Figure Skating

[specialj67]

Oof, the men’s event from SC this week was a tough watch. IDK what was up with Junhwan Cha; those falls looked painful…it seemed like maybe his timing was way off?

Deanna and Max were clearly on a different level compared to the other pairs teams. I love that they finally got a win and really look forward to seeing how they do, now that the Japanese’s world champ team is out of the GP for the season.

 

[redpencil]

9 hours ago, specialj67 said:

Oof, the men’s event from SC this week was a tough watch. IDK what was up with Junhwan Cha; those falls looked painful…it seemed like maybe his timing was way off?

I've never really been a big fan of Cha, but has he always had such looong set ups/takeoffs for his 3A? It's so distracting, even if there aren't all the other errors. On the shallow side, I do, however, appreciate that he has changed up his glove game. In the past he wore flesh-colored gloves that made him look like he had doll hands.

[Salacious Kitty]

Junhwan 😭

That was the worst I've ever seen him. Congratulations to the podium. A nice group. 

[SeanC]

Piper & Paul looked great to start the year, despite the shorter off-season.

The US dance scene below Chock & Bates is remarkably unsettled right now, between Hawayek & Baker’s absence, Green & Parsons’ surprisingly tough start, and the other young teams jockeying for position.

Allison Reed boldly goes where none of her siblings had gone before — a Grand Prix podium.

On 10/27/2023 at 9:58 PM, Avaleigh said:

Sidenote: It's kind of annyoing that it's apparently a requirement for skaters to have a moment where they're sliding around on their knees even when it doesn't jive with the choreography. 

It’s not a requirement. Knee slides have just become popular choreographic features in the past few seasons, inspired (as so much is) by ice dance choreo.

[Avaleigh]

18 minutes ago, SeanC said:

It’s not a requirement. Knee slides have just become popular choreographic features in the past few seasons, inspired (as so much is) by ice dance choreo.

Glad to know it's not a requirement, but it's still too bad that everyone feels the need to do the same thing even when it isn't well executed. It's kind of like everyone turning their layback into a Biellmann even when it doesn't look good.

[annzeepark914]

I remember when a rule was created that stipulated "no dying on the ice". It might've been Klimova & Ponomarenko who started all the lying-on-the-ice drama (but they were sooooo good at it...1991-92 season?). Then, every ice dance team was doing it and it got to be ridiculous. So, hopefully a new rule will emerge that will cut down on all the sliding, slithering, whatevering on the ice. What was the move that Bourne & Kratz started doing (& soon lots of teams were using it)? Can't think of the name. I wasn't referring to that because that move requires skill.

[Avaleigh]

23 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

I remember when a rule was created that stipulated "no dying on the ice". It might've been Klimova & Ponomarenko who started all the lying-on-the-ice drama (but they were sooooo good at it...1991-92 season?). Then, every ice dance team was doing it and it got to be ridiculous. So, hopefully a new rule will emerge that will cut down on all the sliding, slithering, whatevering on the ice. What was the move that Bourne & Kratz started doing (& soon lots of teams were using it)? Can't think of the name. I wasn't referring to that because that move requires skill.

Was it Torvill and Dean who popularized dying on the ice after Bolero?

With Bourne and Kraatz--was it the hydroblading? (Sp?)

[Notabug]

1 hour ago, annzeepark914 said:

I remember when a rule was created that stipulated "no dying on the ice". It might've been Klimova & Ponomarenko who started all the lying-on-the-ice drama (but they were sooooo good at it...1991-92 season?). Then, every ice dance team was doing it and it got to be ridiculous. So, hopefully a new rule will emerge that will cut down on all the sliding, slithering, whatevering on the ice. What was the move that Bourne & Kratz started doing (& soon lots of teams were using it)? Can't think of the name. I wasn't referring to that because that move requires skill.

I think you're thinking of hydroblading.   Bourne and Kraatz did it beautifully; but they had incredibly 'deep knees' that most skaters cannot come close to matching.

https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=bourne+and+kraatz+hydrobLADING&mid=030AA6A75129DC063F15030AA6A75129DC063F15&FORM=VIRE

There are multiple examples of hydroblading in this video.  The best joint move is at around 3 minutes.

The dying on the ice move was definitely popular in the early 90's.  Christopher Dean said that part of their motivation in returning in '94 was to reject the death skating and put the fun back into ice dance.  I think the incredible innovation and success of Bolero inspired a lot of dance teams to go for the dramatic finish and that led to all the death scenes in ice dance; but I don't think that was Torvill and Dean's intention when they did it.

The Duchesney's from France were well known for their death scenes at that time.  Isabelle Duchesney, of course, was Christoper Dean's first wife and they met when he did some choreography for them.

Edited October 30, 2023 by Notabug

[ML89]

The CBS piece on death on the ice from 1994:

 

https://youtu.be/U-0B72qzkeQ?si=m0sIwdlg048QaTtL

(Mark Philips is a very snarky Canadian who has been with CBS News since the 80s...) Also bonus sightings of Jill Trenary, Chris Bowman, Todd Eldredge...

Edited October 30, 2023 by ML89

[SeanC]

2 hours ago, Avaleigh said:

Glad to know it's not a requirement, but it's still too bad that everyone feels the need to do the same thing even when it isn't well executed. 

You could apply that same reasoning to virtually any element, could you not? Most competitors will be attempting various challenging things to varying degrees of success.

Like, there were very few good spiral sequences back when they were mandatory for women.

[wintrygal]

1 hour ago, Notabug said:

I think you're thinking of hydroblading.   Bourne and Kraatz did it beautifully; but they had incredibly 'deep knees' that most skaters cannot come close to matching.

https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=bourne+and+kraatz+hydrobLADING&mid=030AA6A75129DC063F15030AA6A75129DC063F15&FORM=VIRE

There are multiple examples of hydroblading in this video.  The best joint move is at around 3 minutes.

The dying on the ice move was definitely popular in the early 90's.  Christopher Dean said that part of their motivation in returning in '94 was to reject the death skating and put the fun back into ice dance.  I think the incredible innovation and success of Bolero inspired a lot of dance teams to go for the dramatic finish and that led to all the death scenes in ice dance; but I don't think that was Torvill and Dean's intention when they did it.

The Duchesney's from France were well known for their death scenes at that time.  Isabelle Duchesney, of course, was Christoper Dean's first wife and they met when he did some choreography for them.

Thanks for sharing, enjoyed watching that, one of my all time favorites teams to watch back then!

[Avaleigh]

4 hours ago, SeanC said:

Like, there were very few good spiral sequences back when they were mandatory for women.

I don't totally agree with this. In the earlier days, it's true that this was a throwaway element for many women. Skaters like Tonya Harding come to mind. As time went on though, a lot of skaters made the most out of their spiral sequences and not just Michelle Kwan. Skaters who immediately come to mind include: Sasha Cohen, Alissa Czisny, Shizuka Arakawa, Sarah Hughes, Joannie Rochette, Mirai Nagasu, Nancy Kerrigan, Lu Chen, Angela Nikodinov, Nicole Bobek, Alissa Czisny, Mao Asada, Yuna Kim--all of these women made spirals fun to watch. (And this isn't even getting into men like Paul Wylie or Jason Brown who also appreciate the choreographic power of a well placed and executed spiral.)

The spiral sequences only enhanced their programs, they certainly didn't detract from them. If spirals were still a required element, I feel like people would do their best to make sure that their extension and flexibility are on point. IMO great extension and flexibility make for a better skater. Think how many beautiful program highpoints involved a spiral at the perfect moment in the music--to me the only other elements that are comparable to the power of the spiral are a well done spread eagle or ina bauer.

I maintain it's a shame that the spiral sequence was eliminated. 

[annzeepark914]

Figure skating has changed and for me, it has changed in a not good way...mostly in singles. The beautiful moves (change edge spiral, heck any spiral, Ina Bauer, elegant layback spins, spread eagles) seem to be mostly a memory, replaced by jumps with arms over heads and the ever present Biellman spin. Vocals screeching throughout the arena, dreary ballads that mean something special to the skater but mean nothing to the audience.  It feels like only the occasional skater showcases the power and beauty of figure skating today. Jason Brown may not have the required quads but at least it's always interesting watching him compete. Ilia and Kevin are two of the new interesting skaters. The only discipline that seems to hold onto the beauty of the past is ice dance (for me interesting ice dancing past started in the mid 80's).  Skating is a sport and I know it has to evolve. But it shouldn't have to be at the expense of the artistry.

[SeanC]

1 hour ago, Avaleigh said:

The spiral sequences only enhanced their programs, they certainly didn't detract from them.

There are tons of old programs from the mandatory spiral area that stop dead in their tracks with the spirals. And it's not like people can't still do them if they want to and think it fits the choreo sequence, etc.

There were certainly skaters who did them well, but there are as many who can do the knee slides, etc. well. 

18 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Vocals screeching throughout the arena, dreary ballads that mean something special to the skater but mean nothing to the audience.

The use of more contemporary music I would say has greatly increased the meaning of programs to the audience.

[Avaleigh]

1 hour ago, annzeepark914 said:

Vocals screeching throughout the arena, dreary ballads that mean something special to the skater but mean nothing to the audience.

Not only this, but it seems like some skaters want the dreary ballads to do the artistic work for them. 

I was all in favor of allowing vocals because I thought it would lead to people having more fun with their programs, which would in turn lead to more enjoyment from the audience and maybe even have the sport gain some new casual fans. Instead there have been a lot of forgettable programs over the past few years. Just to be clear I don't feel this way with dance or pairs. 

[annzeepark914]

1 minute ago, Avaleigh said:

Not only this, but it seems like some skaters want the dreary ballads to do the artistic work for them. 

I was all in favor of allowing vocals because I thought it would lead to people having more fun with their programs, which would in turn lead to more enjoyment from the audience and maybe even have the sport gain some new casual fans. Instead there have been a lot of forgettable programs over the past few years. Just to be clear I don't feel this way with dance or pairs. 

You said it better than I did. Clutching one's head while a singer wails about something is not all that. I don't think the audience is loving the ballads. They sure light up when upbeat, fun music starts up. 

[ML89]

10 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

You said it better than I did. Clutching one's head while a singer wails about something is not all that. I don't think the audience is loving the ballads. They sure light up when upbeat, fun music starts up. 

I just want someone to tell me what the deal is with "Rain in your black eyes."

[SeanC]

On 10/30/2023 at 11:28 PM, annzeepark914 said:

I don't think the audience is loving the ballads. They sure light up when upbeat, fun music starts up. 

Those are program types that by design aim for different audience reactions.

[ramurphy2005]

Bradie Tennell has withdraw from both of her Grand Prix assignments. I hope whatever has caused her to withdraw isn't too serious. 

[annzeepark914]

Did anyone else here, who gets the Washington Post, see any mention of (hometown boy) Ilia's win & mighty big score at Skate America? If it appeared in the paper, I must've missed it &  I've been checking for it every day. Everything in this paper's sports section is either the sorry Commanders, the basketball team, & DC United (soccer). Ilia's from Vienna, VA, a suburb of DC. I remember when Michael Weiss (of Fairfax) was national champion (3 times) & World's bronze medalist (2 times). He also had few articles written about his achievements. Even our baseball team can get shoved to the back pages once freakin' football practice begins in August 🤬

[Salacious Kitty]

Speaking of Ilia, he had a stumble at the beginning of his footwork sequence. His lead after the short is negligible. Any one of the top 3 can win tomorrow. 

[Avaleigh]

Gubanova's jumps and presentation are very strong. That being said, her spins are not good. I'm surprised there's not more commentary on how much she needs to improve in this area. I'm honestly amazed that her team feels comfortable having that layback be the last thing the judges see. 

I think this is the first time I've seen Nina Pinzarrone. I thought she was good. The jumps seemed a little tight but overall she seems like she has a lot of potential. I'm curious to see how she'll look two years from now.

Kimmy seems a lot taller this year. Maybe it's been challenging for her to adjust to her growth spurt. I remember her being very consistent last year. 

I really like Haein Lee. Underrotations aside, I loved the program and the step sequence was on point. It's nice to see a program that doesn't end with a layback.

Isabeau's short program is really growing on me! She looked like she was having fun out there and I don't think I quite realized how gorgeous her dress is until I saw a closer view of it. 

[SeanC]

Dance

The French dance podium is a literal repeat of the previous year's podium, though I wouldn't say any of it was inaccurate.

I've become a big fan of Lopareva & Brissaud's Mylene Farmer RD, which is one of the only instances of teams using non-English-language 1980s music. It's nice to see a French team repping for French artists, it's not like the 80s only happened in the USA and Britain.

Below the podium, happy to see Lim & Quan continuing to make strides.

Women

Among the ladies, Nina Pinzarrone emerged on the junior scene during the pandemic so she didn't compete as much as she otherwise would have in those years, and then injury cost her her Grand Prix debut last year, so this was a great start. Loena must be so proud.

Cool for Sumiyoshi to finally land the quad, though that was a generous rotation call.

Isabeau's reaction to staying in first overall was cute.

Two of the three French skaters did really well in the free skate, including Serna having what I'd call her best ever.

Men

Now that was a blazing finale. Britschgi with what will probably be the best fourth-place performance of the Grand Prix season, Kagiyama with a solid start to his comeback, then Malinin with what will almost certainly be the best silver medal performance of the season, and Siao Him Fa with a spectacular title defense. If the actual World Championship podium skate that well, it will have been a great event.

Gogolev, iffy free skate, but I think on the whole this event was a positive for him.

Pairs

Woo, Lia & Trennt! I had thought they might win Skate America, but they did get their Grand Prix gold eventually, and by unexpectedly unseating the reigning World bronze medalists.

The Kovalevs are now two-time Grand Prix medalists, remarkably.

Shame about Ellie Kam.

[justmehere]

Finally finished watching this weekend's competition.

-So happy to see both Yuma Kagiyama (love that Carolina Kostner is coaching him) and Wakaba Higuchi again.
-Isabeau is really growing on me - she's quite a lovely skater.
-Hope Adam Siao Him Fa can keep landing his jumps as the season progresses - he's so good when he does. Shoma is going to have some competition this year - but he's still my favorite given that Jason isn't competing fully (and doesn't have the tech levels). (Camden Pulkinen can be really good too, if he lands his jumps.)
-Loved Lim & Quan - their Free program is so beautiful and moving. I really got caught up. Guignard and Fabri's lifts were great and their Free program was lovely.

On 11/4/2023 at 1:53 PM, SeanC said:

Shame about Ellie Kam.

-I so enjoyed Kam and O'Shea's short program. All I heard about the withdrawal was a fall in practice. Ellie seems to fall a lot. Is there any other info? 

[Avaleigh]

Nina was so good! She's definitely a new favorite. She's definitely a full package skater.

Isabeau was lovely. Her jump technique might not be a 100% and her lack of speed is still an issue, but overall I really enjoy her skating and artistry. Well deserved win. 

Adam Siao was great. His programs are exciting and that lutz was on point. Before they skated I was predicting a win from Ilia. Ilia was good and I love that footwork sequence. Too bad about that weird fall though.

Quick question: I understand that Russian athletes will be able to compete at the Olympics under neutral athlete or whatever they'recalling it, but will they be allowed to compete in the team event? I'm hoping the answer is no. The reason I'm curious about this is it seems like Italy is a legit contender these days for the team event. They aren't strong in the ladies but the other disciplines they're pretty solid. It would be nice to see them on the podium. (It would also be nice if a damn decision was made regarding the 2022 team medals. Give the Americans the gold already!)

1 hour ago, justmehere said:

So happy to see both Yuma Kagiyama (love that Carolina Kostner is coaching him)

I didn't know that Carolina was coaching until I saw her here. Glad to know she's still involved with the sport. 

Last comment--I have to say that my faith in the sport was somewhat restored when I saw that Gubanova got a level 1 on her layback. If I'd only seen her do that spin and nothing else, I honestly would not believe that she is an elite level skater. Her coaches have much to answer for if they think that's acceptable. 

[SeanC]

53 minutes ago, Avaleigh said:

Last comment--I have to say that my faith in the sport was somewhat restored when I saw that Gubanova got a level 1 on her layback. If I'd only seen her do that spin and nothing else, I honestly would not believe that she is an elite level skater. Her coaches have much to answer for if they think that's acceptable. 

Gubanova has chronic back problems; it's been very evident with her spins the past two seasons.

[Avaleigh]

11 minutes ago, SeanC said:

Gubanova has chronic back problems; it's been very evident with her spins the past two seasons.

Even with her back problems (which I was unaware of) it still doesn't explain the inexplicable choice to end her program with her weakest element. Also, her spins in 2019 still were not good especially her layback. It's not about her no longer doing the Biellmann (I only think people should do it if it's well done) it's her overall positioning, the traveling, etc. 

[SeanC]

Lajoie & Lagha stage their second dramatic near-upset of one of the teams ahead of them in Canada (after 2023 nationals, where they almost beat Fournier Beaudry & Sorensen). It's been very exciting watching these two's gradual rise over the years, they're IAM's first true development project (as opposed to an already-established senior team).

Tough Grand Prix season for South Korea so far.

Nice to see Peng back competing in pairs, though her new partner has some work to do.

[Avaleigh]

I thought Rinka was great. She was actually my favorite of the ladies. I like the distance she gets with her jumps.

Bummed about Loena. I love that program. Hopefully she makes it happen for the final. 

Maddie's dress for the long was gorgeous. 

Adam is definitely keeping it exciting this season. Proud of how far he's come since the Olympics. He deserved the win. Shoma was a little off but he's still my overall favorite for the men this season. 

I haven't seen any of the pairs yet but wow, how amazing for Deanna Stellato. I remember when she was in singles. How awesome to come back for all that time and start winning grand prix events in a different discipline. My hat is off.

Sidenote: I've been watching a a little of sectionals and I was very impressed with Sherry Zhang. She was great. The combinations aren't there yet, but her skating skills were superior to all of the juniors I've seen.  Definitely a skater to keep an eye on.

Edited November 12, 2023 by Avaleigh

[annzeepark914]

All I saw of CoC today was the NBC presentation from 3-6:00 PM. Shomo Uno is the complete skater (despite being a bit off at this competition)...stellar athletic and artistic skills. They showed a repeat of his SP at the start and I was totally into his every move. Same with Piper & Paul during their FD. Incredible skating (that hydroblading move is a showstopper), with the music pulling you in to the story they were acting out. Their FD reminded me of the programs Klimova and Ponomarenko performed, the last year of competing & then in Champions on Ice. 

Johnny Weir always makes me laugh when he wishes a skater had shown more emotion (e.g., Mikhail Shaidorov). JW was *always* the great stoneface while competing, saying he skated for himself 🙄.  I couldn't believe it when he actually chose "Pokerface" for one of his programs. 

[honeywest]

I hate cartwheels (but I like Adam Siao Him Fa’s backflip), and I hate the requirement that ice dancers skate right up to the judges.

[annzeepark914]

6 minutes ago, honeywest said:

I hate the requirement that ice dancers skate right up to the judges.

What? You don't mean like Loena, do you?

[specialj67]

While I enjoy Loena’s overall style and presence, I can never truly sit back and enjoy watching her. Her consistency on the big jump combos isn’t the best, and her consistency from one phase of a competition to the next is always in question . For me anyways.

[SeanC]

13 hours ago, honeywest said:

and I hate the requirement that ice dancers skate right up to the judges.

It's not a requirement.

[honeywest]

I must have misunderstood Johnny Weir. But it does seem as if many of the skaters are overemoting directly in front of the judges.

[SeanC]

1 minute ago, honeywest said:

I must have misunderstood Johnny Weir. But it does seem as if many of the skaters are overemoting directly in front of the judges.

One of the optional choreo elements is the character step, which goes barrier-to-barrier and is most typically done at centre facing the judging panel (though you can see the much more uncommon long axis version in Carreira & Ponomarenko's free program). But skaters don't have to do it, they just like to.

[honeywest]

Thanks for clarifying that. I haven’t seen Carreira and Ponomarenko yet.

[iMonrey]

On 11/12/2023 at 7:31 PM, honeywest said:

I hate cartwheels (but I like Adam Siao Him Fa’s backflip), and I hate the requirement that ice dancers skate right up to the judges.

What's up with that? Backflips are illegal but cartwheels aren't? Johnny called the one with no hands a "flying Arabian" but he also did one with one hand down. It was gymnastic. And that's allowed?

[ChicksDigScars]

On 10/28/2023 at 2:49 PM, Avaleigh said:

Eta: The way that I feel about this is the way I feel about wolf turns in gymnastics. They're rarely done well so why do we have to see so many of them? 

Signed, someone who would rather see a gorgeous spiral sequence than people sliding around on their knees on the ice for no conceivable reason. 

Shudder. Wolf Turns. 

HATE. HATE. HAAAAAAATTTTE.

Simone is the only one that makes them palatable. Because she's not wobbly as hell when she does them. 

Oh, figure skating. Sorry. Am I the only one that hates the "jump with your arms in the air for extra points every stinking time you jump?"  EVERY. TIME. for some of these girls (especially). It reminds me of when the scoring system was new(ish) and they gave bonus points for catch foot spins and you saw all sorts of really bad ones. Some skaters were grabbing their skates EVERY time they spun. There was a Georgian skater, Eleni Gedevanishvili, who must have done 10 spins with her skate blade in her hand, in a single program. Bad Biellmann and Bad Boitano is the Wolf Turn for skating. 

 

[Avaleigh]

3 minutes ago, ChicksDigScars said:

Am I the only one that hates the "jump with your arms in the air for extra points every stinking time you jump?"  EVERY. TIME. for some of these girls (especially). It reminds me of when the scoring system was new(ish) and they gave bonus points for catch foot spins and you saw all sorts of really bad ones. Some skaters were grabbing their skates EVERY time they spun. There was a Georgian skater, Eleni Gedevanishvili, who must have done 10 spins with her skate blade in her hand, in a single program. Bad Biellmann and Bad Boitano is the Wolf Turn for skating. 

What I would like to see happen is a limit for how many times a skater can put their arms over their head. 

My thought is limit it to no more than three times per program.

One jumping pass can have both arms over the head. If you repeat the jump it has to be done the normal way. That way you show that you've mastered more than one way of doing the jump. 

One jumping pass can have one arm over the head 'tano style. If this jump is repeated, same deal, you have to do it the normal way. 

Allow one jump with an arm accent on the back half of a combination because it's typically harder to do it on the second jump. 

Every other jump should be done the standard way. JMO. 

An arm accent on a jump used to be a cool feature. Now it's just repetitive.

I thought that they didn't get extra points but that it sometimes leads to a higher GOE? I thought that was why all the Russians did it for every jump.

[KittenPokerCheater]

Are they not showing replays on Peacock anymore?

 

[Avaleigh]

I remember awhile back someone here wondering which skating fanbase is the most insane (Virtue and Moir, Sergei's widows, Fanyus, etc.) 

Just in case there was any doubt, it's officially the Hanyu stans.

I was reading Hanyu's post on X regarding why he and his partner are divorcing and it's incredibly disturbing. It seems like they haven't been able to have a moment of peace since they married. It's very sad.

I'd hoped that once he retired maybe the stans would stop with the weirdness, but it sounds like the stalking and general harassment is worse than ever. I feel terrible for Hanyu, his wife, and their families. It's not like he can just flip a switch and not be famous anymore. Short of completely going off the grid, it seems like he's going to have to put up with the stans for the foreseeable future. 

Edited November 18, 2023 by Avaleigh

[Mirabelle]

I remember a woman Japanese marathoner who was so famous she couldn't get a moment's peace in Japan so she lived and trained in the US where no one knew her and she was able to be left alone.

I've read the Rippon arms on jumps (arms over the head) can help with correcting the axis of the jump so some of the people who only jump with Rippon arms are doing so because they can't do them any other way. 

[honeywest]

2 hours ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

Are they not showing replays on Peacock anymore?

 

The Grand Prix Espoo short programs from this morning are on Peacock now.

[ChicksDigScars]

I was going to say that it may be that if Hanyu wants peace and to keep his marriage intact, moving from Japan would be the thing to do. Basically, he and his wife divorcing just handed the psychos a victory. In their delusional minds, they can ruin any future relationships he has because they already did it once. Unfortunately, in the technology/social media age, he  can't disappear completely.

Edited November 18, 2023 by ChicksDigScars

[CeeBeeGee]

5 hours ago, Avaleigh said:

I'd hoped that once he retired maybe the stans would stop with the weirdness, but it sounds like the stalking and general harassment is worse than ever. I feel terrible for Hanyu, his wife, and their families. It's not like he can just flip a switch and not be famous anymore. Short of completely going off the grid, it seem like he's going to have to put up with the stans for the foreseeable future. 

This whole situation is disgusting. These fans should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. What gives them the right to destroy a man's relationship, simply because they like his skating? It's appalling.

[KittenPokerCheater]

Hanyu got divorced because of the crazys stans and how they harassed him/her/his family?  

That. Is. Awful.

And yes, maybe he should move to another country for some peace.

[annzeepark914]

Did I miss hearing that Daisuke retired? I just checked the entries for ice dance at NHK and he & his partner weren't listed. 

[honeywest]

Takahashi and Muramoto retired from competition in May but are still performing together.

[ChicksDigScars]

Speaking of crazy assed fan bases. Tessa Virtue is engaged to one of the Toronto Maple Leafs (old news, but I just read about it). Does he know about the secret basement children? Is he planning to legally adopt them? How many do V/M have now? Gotta be up to at least five now, right?

Asking for a friend.