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S05.E02: This Has to Do With Me


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Daphne and Mingo dress up as their favorite singers for a college party, but backlash over their costume choice escalates into a discussion of race relations and free speech; Regina and Luca team up for a class project.

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I appreciate what they are trying to do, but I wish the show wouldn't try to focus so much on flavor of the week controversies.  Yes, this is a huge topic and it is important but we only have SO many episodes left.  I'd rather see them focus on wrapping things up for these girls. 

Regina doesn't need another guy this season.  Her character had so much potential but it seems like she's going down that rabbit hole again.  I'll be as patient as I can with however many episodes we have left but...

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13 hours ago, Spencer Hastings said:

I appreciate what they are trying to do, but I wish the show wouldn't try to focus so much on flavor of the week controversies.  Yes, this is a huge topic and it is important but we only have SO many episodes left.  I'd rather see them focus on wrapping things up for these girls. 

Regina doesn't need another guy this season.  Her character had so much potential but it seems like she's going down that rabbit hole again.  I'll be as patient as I can with however many episodes we have left but...

Agreed. I don't want to waste time getting up in arms over something that not only won't matter, but ultimately could be dropped regardless because of the lack of time.

And I'm pretty much over Regina. I've been steadily getting more sick of her since the moment they revealed she has known so long about the switch, but I was totally done last season with the whole Eric debacle. I'm not surprised she has shacked up with a teeny bopper BF. She's got a history of prioritizing random men over her own personal business she needs to take care of. 

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The only plot on this show that still bothers me is that something happened to Regina's hands to the point that she couldn't sign anymore. Why did they do that? Did Constance Marie not want to sign anymore?

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33 minutes ago, Jeffurry said:

The only plot on this show that still bothers me is that something happened to Regina's hands to the point that she couldn't sign anymore. Why did they do that? Did Constance Marie not want to sign anymore?

After the first season, Constance Marie developed really bad tendonitis, carpal tunnel and nerve damage from learning ASL for the show. Her doctor told her she had to stop using sign language so much because of the damage it was doing to her hands.

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Love that the over the top gaming nerd was protesting arcade games but wearing a Bayside Tigers shirt.  Okay. 

I feel weird about this episode.  I know what message they were trying to get across and I appreciate them showing both sides.  It's extremely counterproductive, however, when every person of color in the episode is Angry Black Personized.  See: Iris, random kid in class, Chris the swindling ball player, No Wifi Gaming nerd.  I was more offended by that than Mingo's costume.

Edited by Spencer Hastings
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Daphne's friend from the Chilton field hockey team (can't remember her name) wasn't angry.  She said the photo didn't bother her.  She did warn Daphne that just because she was chill about it didn't mean other people would be, but she wasn't angry.   

I'm glad Regina asked Daphne how she'd feel about a person with a sombrero and a lawn mower because I really don't believe Daphne wouldn't  have been aware of the cultural appropriation issue already.  She's latina and she's deaf (although I can't imagine what deaf cultural appropriation would look like) those are both strong cultures.

I think I would buy this story a lot more if it was John or Bay or Toby who was in it rather than Daphne.   

Travis was super sweet at the end.  I'm so going to hate Bay when she breaks his heart over Emmett.   

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This episode was weird. I'm totally on board with the idea that no one should be belittled or ridiculed based on the group to which they belong, but the way this story was told left so many things open. For instance, Mingo didn't go to the party as " generic ghetto black guy", he went as an artist he admired, Lil Wayne, for whom the costume was spot on. Unfortunately, by making this the thing that students got all worked up over, it seemed to make light of the very real crap that minority students actually face every day. This seems to get some perfunctory treatment in the last 2 minutes of the episode, but by then, everything's over. Too many things got glossed over, but I guess this is exactly what I should expect from this show. I'm in it 'til the end, though, even if I'm on the verge of hate-watching at this point.

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  9 hours ago, Jeffurry said:

The only plot on this show that still bothers me is that something happened to Regina's hands to the point that she couldn't sign anymore. Why did they do that? Did Constance Marie not want to sign anymore?

After the first season, Constance Marie developed really bad tendonitis, carpal tunnel and nerve damage from learning ASL for the show. Her doctor told her she had to stop using sign language so much because of the damage it was doing to her hands.

Oh, ouch! I had no idea that it just mirrored real life. Awful.

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I agree with above posters above that the issue being glossed over and I personally think not dealt correctly on the show.

I understand Iris point of wanting a safe space but Mingo was dressed as Lil Wayne. Like TVForever said, he wasn't dressed as generic ghetto black guy.

Regina's example of a person dressed in a sombrero with a lawn mower failed.  A better example would have been - if someone who wasn't Latino/Latina dressed as Ricky Martin, Menudo or Selena. 

Degrassi also tried to tackle this issue and failed miserably.  The issue has too many shades of grey and is very complex. For example: what if a Caucasian likes Psy and dressed in a powder blue suit doing the gangham style dance? Is that racist? Ok, so what if it was a Japanese guy? Would that be ok? But Psy is Korean. So still ok? But Japanese and Korean are two different cultures.  And what if a hearing person came dressed up as Marleene Matlin? 

I am liking Travis and Bay. I think it's the end game for them to be happy. Fingers crossed.

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Like others said, I understand what they're trying to but they handled it wrong and badly. 

Also, I don't buy that none of the students wouldn't have wanted to play the arcade games. 

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9 minutes ago, Court said:

Also, I don't buy that none of the students wouldn't have wanted to play the arcade games. 

I agree with this.  We have an arcade here in a very "hipster"/young/trendy part of town that is all old school games and people love it.  It's always busy, even packed.  ETA: This arcade does serve beer, though.  And good beer at that with quite the variety.  But the games do all get played, many have lines of people waiting.

I miss Toby.  

Spoiler

But I'm not sure I'm going to enjoy his storyline next week.  We'll see.  I might just be happy to have him back.

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1 hour ago, Court said:

Also, I don't buy that none of the students wouldn't have wanted to play the arcade games. 

In fact, the whole "retro" game thing seems to be very "in" right now. At least in some of the cities I've visited in the past few months. It's been kind of fun seeing some of the games of my youth coming back in vogue, even if it's now considered old-school fun.

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22 hours ago, Jeffurry said:

The only plot on this show that still bothers me is that something happened to Regina's hands to the point that she couldn't sign anymore. Why did they do that? Did Constance Marie not want to sign anymore?

In the earlier seasons, it was mentioned in an article that the actress suffered tendonitis off-screen from all the signing she had to learn so quickly so they reduced her involvement from minimal to "I have a degenerative wrist condition that will render me useless if I continue so I can't sign or do hair anymore."

Edit: I didn't see someone answered the questions already - sorry! I still miss her signing however..

Edited by Eri
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6 hours ago, aquarian1 said:

I agree with this.  We have an arcade here in a very "hipster"/young/trendy part of town that is all old school games and people love it.  It's always busy, even packed.  ETA: This arcade does serve beer, though.  And good beer at that with quite the variety.  But the games do all get played, many have lines of people waiting.

Kansas City even has an old-school arcade bar in the Crossroads (the super artsy-hipster part of town). It's called Tapcade and it's always packed. 

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Can someone explain exactly how Travis was coaching baseball in China??? How was he communicating?  I have a hard enough time believing Daphne could communicate effectively with people who speak a tone-based language but  she does communicate orally and is apparently a magical lip reader.  ASL would not be used by Chinese people who are deaf.  They would have their own sign language.  So even if he were somehow coaching deaf students how would they communicate with him?   I have apparently spent too much time obsessing over this. 

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Was it just Asshole Day in Kansas City or something? Because the whole episode was just filled to the brim with assholes. You have the assholes yelling at Daphne in class, you have asshole video game guy (who literally cant go five seconds without insulting any random person who sees), the asshole baseball player, and, of course, Daphne and Mingo, who just cant get why people are pissed off through their thick heads.

I liked Bay in this episode, and I think her being a tattoo artist is a good choice for her. Its just artsy and hipster enough to keep her interested, but you can also earn a decent living if she gets a good job or a studio. Plus she and Travis seem to be in an alike place, after her selfish behavior last episode. And I liked John and Katherine working together. They were a really good team, and it was nice seeing them disagreeing, but without a bunch of drama or anger.

On the other hand, I get what they are aiming for with the cultural appropriation stuff, but MAN is it falling flat. It just comes off as everyone involved being either angry or morons. All the students freaking out about the "horrible racism" of Mingo just come across as wanting to be pissed off at someone, even if it was one minor incident that could have been cleared up quickly if people had just talked about it instead of just started making petitions and screaming at Daphne about how she isn't Latina enough or something. And Daphne and Mingo come across as morons who have no clue about cultural appropriation controversies, and refuse to just listen to any students who are offended, and just apologize for accidently offending people. Daphne is deaf Latina women from a low economic environment, she really has no empathy for the black students? The only character really making sense was Daphne's friend, who said she wasn't offended but got why other people were. This is a REALLY complicated topic (what is the difference between appropriation and appreciation? If Mingo was Asian, would it be as offensive? What if they didn't mean to offend anyone? How do we reconcile safe spaces and freedom of speech?) and this is just not landing the way the writers want it to. And, as other people have said, Mingo was dressed as a specific person, not as "Ghetto Man" or something, so it doesn't come off as someone mocking black culture, it comes across as a guy whos a hip hop fan who didn't really think about his costume. And, also, why are we doing this now?! Its the last run of episodes, lets have the characters get closer to their end goals, instead of screwing around with this racism stuff the writers suck at. Did they just have a check list of every social justice issue ever, and want to make sure they get as many in as possible?

I also call bullshit on the students not enjoying the arcade games. Retro arcade games are super popular with college students! The hipster crowd would be all over the place!

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Sometimes I'm not sure how to describe being entitled and then I watch switched at birth lol I love Bay but wtf with her just expecting to get a top spot at a top place and then being surprised she wouldn't have to do some grunt work first. Internships are a thing, Bay. Especially for a 20 year old. 

The appropriation thing was messy and probably should be left in the hands of better writers. He was dressed up as a rapper he liked not as "random ghetto guy". I think other cultures and races should be able to appreciate and learn about each other. Because I'm black I can only do or learn about so called "black things"? What if I'm interested in Indian culture? Etc. I can't dress up as say Dorothy from the wizard of oz for Halloween? Idk... anyway I digress... 

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Right? White guy can't dress as Lil' Wayne? So.... little black boy can't be Harry Potter now? or is it only going one way, dear kids in this show?

 

One of the comments on the "HateBook" (don't remember the social media they invented (i'm assuming lol) for the show) was "look at two entitled white kids...". All black kids attacking Mingo came of just as entitled: like they OWN everything black and nobody can touch it, only worship it. Also that nasty part of current student activity came to surface: be offended because you want to be offended, protest because you want to protest. It has nothing to do with the issue, you just want attention and that feeling of being important.

Iris in the end made some good points. I mean I faced some attitudes along those lines, from professors too, being often the only girl in high level math classes. And being blonde too lol What she had done to her, said to her, implied to her is wrong, hurtful and I feel for her, but that Mingo story was her trying to put a square peg into a star shaped hole.

I fully blame it on the writers, because the issue still exists and it needs to be addressed,  but doing it this way makes it worse, because it paints the every day victim as a whiny little kid that is too snowflake and way too sensitive, reacting to the "trigger word" like a hypnotized zombie. And it's wrong in relation to real cultural and racial minorities that face real problems...

What were they thinking? 

 

Also, I might be the minority, but I'm just not feeling Bay and Travis...

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2 hours ago, t7686 said:

Sometimes I'm not sure how to describe being entitled and then I watch switched at birth lol I love Bay but wtf with her just expecting to get a top spot at a top place and then being surprised she wouldn't have to do some grunt work first. Internships are a thing, Bay. Especially for a 20 year old. 

It seemed as though that spot was a one woman show, though so that didn't totally bother me. BUT it surprised me that Bay didn't think she had to do anything but show up. I guess in rural China any old person can be a tattoo artist. Because I was curious I looked up Missouri's laws. Taking on an apprentice is kind of a big deal. And to be licensed Bay has to do 50 tattoos and work for 300 hours as an apprentice before she can apply for her license. It includes education on sanitation, disease control, equipment handling etc. She can get out of it if she had a license from some place with similar license requirements, but I would imagine China may not be such a place. 

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5 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Daphne is deaf Latina women from a low economic environment, she really has no empathy for the black students?  

Do most viewers consider Daphne to be Latino? I don't.  She was raised by a Latino mother in a mostly Latino neighborhood but she is definitely a white girl. I get that it's complicated since for the first 16 years of her life she had no idea Regina wasn't her birth mother but I still don't consider her latino. She is definitely well versed in the latino culture and should be more culturally aware in general though. 

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8 minutes ago, Karen885 said:

Do most viewers consider Daphne to be Latino?

Wasn't there an episode where Daphne was dealing with entering a contest for Latino students, and they didn't want her there because she wasn't really Latino, but she still identified that way, even if she was biologically white? I still think of her as Latina, as she was raised as a Latina and spent the majority of her life thinking of herself as Latina. That guy in the episode had no right telling her she wasn't Latina. He knows her dad is white, but for all he knows, her mom could be Latina, or she could be adopted, or anything. Not all Latin people have dark skin (like how on How to Get Away with Murder, which as a light skinned Mexican American woman in the cast) or look the same. So, I don't know about all viewers, but that's how I've always thought of her.

Edited by tennisgurl
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1 hour ago, vavera4ka said:

Also, I might be the minority, but I'm just not feeling Bay and Travis...

Join me at a table for two... because I am not convinced. I'm guessing people have been rallying for them but I think I preferred when he told her that he was interested and she told him that she wasn't. Because that's how it goes in the real world. You don't automatically fall for every guy that says he likes you. Epsecially when he's dated your sister and your relationship with her has been tested in the past because of men. Just saying...

1 hour ago, Karen885 said:

Do most viewers consider Daphne to be Latino? I don't.  She was raised by a Latino mother in a mostly Latino neighborhood but she is definitely a white girl. I get that it's complicated since for the first 16 years of her life she had no idea Regina wasn't her birth mother but I still don't consider her latino. She is definitely well versed in the latino culture and should be more culturally aware in general though. 

I struggle with this at times because I too didn't really consider her to be Latina, which is hypocritical of me. I'm from the Caribbean where many people who appear to be "white" actually are considered black because that is our culture. (I say "white" because many do have some distant trace of negro blood). So I keep reminding myself that Latina is not based on the colour of your skin, but the culture in which you were raised. I'm pretty sure that Daphne celebrated her 15th birthday with a quinceanera, something I didn't do as that's NOT part of my culture, but it is part of hers. :)

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I understand being raised in a culture, and identifying as something, even though you are not the "definition" of that, but I did have a problem with her going for Latino scholarship.

It's been a while, but as far as I remember it was her "whim" not to take Kennish's money and get the education on her own dime. I understand and can respect that, but I see that scholarship as a way for some Latino girl or boy who has no other way to pay for their school. If she was still living with Regina, without knowledge of her bio dad and had no other options, even if she had done full on DNA test to show that she has absolutely no Latino blood in her, that would have been ok.

It was more pride than heritage in her case...

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All the students freaking out about the "horrible racism" of Mingo just come across as wanting to be pissed off at someone

That's how it is in real life. People just want to use their being so "offended" as a tool and get others to apologize. Political correctness isn't just there for show, it's become weaponized.

The whiny girl who moved out of her dorm because she felt "emotionally unsafe"? Haha. Okay. College kids weren't so...childish...even half a decade ago.

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Here's the thing (and I'm white so this is what I've gleaned from my Black friends) cultural appropriation has become so widespread in recent years because white people think that just because they have friends of color and/or believe in equality for all they can co-opt other people's culture for their own fun and games. It's not cool. It's like the black face white actors used to wear to play black characters in movies which is racist as hell.

Here's some context to what I've talked about above and why what Mingo did was wrong.

http://racerelations.about.com/od/diversitymatters/fl/What-Is-Cultural-Appropriation-and-Why-Is-It-Wrong.htm

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What is "co-opting" other cultures? Don't ALL cultures borrow from each other and intermix with each other, sometimes creating totally new cultures? I can't imagine anyone seriously arguing for cultural segregation (this is your culture, this is mine).

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54 minutes ago, CleoCaesar said:

That's how it is in real life. People just want to use their being so "offended" as a tool and get others to apologize. Political correctness isn't just there for show, it's become weaponized.

The whiny girl who moved out of her dorm because she felt "emotionally unsafe"? Haha. Okay. College kids weren't so...childish...even half a decade ago.

Yeah, sorry but all the over-reaction is stupid as hell. People need to choose their battles, so that when there is a real issue, it would get the right attention. Crying wolf doesn't help anyone. 

So if a non-black dresses up like Beyonce for Halloween, is that offensive? Mingo didn't do "black face". He just wore a typical hip hop attire with dreads. I've seen white people in the rap/ hip hop scene dress like that as well even when they are not trying to copy anyone. In this particular case, it's not even a race culture but a pop culture.

Edited by waving feather
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1 hour ago, maraleia said:

Here's the thing (and I'm white so this is what I've gleaned from my Black friends) cultural appropriation has become so widespread in recent years because white people think that just because they have friends of color and/or believe in equality for all they can co-opt other people's culture for their own fun and games. It's not cool. It's like the black face white actors used to wear to play black characters in movies which is racist as hell.

Here's some context to what I've talked about above and why what Mingo did was wrong.

http://racerelations.about.com/od/diversitymatters/fl/What-Is-Cultural-Appropriation-and-Why-Is-It-Wrong.htm

I totally get where you are coming from but  I still think that there is a difference between appropriating someone's culture in general terms and dressing up like a famous person as Mingo did.

For example, if an African American dress up as Giannis Antetokounmpo - the Greek Freak who is a player for the Bucks, because Giannis consider himself Greek - would I be offended? No. Would I be offended if same person dressed up as Pete Sampras? Not at all. Would I be offended if he dressed up as what society deems a sterotypical Greek male - hairy, wife beater, greasy facial hair, smoking, etc? Well, yeah. Would I get offended if Madonna, Gwen or whoever appropriated some Greek culture in their music/act? Meh, nope. I would be tickled pink they added something half decent to their music/act.  Would I get upset if a famous person appropriated some artifacts? or ancient ruins? Yep because its just wrong to buy this in my honest opinion.

I think everyone has been crapped on at one point in their lives or another. If its, race, creed, looks, brains, sexuality, economic background, religion, etc etc etc.

The writers really did a crappy job overall.  I wish they never explored this topic.  The only good thing I saw from this?  Iris is gone. Daphne now has room in the dorm and Bay and Travis can move in.  Win win!  I also enjoy the Bay and tattoo story line.  I can see an end game of her being some famous tattoo artist with her own shop in 5-10 years.

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6 hours ago, Karen885 said:

Do most viewers consider Daphne to be Latino? I don't.  She was raised by a Latino mother in a mostly Latino neighborhood but she is definitely a white girl. I get that it's complicated since for the first 16 years of her life she had no idea Regina wasn't her birth mother but I still don't consider her latino. She is definitely well versed in the latino culture and should be more culturally aware in general though. 

You talk as if being latina AND white is not possible. Latino is not a race, it's an ethnicity. You can be white, black, biracial, native, Asian AND Latino. It's not one or the other. 

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first with the non-rape that they keep going on about and now  the non-existent racism that they're making a way too big a deal about.. I'm starting to get very turned off by this show. I know people disagree with me on these issues but this is why society is the way it is.. everybody gets babied and every non-issue turns into an issue.

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I think the cultural appropriation issue is being handled so poorly. They could've handled this with so much subtly but no. 

Personally, as a black woman I wasn't offended by Mingo's Cotume- as Daphne said it wasn't as if he was wearing black face (which it's own historically offensive connotations) he was wearing hip hop attire, a dread wig and a grill just like Lil Wayne the person he was pretending to be. Dressing up as historical figures is very different than dressing as fictional characters for Halloween/acting in a movie/a play etc, but I do think people have to consider context and intention when speaking about cultural appropriation. 

i think of it this way, would ppl have been offended if Mingo came to a "dress as your fav athlete" party, and was wearing a Bulls 23 jersey and a short textured black wig to be Michael Jordan back in the day- I don't think so.

I understand everything Iris was saying, but I don't think she should've moved out. I don't think her issues are really with what Mingo did but with a variety of things (real not imagined).

Edited by Scarlett45
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On 2/9/2017 at 0:44 PM, t7686 said:

Sometimes I'm not sure how to describe being entitled and then I watch switched at birth lol I love Bay but wtf with her just expecting to get a top spot at a top place and then being surprised she wouldn't have to do some grunt work first. Internships are a thing, Bay. Especially for a 20 year old. 

Well, both of her mothers tend to jump randomly from career to career with minimal dues paying, and her father sort of randomly became a state senator without any real background in politics, so she probably just assumed that's how things work ...

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This show is blundering through this storyline with the same tone-deaf ineptitude with which they treated the campus rape storyline, so I kinda feel like I've already said most of what there is to say back when that was going on. The errors are the same in essentials, only the details are different. 

So instead, I'd like to take a moment to point out the sheer absurdity of the plot point that was that last scene in the tattoo studio. Bay's recently gotten back from China, made a huge mistake that got her fired, and has come to the tattoo studio to beg for her job back. At that exact moment, three men are speaking in Chinese about how they are planning to rob the studio. As one does.

Like, suspension of disbelief can only stretch so far, and I found that scene just too ridiculously stupid to pass unremarked.

Edited by Anisky
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On 2017-02-09 at 8:19 AM, tennisgurl said:

Was it just Asshole Day in Kansas City or something? Because the whole episode was just filled to the brim with assholes. You have the assholes yelling at Daphne in class, you have asshole video game guy (who literally cant go five seconds without insulting any random person who sees), the asshole baseball player, and, of course, Daphne and Mingo, who just cant get why people are pissed off through their thick heads.

I liked Bay in this episode, and I think her being a tattoo artist is a good choice for her. Its just artsy and hipster enough to keep her interested, but you can also earn a decent living if she gets a good job or a studio. Plus she and Travis seem to be in an alike place, after her selfish behavior last episode. And I liked John and Katherine working together. They were a really good team, and it was nice seeing them disagreeing, but without a bunch of drama or anger.

On the other hand, I get what they are aiming for with the cultural appropriation stuff, but MAN is it falling flat. It just comes off as everyone involved being either angry or morons. All the students freaking out about the "horrible racism" of Mingo just come across as wanting to be pissed off at someone, even if it was one minor incident that could have been cleared up quickly if people had just talked about it instead of just started making petitions and screaming at Daphne about how she isn't Latina enough or something. And Daphne and Mingo come across as morons who have no clue about cultural appropriation controversies, and refuse to just listen to any students who are offended, and just apologize for accidently offending people. Daphne is deaf Latina women from a low economic environment, she really has no empathy for the black students? The only character really making sense was Daphne's friend, who said she wasn't offended but got why other people were. This is a REALLY complicated topic (what is the difference between appropriation and appreciation? If Mingo was Asian, would it be as offensive? What if they didn't mean to offend anyone? How do we reconcile safe spaces and freedom of speech?) and this is just not landing the way the writers want it to. And, as other people have said, Mingo was dressed as a specific person, not as "Ghetto Man" or something, so it doesn't come off as someone mocking black culture, it comes across as a guy whos a hip hop fan who didn't really think about his costume. And, also, why are we doing this now?! Its the last run of episodes, lets have the characters get closer to their end goals, instead of screwing around with this racism stuff the writers suck at. Did they just have a check list of every social justice issue ever, and want to make sure they get as many in as possible?

I also call bullshit on the students not enjoying the arcade games. Retro arcade games are super popular with college students! The hipster crowd would be all over the place!

I wouldn't get why they were upset either. It was completely unjustified like they just wanted an excuse to be angry about something. 

On 2017-02-10 at 8:28 AM, Jaclyn88 said:

first with the non-rape that they keep going on about and now  the non-existent racism that they're making a way too big a deal about.. I'm starting to get very turned off by this show. I know people disagree with me on these issues but this is why society is the way it is.. everybody gets babied and every non-issue turns into an issue.

Agreed, I don't at all like how they handle social issues on this show. They take social justice warrior to the max. What happened with tank was really not rape and this incident was not racism 

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