S11.E23: Time Stops

[proserpina65]

While I totally understand how upset I would be if my sister's husband didn't call me in a similar situation, all I could think during that scene is how Amelia makes everything about herself. Why didn't you call ME? (never mind my other family members) I could have saved Derek! I have proven that I perform miracles every day! She just annoys me so much that even though I think she should have been given the opportunity to say goodbye in theory, I just want her to STFU.

Yeah, that's why I feel bad about agreeing with any of her tantrum.  After all, it's not like Mer called Derek's mother or any of his other sisters either.

[esco1822]

I think to say "that's what a family does for each other" just can't be applied to Meredith. She hasn't had a normal family existence, what her family does for each other isn't the norm. Her family was Ellis and Thatcher. She grew up without siblings. Of course they surfaced in her adulthood but even then it took time for her to get close to Lexi and it's taking time for her and Maggie. Meredith has always had to think for herself and fend for herself. I don't give her a little leeway only where it comes to doing what a family should do. That's not her reality. I think her breakdown is part of realizing that she should have called Amelia, not because it would have helped Derek but because she's realizing that she is a part of something bigger now and she does need to starting thinking about people other than herself and of course Derek in that moment.

[Chicken Wing]

I can't stand listening to Amelia rant and rave about anything, but I understand where she's coming from and why she's saying the things she's saying here. Her brother died - and not suddenly, not DOA. He was in a horrible accident, and he was in a "hospital" being worked on for a good while and then he took a turn for the worse and ended up braindead on life support, and then Meredith made the unilateral decision to remove him from life support without anyone there. She's feeling a lot of things about that. She feels helpless that she couldn't help her brother. Not that really she could have helped him, logistically, because at that point he was unsalvageable, but she feels like she should have been there to try. It's not so much a weird "hero" complex as it is the irrational but understandable feeling that she "could have done something," if only she'd been there. Nothing could have been done, though. By the time Meredith was even informed of what happened, it was already past too late. But she could have still called. She could have given other people a chance to say goodbye. She got to take her time to say goodbye and she couldn't even call his sister, who was working nearby, to rush over so she could do the same? I understand why Amelia is upset about that.

 

But, at the same time, I understand why Meredith didn't call her. She was in shock. This horrible tragedy was just brought down on her, and it was a lot to even begin to process. I can only imagine that in that kind of situation, you're not really in a place where you can think clearly about things like, "I need to call X and Y." It's not like Meredith became involved when Derek was first brought to that hospital and they were still working on him and there was time to think about things that need to be done and people to call. He was already gone, she was already a widow in all but name, and she's not thinking about who ought to come down here to pay their respects before she gives the okay to turn off the machines. She probably should have thought to do so, yes, because it would have been a thoughtful thing to do for the other people who loved Derek, would have been mindful of the fact that she is not the only person who loved Derek and is now losing him. But I can't fault her too much for not having that presence of mind at the moment, to remember to be considerate of those other people. So, I understand Amelia's feelings and she's right that Meredith should have called her, at least for the saying goodbye part. And I think Meredith was wrong not to do that, but I completely understand how it could be that she didn't and so I can't fault her too much for it.

 

As for her breakdown, I think it was a combination of things. Sure, she feels bad about what Amelia said. She's right, she should have let her say goodbye, and she feels bad and guilty about that, but I don't think she broke down in sobs over that. She doesn't feel that bad over Amelia's feelings. No, I think it's like what others have said, Amelia directly bringing up Derek's last moments was like ripping the scab off a wound that seemed to be healing. She was doing okay, getting by, getting through, and that conversation was just one of those things that brings it all back and the pain and grief just comes down on her all over again like a hammer.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Chicken Wing

[noname1]

My two cents:

Please go away Amelia, She like the Erica Hahn of recent seasons just be crammed down our throats.

April in the last scene was more try hard than badass to me. Wish she wouldn't have come back in season 5.

[Clanstarling]

So Meredith just invites herself to move into Alex's house with three kids? With no regard to the other people - Jo, Arizona - who live there? And she doesn't bother to tell Amelia, who's been taking care of her house for nine months while Meredith disappeared without telling anyone, that she wants to sell the house?  

Well, she didn't call her to tell her Derek was dying - so why would she give her any heads up that she needs to look for new digs.

 

I think the idiot saying crap in front of the pregnant woman needs to be fired. In fact the whole clueless group of interns who just talk crap in front of a pregnant, injured woman needs to go. I couldn't believe a woman could give birth without moving at all; couldn't they have put her to sleep and done a c-section?  Liked April with the car at the end.

I found the interns unfortunately realistic. My sister was in a teaching hospital, and they gathered around and made comments like that - so my sister found out while being an exhibit that she was terminal.

 

I also wondered about a C section. There's no way a woman does what she needs to do without straining her neck while pushing. Weird.

 

The Alex/Jo drama is totally manufactured. I get why he wouldn't want to go, and I get why she wants to go (and let's face it, it makes more sense for Jo to want to go than April going) but she was pretty clear about wanting to do it as a "couple" thing. I didn't get the feeling at all that she would go without Alex, so it seemed like he completely overreacted instead of being an adult and taking a minute to have a serious moment with Jo to talk.

I thought Alex telling Jo exactly why he didn't want to go was a pretty adult moment, myself. He showed great self-awareness and an understanding of what was important to him.

 

Shondra seems to equate being a strong and assertive woman with being a shouty "my way or the highway" person who is dismissive of any opinion other than her own and uses her power to diminish and intimidate. The fact that Richard was the "interim" chief meant nothing in that situation - Richard didn't want to be chief any longer, and interim does not mean less capable. It was used only as a weapon to put him in his "place." If the genders were reversed, it would be equally unacceptable behavior. Especially for two people supposedly in love.

Edited May 8, 2015 by clanstarling

[kingshearte]

The Alex/Jo drama is totally manufactured. I get why he wouldn't want to go, and I get why she wants to go (and let's face it, it makes more sense for Jo to want to go than April going) but she was pretty clear about wanting to do it as a "couple" thing. I didn't get the feeling at all that she would go without Alex, so it seemed like he completely overreacted instead of being an adult and taking a minute to have a serious moment with Jo to talk.

This is particularly upsetting because those two have been the most consistently good at (when we've actually seen them together) actually talking about their feelings and their situation. It's sucky to seem them just suddenly go the route of forgetting how to communicate.

 

Also loved April arriving with the car on the flatbed, and I agree with those who wondered why that didn't happen sooner. I had that thought as soon as Meredith said that some proposed solution might work if they were closer to a hospital. He's relatively stable while he's in there, so bring him right up close to hospital. Worth a shot, right? So I'm glad April decided to try it, and I'm assuming they'll manage to save him in the end.

 

As for the kid and Owen's experimental craziness, I have two thoughts. (1) I could have sworn that this is not the first time they've effectively "frozen" someone to buy themselves more time. Maybe not with a complete replacement of the patient's blood with saline solution, but I could swear I remember something similar in a previous season. And (2), while I do understand that there are procedures for new treatments, and you can't just let doctors just try random crap any time they want, TBH, I have a hard time finding fault with a potentially fatal experiment in a case where the patient is pretty much for sure going to die if they don't do it. If the options are either dead or maybe (even likely) dead, isn't maybe (even likely) dead a better option? I just have a hard time getting behind the ire-filled "If he dies, it's on you!" in a situation where he was going to die anyway.

 

I actually really liked the Amelia-Meredith confrontation. Chicken Wing, a few posts above me, pretty much summed it up pretty well — understand that Meredith was totally not thinking logically at the time, but also feel that Amelia was 100% justified in being upset that she (and the rest of Derek's family, even if she didn't mention them) wasn't notified until after the fact.

[Shellie]

Why didn't Meredith just ask Alex or a couple of others to move in with her and the kids.  That might gradually change the atmosphere of the house.  (I love that house.  I want that house.)

 

I was thinking Derek would feel sad if he knew she was going to move out and sell the house.  

[Deanie87]

I thought Alex telling Jo exactly why he didn't want to go was a pretty adult moment, myself. He showed great self-awareness and an understanding of what was important to him

Shondra seems to equate being a strong and assertive woman with being a shouty "my way or the highway" person who is dismissive of any opinion other than her own and uses her power to diminish and intimidate. The fact that Richard was the "interim" chief meant nothing in that situation - Richard didn't want to be chief any longer, and interim does not mean less capable. It was used only as a weapon to put him in his "place." If the genders were reversed, it would be equally unacceptable behavior. Especially for two people supposedly in love.

Alex's reasons for not wanting to go were reasonable and him explaining himself to her was adult, at least for this show. But his outright dismissal of her thoughts and his telling her what she can and can't do, followed by him stalking off without letting her finish were classic tantrum-throwing Karev. I am an Alex apologist from way back, but his treatment of Jo this season has been seriously lacking. Some of that is probably due to the writing for them, or lack thereof, but if she allows him to take her for granted and doesn't demand the respect that he is so willing to give nearly every other female in his orbit, then any reconciliation they may have is going to be somewhat soured for me.

Ugh, I just need to not hate Alex and Meredith in the next episode to get me to tune in next season. That shouldn't be so hard.

ETA - I totally agree about the strong women. Strong doesn't mean obnoxious, powerful doesn't mean infallible and smart doesn't mean always right or condescending. All of which I have found most of the women on this show lately.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Deanie87

[readster]

Jesus Christ. SO much word. Adele was a bit of a harpie (but you really couldn't blame her). Ellis was just a bitchy SHREW, and now Catherine Avery, who rivals Papa Pope over on Scandal, for sheer amount of scenery chewed on a single show? Wow. Your "type" is really bad, Chief (I never stopped calling you that). 

 

 I completely agree. What was with Richard's attraction to all of them even with Adele's history, she was known for being very hard on the nurses that were under her when she was still working at the hospital back in the day. Plus, she should have left Richard a long time ago, he knew about he affair and the reason they didn't have children because Richard didn't feel worthy enough to be a dad since he was a cheater. Ellis was someone I don't even know how Thatcher stood her and then add in Catherine... just yikes. Especially with her going on about needing a better chief of surgery. She can't name herself as it because it is a major conflict of interest. 

[proserpina65]

I think to say "that's what a family does for each other" just can't be applied to Meredith. She hasn't had a normal family existence, what her family does for each other isn't the norm. Her family was Ellis and Thatcher. She grew up without siblings. Of course they surfaced in her adulthood but even then it took time for her to get close to Lexi and it's taking time for her and Maggie. Meredith has always had to think for herself and fend for herself. I don't give her a little leeway only where it comes to doing what a family should do. That's not her reality. I think her breakdown is part of realizing that she should have called Amelia, not because it would have helped Derek but because she's realizing that she is a part of something bigger now and she does need to starting thinking about people other than herself and of course Derek in that moment.

That's an interesting perspective.  I hadn't thought about it that way, but you have a point about that not being Mer's way of relating to the family issue.  And it does explain her closet tears.  Thanks for the insight.

[justme]

I would like to see Alex and Meredith get together. I can see a story line where they start to realize they have feelings for each other......

 

The show used to be about relationships. For me, altho I adore Derick, Meredith and Cristina were the heart of the show, their relationship with each other, their relationships with the others and everyone's love interests.

 

I miss seeing them just be people. How many times were we in Meredith's house, the bar and even the cafeteria, seeing them in their personal lives? And there was still time for the hospital drama. Now it is mostly all hospital drama. We might get a minute here and there of anyone's personal life.

 

I have watched my DVD's many times, especially the early years. I do FF through most of the patients stories as I don't care that much for the patients stories. Now it is hardly worth watching an episode over as it would be mostly FF.

[Clanstarling]

Alex's reasons for not wanting to go were reasonable and him explaining himself to her was adult, at least for this show. But his outright dismissal of her thoughts and his telling her what she can and can't do, followed by him stalking off without letting her finish were classic tantrum-throwing Karev. I am an Alex apologist from way back, but his treatment of Jo this season has been seriously lacking. Some of that is probably due to the writing for them, or lack thereof, but if she allows him to take her for granted and doesn't demand the respect that he is so willing to give nearly every other female in his orbit, then any reconciliation they may have is going to be somewhat soured for me.

Ugh, I just need to not hate Alex and Meredith in the next episode to get me to tune in next season. That shouldn't be so hard.

ETA - I totally agree about the strong women. Strong doesn't mean obnoxious, powerful doesn't mean infallible and smart doesn't mean always right or condescending. All of which I have found most of the women on this show lately.

Good point about Alex. I'd forgotten that initial "you can't go" business. He did, ultimately, say the obvious - which was that she could do whatever she wanted to do. His dismissing the idea that he needed to ask Jo about Mer moving in seemed to me to be part of his typical defenses when he feels emotionally threatened. He just shuts down in regards to the other person. I never bought the connection of Alex's sad/bad background and Jo's supposed homeless street-wise girl. She's said the words, the background was written for her, but it has rarely, if ever, seemed to inform the way her character was written (except by manipulating people with fake tears).

Edited May 8, 2015 by clanstarling

[windsprints]

I thought it was a pretty good episode. I was interested throughout for the most part.

I could have sworn that this is not the first time they've effectively "frozen" someone to buy themselves more time. Maybe not with a complete replacement of the patient's blood with saline solution, but I could swear I remember something similar in a previous season.

It reminded me a lot of Joe the Bartender's surgery. I swear they did almost the same thing then Derek had X amount of time to remove the aneurysm.

The cute new dark haired intern? Tell me that in In Shonda's warped mind, she doesn't think that all she has to do is find a cutey with really good hair and all the Dempsey fans will shut up?

No idea what is in Shonda's mind but I can't see why anyone would see him as any kind of Derek replacement. He's an intern. Everything about his role on the show & his relationships to the older doctors will be completely different. Yes, he has good hair and is pretty but its not like Grey's isn't full of pretty people.

Why should she have taken a moment to think of Amelia?  That's what people do.  That's what family does for each other.  Amelia is not some random stranger - she was living with them.

I agree. I fully understand that she was overwhelmed with grief as the unimaginable was happening in her life but there was a span of hours that went by. Her view of family may be different than many people's but she knew Derek's view of family. Derek was the one dying and IMO she should have honored Derek's view. I would not buy for a second that a) Derek would not want his family informed b) that he would not want his sister to have the chance to say goodbye or c) Meredith to be alone as he was dying.  

 

I don't think it would have been as large of an issue for Amelia if she communicated with them at all for the past year. Their brother/son/uncle died and they were completely cut off from his children. They didn't get a chance to say goodbye to Derek and then on top of it they didn't get a chance to say goodbye to the kids or know when/if they would ever see Derek live on in his children. 

As an Alex fan, this is my worst fucking nightmare. It Takes A Village/Who's the Boss starring Alex Karev. See Alex buying tampons, see Alex raise Mer's brood, see Alex listening to the gals hygiene issues and ping-ponging between Maggie and Mer when they need a love interest. All the while they go off to be super-hero doctors working on cool surgeries and Alex assists them and tells them how awesome they are.

This, 100%. I'm hoping its temporary. Derek built that house for his family and I hope that Meredith will come to realize its part of what Derek has left for them before its sold. 

“You know how Wilson gets?” Really, Mer? She lets you kick her out of bed and offers to watch your kids? Whoo boy, what an unreasonable bitch.

I've been feeling so bad for Meredith these past few episodes as obviously she's been through hell. That comment made me realize bitch Meredith has returned and she's close to being like she was before Derek died. She's been gone for a year so she doesn't know "how Wilson gets" about anything recently.

 

I think Jo wanting she and Alex to go overseas was because Meredith was home. I really like Alex and Jo and want them to work out long term but I felt really bad for Jo last night. Alex saying "the past year was crap and now Mer is home and I finally feel like things are back. I don't need to go anywhere. I don't want to." had to make her feel like shit - his year without Meredith sucked yet Jo was there. I don't think Jo will go but I think she will feel pushed aside once again for Meredith. I'm eager to see what the next episode has for Alex & Jo.

Edited May 8, 2015 by windsprints

[skeskali]

The stuff with Richard and Catherine makes me wonder if Catherine is going to appoint herself the new Chief of Surgery.

 

OMG. Please, please, please, please, PLEASE let this happen, Grey's writers!

[DropTheSoap]

 

Please go away Amelia, She like the Erica Hahn of recent seasons just be crammed down our throats.

Except I liked Erica Hahn. I'm still hoping they've named the parking lot in her honor.

 

Someone who's gone through 2 years of classes and then 2 years of clinicals and such as med student should know better than to take off a cervical collar, esp. when it's already said that the woman has a broken neck. Not a possible broken next. Not possible injuries, but a broken neck.

 

Don't care about the new interns. Still don't even care about Edwards, and don't believe she's competent enough for the speech she gave.

 

Amanda sure has that passive-aggressive thing down, doesn't she? I can get she's upset, but over a year later? Really? The "meaningful glances" between her and Owen didn't help.

 

I can take Catherine in small doses. The 800th repeat of a Richard/Catherine quien es mas macho is well past boring.

 

The last scene is almost making me like Kepner. Almost.

 

Catastrophe of the week is a bit boring, also.

 

I do like seeing Heather Matarazzo.

 

The McStandIn intern seems like a message to Patrick D from Shonda. "Look, we found another one." 

[kingshearte]

His dismissing the idea that he needed to ask Jo about Mer moving in seemed to me to be part of his typical defenses when he feels emotionally threatened. He just shuts down in regards to the other person.

I actually interpreted that less as him not thinking that the woman he lives with gets a say in something like that, but more just him assuming that she wouldn't even be there, because she'd have left him, to go do the army thing and/or just straight-up dumped him. Which is not necessarily any better, because it's still just tossing assumptions around, and having so little faith in your relationship that you think one fight can torpedo it, but it is different than just not caring what your co-habitating partner thinks about other people moving in.

 

Either way, though, Meredith's "you know how she gets" comment was way dismissive and out of line. Yeah, Mere, she's just such an unreasonable jerk for having the nerve to express her displeasure when her boyfriend makes unilateral decisions about her living situation.

 

I hope Jo & Alex actually sit down and have a reasonable conversation like some of the ones they've had in the past, rather than more of the assumption-fuelled crapfests like the ones Callie & Arizona used to have all the time.

[Starscream]

 Catherine... just yikes. Especially with her going on about needing a better chief of surgery. She can't name herself as it because it is a major conflict of interest. 

She could always fire Jackson from the board and make him chief.  I hope not though, because Jackson has the weakest personality of the whole cast and it's a chore to find him believable when giving out orders. 

 

I figure Catherine will have to take over the head of the board if she marries Richard.  He's not going to Boston and Catherine seems like she couldn't handle not being the boss of everybody.

[dr pepper]

Really hate fhT they're destroying Jo/Alex without any sort of buildup at all.

 

They destroy all decent relationships on this show. They're just doing this one a little faster.

[taanja]

 

Why should she have taken a moment to think of Amelia?  That's what people do.  That's what family does for each other.  Amelia is not some random stranger - she was living with them.

 

Meredith doesn't "do" families. That has been established. For her entire life except for the brief few years with Derek - it has always been Meredith alone. The only person she can really depend on is herself. If she had called Amelia (I can't even picture her ever doing that no matter the circumstances so it made sense to me) she knows Amelia would have called her entire family (Mother and other sisters) and everything would have been put on hold so they could rush to Seattle to be by his side.

 

Besides---maybe Meredith is as annoyed by Amelia as the audience?

 

[izabella]

Meredith has a family - three kids now.  She's not a complete stranger to family love and obligation.  And she's had a pseudo-father in the Chief for a long time, too. 

 

And she always had Christina.  I have no doubt Owen would be on Meredith's hate-you-til-you-die list if he had pulled the plug on Christina without telling Meredith and giving her a chance to say goodbye if he had had hours and hours to do so.

[Dagny]

Katherine annoys me but she did get some points for having all the reception food brought to the hospital for the staff.

 

I could have sworn this has happened before. Either on this show or another. What did they do with the food from Christina-Burke & the Avery/Kepner cancelled weddings?

 

I suppose one way to shut up Amelia would be to drop the medical records on her and walk away. People have different reactions to death.  I guess I don't "feel" the "I didn't have a chance to say goodbye" if the person is in a coma/life support. The person you knew is gone, its just a shell. Too many years of watching a person in a coma - diapers, feeding tubes and no plug to pull.

[dr pepper]

To be fair to Owen, nearly every advance in surgery has started as a step into Frankenstein territory. I am just old enough to remember when the news outlets would keep track of each heart transplant and celebrate if the patient lived a week. Otoh, an experimental treatment without consent is a Nuremburg violation. Which may end up being the reason that Cathering doesn't report him: she doesn't want that in the headlines.

 

But here's a happy suggestion: they could use Cute New Intern as a vehicle to bring back George. He's preening in the mirror in the changing room, the other interns rush out, leaving him alone. George appears in the mirror and offers him advice on how to be a better intern. Later that day, CNI uses that advice to save a potential disaster. Bailey says, "you must have an angel looking out for you". CNI looks at the mirror, sees George wink, and says "I really do". This being Shondaland, he says it twice.

[politichick]

Yeah, it would be nice if Alex first consulted Jo about Meredith and her kids moving in for a while, but I think he has previously established with her an understanding about the history of the house and how it has always been a safe haven for those in need, which is why Arizona is there, and without Meredith he wouldn't even have such a nice house. She probably gave him a really good deal as it is unlikely there was a huge mortgage when she sold and Alex just finished paying off student loans and wouldn't have been able to save a huge downpayment. Even though his name is on the mortgage, it is a family home meaning the family of doctors. And plus, even though Jo lives there, they are not married and it is not her house.

 

When Derek and Meredith were just dating he initially didn't care for the constant presence of Alex, Izzie, George, et al, and she explained that that's how they rolled. All for one.

 

Also, who told Jo that the Army has a couple's plan?

[KaveDweller]

So did Meredith and Amelia really not talk for a whole year while Amelia was living in her house? Who was paying the bills? If I was staying at someone's house and they just took off, I'd feel kind of weird continuing to live there.

[Clanstarling]

So did Meredith and Amelia really not talk for a whole year while Amelia was living in her house? Who was paying the bills? If I was staying at someone's house and they just took off, I'd feel kind of weird continuing to live there.

The show's never been particularly good about practical matters. Given the way the show presented it - if Meredith didn't talk to Alex, she sure as heck didn't talk to Amelia. As for feeling weird living there - I'm not sure Amelia feels weird about anything. She's pretty self-absorbed.

 

Though I will say, I did not think it odd that she waited so long to talk to Meredith about turning off life support. Initially it seems that no one talked to Meredith, and by the time she's back, there's the distraction of the baby. It took a triggering event for it to even come up. Having had buried resentments myself, and having them come to the forefront much later because something similar triggered it, I found this fairly relatable.

Edited May 8, 2015 by clanstarling

[KaveDweller]

Though I will say, I did not think it odd that she waited so long to talk to Meredith about turning off life support. Initially it seems that no one talked to Meredith, and by the time she's back, there's the distraction of the baby. It took a triggering event for it to even come up. Having had buried resentments myself, and having them come to the forefront much later because something similar triggered it, I found this fairly relatable.

 

That I agree with.  It's also not something people would bring up right away, because I think they would try and be supportive/polite to the grieving widow.  But after some time has come back, the resentment would slowly bubble up to the surface.  

[mythoughtis]

Meredith had better figure out what a family Is. She has 3 children, who have a right to know

Their fathers' family. Otherwise, she is just repeating Ellis's mistakes. Amelia was not just living with them, she was providing child care some of the time. This was her brother, she was right there, and deserved to say goodbye. she and Derek's family deserved to know Meredith was pregnant, and to see the kids during this difficult year. The kids deserved to see their aunt. Also Zola deserved to be around her doctors -she is HIV positive?

Edited May 9, 2015 by mythoughtis

[LeGrandElephant]

I don't think Zola is HIV positive, is she? Didn't she have some surgical thing that was cured when she was first on the show?

[Kagomei]

I'm pretty sure she's not.

[Lillybee]

I think that Mer should have called Amelia if only to get her to help with the kids.

 

I don't understand why Jo thinks that Alex should sign up for the year with the Army. He is a peds surgeon and a person who doesn't live on adreneline. He is very calm and patient oriented.

[lovedoldGreys]

I would like to see Alex and Meredith get together. I can see a story line where they start to realize they have feelings for each other......

 

The show used to be about relationships. For me, altho I adore Derick, Meredith and Cristina were the heart of the show, their relationship with each other, their relationships with the others and everyone's love interests.

 

I miss seeing them just be people. How many times were we in Meredith's house, the bar and even the cafeteria, seeing them in their personal lives? And there was still time for the hospital drama. Now it is mostly all hospital drama. We might get a minute here and there of anyone's personal life.

 

I have watched my DVD's many times, especially the early years. I do FF through most of the patients stories as I don't care that much for the patients stories. Now it is hardly worth watching an episode over as it would be mostly FF.

I am calling that "You're my home" is about Alex realizing Meredith or Jo is his home.  I am not a Jo and Alex fan, I never bought the relationship and the show hasn't been as good in the past few years.  But Dereks death made me watch, and I feel the writers are giving us great stories, with medical drama.  Jo needs her own story, not just to be Alex's gf.  She is young and deserves to have fun.  Alex and Meredith get each other and have great chemistry.  

[breezy424]

While I realize that this is fiction and that writers take some liberties for the 'story', so much of this to me is just lazy writing  So Derek is in a serious accident.  The police show up to tell Mer.  Do the police come in the case of a serious injury?  Never heard of that.  Yes, if someone has died in an incident.  But doesn't the hospital call the next of kin when the injured is still 'alive'?  And then Mer and the kids are taken to the hospital and she doesn't call anyone.  Not even for someone to come take the kids?  Not his sister who who is in the same vicinity?  I don't know where the rest of the family lives.  Mer may have grown up in a dysfunctional family but she's been a doctor for many years.  She's been witness to these situations over and over.  She's been the someone to tell people or ask people to call someone for their kids or the patient.  I don't buy the story the writers are trying to sell.  

 

As for Amelia.  They needed Amelia to go off, and rightfully so, on Mer about not calling her before pulling the plug.  But they decided to skip a year in the life of Grey's Anatomy so they show this a year after the fact.  Realistically, it should have happened soon after Derek's death.  At the very least, Amelia's anger should have been shown.  

 

They (the writers) tried to package this whole thing and it's just is so unreal, it makes the show more contrived than ever.

 

And I can't believe that none of the doctors came up with the idea of towing the car to the hospital.  Yeah, April is a genius.  Really writers?  It's the first thing I thought of and I have no doubt just about all the viewers were thinking the same thing.

 

I wouldn't say the show has jumped the shark but boy, has it gotten lazy.  Or maybe complacent.   

[RedheadZombie]

I really think the show needs to give up on the new interns, and introduce new characters as established doctors.  When the show started, MAGIC were who we identified with.  We fell in love with the characters and rooted for them to thrive as doctors.   At this point, we are now identifying with the attendings, who have thrived in their profession, and we've watched all the bumps along the way.  The new doctors - no matter how they imitate the writing for the original five - are just bumbling idiots who don't know what the hell they're doing.  After watching this group for years, they are who most of us relate to.  It's an us versus them thing.  The interns are them, and the established doctors we've followed for years are us.

 

I didn't mention this last week, but I saw something different in the scene with Amelia gliding into the room holding baby Ellis.  This was my take:  The last time Amelia held a baby she was close to, it was her baby and it was dying in her arms.  I saw a lot of melancholy and "what if" on her face, along with the bitter sweet joy of holding her dead brother's baby.  So I saw her holding that baby, while thinking that this one was healthy, and was going to survive.

 

She feels helpless that she couldn't help her brother. Not that really she could have helped him, logistically, because at that point he was unsalvageable, but she feels like she should have been there to try. It's not so much a weird "hero" complex as it is the irrational but understandable feeling that she "could have done something," if only she'd been there. Nothing could have been done, though.

 

When I was fourteen, my nine year old cousin died when her boat capsized.  When they finally found her body, she had somehow gotten her wrist entangled in a rope, and was caught underneath the boat. My mom tells me that I was convinced that if I'd been there, I would have looked under the boat.  Of course that's ridiculous, many of my cousins, as well as aunts, uncles, and strangers searched and couldn't find her.  It's not a logical thought, but I don't think it's uncommon for Amelia to have wanted to at least try to help him.

 

I was thinking Derek would feel sad if he knew she was going to move out and sell the house.  

 

Here's my fanwank.  In most hospitals, thirty minutes is the established call time.  That means when you're called in, thirty minutes (or less) later, you're in scrubs about to cut into the patient.  When Derek and Meredith lived together in the house, I chose to believe that the one on called slept in an on call room, and the other stayed with the kids.  Now that she's a single parent, Meredith has to either live closer to the hospital, or spend x number of days a week away from her kids for twenty-four hour chunks of time, and sleeping at the hospital.  Moving closer is a sensible decision.

 

I think Jo wanting she and Alex to go overseas was because Meredith was home. I really like Alex and Jo and want them to work out long term but I felt really bad for Jo last night. Alex saying "the past year was crap and now Mer is home and I finally feel like things are back. I don't need to go anywhere. I don't want to." had to make her feel like shit - his year without Meredith sucked yet Jo was there. I don't think Jo will go but I think she will feel pushed aside once again for Meredith. I'm eager to see what the next episode has for Alex & Jo.

 

My heart just melted when Alex said this.  Alex is very much like Meredith.  He had a fucked up childhood, and as an adult he has learned that it's his friends that are his true family.  This was very difficult for Derek to accept, but he did get it eventually, and stopped trying to come between Meredith and her closest friends, and didn't seem to feel much jealousy about the situation.  And when I think about it, Derek wasn't that big a family person when it comes to the family he was born into.  We rarely heard about his sisters and mother, and he easily accepted that Meredith just couldn't stand his sisters.  He chose Meredith over his original family.

 

And I can't believe that none of the doctors came up with the idea of towing the car to the hospital.  Yeah, April is a genius.  Really writers?  It's the first thing I thought of and I have no doubt just about all the viewers were thinking the same thing.

 

This didn't bother me.  April is a trauma surgeon.  Trauma surgeons, more than anybody, have to think on their feet and fly by the seat of their pants.  Maggie sees the heart, Amelia sees the brain, Callie sees bones, and Meredith sees abdominal organs.  Trauma surgeons have to consider all of these at once.

 

She could always fire Jackson from the board and make him chief.  I hope not though, because Jackson has the weakest personality of the whole cast and it's a chore to find him believable when giving out orders. 

 

I figure Catherine will have to take over the head of the board if she marries Richard.  He's not going to Boston and Catherine seems like she couldn't handle not being the boss of everybody.

 

I find Catherine hard to take a lot of the time.  But I love to see how she flusters Jackson, and I enjoy her relationship with April.  When Catherine is at her worst, I remind myself that Catherine did everything that Ellis did, and she did it while black.  I can't even imagine what that woman had to go through to get where she is.

[dr pepper]

This is kind of weird because i had expected this episode to be a let down and to continue my disengagement from the show. But here i am, speculating and analyzing.

 

Latest thought is, i didn't see it at first because he's male, but i now think Curly Top is meant to be the new Izzy.

Edited May 9, 2015 by dr pepper

[AnythingCanBe]

Meredith had better figure out what a family Is. She has 3 children, who have a right to know

Their fathers' family. Otherwise, she is just repeating Ellis's mistakes. Amelia was not just living with them, she was providing child care some of the time. This was her brother, she was right there, and deserved to say goodbye. she and Derek's family deserved to know Meredith was pregnant, and to see the kids during this difficult year. The kids deserved to see their aunt. Also Zola deserved to be around her doctors -she is HIV positive?

 

 

I don't think Zola is HIV positive, is she? Didn't she have some surgical thing that was cured when she was first on the show?

 

I think Zola has spina bifida.

[butterbody]

I may be confused, and I already deleted from the DVR, but wasn't there a scene where they did try to tell Amelia but she was in surgery, and someone said something about how its protocol that you can't interrupt them during surgery with news like that?

[Chas411]

 

Either way, though, Meredith's "you know how she gets" comment was way dismissive and out of line.

This, I mean seriously? When did Meredith start to outright hate Jo. She seemed to like her in season nine or at least she was never outright rude or disrespectful to her. This entire season has been her disrespecting Alex's relationship with Jo and Jo, while not happy, seems to take it from Mer. She's never rude to her and has made attempts at being nice to her which Meredith has dismissed each time. Is it because Alex is her person now she needs him to be on beck and call and Jo is resented because she's a distraction. Cristina had a life outside Meredith. Meredith used to support Cristina as well. I haven't seen her do this for Alex. He doesn't so much feel like her person as he is more her assistant - there to provide hugs, advice, babysitting services and whatever else she may need at her click of a finger.

 

And this was going on before Derek died. The relationship is unhealthy. It's too codependent. He's just turned into such a girl this season. Even his scenes with Maggie as well. It's a nice friendship but it's not romantic to me which is the way I can see them taking it. He doesn't feel like Alex anymore. It just feels like he's there to prop both characters.

[mythoughtis]

I may be confused, and I already deleted from the DVR, but wasn't there a scene where they did try to tell Amelia but she was in surgery, and someone said something about how its protocol that you can't interrupt them during surgery with news like that?

 

 

They wanted to tell Amelia AFTER Meredith arrived at the Grey-Sloan hospital and told her friends, but they had to wait until she finished surgery.  However, we have no idea how long that was after Meredith had the machines turned off.   Meredith had hours to tell Amelia while Derek was still on life-support. 

 

Thanks for the corrections on Zola's condition.  I was obviously wrong.

[Deanie87]

This, I mean seriously? When did Meredith start to outright hate Jo. She seemed to like her in season nine or at least she was never outright rude or disrespectful to her. This entire season has been her disrespecting Alex's relationship with Jo and Jo, while not happy, seems to take it from Mer. She's never rude to her and has made attempts at being nice to her which Meredith has dismissed each time. Is it because Alex is her person now she needs him to be on beck and call and Jo is resented because she's a distraction. Cristina had a life outside Meredith. Meredith used to support Cristina as well. I haven't seen her do this for Alex. He doesn't so much feel like her person as he is more her assistant - there to provide hugs, advice, babysitting services and whatever else she may need at her click of a finger.

 

And this was going on before Derek died. The relationship is unhealthy. It's too codependent. He's just turned into such a girl this season. Even his scenes with Maggie as well. It's a nice friendship but it's not romantic to me which is the way I can see them taking it. He doesn't feel like Alex anymore. It just feels like he's there to prop both characters.

It really seems like the writers are resuming the Mer/Alex/Jo storyline right from where it ended 15 episodes ago except with whole middle part taken out. They decided what happened during those episode so they would know but then either forgot to put it onscreen or cut it out in the editing room.

And my fear is that now that Derek is gone Meredith is going to become even more of THE SUN and she will get even more unbearable while those around her completely change personalities to support and prop her. I just hope she starts to lean more on Maggie, otherwise why is she here?

[Chas411]

 

They decided what happened during those episode so they would know but then either forgot to put it onscreen or cut it out in the editing room.

So we should assume that Jo became unreasonable at some point despite all of her interactions with Meredith pointing to the opposite. Man this show.

 

The whole thing doesn't do Alex any favours either. He's able to be a shoulder to and cheerlead every other woman in the hospital but when it comes to his own girlfiend who's never done anything but support and love him, he'll just overlook her completely.

 

 

I just hope she starts to lean more on Maggie, otherwise why is she here

 

She gets more screentime and development then any of the other characters at this point.

[windsprints]

Alex is very much like Meredith.  He had a fucked up childhood, and as an adult he has learned that it's his friends that are his true family.  This was very difficult for Derek to accept, but he did get it eventually, and stopped trying to come between Meredith and her closest friends, and didn't seem to feel much jealousy about the situation.  And when I think about it, Derek wasn't that big a family person when it comes to the family he was born into.  We rarely heard about his sisters and mother, and he easily accepted that Meredith just couldn't stand his sisters.  He chose Meredith over his original family.

Alex/Jo are nothing at all like MerDer and I'd never expect (or want) them to have any of the same dynamics. Jo is very much like Alex, probably more so than Meredith. Yes, Meredith had a crappy mother and a father that left her. Unlike both Alex and Jo she grew up never worrying about money, having a place to live, etc. 

Meredith used to support Cristina as well. I haven't seen her do this for Alex. He doesn't so much feel like her person as he is more her assistant - there to provide hugs, advice, babysitting services and whatever else she may need at her click of a finger.

100% agree. Meredith has done nothing to support Alex, its all one way. The episode where Alex was preparing for the board meeting highlighted the way she treats him - kicks Jo out, zero consideration for his relationship & zero consideration for him needing to prepare for the meeting.  I also agree that this has been from the start of the season.

Edited May 9, 2015 by windsprints

[Chas411]

 

The episode where Alex was preparing for the board meeting highlighted the way she treats him - kicks Jo out, zero consideration for his relationship & zero consideration for him needing to prepare for the meeting.

Then doesn't even vote for him...

[Deanie87]

100% agree. Meredith has done nothing to support Alex, its all one way. The episode where Alex was preparing for the board meeting highlighted the way she treats him - kicks Jo out, zero consideration for his relationship & zero consideration for him needing to prepare for the meeting. I also agree that this has been from the start of the season.

So let's definitely put them together what an awesome couple they will make lol!

[LeGrandElephant]

Bailey has some nerve complaining that the chief recommending her as head of surgery isn't a sure thing so why should she thank him? It's a recommendation, not a guarantee. She should still thank him for recommending her, while realizing other people on the board might have other ideas.

I didn't watch the last episode that skipped a year. This one was ok, as background while cooking. Not clear why so many doctors are joining the army but whatever.

Edited May 9, 2015 by LeGrandElephant

[FuriousStyles]

And now, let's give a great, big, Grey/Sloane/Shepherd Memorial Sex Closet welcome to our newly ripened redshirts!

Here's an easy test. When a new doctor appears, look at their face. If, regardless of your sexual orientation, you find it a pleasing sight you wouldn't mid seeing a lot of, congratulations, you've discovered this show's next regular.

You're so right. I'm a lesbian and as soon as I saw that doctor with the suit on, I said to myself, this must be McDreamy's replacement. I was kind of surprised when he turned out to just be another idiot intern.

To add my two cents into the Meredith/Amelia debate....I'm all 100% on Amelia's side. Meredith should have called Amelia immediately. And I really don't want to hear anything about how "distraught" Meredith was and whatever else, because she was definitely pretty damn calm and collected for most of that episode. She even had enough wherewithal to calm the doctor down in the parking lot and tell her to use this experience as a learning opportunity to get better. THAT doesn't sound like someone who isn't thinking clearly to me.

Meredith isn't about family or doesn't know what families do for each other? I don't buy that. Meredith may not know what a traditional family is about. Her parents are messed up and all that. But Meredith most certainly understands the concept and general principles of family. Alex is her family, Christina, Webber etc. She had a good relationship with Lexie and she's developing one with Maggie...and oh yeah she has 3 children. And not to mention she's a doctor, so she's seen that situation play out hundreds of times and has probably been in a position where she's had to tell one family member that its probably a good idea to start contacting everyone else because the patient may not make it or whatever the case is. Meredith not calling Amelia or anyone else was just pure selfishness. I get it, Derek was her husband, but that doesn't negate the (moral) rights of Derek's family from being able to say their goodbyes, especially Amelia who was simple car ride away.

While I'm on my bashing Meredith rant, I didn't understand her comment to Alex about Jo "you know how she gets". Well I don't! How exactly does Jo "get", Meredith?" Because from what I've seen, Jo has been way more understanding and accommodating than most, especially as it pertains to you laying in bed with Alex as you rant and rave about whatever issues you're having at home, barging into the bathroom, etc. I guess I should give Meredith credit for actually asking Alex if she could move in vs her just showing up at is door with kids in tow.

Edited May 9, 2015 by FuriousStyles

[Chas411]

 

While I'm on my bashing Meredith rant, I didn't understand her comment to Alex about Jo "you know how she gets".  Well I don't!  How exactly does Jo "get", Meredith?" Because from what I've seen, Jo has been way more understanding and accommodating than most, especially as it pertains to you laying in bed with Alex as you rant and rave about whatever issues you're having at home, barging into the bathroom, etc.  I guess I should give Meredith credit

Exactly and for once I'd love to here Alex actually call Meredith on her shitty treatment of his girlfriend... but no, I guess that would mean he'd have to ask for his balls back off her first.

[lovedoldGreys]

I really think the show needs to give up on the new interns, and introduce new characters as established doctors.  When the show started, MAGIC were who we identified with.  We fell in love with the characters and rooted for them to thrive as doctors.   At this point, we are now identifying with the attendings, who have thrived in their profession, and we've watched all the bumps along the way.  The new doctors - no matter how they imitate the writing for the original five - are just bumbling idiots who don't know what the hell they're doing.  After watching this group for years, they are who most of us relate to.  It's an us versus them thing.  The interns are them, and the established doctors we've followed for years are us.

 

I didn't mention this last week, but I saw something different in the scene with Amelia gliding into the room holding baby Ellis.  This was my take:  The last time Amelia held a baby she was close to, it was her baby and it was dying in her arms.  I saw a lot of melancholy and "what if" on her face, along with the bitter sweet joy of holding her dead brother's baby.  So I saw her holding that baby, while thinking that this one was healthy, and was going to survive.

 

 

When I was fourteen, my nine year old cousin died when her boat capsized.  When they finally found her body, she had somehow gotten her wrist entangled in a rope, and was caught underneath the boat. My mom tells me that I was convinced that if I'd been there, I would have looked under the boat.  Of course that's ridiculous, many of my cousins, as well as aunts, uncles, and strangers searched and couldn't find her.  It's not a logical thought, but I don't think it's uncommon for Amelia to have wanted to at least try to help him.

 

 

Here's my fanwank.  In most hospitals, thirty minutes is the established call time.  That means when you're called in, thirty minutes (or less) later, you're in scrubs about to cut into the patient.  When Derek and Meredith lived together in the house, I chose to believe that the one on called slept in an on call room, and the other stayed with the kids.  Now that she's a single parent, Meredith has to either live closer to the hospital, or spend x number of days a week away from her kids for twenty-four hour chunks of time, and sleeping at the hospital.  Moving closer is a sensible decision.

 

 

My heart just melted when Alex said this.  Alex is very much like Meredith.  He had a fucked up childhood, and as an adult he has learned that it's his friends that are his true family.  This was very difficult for Derek to accept, but he did get it eventually, and stopped trying to come between Meredith and her closest friends, and didn't seem to feel much jealousy about the situation.  And when I think about it, Derek wasn't that big a family person when it comes to the family he was born into.  We rarely heard about his sisters and mother, and he easily accepted that Meredith just couldn't stand his sisters.  He chose Meredith over his original family.

 

 

This didn't bother me.  April is a trauma surgeon.  Trauma surgeons, more than anybody, have to think on their feet and fly by the seat of their pants.  Maggie sees the heart, Amelia sees the brain, Callie sees bones, and Meredith sees abdominal organs.  Trauma surgeons have to consider all of these at once.

 

 

I find Catherine hard to take a lot of the time.  But I love to see how she flusters Jackson, and I enjoy her relationship with April.  When Catherine is at her worst, I remind myself that Catherine did everything that Ellis did, and she did it while black.  I can't even imagine what that woman had to go through to get where she is.

 

Yes to all of this!

[PrincessTT]

Wouldn't it be a conflict of interests for Bailey to be chief considering that she's also a board member?

 

I'm back to not liking Kepner... I couldn't stand her when she first joined, then I started to like her once she settled into being a trauma surgeon running the ER, now she's back from the desert with a new attitude and I don't like her again.

[Deanie87]

Wouldn't it be a conflict of interests for Bailey to be chief considering that she's also a board member?

 

I'm back to not liking Kepner... I couldn't stand her when she first joined, then I started to like her once she settled into being a trauma surgeon running the ER, now she's back from the desert with a new attitude and I don't like her again.

I think that the new Chief will be Mer, Amelia or Maggie due to their superwoman awesomeness.

Who will get Derek's I wonder? Maybe Alex will finally get it.

[PrincessTT]

I think that the new Chief will be Mer, Amelia or Maggie due to their superwoman awesomeness.

Who will get Derek's I wonder? Maybe Alex will finally get it.

 

I remember back in Season 1 (or maybe 2) when Richard told Bailey that she would be Chief one day so I've always thought that when the show ends she'll be Chief, not sure if she'll get it at this point in time though. 

 

Something that's been bugging me since the start of the season is the board seat/shares thing, Bailey got the board seat but Alex still has the shares in the hospital right? So technically he's an owner of the hospital? Cristina gave him her shares (presumably they're in his name) so even though the board voted to give Bailey the board seat they couldn't take away his shares from him as that's a totally different thing. Or at least that's my understanding of it, but the show seems to use the terms owner / board member to mean the same thing (such as in this episode) so maybe I'm wrong.