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S05.E13: Steven and Justin's Story, Part 1


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12 minutes ago, meow-mah-leg said:

Curious; would it be possible for a nurse to bring Steven a bucket with hot water, soap and a rag and tell him to clean up his own spilled piss? I really don't understand why a nurse should have to do this. This is not her job. 

That would have been the logical thing to do. Sadly, urine is a bodily fluid and has to be cleaned up by someone trained in biohazard protcol. I wish they could have left it there and made him deal with it. You know he did it on  purpose.

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There is no reason we need to see any of these people naked, getting 'hosed down' or going to the bathroom. It is clear how fat they are, the mere fact that they are on My 600 pound life would tell us that. The purpose is to shame the person for seeking medical help, and to give the TLC audience something to laugh at. I fast forward thru these scenes because there is no good reason for showing these people naked or to see someone having to clean their genitals. There are also many people with disabilities who require help bathing and tolieting, and we wouldn't dream of robbing their dignity by showing it on TV. 

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26 minutes ago, Madding crowd said:

The goal of the show is to present a modern day freak show.

This is exactly right, it is nothing more.  

I am new to this show and watched maybe 5 stories last year and the 2 current horrors.  I originally thought I would see the HUGE transition they would make down to a normal weight.  I see how wrong I was now!  

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1 hour ago, Supermom23 said:

When Steven wasn't answering his phone and Princess keyed into his apartment, was anyone else whispering "Please be dead... please be dead... please be dead"? 

Sad to say yes I was.

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1 minute ago, wings707 said:

This is exactly right, it is nothing more.  

I am new to this show and watched maybe 5 stories last year and the 2 current horrors.  I originally thought I would see the HUGE transition they would make down to a normal weight.  I see how wrong I was now!  

Go back to some earlier episodes...and some Where Are They Now's...you'll see that some of them have made some really amazing transformations. Some of the earlier ones (season 1 I think) follow them for a lot longer - like a year or two after surgery and you really see them make some progress. It's really gone down a rabbit shithole lately.

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1 hour ago, Miss Chevious said:

 

I really don't care what happens to him. He can stuff himself until he explodes and I actually hope he does.

Think of the poor slobs who would have to shovel up the detritus. Maybe we could assign it to all the clueless, stubborn enablers. 

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1 hour ago, meow-mah-leg said:

It annoyed me when Steven got out of the hospital and got a pizza. Dad says: "can I have a slice? I haven't eaten since 6 this morning". And Steven says "no". WTF do you mean NO? you selfish piece of shit! 

But why didn't dad just help himself to the pizza he paid for? I don't get these wimpy enablers. Let the jackass scream himself into a heart attack. 

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8 minutes ago, atiyah9369 said:

 

1 hour ago, Supermom23 said:

When Steven wasn't answering his phone and Princess keyed into his apartment, was anyone else whispering "Please be dead... please be dead... please be dead"? 

Sad to say yes I was.

 

I said the same thing in the live chat last night. I have never rooted for failure in these patients until the last few episodes. 

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47 minutes ago, scoopski potata said:

No names or any identifying factors (which I'm not saying this person has provided, I'm just clarifying that anything that could be used to identify the patient, not just the name, is technically arguable as a violation). If doctors and nurses are breaching confidentiality about patients to other drs and nurses who aren't authorized to know info about said patients...not really legal. It happens, but it's a HIPAA violation. Just to be clear. 

It happens every day but you're correct.  It reminds me of a situation I remember happening where a patient heard lab personel discussing their diagnosis that was on their paperwork.  Nobody was fired but the ethics were discussed heavily by staff.  But.  I did talk to my husband about what happened during my day at work sometimes - jerk patients,  doctors who sometimes screwed up. One of my best friends is an EMT and sometimes we talk shop. Meh, I'm rambling, but you're correct in the letter of the regulation just maybe not the black and white rigid  application.  

Edited by bubbly
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9 minutes ago, todd said:

If I ever flipped off my dad like Stephen did.................it would have been bad. I wouldn't have been able to eat pizza for awhile hahhahhaha.

That whole thing was so disgusting on every level. His dad should have opened the pizza box and taken what he wanted before he handed it to that nasty behemoth. But, it sure illustrated how twisted the dynamics are in the family.

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25 minutes ago, todd said:

I dont think they do it to shame, it is what it is. I doubt they tell him or anyone else to take their clothes off.

I can't think of any other shows which film people naked, going to the bathroom or getting washed up. What is the reason if it's not to shame the person? 

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39 minutes ago, Madding crowd said:

I am feeling like I shouldn't watch this show anymore. I am not seeing how anyone is learning anything or making any real changes in their life. Putting a food addict in an apartment with no stimulation or reason to live is going to guarantee they won't lose weight. I'm not saying I know what the answer is-I do know that a person sitting around mostly alone 24/7 is going to keep eating. I also. Have suspected for awhile that many scenes on the show are scripted. Steven was in the in the hospital for many months and only became abusive and pushed the call button towards the end. Why? What happened the last month that didn't happen the first few?

It also seemed obvious to me to Steven and his brother had developmental and mental issues. Justin acted like a child, complete with playing with toys and making no effort to support himself, lose weight, make friends etc. I guess the father was either paid to play the part of the patsy on the show, or is trying to make up for something that happened in the guys childhood or both.

Yeah, leaving him in an apartment by himself seemed like a recipe for disaster. But him not being by himself requires some other poor soul to be with him, which also seems to end badly. I thought that Steven was on good behavior for a couple of months in the hospital, then became abusive. That actually doesn't seem all that surprising to me. Some kids with psychological/behavioral disorders can be sweet during the "honeymoon phase" but then when they become comfortable with a situation, or the adults start to thwart their manipulation, all hell breaks loose. Could be something similar happening here, though perhaps TLC fudged the timeline a bit.

With regard to developmental and mental issues, upthread someone mentioned FAS (Fetal Alcohol Syndrome). I'm not seeing the distinctive facial characteristics in the brothers' faces, but I think it is easier to recognize in children, and the brothers' weight may make it harder to spot. There is no conclusive test for FAS, but there is a genetic test for Prader-Willi syndrome, which is associated with extreme overeating, low muscle tone, cognitive impairment, and behavior issues. I assume that patients on this show would have been tested for Prader-Willi somewhere along the line, probably before they reached Dr. Now.

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1 hour ago, operalover said:

I don't understand the father ordering him pizza from a thousand miles away. What does he think Steven is there for?  He thinks that Steven will kill himself if he doesn't order the pizza- that is how far these people go to manipulate. If the kid (kid!) dies he will feel guilty. But really he should feel guilty for not parenting this guy - never giving limits, always giving in to him. I loved how Dr. Na did not give in and kicked him out of the hospital. Those poor nurses- they are not there to wait on him hand and foot. The whole thing is a nightmare. 

I would deny him the pizza and cross my fingers LOL

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2 hours ago, POPTARTIN said:

Lurker on many boards, first post.

With everything said about Dr.Now and shouldn't have let him be a patient, he is totally in this for the viewers and rating himself and saw nothing but viewers and ratings for him with this case.

I live in the Houston area and my mom works in healthcare, and has worked with Dr.Now. Shes on the admin side so sees all their licenses/lawsuits/reviews, gets their hospital privileges  and everything and he is no saint. He is known to only take the bigger people who should not have the surgery due to their risks. This show is such a cash cow for him. Many many people have died on the table and during his treatments than ever should, most due to they should have never even been close to the OR or the crazy diets he puts in place. He definitely has a reputation in Houston and the med center of what kind of doctor he is, how hard he is to work with and for, and generally just not a great person. I wouldn't let him touch my dog. 

Wow...now THIS I didn't know.  I did a little reading on his personal life, and it didn't seem like he was much of a husband, but this...???

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Prior to retiring my sister was a nursing home administrator in Texas.  She said they had a few very large patients who were sent there by the hospital because they could not return home but didn't require hospital care.  She stated they could only manage a limited number because of the number of staff required to assist larger residents.  She stated although many could not leave their rooms and were on low calorie diets they routinely manipulated older residents into bringing them left over food.  She said it was a real strain on the staff.  Special beds and harnesses were required for lifting for bathing and turning.  They only had a few and could not accept a new resident without such special equipment designed for larger people.  

She said what she saw over the years were more and more larger individuals at younger ages being admitted with nothing else wrong with them other than their size.  Often times she said family members who were caretakers just couldn't perform the task any longer from mental fatigue to physical problems from not having the skill to deal with the weight of the individual.  She also stated that those same family members would often bring dozens of donuts, pizza, and other foods to the person knowing they were in a nursing home because of their weight.  She said they seemed to believe bringing such foods equaled love and would comment as the person was losing weight they were just wasting away.  When I asked her who paid their bills she said the cost was paid by the state.  I asked her how long could they live like that and she stated with the right care a long time.  

I believe Steven will eventually become if not already a ward of the state living in a nursing home.  She also said it's not that easy to just put them out because of their size.  She said it's not like their families can just load them up and drive away and most families refuse to take them once they have been admitted to a nursing home. 

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I don't agree- if the person is confined to bed and requires a caregiver, if Dr Now weighs them in at 700 pounds, if they tell their entire life story-we know they are big. Has anyone looked at the shower scenes and posted anything but derogatory comments? I can't think of any that weren't of the " OMG did you see them getting hosed down like an animal" kind. This is exactly what the show wants.

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13 hours ago, Dru Blood said:

I am glad they did THAT, but why not prosecute this dung heap?  What he is doing is straight up abuse.  I know damn well the legal system in Texas DOES NOT PLAY!

What do they do with him physically, though?   What place could they hold him?

5 hours ago, Elizabeth9 said:

Any other Intervention fans think we need to bring in some of those folks for this show????  

I haven't seen much of this episode yet, but I'm thinking it should have been shown on ID, as an episode of Evil Lives Here.  Steven is as bad as a lot of those, just less mobile.

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3 hours ago, Ivylady said:

Steven Sr. needs to get to the "if he dies, he dies" stage soon, or Steven Jr. will be the death of him.

You cannot lift an addict up.  They can only bring you down.

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29 minutes ago, lovesnark said:

That whole thing was so disgusting on every level. His dad should have opened the pizza box and taken what he wanted before he handed it to that nasty behemoth. But, it sure illustrated how twisted the dynamics are in the family.

He should have taken the whole pizza.  Eat a slice or two if he's hungry, then throw the rest away.

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I do find the shower scenes helpful in understanding what it's like to be unable to do simple basic thing like taking a shower without massive pain and discomfort. Also seeing how hard it is for them to reach and clean themselves...they always need brushes on long sticks and have a hard time washing their hair because it's difficult to lift their arms etc. How would I understand all this if they wouldn't show it? 

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1 hour ago, scoopski potata said:

No names or any identifying factors (which I'm not saying this person has provided, I'm just clarifying that anything that could be used to identify the patient, not just the name, is technically arguable as a violation). If doctors and nurses are breaching confidentiality about patients to other drs and nurses who aren't authorized to know info about said patients...not really legal. It happens, but it's a HIPAA violation. Just to be clear. 

But this person wasn't talking about the PATIENTS...she was talking about Dr. Now, and how he treats staff and family.

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7 minutes ago, 55Unicorns said:

But this person wasn't talking about the PATIENTS...she was talking about Dr. Now, and how he treats staff and family.

The post I was addressing was referring to posts talking about the original poster's mother releasing confidential information in general and the mother's access to patient records etc. The first comment suggested that the mother's access to all information ought to, perhaps, remain confidential. The next post then said as long as there were no names...that was what I was referencing and clarifying. 

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3 hours ago, Michael Stabosz said:

I don't know why Dr. Now keeps doing the show.

I read one of the documents from Dr Now's divorce. He claimed to be retired (this was maybe 2008?), which he was not. Things did not go his way. I'm thinking that, even though he is still operating, he is getting older. He probably doesn't have as heavy a surgical schedule as he did in his younger days. He's lost money to the ex-wife. Reality TV brings in decent money that doesn't require him to be in the OR all day.  Shoot, I'd do it.

And to be fair, I don't know if other bariatric surgeons have started to operate on people this big. If he is still the only, or one of the only, doctors doing this, I do think he wants to help those who will die otherwise. So there's that. My stepfather died from lung cancer. He kept his law practice up as long as possible, 1) to bring in money and 2) to make sure his clients had representation until he couldn't do it any more. He was practically bed-ridden before he admitted he had to close his practice.

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10 minutes ago, 55Unicorns said:

But this person wasn't talking about the PATIENTS...she was talking about Dr. Now, and how he treats staff and family.

this 100%. I don't know anything about the patients nor does she, just him and his reputation. Legal stuff as far as how many lawsuits, deaths, and complains he has I don't know exact details/numbers because that is something she wont tell me since that could violate ethics and protocols she has. You can google his name and see some of it, so not exactly huge secrets. I would never repeat anything to ruin her career. There are tons and tons of hospitals in Houston so not identifying at all. He is known to be a huge jerk, I agree to a point need to be stern with patients, but as far as how he treats the nurses, other doctors, and all other hospital staff truly says a lot about his character. He is not a nice man. Hospital privileges are not just a given, he has to apply and they look into his past and records before he will get these. Due to that and the cases he is known to take many hospitals will not grant him that because it is a liability. 

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1 minute ago, POPTARTIN said:

this 100%. I don't know anything about the patients nor does she, just him and his reputation. Legal stuff as far as how many lawsuits, deaths, and complains he has I don't know exact details/numbers because that is something she wont tell me since that could violate ethics and protocols she has. You can google his name and see some of it, so not exactly huge secrets. I would never repeat anything to ruin her career. There are tons and tons of hospitals in Houston so not identifying at all. He is known to be a huge jerk, I agree to a point need to be stern with patients, but as far as how he treats the nurses, other doctors, and all other hospital staff truly says a lot about his character. He is not a nice man. Hospital privileges are not just a given, he has to apply and they look into his past and records before he will get these. Due to that and the cases he is known to take many hospitals will not grant him that because it is a liability. 

That was the part I was interested in.  From the little I know, from online searches, he might be great with the patients, but he doesn't seem very nice to his family.

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40 minutes ago, Madding crowd said:

I don't agree- if the person is confined to bed and requires a caregiver, if Dr Now weighs them in at 700 pounds, if they tell their entire life story-we know they are big. Has anyone looked at the shower scenes and posted anything but derogatory comments? I can't think of any that weren't of the " OMG did you see them getting hosed down like an animal" kind. This is exactly what the show wants.

I think the one thing that needs to be said is that while TLC is well known for exploitation, this show specifically deals with adults.  Adults choose to be on this show. They have made the decision to be naked and shown doing certain things. Nobody forced them.

Some of these adults have also chosen to include their minor children.  There is where I have a huge problem.  Not only are they are national television, their lives off tv are nightmares and imo be child abuse and neglect.

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30 minutes ago, Kid said:

You cannot lift an addict up.  They can only bring you down.

Steven was pretty bad--his pain was so fake I got a headache from rolling my eyes. A 9? A 9 out of 10? Anyone in a 9 out of 10 would be writhing in pain, not giggling. Fucking douche. And the "Stevens" of the world make it difficult for people with legitimate reasons for pain meds to acquire them, even at the pharmacy. A couple years ago I had dental surgery and 5 different pharmacies said I'd have to wait a day for the meds--meanwhile, I'm practically bleeding onto their counter from my mouth that was just operated on. Thanks a lot, Steven. 

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1 hour ago, bubbly said:

As long as no names are used confidentiality isn't technically breached. Doctors and nurses talk amongst ourselves all the time because we're human.

Of course you're human! I would expect a little gossip among colleagues.  A juicy tidbit here and there always brightens my day!!

But -

This woman works with Dr. Now, has access to his "lawsuits / licenses /reviews / privileges /" and access to how many patients were lost on the operating table. This is confidential to her position. If she's talking to her coworkers, that's one thing.  But she's coming home and telling her daughter. Who, in turn, is posting about them on a public forum.

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Folks, let's take the discussion of Dr. Now's behavior, reputation, etc. to the Dr. Now: Savior or Surgeon thread.  This is the Steven and Justin Part 1 topic.  They gave us plenty to talk about, including Dr. Now's interactions with them during this episode, pizza battles, moss growth and broken bed frames.   Thanks! 

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For past guests, for Randy from a season or so ago the way the show played out was not entirely true.  Not all the scenes are staged and edited to make these people look horrible. He was enabled his entire life and still is, his entire family is obese. His father that was on the show with him lost weight just prior to the show. His sisters that were on the show, the bigger one has been that way her whole life and to this day would still be considered obese. His child on the show isn't even known to be his from what I've been told as his first wife couldn't get pregnant and did immediately after she left him. And his new gf was known as a cheater and then got pregnant.  He did not take proper care of himself throughout the process (his eating, exercise, medicine, follow ups)why he ended up in the hospital for months at one point. The house shown on the show has about 10 people living in it. His parents, little sister & her husband, other sister & husband, their 2/3 kids, his brother has a daughter the parents raise that lives there and maybe a 4 bedroom house. The whole family needs therapy like in intervention with they all get sent to Betty Ford for all the co-dependency. 

I can try and answer anything else as far as his story that I can, and can definitely email or something some proof if need to be for backup. Just don't want to blast personal stuff all over.

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Just now, Hockeymom said:

Of course you're human! I would expect a little gossip among colleagues.  A juicy tidbit here and there always brightens my day!!

But -

This woman works with Dr. Now, has access to his "lawsuits / licenses /reviews / privileges /" and access to how many patients were lost on the operating table. This is confidential to her position. If she's talking to her coworkers, that's one thing.  But she's coming home and telling her daughter. Who, in turn, is posting about them on a public forum.

I see what you're saying totally :)

In the case of deaths, they're public record, so as long as the poster is careful to avoid overly specific info I'd think it would be ok. Anywhoo, this is the internet and you never really know if people are who they say they are - this could  just be someone posting for attention.  I've learned to keep my salt shaker on hand when I hop online and to sprinkle its contents liberally when I surf.

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10 minutes ago, Hockeymom said:

Of course you're human! I would expect a little gossip among colleagues.  A juicy tidbit here and there always brightens my day!!

But -

This woman works with Dr. Now, has access to his "lawsuits / licenses /reviews / privileges /" and access to how many patients were lost on the operating table. This is confidential to her position. If she's talking to her coworkers, that's one thing.  But she's coming home and telling her daughter. Who, in turn, is posting about them on a public forum.

And none of that is posted, as even I don't know exacts except it has happened, and can google that and see as well. She has never personally worked with him as he wasn't given access at the hospital. Has met him a few times though in passing.  I know its happened and all I know. His demeanor and personality isn't confidential at all as he blasts that on cable tv. Absolutely nothing confidential has been said, nor does she come home and tell me rather than when its been on TV will make comments should see him irl at the hospital talking to people. 

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Folks, let's take a gander at the mod note above (in a resplendent goldenrod) and move non-episode-specific discussions of Dr. Now to his thread.  Discussions of prior participants also belong on the thread for that topic.  Don't make kitty have to glare at you!  

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1 hour ago, Madding crowd said:

I can't think of any other shows which film people naked, going to the bathroom or getting washed up. What is the reason if it's not to shame the person? 

What about Naked and Afraid?

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3 hours ago, POPTARTIN said:

and has worked with Dr.Now. Shes on the admin side so sees all their licenses/lawsuits/reviews, gets their hospital privileges  and everything and he is no saint. He is known to only take the bigger people who should not have the surgery due to their risks. This show is such a cash cow for him. Many many people have died on the table and during his treatments than ever should,

Now she's never worked with him?

Edited by Hockeymom
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2 minutes ago, todd said:

What about Naked and Afraid?

I know I certainly put down the potato chips when I see the sad state of their bodies.  Scares me something fierce to see what we can do to ourselves. 

This reads a lot more bitchy than it sounded in my head.  In my head it just sounded  archly snarky.

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3 hours ago, POPTARTIN said:

Lurker on many boards, first post.

With everything said about Dr.Now and shouldn't have let him be a patient, he is totally in this for the viewers and rating himself and saw nothing but viewers and ratings for him with this case.

I live in the Houston area and my mom works in healthcare, and has worked with Dr.Now. Shes on the admin side so sees all their licenses/lawsuits/reviews, gets their hospital privileges  and everything and he is no saint. He is known to only take the bigger people who should not have the surgery due to their risks. This show is such a cash cow for him. Many many people have died on the table and during his treatments than ever should, most due to they should have never even been close to the OR or the crazy diets he puts in place. He definitely has a reputation in Houston and the med center of what kind of doctor he is, how hard he is to work with and for, and generally just not a great person. I wouldn't let him touch my dog. 

Yeah, he does seem sketchy, BUT.....his patients are the highest of high risk. The already have one foot in the grave. Most Docs wont even touch patients this far gone......since they have a high probability of dying on the table. Bottom line......its their last last chance.

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I can't stop thinking about this episode. Steven is very different from anyone else we have EVER seen on this show. He is the first one I have thought is totally beyond saving, who will NEVER get better, who is doomed to die and die soon. It's not just that he has a bratty attitude (which he does, in spades), or that he won't let go of his addictions (which he won't). It's because he seems to lack the cognitive ability to change. He is definitely somehow mentally disabled, and it's not curable. I really think we are watching a man die. It is painful and sticking with me all day and I will be interested to see the second episode. 

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3 minutes ago, Hockeymom said:

Now she's never worked with him?

She medical staff on the admin side. He's applied for privileges at her hospital so in that sense worked with him. With they apply, she has to look at his background etc.  She is not a nurse, doctor, custodian so has never personally hands on worked with him. 

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4 minutes ago, ClareWalks said:

I can't stop thinking about this episode. Steven is very different from anyone else we have EVER seen on this show. He is the first one I have thought is totally beyond saving, who will NEVER get better, who is doomed to die and die soon. It's not just that he has a bratty attitude (which he does, in spades), or that he won't let go of his addictions (which he won't). It's because he seems to lack the cognitive ability to change. He is definitely somehow mentally disabled, and it's not curable. I really think we are watching a man die. It is painful and sticking with me all day and I will be interested to see the second episode. 

I have no hope for this guy, either. I just don't have any empathy for him because he's refused to see a psychiatrist which might help address his mental issues. The temper tantrums, the child-like behavior combined with clever manipulation. IMO he was a complete waste of resources just to get some shock value. Someone else could have used the help.

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6 hours ago, Michael Stabosz said:

When Steven ordered the pizza in the Rhode Island hospital.... I want to know what was going on in the delivery guy's head.  Did he not think there was something fishy about delivering to a hospital patient's room?

Believe it or not, food is delivered to patient rooms all of the time. Family members order it the majority of the time but patients do as well. If a patient is 'on the floor' and not in an ICU, the nurses don't monitor it. If a patient is on a medically prescribed diet, the staff will put a sign on the door stating this info and asking for visitors to not bring the patient outside food. If the 'caller' specifies to the restaurant that the delivery person should just enter the room since the food is for 'the family' and not the patient and adds a tip to the total when the call is made, you can darn well bet the food is getting into that room and in the patients hands. 

These tricks are part of many patients pathology. 

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