S06.E05: Episode 5

[Brattinella]

On 5/1/2017 at 0:16 PM, Fireball said:

arrogant Surgeon or General Practitioner or one that hasn't dismiss my concerns because I was a female and obviously just a wimp. 

This attitude makes me show them the door IMMEDIATELY.

[Portia]

6 hours ago, Ohwell said:

Not really. ; )

Yeah, whether or not it's based in fact, I'm not a big fan of the trope of the "hilarious" elderly person who says and does outrageous things. (It's why I despised fan favorite William on This is Us.)  I understand the appeal of saying and doing the unexpected for shock-comic value, and I engage in some of that stuff myself, but I don't think old age entitles anyone to be a dick.

 And when this phenomenon occurs because of illness or disability...well, that's not necessarily the stuff of comedy. After multiple strokes, my mother lost a lot of her "filter" and sometime said inappropriate things in public.  Occasionally there were giggle-worthy moments,  but more often than not we family members were pained because that just wasn't her.  She was always wacky, but she'd never hurt or embarrass someone on purpose. When my sweet father was in the throes of dementia, he had me in tears at times saying hurtful things that his former self would have never said. I knew he couldnt help it, but it was traumatizing nonetheless.

I'm starting to realize why I've never particularly cared for the Monica Joan character. She's a wee bit over-romanticized for my taste.

Edited May 2, 2017 by Portia

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

After Birth: Will The Flowers Have A Funeral?

When Fred's cousin passes away, he and Vi are thrown into figuring out the best home for her developmentally delayed son.

[Portia]

On a lighter (???) note, an elderly lady at my church died during the service just like Reggie's mother. A doctor standing nearby was able to attend to her immediately, and he said she was likely dead before she hit the floor. I've told God that that's the way I want to go when it's my time!

Edited May 2, 2017 by Portia

[Kohola3]

52 minutes ago, Portia said:

I don't think old age entitles anyone to be a dick.

Of course a person of age should not "be a dick" if that person is in possession of all of their faculties.  However, I would hope that we can cut someone with dementia some slack.  They, nor are small children, accountable for what they say or do if they are not able to distinguish the rights and wrongs of their verbalization.

My mother had Alzheimers.  She said some hurtful things.  It was not easy to let that roll off my back but I had to keep repeating to myself that she was acting like a small child.  I always said I lost my mom several years before her actual death.  She was not being "a dick" and while it took some explanation to relatives and strangers, none of them felt that she was either after they knew her condition.

On the other hand, I am of an age that I really don't care if people like me or not.  While I am not cruel to anyone nor do I eschew an honest opinion if one is solicited.  I do not support the Special Snowflake culture where youngsters expect high praise for everything they do including what should be expected as proper behavior.

47 minutes ago, Portia said:

I've told God that that's the way I want to go when it's my time!

Absolutely.  There are way worse ways to go.

Edited May 2, 2017 by Kohola3

[Brattinella]

28 minutes ago, Portia said:

but I don't think old age entitles anyone to be a dick.

So what would you do with a senile old person when they act like a dick?  You certainly can't muzzle them; I think the only solution would be to avoid being in their presence if they are hurting you with their words.  I get lots of slack due to my age, and I will not be penalized for it.

[Chewy101]

3 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

  4 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I don't know if I agree with that.  I think the show's treatment of Sister Monica Joan is fairly unrealistic, like the show can't decide if her senility is cute or dangerous.  For example, with this episode, did she even tell anyone at Nonataus House that she was going with Fred to the hospital?  She just kind of appeared in his car.  Did they just think she wandered off and would eventually find her way back?  

It would have been a sweet scene if Fred popped back into the house and let everyone know she was with him and he'd look after her. Instead we have to fan-wank that part to avoid the atmosphere of negligence. I really don't think they are keeping a close enough eye on her. Just because she has many lucid moments doesn't mean she is safe the other times.

[SunnyBeBe]

7 minutes ago, Chewy101 said:

It would have been a sweet scene if Fred popped back into the house and let everyone know she was with him and he'd look after her. Instead we have to fan-wank that part to avoid the atmosphere of negligence. I really don't think they are keeping a close enough eye on her. Just because she has many lucid moments doesn't mean she is safe the other times.

Exactly.  You would think that that the writers and directors of the show have enough contact with people who suffer with dementia that they know better.  It reminds me of how Type I diabetes is portrayed on tv so often.  Often the story has little actual connection to the the truth about diabetes.  When you decide to cover a subject on tv, I think you owe the public to get it right. 

Of course, maybe, the writers want to show that those with dementia were let to roam free and get injured back in that day. I wonder if they are still allowing her to answer the phone and take messages.  

[Chewy101]

Just now, SunnyBeBe said:

Of course, maybe, the writers want to show that those with dementia were let to roam free and get injured back in that day. I wonder if they are still allowing her to answer the phone and take messages.  

She has not been allowed to do that, ever. She just ignores the rule because no one is watching her. They have shown downfalls from her doing it anyway, and watching her guilt was devastating. Even when she answers the door, she looks fearful and announces she is not authorized to let anyone in. 

I'd love a flashback episode showing her back in the day when she spanking babies, kicking ass, and taking names.

As far as S. MJ spotting S. MC in the hospital, was that actually realistic that one could wander through a psych ward and peek into windows? I get that it made for a touching moment, but I don't think that would have been allowed, would it? I feel like the show is so spot on in the baby and general medicine department, but then it takes some liberties in other areas, all for the attempts of invoking emotion.

[SunnyBeBe]

If Sister Monica Joan is written that way in the books, then, I suppose that offers some explanation, but, I thought that this show now was past the time frame or the books.  I thought that they now the storylines have departed from the book, since they are now in the 1960's.  Anyone know?  I'm afraid that I have never read them.  

s.  

[Guest]

We're getting pretty far off track from discussing episode 5 right now, so please make sure your post centers around the episode.

If you're interested in furthering off-topic discussions, please visit the Small Talk thread.  Thank you.

[Portia]

Moved to Small Talk thread.

Edited May 2, 2017 by Portia

[Ohwell]

1 hour ago, Portia said:

Yeah, whether or not it's based in fact, I'm not a big fan of the trope of the "hilarious" elderly person who says and does outrageous things. (It's why I despised fan favorite William on This is Us.)  I understand the appeal of saying and doing the unexpected for shock-comic value, and I engage in some of that stuff myself, but I don't think old age entitles anyone to be a dick.

 And when this phenomenon occurs because of illness or disability...well, that's not necessarily the stuff of comedy. After multiple strokes, my mother lost a lot of her "filter" and sometime said inappropriate things in public.  Occasionally there were giggle-worthy moments,  but more often than not we family members were pained because that just wasn't her.  She was always wacky, but she'd never hurt or embarrass someone on purpose. When my sweet father was in the throes of dementia, he had me in tears at times saying hurtful things that his former self would have never said. I knew he couldnt help it, but it was traumatizing nonetheless.

I'm starting to realize why I've never particularly cared for the Monuca Joan character. She's a wee bit over-romanticized for my taste.

I agree with everything you've posted.  I'm sorry about your mom and dad; my mom had dementia as well and it was painful when she was no longer "herself" and said weird or hurtful things. 

I'm also glad to know that I'm not the only one who never particularly cared for Sister Monica Joan. 

[JeanneH]

22 hours ago, Libby96 said:

I'm sure this is an unpopular opinion,  but I have not been particularly interested in Sister Mary Cynthia'a story.  I find the character almost too meek and mild, though I certainly don't discount the health issues she is facing, especially in light of the fact that there have been a few mentions of her being based on a real person.  I have read alll three or Jennifer Worth's books about her time in Poplar, but I'm not remembering much about this story line.  What happened with the real Mary Cynthia?

I've written something up about the real Cynthia (summarized what's in the 3rd book), for posterity if nothing else. It's in the Sister Mary Cynthia: She Went And Became A Nun thread.

Edited May 2, 2017 by JeanneH

[Sarah 103]

On May 2, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Chewy101 said:

I'd love a flashback episode showing her back in the day when she spanking babies, kicking ass, and taking names.

Me too. I'd love to see a flashback episode where the characters are sharing stories about thier pasts. Not a cliche clip show, but moments that we haven't seen or heard about before. 

[Megan]

4 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

Me too. I'd love to see a flashback episode where the characters are sharing stories about thier pasts. Not a cliche clip show, but moments that we haven't seen or heard about before. 

I'd love that, like in How to Make An American Quilt

[Chewy101]

18 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

On 5/2/2017 at 2:01 PM, Chewy101 said:

I'd love a flashback episode showing her back in the day when she spanking babies, kicking ass, and taking names.

Me too. I'd love to see a flashback episode where the characters are sharing stories about thier pasts. Not a cliche clip show, but moments that we haven't seen or heard about before. 

 

13 hours ago, Megan said:

I'd love that, like in How to Make An American Quilt

 

I loved that movie. Just imagine how much fun casting would be, picking out "younger" versions of all the sisters. Then we could get S. Evangelina back, despite Pam Ferris retiring from the show.

[Clanstarling]

On 5/1/2017 at 1:05 PM, Ohwell said:

I didn't like Sister Monica Joan thinking she needed to accompany Fred because he might not make the right decision.  I know everyone is kind to her because she's elderly, but Fred was perfectly capable of making the decision about what was best for his cousin.  Sister Monica Joan needed to mind her own business.  

When has Sister Monica Joan ever minded her own business? Love her or not, it is consistent with her character.

On 5/1/2017 at 9:17 PM, LittleIggy said:

I googled the whole British "Dr. v. Mr." thing and got a laugh from a post on a forum that said that in the US even a DVM is called a "doctor." What a snob! Getting into and graduating from a veterinary school is harder than the equivalent MD experience.

People manage to get snotty about pretty much every field of endeavor. Literary fiction authors are snobs about genre fiction authors (and I've even seen science fiction writers be snotty about science fiction vs scifi), artists who want to have their work in galleries are snobby about those who want to create popular art (animation, graphic novels, etc.). I watched a documentary about a woman who became the first credited casting director - and directors were up in arms about her being considered a director. If there is a way to feel superior about others engaged in a similar profession, there will be those who will grab that sense of superiority. Someone mentioned veterinarians upthread, and I've always thought that having to learn the systems and diseases of multiple species, and treat patients who have no way to tell them anything, earns them considerable respect.

On 5/1/2017 at 10:18 PM, Lillybee said:

During the 60's and 70's the British were known for having very bad teeth. So all the working class people of Poplar with perfect teeth seems to be unrealistic.

I suspect some of the "problem" with the teeth of the Brits in those days had to do war time deprivation. Brits and Europeans alike spent many long years on limited rations, and in some cases, near starvation diets (at least toward the end). My mother, an Austrian, had to have all of her teeth removed when she was young, much like the woman in this story. All of my family, siblings born during and shortly after the war, and my father who's own American upbringing was one of deprivation, all had terrible teeth. On the other hand, I came along much later, after she'd had a healthy diet for years. I didn't have a single cavity until I was pregnant (in my 30's), despite not living anywhere with fluoridated water. I saw the dentist for the first time when I was in my 20s (for a cleaning).

I thought the chemistry between Trixie and the dentist was great. He's definitely the one for her, respectful of her skills, handsome, and he had a pretty spiffy car, so he's not struggling too much.

Edited May 7, 2017 by Clanstarling

[Qoass]

I must confess that when they showed the newspaper about the group home celebrating "it's" second anniversary, my heart died a little.

[dcalley]

On 5/8/2017 at 9:36 AM, Qoass said:

I must confess that when they showed the newspaper about the group home celebrating "it's" second anniversary, my heart died a little.

I only just got around to watching this episode, and I was tsk-tsking at that and even took a screenshot so I could go on the internet to register my disgust throughout the world. (That's paraphrasing a quote from The Simpsons.)

Edited May 15, 2017 by dcalley

[anna0852]

I think they were using "it's" in terms of the institution, not the residents. I'm not trying to be snarky and I'm genuinely confused: how is "it's" offensive in that context? I know not to call a person that but an institution?

[jah1986]

It's generally means it is so it would read Glasshouse Village Trust Celebrates It Is Second Birthday which is incorrect.  I believe it should just Its Second Birthday.

[anna0852]

Oh this is a grammar thing? Makes way more sense.

[Qoass]

Right:  its for possession; It's for contraction:  It's time to celebrate its anniversary.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

It's = it is.

[Ina123]

On ‎4‎/‎30‎/‎2017 at 9:27 PM, Sarah 103 said:

Back to the topic at hand: What happened to make that women so fearful of the dentist. It seemed like she had been raped or sexually assaulted by a dentist. Her fear was far beyond a routine dental appointment.  

Lot's of people have dentist phobia, as do I. I get heart palpitations and sweat like a pig. I was a kid in the 50s. It could be really painful and especially bad if you had a dentist with a terrible bedside manner. Although I don't really remember a specific time, he probably hurt me pretty badly and made me phobic.

[Ina123]

On ‎5‎/‎2‎/‎2017 at 2:23 PM, Kohola3 said:

On the other hand, I am of an age that I really don't care if people like me or not.  While I am not cruel to anyone nor do I eschew an honest opinion if one is solicited.  I do not support the Special Snowflake culture where youngsters expect high praise for everything they do including what should be expected as proper behavior.

I'm with you.

[RedbirdNelly]

I enjoyed this episode. I loved Sr. Monica Jones showing up unexpectedly to ride with Fred. I'm fine fan waving through bits--I don't want to watch a show that is too much like real life. There are only so many minutes, so I'm ok not showing me Fred taking a quick jog inside to let someone know where Sr. MJ is. 

I had to look away at any shots of that mom's teeth. I'm not afraid of dentists but I understand. Around middle school my mom changed our dentist after getting disgusted with the prior dentist pushing her to approve him doing things our orthodontist did not recommend on my sister. It was then we learned from the new dentist all the ways they can help minimize the pain of those numbing shots--gas, etc. We kids were thrilled; my mom told us we should have told her old dentist just gave us those shots with no pre-numbing. We had no idea that was an option so it never occurred to us to say anything.

I loved the enthusiasm about driving lessons--though I agree Nurse Crane needed a safer location esp for someone who had not driven before so even steering was new. My husband tried teaching me to drive a stick once. I suppose I could eventually figure it out but we gave up--I did not like trying to stay focused on the clutch plus the gas pedal plus shifting and steering. I would have been deadly on that crowded street. I'll stick with my automatic thanks.

[Kim0820]

On 5/2/2017 at 2:36 PM, Brattinella said:

So what would you do with a senile old person when they act like a dick?  You certainly can't muzzle them; I think the only solution would be to avoid being in their presence if they are hurting you with their words.  I get lots of slack due to my age, and I will not be penalized for it.

I have an in-law who had an unlucky break - iatrogenic stroke - she got a settlement.  She turned from the sweetest person to a picky martinet who was would scold me for doing or not doing something totally irrelevant to me but apparently to her, impermissible in civilized society.  And you do get this feeling of oh she gets to be such a jerk, but you can't say anything about it, since she always has the excuse of what she suffered.  It's one of those things you have to deal with, but can't help feeling hurt at times, though you have no "right" to.