hour ago, Callista said:

I'm really more interested in Episode 4 at the moment than all these new "leaks." For instance, do you guys think the Golden Company will appear in this episode and attack...I don't know, Dany's fleet? Winterfell? And is Euron proposing marriage to Cersei in that scene in the trailer? Or just being his usual pseudo-romantic self?  Am also wondering if Euron will betray Cersei at some point, or Cersei betray him.

It would be the moment for Cersei to sent her army north. It was her stated plan, face the survivors of the battle between NK and Dany/Jon. She could gamble on Dany's dragons being hurt or killed in the fight, the only way for the GC to win a battle in the field.

If not, she may prefer to keep the GC in KL to man the walls, while using the populace as a human shield against the dragons.

[aprilbabe]

10 minutes ago, BadAssRobinArryn said:

And he said that they may have shot fake scenes. And Emilia Clarke openly stated that she shot a fake scene. In fact, she said that the last scene she shot was a fake one, meaning that it must have happened during the Shooting of a very late episode. She may have lied, of Course. But did she really have a reason? At that point no Major spoiler regarding Dany was out?

And the part of the fake scenes is indirectly confirmed by the polnish actor who is quoted in the newspaper article, that they shot three different versions of Jamie in the BoW: One where he survives, one where he is wounded and the fate unclear and one where he dies. In combination with the leaks from Watchersonmyballs, who otherwise gave correct information but claimed that Jaime died in Brienne's arms, this is very believable.

It would make sense in regards to fake scenes. Would make sense why from that one leak, they originally thought Jon and Dany lived and then changed it dany dies. Which ones real? Who knows.

[Bannon]

If Dany or Jon or somebody never figure out that one of the best uses of a dragon is to simply provide aerial recon from 7 or 8 thousand feet, that'll be worthy of yet another eyeroll.

[LadyChaos]

56 minutes ago, GraceK said:

Rhaegal is injured. That’s Rhaegal she’s nuzzling in the preview. Rhaegal is the one who fell in battle with Viserion , he has the hole in his wing. She may have favored Drogon but she’s loves them both . 

yes but i the preview its the bigger dragon with the hole in the wings.  Drogon is bigger.

[Minneapple]

36 minutes ago, BadAssRobinArryn said:

And he said that they may have shot fake scenes. And Emilia Clarke openly stated that she shot a fake scene. In fact, she said that the last scene she shot was a fake one, meaning that it must have happened during the Shooting of a very late episode. She may have lied, of Course. But did she really have a reason? At that point no Major spoiler regarding Dany was out?

Yeah, but clearly none of the other stuff in that leaker's post was fake. The only thing he said was that he heard secondhand that Jon kills Dany and he straight up admitted it may have been a fake scene.

Emilia may have lied at the behest of HBO. The actors have been lying left and right. Maisie said Arya is asexual. Joe Dempsie said all kinds of misleading stuff about Arya and Gendry.

Shrug. There's no law that says anyone has to believe the leaks. I tend to think that some are accurate and some not. It honestly seems like they cast people based on how much they don't know about the show. Don't know anything? YOU CAN BE AN EXTRA!

But the possibility of Dany inheriting Aerys' madness, of Jon or Dany going off to be solitary -- these have been theories forever, so let's not act like it's some crazy new idea that D&D just thought up yesterday. IT SOUNDS LIKE BAD FANFIC! Well, yeah, the show is basically fanfic. It's a derivative work. Expensive derivative work, but derivative nonetheless. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by Minneapple

[YaddaYadda]

42 minutes ago, Wouter said:

I don't think it's Martin's intention to have the Others go all the way to KL. Stopping them at Winterfell does not mean the threat was trivial, especially given that the undead army gets stronger with each battle.

I think they'll at least cross the Trident. It doesn't mean that the winter won't once again end at Winterfell, if the first Long Night ended there. 

[BadAssRobinArryn]

11 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

Yeah, but clearly none of the other stuff in that leaker's post was fake. The only thing he said was that he heard secondhand that Jon kills Dany and he straight up admitted it may have been a fake scene. 

Yes, but as you said, he mentioned the fake scene directly in context with the Dany spoiler. And he said this was the information he was least sure about, because even his source only heard about it and wasn't around personally! 

Edited April 30, 2019 by BadAssRobinArryn

[Minneapple]

12 minutes ago, BadAssRobinArryn said:

Yes, but as you said, he mentioned the fake scene directly in context with the Dany spoiler. And he said this was the information he was least sure about, because even his source only heard about it and wasn't around personally! 

Yeah. It could have been fake. Anything is possible. But I think the story has been moving toward Jon vs. Dany for awhile, so it wouldn't surprise me if it was true.

[WindyNights]

2 hours ago, Jextella said:

Thanks.  I had read this but still, why Bran...why Anakin?

Just luck of the draw?

Pretty much just luck of the draw. I mean in the books, all his siblings are wargs even Jon so it must be somewhat genetic but Bran seems to be the only one born a greenseer which is why the Three Eyed Raven is interested in him.

[Happy Harpy]

54 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

But the possibility of Dany inheriting Aerys' madness, of Jon or Dany going off to be solitary -- these have been theories forever, so let's not act like it's some crazy new idea that D&D just thought up yesterday. IT SOUNDS LIKE BAD FANFIC!

The so-called leaks are fanfic and wishful thinking, but it doesn't mean the theories they support come out of nowhere. Fleaks have a common point, they always "make sense" and cater to a part of the fandom; real leaks like Awaysforthelads' don't, they're different in a very subtle way. Had one of those given extremely bold or original particular details like "Lyanna Mormont kills a giant" then it would be some kind of proof now; but everything I've seen is in the range of your typical educated guesses. It's like the lottery, some are luckier than others.

I only gave some credit to the people who had hard evidence of intel or a track record (WoMB, BSB; Frikidoctor) and relied only on filming info, and yet as soon as one steps away from those pure facts, everything goes off base. It's because those facts are too disconnected and we have no context at all. For example I (and others) thought that Cogman was playing coy with the "final battle" in 8x03: I knew there would be other battles on the show because there's another one in 8x05, and a naval battle, too, was filmed outside. Turns out, it was indeed the final AOTD battle (unless Qyburn played apprenti sorcerer and re-created some wights from some Dumb Cunt 2 parts he somehow retrived, LOL). So I'm not going to take the word of a nobody with no track record and no proof, not after the 999 trolls of the off-season.

The theories themselves are another business. One would have to be soft in the head to have missed the Mad Kweeeen Dany "foreshadowing" after watching S7. It was as subtle as, let's say, the Jon vs NK showdown "foreshadowing"...see what I mean? I don't believe in this particular one for reasons I stated upthread (show vs tell re: Daenerys' behavior) more than I believed the SaNsADiEs fleaks during the off season. It doesn't mean those theories aren't out there, like any other speculation.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Happy Harpy

[Moxie Cat]

19 hours ago, SeanC said:

It looks like there are some funereal burnings next week.  Be interested to see if Alfie Allen, Iain Glen or Bella Ramsey get that corpse money, which would also conveniently push any of those that do to the four episode count necessary to count for the SAG ensemble nomination roster.

It looks like you are correct: Iain Glen confirms he filmed the funeral pyre scene:

https://ew.com/tv/2019/04/30/game-of-thrones-ser-jorah-battle-interview/

[Minneapple]

1 hour ago, Happy Harpy said:

For example I (and others) thought that Cogman was playing coy with the "final battle" in 8x03: I knew there would be other battled on the show because there's another one in 8x05, and a naval battle, too, was filmed outside.

Well yeah. Who the hell thought the final battle would be in the third episode of the season? Is it someone who has never watched TV before? What else were they going to do in this, the final season of a show that prides itself on big dragon effects, for the last three episodes? Stand around talking about a small council? Of course there will be more battles and dragons fucking shit up and more people dying. 

[SeanC]

1 hour ago, Moxie Cat said:

It looks like you are correct: Iain Glen confirms he filmed the funeral pyre scene:

https://ew.com/tv/2019/04/30/game-of-thrones-ser-jorah-battle-interview/

I figure that Glen and Allen are the most likely to get it, being series regulars and the ones whose deaths would most likely be the basis for some reaction from important surviving characters.

I mentioned a while ago that Arya/Daenerys and Arya/Tyrion are two of the more notable character interactions we haven't seen yet, at least in terms of meaningful dialogue exchanges (they've been in the same scene already).  Thinking further along those lines, the most notable ones I came up with were both Stark sisters and Sam.

Edited April 30, 2019 by SeanC

[Morrigan2575]

Oh man, now I'm going to be all emotional with the funerals 😭

[Wouter]

2 hours ago, YaddaYadda said:

I think they'll at least cross the Trident. It doesn't mean that the winter won't once again end at Winterfell, if the first Long Night ended there. 

Possibly, Dany's dream in ACOK shows an army armored in ice crossing the trident, to be destroyed by her dragons. However, this dream contains elements of the Rhaegar/Robert battle and may not be literal.

2 hours ago, Minneapple said:

Yeah. It could have been fake. Anything is possible. But I think the story has been moving toward Jon vs. Dany for awhile, so it wouldn't surprise me if it was true.

For me, it seems the story is moving towards Jon and Dany marriage and co-ruling, unless one or both don't make it.