S03.E19: Broken Arrow

[nksarmi]

You know the more I think about it - the more this might be my favorite episode of the season.  It had humor, emotion, and Team Arrow being smart!  I have to say, when Oliver first saw Roy alive, we should have had a Spoke just found out Captain Kirk was alive - break character and smile and hug him moment.  But it was still great.

[Primetimer]

The Atom and the Arrow have to work together, and it's fun. A surprising number of deaths make it a little somber, though.

Read the story

[Delphi]

I'm actually really bothered by Lance and he used to be my favourite but ain't nobody got time for his vendetta. Especially when he blamed Ollie for Roy's 'death' It's like...no.

You just arrested a teenage vigilante whom everyone has a problem with. He was allegedly killed by an officer. And there's no way that Roy should have been in gen pop anyway. What kind of shitty department do you run?

[BkWurm1]

About Ray's reaction to seeing Felicity give Oliver the arm squeeze. I rewatched that scene and it occurs to me that he could hear what they were saying. He wasn't that far away, it's a quiet night. Ray might get arm squeezes too, but Oliver got the Squeeze and a love you. Granted, it was couched in "people" plural love you, but given that Ray knows she "had" feelings for Oliver and add in Ray's unanswered "I love you" I can see why he would be so deflated to see how easily she said those words to Oliver while Ray got jello.

You just arrested a teenage vigilante whom everyone has a problem with. He was allegedly killed by an officer. And there's no way that Roy should have been in gen pop anyway. What kind of shitty department do you run?

There is a reason Starling got it's very own Vigilante and it's dumb crap like this. There is a general level of incompetence built in right alongside the corruption. I have no trouble believing the DA stayed away until he thought it was safe.

[tennisgurl]

Oh, and when the fern was smashed, I swear I went  straight to "Our love fern! You let it DIE!"

 

Yeah. I went to the "How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days" reference. Not even sorry. 

[TrueMyth]

Put me in the "enjoyed this episode" camp.  Not as much as 3x16, but it was nice.

 

I would like to know what the writers are doing with Malcolm.  He straight up warned Oliver that R'as would be coming for the people he loves next.  Malcolm knows the lengths Oliver will go to for Thea because he yanked that string himself.  So Malcolm had to know Thea was in danger.  Now I understand him vacating the apartment during Lance's hunt, but we know he has a perfectly good spy perch set up to keep an eye on Thea and he's established as super sneaky to the extent that he could evade the crack team of SCPD.  Once Roy is 'dead', he should know the threat level on Thea rises even higher... AND he can now return to the apartment.  Given how quickly he burst in on DJDummy's assassination attempt, he should have been there to defend Thea.

 

Granted, Malcolm has been established as pants-pooping afraid of R'as.  Is that why he did nothing?  Or did he legit let his only child be killed because "I couldn't have stopped it, I would have just died with her, and you may bring her back by LP, but not me"?  Either way, any remote chance of redemption for Malcolm has bit it hard for me in this episode.  Unless he has some crazy hero's death in the finale, he had better reveal some crazy plan of evil soon or be written off the show as a narrative waste.  I pains me, as I love Barrowman, but there it is.

 

Also, PLEASE be Felicity breaking up with Palmer next episode.  I hate that it has become a trend of others telling Felicity how much she loves him.  I love that she almost blurted it out this episode.  It was the first real indication we've had about where her head is, but now we need her rationalization for her relationship with Palmer.  Palmer's knowing looks at Oliver/Felicity, especially at the end, seemed a horrible set-up for him "letting her go..."  *sigh*

 

I really liked the fight with Oliver in control!  I wish it had gone on a bit longer.  Also, it would have been awesome if the remote controls even had some limited feedback or something... I really would have loved to see Felicity run to Ray after the fight and have the hug, only to cut back to Oliver hugging the air with closed eyes before de-linking.  I mean, if you're going to abuse me with triangle angst, go for my jugular, okay?

[WaitandHope]

I think it WAS my favorite episode of the season.  Team Arrow FTW!    My second favorite Team Arrow episode of all time.   I like "Darkness on the Edge of Town" the best. 

 

It really was the perfect use of almost every character, except QL, who has become a total irrational asshole...and Diggle was perfect, but there is never enough Diggle.  Perfect amount of Laurel.   And I always eyeroll Malcolm appearances but the lurk-and-diss is now how Arrow chooses to foreshadow.

 

Ray was enjoyable - finally.  I maintain my stance that MG and co have actually wanted us to groan/eye-roll at Ray all year (like a bad pun), but they grossly overestimated our patience level as an audience.   And I cannot fathom why they would think making a character that annoying could make him spinoff material.  Alas - it's all been said before. 

 

Since I am always focused on Digg, I couldn't tell if his headshake at Oliver over his "anxious" comment to Felicity was a "Dude, not now...let the woman be" or a "hell no, she doesn't get that nervous because you are a total badass and Ray's an idiot."  Either way, it was the best!  DR gives the best reaction shots.  Though SA's after the "related" comment was a close second.

 

I almost thought the last look by Diggle at the end was that he was growing increasingly exasperated with Oliver Queen's continued trust issues and failing to let people help him.    I mean he must wake up at this point feeling like Bill Murray in Groundhog Day.  Today - Oliver is going to brood and resist my help and guidance, I will work my ass off to get thru to him that you need people in your life, he will grudgingly accept this help with a lot of drama, go to bed.  Wake up and repeat.  

 

Sigh, the end of Raylicity is finally here...

 

Thea-Ra's scene was great and heartbreaking.  I was bracing my 10-year old daughters for what was going to happen (and didn't want them to be too freaked out so I totally spoiled them for all the possible deaths).  And I was glad the preview ran right after the scene - though I questioned the decision to spoil something so big literally seconds after.    

 

Lastly, Roy - truly we are going to miss you when you're gone.  We never really appreciated you enough while you were here.  CH acted the hell out of this episode and it was a sight to be hold.  Plus, I will miss the bonus pretty.

 

Do you think Felicity sees herself as Dorothy Gale?  I did love the line.

[TVHappy9463]

so much goodness, the Roy fake out on both us and Oliver. Love me some Mr. Diggle and Felicity. Oliver controlling Ray's suit. Stephen's acting all the way thru, man has he grown as an actor or what. The small exchanges, Diggle's looks, Oliver's eye rolls, this cast is tight, very in sync with one another.

And I don't care what anyone says Brandan Routh is really bringing it, he commits so fully to whatever he is doing in a scene, the goofy high five team up. the sadness in his eyes when he was talking to Felicity about the lack of i love you, and the final scene at the car. He had a full body reaction to watching Olicity and he let us see it. Most TV actors keep it above the shoulders, but not this guy, it was wonderful.  

Colton was amazing, heart breaking an amazing.  Diggle and Oliver fighting, Paul Blackthorne was on it. Not a false note in the group.

 

Congrats to everyone on Arrow, writing, directing all of you wonderfully talented people. 

 

As far as the promo for next week, I think they showed us the LP for Thea, because, 1, they know we are smart enough to figure it out on our own and 2. there is something bigger that they aren't showing us.  

[Samx]

I was really impressed how well Roy handled himself in the prison brawl and kind of felt like he was under used and/or misused until now. Anyway, great ep for CH and I am sad to see him go. I don't know if they plan on putting him in the spinoff or on another show but I am sure CH will be back on our TV and movie screens soon.

Me: "OH JUST HUG HIM DAMMIT!"

Not into Ray. Into OG Team Arrow. Minimal Laurel was perfection. Capt. Lance is the worst cop of all time. Thea's scene with R'as was great - I've really come to enjoy her and root for her.

[Password]

I cannot be watching the "You're the man that I..." scene repeatedly. Literally just that small part.

Someone call EBR and SA about selling a scene.

[Chaser]

I feel like Roy was the first person Oliver had really saved. He tried with Helena but he couldn't get there. He tried with Sara but she went back to the league (not that I think she is a bad or anything). He is still trying with Thea.

 

It made their goodbye even more emotional and I did want a bear hug between them.

 

 

I cannot be watching the "You're the man that I..." scene repeatedly. Literally just that small part.

Someone call EBR and SA about selling a scene.

I think my favorite word to describe them is genuine. They find the honesty in their scenes and I love that.

[33kaitykaity]

Love how Felicity always seems to be able to get through to Oliver.  

 

Color me not shocked that Roy was still alive.  After Lance told Thea and Oliver and walked out, my reaction was show me the body with the Y-shaped autopsy incision, then I'll believe Roy is really dead, but not a second before.  

[Ang]

Boring, predictable and eye roll worthy.

ETA: Which puts me in the minority but I was more annoyed than anything watching and it felt super long.

Oh good, I was hoping for a dissenting opinion! I've been thinking about how they basically have a couple different shows (or more) they're running with the same cast and crew, and I'm really curious about the different ways episodes are perceived. Can you (or anyone else who wants to jump in here) give an example of an episode that you loved? What was missing tonight for you?

(Apologies if this is out of place; I still need to read a couple pages to catch up but didn't want to miss talking about this.)

[tv echo]

Additional comment about the flashback -- Oliver's refusing to leave Hong Kong as Waller recommended shows how much he's already changed in the almost three years since he was shipwrecked on the island.  Pre-island Oliver would've thought only of saving his own skin and getting out of harm's way.  This more heroic Oliver wants to stay and take down General Shreve before he can use the stolen virus to hurt people.

[redsox7819]

Oh good, I was hoping for a dissenting opinion! I've been thinking about how they basically have a couple different shows (or more) they're running with the same cast and crew, and I'm really curious about the different ways episodes are perceived. Can you (or anyone else who wants to jump in here) give an example of an episode that you loved? What was missing tonight for you?

(Apologies if this is out of place; I still need to read a couple pages to catch up but didn't want to miss talking about this.)

I probably have not loved an episode of this show since season two. I cannot name an episode since I am awful at remember which ones I loved. Overall, this season has been all of the place with them trying to be/do god only knows what and failing. Whatever they trying is boring, predictable, lacks actual direction/a plan, falls under a million TV troupes in one episode/season and thinks their viewers are stupid and cannot see any of this. A big TV pet peeve of mine is when show runners think they are smarter than the audience and to me this show is there.  This show in season one and two was interesting, fun, had direction/plan, twists and did not make you feel stupid. None of which has happened this season.

Edited April 16, 2015 by redsox7819

[AES13]

I probably have not loved an episode of this show since season two. I cannot name an episode since I am awful at remember which ones I loved. Overall, this season has been all of the place with them trying to be/do god only knows what and failing. Whatever they trying is boring, predictable, lacks actual direction/a plan, falls under a million TV troupes in one episode/season and thinks their viewers are stupid and cannot see any of this. A big TV pet peeve of mine is when show runners think they are smarter than the audience and to me this show is there.  This show in season one/two used to be interesting and fun. None of which has happened this season.

 

I'm on the same page as you, Redsox7819.  Don't get me wrong, I'm still watching and enjoying the show but I'm hope/fear-watching.  I hope for the best but my fear that I'm about to be betrayed again means that when Roy "died" all I could think is why him and not Laurel? 

 

Colton Haynes' start was rocky (partially due to the fact I'm too old to find him that attractive) but little by little, he has really grown on me.  Those first thankless episodes at the beginning of the season where he had maybe 1 or 2 lines didn't help him much but when I compare the benefit of the doubt that I'm willing to accord Roy compared to Laurel, there is no contest.  I feel like he had masses of room to grow, and Laurel has none, or at least none that I have patience for.

 

The happiness I felt at his survival could not be maintained when it became clear he would no longer be a part of the show.   Thea's "death" at the end was simultaneously shocking (i.e. "Really, we're going to go with yet another close female family member's death to propel the climax of the season?") and dull acceptance.  I mean Oliver has not actually started cutting himself yet, so obviously we still have a ways to go for him to hit rock bottom, right?

 

I'm sorry to say that the longer they keep grinding Oliver down, the more I'm preferring the Flash to Arrow.  Yes, it can be cartoony and childish at times (and don't get me started on Iris' dad and boyfriend colluding to keep the delicate flower in the dark - at least until Eddie marries her, at which point, as her owner he gets to decide what she's told, apparently!) but all in all, it's just more enjoyable to watch IMO.

Edited April 16, 2015 by AES13

[sjohnson]

Since the preview assures us that

people come out of the Lazarus Pit changed, perhaps she could come back as Susanna Thompson. I like Willa but I love Susanna.


Naw, just kidding. I quit comics before Lazarus Pits, so they strike me as the pits. In one sense I've been sorry Oliver came back, because he had a glorious and gloriously appropriate destiny.

 

PS. Sorry I thought writing "preview" and spacing was sufficient warning. 

Edited April 17, 2015 by sjohnson
Spoiler tag; let's use spoiler tags for previews, thanks!

[statsgirl]

I really liked this episode, which makes me happy.  But I wonder why I had to sit through 15 subpar episodes this season when they could produce one like this, which makes me mad.

 

I think the writers were the ones who wrote The Secret Origins of Felicity Smoak so maybe that explains some of it.

 

I liked Ray Palmer wearing a deep blue shirt and a red tie, mirroring his Atom costume.  I liked the parallels of the Lt telling Quentin to back off his Captain Ahab mission and Diggle telling Oliver to back off about going to save Roy.

 

I kind of liked (I guess) the Ray/Felicity parallels, including Ray's fist pump when they got something computery to work, just like Felicity fist pump at Merlyn Global in ep 1x22.  Also liked the shot of the robot hand collapsing when Ray leaves after high-fiving Oliver, a meta statement about how Oliver feels about all this.

 

I really, really liked Roy's first prison fight scene, when he takes down five (?) bad guys even though his hands are cuffed behind his back. That's Team Arrow training!

 

I can't believe Roy is gone. That was the first time I cried watching Arrow. TA saving Oliver against his will was amazing but I'm really upset about Roy. I feel like he was barely starting his journey. I would have loved to see him and Thea going on missions together.

 

I was really hoping next season would have Roy and Theo as the B Team to Oliver and Diggle.  Oh well, at least Roy's not dead, which on this show is saying a lot.

Nah, Ra's would thouroughly stomp Thea with no problem.  He wasn't even trying in this fight, and was toying with her, like in the fight against Oliver.  If he were to actually try, and unleash his skill, he'd wipe out Team Arrow in 5 minutes at most.

Oh, totally,  If Thea had been thinking, she should have run like crazy and jumped off the balcony like when the Arrow showed up at her place at Christmas.  But I still have to admire her guts for fighting.

[Danny Franks]

Wait... so the drama of this episode centred around Roy being in danger from all the inmates in the prison? Is it not the usual procedure to keep any inmate who may be in danger isolated from the rest of the prison population? Especially if he's already been attacked once. If the writers are relying on shoddy, inaccurate nonsense to propel their stories, then they're even worse than I thought they were.

 

Oh well. Maybe they might try for something approaching real and sensible again in season 4. When the game has been so thoroughly changed that they just can't get any more ridiculous.

[Slovenly Muse]

Ok, on The Thrilling Adventure Hour podcast, there's a ridiculous superhero serial called "Captain Laserbeam" wherein the characters are always going on about which of the many heroes have been "teaming up" lately. And "teaming up" is a not-even-thinly-disguised euphemism for "sleeping together." So... Ray's excitement about getting to "team up" with both Oliver and Barry has pretty much made this the best week ever.

[BumpSetSpike]

Finally, a decent episode.  For me, the short and sweet reasons were:

 

• It focused on Oliver as the primary story
• No Black Canary
• Plausible and emotional Roy Harper / Colton Hayes storyline
• Ray was dorky but likeable
• Fantastic Diggle-Oliver moments
• Stephen Amell acted his you-know-what off, and I bought every teary moment of it

Edited April 17, 2015 by BumpSetSpike

[bettername2come]

That was one of my favorite episodes of the season. So if Ray's the Tin Man and Roy's the Scarecrow, what does that make Oliver and Digg? Good Team Arrow moments, nice team up with Ray and Oliver fighting, Brandon Routh looked really attractive in that leather jacket, Roy's alive, Cisco stopped by. The most tense moment for me was when Oliver and Diggle started shoving. That just about broke my heart.

[kismet]

Wanted to put my thoughts down before I read the thread

 

AAAH that episode. I hated so many parts of it and loved so few parts of it, but was unable to real turn away from it. It felt like I was rubbernecking a multicar crash while getting hit by a mack truck!!!

 

Seriously, thank goodness Roy lives!!! I was literally yelling the scream to fix that bullshit and urging OQ to go fight for Roy. Gotta say, I was not expecting them to keep the secret plan from us, so was impressed by that. So that part I loved. Even loved that they showed us the fate of the fern, nice moment. Loved SA performance throughout the whole episode he is just brought it this episode. Colton Hayes also brought it this episode. Amazing performances from them!

 

That's about it for stuff I loved. The rest was just UGH & seriously elgh.

 

Flashbacks - There getting to be kinda annoying this year, when the people in the past literally tell OQ the lesson he is supposed to be learning in the present. Maybe the scripts have taken a hit or maybe the lessons are not that original this year. But if Tatsu told him what he supposed to learn 5 years ago, why hasn't he come close to learning it yet? This is not the first episode where this has happened. I feel like they used to use the FB to show how far OQ has come, now they just use it to explain the lesson of the week, which is REDUNDANT!

 

Thea - Oh yea the most predictable moment of the entire series. Everyone saw that one coming. Felt it would have been better if they had aired it before the Ray death & resurrection. It wasn't going to be a cliffhanger, but imagine how much more it would have hurt to watch Ray say goodbye thinking that Thea was safe only to have it not be true. It just would have brought some needed emotional relevancy to Thea's attack, since we all saw Thea's demise coming.

 

Malcolm - Man's got the best job. He got paid big $$ to have basically one scene in which he just repeated the same lines again. Thx MM for telling OQ for the zillionth time that Ras is going to kill someone OQ's loves. I really didn't understand that the other times you said it. But I totally believe you now that you told him in the alleyway of truth.

 

Felicity - I figured out what I don't like with her performances of late, its her voice. Ever since she started dating RP & any time he is in a scene with her, she gets this really grating tone to her voice that is all wrong. Its just irritating. I just couldn't stomach the majority of her scenes. And the almost ILY (I assume) that got switched to I believe in you I think was supposed to be a sweet moment, but instead it was annoying. It is way beyond time for her to tell OQ directly that she cares for him. Her scenes and concern over Ray was just over the top sappy that I just felt cheapened the scenes & the emotions of what I think the writers wanted me to feel.

 

Raylicity - And I am definitely over her & Ray together, between the Flash & this ep, I just can't see them as an actual couple IRL or on a show. I'm just done with them, plz show just end it. Seriously this should have ended weeks ago or never should have happened. I just can't believe they are trying to get this much leverage out of it. And did OQ just imply that they are actually related? I rewound it, it seemed like an actual possibility in his mind, not just a bad joke. Even Caitlin indirectly implied it. Please writers do not go there!! Loved that Ray figure it out on his own in that final car scene, but it was a little annoying that it took this long.

 

ATOM - The suit worked better this episode because they geared the whole show about him. But honestly, after this episode, I am not into having metahumans on Arrow. The lack of reality just felt a little out of place. I can deal with superhuman strength & power, like mirakuru. But red fire eyes and the rest of the CGI effects were just not in character with Arrow. Even the puppetry of the suit by OQ was anticlimatic. I just wish they had found another way to introduce us to Ray & ATOM, because I feel nothing intriguing about his character that makes me want to see more. I just want him off Arrow, so I can have a clean slate for the spin-off. I know they spent a lot of time & money on trying to make us want more of him. But the wooing is just not working. Im sorry Ray, but Im just not that into you.

 

Things I have to call bullshit on & needs to end now - Oliver Queen propping up Ray Palmer or any other soon to be spin off star. It is one thing to give a motivational speech. But Im watching the scene of him telling Ray what he did in the mayor's office was heroic, and rather than being moved with aw how sweet, Im literally flabbergasted that the writers felt the need to have OQ prop RP that much. I mean I know why Ray had to be in the field instead of OQ, but he shouldn't have needed that pep hero talk to finish the fight. He should have just been able to at least try to fight on, on his own. RP is not OQ, he has not been repeatedly beaten down multiple times & in many ways over the past 8 years. OQ needs to have an motivational speech in 19th episode usually because everything around him is falling to pieces (as it sorta was this time), but he still generally fights on until the last possible moment. Am I supposed to really believe that RP getting his ass kicked when he is unprepared mentally & physically to fight a metahuman is equivalent to OQ struggles that he needed some grand speech to get him through. I really wish they had made RP more prepared to fight in the field before all this. OQ speech to RP just illustrated to me how much they messed telling his story from the moment they put RP on Arrow.

[Moya the Leviathan]

That was one of my favorite episodes of the season. So if Ray's the Tin Man and Roy's the Scarecrow, what does that make Oliver and Digg?

DDigg is Toto, and Oliver is the Ruby Slippers

[twoods]

I'm going to miss Roy. He was such a great addition to team Arrow, and him and Thea make me smile. Hopefully he comes back for a few more episodes.

Poor Thea. I wish she knew Roy was alive before she was gutted.

Enough with the man pain, Oliver. How many times do we have to pan to his face when Felicity and Ray interact? The writers have ruined this ship with too much angst. I like Ray, and don't want him to get crapped on. Maybe he should become a member of Team Flash because he's awesome with Cisco, and he needs to be away from the suckitude that is Olicity angst.

[Locutus]

So Felicity didn't want to tell Ray that Roy was Arsenal, but she did tell him Barry was the Flash?

[wonderwall]

So Felicity didn't want to tell Ray that Roy was Arsenal, but she did tell him Barry was the Flash?

bad writing. Felicity would never reveal anyone's identity without their approval. They set the precedence in episode 4&8 of the Flash and numerous episodes of Arrow. I just think that it's because they wanted Ray in the fold and Felicity telling him was the only way. smh. Very out of character Edited April 17, 2015 by wonderwall

[BkWurm1]

Well, Barry does have a decidedly looser opinion on sharing his secret, lol. Pretty sure he'd be happy to tell everyone if that didn't break his don't tell Iris rule.

My other thought is that telling Ray about Arsenal's identity wouldn't have been as much a priority. It feels like not everyone even remembers the Arrow had a friend in red.

Edited April 17, 2015 by BkWurm1

[tv echo]

MG clarifications about this episode and deleted dialogue...

olicitys-arrow asked:
Did Roy take his Arsenal outfit with him?

It was impounded when Lance raided the lair in 3x19.

pls-moi asked:
LOVED the Roy spoiler. It was perfect! Why did Felicity call him Scarecrow?

She was quoting a line from “Wizard of Oz.”

donna--lynn asked:
I have to know. Who came up with the line "There is a decent chance you and Palmer are related."

That would be me.

arrowfan2 asked:
You said here on tumblr that Laurel would have gone pretty far for Oliver in 3x19. Were you trolling us? Cause she prooved her lawyer skills once again (she just did her job, don't think that should have meant "going pretty far for Oliver) and Oliver didn't even thank her.

I thought that standing up to her father was going pretty far.

mercilesscupid asked:
Hi Marc! Any chance you could share the nice / funny Diggle scene from 3.19 that got cut for time? Thanks!

It wasn’t a scene, just an exchange between Diggle and Palmer:

http://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/

Edited April 17, 2015 by tv echo

[Password]

Aah they left out even more shade from Diggle. For shame.

[tv echo]

On the previous page of this thread I gave my comments on this episode, including that I thought Laurel was not in on Roy's plan because otherwise she would've been present at the final good-bye scene with Oliver, Diggle and Felicity.  Upon further reflection, I could see it either way:

 

Laurel Didn't Know -- Laurel wasn't present in the flashback when Roy, Diggle and Felicity talked about the plan, nor was she present at the good-bye scene.  That good-bye scene takes place at night, so Laurel would not have been tied up with her ADA job (which apparently ends by dinnertime since she always manages to go vigilanting at night as the BC).

 

Laurel Knew -- In the good-bye scene, Roy asks Oliver to tell Thea he's alive.  But he (and no one) says anything about telling Laurel that Roy's alive, even though Laurel/BC has been fighting alongside Roy for the past few weeks.  So it's possible that she knew about the plan and had said her good-bye to Roy earlier (off-screen).

Edited April 17, 2015 by tv echo

[apinknightmare]

I think it's likely that she didn't know. Or, at least, I would prefer that she didn't. What point would there be in telling her? She's an ADA - there really is no reason for them to tell her about the plan, because they didn't need her in order to carry it out, and IMO, the less people who know about Roy being alive and out there, the better.

it also protects her, given that she's an ADA. God, this vigilante lawyer business is so stupid.

Edited April 17, 2015 by apinknightmare

[Delphi]

His poor costume, so he doesn't have a back up one?

Also, how did the police break into the foundry so quickly, that's ridiculous, no wonder they'vE been having security problems for the past year and a half.

Why weren't they already all using the back up lair. That makes no sense. I rewarched last night and that's what stood out the most.

[tv echo]

Another stupid thing - the police forcibly breaking down the door to the foundry basement.  Quentin had a warrant.  He should've asked Oliver or Thea to unlock the code to the basement door first, rather than engaging in unnecessary destruction of private property.

[Chaser]

Another stupid thing - the police forcibly breaking down the door to the foundry basement.  Quentin had a warrant.  He should've asked Oliver or Thea to unlock the code to the basement door first, rather than engaging in unnecessary destruction of private property.

 

Depends on the type of warrant issued. It can be a no-knock warrant, which gives them the right to bust in without any type of warning to the party.

 

I don't think the ADA/Vigilante thing should make a difference. It's crazy that they would allow Laurel into the Foundry and go out as BC, but not tell her about Roy because they are afraid for her job. It's all or nothing.

 

I think they wanted it to be an emotional Team Arrow moment and they don't know how to write her in to that. Which to me is kinda crazy because they did establish some kind of partnership between her and Roy. They could have had Roy at least say 'Tell Laurel bye for me.' 

[KirkB]

Granted, Malcolm has been established as pants-pooping afraid of R'as.  Is that why he did nothing?  Or did he legit let his only child be killed because "I couldn't have stopped it, I would have just died with her, and you may bring her back by LP, but not me"?

 

 

Knowing Malcolm, almost certainly the latter. He might have even been watching, knowing full well about the LP and that Oliver would move heaven and earth to bring Thea back. 

 

I don't imagine Laurel knew about the plan with Roy. For one thing I'm not sure there was time, and for another why bother? She wasn't going to be involved. 

 

Lance was going to break the door down no matter what. Warrant or not even if he had asked politely we all know Oliver would have refused. 

 

As for Roy's costume, we don't know where he's going or what he's doing. He may not need/want to be Arsenal anymore. But even if he does, let's face it. His suit is basically a red hooded sweatshirt and a mask. Shouldn't be too hard to recreate.

[Password]

When the SCPD broke down the door I immediately thought "gee that's a thin door". Why do I imagine it being thicker and more solid.

[MaggieG]

My first thoughts were that QL needs to chillax. He's getting way too worked up and I worry for him. Oliver's reactions to Ray were everything in this episode, especially during the awkward high five! And we need more Diggle!

I will definitely miss Roy, he was a great addition to Team Arrow, at least with him not being dead, they can bring him back for future episodes.

Malcolm continues to be creepy but not really any help to anyone.

Laurel is good at lawyering. Although Roy was never actually charged. Can they charge him for this crimes now that he's "dead"? His fight with the inmates was awesome but some of the scenes you could tell it was a stuntman and not Colton H. I know they use stuntmen for most of the fight scenes but it seemed glaringly obvious. Their hair wasn't even the same.

I'm also over Raylicity but if we ever do get Olicity I really hope that relationship doesn't get screwed up by Oliver's brooding and Felicity's annoyance. They could make a great power couple if they just get over their own shit! Felicity has always been a favorite of mine, the last few episodes haven't done her any favors. Hopefully the writers get back on track with her. All in all, I thought it was a great episode.

Next week, Lazarus Pit!

[apinknightmare]

I don't think the ADA/Vigilante thing should make a difference. It's crazy that they would allow Laurel into the Foundry and go out as BC, but not tell her about Roy because they are afraid for her job. It's all or nothing.

I didn't think they'd keep it from her for fear of her job, but really, when someone fakes their death, the less people who know about it, the better. Laurel wasn't part of the plan, so seems like it'd just be a good idea, generally speaking, to keep her in the dark about it. Those Lances do seem to take nasty turns. Edited April 17, 2015 by apinknightmare

[KirkB]

I forgot to add I liked the fact that when they realized they were dealing with a metahuman Oliver's first thought was to call Barry. Sure, Felicity shot the idea down pretty quickly but at least they did express one of our concerns.

[Delphi]

When the SCPD broke down the door I immediately thought "gee that's a thin door". Why do I imagine it being thicker and more solid.

Because it used to be a huge door with a giant electrical lock? Why would you have an electric lock for a weak wooden door. Why was lair so accessible? I was always under the impression that it was slightly separated from the main structure.

[catrox14]

Just coming by to say, upon rewatch, I really almost love this episode. Even Ray....and I didn't hate Laurel..so..yay?

 

I think if Ray had been introduced as this nerdy guy without the creepy stalker phase with Felicity...I wouldn't have disliked him at all. I legit laughed with some of his scenes...and the constant Oliver eye-rolling was just comedy gold. And that's the kind of comedy I like in this show. The laughs come from the straight man's reactions.

I think now maybe Ray will actually be the floater.

 

Re did Laurel know.....I'm going with she didn't know.  Because her not knowing leaves her with plausible deniability.  If she knew that Roy was alive then her ADA status and whatever sympathy she has from Quentin is lost because she will have aided and abetted a known fugitive from justice because she did not turn him in. 

Edited April 17, 2015 by catrox14

[tv echo]

Laurel didn't turn in mass murderer Malcolm Merlyn, or reveal that he's alive & back in Starling City, even though she's an ADA.  The inconsistencies in Laurel's character are why I can see the EPs spinning it either way as to whether or not she knew about Roy's plan.

Edited April 17, 2015 by tv echo

[kismet]

Upon reflection after a decent day at work, I will say that I did love the episode for all of the team arrow interactions. Appreciated that d/f & especially ray were willing to sacrifice so much for oq. They really are family that love each other, so that was beautiful to see! Never realized that ch contract was coming to an end, so if he had to go-- it was a beautiful touching send off. Also love that it leaves the door open for him to return in present day for guests or arcs. Would have been too sad & depressing if they just killed another character off for reasons. Its nice to see them come back when they make sense to the plot. I seriously think the only reason they made up a twin for shado is because they missed Celina jade & had now way to bring back shado. At least now they won't have to so that with roy.

[Richness]

This was the first episode that I've really enjoyed this season. There have been a few others that I didn't hate, but none that were actually liked.

 

I fell for Roy's death, hook, line, and sinker, so I was extremely pleased with the fake out. Roy is the only character that I haven't hated at one time or another this season. I'm equally surprised that Colton Haynes was able to rise to this level of acting given his Teen Wolf/model roots. Roy has been the MVP of the season, and I loved his kick-ass prison fight scene. While I'm sad to see him leave the show., I'm just glad he isn't dead.

 

On the other hand, just when I was starting to really like Thea, they have to go and kill her off. Sure, she'll be back, but she apparently will never be the same again. Oh well.

 

While I'm thrilled there's been some major repercussions for lieing to Captain Lance, I am so over his personal vendetta against the Arrow. The line about Roy's death being Oliver's fault was such a low blow for Quentin to make. I really hope they get him past this soon, and without killing him off.

 

Also didn't hate Ray or Laurel in this episode. While I thought his visit with the Flash brought that show down a bit, he did a pretty decent job as the inexperienced new hero. Either that, or I just enjoyed seeing him get his ass kicked. Like everyone else, I loved Oliver's snarkiness with Ray. While I can't really comment on the quality of Katie's acting, Laurel is best when she's being a competent layer, and in small doses.

 

The only other thing that I can possibly add is my delight with the episode title. "Broken Arrow" hits on so many things with this episode. From the broken state Team Arrow is currently in, to the "death" of its team members, to Quentin breaking the Arrow cave. In some small ways, it also fits with the definition of a nuclear accident with the laser/energy eyed villain. I almost wish they could have gotten Robbie Amell over from the Flash as Firestorm "the Nuclear Man", but that would have required some serious plot gymnastics, and probably have ruined the episode. One bad acting acronymed wanna-be superhero (Ray) is enough, thanks.

[statsgirl]

I think they wanted it to be an emotional Team Arrow moment and they don't know how to write her in to that. Which to me is kinda crazy because they did establish some kind of partnership between her and Roy. They could have had Roy at least say 'Tell Laurel bye for me.' 

I think it's a combination of a number of things -- making it a Team Arrow moment, which Laurel isn't really a part of the way Roy is, who has been emotionally there since before mirakuru (he was leaving arrows in the alley way when he had a message for The Hood) (notice that Thea wasn't there either), partly because Laurel is ADA and the few people know the better, especially for her sake with plausible deniability, and because she's still a loose cannon in terms of planning.

 

There also seemed to be a pulling back to Original Team Arrow here, just Oliver, Diggle and Felicity sending Roy off, just as there had been "This started with the three of us. It's time see got back to that".at the end of season 2.  In the Behind the Scenes, following a tweet from David Ramsey about O/D/F being the core of the show, we've been debating whether MG knows that too.  Looking at this episode, I think he does; the Team Arrow of Oliver/Diggle/Felicity is the bread-and-butter of this show, and while they mess things up during the season, introducing new characters and alienating others, it seems like the EPs pull back to the core Team Arrow group at May sweeps time to bring viewers back and keep them interested for the next season.

 

I don't know why MG thought that Laurel going against her father is going to great lengths since she's been opposing him since season 1, but I'll take it.  Another reason why I think they didn't tell her the plan.

[Genki]

I think MG is very aware that OG Team Arrow is popular, he has equivocated about how things need to evolve answered more than 1 question about "when can the show go back to that dynamic" since his tumblr account opened. It's just a shame that the wrong Team Arrow interloper (IMO) was written out the show.

 

I agree with @Kismet the Ray propping was too damn much, he really didn't need the hero speech and hero propping moment from Oliver. I hope all their future interactions will be with filled with Oliver Queen snark that was gold and hopefully he won't have to play nice for Felicity's sake soon. I like that Oliver/Barry is a strong Big Bro/Little Bro vibe, it make sense to me that Oliver/Ray will be more along the lines of his relationship to Carter Bowen. OQ eye-rolling every future mention of Ray, for the win.

 

The Ray/Cisco scene while obviously designed for it's spin-off building purposes, show a better geek bond than Felicity/Ray's ever did. While there is a lot of overlap, there is a difference between Engineering Geek and IT Geek, trust me I know.

 

Stephen and Colton really brought the "trying to, but can't be suppressed" feels to this episode, and that glisten unshed man-tears in their eyes, I really felt it.

 

I never realised until this episode that I needed more Lance/Roy bonding but I think they would have been an interesting dynamic to explore & I'm bummed we're not going to get it now. Poor PB he has been stranded a lot on the Isle of Lies & Deception this season. 

 

I cannot emphasis enough how hot SA looked shadow boxing, but please only lay hands on Diggle when you want to give Bro-hugs Oliver. Speaking of which, it was especially weird that Oliver didn't hug Roy because he hugged him in 3.09. It's not big enough a deal that it will eat away at me but I wonder about why they chose that direction.

 

After so many missed opportunities it finally feels like  the season is going somewhere and we are no longer treading water.

Edited April 18, 2015 by Genki

[Chaser]

Ray Palmer = Carter Bowen. That's gold.

[catrox14]

 

I cannot emphasis enough hot SA looked shadow boxing,

 

Oh, man. I'm glad I'm not alone in how damn hot that was. WHEW /fans self

[Genki]

Oh, man. I'm glad I'm not alone in how damn hot that was. WHEW /fans self

 

I'l just leave this here....

 

 

Full Set