S02.E03: Amarillo

[SignGuy77]

It makes sense for the target to be Tuco because we know Nacho likes doing his own (smart, careful) thing, and he's currently doing it behind his unstable boss's back. Also, he probably didn't like Mike using Tuco as a threat against him, and would prefer for that to stop being a possibility.

Tuco surviving does not preclude him from being Nacho's target. We shall see.

[Umbelina]

Then that means Mike fails.  Fails to kill the target.  With a long gun.  I really doubt that.  It's just not "Mike."  Nor is betraying Nacho.  I think it will be someone connected with Gus's organization, or with Tio's, or with the cops'.  In other words, I do expect a BB connection, but not that the target will be someone we already know is alive years later.

[Ronin Jackson]

Why was this episode called Amarillo?  Is there a reference to yellow (the colour or cowardice) or to the city?  I must have missed the connection.  

 

The opening scene takes place in Amarillo Texas. That's the most literal connection. The direct mailer sent to the Amarillo residents is yellow as well... that all said, I think all symbolic interpretations are valid.

[Captanne]

Got it!  Thanks!  (I'm not that familiar with the American west and thought Amarillo was in New Mexico.)  I didn't put the gigantinormous Texas flag (hork) together with Amarillo.  To me, amarillo means (masculine) yellow.  Which can mean "cowardly".  Only then do I think of the city.

Edited March 3, 2016 by Captanne

[Irlandesa]

They can't wait too long to introduce the BB characters.  The actors are not getting any younger so if Fring or even Jesse appears say 5 years or more after they last filmed BB, it's going to appear jarring.  Of course makeup and all that will make them look younger.

I think Fring would be the one character who'd be the most organic to introduce into this timeline*.  They could dye Giancarlo's hair and I think he wouldn't look that much older.  The only way I see a Jesse presence is if  the show fast forwarded to either the BB timeline or "Gene" timeline.  Aaron Paul can't pass as a teenager no matter how youthful he appears.  I think Hank could make sense as well.  Honestly, the person who bothered me the most was Tuco.  I didn't hate it but it was the one thing that most felt like a ploy to seduce Breaking Bad fans which I don't think they needed since we already had Saul and Mike.

 

*In fact, I thought Fring was going to be the person who met Mike.  At this point, there's no evidence they know each other enough for Fring to request Mike specifically but the way the camera shot from behind the person meeting Mike, it felt like they wanted to build up the most suspense before the reveal of who called him.  Except I wasn't surprised.  Nacho seemed like a logical conclusion.

 

The callouts don't bother me because I don't usually recognize them until they're pointed out here or elsewhere.  Ken Wins?  Well I recognized the dude but just thought I was having a "Hey It's That Guy!" moment with the actor.  The tequila?  The name of Saul's holding company coming from the movie?  Nope and nope.  There are a lot of them but they're really for the super super superfans.

[ShadowFacts]

I've forgotten whether Mike lost all of his money he had stashed away for Kaylee in BB, before his demise.  I think he did.  I think Stacey wound up with the last payment he gave to her and that was it.  l hope that was the case.  She should have gotten a widow's pension, she's only got one child, and by the looks of her uniform she's a nurse or in some other health care job.  It's not like she's making minimum wage in some chicken joint.  So while I understand she isn't living in the lap of luxury, she shouldn't be in such dire straits to keep guilt-tripping Mike for money.  I just think she's a manipulative bitch.  

 

I think the DEA got to that money in the safe deposit boxes when his attorney was trying to move it.  But I vaguely remember something about Jesse trying to get money to Drew Sharp's parents and maybe Kaylee too? 

 

 

Walt may only have "broken bad" after being diagnosed, but he'd made plenty of bad decisions before then. By the end of Breaking Bad, we knew that Walt wasn't some meek little Chemistry teacher who broke bad because of illness, but a man who'd always been driven by his ego and resented the life he led (prior to BB) without accepting any responsibility for his choices.

Not unlike Jimmy - though Jimmy seems to have had a bigger heart in the beginning.

 

Agreed.  Walt says in the end he did what he did because he wanted to, he liked it.  Similar to Jimmy really liking what he does.  He enjoys hustling.

[Umbelina]

Yeah, good point about all the yellow.  Colors are rarely random in this show.  "Warning" seems to fit more than "coward" or "cheerful sunshine" in this case though. 

With the meaning of colors, in color psychology, yellow is the color of the mind and the intellect. It is optimistic and cheerful. However it can also suggest impatience, criticism and cowardice.

http://www.empower-yourself-with-color-psychology.com/meaning-of-colors.html

That said, I remember from BB commentary that the clash or opposite or similar colors mean even more, especially among people in the same scene.  I wonder if the podcast will address this? 

[Captanne]

Yeah -- Yellow for warning, too.  Although my military training expects it to be "amber" which is slightly more orange.  Whatever.  LOL  A "yellow" light certainly means to slow down and be attentive.

[RCharter]

It makes sense for the target to be Tuco because we know Nacho likes doing his own (smart, careful) thing, and he's currently doing it behind his unstable boss's back. Also, he probably didn't like Mike using Tuco as a threat against him, and would prefer for that to stop being a possibility.

Tuco surviving does not preclude him from being Nacho's target. We shall see.

I think it could make sense either way.  Tuco's nutiness may serve as a cover for Nacho.  After all, heavy is the head that wears the crown.  Nacho may have no interest in going after Tuco, because Tuco is the big fish, and Nacho can be a remora.  He is doing something behind Tuco's back, so it makes sense for him to want to get Tuco out of the picture....but then who takes over?  Someone who can be easily controlled?  I don't know.  But Tuco does seem awful open to suggestion.  Nacho was able to talk him out of killing Jimmy, and Jimmy (a total stranger) was able to talk him into not killing the two boys.  And I'm not sure if he would want to specifically use Mike for a job that involved killing a person he just threatened to rat Nacho out to.

[RCharter]

It's plausible enough that Nacho may have some reason to have trouble with "Playuh"... but he'd have no difficulty taking care of him himself or finding one of his low level thugs that accompany him to the meets to handle it. He's not setting up a secret midnight meeting and offering next level pay to Mike to handle "Playuh". Nacho realizes Mike is highly competent because of the way he tracked him down and got all the info about his connections with Tuco to use as leverage. The guy has got to be someone much bigger than "Playuh". It'd be a disappointing conclusion to that cliff hanger if "the guy" was the show's comic relief.

The problem, for me, would be that having people on the inside of the organization kill Playah, may set off alarm bells for Tuco.  I'm not sure how much the associates currently know, and they may think that Nacho is handing the money over the Tuco.  As this is a total side hustle for Nacho, I think the best thing for him to do is keep it low profile if he wants Playah killed.

[Ronin Jackson]

The problem, for me, would be that having people on the inside of the organization kill Playah, may set off alarm bells for Tuco.  I'm not sure how much the associates currently know, and they may think that Nacho is handing the money over the Tuco.  As this is a total side hustle for Nacho, I think the best thing for him to do is keep it low profile if he wants Playah killed.

 

Mike, when vetting Nacho, knew that this operation was being done outside of Tuco's knowledge. And Nacho isn't a moron... one of the attributes of his character is he's pretty smart (outside of getting in trouble with the Kettleman's). He wouldn't bring muscle on an operation that he's trying to keep off of Tuco's radar who work in the Tuco organization and would be loyal to Tuco. Seriously, that would worse than Playuh dumb. These are people he can trust to keep it off of Tuco's radar. 

[RCharter]

Mike, when vetting Nacho, knew that this operation was being done outside of Tuco's knowledge. And Nacho isn't a moron... one of the attributes of his character is he's pretty smart (outside of getting in trouble with the Kettleman's). He wouldn't bring muscle on an operation that he's trying to keep off of Tuco's radar who work in the Tuco organization and would be loyal to Tuco. Seriously, that would worse than Playuh dumb. These are people he can trust to keep it off of Tuco's radar. 

Mike had the benefit of knowing that Playah was outside of the circle, and not part of anything Tuco was doing.  Nacho's "associates" may not have the same knowledge, and either don't ask any questions or sincerely don't know that Nacho isn't passing the money up the chain.  I'm sure Nacho makes plenty of money for Tuco -- this just isn't part of it.  As long as Tuco doesn't know, he doesn't ask any questions.

 

I think the smartest thing for Nacho would be to keep the organization "out" of Playah's death, if thats what he was planning.  Can you ever really trust anyone in a criminal organization like that?  People vying for power and to move up in the organization seem like the first people that would turn on you in that situation.  Mike really has nothing to gain by dropping a dime on Nacho, but people within Tuco's criminal organization most certainly would.  

 

A death or "disappearance" of a guy that was pretty straight laced, seemingly average joe citizen is still gonna make some waves.  The sort Tuco wouldn't like if he found out a member of his crew was involved in it.  Killing an everyday citizen can bring serious heat on the crew, and if Tuco started to ask questions, I think people would fold in a heartbeat.  Especially if they saw their own chance to advance in the organization.  For an outsider looking in, this would be a case of an average dude just getting killed in his house....and the police know its a little more, so I think there could be a fairly serious investigation.  And if that investigation led to Nacho, or anyone in Tuco's crew....that kind of a mess.

Edited March 3, 2016 by RCharter

[Ronin Jackson]

It's still a stretch that Nacho would involve people from inside the Tuco organization in an operation he's trying to keep off Tuco's radar. No matter how you spin it that would be incredibly risky and foolish for Nacho. He could get killed for it, he's not going to involve people who don't know what the deal is and just hope the info doesn't leak. Obviously the smartest thing for Nacho if he was plotting to kill Playuh is keep Tuco people out of it. That incidentally, is also the smartest thing for him to do for running a side operation off Tuco's radar. So clearly he's got people outside the Tuco organization and he uses them.

 

Everything about how Nacho has handled recruiting Mike for this job screams that the job is a big deal and he needs someone whose got more savvy than your average street muscle. The fact that he tracked down Mike. The secret location. The "next level pay". We'll see next week if all the rigmarole was for a six year old schoolbus pimp.

Edited March 3, 2016 by Ronin Jackson

[shapeshifter]

She should have gotten a widow's pension, she's only got one child, and by the looks of her uniform she's a nurse or in some other health care job.  It's not like she's making minimum wage in some chicken joint.  So while I understand she isn't living in the lap of luxury, she shouldn't be in such dire straits to keep guilt-tripping Mike for money.  I just think she's a manipulative bitch.

Yes and no, IMO. I think she's not motivated the same as a typical, garden-variety, normal, sociopathic "manipulative bitch." I think she is acting like one, yes, but it's subconscious. Her husband, a "good" cop, was murdered by "bad" cops, and his father was a dirty cop. So, since, as you point out, she's not suffering financially, I think the money she manipulates out of Mike represents what she feels he owes her in the lost companionship of her husband, etc. And I think she really does think the newspaper thumps are bullets and that the chip in the stucco is a fresh bullet mark (but it's not really). Just my take on it, but also I think someone posted upthread that the podcast (or was it an interview?) confirms it.

[queenanne]

A few have wondered why Jimmy's bit on the bus was against the rules.  This is the ABA Rule on Soliciation:

 

Rule 7.3: Direct Contact with Prospective Clients

Information About Legal Services

Rule 7.3 Solicitation of Clients

(a)  A lawyer shall not by in‑person, live telephone or real-time electronic contact solicit professional employment when a significant motive for the lawyer's doing so is the lawyer's pecuniary gain, unless the person contacted:

(1)  is a lawyer; or

(2)  has a family, close personal, or prior professional relationship with the lawyer.

 

 

So, the reason why Jimmy's actions on the bus were wrong is because they were against the ABA rules.  Why there is such a rule, i'm not sure, something about people assuming lawyers are truthful and they have a position of trust and respect (Yeah, people really used to believe that) that can be abused and the rule is to prevent even the appearance of impropriety.

 

So Jimmy's direct contact with the elderly people was wrong.  Of course. some lawyers do this all the time (i.e. ambulance chasers), but most have learned to use middle men, like the ambulance drivers, tow-truck drivers, etc. who carry the lawyer's business cards and hand them out to accident victims.

 

The commercial is allowed because its not "real-time" electronic contact.

 

 

The way I understand solicitation is that it protects potential clients from having to make an immediate decision without carefully thinking about it.  If a lawyer is talking to you face-to-face or on the phone, you might feel pressured to make a decision right away.  If you see a commercial, or a letter, or an email, you can take as long as you want to decide to contact that lawyer.  And the field of law is all about making logical decisions, at least for lawyers that we know aren't destined to become Saul Goodman.

 

The bus scene was entertaining to watch, but kind of uncomfortable.  Yes, as a viewer, I know that Jimmy had their best interest at heart in getting all of the residents legal protections.  But if I was on that bus, I probably would have felt pressured to sign up without taking time to consult my friends/family.  And it might have been legal, since Jimmy was talking to an actual client and other people just happened to overhear and panic, but I don't know if that's what a big firm like Davis and Main wants from a new employee.

 

1 of the things I like about the show is that everybody is understandable and there aren't any moustache-twirling villains (except maybe Chuck now).  Cliff isn't an evil boss, he has every reason to be concerned that a commercial his subordinate secretly aired might result in lawsuits.  

 

agreed, I think the underlying principle of wrongness is assuming your potential/live clients, cannot escape you via the in-person solicitation method.  They're a captive audience, thus bad.

 

For you young'uns out there, law firm advertising is a relatively new development. A number of years ago, lawyers were not allowed to advertise at all. No print ads, definitely no commercials on television or radio and when the rule was changed, attorneys who advertised were thought to be shady.

 

I'm guessing that's clearly it/the problem.  Advertising's tacky like even in Dickens' day, being a lawyer who dunned your clients for payment (which was basically defined as "any attempt to make A Gentleman pay up"), was beneath contempt or notice.  You should rather starve genteelly other than let anyone know you needed filthy lucre, or possibly that your fellow man needed to resort to the services of an attorney.  I have this vague recollection that Johnnie Cochran was one of the first attorneys who lowered himself to appear in-person on TV advertising and that he took a lot of carping over it.  It's Not Done to look desperate and ambulance chasing enough over business; like how attorneys will eagerly acquiesce to having their names in the types of professional directories that non-connected people use to hunt up a law firm; but God forbid any peon actually USE said directory.  The lawyers want the credit for being open to the likes of pro bono, but they don't actually want to deal with the great unwashed pouring in over the transom, and in reality will only call back or take personal referrals for new clients from other (read wealthy, who could find a lawyer some other way) pre-existing clients.

 

Amarillo = yellow in Spanish. The episode made a point of letting us know that Jimmy picked out the canary yellow color of the flyers himself. What's up with that?

The only symbolism I know of re: yellow is cowardice. I did not think Jimmy acted out of cowardice in this episode. Are there other things yellow could mean? Or was there other yellow stuff that I missed?

 

We could say that Davis & Main are cowardly about the commercial, and that Chuck was cowardly about leaving his house, but is no more.

[editorgrrl]

Colors are rarely random in this show. I wonder if the podcast will address this?

They said red = criminal activity.

[Snakelite]

I am confused now that the podcast affirmed that Stacey mistook the sound of the newspapers for the sound of gunshots. The show was very specific about her saying the ones the night before were three shots in quick succession and the ones that night were at 2:13. Neither of those facts would fit with newspapers being thrown. Weren't the papers delivered near the end of Mike's shift? Two in the morning seems too early. Details the show gives us usually are meaningful, so I don't know what to think about the podcast. And if two digits of the last four of the firm's number were changed and all kept in the same order, those old people would reach me!

[RCharter]

It's still a stretch that Nacho would involve people from inside the Tuco organization in an operation he's trying to keep off Tuco's radar. No matter how you spin it that would be incredibly risky and foolish for Nacho. He could get killed for it, he's not going to involve people who don't know what the deal is and just hope the info doesn't leak. Obviously the smartest thing for Nacho if he was plotting to kill Playuh is keep Tuco people out of it. That incidentally, is also the smartest thing for him to do for running a side operation off Tuco's radar. So clearly he's got people outside the Tuco organization and he uses them.

 

Everything about how Nacho has handled recruiting Mike for this job screams that the job is a big deal and he needs someone whose got more savvy than your average street muscle. The fact that he tracked down Mike. The secret location. The "next level pay". We'll see next week if all the rigmarole was for a six year old schoolbus pimp.

I think it would be far riskier for Nacho to involve someone from inside Tuco's organization because Tuco will definitely  find out about that.  Especially when the police come sniffing around.  But, its tough to trace the disappearance of Playah to Mike, and even tougher for Tuco to connect the dots.  The "associates" in the organization would probably assume that Playah and Mike had bad blood and that Mike had him killed...nothing to do with Nacho per se.

 

But if Nacho gives the order to kill to one of the associates, the associate knows that there is something funky going on, and would likely assume that Tuco knew about the hit.  I mean, you're not going to kill a man without assuming there are some order from the top, and if the associates think that Tuco is on in it, there is no reason to think that Nacho is keeping it from him per se.  Or, at least everyone has "plausible deniability" which is fine when there is no heat coming down.  But there will likely be some level of investigation, even when Playah goes missing.  Given that he was already on the police radar, and given the fact that from the outside he is just an average guy, doing average things.  For better or worse, when one drug dealer kills another drug dealer, people sort of shrug their shoulders and figure "well, I'm not in danger because I'm not a drug dealer," but if a nerdy dude just living his life and working IT gets killed I think it disturbs most law abiding citizens.  And therefore brings the heat.  This is why I think the death of Playah could be a very big deal.  If he goes "missing" or "takes a trip to Belize" someone is going to notice.

 

Nacho may be using people outside of the organization, but incidentally, I think that is even more dangerous because I suspect the criminal underworld in NM or anyplace else isn't all that big.  If you're using people aligned with another organization, you're now taking on a risk in threefold: 1) they aren't part of your organization, so you inherently can't trust them to protect you at a deal, 2) there is a good chance that word gets out you are using someone from another gang, which leads to the conclusion that you're doing something you shouldn't be doing and 3) they may simply cheat you, or take the business for their own gang....I mean, its not like you have any recourse if you're cheating your own organization.  There is no way to completely avoid the risk, but I think the risk is minimized by using people within the organization and knowing that they won't talk about a side business because: 1) they know that Nacho can talk Tuco into and out of anything, 2) they don't want to be seen as sniches,  3) they can always say that Nacho told them he was giving the money to Tuco (plausible deniability), and 4) mutually assured destruction -- if Tuco finds out that they were at a drug deal, then Nacho is also in trouble.

 

There is always a possibility he is aligned with a small gang from a bordering state , but I think that involves almost the same level of risk.

Edited March 3, 2016 by RCharter

[shapeshifter]

Yeah, good point about all the yellow.  Colors are rarely random in this show.  "Warning" seems to fit more than "coward" or "cheerful sunshine" in this case though. 

That said, I remember from BB commentary that the clash or opposite or similar colors mean even more, especially among people in the same scene.  I wonder if the podcast will address this?

They said red = criminal activity.

Now I'm picturing Jimmy in his white suit leaning against the darker (mud/adobe-brown?) wall waiting for the bus of innocent elderly to stop according to his payoff of the driver. Perhaps we could say he was a wolf in sheep's clothing? Except that at the end of the day/law suit, the elderly would benefit, right? Or would they just be homeless because the place would be shut down and their payouts would be individually miniscule?

[Captanne]

I understood that Stacy mistook the sound of newspapers for gunshots.  The same way Mike, a seasoned cop who knows gunshots when he fires them and/or hears them, was surprised.  Isn't that why we got that whole newspaper scene in the first place?  

 

What I'm not clear on is why he's agreed to move her.  Which means he needs more money which, in turn, is why he wants "higher level" jobs.  

 

Why not just tell her about the newspapers and that the chip in the house is probably from some random, normal house decay or punk neighborhood kids throwing random rocks for kicks?  There are a million reasons for nicks in garage walls.

Edited March 3, 2016 by Captanne

[shapeshifter]

What I'm not clear on is why he's agreed to move her. Which means he needs more money which, in turn, is why he wants "higher level" jobs.

I can imagine a man of Mike's generation and life experiences figuring a change of scene might be what she needs. Or he might figure there could be something up (if not gun shots) and not want to risk ignoring it.

Also, he feels responsible for not warning his son about the culture of corruption within the department (that got the son killed when he reported it), so Mike is willing to do anything to try to fix the fallout and/or assuage his feelings of guilt. Some of these details may have only been revealed in BrBa.

Edited March 3, 2016 by shapeshifter

[Ohwell]

My opinion of Stacey is colored by the fact that in BB she never stopped asking him for money, or babysitting (which he didn't mind because he loved his granddaughter, but still..).  He could never do enough for her.  

[Ottis]

Walt may only have "broken bad" after being diagnosed, but he'd made plenty of bad decisions before then. By the end of Breaking Bad, we knew that Walt wasn't some meek little Chemistry teacher who broke bad because of illness, but a man who'd always been driven by his ego and resented the life he led (prior to BB) without accepting any responsibility for his choices.

Not unlike Jimmy - though Jimmy seems to have had a bigger heart in the beginning.

Agreed.  Walt says in the end he did what he did because he wanted to, he liked it.  Similar to Jimmy really liking what he does.  He enjoys hustling.

 

 

While Walter had made some poor choices, as anyone has, I don't agree that Walter (or we) knew that he was capable of becoming a drug dealer and would enjoy behaving in all the ways that entailed, not when we first met him. Walter's initial motive to make drug money was a genuine concern for his family, a lack of options to care for them, an assumption (erroneously) that because he had cancer and would die soon therefore there would be no consequences for him/his family and a sense of entitlement linked in part to his anger and belief that his friends stole his work and became rich from it. None of that equates to us or his character realizing that the drug life was for him.

 

My read was that Walter discovered *while he was doing it* that he liked what he did. It was a process to get there. Jimmy apparently has *always* been this way, and we have Chuck's issues with Jimmy as one piece of evidence, as well as Kim's exasperation over Jimmy's behavior. They have seen this before. And they are trying to help Jimmy change and become more "respectable," and he isn't doing it. On top of that, Jimmy doesn't have cancer backing him into a corner. He doesn't have a desperate need to help anyone else. He just likes being a flim flam man.

 

So I don't see Jimmy's situation and Walter's as the same at this stage. They end up in the same place, for some of the same reasons (i.e., this is who they are, at their core), but they don't start at the same place, IMO. The things Jimmy does in this episode, soliciting clients, making a video and not getting permission, he did for an ultimate goal of ... what? Not to make money, nor help his family, nor even to make a bad company pay. He did it because he enjoyed it, from the get go.

Edited March 3, 2016 by Ottis

[ShadowFacts]

I don't want to get too BB-oriented, but I do think the two situations are pretty similar.  My take was that Walter loved creating his own perfect meth first and foremost, and being the best at it, but readily accepted all the murder and mayhem that went with it.  He started off bumbling and stumbling into some violent encounters, but took to it like a fish to water, from my viewpoint.  There was only a two-year or so time span until his demise, and he spent months in New Hampshire, so within 18 months or less he went from zero to 60 lickety split.  He was able to whistle to himself after talking to Jesse about Drew Sharp's murder.  I think he always had the rage and greed and ability to kill people who got in his way but suppressed it until he got cancer.  Jimmy has always had the ability and the inclination to manipulate and scam people, but he tries to suppress it to get Chuck's approval, and fails.  They have different triggering points, or straws that break the camel's back, and we haven't yet seen Jimmy's where he goes full Saul. 

Edited March 3, 2016 by ShadowFacts

[ghoulina]

The things Jimmy does in this episode, soliciting clients, making a video and not getting permission, he did for an ultimate goal of ... what? Not to make money, nor help his family, nor even to make a bad company pay. He did it because he enjoyed it, from the get go.

 

I agree that Jimmy enjoys it, but I also think he thinks he's doing the right thing. By the elderly clients. I truly believe he wants to help them. I think he is flawed in that he is a real problem solver, but he often goes about solving problems in a very unorthodox way. He doesn't want to follow protocol or wait to be told what to do. He wants to get in there and fix it. And yes, he does enjoy putting on a show while doing so. But I think he has a good heart. 

 

I understood that Stacy mistook the sound of newspapers for gunshots.  The same way Mike, a seasoned cop who knows gunshots when he fires them and/or hears them, was surprised.  Isn't that why we got that whole newspaper scene in the first place? 

What I'm not clear on is why he's agreed to move her.  Which means he needs more money which, in turn, is why he wants "higher level" jobs. 

Why not just tell her about the newspapers and that the chip in the house is probably from some random, normal house decay or punk neighborhood kids throwing random rocks for kicks?  There are a million reasons for nicks in garage walls.

 

I think Mike is torn. I think he is mostly convinced she's imagining things, but there is that CHANCE that she's not. And then, how is he going to convince HER that she's imagining things? He just mentioned a dream and she flipped. I think he feels guilty about Matty and doesn't want to risk hurting or alienating Stacy. 

[RCharter]

 

I think Mike is torn. I think he is mostly convinced she's imagining things, but there is that CHANCE that she's not. And then, how is he going to convince HER that she's imagining things? He just mentioned a dream and she flipped. I think he feels guilty about Matty and doesn't want to risk hurting or alienating Stacy. 

I think there is so much brewing inside of Mike.  I think most of it is exactly as you say, but I also feel he still has to feel deep guilt over the death of his son.  If giving this woman whatever she wants can ease his guilt, or make it so he can think a little less about the son he lost, or help him to feel he is doing right by his son I think he would do anything.  And of course, less than Stacy, his grandchild is all he has left of his son.

[Captanne]

RCharter, I think you are SPOT ON about the grandchild.

[Umbelina]

One of my very favorite scenes from BB, and obviously there are thousands of those, was the final scene between Walt and Skylar.

 

Skylar telling him not to sling that bullshit about how he did it for the family again.

Walt, for once, being completely honest with her.  "I did it for me.  I liked it.  I was GOOD at it."  (not a direct quote, although it might be.)

 

Yeah, Jimmy and Walt came from different places and motivations.  I think Walt honestly started it all to take care of his family, but he quickly realized he was good at it.  No longer the milquetoast his brother in law mocked, he'd shed that cocoon and became, in his view anyway, a real "man" a manly man, not the nerd with the test tubes and pocket protector.  He ran things.  He went up against anyone, crime syndicates, the police, stood toe to toe and often won those gunfights.  He LIKED it.  If it was all about his family, he would have taken the offered money from Gray Matter, but he needed to, for once in his life, EARN that himself.  His milquetoast ways caused him to lose the Gray Matter fortune once already.  Facing death, he went for broke, and he measured up, for quite a while.

 

I hesitate to pretend to know what Vince and company will do with Jimmy's transition to Saul.  Some of it seems obvious, but I never like to assume or underestimate these writers, they will zig when any normal people would zag, and make it all believable and poetic, meaningful, surprising, when they do.  It's why I watch, along with the fantastic acting and camera work.

Edited March 4, 2016 by Umbelina

[Christina]

In this 4 1/2 minute video, they mention that DIL has PTSD and that Mike doesn't know how to help her. I really didn't get that from the episode, and wouldn't have thought of it if someone hadn't mentioned it here. There is also a brief discussion of the Chuck/Jimmy relationship.

 

http://www.amc.com/shows/better-call-saul/video-extras/season-02/episode-03/inside-episode-203-better-call-saul-amarillo?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_content=The-Cast-and-Crew-Discuss-Chucks-Irrational-Jealousy-of-Jimmy&utm_campaign=BCS

[ShadowFacts]

In this 4 1/2 minute video, they mention that DIL has PTSD and that Mike doesn't know how to help her. I really didn't get that from the episode, and wouldn't have thought of it if someone hadn't mentioned it here. There is also a brief discussion of the Chuck/Jimmy relationship.

 

http://www.amc.com/shows/better-call-saul/video-extras/season-02/episode-03/inside-episode-203-better-call-saul-amarillo?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_content=The-Cast-and-Crew-Discuss-Chucks-Irrational-Jealousy-of-Jimmy&utm_campaign=BCS

 

I didn't get that either, that was ambiguous at best.  It came across to me as Stacy was manipulating Mike.  But it's funny, looking at it this time, knowing what the producer said, I saw fear in Stacy when she was looking at the garage with Mike, where before I saw her putting on an act.  I guess I'm getting jaded.  

[carrps]

Amarillo = yellow in Spanish. The episode made a point of letting us know that Jimmy picked out the canary yellow color of the flyers himself. What's up with that?

The only symbolism I know of re: yellow is cowardice. I did not think Jimmy acted out of cowardice in this episode. Are there other things yellow could mean? Or was there other yellow stuff that I missed?

Well, there was also his crappy yellow car. But I love the idea of the yellow "warning flags."

 

I am hoping that Nacho wants to take out Tuco because I want to see that CRAZY maniac again.  And if we get Tuco then maybe we will get Uncle 'ding ding' Tito.  I fondly remember the power of the ding. I won't be disappointed if it is Gus and when I think about it, Mike has to meet Gus and start working for him.  This may be the time for that.

 

Tio. Or Uncle. Tio is Spanish for uncle. Blanking on Tio's actual first name -- his last name's Salamanca, right?

 

It's all up to personal taste, but for me, it doesn't really bug me unless it's the kind of thing that wouldn't make sense unless you'd seen BB first.  Of course, aside from the entire name of the show and the Gene scenes, the only one that really felt a little forced to me was the Tuco thing in the first two episodes.  Don't get me wrong, I liked it and it served a great purpose (boosting Jimmy's confidence in his lawyering), but that reveal of Tuco at the end of the pilot had such significance placed on it and nobody who hadn't seen BB would have known who the heck he was.

 

Heh, I yelled "Holy Hell! It's Tuco!!!" And my sister (who still hasn't watched BB yet) was all "Who's Tuco?" But if I hadn't been there to say that, it wouldn't have made a difference to her.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

He doesn't want to follow protocol or wait to be told what to do. He wants to get in there and fix it.

Does that mean Jimmy picked the color of the envelopes so that Sandpiper staff could easily spot them and trash them, providing a rationale to get creative in signing people up?

[ilovebeaarthur]

Tio. Or Uncle. Tio is Spanish for uncle. Blanking on Tio's actual first name -- his last name's Salamanca, right?

 

 

His first name was Hector, and you got the last name right!

[qtpye]

You've put your figure on why it bothers me, and I haven't enjoyed the "Jimmy and the elderly" scenes as much as some have (I felt that way last season as well). I hear a lot of that tone when I visit my mother where she presently lives, and I don't like it then, either. It's patronizing and phony. He's addressing elderly people who do not appear to be demented as though they're...well, as you said, small children. It would do wonders if he'd run up against just one who calls him on it, because there are a lot of smart, tart-tongued older people who would find this approach alienating. 

    On the other hand, I don't necessarily need to approve of Jimmy's style, and if aspects of it bother me, it's consistent with where we know he's heading in his pitches to people of all ages. There was an element of calculation about it from the beginning, with the Matlock suits. 

 

Jimmy is amazingly charming and could probably sell snow to an Eskimo.  However, I could not help but notice that he was talking to the people on the bus the way some adults would talk to a kindergarten class room.  I know that he is not scamming them, like his marks, and is actually trying to help them.  However, it would be cool if one of the elderly people stood up and started asking intelligent questions and told Jimmy to knock it off with the nephew stuff.

   

They can't wait too long to introduce the BB characters.  The actors are not getting any younger so if Fring or even Jesse appears say 5 years or more after they last filmed BB, it's going to appear jarring.  Of course makeup and all that will make them look younger.

    But you can already see Odenkirk and Jonathan Banks are much older than they were in BB, though since they're in every episode, it's not as noticeable.  But if you pull up a BB episode from say season 4 or 5, it would be a lot more noticeable.

 

 

Aaron Paul has a much more mature looking face now, then the boyish teenager look he was sporting at the beginning of Breaking Bad.  In a Breaking Bad flash back scene (the one where Walt is calling Skylar at their first cook) his face had to be kept in the shadows, even though the other actors were just made to look a little younger with makeup and wigs.

 

So as much as I would love to see Jessie, it would not make sense with the time line.

 

However, some of the comments here made me realize how much I need a little Badger and Skinny Pete in my life.  Maybe Pete and Chuck could do dueling pianos.

 

On one hand, Jimmy is a fascinating character and his brother seems to want to hold him down for petty reasons.  On the other hand it is lawyers like Saul that have somewhat tarnished the legal profession.

 

A lot of lawyers are good smart people operating within the boundaries of ethical decency.  However, some people think all lawyers are sleazy, one step above criminals, like Saul.

 

I remember a law school professor once saying an attorney's greatest asset is his or her reputation.  Once it is gone, there is no retrieving it.

Edited March 4, 2016 by qtpye

[RCharter]

 

I remember a law school professor once saying an attorney's greatest asses is his or her reputation.  Once it is gone, there is no retrieving it.

Yep, every professor, every judge, even most other attorneys.  Once people can't trust you, its sort of a mess.

[Clanstarling]

However, I could not help but notice that he was talking to the people on the bus the way some adults would talk to a kindergarten class room.  I know that he is not scamming them, like his marks, and is actually trying to help them.  However, it would be cool if one of the elderly people stood up and started asking intelligent questions and told Jimmy to knock it off with the nephew stuff.

It's not just in senior communities, let me tell you. I'm 60 (which now that I'm 60 doesn't seem all that old - perspective shifts). But various service industry sorts, and medical assistants, insist on calling me "honey" or some other endearment one would use for a child. Today, the cashier at the grocery store clocked FIVE "sweeties" before the transaction was through and I nearly clocked his ass. But, I try to remember that they intend to be nice, despite not knowing they're being disrespectful. Even when I was young, I never called older people anything but "ma'am" or "sir." OTOH, there are people my age and older who do like being addressed that way. Go figure.

[ShadowFacts]

It's not just in senior communities, let me tell you. I'm 60 (which now that I'm 60 doesn't seem all that old - perspective shifts). But various service industry sorts, and medical assistants, insist on calling me "honey" or some other endearment one would use for a child. Today, the cashier at the grocery store clocked FIVE "sweeties" before the transaction was through and I nearly clocked his ass. But, I try to remember that they intend to be nice, despite not knowing they're being disrespectful. Even when I was young, I never called older people anything but "ma'am" or "sir." OTOH, there are people my age and older who do like being addressed that way. Go figure.

So funny!  I know what you mean.  But I have also noticed that some medical people are now doing a better job, they must be getting training or feedback similar to what is being said in this forum.  They don't talk down, they're very direct yet respectful, they don't ignore the older person and talk to the younger person who is with them, etc.  Jimmy has a way with the elders, uses humor and is charming, but the bus scene was just laying it on a little too thick.  His approach would not sit well with a lot of people of any age. 

[Ohwell]

However, some of the comments here made me realize how much I need a little Badger and Skinny Pete in my life.  Maybe Pete and Chuck could do dueling pianos.

 

I could definitely see them having those two show up in BCS.  I hope it happens!

[RCharter]

I could definitely see them having those two show up in BCS.  I hope it happens!

The actor who plays Badger was on NCIS.  I was so happy to see him!

[Ohwell]

The actor who plays Badger was on NCIS.  I was so happy to see him!

I'm glad he's getting more work.  I hope Skinny Pete is working, too.    

[Clanstarling]

The actor who plays Badger was on NCIS.  I was so happy to see him!

He's in a recurring role on Mom, and I've seen Skinny Pete in several things - most recently on Colony.

[Yolapukka]

I find Kim a treat, I enjoy Kim and Jimmy/Saul together even though they are obviously doomed so I really need BCS to stop HITTING! ME! OVER! THE ! HEAD! with the idea that Jimmy's ethical gaps and Kim's hyper-awareness of the same are going to ruin them. I get it, I got it last episode, I got it last season. They've done a great job of filling Kim out, so I'm kind of pissed that they are sending her down the fretful harpy route instead of letting the work that has been put into their characterizations stand for itself. Honestly, a lot of that stuff with her fussing at Jimmy and him just not getting it is starting to feel like filler. They've made a subtler, similar point of both Jimmy and Kim being highly ambitious in their own way and that ambition being rife with potentially conflicting  impulses and it's working better for me in establishing the same conflict as the ethics issues.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

First, thanks to everyone who has contributed such thoughtful remarks in this thread.  I love being made to think in the context of BCS/BB.  Also, a huge THANK YOU to the mod(s) who allowed everyone to swerve into the BB ponds, perhaps a trifle OT.  For me, it has been excellent and highly intelligent, and most of all, honest.   I am grateful.

 

The one thing I want to respond to is Walter's admitting at the end he liked what he had become.  Well, did we get that moment with Jimmy in the last scene in Chicago outside the church?  When he decided to wear the ring?  It seemed like he had finally decided that he was more fully himself and his life made the most sense, when he was scamming/slippin'.   We then had the scene when he literally was walking away in the parking lot from the meeting with Big Law.  I am virtually certain TPTB had decided that Saul had essentially arrived.  Happily, G&G hit the yellow light and things are being dragged out some.  Yet, at least to me, Jimmy has had his Walter moment.  He knows who and what he really is and he likes it.  Pretty much, anyway. 

Edited March 5, 2016 by Lonesome Rhodes

[pasdetrois]

I'm loving the little visual gems this show offers us. The latest is the opening shot of Jimmy propped up against the fading Texas flag, head down and Stetson over his eyes, like every cool cowboy ever. Genius!

[beezus3]

 

Wonder where the building is with the TX flag painted on the side.  In Amarillo?  Don't know where in ABQ it could be.  I guess it could have been painted specifically for the show, but loved how aged and dirty it looked.  Like it had been there for a long time.

I listened to the BCS podcast and their art team created the mural. They explained the location (not TX), and the process, including aging it. 

[MaryPatShelby]

Wow, I didn't get any of that at all. Maybe I'm just a paranoid, cold-hearted bitch. But I seriously thought she was making the whole thing up, down to creating the "bullet hole" in the wall. Now I feel kind of bad for being so hard on her. 

I'll preface this comment by saying I think this is a terrific show, and liked this episode a lot.  However, I don't think you should feel bad because, and this seems to be a major UO, I believe the show should tell the story and we shouldn't have to listen to a podcast or watch a video from AMC to find out what is going on in said show.  I appreciate people here relaying what the podcast said so that some of us have our questions answered; I don't appreciate that that is necessary because the show is either a) not telling the story well enough or b) telling it ambiguously on purpose so that we all have to seek out supplemental content, which probably makes more money for AMC. Cynical, I know, but that's my opinion.

[Umbelina]

Yeah, it was a rare bumble for this team.  Hell, my TV was tilted and I even thought the newspaper was a gun the first time I saw it, the shadows were so extreme, AND Mike had loaded his gun.

 

Meh, they don't do it often.

[AuntiePam]

I'm okay with the ambiguity, especially regarding Stacey.  We're not being deliberately misled.  Some of us see Stacey as manipulative and grasping, and some of us see her as struggling emotionally.  Her behavior fits both scenarios.

 

Same thing happens in real life.  Sometimes it takes awhile for a person's true character to be revealed.  And sometimes we're surprised about why someone does something.  "Linda and Tom got a divorce!  But they had the perfect marriage!  What?  He messed around?  Damn." 

[Shriekingeel]

Network television is almost unwatchable for me anymore with its need to explain everything to the audience, usually through exposition. I like the way some small details aren't fully explained on BCS--it helps bring the show to life, it creates the illusion that the world of the show continues offscreen.

[MaryPatShelby]

I'm not saying I mind ambiguity or that I need every little thing explained to me; I don't. What I mind is that the ambiguity can be immediately resolved by listening to the podcast, or watching the network's video. For example, the viewer doesn't really know what's going on with Stacy after this episode....Is she playing MIke? Is she dreaming? Will she feel better if she learns it's just the newspaper being delivered? We don't know, and we hope that over the next few weeks the story will further unfold.

But then, it turns out, we can just listen to the podcast in which we find out that her mind turned the newspaper splats into gunshots, and she has PTSD. Questions answered, and not by watching the show. THAT'S what I don't like.