S01.E18: Paula Needs To Get Over Josh!

[hogwash]

Finally got around to watching this. Lovely finale. I laughed so hard at the end of the episode (and kept going back and forth on whether it was real). Great teaser for S02. Is it bad that I want Josh and Rebecca together because it's/they're funnier than Greg and Rebecca?

[ToxicUnicorn]

Who thinks of that balloon?  I want to become that person's best friend.

 

Rachel, Donna, and Santino are so freaking talented.  I love them.

 

I agree that Donna looked fantastic, delivered that number flawlessly, looked great, and I was disappointed.  I wasn't expecting her number to be mad like that!  The only solution --- more songs for Donna in season 2.

 

I don't take tv shows too seriously (not to say that I don't watch with great enthusiasm) but I actually felt a pang of sorrow for Greg.  I was sad to see the big Josh and Rebecca moment.  I had gotten over Josh, already.

 

Looking forward to Season 2~

[lovinbob]

Does she hate Greg though? She has - on more than one occasion - said that he is hot. I think she just prefers Rebecca's Josh fantasy, because she is so enamoured with the big romantic narrative around Rebecca's decision to move to West Covina. She's basically a real life shipper.

 

I didn't think Greg was terrible at the wedding. He was just scared to lose Rebecca and tried to hard to be funny or cool. And of course, he can't shake Rebecca's obsession with Josh and the thought of Rebecca only settling for him. Actually, Greg has behaved way worse in other episodes this season. 

...

 

Well, I went to two weddings last year, wearing sneakers and no tie. I didn't wear a flannel shirt though and had a real suit on. I think as long as people dress at least somewhat nicely, everything goes. 

Paula was furious. It's more than that she's a shipper (which she is), it was that she had gone batshit to further Rebecca's agenda. Honestly, based on what Paula revealed, she has a serious personality disorder. (For the sake of the show, I prefer to think she simply went over the edge temporarily, but if this were real life everyone should get a restraining order against Paula.)

 

Greg was TERRIBLE at the wedding. On a basic level, he was a rude date who let his own issues get in the way of being a good friend/boyfriend/companion. Then he passed out from drinking too much. That's beyond bad etiquette. 

 

As far as his clothes were concerned, it was inappropriate for the venue and the occasion. I don't mean to sound like Miss Manners, but I do feel like it's a sign of disrespect to not dress to fit the event. I'd never turn anyone away or make someone feel bad for not dressing a certain way, but when you make an effort to provide a certain level of food, drink, and atmosphere, I think it's nice when the guests try to match that. Not the worst offense, of course, but it was a sign of Greg putting his own needs (insecurities) before Rebecca's (not to mention his hosts).

So Josh decides to make a move on the girl who his supposed best friend is with (and he already knows is really crazy about?) What class. No matter what you think of the relationship, he's your best friend. What kind of friend does that? I can't see how Greg and Rebecca could recover their relationship after this. Greg wouldn't be able to trust her or his own worth after being ditched for another guy twice. And the second time right after she told him that she really liked and cared for him. That'll mess with anyone's head. After this, if Greg ever takes Rebecca back I'd probably lose some respect for him. 

Yes! I think season 2 needs to examine the weird dynamic between these two best friends.

 

I'm rooting for Greg and Rebecca, but I agree this one is a hard one to get over. 

Edited April 21, 2016 by lovinbob

[rejnel]

I realize this is beside the point, but did anyone catch what the pricey wedding gift was, the thing in the gift bag that impressed Lourdes and Aunt Myrna?

[Eyes High]

Greg was TERRIBLE at the wedding. On a basic level, he was a rude date who let his own issues get in the way of being a good friend/boyfriend/companion. Then he passed out from drinking too much. That's beyond bad etiquette. 

 

As far as his clothes were concerned, it was inappropriate for the venue and the occasion. I don't mean to sound like Miss Manners, but I do feel like it's a sign of disrespect to not dress to fit the event. I'd never turn anyone away or make someone feel bad for not dressing a certain way, when you make an effort to provide a certain level of food, drink, and atmosphere, I think it's nice when the guests try to match that. Not the worst offense, of course, but it was a sign of Greg putting his own needs (insecurities) before Rebecca's (not to mention his hosts).

 

I agree. It was an extension of his "I could if I wanted to" attitude with studying; he'd rather not try and act above it all than put in an honest effort and risk not measuring up.

 

It seems that Greg is in general someone who "lets his issues get in the way" of being a good friend/boyfriend/companion/overall human being. The frustrating thing is that with Greg there are these teasing, fleeting glimpses of the great person he could be. I believe that there is a good guy in there; he's just buried most of the time under a heaping load of bullshit: resentment, self-loathing, condescension, trust issues, moralizing, smugness, a Nice Guy mentality, the works. The drinking doesn't exactly help matters, either. However, for me that makes Greg realistic. He sticks out even more in a cast of cartoonish characters for that. I've known so many Gregs that it almost hurts to watch such an accurate representation of a certain kind of person on screen, because the real Gregs are just as intermittently great and just as ultimately frustrating.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Eyes High

[JustaPerson]

In this case, he WAS trying...to act like he wasn't trying. He thought that was the reason Rebecca was suddenly into him. 

[cleo57]

I found this episode emotionally exhausting. I watched this finale and the Better Call Saul finale on Monday night, and if you'd asked me beforehand which I expected to find more draining, I'd have said the latter for sure. Nope. So kudos to Rachel Bloom and company, I guess, for making their tricky little romcom into an exhausting television event.

Sometimes you don't know what you want until confronted with all the things you don't. Rebecca having sex with her childhood boyfriend atop a magic carpet while Lea Salonga sings in the background is apparently all the things I didn't want. I watched that entire sequence with mounting horror; I didn't really think Rebecca's vague, post-dream ghost attempts at emotional health would stick, but watching her retreat so fully back into fantasyland, eyes wide and full of febrile hope, certain for the umpteenth time that Josh Chan was the answer to all her problems…well, it was a punch to the gut. And Josh's expression in that final moment when he finally realizes that no, Rebecca isn't the cool, chill, anti-Valencia, was the perfect way to deflate the moment.

I appreciated it on a narrative level. Obsessions like Rebecca's wax and wane, and her night of disappointment with Greg was reason enough to slide back into princess mode. But it left a bitter taste in my mouth, and I can't help but wish that this show, which is about people trying and failing but most importantly trying to be happy, hadn't ended on such a caustic note.

And speaking of characters failing at happiness, Greg. Rebecca really wasn't asking for much during their final scene. Just the simplest admission of affection would've probably done the trick. He was right to think that Rebecca wasn't over Josh (though his behavior turned this into a self-fulfilling prophecy). But it was Rebecca and Greg's final scene that was tinged with real emotion, filled with the romance of what could have been.

Despite the fact that he was operating at peak garbagery during this episode, I can't help but root for them a little bit. He's terrible, and she's terrible, and their terribleness doesn't really fit. His self-loathing ends with him vomiting his feelings into a bucket, and her self-loathing ends with her backsliding into the worst kind of childhood fantasies. But I do kind of hope those two self sabotaging trash heaps get their shit together. Eventually, someday, in the far distant future. Eh. Maybe I'm a romantic.

[Snarklepuss]

Fantastic post, Cleo57.  What else can I say at 3:00 a.m.?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

This week's songs:

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhz6pmrdGaw

[poeticlicensed]

I realize this is beside the point, but did anyone catch what the pricey wedding gift was, the thing in the gift bag that impressed Lourdes and Aunt Myrna?

It was Llardo. Llardo is a company out of Spain that makes very expensive porcelain figurines. Personally I think they are hideous. But some people prize them. Just Google Llardo and you can see for yourself.

[ToxicUnicorn]

So kudos to Rachel Bloom and company, I guess, for making their tricky little romcom into an exhausting television event.

 

Fantastic post, Cleo57.  What else can I say at 3:00 a.m.?

 

I vote for Cleo57 to be my designated poster.  What she said.

 

Yes! I think season 2 needs to examine the weird dynamic between these two best friends.

 

This would be an interesting twist.  At the end of the season, I'm convinced Santino can handle any material.  I'm not so sure if Vincent is capable of portraying Josh as anything but a cartoon character, but I am willing to give it a try.  I was so happy to see a buff, bro, positive, non-sexist Asian love interest (who is also good at singing and dancing) that I think I've cut his character a lot of slack.  Josh gives fun reaction shots, and he conveys a lot of sweetness, but the playing against type of being kind of dim makes me wonder if it would be possible for Josh can evolve into having a coherent discussion with Greg.  I'd love to see it, though.  

[aiherz]

I realized tonight that Greg reminds me of ... Logan Echolls. (So of course I started drawing Josh/Duncan parallels, and remembering that Veronica Mars had to live out the fantasy of perfect past boyfriend before she could figure out Logan.)

OMG! Now that you mentioned it, you're totally right! Except you know, giving THE drug to Dick. But I hope it doesn't take 3 seasons plus a movie several years later for them to be together and good. (Though I really liked Piz, he was so cute and h.o.t.).

 

I'm not sure if I liked the final, it was okay but Josh felt a bit force, I don't really see the  chemistry between those two. And I was so sad when Greg and Rebecca were talking and Greg not been able to tell her how he really feels because of moronic Josh!

Rebecca needs to stop making the same mistakes with Greg, he didn't deserve it even when he wasn't in his best behavior. 

[PodcastTown]

Season 2, Josh/Greg relationship needs to be examine. Will they continue to be best friends? Is there going to be a feud? Valencia coming back? Is Hector a non existent, again??

[PodcastTown]

 Also, maybe I'm a bit on Josh's side cause he reminds me of the Cobrai Kai from Karate Kid movies. Feel bad for Valencia, 15 yrs??? That's torture!!!  Season 2 would rule if they make him a villain like Johnny, karate kid. Also do millennial understand the Star Search reference??? I don't think they do. Who is the demographic for this show????

 Yep Josh is going to be the Villain in season 2. That would rule.

[PodcastTown]

But I hope Drunk Greg shows up in season 2. It's the best thing ever on comedy tv series.

[dubbel zout]

It was Llardo.

 

Lladró.

 

/that person

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Crazy Ex-Girlfriend Has Come So Far, She Can't Go Back To Where She Used To Be
The finale takes us on emotional magic carpet ride, but was the season shining, shimmering, splendid? (Sorry, not sorry.)

[poeticlicensed]

Lladró.

 

/that person

I stand humbly corrected for my typo

[lovinbob]

I agree. It was an extension of his "I could if I wanted to" attitude with studying; he'd rather not try and act above it all than put in an honest effort and risk not measuring up.

 

It seems that Greg is in general someone who "lets his issues get in the way" of being a good friend/boyfriend/companion/overall human being. The frustrating thing is that with Greg there are these teasing, fleeting glimpses of the great person he could be. I believe that there is a good guy in there; he's just buried most of the time under a heaping load of bullshit: resentment, self-loathing, condescension, trust issues, moralizing, smugness, a Nice Guy mentality, the works. The drinking doesn't exactly help matters, either. However, for me that makes Greg realistic. He sticks out even more in a cast of cartoonish characters for that. I've known so many Gregs that it almost hurts to watch such an accurate representation of a certain kind of person on screen, because the real Gregs are just as intermittently great and just as ultimately frustrating.

Amen. Great post. Greg is so real it hurts. Santino does a great job, and the nuanced, writing of this confounding character is exceptional. 

[tennisgurl]

Having some time to think about it (I spend a ridiculous amount of time thinking about this show), I think I did like this episode, even though it was hard to watch. Rebecca and Greg really could work, but they are just both so messed up, and, in their own ways, both kind of delusional. Greg thinks he can hide away behind his "cool guy" sarcasm, even though its obvious to everyone he really likes Rebecca, and Rebecca retreats into her Fairy Tale world when things with Greg seems a little too real. Honestly, a lot of the characters tend to live in their own heads. Paula lives vicariously through Rebecca and her Josh obsession (thats why I think she snaps about Greg so much. He just does not fit her fantasy), and Josh thinks that Rebecca is the perfect, low maintenance, anti-Valencia. 

 

I am really interested to see where season 2 goes. I knew Rebecca would back slide into Josh obsession, but I figured it would happen. The show is still young after all. 

[MrsR]

Well I for one loved it. Paula as a psycho Rose Hovick was awesome. It will serve as her audition for Gypsy when she gets a bit older and Broadway needs ANOTHER Gypsy revival.*snerk* No really she should play Rose.

 

So it turns out Rebecca is in love with love.  Not Josh. Not Greg. Love itself, in all it's wicked Disney personification. She's been indoctrinated.

 

As for Josh, well in his relationship with Greg he's been the benign Alpha to Greg's effed up Beta. It's easy to be nice and kind when your life is rolling merrily along. Clear goals, home town, longtime girlfriend who does all the work.  Now that he's not the top dog in Rebecca's life he pulls a dick move. And gets more than he bargained for.  Love it!

 

And as for Greg, well let me put it this way, "He's so broooooken INSIIIIIIIDE!!!!"

 

I adore that Santino Fontana, a Disney Prince, Cinderella's Prince is playing such a monumental fuck up. He must be loving this role.

 

No shipper here. I'm here for the bizarro fun.

[AllAboutMBTV]

 

Paula as a psycho Rose Hovick was awesome. It will serve as her audition for Gypsy when she gets a bit older and Broadway needs ANOTHER Gypsy revival.*snerk* No really she should play Rose.

I would totally pay cash money to see Donna Lynn Champlin play Momma Rose -- and I've seen Tyne Daly and Imelda Staunton play the part already. (White Josh could play Tulsa, and Darryl could play Herbie.)

[PodcastTown]

People keep saying Greg screwed up, Greg blew  this and that. He was just being him, that's always been Greg. He dodge the crazy bullet. It's Josh that's screwed up, he's Rebecca's bitch now. Where's he gonna go? His life belongs to Rebecca now. No Valencia to run too. He can't run or escape now that he's Rebecca's property. Really interesting to see how Season 2 plays out.

[aradia22]

Hmn. I enjoyed the episode. I did. But it's just that "Josh And I Go To Los Angeles" was so good. I feel like they didn't pull out all the stops here. Lea Salonga was great in her number but there could have been more with Aunt Myrna. There weren't jokes there. And I think the indictment of princess culture or whatever you want to call it let the air out of the romances with both Greg and Josh long before those storylines concluded. I am appreciative that we didn't have a terrible cliffhanger but at the same time I wonder if the show has momentum going into the next season. I want to have faith but I've been here before. Being Erica, Drop Dead Diva, Awkward, Ugly Betty... basically any show with a female protagonist that features a love triangle at some point seems to get into this annoying pattern of changing partners until no one cares anymore. And we've already had a lot of it on this show. I don't know. I'm hoping they're using their time off well and dreaming up non-romance plots and shenanigans with our host of secondary characters.

[aradia22]

 

That episode did nothing to make me think Paula was less of an asshole, but I did love their reunion anyway since it made it really clear like Dream Ghosts said that it's not about the guys.

The funny thing about that is I immediately thought "Oh, we're doing Frozen again." Or Maleficent. Say what you will about Disney (I say they were one of the only popular brands providing female protagonists for a while) but they've been rewriting the script on their own. I think that's part of the reason I find "takedowns" of the Disney myths/ideals so often lazy. It's like that person who thinks it's impressive to tell you about how dark the "original" fairytales were like those stories aren't at least hundreds of years old.

 

Hee, and I loved Rebecca's terrible "real life" singing.

I thought it was cute from little Rebecca but it concerns me with present Rebecca because I wonder if it means she won't be pursuing theatre. That's a thread I'd like them to pick up. But maybe she could take voice lessons and we'd have another excuse for a Broadway star cameo or she could still be cast in a community theatre production as a villager or something.

 

This episode really made me question whether she and Greg should end up together though. While her romantic notions are way overboard at the moment, that doesn't mean that she shouldn't have any romantic aspirations. And I'm not sure that Greg would ever offer that.

If years of watching TV (specifically TV shows with a female lead) have taught me anything, it's that if the show goes on long enough, Rebecca will be offered a third option of a new guy. This could go on for a while or he could disappear immediately. I hope Trent comes back, but that's more for me than Rebecca. Anyway, in the end though, it's almost always a guy we met at the beginning. Not always, though!

 

As for Rebecca, well she may be more into the flowers and chocolate thing but I think she puts too much stock into what romance should look like than who she's sharing those moments with.

I don't think Rebecca is that high maintenance as portrayed on the show. She seems to put a lot of value in people spending time with her over grand gestures. Sure, it was emphasized in this episode but we've seen her happy to have dinner at home and really often just wanting people to stay with her. My interpretation of Greg since they got together is he's kind of friend-zoning himself. Aside from the sex, he's acting like too much of a buddy. I think that's part of the reason Rebecca wanted clarity on their relationship.

[theatremouse]

Greg probably can't offer the fairy tale romance Rebecca fantasizes about.  Could he try?  I bet he could if he took care of his other issues but I don't know that I would say that Greg doesn't offer any romance.  Because that balloon with that ridiculous message on it?  I found so romantic. Flowers are okay but something unexpected like that would thrille me.

I thought part of the point here is that we already know he's not only capable of coming up with the big gesture, but we saw him do it nudging the grocery store dude in a previous episode. That was there to establish Greg does actually think up this dreamy idealistic big gesture shit Rebecca daydreams about. He's totally got it in him. And the direct result of that episode with the grocery store dude was to "correct" Greg's thinking about such grand gestures and basically talk himself out of that type of impulse (which, if you're dating Rebecca is the opposite of a smart move). So he went way overboard to try to "be cool" and avoid any hint of that type of behaviour in this episode as a juxtaposition to what we saw in that previous one. He's with the girl who digs those shenanigans, but "learned" from the experience of seeing someone else with someone who totally didn't. I don't think his whole excessive aloofness here was just Greg being sarcastic Greg who never tries (even though that is a problem he has in general). I think it was the result of his having gone intentionally into this road of "to get the girl you need to seem like you're not invested", which also jives with basically what he pseudolearned by watching her and Josh, since she conspicuously pined after him and he miraculously seemed not to notice. So Greg has two examples of behaviour to model, both of which are stark contrast to the fairy tale Rebecca was hoping to see.

Edited April 23, 2016 by theatremouse

[PodcastTown]

There's an interesting article that someone posted on the boards with the creators of the show, and them saying this show is kinda like Breaking Bad. Josh Chan is Rebecca's Meth and Rebecca is Greg's meth. I love that.

[PodcastTown]

Ditto on the Trent train. Dude was an awesome character. Love that turtle neck.

[STOPSHOUTING]

I realize this is beside the point, but did anyone catch what the pricey wedding gift was, the thing in the gift bag that impressed Lourdes and Aunt Myrna?

 

It was a Llardo figurine. Very expensive porcelain figurines that often depict romantic or maternal moments. They're often sold at jewelry stores and are a status symbol amongst a certain set. (See: https://issuu.com/www.lladro.com/docs/novedadesspring-summer2016?e=1084391/3907019)

 

I, personally, find them kind of tacky, but one of my best friends in the world,  who has what I'd consider excellent, and very exclusive, taste AND who just happens to also be Filipino, collects them. It's what her husband always gets her for Christmas, birthdays, Mother's Day, etc. And I never thought about it until watching this episode if it's specifically culture, but one of the only other people I've ever seen who has a Llardo figurine is my sister-in-law's mom who is ... also Filipino. Could be a coincidence or maybe they were poking fun at a cultural stereotype I had no idea existed?

 

EDITED TO ADD: And I also immediately thought, but what about Rebecca's money problems?? Dropped storylines annoy me.

Edited April 24, 2016 by STOPSHOUTING

[SmithW6079]

Wouldn't be funny (and sad) if the series ended with Rebecca realizing that Greg was the one she wanted to be with and Greg realizing that he was better off without Rebecca and rejecting her?

Scarlett O'Hara & Rhett Butler, is that you?

[JustaPerson]

Haha I didn't even think of that! Honestly, a Gone With the Wind ending would be extremely fitting for this story. 

[Irlandesa]

EDITED TO ADD: And I also immediately thought, but what about Rebecca's money problems?? Dropped storylines annoy me.

I think it's too early to call it a dropped story.   Even though she had an epiphany, change is hard.  She could have been good but slipped when she felt she needed to arrange for an invite to the wedding.

[aradia22]

 

I think it's too early to call it a dropped story.   Even though she had an epiphany, change is hard.  She could have been good but slipped when she felt she needed to arrange for an invite to the wedding.

Daryl established that this job doesn't pay her nearly as much as her NY firm. But I think in the money problem episode we learned that her paycheck was enough to solve her financial issues for the time being. And since then, I don't think we've seen her spend that much money. So maybe the Lladro peacock wasn't the best choice if she's trying to build up her savings but I'm willing to believe until told otherwise that she at least had enough money to cover it.

[possibilities]

Rebecca's on-going spending in the face of her previous money problems could be leading to her losing her housing, or needing a roommate, or something like that. TV loves to force people to co-habitate. If she spent a fortune on the wedding gift, all the more reason for her to be in financial trouble later. I'm more bothered that we never got follow up on the family heirloom ring she pawned for her airfare.

 

Greg tries, and succeeds, at taking care of his dad. It's the one thing he has committed to.

[STOPSHOUTING]

Daryl established that this job doesn't pay her nearly as much as her NY firm. But I think in the money problem episode we learned that her paycheck was enough to solve her financial issues for the time being. And since then, I don't think we've seen her spend that much money. So maybe the Lladro peacock wasn't the best choice if she's trying to build up her savings but I'm willing to believe until told otherwise that she at least had enough money to cover it.

 

A few episodes ago she was losing her car and pawning rings for airfare, with every credit card she had maxed out, and now she can afford a $2,000 porcelain figurine to give as a gift? I'm not buying that works with a "one paycheck" solution; even if you think she has a salary of $250,000/year (which seems like a lot at that firm). A single $10-$12k paycheck, while substantial, isn't gonna pay off maxed out cards, get your car back and get you back into the black with $2k to spare. Instead, it seems more like the writers just dismissed that storyline to make a joke. 

 

And, yes, never following up on the ring seems like another fail.

Edited April 25, 2016 by STOPSHOUTING

[Rinaldo]

A single $10-$12k paycheck, while substantial, isn't gonna pay off maxed out cards, get your car back and get you back into the black with $2k to spare. Instead, it seems more like the writers just dismissed that storyline to make a joke. 

 

And, yes, never following up on the ring seems like another fail.

That needn't be her only big paycheck. And it's established that she does no budgeting and lives up to the edge of her income, so I can see her taking care of the worst problems and still having enough left to be extravagant. I expect to see the money storyline revisited, as several others have been.

 

Likewise, I wouldn't be surprised if the ring resurfaces; the writers planted it in more than one episode already, and "never" hasn't had time to happen yet.

[aradia22]

 

I'm more bothered that we never got follow up on the family heirloom ring she pawned for her airfare.

I keep thinking about the Garfinkel ring! Every time Rebecca wants a grand gesture I think... Garfinkel ring. When the wedding rings kept coming up this episode I thought... Garfinkel ring. I even thought about it as a way to reconcile Paula and Rebecca.

[Nancybeth]

Did Josh still not have ANY CLUE that Rebecca had moved to West Covina for him? I mean, everyone else seems to have figured it out. I don't honestly get what she sees in him...he's dumb and doesn't seem to have a lot of motivation and I don't even think he's that cute.

I momentarily thought that Valencia had purchased the Garfinkle ring (I couldn't remember what it looked like) and then given it to the aunt to pretend it was a family heirloom.

[STOPSHOUTING]

Likewise, I wouldn't be surprised if the ring resurfaces; the writers planted it in more than one episode already, and "never" hasn't had time to happen yet.

 

Except when they wrote and filmed this episode they MUST have been thinking it was the end of the series, not just the season, as all signs pointed to cancellation. We sort of know one of the lesser producers whom we heard from, coincidentally, just as they were starting their final work week. They said they had no clue at that point, and while they had hope, because of reviews and awards, they knew the deck was stacked against them. (This is the sum total of my inside info, so I'm not trying to sound braggy, just confirming the production staff was on the same page as the general public that renewal was far from guaranteed.) So, this episode was put together completely with the idea they were a long shot to return, therefore I think calling plot points dropped/ignored/contradicted is entirely fair when it was assembled with the very real possibility it could be the final episode.

 

Doesn't mean I don't love the show, because I ADORE it. And, actually, seeing this producer's name in the credits early on, was just icing on the cake ... Meaning, we liked it before we knew our friend was involved in any way.

Edited April 25, 2016 by STOPSHOUTING

[Bline]

Except when they wrote and filmed this episode they MUST have been thinking it was the end of the series, not just the season, as all signs pointed to cancellation. We sort of know one of the lesser producers whom we heard from, coincidentally, just as they were starting their final work week. They said they had no clue at that point, and while they had hope, because of reviews and awards, they knew the deck was stacked against them. (This is the sum total of my inside info, so I'm not trying to sound braggy, just confirming the production staff was on the same page as the general public that renewal was far from guaranteed.) So, this episode was put together completely with the idea they were a long shot to return, therefore I think calling plot points dropped/ignored/contradicted is entirely fair when it was assembled with the very real possibility it could be the final episode.

 

Doesn't mean I don't love the show, because I ADORE it. And, actually, seeing this producer's name in the credits early on, was just icing on the cake ... Meaning, we liked it before we knew our friend was involved in any way.

 

Actually, Rachel Bloom stated that they did the season finale under the assumption (hope?) that they would be renewed.  She said there "was no way" they could end the season otherwise. 

 

How did you approach this finale not knowing about the renewal?

We had to operate assuming that we were going to get a second season. There was no way to wrap up the show, literally no way. So we went in hoping for the best. [showrunner/co-creator] Aline [brosh McKenna] and I know how the series ends, and we're so far from what that is. Had we not gotten a second season, I think we would have tried to get it made somewhere. We're only beginning to tell the story. 

 

Source:  http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/crazy-girlfriend-rachel-bloom-talks-884798

 

So I think they just prioritized plot points to set up for Season 2.  Beck's spending habits and the garfinkel ring might pop up again next season. 

[dubbel zout]

Did Josh still not have ANY CLUE that Rebecca had moved to West Covina for him?

 

Rebecca told him at the end of the season finale. He was appropriately aghast.

[violetr]

I realized tonight that Greg reminds me of ... Logan Echolls. 

 

 

I wish like crazy I saw him this way, because I really miss Logan Echolls. For me, the big difference is that Greg is a wannabe bad boy, whereas Logan was an honest-to-god bad boy. 

 

So it turns out Rebecca is in love with love.  Not Josh. Not Greg. Love itself, in all it's wicked Disney personification. She's been indoctrinated.

 

 

Ding ding ding! This, precisely. I don't think Rebecca will have be capable of maintaining a healthy romantic relationship until she figures this out. 

 

I think that's part of the reason I find "takedowns" of the Disney myths/ideals so often lazy.

 

 

I can never get enough of these stories because I think this issue goes far beyond the Disney mythos (which was damaging enough to generations of young girls on its own). I think it's really about the history of fairy tales, where generally women's only roles were to be rescued in one way or another, preferably by a handsome prince. IMO, the more of these stories we see, the more these patriarchal fictions will be dismantled. I have high hopes for our next generation!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Full version:

[Ultrahyenagirl]

Oh I agree.  I don't think he was pining for her all the time. I also don't think he's thrilled to learn the truth.  But he also has a really really hard time advocating for himself and breaking up with someone.  I think he knew for a while that he didn't want to marry Valencia but he kept letting himself be pushed closer and closer to that.  And I suspect Rebecca will be even pushier.

Yeah, this might be a bit mean of me, but Josh is a total coward. Notice how it was Valencia who had to end that relationship, not him, even though he was clearly unhappy in it. Also, in the first episode, he breaks up with Rebecca on the last day of summer camp, right before he runs off to be picked up by his parents. He chose to break up with her right at the moment when he wouldn't have to deal with any fallout. So yeah, I wouldn't be at all surprised if Rebecca and Josh are still together when season 2 starts. In addition to that his family totally loves her, and he kind of screwed over his best friend in order to be with her, both of which could lead to a feeling of obligation to be in the relationship. I recently re-watched the pilot and Josh says something like "you probably don't remember me much do you?" At first, it seemed to me to be boilerplate meeting-someone-you-haven't-seen-in-a-long-time language, but now I wonder if Josh actually remembers his time at camp that well. 

 

Scarlett O'Hara & Rhett Butler, is that you?

OMG, this comparison really kind of fits. Scarlett O'Hara is actually supposed to be 16 at the beginning of Gone With the Wind. So, Rebecca is Scarlett. Josh is Ashley, aka her teenaged fantasy crush that she holds onto. Greg is Rhett, the cynical guy who sees through her, but can't help but adore her in spite of himself. It makes sense to me. 

 

I really couldn't enjoy the reunion between Rebecca and Paula. I know this is Sitcomland, and the standards of behavior are different, but Paula is a bit of a sociopath. That song rocked though!

[aradia22]

 

I can never get enough of these stories because I think this issue goes far beyond the Disney mythos (which was damaging enough to generations of young girls on its own). I think it's really about the history of fairy tales, where generally women's only roles were to be rescued in one way or another, preferably by a handsome prince. IMO, the more of these stories we see, the more these patriarchal fictions will be dismantled. I have high hopes for our next generation!

Not to completely derail but I grew up during the Disney Renaissance with every kind of princess and turned out to be a feminist, not because I rejected all of that fantasy but because I also grew up with Xena and Ever After and way more other books and positive female role models and characters that were protagonists than I can list. I think the problem with this generation is that at some point, the pool started shrinking and shows like The Mindy Project and Crazy Ex-Girlfriend became outliers.

[Eyes High]

On 4/25/2016 at 3:34 PM, violetr said:

 

I wish like crazy I saw him this way, because I really miss Logan Echolls. For me, the big difference is that Greg is a wannabe bad boy, whereas Logan was an honest-to-god bad boy. 

Agreed. Greg's mostly self-destructive. Logan was destructive-destructive.

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Say what you will about Disney (I say they were one of the only popular brands providing female protagonists for a while) but they've been rewriting the script on their own.

It's not all love-crazed Disney princesses, and it hasn't been for a while. In Mulan the female lead killed something like a thousand baddies and deliberately killed the villain! (FYI, it was awesome.) Even in the 1970s and 1980s, there were Disney movies like the Rescuers films, where Miss Bianca's sidekick Bernard is the lovestruck one.

Edited April 28, 2016 by Eyes High

[dubbel zout]

23 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

Greg's mostly self-destructive. Logan was destructive-destructive.

Yeah, I don't see Greg wanting to organize bum fights any time soon.

[adam807]

15 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

Yeah, I don't see Greg wanting to organize bum fights any time soon.

Would watch. 

[FurryFury]

I don't really see these characters as that similar, aside from being "Veronica"-type in their respective love triangles (and it's very debatable with Greg), plus the self-destructive tendencies. And snark, lots of snark. Hmm... well, now I kinda see the similarities. Still, I've always felt like the show teased Greg/Rebecca as "endgame" pretty early, although not in a too ham-fisted way, while Logan/Veronica is a classic example of an unexpected romantic pairing becoming canon and official despite the original intentions of the writers. 

Greg is, overall, pretty harmless. Sure, he's got a smart mouth on him, and he can be very petty, but he's not that screwed up, I think. He can be supportive, he can be nice. His issues are more real-life than Veronica Mars-style crime drama stuff with an abusive murdering father and absent suicidal mother.

[Bline]

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If years of watching TV (specifically TV shows with a female lead) have taught me anything, it's that if the show goes on long enough, Rebecca will be offered a third option of a new guy. This could go on for a while or he could disappear immediately. I hope Trent comes back, but that's more for me than Rebecca. Anyway, in the end though, it's almost always a guy we met at the beginning. Not always, though!

Thank you. 

It's interesting how so many people assume the series' endgame involves Rebecca in a relationship, especially with Greg. Greg will probably make a comeback sometime in the series but I doubt he's the endgame.  And expect a third guy to appear, probably in the third season. 

Here are some of ABM's  and RB's statements regarding CXG: 

1. It's NOT a romcom
2. CXG is feminist
3. Rebecca avoids her issues by seeking happiness in relationships
4. CXG is about a specific point in Rebecca's life, where she is learning about herself.  It is a coming-of-age story
5. Viewers should be Team Rebecca
6. CXG is partly inspired by ABM's and RB's own relationship experiences

Based on these comments by the show's creators, I bet by series end, Rebecca finally realizes that she first needs to be happy with herself before she can consider a relationship with anyone.  Maybe in season 4 Rebecca starts taking her sessions with Dr. Akopian seriously. 

Edited April 29, 2016 by Bline
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