The Star Wars Saga

[Anduin]

Good find!

[Chyromaniac]

Sorry in advance - this will be long.

It's cool to see notes like that in George's handwriting - and it certainly tracks with the history of how Star Wars developed - from the early Journal of the Whills/Luke Starkiller stuff, to 1977, and eventually to the Episode IV that we have today.  Still, I don't see much difference in how the OT was developed, to the original production schedule for Episodes 7-9.  In both cases, we have a set of characters that get established with one idea of where they might go - but in many cases, circumstances push them in different directions.

They may not refer to it as such, but I absolutely feel that they had a "plan" for the Sequel Trilogy, at least from a production standpoint.  The goal seemed to be to be able to produce 7-9 for biennial releases, with the standalone films filling the gaps.  I feel they also had basic goals for each ST film, but they decided (for better or worse) to leave the actual storytelling to the chosen filmmakers.  It seems as though the overall goals were something like:

Episode 7 - JJ Abrams: Bring back the classic tone and style of the OT, and show how the galaxy has changed since the fall of the Empire.  Introduce the new heroes and villains of this series, and build their relationships with the legacy characters.  Give Han a featured part, with a dramatic exit.

Episode 8 - Rian Johnson: Explain what happened to Luke, and why he's been missing.  Give him a heroic end, saving the day as a true Jedi Master.  Continue to expand on the conflict between the First Order and Resistance, and to develop the new characters.  By the climax, establish Rey and Kylo as the new faces of their factions.

Episode 9 - Colin Trevorrow: Obviously this is the film that changed the most from the "plan" - but I think we can extrapolate some of the original intent from what people have said, and from the leaked draft.  First, people (including Kennedy) had said that this was supposed to be a spotlight film for Leia, and that she would have the pivotal emotional moment.  I believe this would have been Kylo's redemption.  Trevorrow's draft also seems to focus more on the Resistance rising up against the First Order.  It has a big showdown between Rey and Kylo (and ghost Luke).  And, it ends with the new heroes establishing a home for the next generation of Jedi.

Personally, I think they could have scripted every word of this "plan," and it still wouldn't have made a difference in how TRoS turned out.  Sadly, losing Carrie was a severe blow to anything they had been building to for Episode 9.  And, the decision to let Colin go after his Book of Henry debacle probably scrapped whatever was left of the original intentions.  From there we know what happened - JJ and Chris Terrio were brought in as an effort to right the ship.

In retrospect, I absolutely get why they decided to bring JJ back.  Johnson wouldn't or couldn't commit to another film on that turnaround,  They also basically struck out with the up and coming guys they brought in for the standalones.  At that point, who do you call?  I'm not super happy with Rise of Skywalker, but I suppose we could have ended up with an episode IX from Whedon, Kurtzman, Orci... In any case, it could have been worse.

[Danny Franks]

On 6/2/2021 at 2:54 PM, VCRTracking said:

Interesting to see original Lucas handwritten  outline for 12 episode saga:

https://www.starwars.com/news/the-long-winding-and-shapeshifting-trail-to-episodes-vii-viii-ix

It was all very vague, the original was going to be "Episode VI"

 

"On December 29, 1975, in conversation with Alan Dean Foster per the novelization of Star Wars, Lucas mentioned the prequel trilogy along with what would become Episodes V and VI: “I want to have Luke kiss the Princess in the second book. In the third book, I want the story just about the soap opera of the Skywalker family, which ends with the destruction of the Empire. Then someday I want to do the back story of Kenobi as a young man – a story of the Jedi and how the Emperor eventually takes over and turns the whole thing from a Republic into an Empire, and tricks all the Jedi and kills them. The whole battle where Luke’s father gets killed. That would be impossible to do, but it’s great to dream about.”'

So originally Obi Wan wasn't lying, Vader was not Luke's father. If you read the Leigh Bracket script she wrote after story conferences with Lucas, Luke was going to have a twin sister but it wasn't going to be Leia. So the plan changed a lot but there's was still a plan. 

This is really cool. I've long argued with some Star Wars fans that it's simply not credible that Lucas wrote the entire six movie story and then chose to make the latter half because "the first half wouldn't be possible with the technology of the time." There are too many narrative inconsistencies to be explained away.

It's always been my understanding that he had a general idea of wanting to create a TV serial structure for the universe, and an acknowledgement that his starting point wasn't the starting point. But he hadn't planned out Anakin's life, Obi Wan's, or even most of the things that became integral elements of the Star Wars world - Luke and Leia are siblings, Vader is their father etc.

Plus, we know that Lucas lifted liberally from other movies (The Hidden Fortress, in particular) for a lot of the narrative and visual beats of the first movie.

On 6/3/2021 at 12:38 AM, Chyromaniac said:

 It seems as though the overall goals were something like:

Episode 7 - JJ Abrams: Bring back the classic tone and style of the OT, and show how the galaxy has changed since the fall of the Empire.  Introduce the new heroes and villains of this series, and build their relationships with the legacy characters.  Give Han a featured part, with a dramatic exit.

Episode 8 - Rian Johnson: Explain what happened to Luke, and why he's been missing.  Give him a heroic end, saving the day as a true Jedi Master.  Continue to expand on the conflict between the First Order and Resistance, and to develop the new characters.  By the climax, establish Rey and Kylo as the new faces of their factions.

Episode 9 - Colin Trevorrow: Obviously this is the film that changed the most from the "plan" - but I think we can extrapolate some of the original intent from what people have said, and from the leaked draft.  First, people (including Kennedy) had said that this was supposed to be a spotlight film for Leia, and that she would have the pivotal emotional moment.  I believe this would have been Kylo's redemption.  Trevorrow's draft also seems to focus more on the Resistance rising up against the First Order.  It has a big showdown between Rey and Kylo (and ghost Luke).  And, it ends with the new heroes establishing a home for the next generation of Jedi.

I think the first two movies did their jobs pretty well, though there are elements of The Last Jedi that I'm not crazy about. For me, the treatment of Luke's character is 100% fine and in keeping with Jedi traditions. But I don't like the long chase dynamic and I don't think it makes sense in terms of Star Wars science, and I don't like the diversion to the casino planet, which feels more like something out of a low-rent TV scifi show.

But it ends exactly where it needs to - Luke has sacrificed himself in redemption for his past sins, Kylo Ren is in charge of the New Order and Rey is the hope that she spent a whole movie trying to convince Luke to be.

The third movie just backtracks on most of what the second set up - a new big villain to stop Kylo Ren from being the bad guy, further temptation for a Rey who had found her true self in the second movie, not much of anything for Finn or Poe.

On 6/3/2021 at 12:38 AM, Chyromaniac said:

Personally, I think they could have scripted every word of this "plan," and it still wouldn't have made a difference in how TRoS turned out.  Sadly, losing Carrie was a severe blow to anything they had been building to for Episode 9.  And, the decision to let Colin go after his Book of Henry debacle probably scrapped whatever was left of the original intentions.  From there we know what happened - JJ and Chris Terrio were brought in as an effort to right the ship.

In retrospect, I absolutely get why they decided to bring JJ back.  Johnson wouldn't or couldn't commit to another film on that turnaround,  They also basically struck out with the up and coming guys they brought in for the standalones.  At that point, who do you call?  I'm not super happy with Rise of Skywalker, but I suppose we could have ended up with an episode IX from Whedon, Kurtzman, Orci... In any case, it could have been worse.

I think Trevorrow's script was far closer to the marks that the third movie needed to hit, than Abrams' was.

It built the relationships between Rey, Finn and Poe, it made Kylo Ren the big bad that the second movie put him in place to be, it explored the Jedi mythos without reverting to Palpatine as the ultimate enemy. Yes, there were some problems with it, such as Rey being blinded and continually losing to Kylo Ren, but they would have been ironed out in rewrites.

I still believe that Disney got cold feet about the idea of keeping their very popular, white guy actor in the position of villain, and bowed to pressure from very different ends of the fan spectrum - gross misogynists and racists who don't like movies that don't have white guy heroes and Kylo Ren/Rey shippers who refused to accept that he was an evil villain who murdered his own father and abducted, tortured and gaslighted Rey for his own ends.

[VCRTracking]

My argument against Kylo Ren being the sequel big bad is Rey already beat him very soundly in the first movie. She's standing in triumph as he's lying there humiliated. 

People go on and on about what a lame villain Kylo Ren is especially compared to Vader yet also want him to be the big bad at the end.

Edited June 5, 2021 by VCRTracking

[Danny Franks]

8 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

My argument against Kylo Ren being the sequel big bad is Rey already beat him very soundly in the first movie. She's standing in triumph as he's lying there humiliated. 

People go on and on about what a lame villain Kylo Ren is especially compared to Vader yet also want him to be the big bad at the end.

I don't go on about him being a lame villain. I also don't think Rey defeating him in the first movie means he can't be the big bad. Because his journey isn't complete (and he's also just been shot by Chewie). Snoke says it, Kylo Ren says it - he's still learning, figuring out what he has to be. And in the second movie, he finally gets it, when he betrays Snoke and takes command of the First Order.

[VCRTracking]

Well people in the thread other then you think he's lame and still want him to be the big bad. It doesn't matter if he learns to be a more formidable villain or that he was injured we still seen him be defeated by Rey. 

Anyway what's done is done. I think Disney should forward making movies with Finn as a Jedi. 

[Chyromaniac]

Hopefully we all understand that whether a character/plotline/movie works or not is ultimately a matter of opinion.

On 6/4/2021 at 10:33 AM, Danny Franks said:

I still believe that Disney got cold feet about the idea of keeping their very popular, white guy actor in the position of villain, and bowed to pressure from very different ends of the fan spectrum - gross misogynists and racists who don't like movies that don't have white guy heroes and Kylo Ren/Rey shippers who refused to accept that he was an evil villain who murdered his own father and abducted, tortured and gaslighted Rey for his own ends.

I think it's entirely possible that (outside of his career problems) the Kylo issue is ultimately what got Trevorrow fired.  Of all the differences between his script and TRoS, the almost total lack of redemption for Ben feels like the biggest character divergence.  And to be honest, I don't know if I'd even chalk it up to fan blowback - my guess is that Lucasfilm always expected a redemption arc for Episode IX.  I personally doubt that it was done for either the Griefers or the Shippers benefit, because I don't see how either side got what they wanted - Ben didn't supplant Rey as the "actual" hero, and the peak of their romance in IX was just one ambiguous kiss.  I think it just comes down to Disney not wanting the Skywalker "legacy" to end with an outright villain.  Plus, Kylo already has two looks - mask and no mask - he doesn't need some weird Dr. Doom-ish metal face.  Otherwise if Colin was, for whatever reason, unable or unwilling to do the redemption to Lucasfilm's satisfaction, then I can see why they'd part ways with him.

[katha]

I fundamentally disagree that Kylo was ever supposed to be the big bad. IMO his redemption arc is set up from TFA. It's Abrams' best bit of characterization: He kills Han and immediately regrets it. It's played beautifully by Driver: He thought killing Han would be a relief, but he's more conflicted than ever. I also think that TLJ and Johnson built on that redemption arc. I read Kylo as totally sincere in his interactions with Rey, if wrongheaded to a ridiculous degree. It's also played as sincere and Johnson has since confirmed that. 

Carrie dying really made all of that more difficult for them, since Leia was probably supposed to play a central role in Kylo/Ben's ultimate return to the light. So they stitched together as best as they could. That last scene with Han is a highlight in TROS, though. 

I think Kylo/Ben's story holds together the best from all the cast, even though it's rushed and chopped. Which is because even though you can disagree with it, it has thourough-line that is recognizable in all three movies. 

He doesn't have much screentime, but what is there counts. Which is also why I think people perceive his presence as much more dominant than it is in the movies: A mix of AD's strong acting and writing that is better than for almost all the other characters. 

The problem isn't Kylo IMO. The problem is everyone else. They get screentime, but they often don't get meaningful writing, which diminishes their presence. They just didn't have a plan. The only plan they could vaguely agree on is Kylo, so he's the only one that has a recognizable narrative in all three movies. 

ETA: I also suspect that the Kylo issue was one of the reasons Trevorrow was let go. It's the one firm plan they had throughout. 

Edited June 7, 2021 by katha

[ICantDoThatDave]

On 6/7/2021 at 3:45 AM, katha said:

I fundamentally disagree that Kylo was ever supposed to be the big bad. IMO his redemption arc is set up from TFA. It's Abrams' best bit of characterization: He kills Han and immediately regrets it. It's played beautifully by Driver: He thought killing Han would be a relief, but he's more conflicted than ever. I also think that TLJ and Johnson built on that redemption arc.

You don't get to have redemption after murdering your father, no matter how sad you are afterwards.

[VCRTracking]

I love that there's a meme now of this almost 20 year old scene:

 

 

[Luckylyn]

Carl Sagan Talks about Star Wars A New Hope Mistakes (1978)

He makes some great points about the lack of diversity.  I loved that  moment he brings up Chewbacca.

[Zuleikha]

My argument against Kylo Ren being the sequel big bad is Rey already beat him very soundly in the first movie. She's standing in triumph as he's lying there humiliated.

I agree with this. It doesn't work to have Kylo Ren as the big bad for the third movie when both the first and second movie end with his clear defeat.

I don't think the writing for Kylo Ren is really that much better than it is for other characters, but Adam Driver and Daisy Ridley happened to have amazing screen chemistry. Writing worked that really shouldn't have. (and I definitely don't mean this in a shipper way!)
 

[Anduin]

I just got back from Return of the Jedi in concert. Damn that was a good show. The orchestra was in fine form and I love the movie to bits anyway. If you ever have a chance to see a movie in concert, I feel it's worth it. At least, if you know and love the movie. It probably wouldn't enhance rather average movies much, and it helps to know the story beforehand.

It was odd seeing the modern edition. I'm more a despecialised fan. That dance was shorter than I remember when the special edition came out in cinemas. Did it get trimmed over the years? I still feel the sarlacc tentacles were overdone. And not all the effects matched the old footage.

Still, the bulk of the movie was how it should be. And the music is as good as ever. Thumbs way up.

[Fool to cry]

I love the "Into the Trap" cue when the Rebel fleet arrives at the Deat

6 hours ago, Anduin said:

I just got back from Return of the Jedi in concert. Damn that was a good show. The orchestra was in fine form and I love the movie to bits anyway. If you ever have a chance to see a movie in concert, I feel it's worth it. At least, if you know and love the movie. It probably wouldn't enhance rather average movies much, and it helps to know the story beforehand.

It was odd seeing the modern edition. I'm more a despecialised fan. That dance was shorter than I remember when the special edition came out in cinemas. Did it get trimmed over the years? I still feel the sarlacc tentacles were overdone. And not all the effects matched the old footage.

Still, the bulk of the movie was how it should be. And the music is as good as ever. Thumbs way up.

I love the "Into the Trap" cue when the Rebel fleet arrives at the Death Star and you have the repeating motif as the pilots sign in. Then when it appears they've fallen into a trap the motif gets louder and more urgent.

The new song in Jabba's palace never got trimmed. The thing I like about it is the added shot of the unfortunate Twilek dancer in the Rancor pit. Amazing that it was the same actress from the old footage 14 years later!

Edited October 9, 2021 by Fool to cry

[starri]

I love the use of the almost Gregorian chant-like choral music in the scenes in the Emperor's throne room.  It's maybe the only time Williams used human voices--the only one I can think of--and it just adds this unsettling air to everything.  Especially when it really kicks up when Anakin uses Leia to bait Luke into attacking.

Oh, so good.

[Fool to cry]

On 10/9/2021 at 6:57 PM, starri said:

I love the use of the almost Gregorian chant-like choral music in the scenes in the Emperor's throne room.  It's maybe the only time Williams used human voices--the only one I can think of--and it just adds this unsettling air to everything.  Especially when it really kicks up when Anakin uses Leia to bait Luke into attacking.

Oh, so good.

Funny how fans criticize Disney because they think Lucas had the original trilogy planned out unlike the sequels but around the hour mark of the 1983 Making of Jedi on special you can find on YouTube he admitted when they were about to film the scene they didn't have anything specific in the script that Vader would say to make Luke angry. Then Lucas realized he could have Vader threaten to turn Leia to the Dark Side and that would set Luke off!

Edited October 11, 2021 by Fool to cry

[Spartan Girl]

Yeah, if Lucas really had planned everything out, he never would have had Leia kiss Like like that in Empire.

[DoctorAtomic]

I went in '97 to see the special editions in the theatre. Everyone was 'EWWWWWWW!' when they kissed. So great. 

[Fool to cry]

8 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I went in '97 to see the special editions in the theatre. Everyone was 'EWWWWWWW!' when they kissed. So great. 

Yeah when I saw it in 1997 it was more snickering knowingly!

Looking into behind the scenes and Leigh Brackett's only draft it was going to be revealed that Luke had a long lost twin sister but it wasn't Leia.  Luke was going to find her in the next movie.

 

[Morrigan2575]

If I heard this before S7 of Clones I probably would have been turned off...now I'm excited.

 

[DoctorAtomic]

How? 

I assumed the tv show was the same time as the Mandalorian, so he's a Force Ghost. Flashbacks? 

Edited October 22, 2021 by DoctorAtomic

[Sakura12]

So as a force ghost or are they going to do flashbacks? 

[Morrigan2575]

50 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

How? 

I assumed the tv show was the same time as the Mandalorian, so he's a Force Ghost. Flashbacks? 

 

6 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

So as a force ghost or are they going to do flashbacks? 

Yes 😂

[DoctorAtomic]

What's funny is that the voice actor from Clones is really 'Anakin' for me now. They did such a fantastic job with his characterization. If Christensen thinks he's going to just take Anakin from the movies as his approach, it's going to fall totally flat. 

Although, if they're going to do flashbacks, I would love love love to see some of the seminal moments from Clones as live action.

[andromeda331]

22 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

What's funny is that the voice actor from Clones is really 'Anakin' for me now. They did such a fantastic job with his characterization. If Christensen thinks he's going to just take Anakin from the movies as his approach, it's going to fall totally flat. 

Although, if they're going to do flashbacks, I would love love love to see some of the seminal moments from Clones as live action.

He really did a great job in Clones series. It helped that they fleshed out Anakin's character more and he had more to work with then Hayden did. For seven seasons I got really used to Matt Lanter voicing Anakin. Even when they merged the scene from Revenge of the Sith of Palpatine and Windu facing Hayden's lines with Matt Lanters words "What have I done?" It really worked. I had gotten so used to Matt's voice as Anakin that it didn't seem at all out of place to hear his voice in the scene from Revenge of the Sith. 

[DoctorAtomic]

I guess it depends what his appearance will actually be. If it's post Return of the Jedi, he (HC) can basically do what he wants because it's unwritten. If there's flashbacks, I think it's a huge mistake to not take Clones into consideration, in terms of acting approach. 

I mean, Clones is canon, no? 

 

[BetterButter]

Patty Jenkins ‘Star Wars’ Movie ‘Rogue Squadron’ Delayed

[andromeda331]

3 hours ago, BetterButter said:

Patty Jenkins ‘Star Wars’ Movie ‘Rogue Squadron’ Delayed

That stinks!

[Anduin]

5 hours ago, BetterButter said:

Patty Jenkins ‘Star Wars’ Movie ‘Rogue Squadron’ Delayed

Of all the announced movies, this is the one I'm most looking forward to.

[Spartan Girl]

I don’t mind waiting a little longer for the Patty Jenkins Star Wars movie if it means the next Wonder Woman movie will be better than WW1984.

So I was thinking: wouldn’t it be cool if there was a What If…? version of Star Wars where Leia was raised on Tatooine and got to be a Jedi while Luke wound up being an Alderaan Prince? Come on, I can’t be the only one interested in such a A/U! 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Spartan Girl

[Kel Varnsen]

4 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

I don’t mind waiting a little longer for the Patty Jenkins Star Wars movie if it means the next Wonder Woman movie will be better than WW1984.

Maybe the delays were caused by Lucasfilm bosses seeing Wonder Woman 84 and being like "oh shit".

Edited November 9, 2021 by Kel Varnsen

[Anduin]

13 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

I don’t mind waiting a little longer for the Patty Jenkins Star Wars movie if it means the next Wonder Woman movie will be better than WW1984.

So I was thinking: wouldn’t it be cool if there was a What If…? version of Star Wars where Leia was raised on Tatooine and got to be a Jedi while Luke wound up being an Alderaan Prince? Come on, I can’t be the only one interested in such a A/U! 

Would things have played out much differently? They've both been spunky go-getters all along. Let's see. Luke was somewhat reluctant at the start of ANH, and Leia has always had more of an aggressive streak. Would he still have gone into galactic politics? Become an undercover rebel? Would Leia have gone to Dagobah in the first place, or stuck with the others? Yeah, there's some material there.

8 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Maybe the delays were caused by Lucasfilm bosses seeing Wonder Woman 84 and being like "oh shit".

I read somewhere else that Cleopatra was always her next scheduled movie. But feel free to take that with as much salt as you want.

[DoctorAtomic]

If Leia and Luke flipped, there would be no Empire to Strike Back. She'd have cleaned their clocks. 

[Chyromaniac]

I think What If Star Wars is trickier, because the storytelling is much more confined to specific characters and concepts - but I think there are some possibilities.  Beyond the Luke/Leia swap, how about...

1) What if Han never won the Falcon from Lando?

2) What if Rose and Finn had met the real codebreaker?

3) What if the clones were based off Bossk?

4) What if Anakin lost the Podrace?

5) What if Luke had stayed on Dagobah?

6) What if Death Star II was built near Kashyyk?

7) What if Depa Bilaba survived Order 66?

8) What if Poe actually had died on the way back to Jakku?

9) What if Count Dooku betrayed and usurped Darth Sidious?

10) What if Jyn Erso escaped Scarif with the Death Star plans?

11) What if Grogu was rescued by Dengar?

12) What if the Last Order fleet had destroyed Coruscant?

13) What if Obi-Wan survived the Death Star?

[Spartan Girl]

9 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Maybe the delays were caused by Lucasfilm bosses seeing Wonder Woman 84 and being like "oh shit".

They’re hardly one to point fingers after Rise of Skywalker.

[Kel Varnsen]

On 11/9/2021 at 7:32 AM, Spartan Girl said:

They’re hardly one to point fingers after Rise of Skywalker.

I would probably give the slight edge to Rise of Skywalker there. It had story problems but there was enough exciting stuff happening where I was able to overlook them until I left the theatre. With WW84 the story problems were bugging me while I was watching it. Plus for RoS, I'll never forget the look on my 6 year old's face when she saw Lando and Chewie show up at the end with the Falcon and all those other ships.

Edited November 10, 2021 by Kel Varnsen

[Chyromaniac]

44 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Plus for RoS, I'll never forget the look on my 6 year old's face when she saw Han and Chewie show up at the end with the Falcon and all those other ships.

Awesome- that’s a great moment.  I remember some criticism saying it was too similar to “on your left” from Endgame- but honestly I wish they would have leaned into that vibe even more.  Like, Poe hears Lando tell him that he’s not alone on the headset, and at first the only ship in sight is the Falcon.  But then- another drops out of hyperspace, and it’s the Ghost.  Then, they just hold on the two ships side by side for a moment, before zooming out as literally every other ship pops up, like fireworks going off.  Cue John Williams.

[Morrigan2575]

8 hours ago, Chyromaniac said:

But then- another drops out of hyperspace, and it’s the Ghost.  

Was the Ghost there and I totally forgot?

[Chyromaniac]

5 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Was the Ghost there and I totally forgot?

It’s visible- just above and to the right of the falcon after Lando swoops into frame.  But as it is, it’s just part of the background- basically an Easter egg.  And honestly, Star Wars has so few truly personalized ships (other than generic x-wings or tie fighters)- I just think it would have been cool to just see arguably the two most distinctive Rebel ships on screen together, before it got filled up with all the clutter.

[starri]

The Ghost, in formation behind the Falcon.

I'm still pissed they couldn't be bothered to stick Vanessa Marshall in Twi'lek makeup or at the bare minimum had Hera's voice over the radio.

Frankly, while I know why they felt it was important to give Leia closure, despite the obvious limitations they were working under, they missed a real opportunity to give the Resistance more of a presence by not either bringing in Hera or expanding Maz's role.

[BetterButter]

 

[supposebly]

I started watching the last one on the plane about a week ago and stopped about 1 hour into the movie. It was a boring mess that didn't seem to make sense from a character or a plot point of view where people don't communicate properly. So, I went to sleep. I might try again at some point, but I'm not terribly optimistic.

I'm not much of a Star Wars fan but I enjoyed the first three and the previous ones of these last two ones ok.

I can't say I have an easy time paying attention to the prequels. I always get bored there too and end up doing something else. Which is a shame because I think the story ideas would have been quite interesting.

I am however intrigued by the Obi Wan Kenobi series, so I might check that out. 

[DoctorAtomic]

I think part of the problem was the most fans (I'm generalizing) wanted to see some BAMF Vader and Luke, but never really got that in the movies; e.g., the end of Rogue (Vader), and the finale of the Mandalorian (Luke). I think they're could have been room for the BAMF and what we got. 

 

[Anduin]

We can't let Star Wars get too interesting. Let's do the most safe and boring thing instead. Taika Waititi's movie is up next. Rian Johnson? Backburner. Will this be the first Star Wars I don't see in the cinema? Possibly. The man took a bad film series, Thor, and made it even worse. His continued popularity is completely baffling. I don't believe that he can make a good Star Wars movie if he tried.

However, he has at least three other projects in the works. There's still time for him to get too busy and have to drop out.

[benteen]

Taika did an amazing job with Thor Ragnarok and is the right guy to do a Star Wars movie. Rian Johnson is the man who torpedoed the sequel trilogy by going rogue and that's the reason Star Wars as a movie franchise is on life support.

The Rogue Squadron movie is a case of playing it safe.

Edited May 19, 2022 by benteen

[Anduin]

4 hours ago, benteen said:

Taika did an amazing job with Thor Ragnarok and is the right guy to do a Star Wars movie. Rian Johnson is the man who torpedoed the sequel trilogy by going rogue and that's the reason Star Wars as a movie franchise is on life support.

I stand by my words. Star Wars needs a shot in the arm that it's not likely to get any time soon. Johnson tried to be interesting, but the forces of 'same old' complained too loud. We got JJ back, and look at TROS. Trying to please everyone, falls flat. Winds up as a 'not bad' movie at best. Whereas TLJ, people either love it or hate it. There isn't much middle ground. And isn't that better than something kind of average?

[Kel Varnsen]

2 hours ago, Anduin said:

I stand by my words. Star Wars needs a shot in the arm that it's not likely to get any time soon. Johnson tried to be interesting, but the forces of 'same old' complained too loud. We got JJ back, and look at TROS. Trying to please everyone, falls flat. Winds up as a 'not bad' movie at best. Whereas TLJ, people either love it or hate it. There isn't much middle ground. And isn't that better than something kind of average?

I just hope they start doing stuff that is brand new. So much of what has come out recently or is coming out is just redoing or continuing previous stories. The new trilogy repeated a lot of elements from the original. The Boba Fett show was basically a spin off of the Mandalorian and a sequel to Return of the Jedi. Mandalorian season 1 was great and original, but season 2 carried over a bunch of story elements from cartoons. Upcoming we have an Obi Wan show (also starring Darth Vader, with a bunch of it likely set on Tatooine (again)), an Ashoka show, and a show about the guy from Rogue One. Just give me something in a new setting with all new characters. The Star Wars brand has so much recognition, they could basically do anything and still make a bunch of money. Hopefully the Waititi movie will be that instead of something stupid like the origin story of Luke's aunt.

[Anduin]

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

I just hope they start doing stuff that is brand new. So much of what has come out recently or is coming out is just redoing or continuing previous stories... The Star Wars brand has so much recognition, they could basically do anything and still make a bunch of money. Hopefully the Waititi movie will be that instead of something stupid like the origin story of Luke's aunt.

I hear that a lot. Star Wars should do something different. And yet, somehow everything different gets cancelled in favour of the same old again.

Actually, in-universe, why did the Jedi never chase up the Skywalker family tree? Did they just accept that the Chosen One popped out of nowhere? If it were me, I'd want to know all about his ancestry.

[tv echo]

Star Wars Forever: How Kathleen Kennedy Is Expanding the Galaxy
BY ANTHONY BREZNICAN    MAY 18, 2022
https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2022/05/star-wars-kathleen-kennedy 

Quote

Can we touch upon “storytelling classic”—the movies? I know about Taika Waititi’s untitled film written by Krysty Wilson-Cairns, and Patty Jenkins is doing Rogue Squadron. Do you have a road map for features, or are you still developing that?

We have a road map. I would say that Taika’s story fits more specifically into that. Rogue Squadron…we kind of pushed off to the side for the moment. Patty is developing the script further. Then we will talk about how that connects to the central spine that we’re working on. There’s a couple of [filmmakers] that we’ve been in conversation with over quite a long period of time that I’m hoping will come in and make the overall commitment that Jon and Dave have made. That’s ideally what I would love to see happen in the feature space.

Are you talking about a commitment to make, say, three movies, or are you talking about an even bigger commitment of shepherding phases of films in the way that Kevin Feige did with Marvel?

I wouldn’t go so far. Kevin is an anomaly—an amazing one. But [the goal is] definitely having somebody make more of a commitment. I hesitate to use the word trilogies anymore because Star Wars is much more about persistent storytelling.
*  *  *
I mentioned Kevin Feige before, and I know it’s been reported he’s producing something for you. Can you tell me about that?

[That’s] the rumor mill. Kevin, I think everybody knows, is a huge Star Wars fan. He’s clearly been inspired by Star Wars in the way in which he’s handled Marvel. I know he’s got a lot on his plate right now. I would love to see at some point what movie he might come up with. But right now, no. There isn’t anything specifically on the horizon. [UPDATE: This interview with Kennedy was in March, and last week screenwriter Michael Waldron told Variety he was working on a script for the rumored Feige project: “We’re finally into it in earnest.”]  

 

Edited May 19, 2022 by tv echo

[Grimnar]

4 hours ago, Anduin said:

I stand by my words. Star Wars needs a shot in the arm that it's not likely to get any time soon. Johnson tried to be interesting, but the forces of 'same old' complained too loud. We got JJ back, and look at TROS. Trying to please everyone, falls flat. Winds up as a 'not bad' movie at best. Whereas TLJ, people either love it or hate it. There isn't much middle ground. And isn't that better than something kind of average?

I think that problem wasn't that Johnson tried to be interesting but that he contradicted half of the stuff from previous movies(and Abrams did same in TROS). But it is more failure from Kennedy or others who should keep control on the story and not to give every director free hand beacause it lead to so many issues in the movies.