S07.E08: The Cavi-Art Of War

[LotusFlower]

Someone, some PTB, has to be throwing fits over paying Bethenny a million bucks to end up with ratings this bad. Almost 3 million tuned in to see episode 1 and then half never returned.

This isn't accurate. The premiere episode attracted 1.5 million (.6 in the 18-49 demo), then the ratings dropped to around 1.2 to 1.3 (thereabouts) for the next bunch.

[Beden]

Just took a look at Sonja in that red jumpsuit and just yikes. Aside from maybe immature teens or naive early twenty-somethings, does anyone really think it's attractive to have your boobs hanging out like that? I mean among an adult, sophisticated crowd? Are sneaky glimpses of side boob really all that titillating? I mean after junior high? The jumpsuit was a poor choice for Sonja, ill filing and made her look hippy. 50+ is when having your top opened to your waist isn't sexy (sexy J or not); it looks desperate.

 

I kept thinking of friends who went to a Playboy club back in the 70's when they were seriously trying to hang on to the old concept of how exciting it was to have a brush of a playmates tail or to catch a peek of tits as you were handed your drink--while the hippie movement was in full flower. Hefner didn't get that times had moved on and changed and it looks like Sonja is likewise stuck in the past. The red dress in the last episode wasn't a bad dress but, as mentioned above, it wasn't new nor original.

 

Has anyone seen any reviews of her shows? I'd be curious to see what the real fashionista crowd thought, beyond her circle of friends and paid hangers on.

[WireWrap]

This isn't accurate. The premiere episode attracted 1.5 million (.6 in the 18-49 demo), then the ratings dropped to around 1.2 to 1.3 (thereabouts) for the next bunch.

You mean the site listed the wrong numbers? They said there were 2.9 million viewers for the first episode. How could they get the numbers that wrong? Did they get them directly from Andy or Bethenny? LOL

[LotusFlower]

You mean the site listed the wrong numbers? They said there were 2.9 million viewers for the first episode. How could they get the numbers that wrong? Did they get them directly from Andy or Bethenny? LOL

Yes - the article is wrong. It looks like their source is Tvbythenumbers.com, but I checked over there, and the premiere got a 1.5 rating. Plus, I even remember Andy tweeting the premiere episode's numbers - I think he thought it was a positive. Believe me, if the ratings were 2.9 - that's HUGE - that would have been a huge story, and we would have heard about it. But an even bigger story would have been the huge drop-off for the next week's episode. But of course none of this happened.

Has anyone seen any reviews of her shows? I'd be curious to see what the real fashionista crowd thought, beyond her circle of friends and paid hangers on.

It wasn't part of NY Fasion Week. It was more self-produced, and I doubt it was reviewed.

[ciaoformeow]

Well you can see some of the stuff from Sonja's line on her website http://www.sonjamorgannewyork.com

 

The dress she wore on this episode she has priced at $1,095, so there's that. 

 

Most items are just basic styles, nothing new. But on first glance, the price points aren't matching the pics. These items don't look worth the amount she has at msrp. 

 

The jogging pants are almost $225 and they have faux pockets. Sorry but for that price, I expect fully lined, with real pockets - at the least. thank you much. 

 

She also has some video of fashion show on her Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/sonjamorgannewyork/videos/1666263003603898/

I didn't watch it, but i think that's it 

Edited May 29, 2015 by lilsadone

[WireWrap]

Well you can see some of the stuff from Sonja's line on her website http://www.sonjamorgannewyork.com

 

The dress she wore on this episode she has priced at $1,095, so there's that. 

 

Most items are just basic styles, nothing new. But on first glance, the price points aren't matching the pics. These items don't look worth the amount she has at msrp. 

 

The jogging pants are almost $225 and they have faux pockets. Sorry but for that price, I expect fully lined, with real pockets - at the least. thank you much. 

 

She also has some video of fashion show on her Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/sonjamorgannewyork/videos/1666263003603898/

I didn't watch it, but i think that's it 

I wonder if they staged/filmed this for the HW show?

[JAYJAY1979]

her fashion.show was filmed for the show..perhaps the finale

[imjagain]

I wonder if they staged/filmed this for the HW show?

I saw an article about it somewhere, and Ramona and Beth were seated front row and it said Bravo was filming. I have go look around be remember seeing it, but can't remember what site.

Eta:

I read it in the New York post, it's focus is on Ramona and Beth arguing. It did say cameras were rolling.

As JayJay said for the finale, that makes sense.

Edited May 30, 2015 by imjagain

[essexjan]

I just went through the FB video, pausing at the clothes and about half the outfits shown on the runway don't appear on the website for sale, although pictures of them from the fashion show appear in the 'preview' section. It's also ridiculous for Sonja to tell the HWs at the Latino magazine party that the collection was for Spring/Summer 2015. The fashion show, according to the press reports on the website, was in February 2015, when real designers are debuting their Spring/Summer 2016 collections.

[essexjan]

In this photo from the Daily Mail article (from the press section on Sonja's website) you can see how badly made that jumpsuit is. You can see the pocket linings, the leg seam is puckered and there's something going on where the fly meets the waistband. (And why does it have a fly, if it's a jumpsuit?)

 

There also seems to be a tiny stain (I hope a splash of champagne rather than a pee spot, but who the hell knows with these girls) on the fly.

 

 

ETA:  In the photo slideshow on the Reality Tea page the show is described as 'Bravo Taping', for the person above who asked if it was staged for the show.

Edited May 30, 2015 by essexjan

[imjagain]

In this photo from the Daily Mail article (from the press section on Sonja's website) you can see how badly made that jumpsuit is. You can see the pocket linings, the leg seam is puckered and there's something going on where the fly meets the waistband. (And why does it have a fly, if it's a jumpsuit?)

There also seems to be a tiny stain (I hope a splash of champagne rather than a pee spot, but who the hell knows with these girls) on the fly.

That looks bad. If people weren't embarrassed for Sonja before, they have to be now, for sure.

Looks like Lu is trying to hold it together. I have to look away, my face is getting red.

Edited May 30, 2015 by imjagain

[Beden]

I went to Sonja's site to take a look at her collection but it requires entering your e-mail address. Screw that.

[essexjan]

I went to Sonja's site to take a look at her collection but it requires entering your e-mail address. Screw that.

 

It doesn't. Just close the pop-up asking for your email and you can look at it.

[ciaoformeow]

I went to Sonja's site to take a look at her collection but it requires entering your e-mail address. Screw that.

 

You just click the little X on the popup and it closes. I didn't have to enter anything details to see the site :) 

 

OOPS I see another just said the same thing. Posting jinx, sorry :D 

That looks bad. If people weren't embarrassed for Sonja before, they have to be now, for sure.

Looks like Lu is trying to hold it together. I have to look away, my face is getting red.

In this photo from the Daily Mail article (from the press section on Sonja's website) you can see how badly made that jumpsuit is. You can see the pocket linings, the leg seam is puckered and there's something going on where the fly meets the waistband. (And why does it have a fly, if it's a jumpsuit?)

 

There also seems to be a tiny stain (I hope a splash of champagne rather than a pee spot, but who the hell knows with these girls) on the fly.

 

 

ETA:  In the photo slideshow on the Reality Tea page the show is described as 'Bravo Taping', for the person above who asked if it was staged for the show.

 

 

And you can see her implant outlines. Bless her heart. 

Edited May 30, 2015 by lilsadone

[phoenix780]

 

The dress she wore on this episode she has priced at $1,095, so there's that.

Please keep in mind that I'm a guy who shops at JCPenney as I ask this question...I thought her brand was accessible luxury?  Is that price point really "accessible" when it comes to women's fashion?

 

That's more than my monthly rent payment.  When she said "accessible" I imagined something up to maybe $500.

[ScoobieDoobs]

At these price levels, it isn't accessible luxury at all.  Bethenny coined that term, but she was unfamiliar with the specifics of Sonja's line.  I would think accessible would be $300 or less.  What large scale retailer would be a good fit for such a marketing shtick?  Probably Macy's.  Kmart?  No.  JCP or Kohl's?  Not really.  The stores Sonja's team-guy mentioned ONLY carry high end merchandise.  Not accessible in the least.  Her team seems so ridiculously inept, I still think they should have been filmed more.  I'm sure we woulda gotten plenty of chuckles & giggles from them.

 

Hey, guess what?  Just saw Andy Cohen himself bopping along by himself downtown in Chelsea.  Was so tempted to say to him he failed big time with Bethenny.  But I didn't.  Wow, he looks much better on TV.  In person, he looks short, dumpy & goofy.  

 

His eyes were darting everywhere as he was walking & his head was turning so much -- as if he was looking to see if anyone recognized him.  Sorry, I didn't wanna give him the satisfaction I did, so I moved past him quickly.  Did give me a giggle how his head turned so much to see who was looking at him.  I thought his head was gonna turn around completely -- like the girl in The Exorcist.  But it didn't.  Drats.  Man, I'm  6 foot & I was like a head taller than him.  Still think he's an asshole.  A short asshole.

Edited May 30, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[BettyPoz]

Not really, they seemed to have filmed in a lot of restaurants & stores around the city   They should have done more outdoor scenes, but the weather probably sucked when they were filming.  It's the big disadvantage of NYC.  The weather here usually sucks.  Best time to film is in the short Spring.

 

 

Both Bethenny & Satan Andy described her that way on WWHL.  What does this mean?  I'm lost.  They both were shaking their heads in agreement & seemed happy & satisfied to come up with this way of describing her, but I didn't understand it at all.

 

 

I think I saw somewhere Bethenny said he didn't wanna be on the show.  Could be.  Eh,  I think she didn't want him on the show, to take the "poor widdle rich me" spotlight off her.  I don't think this rough-looking dude would have any patience for all the whining & crying we're seeing on the show.  He would not have fit in with the routine/storyline Bethenny is shoving at us.

Oh not enough for me!  I want to see apartments and families and all of them doing "stuff" that they would normally do as a NYC housewife!  It's so tiring to watch 2 at lunch here and 3 at dinner there.  Not representing their lives at all.

 

I went to Sonja's site to take a look at her collection but it requires entering your e-mail address. Screw that.

Since I have it cut and pasted already -- Yeah! just hit that big ol' X in the upper corner!

[ryebread]

I'm almost more offended by Lu's outfit.  That's got to be faux, right?  But even still...the shoulder pads, the white leggings, the cape. And I think I spy a statement necklace.

[Beden]

 

It doesn't. Just close the pop-up asking for your email and you can look at it.

Sorry, my bad. I'll try again.

[WireWrap]

I'm almost more offended by Lu's outfit.  That's got to be faux, right?  But even still...the shoulder pads, the white leggings, the cape. And I think I spy a statement necklace.

LOL! That is part of her, LuAnn's, fashion line she sells on Evine!  http://www.evine.com/Offer/Default.aspx?OfferCode=722-275

 

http://www.evine.com/the-countess-collection-stretch-woven-side-zip-slim-leg-pants/722-285.aspx

Edited May 30, 2015 by WireWrap

[Rhetorica]

Sonja is a fine looking woman but really needs to stop wearing these open fronts. I'll say it again...It's better to wear something with a bra and appear perky rather than a plunging neckline and remove all doubt.

[Bronzedog]

Luanne looks like she's ready to catch anything that falls out.

[motorcitymom65]

That looks bad. If people weren't embarrassed for Sonja before, they have to be now, for sure.

Looks like Lu is trying to hold it together. I have to look away, my face is getting red.

I have seen better frocks at Kmart. Is this really from her "collection"? I have second hand embarrassment for her.

[LotusFlower]

Please keep in mind that I'm a guy who shops at JCPenney as I ask this question...I thought her brand was accessible luxury?  Is that price point really "accessible" when it comes to women's fashion?

Not at all. Just proves that the people she hooked up with have no idea what they're doing.

It kinda reminds me of the furniture store Design Within Reach, and their $5k Eames chair items for sale. Design Within Whose Reach? Millionaires?

[Persnickety1]

Part of the problem for me with Bethenny is that we have heard this story about her childhood for years and years now, so much so it has become a mantra for her. By her own words, she has not sought help to deal with her past/pain unless it is for the show, on camera, which means it is not real help and that she has no interest in getting help because she doesn't feel she really needs it. She needs to stop using it as part of her storyline and as an excuse for her caustic behavior towards others.

 

I agree, if juggling her schedule is so difficult and her time with her daughter so important, then why cut into that time by being on the show? Why risk it, is money/fame more important to Bethenny than peace of mind and ease of having enough time for Bryn?

 

I was really hoping we'd get more scenes of Bethenny in the board room or doing something with her business hustle...not more scenes with that sorry excuse for a therapist.  Those scenes bore me to fucking tears.  A little more board room, Bravo, and a little less therapist's couch please.

 

I was also hoping we'd get some scenes of Heather and her business, and, even more so, a few scenes with her adorable son and he's doing.

 

And right now it's back to "Kristen...Who?"  Well, at least next week we get to see Dorinda take her on about her part in the The Great Dance Debacle.  Other than that, I'm perplexed as to why Bravo even kept her on board this season.  I had read where Kristen didn't want to focus as much on her marriage this season (guess they all can call their own shots to some degree), but I'm sure Bravo has filmed footage of her at home with her kids that wouldn't directly relate to her asshole husband.  Right now she's such a one-dimensional figure on this show it's like she might as well be a mannequin propped up in the corner.

 

I think once again Bravo might have (did) miscalculate what the majority of the viewers really want to see with these shows and have edited it strictly to fit whatever storyline it is that Bravo wants to sell us.  

 

I remember Andy said way back before the season premiered that he realized audiences would think that 8 housewives were way too much, but then assured everyone to hang in there and it would all fall together for us.

 

Sorry, Andy, so far it's not really falling together for this viewer...it seems like a few of the 8 have been unofficially relegated to "friend of" status.  

 

Hopefully at least Bravo will have an epic unseen footage episode after this season so we can see what else the women were really up to during filming.  

[imjagain]

LOL! That is part of her, LuAnn's, fashion line she sells on Evine! http://www.evine.com/Offer/Default.aspx?OfferCode=722-275

http://www.evine.com/the-countess-collection-stretch-woven-side-zip-slim-leg-pants/722-285.aspx

This is the kind of collection you expect from the housewives. Lu has a variety of things and it looks like most things are under $100.

I have never bought a housewife product, but there is couple of dresses that don't look bad for a summer get together at about 40-50 dollars seems reasonable. I have a wedding to go to in few weeks, I'm tempted to get one of Lu's flirty dresses :)

Sonja and her $1000 plus clothing line is laughable.

Edited May 30, 2015 by imjagain

[essexjan]

Sonja and her $1000 plus clothing line is laughable.

 

The type of woman who'd spend $1,000 on a dress or a top would never buy something from Sonja's line (if it ever gets into production, that is).

 

For me "affordable luxury" is under £300 (about $500).  I went to a fancy wedding in Massachusetts last year, and found a really affordable and luxurious dress, designed by David Emanuel (who made Princess Diana's wedding dress) in a UK chain store for £25 ($40)!  It was beautiful, and I knew nobody in the wedding would be wearing anything like it. I had lots of compliments from other guests who asked me where it was from. When I said it was a David Emanuel I left people thinking it had cost hundreds of dollars. It was far, far nicer than those shoddy rags Sonja is flogging.

[tulip555]

Bethenny is a big girl now....she needs to stop blaming others and learn to control her behavior. So, she had a rotten childhood....it is time to let IT go...Imo, she is just so self-centered that the more she can "milk" her situation, the better.

[JAYJAY1979]

So Andy even admitted that 8 were too many? If he thought this, he should have demoted a couple of the women.

This is why I'm looking forward to OC...five women and three friend ofs (well two full time friend of..and one part time friend of since she quit partway through filming). And it looks like all five of the main women have individual narratives along with group scenes... fun, intense and a little toxic thrown in....what a housewife show should be.

BH managed to feature 7 women quite well nd balanced how they were shown... that no one housewife was feature over others...yes..even doing the second.half of season 5. It may have been toxic..but at least we got to see them all in some capacity unlike here.

I think its time Andy is removed and replaced with someone who understands the current desires of the viewers...balance balance balance.... some drama mixed with fun. I don't.want to.view a show and wonder why these women r hanging out together if they fight so much.. I want to see women who enjoy each other, have fun and can still argue if something comes up then make amends and move forward. Not too.hard to do.

[goofygirl]

Oh puleez.... No more of Beth's problems! Be they eating, living situation, business, Howives she hates... No. Just No.

[ScoobieDoobs]

I think once again Bravo might have (did) miscalculate what the majority of the viewers really want to see with these shows and have edited it strictly to fit whatever storyline it is that Bravo wants to sell us. 

I remember Andy said way back before the season premiered that he realized audiences would think that 8 housewives were way too much, but then assured everyone to hang in there and it would all fall together for us.

Sorry, Andy, so far it's not really falling together for this viewer...it seems like a few of the 8 have been unofficially relegated to "friend of" status.

 

Well, let's see if anything changes, but this has become The Bethenny Show & it ain't good.  Eh, maybe there's some Carole & Dorinda mixed in, and then a bit of Sonja for comic relief.  And that's about it.  Moaner & Lu seem to be left in the dust.  And Heather & Kristen are a mere after-thought.  No likey.

 

Btw, the abuse Bethenny describes (in the fake therapy session) witnessing her stepfather do to her mother sounds absolutely horrible.  She really wants to introduce her daughter to this awful character?  I don't believe that for a second.  Er, why would she wanna do that?  And yet this is what she said last ep was her motivation to meet with her step-dad.  Um, no.  I don't believe that either.  It was just a storyline she & Satan Andy came up with for her to do for the million bucks.

 

Anyone think Moaner went out again with that guy who was her date at the caviar joint?  Or did he smartly hightail it quickly away from her?

[imjagain]

Well, let's see if anything changes, but this has become The Bethenny Show & it ain't good. Eh, maybe there's some Carole & Dorinda mixed in, and then a bit of Sonja for comic relief. And that's about it. Moaner & Lu seem to be left in the dust. And Heather & Kristen are a mere after-thought. No likey.

Btw, the abuse Bethenny describes (in the fake therapy session) witnessing her stepfather do to her mother sounds absolutely horrible. She really wants to introduce her daughter to this awful character? I don't believe that for a second. Er, why would she wanna do that? And yet this is what she said last ep was her motivation to meet with her step-dad. Um, no. I don't believe that either. It was just a storyline she & Satan Andy came up with for her to do for the million bucks.

Anyone think Moaner went out again with that guy who was her date at the caviar joint? Or did he smartly hightail it quickly away from her?

I agree I think this all part of a storyline that was thought up for what ever reason. My mind can't understand what they were thinking. It's a bad storyline, it makes no sense. Why would any viewer think Beth introducing her daughter to this man who abused not just her mother but her, was a sympathetic move or a good idea. Even Beth's biggest fans have to be scratching their heads over this.

[Mrs peel]

There was a prenup. Of course, the other side is why hasn't Jason settled? There seems to be an assumption that Bethenny needs to pay Jason to make this go away and that she's not settling, which I don't think is exactly fair. What if it's Jason that won't settle? I think Jason is looking to take Bethenny for everything and then some.

As I said, I don't believe the issue of dividing the assets is causing Bryn stress. It's the division of the living situation, and that won't be fixed by paying off Jason.

I don't think it is an assumption that Bethenny "has" to pay Jason. She doesn't until and unless a judge orders her to do so. But she has spent considerable time whining that her divorce is not over, the stress is bad, it is hurting her child (directly the financial decisions don't affect the daughter but 2 parents under stress, one of them with no filter from her brain to her mouth will stress a child), etc.

The simple fact is B has the money, J doesn't. So if she wants this over NOW, she is the one who has to compromise and pay him off. We haven't heard from him, but if he were whining the same could be said - give up on the claims in order to move on with your life. Is it what a judge would have decided - one or two years down the line when the case is finally decided - who knows. She would be paying to have it done rather than continuing to live with uncertainty.

Frankly, Bethenny seems to love to whine about her life instead of deal with her life (See for example the fake therapy about her childhood), so I doubt she will short circuit the legal process by settling. That is, until either just before a trial (because just before trial is usually when people wake up to the fact that you don't really want to roll the dice at trial and/or your lawyers have a 'come to Jesus' meeting with you) or if Jason's financial backers back out or he decides he wants it over now.

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

I agree I think this all part of a storyline that was thought up for what ever reason. My mind can't understand what they were thinking. It's a bad storyline, it makes no sense. Why would any viewer think Beth introducing her daughter to this man who abused not just her mother but her, was a sympathetic move or a good idea. Even Beth's biggest fans have to be scratching their heads over this.

 

I believe in redemption and on the surface, the guy seems to have changed. But forgiving  and moving past a horrible past is a far cry from introducing a young person to this stranger and forging a relationship with them. If he's really changed, the man the stepfather has become will be a stranger to both Bryn AND Bethenny. The changes (for Beth to even consider a reconciliation) must be drastic given who he was in the past. 

 

As an adult, I would forgive but keep a distance. I can't conceive introducing this man, changed or not, into my young daughter's life. There are some gambles I won't make when it comes to my children.

 

There is genuine forgiveness and there is reaching out to one man up. I think Bethenny was doing the latter with the added benefit of a positive narrative in RHONYC. In her own words, she made this move so that her daughter can have roots in her side. The ex has roots that Bryn knows so damn it, she [beth] will have her's too even if it in the form of mine and my mother's former abusive alcoholic. 

 

The thing she is missing, or doesn't get is that roots don't have to be familial. We make roots as we go through life. If at this point in her life, she doesn't have any roots that she wasn't born into or that goes back to her shitty childhood,  then by all means, start making them. Like, right now. You have to cultivate relationships, with family or none family alike, for "roots" to matter. Roots don't mean anything if you don't work at the relationships. And no, ex abusive stepdad do not count.

 

Nothing against the stepfather but for the sake of Bryn, I hope the meeting was for the show and nothing more. It is deceptive, but I'll rather be deceived than think the innocent kid could be introduced to the character Bethenny describe should he suffer a relapse. 

Edited May 30, 2015 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[JAYJAY1979]

I would think.behannys long time girlfriend could act as an aunt for byrnn...

[ZoloftBlob]

Why would any viewer think Beth introducing her daughter to this man who abused not just her mother but her, was a sympathetic move or a good idea.

 

Why do any abuse victims ever continue to make contact with their abusive family members? For all that his terrible past is being emphasized, I never got the impression that "I'd like you to be in Bryn's life" was an offer to leave the kid unsupervised at Parisella's house for a week at a time. I have members of my own family that whle I would never allow a child to be left alone in their care, I'd be completely comfortable with them knowing this person was a family member. Particularly since Jason also doesn't seem to have a lot of family (there's his aging parents and what else?)

 

I mean people make it sound like Bethenny is wanting to drop the kid off expressly to provide her step dad with a little punching bag and that really was not what I got out of that scene.

[WireWrap]

I believe in redemption and on the surface, the guy seems to have changed. But forgiving  and moving past a horrible past is a far cry from introducing a young person to this stranger and forging a relationship with them. If he's really changed, the man the stepfather has become will be a stranger to both Bryn AND Bethenny. The changes (for Beth to even consider a reconciliation) must be drastic given who he was in the past. 

 

As an adult, I would forgive but keep a distance. I can't conceive introducing this man, changed or not, into my young daughter's life. There are some gambles I won't make when it comes to my children.

 

There is genuine forgiveness and there is reaching out to one man up. I think Bethenny was doing the latter with the added benefit of a positive narrative in RHONYC. In her own words, she made this move so that her daughter can have roots in her side. The ex has roots that Bryn knows so damn it, she [beth] will have her's too even if it in the form of mine and my mother's former abusive alcoholic. 

 

The thing she is missing, or doesn't get is that roots don't have to be familial. We make roots as we go through life. If at this point in her life, she doesn't have any roots that she wasn't born into or that going back to her shitty childhood,  then by all means, start making them. Like, right now. You have to cultivate relationships, with family or none family alike for "roots" to matter. Roots don't mean anything if you don't work at the relationships. And no, ex abusive stepdad doesn't count.

 

Nothing against the stepfather but for the sake of Bryn, I hope the meeting was for the show and nothing more. It is deceptive, but I'll rather be deceived than think the innocent kid could be introduced to the character Bethenny describe should he suffer a relapse. 

Add to this "forgive" dear old step dad, Bethenny has no way of knowing if he really changed or not, they have not been in each others lives for over 20 years. He admits to drug/alcohol abuse and at the end of their talk, Bethenny asks him to go get a "drink", tells him she has lots of alcohol and he agrees to go have drinks with her. She also said that even if her "family" is not healthy (my words, not her exact words) for Bryn that at least it is "her" family. Twisted logic at the very least IMO.

Why do any abuse victims ever continue to make contact with their abusive family members? For all that his terrible past is being emphasized, I never got the impression that "I'd like you to be in Bryn's life" was an offer to leave the kid unsupervised at Parisella's house for a week at a time. I have members of my own family that whle I would never allow a child to be left alone in their care, I'd be completely comfortable with them knowing this person was a family member. Particularly since Jason also doesn't seem to have a lot of family (there's his aging parents and what else?)

 

I mean people make it sound like Bethenny is wanting to drop the kid off expressly to provide her step dad with a little punching bag and that really was not what I got out of that scene.

But why risk this guy going off around Bryn to begin with? There is no way for Bethenny to know if he really changed for the better or not because they have not been around each other for over 2 decades. It is not a risk I personally would be willing to make. It is possible that there are Great Aunts/Uncles/cousins on the Hoppy side (Jason's parents family), we do not know how large or small that family is.

[ZoloftBlob]

But why risk this guy going off around Bryn to begin with? There is no way for Bethenny to know if he really changed for the better or not because they have not been around each other for over 2 decades. It is not a risk I personally would be willing to make.

 

And I sometimes question why anyone would bring a child to prison to visit their parent because it sure seems like they'd be a bad influence, but people make that choice every day.

 

I see nothing inherently damaging in Bryn meeting and knowing her step granddad as long as there's supervision. He seems a changed man, and Bethenny is not making a dangerous, abusive choice in simply letting her daughter know him. She is making a choice that isn't actually judged harshly in other families.

 

I mean, I assume if this was genuinely dangerous, that Jason Hoppy her father would be going to court to insist that Bryn never be allowed to be in contact with Bethenny's stepdad... and he's not. If he's not concerned enough to protest, I see no reason to be.

[WireWrap]

And I sometimes question why anyone would bring a child to prison to visit their parent because it sure seems like they'd be a bad influence, but people make that choice every day.

 

I see nothing inherently damaging in Bryn meeting and knowing her step granddad as long as there's supervision. He seems a changed man, and Bethenny is not making a dangerous, abusive choice in simply letting her daughter know him. She is making a choice that isn't actually judged harshly in other families.

 

I mean, I assume if this was genuinely dangerous, that Jason Hoppy her father would be going to court to insist that Bryn never be allowed to be in contact with Bethenny's stepdad... and he's not. If he's not concerned enough to protest, I see no reason to be.

Well, we don't know if Jas objects to Bryn being around John, as far as we know, Bethenny hasn't had Bryn round him. IMO, this was just for sympathy and not a real move on Bethenny's part.

[ZoloftBlob]

To be fair, if it's as serious and scary as people seem to think, I'm not sure why we haven't heard from Jason on this point.... if he shares the concern.

 

Jason isn't protesting. If he wanted the public to know his concern, he could see to it. My guess? It's not that big of a deal to him. Probably because like in many families, there are relatives who have troubled pasts who you do introduce your children to, rather than deny that family member's existence. Parisella is an old man and there's no intimation that Bethenny was ever considering unsupervised visits. Where's the fire? Jason doesn't see the fire, the danger, and to be honest, neither do I... *especially* if you're correct and Bethenny has no intention of letting Parisella see Bryn.

[imjagain]

Why do any abuse victims ever continue to make contact with their abusive family members? For all that his terrible past is being emphasized, I never got the impression that "I'd like you to be in Bryn's life" was an offer to leave the kid unsupervised at Parisella's house for a week at a time. I have members of my own family that whle I would never allow a child to be left alone in their care, I'd be completely comfortable with them knowing this person was a family member. Particularly since Jason also doesn't seem to have a lot of family (there's his aging parents and what else?)

I mean people make it sound like Bethenny is wanting to drop the kid off expressly to provide her step dad with a little punching bag and that really was not what I got out of that scene.

My point really was I believe this whole meeting up with the step dad is a story. I don't believe Beth wants to really have him in her life. She hasn't seen the man in decades and now on camera wants to reunite.

So why make it part of your story and say you want him in your daughters life. I think most of us would be fine and understand if Beth never spoke to the man again, no judgment at all.

The storyline is not good. That's all I was saying.

Beth absolutely should move on and not hold on to anger and bitterness regarding her childhood. I just believe there is a lot stuff she is doing just for the camera.

I hope she is in real therapy.

Edited May 30, 2015 by imjagain

[ZoloftBlob]

My point really was I believe this whole meeting up with the step dad is a story.

 

And I don't deny that it's possible but people who aren't Bethenny do this all the time - introduce their children to relatives that have been abusers in some way and there's not all that much handwringing or concern over it as long as they're keeping thing supervised. Bethenny *may* be simply telling a story for the show, but on the off chance she's not, I don't think its fair to assume she's a) completely lying about letting him see Bryn and also b) she's planning to let him see his sort of grandchild and how can anyone do something so awful???

 

If the first is true, then there's no need to be worried. If the second is true, then its fair to point out that she wasn't suggesting unsupervised visits and Bryn's father has not protested this in any way.

 

Right now, Bethenny is getting blamed for both lying about letting her stepdad see her child and also actually allowing her step dad to see her child.

[LotusFlower]

The thing she is missing, or doesn't get is that roots don't have to be familial. We make roots as we go through life. If at this point in her life, she doesn't have any roots that she wasn't born into or that going back to her shitty childhood,  then by all means, start making them. Like, right now. You have to cultivate relationships, with family or none family alike for "roots" to matter. Roots don't mean anything if you don't work at the relationships. And no, ex abusive stepdad doesn't count.

Bravo.

There is genuine forgiveness and there is reaching out to one man up. I think Bethenny was doing the latter with the added benefit of a positive narrative in RHONYC. In her own words, she made this move so that her daughter can have roots in her side. The ex has roots that Bryn knows so damn it, she [beth] will have her's too even if it in the form of mine and my mother's former abusive alcoholic.

I thought the same thing. It feels very much like a repercussion of her divorce battle. If Jason is going to pull the family card for holiday visits, for ex., then I will, too..

I see nothing inherently damaging in Bryn meeting and knowing her step granddad as long as there's supervision. He seems a changed man.

We don't know that. He might be, but change is rare, and we saw nothing in one short, made-for-TV moment to really assess this.

[The Mighty Peanut]

Not at all. Just proves that the people she hooked up with have no idea what they're doing.

It kinda reminds me of the furniture store Design Within Reach, and their $5k Eames chair items for sale. Design Within Whose Reach? Millionaires?

I am in favor of increasing taxes for anyone who discusses what constitutes a reasonable price that anyone can afford and then names a price that is four figures.

[Celia Rubenstein]

I see nothing inherently damaging in Bryn meeting and knowing her step granddad as long as there's supervision. He seems a changed man, and Bethenny is not making a dangerous, abusive choice in simply letting her daughter know him. She is making a choice that isn't actually judged harshly in other families.

 

Many people do what Bethenny was doing and they get applauded for their ability to forgive.  Criticism might be heaped on the person who would deny the stepfather any relationship with the child.  

 

There really is no one way to look at it.  

 

I thought the same thing. It feels very much like a repercussion of her divorce battle. If Jason is going to pull the family card for holiday visits, for ex., then I will, too..

 

It might be.  But it could just as easily be the the result of Bethenny's sincere desire to provide her daughter with as much extended family as possible.  Let's face it, she doesn't have a lot of people to choose from.  Her father is dead and she and her mother have not come anywhere near making peace.  At least her stepfather is not trashing her in the press, even though she has said more damning things about him to the media than she has about her mother. He's willing to acknowledge he made mistakes and apologize.  So he's at the top of the list of candidates.  We all have to play the hand we are dealt in life.  I think this is just Bethenny working with what she has to work with. 

 

With so many people asserting that Bethenny needs to put her childhood behind her and move on (and I agree to an extent), I'm surprised she is being faulted her for her efforts to put the past in the past and move ahead with her stepfather.  I think if she refused to accept her stepfather's apology and wouldn't allow him any kind of relationship with Bryn, she would criticized for not giving her stepfather a chance because she was too hung up on the past.  At least by allowing John into her life, she is showing some sign of growth, for what that's worth.  I can't criticize it. 

[Mrs peel]

But changing custody can always be re-approached, correct? If he felt he had evidence showing reasons why he should have her more then Beth, wouldn't he be able to try for that again at any time?  A petition to modify. 

 

Considering Beth is paying his legal fees too, I wouldn't put it past him

 

And what did she say to Carol about it? I heard her talking about wanting real glasses, etc. but I also heard her say she doesn't want to talk about it while she apologized for being emotional but that she needs to spend time with her kid. 

 

Outside of her saying she wants to spend time with her kid over the HW's that's really the most I've heard her say about it with the other wives (besides R and S and Lu == all people she has known for years)

I am not going to claim to know the specifics of NY law, but it is highly unlikely that Jason can now petition to change custody. The courts generally promote stability for the child. In IL (where I practiced family law) for the first 2 years it is almost impossible to change a custody decision/agreement because you need to show a serious endangerment to the child's health. After 2 years the standard is a "substantial change in circumstances" - again not that easy. NY is not likely to be much different.

Also, I didn't think Bethenny was paying Jason's legal bills. At least not all of them, I seem to recall hearing he had financial backers for his legal fees.

[telemachus2]

If the reports ARE correct that Bethenny had to pay $100,000 (?) towards Jason's legal fees, on what basis could that be assessed?  Is this typical in divorces of the rich, where one spouse has considerably more assets than the other?  Doesn't seem fair (& I dislike Beth) & obviously gives the poorer spouse little motivation to settle.

[Mountainair]

Mostly, I'm sad that I scroll through most of these posts without reading them. Thats not the fault of my fellow posters, it's Bravo's fault. Why not give Bethenny her own show instead of turning the Real Housewives of New York into The Bethenny Show? This thread and the show reflect what this season has become and I don't know how much more I'm willing to tune in anymore. It's all about Bethenny all the time. BORING!

ETA: for crap's sake we can give Kandi her own fucking Ski Show can we not give Beth her own show for no one to watch as well!

Edited May 30, 2015 by Mountainair

[ScoobieDoobs]

I mean people make it sound like Bethenny is wanting to drop the kid off expressly to provide her step dad with a little punching bag and that really was not what I got out of that scene.

 

No, I don't think anyone is quite assuming that.  But Bethenny paints a horrible picture of how her stepfather behaved back then (with her mother).  She really does -- I mean, constantly.  She does this over & over & over & over.  She and Satan Andy never stop slamming this shit in our faces.  And she said to him (an extremely strange & uncomfortable thing to say to your former stepfather) that she has trouble having sex with men & dating because of what she saw him do to her mother.  And yet she says (before she met with him) that he's a good person.  Er, huh?  He doesn't sound like a good person to me.  Not at all.  

 

Look, she hasn't seen him in over 25 years.  So I'm sure she had good reason for that.  His actions really scarred & damaged her in many, many ways.  That I absolutely believe.  I think she sold Satan Andy on the idea, before they agreed for her to be on the show, she'd meet with the stepdad & they figured that would offer up all kinds of storyline -- even tho it has absolutely nothing to do with the other women & sets her off on her own little island, totally separate from the rest of the cast.

 

Now, is it possible for someone to change completely after 25 years?  Sure.  Is it possible she'd like to offer her daughter a grandfatherly figure?  Yup, it's possible.  He doesn't live near her, so he's just someone her daughter would see once in a great while.  And it's likely B would always supervise any visits, so it's probably harmless.  But it's still my hunch Bethenny did this just for the show & for a storyline & she'll never see him again.  

 

I just doubt she's so eager to hang with him or have her daughter anywhere near him.  Look how she's been on the show.  She can barely stand to have anyone near her.  Let alone someone she has such a horrible, horrible, horrible history with.   Why would she bother to have any relationship with him?  Doesn't make much sense to me.  

 

Unless she's motivated to provide a grandparent figure to compete with the attention Jason's parents give to Brynn.  That, I can kinda understand.  What kid doesn't like to have kindly grandparents around?  If I were her I couldn't do it.  Too many terrible memories connected to him & trust issues abounding that I couldn't get past.  Will Bethenny?  Me doubts it.

Edited May 31, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[JennyMominFL]

Just want you all to know, I got my parmesan puffs from Trader Joes, and I am saving them for the next show. 

Edited May 30, 2015 by JennyMominFL