All Episodes Talk: Lorelai and Rory and the People They Love

[andromeda331]

17 hours ago, ghoulina said:

Richard was an ass in that episode, but I kind of felt badly for him. He had just retired and didn't know what to do with himself. This was a man who had worked hard his entire life. Suddenly he feels useless; and unwanted in his own home. It was also quite obvious that Lorelai didn't really want him hanging out in Stars Hollow with her either. Richard was a smart man. He KNEW everyone was pawning him off on each other. 

So, to me, his behavior that day was about fighting for a modicum of control. Making himself feel like he was still that "businessman". That leader. It wasn't his place (in either case); he was definitely out of line. But I understood where he was coming from. 

But I'm one who generally likes the elder Gilmores more than daughter and granddaughter, so I likely have a different perspective. 

I do feel bad for him. He's out of a job that he loved and worked hard and didn't know what to do. He's trying to find something else to feel it. He was important and did stuff. But its also easy to see why Emily and Lorelai got frustrated with him. He wasn't just following them around and spending time with them. He was corrected them on how to do their jobs which was driving them both crazy. Neither Emily nor Lorelai needed any help they knew how to do their jobs very well. Telling Emily she didn't need to get her hair done, following her to her various committee meetings given how he speaks up and spoke to Lorelai there's no way he wasn't doing the same thing where ever he went with Emily. He sent a freaking note to a neighbor about needing a new roof. He was out of line butting into to Lorelai's business and had Lorelai done the same thing he would have been pissed and righty so. Its a funny episode. Poor Emily calling up and begging Lorelai to take Richard anywhere "the zoo, Rhode Island". The talk between Emily and Lorelai at the table Emily really was trying to be understanding, the talk at the end with Richard telling Lorelai what it was like for him now, being a burden. Which is really sad. 

But there's one more part that makes it a little hard for me to be completely sympathetic to Richard in this situation because of what he said in Presenting Lorelai about that he was being phased out. That he's the one who invented phasing out and did the same thing to other co-workers that was now happening to him. It never comes up again. I really wish they hadn't said that Richard invented it. It makes it a lot harder to feel sympathy for him in Richard in Stars Hollow knowing he did the same thing to other people. The only difference was he quit. 

[Kohola3]

4 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

They knew each other and probably had the same banter and flirting for years. She said what she said to get the linens they really needed sooner and knew him well enough to know that would work. Richard was in a different business. His way of handling people is going to be different from Lorelai's.

I agree. I deal with lots of different levels of people and I talk to them each in a different manner. Some would be turned off by "business talk" and like the informality.  Others are very staid so I have to match that. 

Richard criticizing her was uncalled for since he had apparently never seen her in action.  There is not only one type of "management" and he didn't know hers.

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

Richard discussing Lorelai’s professional demeanor is uncalled for point blank, because it’s not his place to criticize her in that domain at all. His parental authority does not extend into her workplace, and he has no standing in the running of the Independence Inn. He was out of line. 

It also makes it hard to sympathize with him when he bemoaned that he was a nuisance to his wife and a burden to his daughter. The fact of his presence was not the issue, the fact that he butted in to their established routines and undermined their expertise regarding how their days should be run was. If Emily or Lorelai charged into his office and rearranged his schedule, chastised him in front of his subordinates, and criticized his food and clothing choices, I doubt he would’ve been anywhere near so diplomatic as they were. 

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, ZuluQueenOfDwarves said:

Richard discussing Lorelai’s professional demeanor is uncalled for point blank, because it’s not his place to criticize her in that domain at all. His parental authority does not extend into her workplace, and he has no standing in the running of the Independence Inn. He was out of line. 

It also makes it hard to sympathize with him when he bemoaned that he was a nuisance to his wife and a burden to his daughter. The fact of his presence was not the issue, the fact that he butted in to their established routines and undermined their expertise regarding how their days should be run was. If Emily or Lorelai charged into his office and rearranged his schedule, chastised him in front of his subordinates, and criticized his food and clothing choices, I doubt he would’ve been anywhere near so diplomatic as they were. 

Are you kidding? He would have had a meltdown of epic proportions. Emily and Lorelai knew their respective business perfectly well and had for years (decades in Emily's case) the superior way he assumed that he knew better made me incredibly stabby.

[andromeda331]

15 hours ago, ZuluQueenOfDwarves said:

Richard discussing Lorelai’s professional demeanor is uncalled for point blank, because it’s not his place to criticize her in that domain at all. His parental authority does not extend into her workplace, and he has no standing in the running of the Independence Inn. He was out of line. 

It also makes it hard to sympathize with him when he bemoaned that he was a nuisance to his wife and a burden to his daughter. The fact of his presence was not the issue, the fact that he butted in to their established routines and undermined their expertise regarding how their days should be run was. If Emily or Lorelai charged into his office and rearranged his schedule, chastised him in front of his subordinates, and criticized his food and clothing choices, I doubt he would’ve been anywhere near so diplomatic as they were. 

That is what makes it hard. He had been criticizing Lorelai all day long. Starting with the grapefruit. Its none of his business what Lorelai does or doesn't eat for breakfast. She tried to be polite pointing out she doesn't really like grapefruit but he continued on with his lecture until Lorelai gives in and goes to beg Luke for a grapefruit. He won't take no for an answer. Then continues at the Inn over Lorelai not wearing a jacket and then how she talked to her supplier. Once again Lorelai tries to point out that she knew the man for years but Richard doesn't care and continues to lecture her. Lorelai once again just nods trying not to say anything and get it over with. She knows her job. She knows how to handle her suppliers, and everything else. He continues over their Chinese food order even after they explained they over order for leftovers, then its about Yale and then the car when Lorelai finally breaks. He was on her non-stop the entire day butting into her business, lecturing her, and telling her how she should do things. Not just once but several times before Lorelai finally broke. Richard turns it all around so she feels sorry for him. Poor Richard. Lorelai and Emily both had great sympathy for him and were the ones trying to be patient and understanding. He was the one who just wouldn't stop until Emily called up Lorelai begging her to take Richard for a day and until Lorelai finally had enough after a day of putting up with him butting in and telling her how to do things. 

[andromeda331]

Thinking about that comment Trix makes if she's ever held hostage not to let Emily make the drop. You have to love the optimism Trix has in thinking that Emily want to get her back. Every time I watch that episode and she says the line I imagine Emily getting a phone call from a kidnapper "If you ever want to see your mother-in-law again..." And Emily pausing really thinking about it and how nice her life would be without having to put up with Trix. Maybe if your ever kidnapped Trix, make sure the kidnapper calls Richard instead. 

[Taryn74]

5 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Thinking about that comment Trix makes if she's ever held hostage not to let Emily make the drop. You have to love the optimism Trix has in thinking that Emily want to get her back. Every time I watch that episode and she says the line I imagine Emily getting a phone call from a kidnapper "If you ever want to see your mother-in-law again..." And Emily pausing really thinking about it and how nice her life would be without having to put up with Trix. Maybe if your ever kidnapped Trix, make sure the kidnapper calls Richard instead. 

HA!!!!

[chessiegal]

Well I was enjoying watching reruns on UP until ASP decided to destroy the show with her stupid April storyline because she was pissed at the network on her renewal deal. I'll wait until it starts over, although the series finale always makes me cry.

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, chessiegal said:

Well I was enjoying watching reruns on UP until ASP decided to destroy the show with her stupid April storyline because she was pissed at the network on her renewal deal. I'll wait until it starts over, although the series finale always makes me cry.

Yup. I've been watching TCM instead. I'll be back to see Lorelai sing I Will Always Love You and then the finale.

[chessiegal]

1 minute ago, peacheslatour said:

Yup. I've been watching TCM instead. I'll be back to see Lorelai sing I Will Always Love You and then the finale.

Thanks for reminding me on the Karaoke night. Lauren has a lovely singing voice.

[andromeda331]

5 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Yup. I've been watching TCM instead. I'll be back to see Lorelai sing I Will Always Love You and then the finale.

5 hours ago, chessiegal said:

Thanks for reminding me on the Karaoke night. Lauren has a lovely singing voice.

I love those too as well. I always skip when they get to the April storyline too until Will You Be My Lorelai Gilmore? Then it starts getting better again. I do hate that we never got to see Gypsy's Pat Benatar that would have been awesome. The finale always makes me wish we got a 9th season but not the revival. But watching it start up back at the beginning again is always great. Despite so many complaints, bad storylines etc. I really do love this show. 

[ghoulina]

I don't skip anything, but the Chris 2.0 storyline always bothers me way more than the April storyline. (Although, they do overlap for a bit, so you'd be skipping some of the same stuff.) I usually multitask with a book when Chris is back. Ugh. 

[peacheslatour]

3 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I don't skip anything, but the Chris 2.0 storyline always bothers me way more than the April storyline. (Although, they do overlap for a bit, so you'd be skipping some of the same stuff.) I usually multitask with a book when Chris is back. Ugh. 

Same here.

[chitowngirl]

Ok, so I’m watching on UP. Those Are Strings Pinocchio was on. It’s near the end and Lorelai grabs Rory’s hand and they’re going down the hall at Chilton. Cut to Lorelai entering Luke’s and asking Luke not to get engaged on his trip. Cut back to Chilton where Lorelai is deciding where to leave their “mark”. ????? Why the clumsy re-edit???

[Kohola3]

45 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:

Cut to Lorelai entering Luke’s and asking Luke not to get engaged on his trip. Cut back to Chilton where Lorelai is deciding where to leave their “mark”.

Luke was dreaming.  They show him waking up.

[Jack Shaftoe]

So I was rewatching Those Lazy-Hazy-Crazy Days and once again I was dismayed by Richard and Emily's blind spot when it comes to Christopher. Richard saying that "Christopher always tries to do the right thing" is downright bizarre and utterly nonsensical. If you watch the scene without knowing the background you would think Christopher is some great guy whom Lorelai rejected again and again for no reason.

It reminded me of the even more bizarre scene in season 1 in which Christopher's parents blamed Lorelai for Christopher not going to Princeton and "ruining his life". Lorelai has many faults but the notion that Christopher couldn't go to Princeton because Lorelai had a child with him, a child in whose raising he did not participate at all, financially or otherwise, is insane. This plot could have worked if their families weren't rich and Christopher had to get a job to support Rory and Lorelai but nothing of the sort happened. Honestly, I am surprised Lorelai didn't laugh in the face of Christopher's dad because the idiot totally deserved it.

Back to episode 3.01. - Emily immediately starting to yell at Lorelai upon hearing that she and Christopher were no longer together was also yet another example of her low opinion of her daughter. Of course it must be her fault, that precious Christopher could never do something like that!

Edited September 6, 2019 by Jack Shaftoe

[scarynikki12]

Christopher was willing to get married and Lorelai wasn't so he gets a lifetime pass with the Gilmores while she is forever scapegoat for whenever something goes wrong in their lives. With the Haydens they also use Lorelai as their scapegoat to avoid accepting the truth that Christopher was never getting into Princeton nor live up to the expectations of being a Hayden.

[junienmomo]

The elder Gilmores’ treatment of Christopher always reinforces my opinion that they didn’t like Lorelai very much.

[peacheslatour]

15 hours ago, junienmomo said:

The elder Gilmores’ treatment of Christopher always reinforces my opinion that they didn’t like Lorelai very much.

That time Lorelai went to her father after he went back into business with Jason's father, leaving Jason with nothing. Richard was so cold to her, it was almost like he hated her.

[andromeda331]

On 9/5/2019 at 8:34 PM, junienmomo said:

The elder Gilmores’ treatment of Christopher always reinforces my opinion that they didn’t like Lorelai very much.

I really don't think they do. They are so willing to treat Christopher well all because he proposed to Lorelai because if that they don't care that he completely bailed on raising and supporting their perfect granddaughter. Richard's praising Christopher for being a "brilliant" businessman in the pilot when Lorelai's the one who's been working the past fifteen years, worked her way up to manager and is actually taking business classes. Emily says as much in Come Home she doesn't actually like Christopher he's weak but she still wants them together because he has the right pedigree. Richard doesn't defend Lorelai to Straub because he insulted Lorelai no because of the name. They really like and need to blame Lorelai for everything that goes wrong. They can never admit Emily in particular that they possibly made any mistakes. No its more important to her and probably both of them that their right, they have to be right then try and have a relationship with their daughter. Emily's happy to scream and yell at Lorelai after seeing shed but refuses to listen a single word when Lorelai tries to explain. Richard would rather yell at Lorelai about what Lorelai did to them after he "defended the Gilmore name". Lorelai just for one moment she actually believed her father defended her, for her. Only to learn it was all about the last name. Lorelai tries to explain at the end of Hammers and Veils why she doesn't like to tell her mother things when something good happens Lorelai's always afraid her mother will ruin it and when something bad happens she's worried she'll be there to tell her I told you so. I don't think they do like her very much. I go back and forth on whether they even love Lorelai. But its more important for them to always be right, to always blame Lorelai and that Lorelai being in the "right" marriage and living the "right" life then her happiness, then have her married to someone who's weak, what she wants or anything else. 

[chessiegal]

Yes, recently I watched the episode where they throw the mating ritual party for their alumni friends" , whp all happen to have sons, and Rory is the only girl and Emily dresses her up like a princess. At the end when Lorelai calls them, Emily says "It's too late for you, but it's not too late for Rory". They cared more about what they thought was the proper pairing and breeding than the happiness of their child.

[readster]

7 minutes ago, chessiegal said:

Yes, recently I watched the episode where they throw the mating ritual party for their alumni friends" , whp all happen to have sons, and Rory is the only girl and Emily dresses her up like a princess. At the end when Lorelai calls them, Emily says "It's too late for you, but it's not too late for Rory". They cared more about what they thought was the proper pairing and breeding than the happiness of their child.

Right and that's where it even comes full Circle in Wedding Bell Blues. When Emily brought Chris to bring Lorelai and Luke up with: "But I like your breeding and name." Or when Richard admitted that his and Emily's song was because Lorelai had a sever ear ache and they couldn't keep a nanny. With Lorelai even telling Luke: "I just wanted them to hold me instead of a new nanny every day." Plus, you also go into how Straub treated Christopher and Chris's only family member that seemed to love him was his grandfather. Pretty much The Elder parents just had a kid to keep the name and hated children. We even got that from all of the Gilmores' rich "friends" they treated their kids in name only. The only way they actually showed affection is if they followed their warp sense of how the rich should live. Other wise, they yelled at them, told them how they were doing it "all wrong" and even if they were in a hospital like how Logan did. They still are: "Well, they need to stay there and think about what they did." It was boarding on mental child abuse and then when Lorelai or someone else would be pissed at them for the right reasons it was: "Why do they hate me?" "I'm only doing what I believe is right." Yeah, discouraging, never standing up for your kids or even having them just be a shoulder to cry on. OH NO! The horror if they did that.

[Jack Shaftoe]

17 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

They can never admit Emily in particular that they possibly made any mistakes. No its more important to her and probably both of them that their right, they have to be right then try and have a relationship with their daughter.

Yes, and they drive me crazy with their "I am always right" attitude. Lorelai, with her million quirks and tendency to be extremely stubborn is still a million times more likely to admit she was wrong. Now, she might do it in an immature fashion but she is not nearly as unreasonable in that respect than Emily and Richard.

My very slow rewatch is continued with Haunted Leg today and once again, Emily's attitude towards Lorelai in regards to Christopher pissed me off. Not only was she acting as if Lorelai were 16 and living in Victorian England and thus needs her mother to pick a husband for her, but she also should have been perfectly aware that the surest way of getting Lorelai to not do something would be for Emily to suggest it. And of course Christopher had some nerve complaining about Rory not calling him (in addition to complaining about Lorelai cutting him off after he dumped her) after being a non-entity as a father for her entire life. If Emily had any genuine affection for Lorelai and/or Rory she should have called him on his BS but no, she kept dreaming of getting him and Lorelai back together. And in the beginning of the episode Emily is all outraged that Lorelai left after her dear parents yelled at her for daring to be dumped by dear Christopher in the previous episodes.

Honestly, I have never questioned Lorelai's decision to avoid contact with her parents as much as possible. Time and again they literally treated her as if she were mentally challenged and they had the full right to make decisions for her, despite her being thirty-something.

Edited September 7, 2019 by Jack Shaftoe

[Katy M]

9 hours ago, chessiegal said:

Yes, recently I watched the episode where they throw the mating ritual party for their alumni friends" , whp all happen to have sons, and Rory is the only girl and Emily dresses her up like a princess.

I've always wondered what they told the people they were inviting. did they know this was a husband-search party?  did their sons?  it was  like a weird mini-The Bachelorette.

[chessiegal]

The young men seemed to understand what it was all about with the meat market party. Some even commented on it. When Logan "rescued" Rory, the guy she was talking to commented that if she already had a boyfriend, what was he doing there.

[andromeda331]

7 hours ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

Yes, and they drive me crazy with their "I am always right" attitude. Lorelai, with her million quirks and tendency to be extremely stubborn is still a million times more likely to admit she was wrong. Now, she might do it in an immature fashion but she is not nearly as unreasonable in that respect than Emily and Richard.

My very slow rewatch is continued with Haunted Leg today and once again, Emily's attitude towards Lorelai in regards to Christopher pissed me off. Not only was she acting as if Lorelai were 16 and living in Victorian England and thus needs her mother to pick a husband for her, but she also should have been perfectly aware that the surest way of getting Lorelai to not do something would be for Emily to suggest it. And of course Christopher had some nerve complaining about Rory not calling him (in addition to complaining about Lorelai cutting him off after he dumped her) after being a non-entity as a father for her entire life. If Emily had any genuine affection for Lorelai and/or Rory she should have called him on his BS but no, she kept dreaming of getting him and Lorelai back together. And in the beginning of the episode Emily is all outraged that Lorelai left after her dear parents yelled at her for daring to be dumped by dear Christopher in the previous episodes.

Honestly, I have never questioned Lorelai's decision to avoid contact with her parents as much as possible. Time and again they literally treated her as if she were mentally challenged and they had the full right to make decisions for her, despite her being thirty-something.

I've never questioned it either. What gets hard as the series goes on and it continues is why Lorelai don't cut them out of her life again and this time for good. Emily sees Lorelai holding a wedding dress and high tails it to Christopher's to break up Luke and Lorelai because he has good genes and Emily Gilmore can't have diner owner for a son-in-law.  Who cares that Lorelai loves him, he's been employed longer then Christopher ever has, has done so much for Lorelai and Rory, while Christopher has done none of those things and Emily doesn't even really like and won't make Lorelai happy. She's shocked when Lorelai won't speak to her afterwards and goes to talk to Luke. Lorelai still doesn't come to FND Emily and Richard have that horrible conversation in So...Good Talk about Lorelai 

Emily: I only want the best for her and since she is incapable of judging what is right and what is wrong I had to step in, I had to act. -

Richard: Yes, you did. You acted, and it backfired.

Emily: Richard.

Richard: Well, it did. It was a noble effort, but it failed. And now we have to dea| with the reality in front of us. However misguided Lorelai's feelings are right now the fact is, she is not willing to deal with you. She will, however, deal with me. And at least this way, we still have contact with her. Contact. Please. And, hopefully, with time we will be able to convince her to come back and things will return to normal. However, if we simply cut her off, no contact whatsoever then the odds of being able to get things back to the status quo are not very good at all. Don't you agree? I thought so. All right, now, don't worry. I have everything under control.

You'd think they were talking about a mental patient instead of their grown adult daughter and who cares about her happiness and what she wants. Nope its all about what they want. And of course neither think Emily did anything wrong. 

Emily having Luke come to FND so she could insult him completely Richard playing golf with Luke so he could try and talk/force Luke into changing everything about him so Luke would be "respectable" for Richard and Emily. So they wouldn't be embarrassed by him.   

[andromeda331]

17 hours ago, readster said:

Right and that's where it even comes full Circle in Wedding Bell Blues. When Emily brought Chris to bring Lorelai and Luke up with: "But I like your breeding and name." Or when Richard admitted that his and Emily's song was because Lorelai had a sever ear ache and they couldn't keep a nanny. With Lorelai even telling Luke: "I just wanted them to hold me instead of a new nanny every day." Plus, you also go into how Straub treated Christopher and Chris's only family member that seemed to love him was his grandfather. Pretty much The Elder parents just had a kid to keep the name and hated children. We even got that from all of the Gilmores' rich "friends" they treated their kids in name only. The only way they actually showed affection is if they followed their warp sense of how the rich should live. Other wise, they yelled at them, told them how they were doing it "all wrong" and even if they were in a hospital like how Logan did. They still are: "Well, they need to stay there and think about what they did." It was boarding on mental child abuse and then when Lorelai or someone else would be pissed at them for the right reasons it was: "Why do they hate me?" "I'm only doing what I believe is right." Yeah, discouraging, never standing up for your kids or even having them just be a shoulder to cry on. OH NO! The horror if they did that.

Your right I don't think we ever saw a single one of among the rich that seemed like decent parents. Christopher's parents were crap, Paris's parents were so completely absent they couldn't even be bothered to go to her graduation, Logan's parents were assholes, and even the guys at the steam room at the country club Richard talks to when he takes Rory golfing in the third episode with their comments about their granddaughters, and Jason's parents. None of them really cared about their kids as anything beyond carrying on the name. They didn't want kids. They wanted mindless robots who carried on their name, they could program and they didn't have to do anything else.

[Kohola3]

4 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

You're right I don't think we ever saw a single one of among the rich that seemed like decent parents.

That's why ASP's obsession with money as the antidote for every problem was so weird.  She wrote that whole parental generation as horrible people but then made sure that the money was the focus of fun and games.  The rolling-in-dough LDB were supposed to be such adventurous and cool kids.  Logan was the hero, swooping in with his chauffeured limo to transport Rory to her mom and buying Birkin bags as little tokens of affection,  Christopher inherits a fortune and pays for Yale so there is no longer an obligation to the elder Gilmores.

Money bad, money good.  Pick one.

[readster]

4 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Your right I don't think we ever saw a single one of among the rich that seemed like decent parents. Christopher's parents were crap, Paris's parents were so completely absent they couldn't even be bothered to go to her graduation, Logan's parents were assholes, and even the guys at the steam room at the country club Richard talks to when he takes Rory golfing in the third episode with their comments about their granddaughters, and Jason's parents. None of them really cared about their kids as anything beyond carrying on the name. They didn't want kids. They wanted mindless robots who carried on their name, they could program and they didn't have to do anything else.

Right and I think it got worst when you got Richard and Emily's generation, but how people like Paris's parents or the Huntzburgers were. It's like the old Klive saying: "As much as we try to avoid being like our parents, we turn into a more twisted version of them. Some good, some worst." I think Rory said it best: "But your dad and grandfather did all that stuff too." Logan: "Yeah, but they eventually gave it up and took over the business."

Something that also bothered me about the revival was when we saw the LDB they were not guys in their 30s that had "grew up" and moved on. They were a bunch of people trying to act like they could be 19 again because you know, they had the time and money to do that followed by: "Oh damn, my knee surgery, I guess I'm not as young as I once was." Like they were some 50 year old with a mid life crisis. Hence, acting worst then their parents were at that age who were working, had a family and trying to have a life that didn't lead to meaningless sex and passed out on the lawn and mom and dad being called.  Yeah, so great the life of 32 and then going: "Shit, I have to be at work tomorrow." 

  Talk about screwed up raising. 

6 minutes ago, Kohola3 said:

That's why ASP's obsession with money as the antidote for every problem was so weird.  She wrote that whole parental generation as horrible people but then made sure that the money was the focus of fun and games.  The rolling-in-dough LDB were supposed to be such adventurous and cool kids.  Logan was the hero, swooping in with his chauffeured limo to transport Rory to her mom and buying Birkin bags as little tokens of affection,  Christopher inherits a fortune and pays for Yale so there is no longer an obligation to the elder Gilmores.

Money bad, money good.  Pick one.

Or: "Money will never buy me happiness, but hell I need it or I can't do shit!" Yeah, it was like with Emily. Either realize the past is the past and move on or go be a condescending: "I hated how my mother forced me to do this crap, but I'm going to do it anyhow." It was like how Luke wondered what the DAR was and Emily and the other women kept laughing. How about you, I don't know: "JUST ANSWER THE DAMN QUESTION?" Instead it was: "Oh you poor, diner owner, you don't know anything and are pathetic." 

[Jack Shaftoe]

I just don't understand why Emily was so obsessed with Lorelai's love life. If Rory wasn't in the picture, at least it would have made some sense that she would be pushing for grandchildren but that wasn't the case. She knew perfectly well that Christopher was a manchild who made even Lorelai look like paragon of maturity and responsibility. She knew Lorelai had nothing but contempt for high society and even if she had magically convinced her wayward daughter to come back into the fold, her quirky ways would inevitably have embarrassed Emily in front of her rich (idiot) friends again and again. If this weren't a TV show Lorelai would have cut Emily and Richard out of her life for good at some point, since they so richly deserved that. It's as if ASP and company had decided that good acting alone could make up for any flaws of the characters (this also sometimes applies to Lorelai, Paris, etc.).

Edited September 8, 2019 by Jack Shaftoe

[readster]

1 hour ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

I just don't understand why Emily was so obsessed with Lorelai's love life. If Rory wasn't in the picture, at least it would have made some sense that she would be pushing for grandchildren but that wasn't the case. She knew perfectly well that Christopher was a manchild who made even Lorelai look like paragon of maturity and responsibility. She knew Lorelai had nothing but contempt for high society and even if she had magically convinced her wayward daughter to come back into the fold, her quirky ways would inevitably have embarrassed Emily in front of her rich (idiot) friends again and again. If this weren't a TV show Lorelai would have cut Emily and Richard out of her life for good at some point, since they so richly deserved that. It's as if ASP and company had decided that good acting alone could make up for any flaws of the characters (this also sometimes applies to Lorelai, Paris, etc.).

Right and that's where shows start going down hill and eventually cancelled. They start getting to the point, it doesn't make any sense. They can't EXPLAIN the reasoning behind things and just keep going with: "come on you can fill in WHY the act like this." No, they don't. The last good thing was when Emily in the revival finally gold everyone in the DAR that it was all bullshit and everything died with Richard and she was done living a lie of something she NO LONGER enjoyed. However, that was like a accumulation of the entire series. Yet still they had to throw in the inheritance to Luke to "Get him out of the diner business. Yeah, doesn't fly when you are pushing 60. Sorry, I think by that point they would realize that Luke was happy how things were.  

[scarynikki12]

Here's a question: do we think Lorelai ever told Max she loved him between his proposal and calling off the wedding? For story purposes it makes sense that we never saw it with Max because I think the Ps did intend for us to see her say it to her husband but I have a hard time buying that Max went through their engagement not noticing or minding her not saying it. They did have Lorelai tell Sookie "we all still love Max" when she called to tell her the wedding was off so it's possible she said it once and that satisfied him. Or maybe he did mind but privately assumed that she'd say it during their vows. I don't know but it occurred to me today.

[ghoulina]

16 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

Here's a question: do we think Lorelai ever told Max she loved him between his proposal and calling off the wedding? For story purposes it makes sense that we never saw it with Max because I think the Ps did intend for us to see her say it to her husband but I have a hard time buying that Max went through their engagement not noticing or minding her not saying it. They did have Lorelai tell Sookie "we all still love Max" when she called to tell her the wedding was off so it's possible she said it once and that satisfied him. Or maybe he did mind but privately assumed that she'd say it during their vows. I don't know but it occurred to me today.

I think this show is really terrible with having characters express love and affection. I always remember being struck how they say goodbye to each other without "I love you", or a hug or kiss. I've been with my husband 13 years and we always say, "I love you". Multiple times a day. I know we're not oddballs. I'm not saying they never did that stuff, but I always found the romantic couples to be less "romantic" with each other than I'd expect. 

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, ghoulina said:

I think this show is really terrible with having characters express love and affection. I always remember being struck how they say goodbye to each other without "I love you", or a hug or kiss. I've been with my husband 13 years and we always say, "I love you". Multiple times a day. I know we're not oddballs. I'm not saying they never did that stuff, but I always found the romantic couples to be less "romantic" with each other than I'd expect. 

Same here. And every visit and phone call from my son ends with "love you, mom."

[readster]

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

Same here. And every visit and phone call from my son ends with "love you, mom."

Yep, say it to my wife every day and my son. I even was in a shelter place with a tornado went by my area this week. I texted out: "I love you." just in case. 

[peacheslatour]

1 minute ago, readster said:

Yep, say it to my wife every day and my son. I even was in a shelter place with a tornado went by my area this week. I texted out: "I love you." just in case. 

 I'm glad you're ok. Wow, how scary. My husband is the one who taught me to do it. My parents, while affectionate, lovely people weren't overly demonstrative. He told me when you say goodbye, you never know if it's the last time, shit happens. We never part without a hug, a kiss and an I love you.

[Kohola3]

3 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I think this show is really terrible with having characters express love and affection.

It's always been my feeling that the Palladino's were like that in real life.  Viewers were begging for even the most rudimentary shows of affection and we never got much even when Luke and Lorelai got together.  The only "I love you's" I recall between them were blurted out in times of frustration (the discussion about the wedding in that awful Valentine's debacle and when Lorelai was giving Luke an ultimatum), not tender scenes.

[lulu1960]

Just now, Kohola3 said:

It's always been my feeling that the Palladino's were like that in real life.  Viewers were begging for even the most rudimentary shows of affection and we never got much even when Luke and Lorelai got together.  The only "I love you's" I recall between them were blurted out in times of frustration (the discussion about the wedding in that awful Valentine's debacle and when Lorelai was giving Luke an ultimatum), not tender scenes.

Those were the only times. I think the Palladinos were more the "actions speak louder" people. Ice rinks built, "I just like to see you happy." You can pull sausages out of me."

[readster]

14 hours ago, lulu1960 said:

Those were the only times. I think the Palladinos were more the "actions speak louder" people. Ice rinks built, "I just like to see you happy." You can pull sausages out of me."

Right, it was that. Even when they had crap like Christopher or the Elder Gilmores doing things it was more of: "see that's why." Yeah, because constantly sleeping with someone shows "love". Dropping off checks and giving the occasional hug should be enough. When really, just say the damn words.

[andromeda331]

Except for Rune I really do like Sookie's and Jackson's first date. It didn't go well but it made sense. Their first date, they were trying really hard. A fancy restaurant, and I like Lorelai helping Sookie from getting dressed, to trying to steer the conversation back to Jackson and taking her away to talk. I can see why Sookie kind of ignores Jackson, its not that she wants too but she's just really likes him and is afraid of messing that up and really nervous. Jackson being confused and almost leaving with Rune to go bowling before Sookie speaks up.  A nice touch was Sookie knowing Jackson's number by heart. 

[Taryn74]

26 minutes ago, andromeda331 said:

Except for Rune I really do like Sookie's and Jackson's first date. It didn't go well but it made sense. Their first date, they were trying really hard. A fancy restaurant, and I like Lorelai helping Sookie from getting dressed, to trying to steer the conversation back to Jackson and taking her away to talk. I can see why Sookie kind of ignores Jackson, its not that she wants too but she's just really likes him and is afraid of messing that up and really nervous. Jackson being confused and almost leaving with Rune to go bowling before Sookie speaks up.  A nice touch was Sookie knowing Jackson's number by heart. 

I do, too. They both looked so nice, and like you said they were trying so hard! It was sweet.

I'm glad it worked out for them, they're my favorite couple on this show. (As long as I ignore the forced vasectomy/surprise pregnancy thing.)

[andromeda331]

34 minutes ago, Taryn74 said:

I do, too. They both looked so nice, and like you said they were trying so hard! It was sweet.

I'm glad it worked out for them, they're my favorite couple on this show. (As long as I ignore the forced vasectomy/surprise pregnancy thing.)

Their my favorite too as long as I ignore that part too. They really love each other and share their love of food. They really are perfect for each other.

[ghoulina]

I thought the Rune part was hilarious!!!

[peacheslatour]

13 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

I thought the Rune part was hilarious!!!

I wanted him dead.

[andromeda331]

10 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I wanted him dead.

So did I. He was that bad in one episode. And then they brought him back.

[ghoulina]

On 9/27/2019 at 1:25 PM, peacheslatour said:

I wanted him dead.

I definitely didn't like Rune himself. He was awful. That's what made it so funny? I don't know. I can't really articulate it, but I think I just found him to be one of those love-to-hate characters. 

[Katy M]

11 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

I definitely didn't like Rune himself. He was awful. That's what made it so funny? I don't know. I can't really articulate it, but I think I just found him to be one of those love-to-hate characters. 

I thought it was funny, too, because he was just uber-ridiculous.  OK, Lorelai's not his type.  That's fine.  But, this was a blind double-date, not an arranged marriage.  You grin and bear it for a couple of hours.  I could also understand his being disgruntled if they had had tickets to a concert or sporting event that Jackson was making him miss, or even if they were in a bowling tournament. but, no, it was just a night out of bowling that they could do any time.   Lorelai should have dropped it about his name, but he had already been rude to her by that point, so, yeah, I just think the unreasonableness of it all made it funny.

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, ghoulina said:

I definitely didn't like Rune himself. He was awful. That's what made it so funny? I don't know. I can't really articulate it, but I think I just found him to be one of those love-to-hate characters. 

That episode is on right now and I hate him even more than I did the first time. What a jerk. And he's a manbaby of the first order. When Jackson is saying "Look you're staying at my house rent free, eating my food and using my stuff, can't you just behave?" And Rune is all  "Why can't we just go out, the two of us?" Jeez, he should just go home to mama, he's not ready to socialize with adults.

[andromeda331]

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

That episode is on right now and I hate him even more than I did the first time. What a jerk. And he's a manbaby of the first order. When Jackson is saying "Look you're staying at my house rent free, eating my food and using my stuff, can't you just behave?" And Rune is all  "Why can't we just go out, the two of us?" Jeez, he should just go home to mama, he's not ready to socialize with adults.

He really is a jerk. For the moment he saw Lorelai and insisting to talk to Jackson and getting pissed at Jackson for setting him up with "that". Seriously what was the big deal? Yeah he wasn't thrilled. Neither was Lorelai but she sucked it up for Sookie and she tried in the beginning to be nice. I don't blame her at all for being rude. Jackson was right that all he had to do was go to dinner and who knows maybe he'd like. That's really all he had to do. Go to dinner and not be rude. That's it. Then getting up at Luke's demanding they leave and go bowling and annoyed because he was dragged out of a restaurant. I love Jackson telling him to leave. I really wish Jackson had kicked him out completely. Especially considering Rune showed up at his house unannounced, was eating on all his food, and not paying rent. Throw him completely out Jackson.

[Guest]

20 hours ago, Katy M said:

I thought it was funny, too, because he was just uber-ridiculous.  OK, Lorelai's not his type.  That's fine.  But, this was a blind double-date, not an arranged marriage.  You grin and bear it for a couple of hours.  I could also understand his being disgruntled if they had had tickets to a concert or sporting event that Jackson was making him miss, or even if they were in a bowling tournament. but, no, it was just a night out of bowling that they could do any time.   Lorelai should have dropped it about his name, but he had already been rude to her by that point, so, yeah, I just think the unreasonableness of it all made it funny.

Exactly - he was just so over the top that it just kind of worked. Like "Lorelai's not my type" vs. "Where did you find that thing?"  And I also enjoyed his interactions with Michel at the Inn.