MSNBC: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (Vaulted)

[Jaded]

Who was that bitchy 'columnist' that was on with Joy earlier? 

CBSN online is doing pretty good coverage too.

http://www.cbsnews.com/

[Jaded]

I'm answering my own question here. The bitchy lady goes by the name C.J. and works for the Star Tribune. 

[NextIteration]

I'm answering my own question here. The bitchy lady goes by the name C.J. and works for the Star Tribune. 

 

There are no words for her. Essentially she's a star-fu*ker, who tries to be someone.

[bluepiano]

On a different note, if I were the MSNBC, FOX, or CNN exec I would stop having all campaign surrogates on as guests. Get a comment at a campaign event maybe, but these people are all so utterly predictable in their spin for the candidate (whoever the candidate is). And why do we need a whole interview like that? It's worthless. I'd rather hear from some journalists or political experts. The surrogates really add nothing (and Rick Tyler, I include  you until someone asks publically--print is fine--if you still get paid by the Cruz campaign in ANY capacity and you say, "No".) 

 

The surrogate thing (and I hate that term, which I never heard used that way before this election) is because MSNBC has so many hours of air time to fill, and obviously their access to the candidates themselves is limited. At this point, I don't feel that there's anything anyone can say (including journalists and pundits) that I haven't heard a million times. I swear, I can't even remember a time before the primaries. What did the news media talk about before then?

 

I've heard Tyler say that he is not being paid anymore by the Cruz campaign, but in every one of his MSNBC appearances as an "analyst" he is shilling unashamedly for his boy. A network analyst should never be openly partisan towards a candidate. What is MSNBC thinking??

 

On another subject, when I heard that Brian Williams is hosting MSBNC's Prince special I thought, wow, could they find anyone more white?

 

Right now I'm watching Chris Hayes devote at least half his show to Prince. As the arts are not something MSNBC usually covers, it seems kind of morbid that they devote so much air time to an actor or musician's death. I get that when someone as famous as Robin Williams or Bowie or Price dies it's news, but it still feels to me that they're jumping on the bandwagon.

Edited April 22, 2016 by bluepiano

[Padma]

Joy Reid did a very good job this afternoon. I caught just the tail end of Brian Williams' announcement that she was coming on and fully expected him to continue--uselessly, worthlessly--being there, too.

 

So I was giving MSNBC all kinds of props for someone pulling the plug on him and saying, "Let Joy do it alone now." That is the first time--in so many "special reports" since BW has returned--that he not only was not the "head honcho" on the team coverage but was actually bumped off.

 

My appreciation ended just now hearing Chris Hayes announce that tonight's special about Prince is hosted by...Brian Williams.

 

He has zero musical knowledge that I can tell, is a lousy interviewer especially when out of his depth with a subject (like this one). Plus, he's discredited, and I'm sick of him taking the dominant role Every. Single. Time. he's on with other anchors. He ALWAYS gets to do the intros and outros and make it ever so clear that he outranks the others. He obviously has zero humility--including the humility to say, "When it comes to a retrospective about Prince, I'm sure others here would do it better." I'll bet he's quite a joke behind the scenes as even at NBC his arrogance was legendary.

 

ETA: To bluepiano's point about cultural news coming mainly when people die, there's that. That would be something I'd like (maybe no one else would) for the new MSNBC to add in more world news (not just terrorism updates) and cultural segments (not only when major figures die). Music, literature, art--some of those people would be interesting to hear/see from since MSNBC has So. Many. Hours. To. Fill. (Of course, it probably would go the way of the Gay Talese interview, but I think Chris Hayes would be equal to the challenge, and possibly one or two others.)

 

 

Edited April 22, 2016 by Padma

[chessiegal]

Good grief, this is a really huge election year, I think more than any of my 65 years, and we're talking about Prince????? Maybe I'm too old. Really Rachael?????

Edited April 22, 2016 by chessiegal

[bluepiano]

It was pretty much all-Prince all-night. I think that Chris Hayes, Rachel Maddow, and Lawrence O'Donnell (though he was pre-empted) all see themselves as being fully capable of playing the role of commentator on the cultural zeitgeist. It's probably a welcome relief from talking politics and current events all the time.

 

Maybe it's a generational thing, but Chris Matthews is the only one of the MSNBC old guard who doesn't seem to have any interest in shading into pop culture territory.

Edited April 22, 2016 by bluepiano

[NextIteration]

Chris Matthews loves films.  I think they should have kept Toure on set all evening, it's a shame if they didn't. I could't watch much of any of it because our local coverage was so much better.  People he knew in his every day life are here, the people that launched him are here, and most importantly First Avenue and Paisley Park are here.  People were partying like it's 1999.

[Padma]

I didn't see much of BW day or night. But even so, I heard him say the same preface to a question at three different times, "There was never any question at all about Prince's sexuality, that he was a [insert: normal] heterosexual man, but he liked to play with these kinds of different images on stage...."

 

And Joy asked one African American who'd worked with him about that from a different point of view, "Prince was revolutionary, especially in the black community, as a male who made his sexual preference--even his gender identity--intentionally ambiguous, challenging the ideas of homophobia and the stereotypes of gender. In the 1980s, that was revolutionary....." (paraphrased, but that was the gist of it).

 

The black guy she was talking to just shut that all down. Like BW, he couldn't deal with the idea of either -genuine- ambiguity of sexual preference or of gender ambiguity.  He said something like, "The thing that was really revolutionary about Prince was that he played 27 different instruments...."

 

Apparently, after so many decades, it was interesting to see that many men--black or white--still aren't comfortable with the ambiguous sexuality or the gender bending that Prince was comfortable putting out there. Seeing the discomfort in the interviews showed to me how pioneering and brave he was in doing that (not the only one, but one of the few and one of the biggest).  

[Ohwell]

I started calling Prince "pansexual" in the 80s before I even knew what it meant.  It just seemed like an appropriate word that I thought only I had made up.  I found him incredibly sexy and I honestly didn't care what he identified as.  

[maraleia]

I didn't see much of BW day or night. But even so, I heard him say the same preface to a question at three different times, "There was never any question at all about Prince's sexuality, that he was a [insert: normal] heterosexual man, but he liked to play with these kinds of different images on stage...."

 

And Joy asked one African American who'd worked with him about that from a different point of view, "Prince was revolutionary, especially in the black community, as a male who made his sexual preference--even his gender identity--intentionally ambiguous, challenging the ideas of homophobia and the stereotypes of gender. In the 1980s, that was revolutionary....." (paraphrased, but that was the gist of it).

 

The black guy she was talking to just shut that all down. Like BW, he couldn't deal with the idea of either -genuine- ambiguity of sexual preference or of gender ambiguity.  He said something like, "The thing that was really revolutionary about Prince was that he played 27 different instruments...."

 

Apparently, after so many decades, it was interesting to see that many men--black or white--still aren't comfortable with the ambiguous sexuality or the gender bending that Prince was comfortable putting out there. Seeing the discomfort in the interviews showed to me how pioneering and brave he was in doing that (not the only one, but one of the few and one of the biggest).  

Did the person actually use sexual preference when they spoke because if so that's not cool because its sexual orientation. Why can't reporters correct people in that moment? I know the answer because they don't care that much and that's sad.

[stormy]

I'm sick of Steve Kornacki.

He's on constantly, or so it seems.

He's gotten so annoying to me, that I can't and won't watch him anymore.

[Padma]

Did the person actually use sexual preference when they spoke because if so that's not cool because its sexual orientation. Why can't reporters correct people in that moment? I know the answer because they don't care that much and that's sad.

I feel like blaming it on BW, but actually I think the mistake is mine. I was thinking about all the choices he made regarding expression of sexuality, plus the ambiguity, and wrote "preference". I'm not sure any of them actually used any specific, related phrase, but of course, you're right, that mine is the wrong one. Of course it's "sexual orientation"--an important distinction.

 

The fact that things like this as still controversial--and positions hotly held as to whether one "chooses to be gay"--plus controversies like North Carolina law--show the image that Prince created/presented several decades ago made many uncomfortable then and still does today, for a big group of people who just won't change on those feelings.

 

More added to my BW dislike yesterday. I thought the police/coroner press conference was very moving in its way--they were not only so respectful of Prince, but also spoke so warmly about him. These gray-haired balding, paunchy guys talking about "He was the music of our generation"--when Prince seemed so perennially young--was affecting. Then the reporter asked, "Did his music mean anything to you personally, did you like it?" and the coroner gave what I felt was a touching, impromptu answer.

 

Cut to BW, in studio with Cyril Wecht. Brian makes some coldly worded transition to bring it all back to himself--nothing at all about how respectful they'd all been.  And then, right after the police et al had said, "We're glad the media is going to respect the process and his family and not speculate, just wait for our results"--Brian and Wecht start speculating about drugs. And while we've all read the internet rumors about prescriptions, I thought at that time Wecht--egged on by BW--went a little far afield (as did Toure with Rachel later) in speculating about what had really happened.

[maraleia]

I feel like blaming it on BW, but actually I think the mistake is mine. I was thinking about all the choices he made regarding expression of sexuality, plus the ambiguity, and wrote "preference". I'm not sure any of them actually used any specific, related phrase, but of course, you're right, that mine is the wrong one. Of course it's "sexual orientation"--an important distinction.

 

The fact that things like this as still controversial--and positions hotly held as to whether one "chooses to be gay"--plus controversies like North Carolina law--show the image that Prince created/presented several decades ago made many uncomfortable then and still does today, for a big group of people who just won't change on those feelings.

 

More added to my BW dislike yesterday. I thought the police/coroner press conference was very moving in its way--they were not only so respectful of Prince, but also spoke so warmly about him. These gray-haired balding, paunchy guys talking about "He was the music of our generation"--when Prince seemed so perennially young--was affecting. Then the reporter asked, "Did his music mean anything to you personally, did you like it?" and the coroner gave what I felt was a touching, impromptu answer.

 

Cut to BW, in studio with Cyril Wecht. Brian makes some coldly worded transition to bring it all back to himself--nothing at all about how respectful they'd all been.  And then, right after the police et al had said, "We're glad the media is going to respect the process and his family and not speculate, just wait for our results"--Brian and Wecht start speculating about drugs. And while we've all read the internet rumors about prescriptions, I thought at that time Wecht--egged on by BW--went a little far afield (as did Toure with Rachel later) in speculating about what had really happened.

No worries. The fact that I had to ask you that question is a testament to how much MSNBC has fallen from grace because honestly I wouldn't put it past anyone on the day side of the channel to say outdated phrases.

I hate Andy Lack and Phil Griffin for changing the network so much I can't even bring myself to watch it anymore.

[NextIteration]

I'm completely disgusted that they dragged out Cyril Wecht and appalled at his certainty based on crap that TMZ posted, Prince famously did not drink or use drugs.

 

I went to Paisley Park early this morning and left a purple balloon and some flowers.  I'm still wrecked about this.

Edited April 23, 2016 by NextIteration

[NewDigs]

And while MSNBC blathers and blithers on with spurious reportage about Prince, CNN was at Paisley Park this morning interviewing the Chanhassen mayor and others who spoke to how Prince was an important part of the community and the need to adequately honor his life.

To say that I am disappointed in MSNBC is a grand understatement. I thought they had turned the corner on Prince when on Thursday they ditched BriWi for Joy Reid. Wishful thinking. They blew it! In so many ways.

Let's not forget that BriWi's first caller was Clay Aiken. Please.

[stormy]

LOL Next, re: CJ

As a fellow CJ hater in Mpls, she gets paid to watch TV and report on what Tony and Michael say on PTI.

[bluepiano]

My bad week on MSNBC wasn't the Prince coverage, it's having to endure Rick Tyler and Ben Ginsberg on my TV screen at some point every day. Even multiple times a day. They are not "analysts." They are outspoken partisans for Ted Cruz.

"Politics make strange bedfellows," and it's been very strange to see Lawrence O'Donnell cozying up to these two and others in the "Stop Trump Movement." O'Donnell's hatred of Trump seems to go beyond the issues and into something that is very deep and personal. Almost pathologically so. How else to explain his on air embrace of anti-Trumpers who support Ted Cruz, the guy who stipulated that bottled water he donated to Flint only be given to anti-abortionists, and who wants to carpet bomb the Middle East until "the sands glow," among other extremist positions that are antithetical to everything O'Donnell has been professing to believe for years.

I've pretty much had to stop watching O'Donnell (admittedly never my favorite), because most nights his show is an hour long anti-Trump screed. I am not a Trump supporter, but enough already. It's bad television.

Edited April 28, 2016 by bluepiano

[Ohwell]

2 hours ago, bluepiano said:

 O'Donnell's hatred of Trump seems to go beyond the issues and into something that is very deep and personal. Almost pathologically so.

I've always thought that about O'Donnell, that his grudge against Trump is personal.  I'm no Trump supporter either, but O'Donnell's so fanatical until I had to stop watching his show.  Trump clearly gets under his skin.

[Mumbles]

This morning Luke Russert, in his best Ken Brockman anchorman voice boldly predicted Trump endorsements very soon from various members of the Pennsylvania congressional delegation because he saw one of them talking to Paul Manafort or some other dumb reason 

I make the not-so-bold prediction that it will be months until any such thing happens, if it happens at all. He's such a pompous boob.

[bluepiano]

4 hours ago, Ohwell said:

I've always thought that about O'Donnell, that his grudge against Trump is personal.  I'm no Trump supporter either, but O'Donnell's so fanatical until I had to stop watching his show.  Trump clearly gets under his skin.

Glad I'm not the only one who has felt this. I think that when a broadcaster has such a deep personal hatred towards a political figure, it should disqualify them from commenting on that person. Kind of how a prospective juror would be excused because of a deep personal prejudice against a defendant. 

I guess that technically speaking, the MSNBC show hosts are not newscasters, and so are not prohibited from expressing their personal opinions. And probably a vast majority of MSNBC viewers also have strong negative opinions of Trump. But O'Donnell's treatment of Trump reminds me of the vitriol various right wing radio and TV broadcasters have expressed towards President Obama over the years. So when you sink to that level, you forfeit any claims you may have to moral superiority. There are others on MSNBC (Chris Hayes, Rachel Maddow) who find ways to let you know how they feel about Trump without acting like a left wing version of Glen Beck.

Edited April 29, 2016 by bluepiano

[Moose135]

It goes back a ways:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/lawrence-odonnell-donald-trump/

In 2011, Trump even threatened to sue O'Donnell over comments about Trump's wealth, or lack thereof.

[NextIteration]

O'Donnell has become completely unwatchable.  At least he isn't bashing Clinton like he was, I guess.

I noticed that Kasie Hunt has been pulled from Sanders coverage and is now the go-to Anti-Trump reporter.

[Milburn Stone]

Re Brian Williams...it's a little weird to me that MSNBC considers him not damaged goods, when NBC obviously made the call that he is. I don't begrudge the guy's right to make a living, and I don't want him to end up living in a box or anything, but if his credibility has been judged to be kaput (sufficiently that he can't be on the parent network), what does it say about MSNBC that they're OK with that damaged credibility? Seems to me the most appropriate thing, in terms of upholding NBC/MSNBC's news-organization image, would be for them to cut him loose so he can get a job with a competing network that hasn't made a public judgment on his credibility.

Edited April 29, 2016 by Milburn Stone

[Mumbles]

Yeah, NBC punting Williams over to MSNBC says a lot about what the corporate types think of MSNBC.  

Williams made multiple millions of dollars in his heyday and even now probably makes multiples of what an average American makes. He could retire now comfortably and with little impact on the life he's led thus far.

Or if he wants to work, he should do something like host a game show. Something that doesn't involve credibility.

Television news is fickle - a rising star one day is hosting a morning zoo radio show years later. Arthur Kent, Kathleen Sullivan, Jodi Applegate - all household names or close to it at one point. And *they* weren't plagiarists.

[bluepiano]

4 hours ago, Moose135 said:

In 2011, Trump even threatened to sue O'Donnell over comments about Trump's wealth, or lack thereof.

A few months back O'Donnell returned a donation Trump tried to make to his charity for supplying desks to schools in Africa. He said that as a journalist he could not accept a contribution from someone running for office. So he personally donated the same amount himself. It felt like a grandstand play, at the expense of the children in Africa he is trying to help. (He could've made his own personal donation in addition). The idea of O'Donnell maintaining his impartiality is a joke, since he has none.

2 hours ago, Mumbles said:

Yeah, NBC punting Williams over to MSNBC says a lot about what the corporate types think of MSNBC.  

It felt to me that dispatching Brian Williams to MSNBC was a way to try to make it more corporate, in line with the parent network. Same with giving Chuck Toad that MTP Daily show. But since Williams was considered damaged goods, maybe it is a way to stick it to MSNBC. Like, he's not good enough to play in the major leagues, so we're sending him down to the minors.

It always feels weird when I see him co-hosting the primary coverage with Rachel. "What's wrong with this picture?"

Edited April 29, 2016 by bluepiano

[33kaitykaity]

I was so pissed today, this afternoon, grossed out beyond belief.  MSNBC spent nearly 3 hours "covering" the Trumpster's arrival, speech, and departure at the GOP convention.  I stream for noise, but ended up switching to baseball.  

[Queena]

I don't have Twitter, but someone posted a Tweet that Chris Hayes posted. Apparently, it was take your child to work day at MSNBC. They saw Iggy Azalea in the elevator, and his 4 year old daughter told her "Keep Beyonce's name out of your mouth". Apparently, I'm behind the times, because I have no idea why Iggy would have anything to say about Beyonce. 

[Medicine Crow]

11 hours ago, 33kaitykaity said:

I was so pissed today, this afternoon, grossed out beyond belief.  MSNBC spent nearly 3 hours "covering" the Trumpster's arrival, speech, and departure at the GOP convention.  I stream for noise, but ended up switching to baseball.  

I totally hear you KAITY, but personally, I couldn't watch enough of The Donald having to negotiate a steep flight of stairs, being helped to hop off the bottom step & humping his butt across the parking lot with at least fifteen of his black-coated minions & press.  I grin from ear to ear every time I watch it.  Entering via the back door, now that's a picture of Trump I like!!!

[Mumbles]

I think it has to do with Iggy Izalea claiming early this week that Beyonce's lyric "Becky with the good hair" referred to a white woman and thus was racist against white women. 

I find it hard to believe a four-year old would have the werewithall to say that so I'm calling shenanigans.

(Attributing wit and insight to children who are probably too young to possess such wit and insight is a known and annoying phenomenon on Twitter.)

[xaxat]

We're not the only ones tired of Chuck Todd. The President is as well.

Edited May 1, 2016 by xaxat

[jackiecat]

Chris Hayes soon after announced that it was a joke and he was surprised that anyone took it seriously.

[xaxat]

There were people who took a sketch for the White House Correspondents Dinner seriously?

I think my favorite part was Joe Biden.

[Ohwell]

The women seem to love Joe Biden.  He doesn't seem to mind at all. : )

[xaxat]

A fight broke out between a Huff Post and Fox reporter at the MSNBC after party.

[Ohwell]

Which is why, if I were ever invited to one of those things, I'd stick to drinking ginger ale.  

[NextIteration]

15 hours ago, xaxat said:

A fight broke out between a Huff Post and Fox reporter at the MSNBC after party.

Who wouldn't want to punch Jesse Watters in the face?

16 hours ago, Ohwell said:

The women seem to love Joe Biden.  He doesn't seem to mind at all. : )

Joe was quoted as walking up to Gladys Knight and saying "I am the Pip!"  I love Joe Biden!

I thoroughly enjoyed Wilmore's jokes at the expense of MSNBC.

Edited May 2, 2016 by NextIteration

[33kaitykaity]

Chris Matthews having vapors when Andrew Sullivan called tRump an asshole on Chris's air was hysterical, especially after Sullivan had been ripping the media to shreds for creating and sustaining the tRump phenomenon.  

Edited May 3, 2016 by 33kaitykaity

[33kaitykaity]

It's segments like this that remind me of how much I used to really like Rachel.  she was positively giddy to be able to do this interview.

Quote

THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 5/2/16

Echoes of Goldwater in 1964 seen in Trump 2016 campaign

Bill Bogert, actor in the famous 1964 anti-Goldwater campaign ad "Confessions of a Republican," talks with Rachel Maddow about the unnerving parallels between the 2016 Republican primary race and the 1964 presidential race. 

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/echoes-of-goldwater-seen-in-trump-campaign-678244419675

[xaxat]

So the press has determined that anything Donald Trump spews out of his mouth is now news?

Great. I can't wait until he starts accusing Hilary of strangling Vincent Foster with her bare hands.

[bluepiano]

So how many hours has MSNBC expended over the past few months talking about the upcoming contested Republican convention, both with their new coterie of in-house Republican commentators and an army of talking heads from various Stop Trump PACs? Delegate fights, second and third ballots, Paul Ryan riding in on a white horse, the riots in the streets when Trump is denied the nomination etc etc. And guess what? None of it's going to happen. MSNBC may just have well filled their air time with repeats of Lock Up Extended Stay.

I'm sure they're really bummed, as is the rest of the news media, because a knock-down, drag out convention would've been ratings gold. Sorry guys. At least you still have Bernie vs. Hillary, although that doesn't promise the same kind of fireworks (and insanity) of Trump vs. Cruz.

Edited May 4, 2016 by bluepiano

[stormy]

Today I caught up with Chuck Todd on MTP Daily.  Boy, have I been missing the smartest people in the republican party.

Chuck had republican strategist Alex Castellanos and National Journal's Ron Fournier on together for a segment.

Castellanos says that Trump doesn't need to win any of the minority voters and that he'll win the women so he will win the election.

Chuck and Ron Fournier kept protesting that nothing Castellanos was saying made any sense, but ole Alex wasn't backing away from his prediction.

I hope saying it enough times doesn't make it so.

Edited May 7, 2016 by stormy

[ktwo]

7 hours ago, bluepiano said:

So how many hours has MSNBC expended over the past few months talking about the upcoming contested Republican convention, both with their new coterie of in-house Republican commentators and an army of talking heads from various Stop Trump PACs? Delegate fights, second and third ballots, Paul Ryan riding in on a white horse, the riots in the streets when Trump is denied the nomination etc etc. And guess what? None of it's going to happen. MSNBC may just have well filled their air time with repeats of Lock Up Extended Stay.

I'm sure they're really bummed, as is the rest of the news media, because a knock-down, drag out convention would've been ratings gold. Sorry guys. At least you still have Bernie vs. Hillary, although that doesn't promise the same kind of fireworks (and insanity) of Trump vs. Cruz.

Does the lack of contested Republican convention mean that we've heard the last of the mini-Joe Scarborough "delegate hunter" Jacob Soboroff? Because that would be welcome.

[arejay]

So, two things:

A) How manytimes must professional TeeVee types need to be reminded that anytime they are exposed to a microphone, they should expect it to be live, and;

B) We the general public are to assume that Melania Trump is an "independently successful woman" on her own.  Riiighht.

[33kaitykaity]

So Lawrence has Steve McMahon and Kellyanne Conway on in his War Room segment.  Rather than let McMahon speak, this ReThug talking points parrot parroted the same absolute shit she spewed on Real Time last week and kept interrupting McMahon and Lawrence fucking let her.  Grr.

[Jaded]

MSNBC’s Chris Matthews Caught on Hot Mic Ogling Melania Trump

[AnnaMayWong]

Synonyms for PRESUMPTIVE ?  Puh-leeze, anyone?

[33kaitykaity]

46 minutes ago, BookElitist said:

Synonyms for PRESUMPTIVE ?  Puh-leeze, anyone?

 

conjectural, speculative, tentative; theoretical, unproven, unconfirmed

[Mumbles]

Sounds to me that Castellanos is angling for Trump work, and given his history (Google him and "jesse helms ad") it would be a great fit.

IIRC he was on ABC's This Week a few months ago, kind of pushing for Rubio and arguing that Trump was stoppable.

[arejay]

No, Joy Reid, Cecily Tyson was not "getting emotional as she prepares to introduce the President", she had slipped back into her character, Miss Jane Pittman.