NFL Thread

[mojoween]

Maybe the new owner will be a quadzillionaire and can buy up all the Commander stock and start over.

[Carey]

I sorta hope the new owner doesn't.  The Commander name isn't great, but I'll take it over their previous name and their one before that.  What a waste of time making a big deal over it.  However, I'll be fine if there is a switch but it's done in prompt and rather quiet fashion

[mojoween]

Listening to Tom Brady yammering during The Match makes me absolutely not want to listen to him for three hours during a game.  Also he is so dour and humorless but it seems like he thinks he’s charming and droll?

[AimingforYoko]

Former Cowboy (and MN Gopher) Marion Barber III found dead in his apartment.

He was 38 and has had all manners of difficulties as noted in the article. Sounds like a pretty typical case of CTE.

[Crashcourse]

That's too bad about Marion Barber.  Since there's no "sad" emoji anymore, it feels weird to "love" the post.  Or do we use that "hugs" emoji?  

[Popples]

[Moose135]

He probably had to - there's no way a facemask fits over that beard!

[Fukui San]

That's a shame that Fitzpatrick is retiring. There are a lot of young, questionable starting QBs in the league who need undermining. 

[BetterButter]

Another lawsuit filed against Deshaun Watson after HBO’s 'Real Sports' story

Quote

The former Houston Texans quarterback now is facing 23 civil suits accusing him of sexual misconduct during massage sessions

[Prairie Rose]

13 minutes ago, BetterButter said:

Another lawsuit filed against Deshaun Watson after HBO’s 'Real Sports' story

Of course. I've lived a lifetime in the Cleveland suburbs and have witnessed the Browns make a million stupid moves, but not until they signed that guy was I actually ashamed of them.

[nittany cougar]

On 5/26/2022 at 11:14 AM, Johann said:

I bet if he's forced to sell the team, the new owner wishes this all happened before the new name became official so they could pick a better one.

I hope so, too. I live in Wash, DC, and from what I can tell, there's no enthusiasm for the "Commanders."  I have not seen one person in a Commanders shirt or hat.  And I know they are marketing it heavily because I've received numerous emails from the NFL shop inviting me to buy new Commanders merchandise.

[JTMacc99]

On 6/4/2022 at 4:44 PM, nittany cougar said:

I hope so, too. I live in Wash, DC, and from what I can tell, there's no enthusiasm for the "Commanders."  I have not seen one person in a Commanders shirt or hat.  And I know they are marketing it heavily because I've received numerous emails from the NFL shop inviting me to buy new Commanders merchandise.

I probably already said this, but it's simply not a good sports team name. It doesn't even have a natural way to shorten it the way that the Forty Niners can be just the Niners.

But I would assume that if the team got out to an 8-1 start this year, the NFL shop would be seeing some action.  Nothing moves merchandise like winning.

[Fukui San]

6 minutes ago, JTMacc99 said:

I probably already said this, but it's simply not a good sports team name. It doesn't even have a natural way to shorten it the way that the Forty Niners can be just the Niners.

But I would assume that if the team got out to an 8-1 start this year, the NFL shop would be seeing some action.  Nothing moves merchandise like winning.

Sure there is! "Commies" is a natural knickname. If only there weren't other connotations.

[emmawoodhouse]

Sweet baby Jesus, a 24rh woman has come out of the woodwork to file charges against DeShaun Watson. 

[Prairie Rose]

Yup. I said when the Browns first signed him that it was going to come back to bite them - big time. Ahhhhh, we were all so innocent in the Johnny Manziel era!

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34047357/number-lawsuits-vs-cleveland-browns-qb-deshaun-watson-now-24

[Irlandesa]

6 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Sweet baby Jesus, a 24rh woman has come out of the woodwork to file charges against DeShaun Watson. 

If I were a victim, I'd wait a year before filing just because of the shenanigans they're trying to pull with his contract.

[Danny Franks]

The NFL and the Browns thinking they could lay low until this blows over... not working out so well, is it? I hope this ends up completely humiliating the league, the organisation and Watson himself. Bunch of arrogant arseholes.

[Lamb18]

How much would the head coach be involved in all this? From what I know of Stefanski all this controversy and maneuvering is unlike him.

[bluegirl147]

1 hour ago, Danny Franks said:

The NFL and the Browns thinking they could lay low until this blows over... not working out so well, is it? I hope this ends up completely humiliating the league, the organisation and Watson himself. Bunch of arrogant arseholes.

I totally agree with you.  But I have an awful feeling fans will be less outraged over this than they were over Colin K. taking a knee.  

And is Deshaun Watson that good of a QB to risk everything on?  When Big Ben had the accusations against him the Steelers were considering trading him. But the Browns actively pursue and sign Watson. I will never understand why the Browns do the things they do.

[JTMacc99]

10 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

If I were a victim, I'd wait a year before filing just because of the shenanigans they're trying to pull with his contract.

In the event that he plays this year with his $1M salary, and then is suspended next year with his $40M salary, the Browns could simply change the 2023 salary to $39M of signing bonus and send him that check, and let the league fine him during his suspension based on a $1M salary. There are no rules against that.

35 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

And is Deshaun Watson that good of a QB to risk everything on? 

Yes.  Not every team was willing to take the risk, but there were several making the effort. (Although only one apparently who was willing to make the deal the Browns were willing to make.) 

[Prairie Rose]

2 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

But I have an awful feeling fans will be less outraged over this than they were over Colin K. taking a knee.  

Same here. I think there will be a lot of parallels between this and a case like Depp/Heard.

[xaxat]

This is the public defense Watson's lawyer thinks is his best play?

Quote

“I don’t know how many men are out there now that have had a massage that perhaps occasionally there was a happy ending,” Hardin said. “Maybe there’s nobody in your listening audience that that ever happened to. I do want to point out, if it has happened, it’s not a crime. OK? Unless you are paying somebody extra or so to give you some type of sexual activity, it’s not a crime. . . . Doing something or saying something or being a way that makes you uncomfortable is not a crime.”

[Fukui San]

Speaking of the Browns, I only now learned this story from the 2011 draft. In the 4th round they called DE Cameron Jordan to know they were drafting him. Unfortunately he had already been drafted in the first by the Saints. They meant to call TE Jordan Cameron. 

Jordan: "Right. ... Sitting there, you're just like, 'I mean, I'll take two signing bonuses. But I refuse to go to Cleveland.'"

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/saints-cameron-jordan-tells-the-most-browns-story-ever-involving-a-draft-day-mixup-with-jordan-cameron/amp/

[NUguy514]

3 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

And is Deshaun Watson that good of a QB to risk everything on?

No.

[bluegirl147]

26 minutes ago, xaxat said:

This is the public defense Watson's lawyer thinks is his best play?

I wonder how many people will read/hear that and think "well yeah Ok when  you put it like that"?  I am so tired of being told the gross things men do is no big deal.

[merylinkid]

Watson is that good.   He really is.   It was tough to tell because he played for the Texans, but damn, he was magic out there.   Now he had a year off so he may be a tad rusty.   But yes, if these cases were settled, a LOT more teams would be pursuing him.   It was only the unknown NFL punishment that scared a few teams off.

Not saying I agree with it.   But from a purely football "what happens on the field only" perspective hell yeah.   Teams are going to want him.

[mojoween]

Fuck all those teams, Cleveland specifically.

Calvin Ridley got a year for one parlay when he wasn’t even active.  DeShaun Watson never needs to show his face on ANY football field for the rest of his sad awful disgusting life.

[Prairie Rose]

1 hour ago, xaxat said:

This is the public defense Watson's lawyer thinks is his best play?

Sickening but so not surprising. 😣😣😣😣😣

[Prairie Rose]

1 hour ago, mojoween said:

DeShaun Watson never needs to show his face on ANY football field for the rest of his sad awful disgusting life.

THANK YOU. 👏👏👏👏👏 I have always lived in the Cleveland area and supported its teams. Adding this guy to the Browns tells me that the organization doesn't care about its female fans or females in general, so why should I continue to support them? I refuse to watch and I hope he performs poorly. It would serve all of them right.

[NUguy514]

3 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Watson is that good.   He really is.   It was tough to tell because he played for the Texans, but damn, he was magic out there.   Now he had a year off so he may be a tad rusty.   But yes, if these cases were settled, a LOT more teams would be pursuing him.   It was only the unknown NFL punishment that scared a few teams off.

Not saying I agree with it.   But from a purely football "what happens on the field only" perspective hell yeah.   Teams are going to want him.

The problem, of course, is that you cannot separate his off-field crimes from his on-field accomplishments, so, no, Watson is not that good.  No athlete in any sport ever is good enough to supersede sexual assault (or any other serious crime), and the athlete in question and any team willing to pay him (or her, I guess, although it's always a "him") as much money as the Browns are paying Watson deserve to be vilified until such time as the culture and mentality of said sport are changed irrevocably not to prioritize rewarding criminal behavior because of the perception that someone's ability to win is more important than the lasting damage his crimes cause (and that is true in every area, not just sports).  If that day ever arrives, I will celebrate.🕺

[Prairie Rose]

46 minutes ago, NUguy514 said:

If that day ever arrives, I will celebrate.🕺

I'll celebrate with you and I'll bring the champagne. 🍾🥂

[Carey]

I guess I'd be surprised if Watson played (at all) this season.  TBH, I wouldn't be surprised if he did, but the Browns sucked anyway.

It's Cleveland.  They find ways to ruin whatever, even if it's actually impossible to screw something up.  While it probably would not have worked anyway, maybe be super serious in saying that Baker and DeShaun are battling for the starting role.

Actually, just stick with Mayfield since losing is traditional, and then maybe strike lightning in a decade before you celebrate by blowing that up over trying to win a championship at that moment

[Prairie Rose]

11 minutes ago, Carey said:

I guess I'd be surprised if Watson played (at all) this season.  TBH, I wouldn't be surprised if he did, but the Browns sucked anyway.

It's Cleveland.  They find ways to ruin whatever, even if it's actually impossible to screw something up.  While it probably would not have worked anyway, maybe be super serious in saying that Baker and DeShaun are battling for the starting role.

Actually, just stick with Mayfield since losing is traditional, and then maybe strike lightning in a decade before you celebrate by blowing that up over trying to win a championship at that moment

This is all very true. If the Haslams thought this would be the move that would finally put them over the top, they have to be kidding themselves.

[mojoween]

66 massage therapists in 17 months means you did something so heinous you can’t go back to the one you used before.  The NFL has a character clause in the collective bargaining agreement.  USE IT.

[bluegirl147]

41 minutes ago, mojoween said:

66 massage therapists in 17 months means you did something so heinous you can’t go back to the one you used before.  The NFL has a character clause in the collective bargaining agreement.  USE IT.

https://sports.yahoo.com/report-deshaun-watson-66-women-for-massages-17-months-texans-behavior-221930918.html

The Browns offered up all that money knowing all this? If I was a Browns fan I don't know if I would be more pissed or more disappointed.  

[merylinkid]

The Browns didn't know.  They CLAIMED they did their due diligence, but they didn't want to look too closely.    And really if 22 civil lawsuits were not enough to dissuade them knowing he had that many massage therapists in a relatively short time frame wasn't going to do it.   

Some athlete said when this story originally broke that you don't keep changing massage therapists.   You find one you like and stick with it.   Maybe have a back up for when the regular is not available but its not normal to have a variety of massage therapists.    so the Browns knew from the get go, even if they didn't know the exact number, that the situation was off.

 They weren't looking beyond the field. 

[bluegirl147]

11 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

The Browns didn't know. 

Willful ignorance doesn't work with me.  And I'm not so sure it's going to work with most people.   So the Browns knew there was something there but didn't know the extent of the something and just hoped the something would go away.  Millions of dollars at stake.  Their next season's success at stake. Their reputation, such as it was and is, at stake.  And they choose to go with the guy who has those allegations against him. My sympathies to the Browns fans.

[Danny Franks]

1 hour ago, bluegirl147 said:

 My sympathies to the Browns fans.

Except for the ones who have decided to believe Watson and proceeded to blame the victims, claiming they're liars and prostitutes just out to make money off a poor, sweet boy who didn't realise how duplicitous women are.

[JTMacc99]

The Browns were not the only team trying really hard to trade for Watson. They were simply the team that made the best offer both to the Texans and to Watson himself.  All of the trade activity picked up immediately after it became clear that there would be no criminal trials.

So whatever all of these teams knew about the civil suits was apparently enough for them to all think it was something that will be dealt with over a short period of time, and that Watson would eventually just be a football player again. 

FWIW, it seems as though he was thought of very highly as a professional and a person before this all came to light. 

But now that additional women have come forward, with very clear explanations of what Watson did to them, and major media reporting is also shedding light on all of it, I'm sure every team that was previously interested is privately thinking how fortunate they are that they were not the ones who made that trade. 

The league HAS to keep him off the field at this point. 

From a football perspective, this is going to very quickly turn into a discussion of what kind of ways the Browns can get out of that (ridiculous) contract.

[Black Knight]

2 hours ago, JTMacc99 said:

From a football perspective, this is going to very quickly turn into a discussion of what kind of ways the Browns can get out of that (ridiculous) contract.

It's the Browns. They probably signed an absolutely airtight contract whereas the other teams probably would have included some kind of clause. I know the Browns threw a ton of money at Watson, but I don't think that's the only reason he went with them. If you know you are likely to have continuing issues and revelations, you go with the team dumb enough to agree to be totally on the hook no matter what happens.

The Browns really should have just given Mayfield one more season and seen how much of a factor his health was last season. If he turns out to just be bad, so what? Gives them a good draft position for next year's draft which will have a better selection of quarterbacks than this year's draft did. Win-win either way. Mayfield's antics are nothing compared to Watson's.

[bluegirl147]

2 hours ago, Black Knight said:

Gives them a good draft position for next year's draft which will have a better selection of quarterbacks than this year's draft did.

How many QBs have we seen come through Cleveland? I thought they might have finally had one who could do the job for a few years with Mayfield.  But instead they sign a QB who is problematic to say the least for a shit ton of money and he might not even play a down. Well done Browns.  

[Irlandesa]

10 hours ago, JTMacc99 said:

So whatever all of these teams knew about the civil suits was apparently enough for them to all think it was something that will be dealt with over a short period of time, and that Watson would eventually just be a football player again.

IIRC, the lawyer for some of the plaintiffs said they were never contacted.  So they dug far enough to think they had plausible deniability.

The thing that might get interesting is whether or not the Texans face anything for covering up for him.  Could the Browns go after them?

[Black Knight]

Yes, the Browns said back when they announced the Watson signing that their "due diligence" didn't include actually speaking with any of the many women involved. They claimed their lawyers told them not to. Uh huh.

But obviously any investigation in which only one side is talked to and not the other is going to be a skewed investigation. Someone at the Browns, probably Haslam, really wanted Watson and did not want to be talked out of it, clearly.

[xaxat]

1 hour ago, Irlandesa said:

The thing that might get interesting is whether or not the Texans face anything for covering up for him. 

Attorney Tony Buzbee: Houston Texans, others to be added as defendants in lawsuits against Deshaun Watson

I understand that some of the women have said that they won't accept a settlement, but I wonder how much pressure the NFL, Browns, Texans etc. are putting on Watson to settle the suits and make this go away, because they know/strongly suspect he is in the wrong. Discovery is going to be ugly.

Damien Woody on ESPN described his actions as predatory and from what I have read, that sounds accurate. 

Edited June 9, 2022 by xaxat

[merylinkid]

From what I read in the latest complaints -- the Texans were ACTIVELY INVOLVED in Watson's activities.   They supplied the NDAs and TEAM facilities for some of the massages.   So they knew that he was cycling through masseuses.   They HAD to know something was off.   

Of course, the Texans have their own issue with the team chaplain turned GM running everything because he prays with the owner.   

[bluegirl147]

10 hours ago, xaxat said:

Damien Woody on ESPN described his actions as predatory and from what I have read, that sounds accurate. 

I watched Bryant Gumbel's Real Sports and Soledad O'Brien interviewed two of the women and they sounded very credible and I believe them.  

Deshaun Watson has said nope this didn't happen.  He has said some stuff did happen but it was consensual.  Men accused of a lot less has faced consequences.  The NFL always wants to bury their head in the sand and say well we didn't know. There wasn't any proof.  Remember Ray Rice? That wasn't taken seriously until there was the elevator video.  

1 hour ago, merylinkid said:

From what I read in the latest complaints -- the Texans were ACTIVELY INVOLVED in Watson's activities.   They supplied the NDAs and TEAM facilities for some of the massages.   So they knew that he was cycling through masseuses.   They HAD to know something was off.   

The NDA's I find troubling.  Why does a massage therapist need to sign an NDA?  NDA's are offered up when you want to keep something from becoming public knowledge.  

[Notabug]

On 6/8/2022 at 8:07 AM, bluegirl147 said:

https://sports.yahoo.com/report-deshaun-watson-66-women-for-massages-17-months-texans-behavior-221930918.html

The Browns offered up all that money knowing all this? If I was a Browns fan I don't know if I would be more pissed or more disappointed.  

As a Browns' fan, I think we're more resigned than anything else.  It's now been several decades of mismanagement and stupidity.  Long gone are the days when we were proud of the Browns.

Lifelong fan, I was actually sitting in the stands for The Drive.  I was proud of that team.  No pride whatsoever in the current team.

Quote

 Someone at the Browns, probably Haslam, really wanted Watson and did not want to be talked out of it, clearly.

Haslam was also the guy who demanded that the Browns draft Johnny Manziel which looks like a genius move compared to this debacle. He is a joke as an owner.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Notabug

[Prairie Rose]

28 minutes ago, Notabug said:

As a Browns' fan, I think we're more resigned than anything else.  It's now been several decades of mismanagement and stupidity.  Long gone are the days when we were proud of the Browns.

Lifelong fan, I was actually sitting in the stands for The Drive.  I was proud of that team.  No pride whatsoever in the current team.

Haslam was also the guy who demanded that the Browns draft Johnny Manziel which looks like a genius move compared to this debacle. He is a joke as an owner.

I don't think I've had real pride in the team since Bernie left. 

[Ohiopirate02]

24 minutes ago, Prairie Rose said:

I don't think I've had real pride in the team since Bernie left. 

Not even 2 years ago?  That primetime wild card game in Pittsburgh was fire.

[Notabug]

21 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Not even 2 years ago?  That primetime wild card game in Pittsburgh was fire.

That was a very fine moment, albeit  brief.  Like finding a diamond in a pile of poop.

I get very sad these days watching Jim Donovan, voice of the Browns, doing his sportscast and having to say stuff like.  'Well, Watson had 66 different masseuses in just over a year, but 15 of them have come forward and said that he DIDN'T sexually harrass/assault them.'  Like we should be bragging about how he didn't abuse ALL of them.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Notabug