The DC Extended Universe: To Thanagar and Beyond!

[Spartan Girl]

17 hours ago, BetterButter said:

The Joker Origin Story On Deck: Todd Phillips, Scott Silver, Martin Scorsese Aboard WB/DC Film

A-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-oh-hee-ha-ha-ha...

And I thought MY jokes were bad.

[BetterButter]

‘The Batman’ is ‘Not Part of the DC Extended Universe,’ Says Matt Reeves

[starri]

Make up your damned minds, people. 

This is confusing to me, and I can talk about the intricacies that make the post-Zero Hour DCU different from the post-Convergeance/pre-Rebirth one. 

[BetterButter]

'Crazy, Stupid, Love' Filmmakers to Write, Direct Joker and Harley Quinn Movie

[GHScorpiosRule]

On 8/22/2017 at 6:49 PM, BetterButter said:

The Joker Origin Story On Deck: Todd Phillips, Scott Silver, Martin Scorsese Aboard WB/DC Film

Why? WhyWhyWhyWhyyyyyyy????!!!

???

9 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

A-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-oh-hee-ha-ha-ha...

And I thought MY jokes were bad.

And I can't tell if you think this news is a joke...??? And mocking??? Cuz, if so, then I won't feel so alone!

[Spartan Girl]

8 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Why? WhyWhyWhyWhyyyyyyy????!!!

???

And I can't tell if you think this news is a joke...??? And mocking??? Cuz, if so, then I won't feel so alone!

Yup, I was mocking it. In reality I'm just as horrified as you.

[MarkHB]

12 hours ago, starri said:

This is confusing to me, and I can talk about the intricacies that make the post-Zero Hour DCU different from the post-Convergeance/pre-Rebirth one. 

I quit collecting comics in 1997 for several reasons, but one of those was that, with the endless post-Crisis tweaking, I just didn't care anymore.  Also, Parallax. :<

Re: the Joker / Joker and Harley / The Batman stories, Deadline and THR were going crazy last night with posts and retractions.  I think the latest is that the relationship of Reeve's Bat-movie to the rest of the DCEU is "unclear," and that "Joker and Harley" does not replace "Gotham City Sirens," which still has David Ayer attached to direct (and on which Margot Robbie is a producer, and I think a primary driver of the project).  It occurs to me that it's also possible that "Sirens," with its presumed dramatis personae including Catwoman and Poison Ivy, could conflict with what Reeves wants to do with The Batman or the Joss Whedon Batgirl flick.

[starri]

[MarkHB]

Chris at Batman News is largely positive about the DCEU, but after last night he sent this out...

[MarkHB]

Matt Reeves spoke up... The Batman will be part of the DCEU, and what he meant was that it won't be messing around with cameos from Diana or Clark or Ambush Bug or Blue Devil or whoever... it'll be a pure Batman movie.

[Zuleikha]

The Harley/Joker movie sounds horrible and makes me concerned for Gotham City Sirens (even more than I already was about David Ayers directing!). I don't feel that the people involved in DCEU have any sense of what Harley represents to a lot of her female fans (with the caveat that yes, there are certainly female fans who view Harley/Joker as a fractured fairy tale romance). And I am really unhappy that every non-WW movie with female protagonists with listed credits so far is being written and directed by men, especially as there are currently no male protagonists being written or directed by women.

My main hope for Gotham City Sirens is that Robbie advocated it and Robbie was very vocal about her discomfort with the way Harley was sexualized. Hopefully, she can push for a more WW-style approach. But I see nothing good from the current description of Harley/Joker. It's not a romance! It's a tale of a woman waking up to and escaping domestic abuse!

[HunterHunted]

On 5/2/2017 at 5:14 PM, GHScorpiosRule said:

I grew up watching the 70's cartoons and even though I was an adult when Bruce Timm came along with Batman: The Animated Series, Superman: The Animated Series, Justice League, Justice League Unlimited, I was ECSTATIC. First, because THIS was the Batman that needed to be seen. As well as all the other DC heroes in Justice League and Justice League Unlimited. Other than Super Friends, every other iteration of Superman was spot on. And of course Lynda Carter's Wonder Woman was AWESOME! Even if she couldn't fly. I even remember when I watched Super Friends after Timm's versions, I CRINGED, and couldn't believe I got up to watch that show after? before? My FAVORITE SHOW, The Bugs Bunny and Tweety Show on Saturday mornings!

One of my dad's co-workers is a huge fan of the Timmverse. He grew up watching the 70s cartoons too. When B:TAS was on, he'd always volunteer to watch the kids when the kids were "watching cartoons." The kids were 3 years and 9 months old. His kids grew up watching the Timmverse. There are 2 generations of fans in his house. I lent my brother's kids my Timmverse DVDs. The kids like the shows, but my sister in law fell in love with them in her 40s.

I'm still perplexed that Warner film wouldn't let the film folks talk to the animation folks. The animation people have 25 years of adapting these properties. Whether the film folks use any of the ideas from the animation people is not material, but to completely ignore an obvious resource is maddening. I also find it hilarious that the film folks ignored the animation group, but still used the characters that the animation group created like Harley Quinn and Mercy Graves.

On 6/10/2017 at 9:40 AM, darkestboy said:

It's been four movies so far, but ranking them, I'd go ....

1: Wonder Woman

2: Batman V. Superman: Dawn Of Justice

3: Suicide Squad

4: Man Of Steel

This wouldn't be my order at all. My order would be:

1. Wonder Woman
2. Man of Steel
3. Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice
4. Suicide Squad

As much as I hated Man of Steel, the sheer incompetence of the story telling in Dawn of Justice and Suicide Squad pushes Man of Steel to the second spot.

Every time I hear about Gotham City Sirens, Flashpoint, or Joker: Origins, I want to scream at WB to put together more than a single good superhero movie before you decide to be experimental.

Edited September 6, 2017 by HunterHunted

[Bruinsfan]

Yeah, that would be my order too, with an extra blank paragraph return or two between the first and second and about 15 between the second and third.

[BetterButter]

‘Suicide Squad 2’: Gavin O’Connor to Write and Direct Sequel

[darkestboy]

I'm really hoping the Harley/Joker and Scorsese Joker movies never see the light of day.

Neither of them are needed.

Shazam is supposed to be the next DCEU movie to be filmed, it's that we should be getting information on by now.

[MarkHB]

14 hours ago, darkestboy said:

I'm really hoping the Harley/Joker and Scorsese Joker movies never see the light of day.

Neither of them are needed.

The Scorcese one is out-of-continuity with the DCEU (effectively Elseworlds), and I think WB is trying to make it happen for the sake of getting someone like DiCaprio into a superhero movie.  It's probably

So far as Joker/Harley goes, my speculation is that they'll make Suicide Squad 2 (which can't even start filming until the end of next year because Will Smith is booked until then) first, and then Joker/Harley as a bridge to Gotham City Sirens, which they're pushing out because (again, speculation on my part) Matt Reeves maybe wants Catwoman or Ivy in one of his Batman films, and those will then need to line up with GCS.

[starri]

It occurred to me the other day that the MCU would not exist without RDJ.

Should the DCEU continue to exist in anything near its present form, it's going to be because of Gal Gadot.  I wonder if it bothers Ben Affleck that instead of Batman being the lynchpin to the entire exercise, it's Wonder Woman instead.  I know he's apparently so miserable, but he's freaking Batman.

[GHScorpiosRule]

So I just watched this podcast hosted by MichaelFUCKING!Rosenbaum, interviewing Tom Welling (Inside of Tom Welling) and Rosenbaum reveals that Snyder approached him about playing Lex Luthor in his movie. And Rosenbaum was all for it and willing to do it! I'd like to know who the fucktoids were that nixed this!!!?????

It's a NO-BRAINER!!!!

Found the link and inserted it. The podcast is about an hour and a half.

Edited September 13, 2017 by GHScorpiosRule
provided link

[starri]

So, the Wonder Woman Blu-Ray includes "Epilogue: Etta's Mission," which is a delightful little scene, but I'm sure it was intended as a Marvel-style post-credits sequence.

Spoiler

Etta gets Sam, Charlie, and the Chief back together for a mission (that she's leading!) to recover "something" that was found after Diana's battle with Ares.  The team is to find it and make sure it gets to the Americans because AMERICA!!!!!

Anyway, as she pulls out the dossier to show them, there's a drawing of the Something.

It's a Motherbox.

[Captain Carrot]

On 9/13/2017 at 11:01 AM, GHScorpiosRule said:

So I just watched this podcast hosted by MichaelFUCKING!Rosenbaum, interviewing Tom Welling (Inside of Tom Welling) and Rosenbaum reveals that Snyder approached him about playing Lex Luthor in his movie. And Rosenbaum was all for it and willing to do it! I'd like to know who the fucktoids were that nixed this!!!?????

It's a NO-BRAINER!!!!

Found the link and inserted it. The podcast is about an hour and a half.

I'm not defending it, but my guess is that they thought people would be confused by having the 'Smallville' Lex Luthor appears as Lex Luthor in a different continuity.

[Bruinsfan]

I like Rosenbaum, but I'd have been dubious about his casting for those reasons. Though anyone would probably have been better than what we got.

[MarkHB]

Parker Young (Oliver's campaign manager from S4 of Arrow) has an audition tape for Shazam.

[dusang]

I don't understand what's happening with Ben Affleck -- does he not want to be part of it anymore? does DC not want him to be part of it anymore but they don't want to publicly announce that until they've cleared his contract? What is going on? I did hate BvS but not because of Affleck, if anything he was a pleasant surprise in the middle of a nightmare.

[MarkHB]

15 hours ago, dusang said:

I don't understand what's happening with Ben Affleck -- does he not want to be part of it anymore? does DC not want him to be part of it anymore but they don't want to publicly announce that until they've cleared his contract? What is going on? I did hate BvS but not because of Affleck, if anything he was a pleasant surprise in the middle of a nightmare.

As best I can tell (and I have absolutely zero contacts in the film industry, so this is garnered from various online sources):

• Ben was signed to a 3-picture deal, just as the rest of the principal players were.  Those were originally going to be BvS, JL Part 1 and JL Part 2 (the SS cameo doesn't count), but when the latter was cancelled they decided to go ahead with The Batman.
• Ben was going to direct and star in that film.  I think he withdrew mostly because of common sense (these movies are just too big for the director, who's in charge of everything on-set, to try to act in them as well); the rest of what was going on in his life (the reception of BvS, his then-faltering marriage) may have played a part as well.
• WB then brought in Matt Reeves, who is coming in with very strong ideas about what he wants to make, and is apparently planning a Bat-trilogy.  Ben may not want to sign for those 2 additional movies (and I have no idea if WB has any options for an eventual JL2, etc.), which throws everything up in the air (do they keep Ben and then switch him out for the sequels, or go with someone else from the start?).
• The rumored Jocaprio movie is entirely separate from any of this; it's planned to be an Elseworlds.

As of right now, Ben's saying he enjoys playing Batman, and is happy to continue as long as WB wants him to.  I have no specific reason to doubt him when he says that, and I enjoyed what he's done with the character, so I hope he does continue.

Incidentally, some rumors have come out regarding the cancelled Affleck script for The Batman...

Spoiler

Apparently, it was going to be based on the 1997 Michael Douglas movie The Game, and according to Umberto Gonzalez, “Sources tell me it’s inspired by The Game, where Deathstroke is setting up all these traps and beating the crap out of (Batman),”  Joe Manganiello, who was going to play Deathstroke, replied to a Tweet related to that with a crossed-swords emoji, so there may be something to it.

[PepSinger]

On 9/13/2017 at 11:01 AM, GHScorpiosRule said:

So I just watched this podcast hosted by MichaelFUCKING!Rosenbaum, interviewing Tom Welling (Inside of Tom Welling) and Rosenbaum reveals that Snyder approached him about playing Lex Luthor in his movie. And Rosenbaum was all for it and willing to do it! I'd like to know who the fucktoids were that nixed this!!!?????

It's a NO-BRAINER!!!!

Found the link and inserted it. The podcast is about an hour and a half.

Thank you for this. It is truly a gift. Love me some Tom Welling and Michael Rosenbaum. Also, they were very stupid not to get Michael to play Lex Luthor. However, maybe it's better that he was spared association with that movie.

[MarkHB]

HUGE article on where DC and WB are going with the movie universe.  Very interesting bit of history (just after talking about the appointment of Lee and DiDio as co-publishers of DC Comics and their successful launch of the New 52):

Quote

Nelson and her team didn’t have — and would never have — that kind of direct influence over any of the other mediums in which their superheroes appeared. When it came to all other divisions, Nelson would have to play nice. That meant a need for a new role, one whose borders would be blurry and whose responsibilities would be multitudinous: a chief creative officer who would act as liaison to the rest of Warner. Johns was DC’s golden boy at the time, penning hit stories about the company’s biggest characters and stoking interest in many of their lesser-known ones, too. What’s more, he had Hollywood experience: Before working at DC, he’d been an intern and production assistant for production house Donners’ Company. After a series of conversations, Nelson concluded that she’d found in Johns a perfect candidate and anointed him as her CCO.

[HunterHunted]

2 hours ago, MarkHB said:

HUGE article on where DC and WB are going with the movie universe.  Very interesting bit of history (just after talking about the appointment of Lee and DiDio as co-publishers of DC Comics and their successful launch of the New 52):

I read the piece and as always Warners came to the wrong conclusion about Wonder Woman. Yes, a shared universe can be unwieldy and confusing. However, the most important parts of adapting these properties for animation, tv, or film is understanding the characters and having a decent script. After that, everything else is extra.

For example, Jonathan Kent in Smallville and Man of Steel are overprotective of Clark. They go to insane lengths to protect him from being found out and imprisoned and experimented upon. Both are willing to give their lives to protect Clark. However in Smallville, Jonathan and Clark get to have a dialogue about how Jonathan's ultimate goal was to raise Clark to be a good man and how strongly Clark feels that to be a good man, he must use his powers. Jonathan would come to accept Clark's decision. Jonathan's death is an affirmation of his good job parenting Clark and the fundamental decency of Clark. Whereas in Man of Steel, Clark begins helping people again because of his failure to save his father. It's very much Spider-Man's superhero origin--one driven from shame and guilt. And Jonathan's death is basically pointless and runs counter to what we think Clark's morals and values should be.

Smallville is a deeply flawed show, but it had a much better understanding of its characters than the DCEU.

[HunterHunted]

On 9/20/2017 at 1:00 PM, MarkHB said:

Parker Young (Oliver's campaign manager from S4 of Arrow) has an audition tape for Shazam.

He was hilarious on Imposters. He played a sort of douchey doofus. He'd be pretty good as the Big Red Cheese.

On 9/22/2017 at 9:42 AM, PepSinger said:

Thank you for this. It is truly a gift. Love me some Tom Welling and Michael Rosenbaum. Also, they were very stupid not to get Michael to play Lex Luthor. However, maybe it's better that he was spared association with that movie.

I can't imagine that he would have completed filming. I can't imagine that he wouldn't have left because of creative differences. Eisenberg played Lex as quite manic. Snyder had no problems with the performance. I don't know that Rosenbaum would have played Lex the same way. If Snyder had wanted Rosenbaum to play Lex as manic the entire film, I suspect Snyder wouldn't have been happy with Rosenbaum. 

Eisenberg'sportrayal never worked for me because he presents the wrong way to military and elected officials. They are just used to getting information a certain and manic hipsters is not that way. It's highly unlikely that they would have even talked to him about creating Doomsday without putting a defense contractor and lobbyist  who they would be comfortable dealing with in between them and Lex.

[Fukui San]

5 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

I read the piece and as always Warners came to the wrong conclusion about Wonder Woman. Yes, a shared universe can be unwieldy and confusing. However, the most important parts of adapting these properties for animation, tv, or film is understanding the characters and having a decent script. After that, everything else is extra.

For example, Jonathan Kent in Smallville and Man of Steel are overprotective of Clark. They go to insane lengths to protect him from being found out and imprisoned and experimented upon. Both are willing to give their lives to protect Clark. However in Smallville, Jonathan and Clark get to have a dialogue about how Jonathan's ultimate goal was to raise Clark to be a good man and how strongly Clark feels that to be a good man, he must use his powers. Jonathan would come to accept Clark's decision. Jonathan's death is an affirmation of his good job parenting Clark and the fundamental decency of Clark. Whereas in Man of Steel, Clark begins helping people again because of his failure to save his father. It's very much Spider-Man's superhero origin--one driven from shame and guilt. And Jonathan's death is basically pointless and runs counter to what we think Clark's morals and values should be.

Smallville is a deeply flawed show, but it had a much better understanding of its characters than the DCEU.

It's so true. It's not that they have a shared universe, it's that they had a shared tone and it's a tone that clashed with the majority of the DC movies. I've soured on Zach Snyder's Watchmen, but I admit the tone was close to being in the neighborhood of correct for a Watchmen adaptation. Grim, grandiose, humorless, self-important. The comic isn't that far off. This approach could arguably be successfully used in a Batman movie, since that's on the darker side of the DC universe and under some comics regimes got that dark and more. But a Zach Snyder tone of ultra violence, moral apathy, and dark and gritty for the sake of dark and gritty is anathema for Superman, Wonder Woman, and most of the Justice League.  I'm not sure they've learned this yet despite the success of Wonder Woman.

[stealinghome]

I don't disagree, but a few parts of the article caught my eye:

Quote

As Nelson puts it, “Moving forward, you’ll see the DC movie universe being a universe, but one that comes from the heart of the filmmaker who’s creating them.”

Translation: "we realized Snyder's gritty gritty grimdark style is actually awful and unpopular and want directors to do something other than be gritty gritty grimdark!"

Quote

Nelson and Johns faced further cinematic frustration: During the development of Man of Steel, they were marginalized creatively. It was a decidedly gritty take on Superman, and its final battle featured him remorselessly destroying skyscrapers and ultimately executing his foe, General Zod. This didn’t sit right with Johns. “Geoff Johns and Diane were reading scripts, and Geoff Johns, to his credit, was concerned that there was not enough lightness or humor, given who the character is,” recalls one person with knowledge of the making of Man of Steel. “Geoff definitely raised that point, but that current administration didn’t care that much about what Geoff Johns thought.” The movie came out in June 2013 with the DC Entertainment branding, but largely without its fingerprints.... Johns’s warnings about needing lightness were going unheeded.... But a week before Rebirth debuted, a bomb was dropped. Johns had flown to New York to talk to reporters about the comics initiative, but he found himself mobbed by questions wholly unrelated to the funnybooks. Reports had emerged overnight that Johns was no longer just a creative liaison to the rest of Warner Bros. and that he’d been paired with studio exec Jon Berg to oversee Warner’s superhero-movie output. The message was clear to anyone paying attention: The recent critical failure of Batman v Superman had spooked the powers that be, and a change in the leadership structure was necessary. Having found success in TV and comics, the experts at DC Entertainment were being called in alongside Berg to bring their skills to a new arena. Johns — and his boss, Nelson — had just adopted a problem child.

Translation: after BvS, the WB said "hey, actually we maybe don't know what we're doing and maybe Snyder's gritty grimdark style is REALLY awful and unpopular. Save us from our bad mistakes!!!!"

I seriously don't know why anyone thought doubling down on Snyder after Man of Steel was a good idea (and I liked Man of Steel). The WB is going to be paying for that decision for years.

[starri]

9 hours ago, Fukui San said:

the tone was close to being in the neighborhood of correct for a Watchmen adaptation.

Of course it was, he literally just translated Dave Gibbons' art onto the screen.

[Bruinsfan]

If only Gibbons had foreseen the future and compensated to prevent the "Hellelujah" scene and Matthew Goode's hair!

Quote

As Nelson puts it, “Moving forward, you’ll see the DC movie universe being a universe, but one that comes from the heart of the filmmaker who’s creating them.”

I don't think the problems with BvS and Man of Steel were about not coming from the filmmaker's heart. I've seen interviews where Snyder basically said Superman had to die to get him out of Batman's way so the latter could be the leader of the Justice League, indicating where his actual interest lay in that narrative. Also ones where he was chortling about ultraviolence, collateral damage, and Batman's trauma over Robin's death so gleefully that I assume the interview was cut short when he started unzipping. What we got on the screen was exactly what he intended.

[Fukui San]

Yup. As weird as it is to hear about Star Wars and Marvel movie directors getting shitcanned at all stages of production, the impetus for those firings seem to be the studios reigning in directors creativity in favor of hewing to the company's vision and respecting the history of the characters and overall universe. The company can and will pull rank on the directors  

We're robbed of true visionary work like whatever Edgar Wright would have done with Ant Man, but we get good consistent quality product so far instead with no outright disasters. 

[stealinghome]

Agreed--I think it probably balances out in the long run, and as it's ultimately the studios' bottom line/brand name on the line when they don't feel a project is going well, I can understand why they pull the trigger on changing directors when production isn't going the way they want it to. I'm sure Edgar Wright's Ant Man would have been more interesting than what was on-screen, and I would have loved to see a Thor: The Dark World where Patty Nelson was given a great deal of creative control (especially over the script, which was just a hot mess that the actors really salvaged). OTOH, I am quite sure Star Wars: Episode IX will be significantly better for getting rid of Colin Trevorrow. So, you know. It evens out.

That said, I agree that the problem with Man of Steel and BvS wasn't that they didn't come from Snyder's heart. It's that his heart was totally in the WRONG place when he worked on the movies. But I think you can also interpret that quote as wanting to get heart into the movies--Man of Steel and BvS didn't have much heart period.

DC/the WB need to get over their Batman fetish. Yes, it's a franchise that has been very profitable and (when Chris Nolan directs) critically acclaimed for you. But no, that doesn't mean every other superhero you put on screen has to be Batman-lite.

[Perfect Xero]

The news is about a month old but Whedon is getting a writing credit on Justice League, which would suggest that they've made fairly substantial changes to the movie since him came on for the re-shoots.

[Trini]

21 hours ago, stealinghome said:

DC/the WB need to get over their Batman fetish. Yes, it's a franchise that has been very profitable and (when Chris Nolan directs) critically acclaimed for you. But no, that doesn't mean every other superhero you put on screen has to be Batman-lite.

Or at least channel some of that fetish to other characters in the 'Bat family'. I know there are Batgirl and Nightwing films in development, but I also wouldn't mind them trying again with Catwoman.

[MarkHB]

9 hours ago, Trini said:

I know there are Batgirl and Nightwing films in development, but I also wouldn't mind them trying again with Catwoman.

I have a gut feeling - and that's all it is - that Matt Reeves wants Catwoman and/or Poison Ivy for his Bat-movies, and that contributed to pushing out Gotham City Sirens, because he wants one or the other first.

[greenbean]

On 30/09/2017 at 7:01 PM, Bruinsfan said:

I've seen interviews where Snyder basically said Superman had to die to get him out of Batman's way so the latter could be the leader of the Justice League, indicating where his actual interest lay in that narrative.

I never knew he said this, but it doesn't surprise me one bit. It's what I've suspected. There is a deep disdain for Superman within DC Entertainment, which comes through in the movies, and is partly why the franchise hasn't fared well imo. It's telling that Marvel has made Captain America work, while DC flounders with Superman. Until someone who is truly interested in the boy scout gets ahold of his story, I can't see things getting better.

[MarkHB]

17 hours ago, greenbean said:

I never knew he said this, but it doesn't surprise me one bit. It's what I've suspected. There is a deep disdain for Superman within DC Entertainment, which comes through in the movies, and is partly why the franchise hasn't fared well imo. It's telling that Marvel has made Captain America work, while DC flounders with Superman. Until someone who is truly interested in the boy scout gets ahold of his story, I can't see things getting better.

I'm not sure that Snyder's original comment about Superman needing to die so Batman could form the JL was really born out of a disdain for Superman, though.  I think it's more that, within the religious framework that's driving the whole trilogy, JL is essentially the Acts of the Apostles.  The rest of the heroes need to find their own faith (in themselves, in this case) to carry on with Superman seemingly gone forever.

[MadyGirl1987]

On 9/30/2017 at 11:37 AM, stealinghome said:

DC/the WB need to get over their Batman fetish. Yes, it's a franchise that has been very profitable and (when Chris Nolan directs) critically acclaimed for you. But no, that doesn't mean every other superhero you put on screen has to be Batman-lite.

This! So much this! They seemed to take away the wrong lessons from the success of the Dark Knight trilogy. People, didn't like it because it was dark and gritty, they liked what they did with the character and story. When you try to replicate that with all of your characters, no matter whether it fits, it's going to be bad. For that matter, who wants to watch a team where everyone is the same? Part of why the Avengers succeeded is you have the joining of many different personalities, and having those personalities interact and bounce off each other is part of what makes those team-ups entertaining to watch. 

[wingster55]

But the purpose of the trilogy was about Superman providing hope and ultimately being the beacon of light everyone looks to. It's what he strived to be but the cynicism of the world (a real world thing) prevented that. 

[BetterButter]

DC Villain 'Deathstroke' Movie in the Works from 'The Raid' Director

[HunterHunted]

On 10/8/2017 at 11:35 AM, wingster55 said:

But the purpose of the trilogy was about Superman providing hope and ultimately being the beacon of light everyone looks to. It's what he strived to be but the cynicism of the world (a real world thing) prevented that. 

The Trilogy of Man of Steel, Batman v Superman, and Justice League? That might have been their message, but it's a completely unearned message. They sure did a crap job at showing hope is the answer to cynicism.

In Man of Steel, Jonathan Kent is a profoundly cynical character who teaches Clark to put himself over the well being of others. That's a terrible selfish foundation upon which to build the legacy of Superman. Jonathan doesn't even get to utter an Uncle Ben like admonition such as "With great power comes great responsibility" to help guide Clark on his journey. That's left to hologram Jor El. And that's nonsense and bullshit. Snyder might have intended to portray hope vs cynicism, but the execution was lacking.

If Jonathan's message had been to help but not get caught, that would have been better. If Jonathan had died while both he and Clark were attempting to save people and Jonathan's head nod of "no" was to indicate that Clark should continue saving the people he was already helping rather than save Jonathan, that would be an affirmation of the hope vs cynicism message. If Clark had been shown to have been secretly helping people over the years creating an urban legend of the man who appears out of nowhere and saves people in superhuman ways, that would align with the message. When Perry White shoots down Lois' piece that is about Clark, it should be obvious that "the blue angel" is an urban legend that everyone is familiar with.

There needs to be a significant group (it doesn't need to be a majority) of the public who are vehemently opposed to the demonization of Superman to demonstrate that hope beats cynicism. They just need to show that others like Wonder Woman and the Flash would be encouraged by Superman's example to hero when Superman is gone. As it stands, the movies pay lip service to the idea, but undermines it at every point.

[Dee]

If Aquaman is DC's answer to Thor does that make The Flash DC's answer to Spiderman?

[BetterButter]

DC’s ‘Shazam!’ Taps Star Zachary Levi

[MarkHB]

2 hours ago, BetterButter said:

DC’s ‘Shazam!’ Taps Star Zachary Levi

I saw that, and I think you ought to know that I'm feeling very depressed. 

[darkestboy]

Levi seems like a good fit for Shazam and I'm more interested in that than movies centering on Black Adam, Deathstroke and Deadshot, who along with the Joker/Harley movies are things we do not need in the DCEU.

[HunterHunted]

On 10/27/2017 at 8:16 PM, MarkHB said:

I saw that, and I think you ought to know that I'm feeling very depressed. 

Levi wouldn't be my choice either. I probably would have gone with Parker Young or Billy Magnussen. And a dark horse that I'm not sure ever auditioned -- Ryan Hansen. I love Jake McDorman, but didn't think he was quite right for the part either.

Edited October 29, 2017 by HunterHunted

[Trini]

On 10/27/2017 at 9:16 PM, MarkHB said:

I saw that, and I think you ought to know that I'm feeling very depressed. 

Aw, I like him! Glad he's got a big starring role in something, because I've always thought he's very talented.

[MarkHB]

Having thought about it some more, I have no doubt that he can play the "kid in an adult body" aspect very well, and when an audition video leaked a few months ago I know one of the sides focused on that (the actor neglected to password:protect the video until after it made it to Batman News).  But I'm still doubtful that he'll be able to get big enough to make a fight with The Rock look convincing. I'm ready to be proven wrong, though, and FWIW I liked his work on Heroes Reborn.