Mark & Nikki: Touch That Window, Lose Your Hand

[Aw my lahgs]

I think it was a dating site where he met her when she was 16. Question... what's a 16-yr old doing on a dating site? Who's idea was that?

I am trying to give her the benefit of being from a totally different culture from us, but at the same time... where are her parents? Has she mentioned family at all?

16 year olds aren't babies. Many of them are on adult sites and may or may not lie about their age.

I think she knew from a very young age what she wanted: an American or European husband and life abroad. She got exactly what she wanted.

Mark seems a controlling douche, and it sucks to be Nikki, but she got into it with her eyes wide open.

[trimthatfat]

In a bonus clip I caught of a reairing of the first episode, Mark told a friend that Nikki lied about her age. Not that Mark isn't gross, but there are a lot of minors on 18+ dating websites.

[truelovekiss]

I'm watching the "more to love" episodes and Mark told his friend that he went back to the Philippines because American women were "too old" and had "baggage." Umm...try "appropriately aged" and "have had a chance to live full lives before I graced them with my specimen self."

[truelovekiss]

16 year olds aren't babies. Many of them are on adult sites and may or may not lie about their age.

I think she knew from a very young age what she wanted: an American or European husband and life abroad. She got exactly what she wanted.

Mark seems a controlling douche, and it sucks to be Nikki, but she got into it with her eyes wide open.

I agree that Nikki knew (at least to some extent) what she was getting into. She seems very sharp, and her English is very good. When Mark's daughter asked her if she planned to go to school or work, and Mark asked if she would get bored, it seemed very clear that sleeping in, laying out and doing her nails was what Nikki had planned. (No hate, that sounds like an ideal day for me.) I do hope that she does get some kind of skill or education so that she will be able to support herself when this inevitably doesn't work out.

[CofCinci]

Since she worked in a karaoke bar -- I'm going to assume that she was a Bar Girl, basically a prostitute for men who want the girlfriend experience.

[LaChavalina]

The irony of Mark accusing anyone of too much baggage...

 

Also, the nature of "karaoke bar" employment was already discussed at length up thread.

[Eme]

No daughter wants to hear about her Dad waking up to the Most Beautiful Sunrise with his new chickie.  No one.  You could see she threw up in her mouth a little bit at that visual….much like the rest of us did.  What Mark was doing was treating his daughter like he treated his "Boat Landlord".  Mark used the same language with her as he did to talk about seeing the sunrise with someone in his arms to that Boat Guy.  Ok.  Even that Boat Guy was grossed out thinking of Mark with a 19 yr old.  All of that advice that the Boat Guy gave Mark was clearly the Voice of Reason … and his daughter was another Voice of Reason, but come hell or high water, Mark is determined to Ignore Voices of Reason all around in his quest to wake up with a young girl in his arms. 

Nikki seems to like what she sees.  She might feel differently when she sees Mark talking to the Boat Guy and he says that he has an IRONCLAD PRENUP and that he will "be a nice guy and give her a return ticket home."  Nice indeed.

[RCharter]

16 year olds aren't babies. Many of them are on adult sites and may or may not lie about their age.

I think she knew from a very young age what she wanted: an American or European husband and life abroad. She got exactly what she wanted.

Mark seems a controlling douche, and it sucks to be Nikki, but she got into it with her eyes wide open.

In this country there are so many things that we don't allow 16 year olds to do because we accept that they aren't adults yet.  We don't allow 16 year olds to drink, get married or even vote because we accept that they haven't matured enough yet to make adult decisions.  So to me, the suggestion that its somehow okay for a 50+ man to court a 16 year old because she is on an adult site and MIGHT have lied about her age doesn't hold much water with me.

 

14 year olds and 12 year olds aren't babies either.   You can find mature 14 year olds that probably log onto adult sites, and even mature 12 year olds on adult sites.  To me, that doesn't make it okay for 50 year old men to court them.  I mean, if we call this type of behavior okay from a 50 year old man courting a 16 year old girl, at what age do we draw the line?  At what age do we say that even if a child "knew what they were doing" that they are still a child and its still taking advantage of them even if they are on the website?  Personally, I think a 50+ man, courting a 16 year old girl fits the bill.  

 

Mark is taking advantage of the fact that she is young and doesn't have many options in life coming from a poor country.  He is taking advantage of a power imbalance caused by age and situation so he could sleep with a child.  

Edited October 31, 2015 by RCharter

[greekmom]

Has anyone found a picture of Mark's ex-wife back when she was younger? I am wondering how similar looking to Nikki she is. He keeps mentioning her. Did it again in the preview with the red sports car.

[cooksdelight]

Her face was blurred out on the photo, my guess is she didn't give TLC permission to use her image, her name, zip.

[okerry]

Mark is taking advantage of the fact that she is young and doesn't have many options in life coming from a poor country.  He is taking advantage of a power imbalance caused by age and situation so he could sleep with a child.  

I wouldn't exactly consider Nikki a child, but I do agree with you about Mark taking advantage of a very large power imbalance. He seems to have little or no conscience about that and probably wonders why more men aren't as clever as he is when it comes to getting a wife. Hope he gets exactly what he paid for.

 

And I think that any number of the other couples on this show are using the power imbalance to their advantage, too. It's almost always about marrying the kind of youth and beauty that they'd never get in the States and I can't imagine such a union is going to last for long, once the import gets settled here and realizes how much better they can do if they want to. Especially someone like Nikki.

[cooksdelight]

Oh god.... something I just thought about.... Mark has that old-style 70s platform bed. With those zebra sheets and matching comforter, also 70s-80s. I wonder if he's ever replaced the mattress??

[Raja]

This is law in the Philippines, right? There's no such law here in the U.S., and I doubt the Philippines could apply that extraterritorially with any meaningful effect.

 

Anyway, I'll stop now. I do hope that somewhere, off camera, she knows who to reach out too if this goes bad.

All Filipinos going abroad to work (OFWs) or as immigrants have to go to and pass a Commission on Filipinos Overseas (CFO) seminar discussing such issues. No certificate she can't get on the airplane flying out. The parental approval (18 to 21 years) and advice (21 to 25 years) provisions in the Family Law codes for legal adults needing parental approval to marry would only apply if a Mark attempted to marry in the Philippines and then go for a K-3 or CR-1 spousal visa. A parent can not give a minor the right to marry as in many US states.

 

So far the show hasn't broadcast a couple not making it to the legal marriage. In the first season one couple didn't but their story was only on online supplements and they were not used in the broadcast edit.

[AussieBabe]

Even if she isn't a minor now, she had to have been at some point during this courtship. Obviously she lied about her age if they "met" on a dating site when she was 16. Wtf would make him want to continue engaging with a minor after he discovered her real age? That makes him look questionable. Has he looked at other girls under 18, too? The minimum age on a dating site would be 18 or so, right? I'm wondering if she was over or under 18 when he was travelling there? And if she was under 18, dude that makes you no better than the average paedo or trafficker.

[Granny58]

Yes, but let's wait and see what happens before calling too many judgments his way. She may be a very sweet individual and he may be an asshole. That's what I'm going with for now. :)

so far she doesn't actually seem very sweet.  He, however, DOES seem like a dirty old man.  

[cooksdelight]

so far she doesn't actually seem very sweet.  He, however, DOES seem like a dirty old man.

Yes, I'm slowly revising my opinion of Nikki, but I still feel sorry for her having to be treated like a replacement for his ex.

[Granny58]

This is TLC, the same station known for highlighting hoarders, people addicted to eating couch cushions, and people who are so cheap they cook in their dishwasher and wear decades old underwear.

it's "the LEARNING channel" doncha know?

[trimthatfat]

Based on what I've seen, I am not convinced that Nikki is a hapless young woman who is being taken advantage in that I think she has an agenda of her own.

[poeticlicensed]

I am trying to figure out Mark's endgame. What exactly does he want from Nikki? Sex? You can get that without marrying a Filipino teenager. Does he want her to work to bring in more income to the household? Well, she seems unskilled (with the exception of karaoke). Companionship? They have zero in common, that would be tough. God forbid he wants to have babies. So what's the deal? I see what Nikki gets out of the relationship if coming to the US is her goal. But Mark, I just don't get it. 

Edited November 2, 2015 by poeticlicensed

[Raja]

I am trying to figure out Mark's endgame. What exactly does he want from Nikki? Sex? You can get that without marrying a Filipino teenager. Does he want her to work to bring in more income to the household? Well, she seems unskilled (with the exception of karaoke). Companionship? They have zero in common, that would be tough. God forbid he wants to have babies. So what's the deal? I see what Nikki gets out of the relationship if coming to the US is her goal. But Mark, I just don't get it. 

Normally it is the other way around with the Filipina wanting at least one child while the older grandpa/dad trying to avoid it.

[truelovekiss]

I think it was a dating site where he met her when she was 16. Question... what's a 16-yr old doing on a dating site? Who's idea was that?

I am trying to give her the benefit of being from a totally different culture from us, but at the same time... where are her parents? Has she mentioned family at all?

I don't think she has. Not even in a generic "I miss my family" kind of reference.  I'm actually very curious now about her family.  

I am trying to figure out Mark's endgame. What exactly does he want from Nikki? Sex? You can get that without marrying a Filipino teenager. Does he want her to work to bring in more income to the household? Well, she seems unskilled (with the exception of karaoke). Companionship? They have zero in common, that would be tough. God forbid he wants to have babies. So what's the deal? I see what Nikki gets out of the relationship if coming to the US is her goal. But Mark, I just don't get it. 

I thought I remembered him saying he didn't want any babies with her.  (Maybe during the bonus footage episode with his friend, while they were talking about how she lied about her age?)  Even if she told him she didn't want kids ever (which she might have, because you do what it takes to get the k1 visa) he shouldn't have taken that at face value.  I know plenty of women have known for their whole lives that they didn't want children, and I respect that.  But even at 23 years old now, I can see how much I've changed my mind about what I want for my future.  Mark at 58 should know that what you envision for yourself at 19 is very seldom what you actually want 5-10 years later.

Just a random question:

 

Do we know how Mark met wife #1?  We know he met Nikki on a dating website, but back in the late 80s when he met the original Mrs. Specimen, there were no dating websites.  So was he just hanging out in the Philippines?

[AussieBabe]

I'm cracking up at Mrs. Specimen. Such high aspirations. That's #goals.

I'd love to know where he met wife #1.

[cooksdelight]

There have been marriage brokers around forever. Mark probably contacted one in Baltimore, who could find him a willing, subservient wife from another country. He would look at photos, fly to the country in question, meet a group of women and pick his favorite. And pay a hefty fee. The Internet killed that business for the brokers.

[Raja]

There have been marriage brokers around forever. Mark probably contacted one in Baltimore, who could find him a willing, subservient wife from another country. He would look at photos, fly to the country in question, meet a group of women and pick his favorite. And pay a hefty fee. The Internet killed that business for the brokers.

That's my guess agencies like Cherry Blossom used to do the talk shows like Oprah and Donahue before the format changed to Springer and Maury. If not he could have been Navy or Air Force just before the bases closed, but that doesn't fit with Cebu.

[cooksdelight]

No, I don't think he was in the military, based on him bragging about having this business all his life, raising these kids in Baltimore all his life.... unless he was in for a short 4-year stint and stationed there. I'm going with him being the dateless geek who needed to buy a wife.

[RCharter]

No, I don't think he was in the military, based on him bragging about having this business all his life, raising these kids in Baltimore all his life.... unless he was in for a short 4-year stint and stationed there. I'm going with him being the dateless geek who needed to buy a wife.

I think thats a safe bet.  My ex-boyfriend's father kept trying to get him to buy a wife from the Philippines.  It was pretty pathetic and funny that he never wanted me to meet his father.

[guilfoyleatpp]

I am trying to figure out Mark's endgame. What exactly does he want from Nikki? Sex? You can get that without marrying a Filipino teenager. Does he want her to work to bring in more income to the household? Well, she seems unskilled (with the exception of karaoke). Companionship? They have zero in common, that would be tough. God forbid he wants to have babies. So what's the deal? I see what Nikki gets out of the relationship if coming to the US is her goal. But Mark, I just don't get it. 

This is a really good question. I do think he wants a do-over of his first relationship, perhaps if just to prove to himself that there's nothing wrong with HIM, it was with the first wife.

 

If that's what it is, it's an excellent case study for a psychoanalyst (trying to "fix" a past relationship).

 

It's also quite creepy and sort of...serial killer-ish? Not that Mark is a serial killer, but there's a sort of compulsion and grand scheme that's almost reminiscent of that.

 

Additionally, what was his relationship with his own mother like? Oh man, a field day could be had by an analyst figuring this one out.

[LaChavalina]

I didn't see the "bonus clip" with Mark talking about Nikki being 16 when they met online, but homeboy might want to watch what he admits to on camera. If he went overseas to meet her before she was 18, he could be prosecuted.

[AussieBabe]

I didn't see the "bonus clip" with Mark talking about Nikki being 16 when they met online, but homeboy might want to watch what he admits to on camera. If he went overseas to meet her before she was 18, he could be prosecuted.

I was thinking the same thing. I don't want to speculate, but I have to wonder. Simple reasoning would likely mean she might have been younger than 18. If the process for a K1 has taken several months for the other couples, I can't see why their process would go any faster.

[locomoco]

I doubt Mark would do anything on camera, but I wonder what will happen when the cameras are off.

Look at what he's ALREADY done on camera:

1. Chastised her for touching the car window
2. Waking her up with a train whistle
3. Bought her the exact same car he bought he first wife who was from the same country and city
4. Talks to her like she's a pet

 

If he thinks this is normal/acceptible behavior that he can share out with America, then I shudder at the thought of what he would consider inappropriate.

[RCharter]

Look at what he's ALREADY done on camera:

1. Chastised her for touching the car window
2. Waking her up with a train whistle
3. Bought her the exact same car he bought he first wife who was from the same country and city
4. Talks to her like she's a pet

 

If he thinks this is normal/acceptible behavior that he can share out with America, then I shudder at the thought of what he would consider inappropriate.

exactamundo!

 

I just get this feeling from him that he is putting on this goofy front, but its something of a mask......and if you pull that mask away you get something way ugly.  He went out of his way to pick a girl he thinks he can control....and yes, a lot of that is that he wants to be around eye candy....I get it.  But he holds so much of the power in that relationship, and I wonder at a man who wants so much control.  There is such a power imbalance.

 

I would love to hear his first wife's story, but she may be in witness protection.

[AussieBabe]

This is a really good question. I do think he wants a do-over of his first relationship, perhaps if just to prove to himself that there's nothing wrong with HIM, it was with the first wife.

 

If that's what it is, it's an excellent case study for a psychoanalyst (trying to "fix" a past relationship).

 

It's also quite creepy and sort of...serial killer-ish? Not that Mark is a serial killer, but there's a sort of compulsion and grand scheme that's almost reminiscent of that.

 

Additionally, what was his relationship with his own mother like? Oh man, a field day could be had by an analyst figuring this one out.

 

He is a psychotherapist's/psychoanalyst's dream.

 

Of course there's nothing wrong with the specimen. He just treats his fiancee like the 19 year old child he and his wife likely would've had. He constantly compares the two. He bought her the same car. He probably kept the same sheets and maybe even some of her clothes. He was sleeping next to her picture every night. He blew a train whistle to wake his fiancee up. He complains about her immaturity. Chastised her and told her she was threatening his happiness by touching the window because he told his children they couldn't do that when they were kids. 

 

Yeah, the fault is definitely not on the specimen. It's everybody else.

 

Why hasn't he mentioned his parents? Why hasn't she said anything about her family? We didn't see her packing or saying goodbye to anyone. Even Noon showed her family home and mum maybe when she was packing and leaving.

[locomoco]

He is a psychotherapist's/psychoanalyst's dream.

Seems like a garden variety Peter Pan syndrome case, but Nikki better run if she finds a bunch of Death Head moths in the cellar.

[GracieK]

My problem with people calling it Peter Pan syndrome is that makes it sound innocent and charming.  Peter Pan is eternally a young boy.  Mark is not boyish in any way.  He is very much a 58 yr old man, living in a dated home, with no concept of what is young, relevant or 2015 in any way.  What exactly is he getting out of this relationship?  Much like I said about Mo and Dani's.. what is the point?  I get it from the foreigner's side, as a play for a green card.  But beyond "arm candy", what are these people getting out of it?  There doesn't seem to be any sort of similar interests, complementing of personalities, or even physical chemistry.  If Mark had to give 5 reasons why he loves Nikki or thinks they are a good couple, could he even come up with that many?

 

And Nikki does not impress me.  I feel bad for criticizing her as she is just a teenager, but she doesn't come off as a very dynamic or interesting one so far.  She seems dull.. and she constantly looks like she needs to wash her hair.

[locomoco]

 If Mark had to give 5 reasons why he loves Nikki or thinks they are a good couple, could he even come up with that many?

He's say something like:

1. She's beautiful
2. She makes me feel young again
3. She reminds me of my first wife before she "went crazy"
4. She can wear my daughter's hand-me-downs
5. I like Adobo

Edited November 3, 2015 by locomoco

[Aw my lahgs]

Mark said "my future depends on her happiness."

[Neurochick]

I just don't get Mark.  He said he doesn't want Nikki to be bored.  Did they ever discuss what she would do in America?  

 

I don't think Mark is "creepy" for marrying a younger woman.  What's creepy is that he's trying to recreate his first marriage, even giving her the same type of car.  

 

Why is Mark complaining that Nikki is immature, doesn't he know how old she is?  

 

What is Mark getting out of the relationship?  He gets to walk around with a much younger woman.  He sees that as a badge of honor, that other men will envy him and I get that.  Men will turn to their wives and say, "that's gross" but privately they're thinking, "Damn, he's one lucky motherfucker."   I used to know this older man when I was younger (twenties) and all he wanted from me was to hang out with him, so other men would see that I was with him.  Strange, but to each his own I guess.

Edited November 3, 2015 by Neurochick

[GracieK]

It's one thing to date younger women or play sugar daddy so that other guys will be envious.  It's quite another to import and pay for all the fees and relocation costs to bring over a teenager from an impoverished area, set her up in your home, and marry her solely for that purpose.  She is immature because she is a teenager... that isn't something you set yourself up with to marry when you are pushing 60.  Seems like the cons of that situation would far outweigh the pros.  He's an idiot. 

Edited November 3, 2015 by GracieK

[Neurochick]

Well he is an idiot, can't argue with that.  

 

I bet he thinks all other men are jealous of him because he's got a young woman with him.  

[RCharter]

He seems to be looking to mold her into what he wants.  Which is an idealized version of his ex-wife.  Mazda Miata included.

 

I'm sure Mark thinks all the other men are jealous, but to me he looks absolutely ridiculous.  It looks like he bought her.  Maybe he is using her to show other men how much money he has.  I do think there is a reason that not every man is doing this, and its because I think most men don't want to, because there is something to be said for having an adult relationship with an adult woman.

 

He is going to actively try to change her, but I don't know how that is going to work.  But hey, it didn't take long for him to hold the threat of going back over her head.

[WhoAmIReally]

I think Mark and Nikki are equally reprehensible.  Him, for all the reasons noted by others, but we're just starting to learn why she's such bad news.  I remember the episode where he was talking to her over the computer, and he tried to press her to make some decision about (or even get an inkling of) what she was going to do here, or whether she would be happy.  Her response was some idiotic thing like:  "I love you.  I'm happy when I'm with you."  He looked frustrated.  She's made it clear she wants to do nothing except to be waited on hand and foot.  His irritation with that is clearly growing and I think he knows he's in deep shit now.  She's extremely emotionally immature (even for her age) and I would peg her as a little "slow" except that she speaks English.  I doubt she even finished high school, what with her bar career and all, so she probably couldn't even help him with his business (like recordkeeping or bookkeeping), much less get a job of her own.   

 

Also, she could at least wash her damn hair.  She looks filthy.  I don't even think she's pretty; she just has the glow of youth, which will fade pretty quickly if she stays with him and becomes a frustrated nag.  Perhaps she can tune Mark out and do her required number of years and dump him while she's still in her 20's and find some new sucker.  I just hope this doesn't turn into a Lifetime movie situation.  The weird thing is, I can't tell who would kill whom.

 

I have to admit if I saw them together in public I'd be embarrassed for him.  He looks like a fool with this child.

[Raja]

She's extremely emotionally immature (even for her age) and I would peg her as a little "slow" except that she speaks English. I doubt she even finished high school, what with her bar career and all, so she probably couldn't even help him with his business (like recordkeeping or bookkeeping), .

.

Unless Cebu, if she is a native and not another province and moved for work, has gone through the transition Filipinos finished high schools at 16. Our equivalent of the 10th grade. The nation is moving towards 12 grades/year.

Her native language is probably Visayan/Cebuano. English and Filipino/Tagalog are the official languages but outside of the Greater Manila Area English may be more widely used than Tagalog.

She's extremely emotionally immature (even for her age) and I would peg her as a little "slow" except that she speaks English. I doubt she even finished high school, what with her bar career and all, so she probably couldn't even help him with his business (like recordkeeping or bookkeeping), .

.

sorry double post from the phone.

 

In any case English is a major cash crop for the Republic. First from providing English speaking workers abroad. Then by providing a middle class living in the call center industry, only you will be working graveyards for the Americans calling. The call center workers tend to be college graduates. Finally by teaching English to Japanese and Korean students.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Raja

[PityFree]

If I had to touch Mark's peepee you'd better believe I would have earned the right to lounge around all day every day when I wasn't driving around in my new car buying things for myself with his money!

 

Mark probably thinks having a 19 y.o. bride means he will save money by not having to hire a housekeeper or cook or prostitutes. He is very wrong, of course, but I'm sure he thinks that.  

[RCharter]

If I had to touch Mark's peepee you'd better believe I would have earned the right to lounge around all day every day when I wasn't driving around in my new car buying things for myself with his money!

 

Mark probably thinks having a 19 y.o. bride means he will save money by not having to hire a housekeeper or cook or prostitutes. He is very wrong, of course, but I'm sure he thinks that.  

LMAO.  You would probably also have to put up with him pawing you Dani style!

[WhoAmIReally]

Mark really seems to only have an end goal of "happiness" without knowing how to achieve it in a relationship.  Obviously, he's missing the boat on finding a true companion (someone who can provide decent conversation, understand where you're coming from, and meet your emotional needs (plus sex!)) and has just found an empty vessel he thinks he can fill.  I pity him. He has no freaking clue what a successful marriage entails, but I think he desperately wants one. 

[cooksdelight]

I bet the producers had a party when Mark sent in his application for this show. Then I started wondering what his motivation was, saw his OK Cupid profile, and all the pieces fell into place. He wants to be a TV staaaaarrr! I think he'll get his wish, as this is the network that gave us Momma June, after all.

[greekmom]

If I had to touch Mark's peepee you'd better believe I would have earned the right to lounge around all day every day when I wasn't driving around in my new car buying things for myself with his money!

 

Mark probably thinks having a 19 y.o. bride means he will save money by not having to hire a housekeeper or cook or prostitutes. He is very wrong, of course, but I'm sure he thinks that.  

Thank you!!! I have been giggling non stop at work. 

[Kiss my mutt]

Hopefully Nikki finds his Viagra stash and throws it out or replaces it with cold medicine.

[jennylauren123]

OK. I'm gonna go ahead and say it: I'm 53, and Mark is too old for me. He doesn't look his age, or act his age. He looks and acts and moves and dresses like a much older man. Which I, as a pretty good 53, do not find sexually attractive at all. And I say this as someone who is dating a 59-year-old.

[seacliffsal]

Mark seems like he has a vision of what he wants his life to be and will do anything he can to make it a reality. So, Nikki lies to him from the get go (about her age) and he justifies it as love at first contact. He's working and she calls him in to her and then just tells him to kiss her. He is starting to show his frustration but is still denying that the reality is different from the vision.