S01.E10: eps1.9_zer0-day.avi

[SharonH58]

I didn't make it past episode 2. Only character I liked was the dog and they treated him bad!

[shapeshifter]

the Ashley Madison comment was clearly pieced in during the week they had off.

I have no knowledge of when the episodes were originally in the can, but apparently that could've been added before last week too--maybe Esmail will post about it in the future--but for now, according to Wikipedia:

The company [Ashley Madison] received attention on July 15, 2015, after hackers stole all of its customer data—including emails, names, home addresses, sexual fantasies and credit card information—and threatened to post all the data online if Ashley Madison and fellow Avid Life Media site EstablishedMen.com were not permanently closed. By July 22, the first names of customers were released by hackers, with all of the user data released on August 18, 2015. More data (including some of the CEO's emails) was released on August 20, 2015...

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode.

 

'Where Am I? I Mean...Where Am I?' / 'That's a good question.' Looking back at Mr. Robot's first season.

[FishyJoe]

I think Tyrell 'fixed' the problem. If he has the decryption key, he could use that as leverage to become the new CTO of Evil Corp. That could also be the reason why the new CEO is so confident, because the situation isn't hopeless and he will be the savior of Evil Corp and the world for that matter. 

[DotCotton]

There were hinting strongly, but I don't think Elliot is Tyrell. I'm more inclined to believe some kinky threesome happening during Elliot's missing three weeks. I do think Joanna has met Elliot before, though, and she seems to know he has some mental lapses.

I also think Joanna knew Elliot before this meeting.  The way she talked to him and when she called him "Ollie" as if she knew that wasn't his real name. She was talking to him almost as if she was just humoring him, knowing that he has multiple personalities.  Then she speaks Danish to send her menacing message.To me that makes it look like she knows Tyrell was with Elliot.  Maybe she's known about  or even known Elliot for a while.  After all, she was pretty much the mastermind behind Tyrell's rise (or attempted rise) to power until Tyrell had to go and strangle a woman.  Elliot and her may even have a past together. Oh and what about her first baby?! Why even bring up the baby?  Just to show that she has secrets from Tyrell?  There has to be more there, right? Or am I just over-analyzing it?

 

Did I miss something or did we not see the Chekhov Popcorn Gun?! They even showed Darlene putting the gun in the popcorn during the "previously on..." as if it was an important  scene.  

 

Ug! So many questions unanswered! All I feel like I really know for sure is that Elliot's father/Mr. Robot is not a real person.  Hell, his father as presented in his mind may not have ever existed.  This show drives me crazy, but I'm addicted to the craziness. 

 

Rami Malek better at least be nominated for an Emmy if not wining one.  He is just so friggin' good!

 

 

[Eliz]

Boy I hated that last scene, and I hate the idea that the show is going in the direction of a shadowy conspiracy. To me, it undercuts so much of what has been exciting about the show's critique of capitalism. It's so much less interesting -- and so much sillier -- if the evil is the product of a coordinated effort of a group of rich men sitting around together in a dark room with a roaring fire, a harpist, and champagne. The much bleaker reality was presented so well in the conversation Terry Colby had with Angela when he described the meeting in which the decision was made to go forward with the actions that led to her mother's death.

I guess an evil cabal is easier to dramatize on a tv show than the cumulative effect of all the independent decisions made in a system that incentivizes greed. But god, it just makes me roll my eyes. I've never enjoyed (or even bothered to follow) a vast global conspiracy storyline -- I lost interest in the X Files, in Alias, and I will lose interest here with a quickness.

[AlliMo]

In the Mr. Robot televised speech, it looked like one eye was Elliot's and the other was Tyrell's.

 

And the Ashley Madison comment was clearly pieced in during the week they had off.

 

According to Esmail, the reference to Ashley Madison was in the original script.

 

http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/mr-robots-creator-did-everything-in-my-power-to-telegraph-the-big-twist

[Eliz]

It's really daring of the show to take the climactic action of the whole season -- fsociety executing the hack -- and not show it to us. I mean, I guess it would just be a scene of somebody typing some things on a keyboard? But still, they've managed to make plenty of scenes like that dramatic.

I get that the point is to put us in the same position as Elliott (right?), but still, daring. I'm not sure it worked, but I admire the risk.

[Avaleigh]

This episode blew my mind and it was the Joanna/Elliot conversation that did it. 

 

I'm not 100% sold and I still have a bunch of questions but I do think it's very possible that Elliot and Tyrell are the same person. I'm not sure if Elliot is Tyrell or Tyrell is Elliot but I want to strictly focus on the conversation between Joanna and Elliot because I think it was very revealing. I got vibes of how things were coming together for him once he started to figure out and remember who Darlene is.

 

Let's pretend for a second that Elliot is Tyrell and Joanna recognizes that Tyrell is currently not himself but thinks that he's somebody else. 

 

Elliot/Tyrell is knocking on the door as Joanna approaches the building. She asks him if she can help him and he tells her that he's looking for Tyrell. To me it looks as though Elliot is trying to remember where he's seen Joanna before. Joanna's expression is harder to read but I think she looks unhappy. 

 

She says that Tyrell isn't there. I think this could be referring to him not currently being there mentally. 

 

When Elliot asks her if she knows where Tyrell is, she tilts her head, looks at Elliot curiously, and asks him "Who are you?" Elliot thinks to himself that this is a good question. 

 

Joanna wants to keep Elliot talking so she tells him that she just talked to Tyrell and that Tyrell should be "back" any moment. She tells the weird acting, perfect stranger that he's welcome to wait inside with her and the baby. It's not 'hey, I'll tell Tyrell to give you a call and that you stopped by'. 

 

She asks again about his name and Elliot tells her that he's Ollie. *cue the weird music* She asks to know what Ollie and her husband were working on and this causes Elliot to think "You've got to help me get out of this. There's something about her. I feel like she can hear us."

 

When Joanna asks about the last time Elliot saw Tyrell, Elliot knows that Joanna is lying and fishing for information. He's even more uneasy than he already was and says that he saw Tyrell last week. Joanna smiles, picks up the baby, and tells Elliot that she's been a little concerned about Tyrell. Again, she's telling this to a person she just supposedly met. 

 

She wonders if Tyrell was being strange last time Elliot saw him and Elliot immediately wants to cover for Tyrell. Joanna tells Elliot that Tyrell was being very strange the last time she saw him and that the last time was three days ago. This coincides with Elliot's three days away from fsociety. 

 

She speaks to him in Danish and when he tells her that he doesn't understand what she's saying, she looks upset and has to look down, close her eyes, and turn her head away. She rolls her eyes as though she's done this with him before. Elliot totally notices her reaction because he asks her if she's okay. 

 

Her wedding ring is being kept very deliberately in the shot and Elliot seems like he's looking in the direction of the baby.

 

She tells him that she shouldn't take up any more of his time, thanks him, and calls him Ollie. They both know that she knows he's not Ollie and so he turns and walks away. She kisses the/their baby as she watches him leave. 

 

I don't know, I thought this scene was very convincing that Elliot could actually be a personality of Tyrell's.

 

[DotCotton]

If Tyrell and Elliot are the same person, what about when Elliot went to Steel Mountain.  I can't remember exactly but weren't the other members of FSociety watching him? Wouldn't they have seen him with Tyrell? If he is Tyrell, why would he have to use the different ploys to get into Steel Mountain?

[editorgrrl]

I do think it's very possible that Elliot and Tyrell are the same person.

Taking this to "Mr. Spoiler and Ms. Speculation Discussion." And thank you for the thorough breakdown of the scene!

[shapeshifter]

...I don't know, I thought this scene was very convincing that Elliot could actually be a personality of Tyrell's.

That scene gave me the same impression, but it could still be just a red herring for us viewers, right? I mean, there's nothing in it that definitively proves Tyrell is Elliot, right?

[WentMissing]

When Elliot gets out of Tyrell's SUV in the parking lot, it sounds to me like he says, "Who am I? I mean...where am I?" Not "Where am I...where am I?" like I think I've seen written it in more than one place. Does anyone else hear this?

 

That suggests to me that Elliot finally realized (at least that one time) that he does have more than one personality. I'm going back and forth on whether he's Tyrell or not but if the translation of Joanna's is accurate, that she said she would kill him if he did anything to Tyrell, I guess he's not. Unless the Joanna/Elliot scene that Avaleigh provided is somewhat accurate and she meant she would kill him if Elliot got rid of the Tyrell personality that she prefers/knows.

 

 

 

Edited to correct Tyrell's name

Edited September 4, 2015 by WentMissing

[editorgrrl]

When Elliot gets out of Tyler's SUV in the parking lot, it sounds to me like he says, "Who am I? I mean...where am I?" Not "Where am I...where am I?" like I think I've seen written it in more than one place. Does anyone else hear this?

That suggests to me that Elliot finally realized (at least that one time) that he does have more than one personality.

According to closed captioning it was "where," not "who." But when Joanna asked, "Who are you?" Elliot thought (via voiceover), "Good question."

[Chicago Redshirt]

One of the main wrenches in the Tyrell=Elliott theory is that Tyrell's secretary would presumably have said, "But you're Tyrell" or something like that when Elliot showed up asking for Tyrell. 

[possibilities]

When Elliot gets out of Tyler's SUV in the parking lot, it sounds to me like he says, "Who am I? I mean...where am I?" Not "Where am I...where am I?"

That's what I heard, too. I watched it multiple times and heard it that way every time.

 

I was sure that Tyrell could not be Elliot, because of the assistant not recognizing him as Tyrell. But now I'm feeling insecure that maybe that wasn't Tyrell's assistant, but a different one? I'm not confident anymore, about my facial recognition sharpness and I didn't think to double check that carefully enough.

 

I would have thought that when they caught Elliot with a dog that was chipped and reported stolen, that someone would have detained him or at least the dog. What's the point of having a chip if everyone will just look the other way once the dog turns up? I don't want Flipper to go back to the abusive little shit who owned him, but from a systems point of view, it seems odd that no one flagged the situation.

[sjohnson]

I thought the Mr. Robot reveal episode made it clear that kid Elliot threw himself out the window, just as he threw himself off the railing on Coney

Island.

 

In post-finale interviews, Sam Esmail has stated that he intends Elliot to have Dissociative Identity Disorder; also that people who are presented as real beyond Elliot's perception of them are real.

Responding to Esmail (not Cardies post)...

 

Every indication is that DID of this sort is iatrogenic, manifesting after an intervention. It could be psychiatric as in the famous cases of Sybil or Three Faces of Eve. Or it could be hypnotic, as in reincarnation stories like Bridey Murphy. I think the first recorded instance of an alternate personality was made by a Morton Prince, who if I remember correctly from an early high school reading of George Estabrook on the history of hypnotism, quite an eminent psychologist in his day.

 

Also, the notion that the alters are so separate as in second rate melodramas is not supported. 

 

Also, the notion that mental illness is not just compatible with high function, but possibly a necessary component of true genius, is both ludicrous and backwards. 

 

Also, the show had early established that Elliot somehow displayed ASD symptoms, despite autism having nothing to do with DID, or with paranoid schizophrenia.

 

Also, which by the way, the show early clearly established that Elliot was severely paranoid, acting it out in preemptive plotting against (or as the show would have it somehow, for) figures personally important to him. 

 

Voice of God or no, Elliot's mental disturbances, which are clearly what the show is about, are a motley collage of images secondhanded from old TV and movies. Where anything can happen, does anything matter? As for any political/social issues, Elliot's innocence of doing the hack, renders any audience judgments of all the political/social issues raised, irrelevant. And it doesn't matter if an alter is engaged...the adorable, suffering but hypercompetent core personal of Elliot is the hero. Tyrell Wellick seemed to be some sort of mirror, where madness=evil. I guess the character exists so that the audience can think "no, Wellick's the evil one," since so many people think mad, evil, genius, and demonic are more or less synonymous. I'm not sure Esmail doesn't share this mindset and is delighted to think Elliot is an antihero.

[editorgrrl]

I would have thought that when they caught Elliot with a dog that was chipped and reported stolen, that someone would have detained him or at least the dog. What's the point of having a chip if everyone will just look the other way once the dog turns up? I don't want Flipper to go back to the abusive little shit who owned him, but from a systems point of view, it seems odd that no one flagged the situation.

Lenny gave Flipper's chip number to all the vets in the city. Once he had an ID, he went to the police, who are investigating the hacking—not the dognapping. Lenny told Krista, "The police had their cyber crime division look into it. They've been trying to track him down for the past six weeks."

Did Elliot take Flipper to the vet six weeks ago? Or did the pilot episode occur six weeks ago?

[WentMissing]

According to closed captioning it was "where," not "who." But when Joanna asked, "Who are you?" Elliot thought (via voiceover), "Good question."

I'm thinking that person just didn't hear it correctly either. In a separate matter, is that Harriet the Spy in your Avi? I loved that book as a kid.

 

One of the main wrenches in the Tyrell=Elliott theory is that Tyrell's secretary would presumably have said, "But you're Tyrell" or something like that when Elliot showed up asking for Tyrell. 

I know, I know...

 

I was sure that Tyrell could not be Elliot, because of the assistant not recognizing him as Tyrell. But now I'm feeling insecure that maybe that wasn't Tyrell's assistant, but a different one? I'm not confident anymore, about my facial recognition sharpness and I didn't think to double check that carefully enough.

It was his assistant.

[Ottis]

I guess an evil cabal is easier to dramatize on a tv show than the cumulative effect of all the independent decisions made in a system that incentivizes greed. But god, it just makes me roll my eyes. I've never enjoyed (or even bothered to follow) a vast global conspiracy storyline -- I lost interest in the X Files, in Alias, and I will lose interest here with a quickness.

 

 

Agree, though I loved X-Files and Alias. Mr. Robot reminds of me of the third, recent Batman (with Kane). It starts out with a promising perspective on capitalism, and then becomes about a revenge fantasy of someone who was pulling Kane's strings. Completely lost my interest. I wonder if Mr. Robot can keep making observations on capitalism even with a rich guy conspiracy in place. Though I don't think the show did a good enough job of showing the negative effects of the hack. Lots of people with no cash now can't get food.

[kat165]

Avaleigh, thank you so much for that detailed interpretation of the Elliot/Joanna scene. I've been baffled as to why people have been wondering if Tyrell is another alter of Elliot's (or vice a versa) and your analysis makes it clearer to me. Finally. :)

 

An aside: I found Lenny's chipping the dog and alerting all the vets in the area completely contrary his "caring" for the dog when he had him. He treated Flipper pretty poorly. It's hard to imagine he'd go to all that trouble on Flipper's behalf.

[cardigirl]

Avaleigh, thank you so much for that detailed interpretation of the Elliot/Joanna scene. I've been baffled as to why people have been wondering if Tyrell is another alter of Elliot's (or vice a versa) and your analysis makes it clearer to me. Finally. :)

 

An aside: I found Lenny's chipping the dog and alerting all the vets in the area completely contrary his "caring" for the dog when he had him. He treated Flipper pretty poorly. It's hard to imagine he'd go to all that trouble on Flipper's behalf.

I think Lenny had chipped the dog because he's purebred and because most vets suggest doing it when you get a puppy.  He alerted the vets in the area after Elliot took the dog, because he wanted to track Elliot down.  He could still do all of this and not be a great dog owner.

Edited September 4, 2015 by cardigirl

[Cardie]

Lenny's a self-important, controlling a-hole. He cares nothing about the dog in and of herself but damned if he's going to let anyone else take her from him. It's just like men who beat their wives or girlfriends but come with a gun to shoot any other guy they're with after the women finally get up the courage to dump them.

 

My current feeling on the Joanna scene is that Tyrell and Elliot-in-Mr. Robot-mode together confronted her during the missing three days, saying "crazy" stuff. Now that "Ollie" is acting like he doesn't know her, she wonders what else he's done with/to Tyrell. 

[possibilities]

I think there is a certain sort of person who will fight back out of pride, i.e. "he took my property and I won't let him get away with it!" -- and that this is the kind of person who would be angry that his dog was stolen, even if he hated the dog and was mean to it.

 

Also, I don't know why it would be hard to track Elliot down. He isn't living underground. He has an apartment. He is there frequently. He also occasionally showed up at work at AllSafe. People at AllSafe know where he lives. He's also mandated to see Krista, and apparently Whiny Dog Abuser knew this, and the police could have court-ordered her to disclose his address if nothing else. Or they could have waited at her office when he was due there, with a warrant for his arrest. It's just not that hard to find someone. So I also wonder how much dude was lying to Krista at their rendez-vous. And I loved that she stuck to her perception of him as the scum he is, and looked him in the eye and lied to him. She knows Elliot's a hacker. He told her all kinds of things.

 

RE the representation of DID and whether it's accurate, I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, I see absolutely nothing to preclude multiplicity where one personality is on the autism spectrum, since I personally know someone in that category. The two things are not mutually exclusive. On the other hand, while sometimes people in the process of integration will interact with other people in the system, I have never heard of this being the case with someone who was not aware of the DID itself, nor have I heard of them having any awareness of others even if they don't realize they are part of the same system. The interactions between Elliot and Mr Robot to me are schizophrenic, not like anyone I know with DID. But maybe there are more forms of DID than I am familiar with.

 

My understanding of multiplicity is that it is caused by severe trauma. They had been implying that the situation growing up was extremely abusive, so I could buy it from that perspective. But over time the show has shied away from that narrative, and made it seem like Elliot is just off his rocker for no known reason. That is something I find unlikely for a DID case study. It's not an organic disorder or a genetic condition. Likewise, as far as I know, there is not any medication used to treat it (none of the multiples I've known were ever treated with pharmaceuticals the way schizophrenic or other "psychotic" or "delusional" people are). That's actually a similarity with people on the autism spectrum, i.e. it's not something people prescribe a drug to eliminate... though perhaps the meds Darlene referred to were anti-anxiety or anti-depression drugs, which I could see as possible. But they never did explain why Elliot would prefer morphine, if that's the case.

Edited September 4, 2015 by possibilities

[Ronin Jackson]

I don't think the Elliot is Tyrell thing works... not only for the aforementioned scene where Elliot speaks to his assistant and there's nothing to indicate she thought she was speaking to her former boss, but we also have numerous scenes of Tyrell and Elliot's separate lives. We know Elliot worked at Allsafe, and have numerous examples of Allsafe employees addressing him as Elliot and a tangible impact that he had as an employee there. And we have the same thing with Willick at Evil Corp, people addressing him by his name, him having his own office, and again having tangible impact. If Elliot and Tyrell are the same person, then we are talking about either one person having and maintaining two separate lives and identities, or one of these person's entire existence, and all of the people within it, are imaginary. That's a horrible leap to ask the audience to take... it means a great deal of the show's content is a delusion, which. I'm sure a rewatch of the series would effectively torpedo this theory. And it would be an awful, terrible plot development.

 

I can accept that Esmail intentionally telegraphed the Mr. Robot is not real thing, which I still don't think is a great choice, but the show has so many other merits that I'm no longer going to harp on it (especially now that it's done). But if there's more hijinx involved with identity in store for the show, it's not going to hold up. It's the weakest aspect of a strong show. This show needs to be about something else, and so far it is, but if they keep up with such nonsense it won't be about anything else. It would weaken the shows strengths and timeliness if they keep pushing the envelope with the unreliable narrator thing to the point where potentially nothing we have been watching is real. 

 

As another response to Esmail's a comments, it's a little hard to swallow Esmail's claim that the "Ashley Madison dump" line was written before the Ashley Madison dump... it's way too on the nose and totally random out of context... I'd like to believe what he's saying... but who would have any idea what an "Ashley Madison dump" is referring to before there was an actual Ashley Madison dump. I don't know how well known the website was but I hadn't even heard of it before the hack made news.

 

It's interesting that they cast an Indian women as Elliot's mother to account for Elliot's ethnicity... Carly Chaikin doesn't look remotely ethnic but it's not a point worth quibbling with.

[Ailianna]

The only thing I really didn't like about the finale was the ex-boyfriend of Krista's and his claims that he was having Elliott arrested.  In New York, which is clearly where the show takes place, just hacking into someone's online accounts isn't a crime.  Invading privacy electronically is nothing, under NY law, unless there is money stolen, goods taken, or blackmail or extortion of some type.  It's sort of possible that the dog issue is a misdemeanor larceny, but NYPD's cyber crimes unit isn't wasting their time over an asshole's dog.  The police aren't looking for him, and as far as Lenny goes, he's got nothing.  The big hack is obviously something very different, but Lenny wouldn't even make it far enough into NYPD to talk to a cyber crimes detective.

[Chaos Theory]

The only thing I really didn't like about the finale was the ex-boyfriend of Krista's and his claims that he was having Elliott arrested. In New York, which is clearly where the show takes place, just hacking into someone's online accounts isn't a crime. Invading privacy electronically is nothing, under NY law, unless there is money stolen, goods taken, or blackmail or extortion of some type. It's sort of possible that the dog issue is a misdemeanor larceny, but NYPD's cyber crimes unit isn't wasting their time over an asshole's dog. The police aren't looking for him, and as far as Lenny goes, he's got nothing. The big hack is obviously something very different, but Lenny wouldn't even make it far enough into NYPD to talk to a cyber crimes detective.

I think that is why he went to Krista. He needs more. I doubt he has anything. Hell when Elliot googled himself he came up blank; I doubt Lenny has jack on him. Going to Krista was a combo get Elliot(does he even know Elliot's name?) /charm my way back into your pants but neither worked. However now that the hack happened he actually does have something which puts him back in the game.

Edited September 4, 2015 by Chaos Theory

[WentMissing]

My current feeling on the Joanna scene is that Tyrell and Elliot-in-Mr. Robot-mode together confronted her during the missing three days, saying "crazy" stuff. Now that "Ollie" is acting like he doesn't know her, she wonders what else he's done with/to Tyrell. 

This makes sense.

 

As another response to Esmail's a comments, it's a little hard to swallow Esmail's claim that the "Ashley Madison dump" line was written before the Ashley Madison dump... it's way too on the nose and totally random out of context... I'd like to believe what he's saying... but who would have any idea what an "Ashley Madison dump" is referring to before there was an actual Ashley Madison dump. I don't know how well known the website was but I hadn't even heard of it before the hack made news.

I didn't think he was saying that specific line was in the script before. He said he made a number of Ashley Madison references in general, thought they were too much, took them out, then the real life dump happened and he decided to add the line in post. He had time to do it since the epi was postponed a week.

Edited September 4, 2015 by WentMissing

[Eliz]

My current feeling on the Joanna scene is that Tyrell and Elliot-in-Mr. Robot-mode together confronted her during the missing three days, saying "crazy" stuff. Now that "Ollie" is acting like he doesn't know her, she wonders what else he's done with/to Tyrell.

This seems right to me. There was definitely an undercurrent in their interaction, and I think this is a better reading of it than as a suggestion that Tyrell is an Elliot identity. I think the show has conclusively shown us that is not the case (there's no getting around that scene with Tyrell's assistant, for one thing). I do think that Joanna's reaction to Elliot indicates that this was not the first time she's seen Elliot's face, and the way she was testing him about whether he's seen Tyrell during the last three days probably means she knows he has because she saw them together sometime during Elliot's missing time.

[FishyJoe]

I can't remember but was Gideon present when Tyrell was visiting the Allsafe office?

[Kiss my mutt]

Maybe someone involved with the show knew the Ashley Madison plot line and went all fsociety and hacked it.

Anyway, my hat is off to any of you who understood this episode. It just seemed to go in a completely different trajectory then the previous episodes would suggest. It confused my poor noggin.

[dgpolo]

Wasn't there a scene in an earlier episode that had a bunch of people in someone's office, Gideon's maybe? And Tyrrel was there? and asked Elliot if he wanted to be on his team or something? Sorry I just remember a scene with a lot of people in an office and both of them being there.

[xaxat]

When the E Corp crew visited the Allsafe office, Tyrell was there, but I don't think he talked during the meeting. (The one where Angela was dismissed.) 

 

Tyrell did talk to Elliot at his workstation and they discussed working in Linux or something and, if I remember correctly, each was impressed with the other's skill.

 

It was an episode or two later, in the E Corp conference room where the executive committed suicide, that Tyrell asked Elliot to be on his team.

[queenanne]

I can't articulate why I think Tyrell is not Elliot any better than some folks already have, but I object vehemently if we're going to believe there is no Darlene or that she is an Elliot alter, because Darlene and Angela in ballet together.  I would really find it hard to believe that Elliot would think he's Darlene in a leotard, or that it would be appropriate for an Elliot-Darlene combo to tell Angela that ballet means "they get to spend some time together".  Expecting us to believe both is/are, is too much.  I might believe Elliot weirdly saying he gets to spend time with Angela because not so much with Ollie always around, but at the time they worked together, so I find that unlikely as a conversational choice on his part also.  And while I dunno if anything rules out the logic of men being in a solely ladies' ballet class (which I think that was), then again, I have been in and seen single-sex ballet classes.  (Though again, not overwhelmingly so - I've only been in one -  and it could be possible that as a self-selecting gesture some ballet classes can be only women, if any ballet class would be mixed, I should think it would be in the likes of NYC.)  So yes, I think Darlene stands on her own.

 

I'm likewise not in love with the whole hacking played-out, but I tend to think that part of it Elliot made up.  I know it would be weird for him to make up something like Angela and Michael Cristofer together where he isn't there, and kind of cheating, but I'm not comfortable with the fact that they did it for reasons that folks have already previously articulated so well (it would just be alarming economically, etc.).  It seemed really extreme that people weren't reacting more negatively, that's why I think somehow it's fantastical.  I could be very wrong, and probably am, because it also makes sense that essaying such an action is more sensible than seasons of fsociety making plans to take things down that in reality crap out and fall apart, but while we're busy reacting to trippy things I thought I'd throw that reaction on in there.

 

Thanks to those who alerted me I should go back and check out post-credits scene; I assumed there was nothing and shut off my digital copy sooner (I had a paper due Thurs. and nothing indicated on my DVR that it wasn't going to tape the episode, yet it did not.  Feh.)

[Hecate7]

I think that is why he went to Krista. He needs more. I doubt he has anything. Hell when Elliot googled himself he came up blank; I doubt Lenny has jack on him. Going to Krista was a combo get Elliot(does he even know Elliot's name?) /charm my way back into your pants but neither worked. However now that the hack happened he actually does have something which puts him back in the game.

 

 

OMG. Elliot came up blank. That could mean he's not who he thinks he is.

[Netfoot]

I think it's preposterous to suspect everyone of being either one of Elliot's alter egos, or a figment of his imagination.  

 

I mean, like, maybe Darlene is really Elliot!  Maybe Angela is really Elliot's mother!  Maybe Tyrell's wife is really Elliot's wife, because Tyrell is really a figment of Elliot's  imagination!  Or Elliot is really a figment of Tyrell's imagination.  Maybe Elliot is still in a coma after falling off the railing onto the rocks.  Maybe the dog is really a cat.  Maybe the fish is really a parakeet!

 

Or maybe there is only one character that is all in Elliot's head, because the writers realized that more than one would be overdoing it, and would ruin the show.  Because a show with all the characters non-existent, and all the scenes just a dream, wouldn't be a show worth watching.

[Cardie]

I didn't think he was saying that specific line was in the script before. He said he made a number of Ashley Madison references in general, thought they were too much, took them out, then the real life dump happened and he decided to add the line in post. He had time to do it since the epi was postponed a week.

 

I read an interview with him the day after the postponement and he said that he was in the middle of referencing the Ashley Madison hack in post on the morning the episode was going to air and he heard about the Virginia shooting and figured they would not be able to air the finale that night. Then he commented on how real life was always catching up to the show's world.

[rozen]

I think people are underestimating how much Joanna hyperanalyzes people. She has apparently been the director of Tyrell's interactions with others in their scheme to quickly rise to the top of E-Corp. She immediately put the pieces together when the police arrived without batting an eyelash, them promptly left to get a fork to bail her husband out. She's a pretty top notch profiler (imo), and Elliott is not exactly in a position to hold together, I think Joanna simply read him like an open book. Then she got carried away, threatening him in Danish. To me, that indicates that Joanna and Tyrell have all kinds of nasty things in their closest, perhaps that's why they're in America. I think that line is just setup for more backstory next season. Maybe the financial meltdown and Tyrell having his own mini-meltdown just provided an opening for some other bad actor to swoop in and capitalize.

 

Or maybe he just had enough of a head start on what fsociety was planning that he ran out to do as much as possible to insulate himself/gain leverage on E-Corp. There's plenty he could probably accomplish in the kerfluffle besides figuring how to deencrypt the 'unencryptable' data E-Corp holds. That, and his nemesis is still dealing with the brutal murder of his wife, for all we know Sociopath Grandpappy CEO is going to encourage him to commit suicide too.

 

The introduction of a shadow cabal doesn't bother me. I can buy that a bunch of rich economic types could forsee this type of thing is inevitable, and simply harness the boundless energy of young and dumb hackers to make it happen. That, and the Elliott vs himself, is anyone really real? storyline doesn't have much legs left in it (imo). If too many people are hallucinations, the entire show turns into a schizophrenic version of The Affair. Things have to, eventually, objectively happen.

[Saje]

Excellent analyses in this thread! I can't think of a show more deserving right now of all your brilliance! For the record, here's my dos centavos:

 

I do NOT think Tyrell is an alter. I fucking hope not, he's a great "Spike" and I want to see more, much more. Did anyone else see the actor on a car commercial?

Joanna. She baffles. I didn't think she knew Elliot prior to the finale. Now, not sure. Whatever, she's dangerous.

I want dad to be alive. He can still be the figment, the driver... but I want him to be in a cabin in Alaska somewhere. And I want Elliot to find him.

Darlene-Angela-Krista... want them all to be real and useful. Darlene - obvious attempt to cash in on the Kat Dennings thing. Damn they did a bad job of casting Angela. Weakest actor on the show with her big moon head and stilted, false notes. She takes me out of the show with how really bad she is sometimes.LOVE Gloria Reuben. Want her to stay in this sphere - almost like Melfi in The Sopranos. See where she takes it.

Gideon. Can he not be corrupt or die? Fuck corruption or death. I really am rooting for this one. Please don't make him the sacrificial lamb you are aiming for, show!

[GaT]

Finally watched the finale. No idea what I just watched. 

[Hecate7]

I think it's preposterous to suspect everyone of being either one of Elliot's alter egos, or a figment of his imagination.  

 

I mean, like, maybe Darlene is really Elliot!  Maybe Angela is really Elliot's mother!  Maybe Tyrell's wife is really Elliot's wife, because Tyrell is really a figment of Elliot's  imagination!  Or Elliot is really a figment of Tyrell's imagination.  Maybe Elliot is still in a coma after falling off the railing onto the rocks.  Maybe the dog is really a cat.  Maybe the fish is really a parakeet!

 

Or maybe there is only one character that is all in Elliot's head, because the writers realized that more than one would be overdoing it, and would ruin the show.  Because a show with all the characters non-existent, and all the scenes just a dream, wouldn't be a show worth watching.

 

 

You gotta admit, though, it's just possible Elliot's being "followed around" by his own employees, and it was his own car that took him to his own office in the first episode. It would also explain why Tyrell's car is there, but there's no sign of Tyrell.

 

His conversation with the wife reminded me of his first conversation with Darlene. I think the women are real, but he may be hallucinating that there are more of them than there really are.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Hecate7

[shapeshifter]

I think it's preposterous to suspect everyone of being either one of Elliot's alter egos, or a figment of his imagination.

I mean, like, maybe Darlene is really Elliot! Maybe Angela is really Elliot's mother! Maybe Tyrell's wife is really Elliot's wife, because Tyrell is really a figment of Elliot's imagination! Or Elliot is really a figment of Tyrell's imagination. Maybe Elliot is still in a coma after falling off the railing onto the rocks. Maybe the dog is really a cat. Maybe the fish is really a parakeet!...

Yes, it would be preposterous, but if it can be pulled off elegantly, it would also be groundbreaking. You know: "Fine line between madness and genius" (speaking of Esmail et al. rather than Elliot) and "Nothing ventured; Nothing gained" and all that.

Now I want Qwerty to be a canary, LOL.

Edited September 5, 2015 by shapeshifter

[Hecate7]

I think Darlene is real. The Mom was pregnant in the flashback.

If Elliot could forget he had a sister, and not recognize his own father, there's no limit to what he might have forgotten. The show HAS established rules, though. Elliot is dissociative, and schizophrenic, AND he's doing morphine. So far, the show has followed the rules of what that does to a person pretty well.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Hecate7

[Saje]

[terxav]

Who is making the videos or rather who is behind the mask? They zoomed in to show blue eyes, and Joanna has the most beautiful blue eyes on the show. I kept thinking of their scene and how her eyes seemed to pop.

[alias1]

I think it's preposterous to suspect everyone of being either one of Elliot's alter egos, or a figment of his imagination.  

 

......there is only one character that is all in Elliot's head, because the writers realized that more than one would be overdoing it, and would ruin the show.  Because a show with all the characters non-existent, and all the scenes just a dream, wouldn't be a show worth watching.

After having read everyone's analysis of this show, I have to agree with this.  I know one thing.  If Elliot is Tyrell then I will be extremely disappointed.  As was stated, It would be the same as everything being a dream and, of course, the show could do anything then because nothing has to make sense. Using Elliot's mental state as an excuse for so many things not making sense would be cheap.  It would also mean he killed Sharon and I can't believe that.  I also don't believe that Joanna has ever met Elliot before.  I agree with the person who said she is just good at reading a situation and improvising a response.  Yes, she's dangerous.  Even more so, now that she's met Elliot.   I believe that Darlene is real (and his sister).  Krista is real.  Angela is real.  Beyond that, I don't know. 

[editorgrrl]

It was interesting seeing Krista again too with an unexpected callback to the first episode. They must have added that bit about the Ashley Madison hack late in post-production as it's a very recent thing.

Mr. Robot Creator Says Finale's Big Reveal 'Is the Heart of Future Seasons,' Names the Scenes That Wowed Him

http://tvline.com/2015/09/02/mr-robot-finale-post-mortem-elliot-realizes-psychotic-break/

It was ironic that you purposely edited into the finale a timely Ashley Madison hack reference, only to have the episode wind up reflecting a different current event (the live, on-air Virgina shooting), in an unfortunate way (and thus was postponed a week).

Yeah…. The Ashley Madison thing was there in the pilot, one of the pieces that Elliot uses as leverage against Lenny. So what happened was in the original draft of the finale… I used Ashley Madison again, but then I felt like, “Eh. I’ve already made reference to that, let’s cut it.” And then when we were editing it, the actual Ashley Madison story came out and I was like, “How can we not?” It just makes total sense, so we put it back in.

[fastiller]

Edited to add that the music was even more retro than the Cure or Pixies: 1980's "People Who Died" by Jim Carroll (the guy Leonardo Dicaprio played in Basketball Diaries).

Love that song.  And - great use of it in the episode.

 

Yes. I was afraid Tyrell's body would be there when he opened the back. I doubt they'd go back to that well, though - my guess is he's alive, and it was him in the Mr. Robot mask.

I thought so too.

 

Did I miss something or did we not see the Chekhov Popcorn Gun?! They even showed Darlene putting the gun in the popcorn during the "previously on..." as if it was an important  scene.  

 

<snip>

 

Rami Malek better at least be nominated for an Emmy if not wining one.  He is just so friggin' good!

I was a little confused that we didn't see that specific gun used.  I sort of half expected it to go off as the popper started popping.  And seconding the comment about Malk and the Emmy.

 

From the recap:

Price stuns Angela by saying he's relieved the degenerate weakling Plouffe killed himself, then takes the podium above a gathering of somberly-clad flunkies and press, arrayed roughly in the shape of a dark star around a giant Evil Corp "E" set into the floor: very Illuminati, very compelling, not too heavy-handed, buuuut...we know.

 

That room was 1356 Broadway, currently the Gotham Club (or it looked very like it!).  It used to be a bank that I worked for; training was done on the 6th floor of the building, so I've walked through that room many times.  Aside from the fact that there's a landmark preserve on it and so the ATMs that I'd install/service had to be standalone machines, it's one of my favourite rooms in all of NYC.  I love how this show has used NYC, both the well-known aspects and the less well-known.

 

Edited b/c the Oscar and the Emmy are different awards.

Edited September 9, 2015 by fastiller

[bros402]

Love that song.  And - great use of it in the episode.

 

I thought so too.

 

I was a little confused that we didn't see that specific gun used.  I sort of half expected it to go off as the popper started popping.  And seconding the comment about Malk and the Emmy.

 

From the recap:

 

That room was 1356 Broadway, currently the Gotham Club (or it looked very like it!).  It used to be a bank that I worked for; training was done on the 6th floor of the building, so I've walked through that room many times.  Aside from the fact that there's a landmark preserve on it and so the ATMs that I'd install/service had to be standalone machines, it's one of my favourite rooms in all of NYC.  I love how this show has used NYC, both the well-known aspects and the less well-known.

 

Edited b/c the Oscar and the Emmy are different awards.

 

My dad is in A/V.

 

He said that building was the Gotham Club, he was there a month ago to make sure a show setup went smoothly.

[Jmoney]

I'm surprised not one person has mentioned that White Rose is talking with the E corp CEO in the final scene. Obviously no longer cross dressing but its BD Wong nonetheless. BTW I feel like Wong threw in the cross dressing thing to support transgender community because it really wasn't a great disguise if he was trying to fool Elliot.

Let's be serious Elliot can't be everyone! The show is called Mr Robot they need to stick to the idea his counter personality is only Mr Robot.

Love the show everytime I finish watching its like the way I felt after I read Catcher in the Rye.