In The Movies: Bette & Joan on the Big Screen

[Pete Martell]

I have to admit I find the Crawford screen persona fascinating, as, unlike Bette, who wanted the best but was also aware enough to know time passes for everyone, Joan tried to hang on and hang on and hang on. While I don't think it did her psyche much good, it leads many of her films and her public face, in some bizarre way, to be more modern to me (as pop culture today is littered with actors who just never seem to go away and never seem to know when they have aged out of the types of films or shows or music they want to make) than they often get credit for. A lot of her Warners films are pseudo-intellectual and "artistic" in that way many post-WWII films were, but they have some fascinating insights and some of them are a good watch, like Humoresque (moreso for the supporting players like Ruth Nelson and Oscar Levant than the leads as Joan's role in it is very sexist and predictable, although she does a good job with the repartee) or like Daisy Kenyon, where Joan plays a woman who feels more honest than you might expect - searching for things, tired, a working woman settled into an unhappy affair and now finding something new, something that doesn't seem hugely happy either, but is at least different to what she's already had. Ruth Warrick also gives a good performance as the wife of Joan's longtime lover. It's a slack picture but the only big complaint I have is the ending seemed incredibly rushed. The movies themselves don't matter as much to me as the Joan presence - I think she was at her acting and physical peak in these years. 

Torch Song is not good, and the blackface scene is...well it's offensive of course but also incredibly bizarre (and treated as bizarre by the director - it outcamps anything John Waters or Warhol could have done), but I enjoy her chemistry with Michael Wilding. Strait-Jacket is not that good either, but Joan commits to the role and is very watchable. It has a good "twist" to it and it's also fascinating to see that somehow even after all these years Joan is still playing an ingenue. Let's not talk about the wig...

Johnny Guitar is a riveting watch, and the chemistry between Joan and Mercedes McCambridge flies off the screen. I first saw them in a clip from Celluloid Closet and I knew I had to see more. I doubt Joan would have done as well as Barbara Stanwyck did but seeing her star in one of the main "Freudian" Westerns makes me wish she'd had a stab at The Furies - she would have given me a bit more entertainment.

Sudden Fear is one of her few later films that is actually very good, which is a credit to her, as she was heavily involved in making it after Paramount pushed her out. She is, of course, the ingenue, but it doesn't seem cloying and you can relate to her as she moves from one realization to another and struggles between remaining a decent human being and becoming the scum that her husband (a great performance by Jack Palance) has been. The final shots and the shot where she discovers his treachery are standouts.

[enoughcats]

The came The Dancing Lady and, wow, what a bunch of stars.  Then remind myself that the rich guy is Franchot Tone, who Joan married (and somewhere I read that Bette Davis also wanted to marry him) and he was so smooth and handsome.  Playing in the same movie as Clark Gable and Fred Astaire.  But the real not ready for prime time players were "Ted Healy and his stooges".  I think we all know someone who loves the Three Stooges (and we like that person well enough to tolerate their Stooge sense of humor.)  This is the movie to make them sit through and watch them discover the Stooges as stage hands, with all the Stooge-isms that they love.

Back to 'stuff'.  Joan Crawford was described as a Chlorine.  Boy, how long has it been since that word was even used.  Her lighter colored hair (no where near as brassy white-yellow as most of the chorus girls of that day).  The glorious picture of her may have been from the time of this film. Joan Crawford danced.  And danced and danced and got billing above Fred Astaire, who made her look good (but there was none of the complicated Astaire we later know.) 

We'll just say Joan's trip to Havana (?) with Franchot was morally ambiguous . 

With the talk of plastic surgery coming so much later, I zeroed in on a toss away phrase by one of the other chlorines, something like "Pretty soon we'll all have to get plastic surgery"  This was 1933.

[psychoticstate]

On 3/30/2017 at 0:36 PM, LilWharveyGal said:

I recorded Dead Ringer and just watched it for the first time.  "Enjoyable" probably isn't an appropriate word for such a morbid tale, but that's exactly what this movie was.  (The ominous harpsichord music kept cracking me up.)  Bette was great in both roles, and what a wonderful supporting cast of Karl Malden, Jean Hagen, and Peter Lawford.  And you're right, the jewels and dresses were great!

Me too!!  I watched it for the first time yesterday and man!  I loved it! It was certainly dark and I think we could figure what was going to happen to Bette but you still felt sorry for her. 

I do find it interesting that the script bounced around from 1944-ish until Bette agreed to do it in 1963.  And it was filmed in only a month and directed by her former co-star Paul Henreid.  The only quibble I have, if you want to call it that, is that I felt Edith and Margaret were meant to be around forty and not the actual age of the 15 years older Bette. 

Excellent entertainment though! 

5 hours ago, Pete Martell said:

I have to admit I find the Crawford screen persona fascinating, as, unlike Bette, who wanted the best but was also aware enough to know time passes for everyone, Joan tried to hang on and hang on and hang on. While I don't think it did her psyche much good, it leads many of her films and her public face, in some bizarre way, to be more modern to me (as pop culture today is littered with actors who just never seem to go away and never seem to know when they have aged out of the types of films or shows or music they want to make) than they often get credit for. A lot of her Warners films are pseudo-intellectual and "artistic" in that way many post-WWII films were, but they have some fascinating insights and some of them are a good watch, like Humoresque (moreso for the supporting players like Ruth Nelson and Oscar Levant than the leads as Joan's role in it is very sexist and predictable, although she does a good job with the repartee) or like Daisy Kenyon, where Joan plays a woman who feels more honest than you might expect - searching for things, tired, a working woman settled into an unhappy affair and now finding something new, something that doesn't seem hugely happy either, but is at least different to what she's already had. Ruth Warrick also gives a good performance as the wife of Joan's longtime lover. It's a slack picture but the only big complaint I have is the ending seemed incredibly rushed. The movies themselves don't matter as much to me as the Joan presence - I think she was at her acting and physical peak in these years. 

Torch Song is not good, and the blackface scene is...well it's offensive of course but also incredibly bizarre (and treated as bizarre by the director - it outcamps anything John Waters or Warhol could have done), but I enjoy her chemistry with Michael Wilding. Strait-Jacket is not that good either, but Joan commits to the role and is very watchable. It has a good "twist" to it and it's also fascinating to see that somehow even after all these years Joan is still playing an ingenue. Let's not talk about the wig...

Johnny Guitar is a riveting watch, and the chemistry between Joan and Mercedes McCambridge flies off the screen. I first saw them in a clip from Celluloid Closet and I knew I had to see more. I doubt Joan would have done as well as Barbara Stanwyck did but seeing her star in one of the main "Freudian" Westerns makes me wish she'd had a stab at The Furies - she would have given me a bit more entertainment.

Sudden Fear is one of her few later films that is actually very good, which is a credit to her, as she was heavily involved in making it after Paramount pushed her out. She is, of course, the ingenue, but it doesn't seem cloying and you can relate to her as she moves from one realization to another and struggles between remaining a decent human being and becoming the scum that her husband (a great performance by Jack Palance) has been. The final shots and the shot where she discovers his treachery are standouts.

Just responding to your first sentence - - I absolutely agree.  When Joan is on the screen, you simply can't take your eyes off her.  She doesn't even need to speak. (Not to say that Bette wasn't electrifying as well because she most certainly was.) 

Have you seen Autumn Leaves?  I find Joan's performance in it very touching and raw.   I also liked her in Flamingo Road, although the part of Lane should be someone in her late twenties or early thirties. I think she captured Lane's desire at wanting roots and feeling ostracized. 

One of my favorite Crawford performances is in one of her less known films, and with a co-star that I think is terribly underrated.  They All Kissed the Bride with Melvyn Douglas.  I do't think Joan herself thought it was any great shakes but she and Douglas have a wonderful chemistry together and Joan shines as the all-work MJ Drew.  She didn't do much straight up comedy, sadly, but she really does the part, originally meant for Carole Lombard, justice.  And she looks stunning doing it. 

5 hours ago, enoughcats said:

The came The Dancing Lady and, wow, what a bunch of stars.  Then remind myself that the rich guy is Franchot Tone, who Joan married (and somewhere I read that Bette Davis also wanted to marry him) and he was so smooth and handsome.  Playing in the same movie as Clark Gable and Fred Astaire.  But the real not ready for prime time players were "Ted Healy and his stooges".  I think we all know someone who loves the Three Stooges (and we like that person well enough to tolerate their Stooge sense of humor.)  This is the movie to make them sit through and watch them discover the Stooges as stage hands, with all the Stooge-isms that they love.

Back to 'stuff'.  Joan Crawford was described as a Chlorine.  Boy, how long has it been since that word was even used.  Her lighter colored hair (no where near as brassy white-yellow as most of the chorus girls of that day).  The glorious picture of her may have been from the time of this film. Joan Crawford danced.  And danced and danced and got billing above Fred Astaire, who made her look good (but there was none of the complicated Astaire we later know.) 

We'll just say Joan's trip to Havana (?) with Franchot was morally ambiguous . 

With the talk of plastic surgery coming so much later, I zeroed in on a toss away phrase by one of the other chlorines, something like "Pretty soon we'll all have to get plastic surgery"  This was 1933.

I love Dancing Lady! Maybe not the greatest script but she and Gable are so good and we do get to see a bit of Joan's dancing ("oh, a brush off!").  I also think she looks gorgeous here - - I wished I looked half as good in the gym as she and Gable do! 

[Mindthinkr]

In the 1970's I read a macabre book Harvest Home. Later I saw it was being filmed in a mini series with Bette Davis and thought great. Sadly it wasn't great. Heck, it was 1978 tho and she was still out there working and trying to be relevant.  

[Jan Spears]

11 hours ago, Pete Martell said:

Strait-Jacket is not that good either, but Joan commits to the role and is very watchable. It has a good "twist" to it and it's also fascinating to see that somehow even after all these years Joan is still playing an ingenue. Let's not talk about the wig...

Here is a very good featurette about the making of Straight Jacket:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Rz1lpIcBGs

Diane Baker, who starred opposite Crawford in Straight Jacket (and 1959's The Best of Everything), makes some particularly perceptive comments about Crawford.

5 hours ago, psychoticstate said:

I also liked her in Flamingo Road, although the part of Lane should be someone in her late twenties or early thirties. 

Crawford was definitely too old for the part and this was the point where Crawford started playing characters who were meant to be younger than her actual age at the time. But, she peels paint in her scenes with Sydney Greenstreet. And she sure is believable in the nighttime carnival scenes with Zachary Scott. It's hard to know in those scenes where Lane begins and Lucille/Billie the showgirl ends.

Edited April 3, 2017 by Jan Spears

[Pete Martell]

There's some footage of Joan from 1974 (her last public appearance) where she says that she is going to Europe to work out a film role. Obviously that didn't happen (and unflattering photos made her become a recluse soon after this appearance), but I wonder what it might have been.

 

While this isn't an acting role (other than Joan always acting, even as herself...), it really is one of the weirdest things I've ever seen, especially when it gets to the part where Joan tells us that what her generation used to credit to God, the young generation now credits to the supermarket (I can't imagine what Joan would have felt about how people treat Wal-Mart). I'm surprised MST3K never used this. Maybe they couldn't get the rights...

Edited April 4, 2017 by Pete Martell

[kassa]

On 3/13/2017 at 7:55 PM, blaase said:

Love Joan in The Women, she played a bitch so well and actually made me root for her over Norma Shearer.

Anybody who hasn't seen The Women ... seriously, see The Women!  (Not the horrific remake.)   Made just before they cracked down on Hollywood innuendo -- Wife confronts mistress at the store by coldly informing her that the husband wouldn't like an outfit so obvious, mistress responds "Anytime he doesn't like what I'm wearing, I just take it off."  Mistress, of course, is Joan Crawford.

 

Absolutely glorious movie - smart, vicious, hopelessly old fashioned yet ridiculously modern.

[psychoticstate]

44 minutes ago, kassa said:

Anybody who hasn't seen The Women ... seriously, see The Women!  (Not the horrific remake.)   Made just before they cracked down on Hollywood innuendo -- Wife confronts mistress at the store by coldly informing her that the husband wouldn't like an outfit so obvious, mistress responds "Anytime he doesn't like what I'm wearing, I just take it off."  Mistress, of course, is Joan Crawford.

 

Absolutely glorious movie - smart, vicious, hopelessly old fashioned yet ridiculously modern.

The Women is one of my favorite classic movies of all time.  Witty, golden zingers at every turn.  And not a single male in the cast - - no actors, even the animals and the books on the shelf in the library scene are reportedly by female authors.  And yet 90% of the movie is about men.  You gotta love it.

Joan lobbied hard for the role of Crystal.  L.B. Mayer did not want to give it to her; he thought the part too small and she was too big of a star to accept it.  Her response?  A nobody cannot steal Norma Shearer's husband!   She also famously said that she would accept the role of Wally Beery's grandmother if the part was good. 

Minor nitpick but The Women was made a good 4-5 years after the Production Code went into effect, which was a good thing for the film, I think.  Because they couldn't come right out and make certain remarks, they skirted around it and it made the film more delightful. 

1939 was a stellar year in Hollywood. 

[kassa]

Wow - sorry I got the code dates wrong.  When I first caught this (midnight movie on local uhf station when I was in college), I was astounded by how current it felt.  Okay, not all of it -- but not many b/w movies from that era are that sharp.  Credit Clare Boothe Luce, the playwright.  

JUNGLE RED!

[CraftyHazel]

The Women is an incredible movie!  One of the first classic movies I ever owned, and my introduction to a young Rosalind Russell.  "By the way, there's a name for you ladies, but it isn't used in high society...outside of a kennel."  One of the best exit lines ever!

[chitowngirl]

I liked both versions of The Women. There are problems with the remake, but if you don't think of it as a remake, but as it's own movie, I thought it worked.

An unpopular opinion-I never thought of Joan Crawford as beautiful, especially as Crystal. I couldn't see why the unseen husband would leave his family for Joan Crawford. Now Eva Mendes, that I could see. Jada Pinkett Smith's jaw dropped at her!

[Jan Spears]

On ‎3‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 7:12 PM, Jan Spears said:

I rewatched Flamingo Road (1949) with Crawford, Sydney Greenstreet and Zachary Scott (Crawford's co-star in Mildred Pierce) this weekend.

That being said, Crawford is great during the first half, especially when she meets Scott at night in her carnival tent and she gives her speech about being tired of life as a carnival dancer.

I re-rewatched Flamingo Road tonight. Crawford's speech in the carnival tent gets me every time. When Zachary Scott's Field(ing) ask Crawford's character, Lane, what she did in the carnival, at first Lane responds with a list of the tacky roles she performed. But then she slips into a more meaningful key and says:

"But most of the time I was just a little tired and dirty . . .

Sick of moldy tents and one-night stands and greasy food . . .

Sick of having people look at me like I was cheap."

Crawford really sells that speech. You have to wonder how much of it was acting and how much it was Crawford drawing on Lucille who lived in the back of a laundry as a young girl and Billie the showgirl who travelled from New York to Chicago to Detroit in her pre-MGM days.

[Milburn Stone]

In This Our Life is also notable for containing a stunning performance by Ernest Anderson, a young black actor who unfortunately went on to play porters and waiters for the rest of his life.

[enoughcats]

1 hour ago, Milburn Stone said:

Ernest Anderson, a young black actor who unfortunately went on to play porters and waiters for the rest of his life.

His imdb shows lots of minor uncredited roles.  I had read he was in Baby Jane, and he was according to imdb the uncredited ice cream seller at the beach. 

Some of his TV work was credited.

[Milburn Stone]

6 minutes ago, enoughcats said:

His imdb shows lots of minor uncredited roles.  I had read he was in Baby Jane, and he was according to imdb the uncredited ice cream seller at the beach.

Indeed, a lot of them--a lot of roles like "uncredited ice cream seller at the beach." Which, after you've seen him in In This Our Life, you recognize as one of the most colossal, tragic wastes of talent in Hollywood history.

Edited April 9, 2017 by Milburn Stone

[benteen]

I just saw Hush...Hush Sweet Charlotte today and I really enjoyed it.

[psychoticstate]

On 4/8/2017 at 4:50 PM, chitowngirl said:

I liked both versions of The Women. There are problems with the remake, but if you don't think of it as a remake, but as it's own movie, I thought it worked.

An unpopular opinion-I never thought of Joan Crawford as beautiful, especially as Crystal. I couldn't see why the unseen husband would leave his family for Joan Crawford. Now Eva Mendes, that I could see. Jada Pinkett Smith's jaw dropped at her!

There are actually 3 versions of The Women.  The original from 1939, the more current remake with Meg Ryan and one made in the 50s called The Opposite Sex.   Don't even bother with that one.  It includes men and songs.  It's what the word "turkey" when describing a movie was invented for.  June Allyson plays Mary Haines, here renamed Kay and a former radio singer and she's too sickeningly sweet.  Hell, I wanted to throttle her.  Crystal in this one is played by Joan Collins and she's a chorus girl. 

The film absolutely does not work for many reasons.  It's a musical.  It has male actors.  It doesn't have George Cukor. It lacks the charm and biting wit of the original.   There is no comparison.  This one should go down in the Hall of Shame.  Even Crawford herself agreed saying:  "It's ridiculous. Norma and I might not ever have been bosom buddies, but we towered compared to those pygmies in the remake."

[enoughcats]

12 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

 Even Crawford herself agreed saying:  "It's ridiculous. Norma and I might not ever have been bosom buddies, but we towered compared to those pygmies in the remake."

What a wonderful, straightforward comment.  

[ennui]

On 3/17/2017 at 8:20 AM, enoughcats said:

But have you seen "The Bride came C.O.D."?

I caught the last 20 minutes or so of this on TCM last night. It wasn't as bad as I expected, but I 'm not certain comedy is Bette's forte. I'd like to see it from the beginning, so I'll try to catch it again. I suspect the title is misleading, because Bette portrayed a wealthy, spoiled young woman.

Spoiler

The last scene with the parachute and the cactus was cringeworthy.

[enoughcats]

There are three Joan Crawford movies on TCM Friday morning (4/14) starting with 

Goodbye, My Fancy 1951 

Harriet Craig 1951

And Mildred Pierce 1945  (Oscar!!!)

[enoughcats]

To put Mildred Pierce into context, this was twenty long hard working   years after she appeared in her movies (mostly uncredited, and one (in 1925) when she was credited under her real name. 

Twenty years and to look Mildred Pierce good, and to have upper arms six years later to wear that very revealing evening gown when she was two and a half (or more) decades from being an ingenue. (I'm sure whoever designed that gown was proud of it. So we'll just say "Bless its heart.")

[Inquisitionist]

She did keep her body in great shape, but I've just never understood the appeal of that face.

[CraftyHazel]

2 hours ago, Inquisitionist said:

She did keep her body in great shape, but I've just never understood the appeal of that face.

Can I love this comment times 1,000?!  I have occasionally found Joan interesting looking, most notably in Mildred Pierce (something about  the film noir quality of the photograpy, I assume), but I have never really found her beautiful.  And in her early Hollywood period, during her silent picture days, I thought she was decidedly homely.  Everybody has their own standard of beauty, of course, and I understand that.  But when people go on about how lovely she was, I can just never see it.

[ciprus]

Bette Davis: Baby Jane, All About Eve, The Little Foxes, The Nanny, Death on the Nile, The Virgin Queen, Hush hush sweet Charlotte, Murder with Mirrors

Joan Crawford: Baby Jane and Mildred Pierce

I love Bette Davis but I just realized that I've never seen any of her early movies. The Little Foxes comes closest, and it's from '41! I should probably rectify that if I can actually find any. That said, she and a young Maggie Smith were wonderfully snarky in Death on the Nile. Pure delight, just because of that. The film itself is okay.

[sugarbaker design]

Now Voyager is an absolute must-see.  Dark Victory too.

[enoughcats]

12 hours ago, Marmiarmo said:

 I have occasionally found Joan interesting looking, most notably in Mildred Pierce (something about  the film noir quality of the photograpy, I assume), but I have never really found her beautiful.

In reading summaries of some JC movies in wikipedia, I kept running into the name of the NYT movie critic who seemed never to have anything good to say about Joan Crawford.  So I looked him up on Wiki (lazy on my part, but it's a start), and found this

Quote

 Crowther also had a barely concealed disdain for Joan Crawford when reviewing her films, referring to her acting style as "artificiality" and "pretentiousness,"[6] and would also chide Crawford for her physical bearing. In his review of the cult classic Johnny Guitar, Crowther complained that, "...no more femininity comes from (Crawford) than from the rugged Mr. Heflin in Shane. For the lady, as usual, is as sexless as the lions on the public library steps and as sharp and romantically forbidding as a package of unwrapped razor blades."[7]

Ouch.

With his eagle eye and rapier wit aimed at her, no wonder she kept her weight down; it was one thing she could control.

[ennui]

14 hours ago, Marmiarmo said:

But when people go on about how lovely she was, I can just never see it.

That's okay; I think Bette Davis was beautiful, but everyone talks about how she had to be a good actress because she wasn't pretty. I think Joan was beautiful before the eyebrows took over.

[CraftyHazel]

Bette Davis herself thought she wasn't beautiful.  I always thought she was.  Then again, she thought Katherine Hepburn was both beautiful and spectacularly talented, and I have never liked Katherine Hepburn in anything, and found her very plain.  Different strokes...

[Florinaldo]

I passed on In This Our Life the last time I delved into the BD box set it's part of, despite the fact it's got a commentary by the great Jeanine Basinger but comments posted here have revived my interest in watching it. Instead, I opted for Watch on the Rhine, with BD playing the ultra-noble martyr to the cause of good, wife of a leader of the resistance, the whole family back in the US for a short time. It is preachy, although it is difficult to disagree with its underlying ideology, and BD delivers such a saintly portrayal it's at times grating. It also features George Coulouris in a wonderful turn as a slimily devious nobleman, a well as Lucile Watson as BD's mother; every time I hear that actress I feel like the speech patterns of the lead character in the sitcom Keeping Up Appearances may have been modeled on her.

The first version of The Women was great, except for the last shot, in which the Norma Shearer character runs with open arms towards her husband (off-screen and never seen of course) with a look of ecstasy on her face that undermines a good deal of what was shown previously.

 

ETA: I forgot to mention that Lucile Watson also appears in The Women, again as a respectable and patrician mother, this time of the Norma Shearer's character.

Edited April 15, 2017 by Florinaldo

[Mindthinkr]

I watched the movie 'Harriet Craig' on TCM starring Miss Crawford yesterday and had a few thoughts. She plays a bitter calculating wife whose manipulation tried to keep her husband in line. I almost thought (after reading her daughter Christina's book, watching this series, and much of what I've read here) that this movie somewhat resembles her own life. What a cold fish. She probably needed very few acting skills to pull this role off. Her facial expressions spoke volumes and like for her in real life, 

Spoiler

this story had no happy ending 

This show has succeeded in one thing for me. To draw me in to watching more of her movies as they come up. TCM seems to be showing more of both of her and Miss Davis's movies to my delight. 

[JudyObscure]

On ‎4‎/‎8‎/‎2017 at 8:06 PM, Jan Spears said:

I re-rewatched Flamingo Road tonight. Crawford's speech in the carnival tent gets me every time. When Zachary Scott's Field(ing) ask Crawford's character, Lane, what she did in the carnival, at first Lane responds with a list of the tacky roles she performed. But then she slips into a more meaningful key and says:

"But most of the time I was just a little tired and dirty . . .

Sick of moldy tents and one-night stands and greasy food . . .

Sick of having people look at me like I was cheap."

It's that speech that makes me think she wasn't really too old for the part. In it Joan could be beautiful but still have a little bit of that "been rode hard and put away wet," look.

 

On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2017 at 9:15 PM, enoughcats said:

(I'm sure whoever designed that gown was proud of it. So we'll just say "Bless its heart.")

It's like a satin evening gown met Ma Kettle's apron; it makes me wonder if  she has a pot holder in one of those pockets.  Not that that's any of my business.

[Jan Spears]

On ‎4‎/‎15‎/‎2017 at 3:13 PM, JudyObscure said:

It's that speech that makes me think she wasn't really too old for the part. In it Joan could be beautiful but still have a little bit of that "been rode hard and put away wet," look.

She definitely sells it and makes you forget that she's at least 10 years too old for the part.

Here's Joan's opening scene from Flamingo Road after she's been left behind by the carnival:

I love her dialogue with Zachary Scott:

Field: "What are you doing here?"

Lane: "Gettin' up a parade -- you're just in time."

Crawford would reprise the song she's "singing" -- "If I Could Be with You" -- later in the movie at the "roadhouse" (a.k.a. the bordello).

[JudyObscure]

9 hours ago, Jan Spears said:

I love her dialogue with Zachary Scott:

Every bit of dialogue Joan had with Zachary Scott in "Mildred Pierce," was steamy.  I wonder if he was one of her off screen romances?

[MonkeySee]

11 hours ago, Twopper said:

Well, I have set the dvr to record Baby Jane tomorrow on TCM.   I wish they had Hush, Hush on the schedule .

I've got it (Hush, Hush....) set to record on TCM on Wednesday the 26th!

[Ki-in]

On 4/8/2017 at 7:50 PM, chitowngirl said:

I liked both versions of The Women. There are problems with the remake, but if you don't think of it as a remake, but as it's own movie, I thought it worked.

An unpopular opinion-I never thought of Joan Crawford as beautiful, especially as Crystal. I couldn't see why the unseen husband would leave his family for Joan Crawford. Now Eva Mendes, that I could see. Jada Pinkett Smith's jaw dropped at her!

Norma Shearer's mother explains it's about her husband seeing himself through new eyes and not about her lack of qualities. It's never so much about looks as it is about feelings. Think about ANY beautiful woman that you can think of and there's a 99% chance she's been cheated on.

 

IMHO Joan was never a beauty but she did make the most of what she had. She was into her glamorous image and screen queen persona and said if guys wanted to look at the girl next door then go next door.

[Sew Sumi]

6 hours ago, MonkeySee said:

I've got it (Hush, Hush....) set to record on TCM on Wednesday the 26th!

What time? I don't see it on my guide, but All About Eve IS on that day. :)

[Newberry]

1 hour ago, Sew Sumi said:

What time? I don't see it on my guide, but All About Eve IS on that day. :)

Yes, I was looking too. I didn't see it on the schedule. Maybe not TCM?

[enoughcats]

9 minutes ago, Newberry said:

1 hour ago, Sew Sumi said:

What time? I don't see it on my guide, but All About Eve IS on that day. :)

Yes, I was looking too. I didn't see it on the schedule. Maybe not TCM?

Directv sat there and looked at me as if it had never heard of Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte.  Directv didn't limit its search to TCM

[ennui]

5 hours ago, Ki-in said:

Think about ANY beautiful woman that you can think of and there's a 99% chance she's been cheated on.

99%?! I doubt that. Besides, cheating says more about the cheater than it does the injured spouse.

[peacheslatour]

Right now I'm watching WEHTBJ on TCM and I am noticing that in the musical score they interlaced snippets of Hooray For Hollywood with Letter To Daddy. Very clever.

Edited April 18, 2017 by peacheslatour

[toodles]

1 hour ago, enoughcats said:

Directv sat there and looked at me as if it had never heard of Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte.  Directv didn't limit its search to TCM

I hate when that happens.  :)  Directv and I don't always get along.

[Sew Sumi]

I did a voice search on Comcast, but no showtimes cane up. I could, however, watch it for 3.99. I did the same search for WHTBJ and got both showtimes (it's on right now on TCM) plus the offer to rent/own. 

Come ON, TV Land (as LL teevee, not the channel), come through with HHSC. If I saw it, I can't remember. 

Edited April 18, 2017 by Sew Sumi

[psychoticstate]

12 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Every bit of dialogue Joan had with Zachary Scott in "Mildred Pierce," was steamy.  I wonder if he was one of her off screen romances?

I've never heard nor read anything about Joan having a romance with Zachary Scott so I'm going to say no.   They were steamy, though, weren't they?  

I've always thought Joan was beautiful in Mildred Pierce, as well as Humoresque and They All Kissed the Bride (as far as her 1940s films go.)  I find her stunning in Possessed and Dancing Lady.  Beautiful eyes and cheekbones to kill for.  To each his own, I suppose.

 

[The Wild Sow]

On 4/3/2017 at 7:00 PM, Mindthinkr said:

In the 1970's I read a macabre book Harvest Home. Later I saw it was being filmed in a mini series with Bette Davis and thought great. Sadly it wasn't great. Heck, it was 1978 tho and she was still out there working and trying to be relevant.  

 

Ha, I'm glad someone else remembers that!  It was the last thing I saw Bette Davis in.

The TV title was The Dark Secret of Harvest Home.  At the time, Woolworth stores had a cafeteria called "Harvest House," so we always wondered what their "dark secret" might be!

[ClareWalks]

Wow, I am surprised there are people who think Joan Crawford is unattractive. I finally watched Baby Jane today and I was thinking that, even a bit older, she was so striking and easy on the eyes. Especially with her hair down. Women in Hollywood generally are held to (extremely, ridiculously) high standards for their looks, it just goes to show that is nothing new. But speaking of Baby Jane, damn, Bette Davis was riveting. I'd never seen a Bette movie before (I know, I know), but she totally NAILED that role, and it wasn't an easy role to nail.

[Kiki777]

I just watched Dead Ringers off my DVR and must say I enjoyed it tremendously to the point where I would definitely rewatch it.  BD was fabulous in both roles.  (Side note: I loved the Great Dane and how he failed to seem scary when the script called for it- at one point he was smiling while the sound f/x was of a dog growling)

TCM has been airing a lot of BD and JC films lately- caught young BD in The Petrified Forest which bored me to tears but damn she was pretty.  She seemed like such a natural beauty while JC's beauty seemed IMO more the high-maintenance type.

[ennui]

On 4/18/2017 at 2:59 PM, psychoticstate said:

Humoresque

I saw part of this last night. Joan was beautiful, but I didn't care for the film -- I fail to see the appeal of John Garfield, and there were extended scenes without dialogue, only violin music. I loved the scenes at the end. Joan wore a black sequined gown, and it was stunning with the ocean in the background. There are some things that black and white cinematography favors, and that dress was one of them. 

[Inquisitionist]

I recorded All This, and Heaven Too from TCM recently and watched a bit of it this morning.  Davis definitely looks plain playing the noble governess to a French duc's children.  Her character is supposed to be 25, which I don't think the then-32-year-old Davis pulled off very convincingly.  Oddly, Davis was actually older than Barbara O'Neil, who plays the duc's wife and laments the governess's youth.  But O'Neil always seemed to play "older" than she was.  She portrayed Scarlett O'Hara's mother, Ellen, when she was only 28/29 to Vivien Leigh's 25.

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, Inquisitionist said:

I recorded All This, and Heaven Too from TCM recently and watched a bit of it this morning.  Davis definitely looks plain playing the noble governess to a French duc's children.  Her character is supposed to be 25, which I don't think the then-32-year-old Davis pulled off very convincingly.  Oddly, Davis was actually older than Barbara O'Neil, who plays the duc's wife and laments the governess's youth.  But O'Neil always seemed to play "older" than she was.  She portrayed Scarlett O'Hara's mother, Ellen, when she was only 28/29 to Vivien Leigh's 25.

She was fairly close to Ellen O'Hara's real age of thirty two. Scarlett was supposed to be sixteen at the time. Vivien Leigh didn't exactly pull off teenager but she was great as grown up Scarlett.

Edited April 23, 2017 by peacheslatour

[JasonCC]

Quote

An unpopular opinion-I never thought of Joan Crawford as beautiful, especially as Crystal

I think Crawford is GREAT as Crystal, but you're right she is not at her most beautiful in that film. I think the hairstyle is partially to blame---more conventional 1930s hairstyles have a cool vintage look now (AKA most of Joan's MGM films) but Crystal's haircut (daring at the time) just became an paint-by-numbers old lady perm a couple decades later.