S08.E03: First Week of School

[UsernameFatigue]

I think Jen's biggest problem is that Bill does not step in to back her up when she is trying to discipline. Of course Will 'prefers' Bill - he is the fun parent. What kid doesn't prefer the fun parent over the disciplinarian? None that I know of. Bill and Jen have a solid relationship, but the same scenario played out many times with my brother (the disciplinarian) and his wife who often openly went against what he would tell the kids. To no ones surprise they divorced. But even when my sis in law continued to spoil the kids and expect nothing from them other than good grades (they were both honour students through their academic lives) they turned into wonderful, successful and productive women who both married fabulous men and now have their own families.

 

The bottom line for me though is that if there were more parents like Bill and Jen - regardless of their medical issues or those of their kids - and I am including biological parents here - the world would be a much much better place.

[Adeejay]

It’s been said that when it comes to the delicate art of “parenting” the most judgmental are those that do not have children. 

[camom]

 

I am surprised that the school put him in a class with other children his age. It must be very hard for him. He isn't as mature as most 4 year olds.

 

Good point.  I have a developmentally delayed daughter.  When she went to preschool, she was in the class with children who were 6-12 months younger than she was and it worked well.  She would have been overwhelmed in a class where the children were her age or older.  

[Foghorn Leghorn]

When they were eating their lunch (take out) after swimming Jen mentioned school lasting for 2 hours.  I thought Jen saying the teacher/school mentioned Will was asking for both parents not just Bill was a little jab at Bill as she gave him the side eye when she said it almost making Bill acknowledge it "not just his Baba" or something like that.  

 

Jen keeps picking battles but she isn't winning the "war."  Will is dominant and is telling others how it is rather than them telling him.  His commands MINE, DON'T TOUCH to name a few were given often throughout the show and everyone OBEYED.   Bill laughed!  But the icing on the cake was Will telling Bill to SIT DOWN! MY POOL!  Bill promptly sat down and then laughed.  

 

The school won't tolerate his spoiled behavior for very long.  It was nice to hear Zoey did so well although I am surprised she didn't have a meltdown because she simply seems to hate new things.  She is talking really well.  Will at least is up to 2 words together.  Bill and Jen both had no idea what he was talking about when Will kept saying in a very baby voice POP POP POP when Zoey said rabbit (very clearly) and Will said "ibbitt".....twice weekly speech therapy is much needed.  I think many viewers are wondering if there is more to Will's lack of development. 

Edited December 17, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[toodles]

Bill and Jen hit the ground running as parents.  They are going to make mistakes.  All of us parents have. 

 

Those kids had a really rough start in life.  You don't overcome that in a few months.  It can take years. We only see a small peek at their lives.  I know it was their choice to do a tv show.  But maybe we don't see all the times the crackers go back in the pantry.  I'm just sayin'. 

[Barb23]

Good point.  I have a developmentally delayed daughter.  When she went to preschool, she was in the class with children who were 6-12 months younger than she was and it worked well.  She would have been overwhelmed in a class where the children were her age or older.

I was thinking the same thing. I assumed they would be in the same class, the lower aged one, until Jen said about visiting their "classes" ahead of time. And if Will isn't potty trained, I don't see how he is in the class he is in (3-4 yrs old) as most preschools require the children to be potty trained. (I know from experience when my son, who was potty trained, had an accident & teachers weren't thrilled.)

I also think Jen needs to talk to the kids in a more kid friendly type of way. She rambles on trying to explain things to them & the kids have already tuned her out. ( I don't mean baby talk) It may be from her being a doctor/instructor but with kids, sometimes simpler is better. When she was telling Will about how he shouldn't be afraid of school because they are always there for him, this is his home, etc. I was tuning her out.

[Absolom]

Goldfish-gate:  We don't know if production called Will over and gave him those goldfish.

You have to know that was my second thought right after why is he pilfering in the pantry right after "breakfast."  TLC has to love every time the viewers get completely involved in a scenario they have created. 

[gunderda]

I think Will and Zoey are too old for high chairs. Even though they still fit in them, I don't think they should use them. I think they should always sit at a table, like other kids their age.

We've seen them sit at the regular table in booster seats.  I think the high chairs are just for quick meals: breakfast and lunch.  Last season all dinner meals were at the dining table and they were not in high chairs. 

 

And since they can get in them themselves I think it just makes it easier.  I believe Bill had to put them both in and out of the boosters at the dining table. 

Edited December 17, 2014 by gunderda

[Foghorn Leghorn]

And since they can get in them themselves I think it just makes it easier.  I believe Bill had to put them both in and out of the boosters at the dining table. 

 

I think it is Bill's back.  They have to be lifted into the chairs with boosters and Jen can only lift Zoey for now.  It does seem odd Jen and Bill retreat behind the gate to watch and talk with the kids while they eat rather than sitting down somewhere or something.  The dogs have the run of the house, the gate was to keep the kids out of the kitchen.   

[NausetGirl]

Besides what other posters have said about Will being different than other kids at preschool, I do think Jen & Bill hit on something that Will relates school to the orphanage. I like how Bill said he thought Will would go to school with no problems & it's the exact opposite. Many kids have separation anxiety. My son had a preschool classmate who had to be peeled off her mother, crying the whole year. But once she was in room, she was fine.

 

After teaching young children for 30+ years I can vouch for the fact that virtually ALL kids are fine once the parents leave. Yes, some children certainly have more separation anxiety than others. Some get over it faster too, but everyone adjusts eventually, and most quite quickly. The biggest problem is often for the parents.  Part of them - somewhat understandably - wants to imagine that their child is just bereft without them. And they are the first few times they come to nursery school or kindergarten, but as I said, for the vast majority, this lasts a few minutes at most. Trouble is, most parents really don't want to hear this.  But it's true nonetheless. The child will get involved with whatever little groups might be doing, or explore the classroom, tinker with the piano, visit the pet corner, look at books etc. Instead of hoping their child will miss them, parents should view this as a very good marker. It indicates they've prepared the child well for his/her first step into the world. Any child who's not able to separate from his parents is in for a long difficult haul in life.

Edited December 18, 2014 by NausetGirl

[gunderda]

Goldfish-gate:  We don't know if production called Will over and gave him those goldfish.

To me it seemed that Jenn was in the pantry and Will was in there with her? Or maybe I wasn't watching very closely. 

 

Re: Will's bratiness. Yes , they were filming and I understand that plays into how much discipline Bill and Jen display on tv for fear of being criticized , however, it is obvious that this is not the first time we have seen that Will doesn't listen. I don't really think it has anything to do with the camera's. Will is a happy, fun, sweet kid when he is doing what he wants to do.   I actually think Bill is worse then Jen. At least she tries. Bill does nothing to correct their behavior at all.  Bill and Jen are lovely people,  they are just lousy disiplinarians. They have got to get a handle on it now because Will is going to grow much bigger and much heavier than Jen. All it will take is one accidental push or shove from Will and Jen could fall to the floor and easily get hurt.  And they need to control Will's weight. At just 5 yrs. old he is getting fat. They and other little people (Roloffs) have said how important it is for little people to watch their weight for health reasons. 

 

Pretty sure kids not listening are just a normal fact of life at that age. I know my nephews were like that, the one is currently in that stage, the other one is older and DOES listen now.  But when my oldest nephew was in that stage it was a constant battle of "can you have that??" with him telling me yes and that his dad said he could when I had just heard his dad say 5 min earlier that he could NOT have it. 

I think it is Bill's back.  They have to be lifted into the chairs with boosters and Jen can only lift Zoey for now.  It does seem odd Jen and Bill retreat behind the gate to watch and talk with the kids while they eat rather than sitting down somewhere or something.  The dogs have the run of the house, the gate was to keep the kids out of the kitchen.   

Yea i forgot about his back.  So they are mostly likely in the high chairs for all meals now.  (or at least were until the surgery happened)

[DkNNy79]

Jen keeps picking battles but she isn't winning the "war."  Will is dominant and is telling others how it is rather than them telling him.  His commands MINE, DON'T TOUCH to name a few were given often throughout the show and everyone OBEYED.   Bill laughed!  But the icing on the cake was Will telling Bill to SIT DOWN! MY POOL!  Bill promptly sat down and then laughed.  

 

Will told Bill to sit down with him in DC and Bill politely declined.  To me it seems like if something really bothered Bill and Jen they would address it. 

 

My co-worker's son went to a BOCES pre-school/daycare when he was 3 and they provided potty training in their program.  I thought that was unusual but what do I know.  None of the kids in my family growing up went to daycare.

Edited December 17, 2014 by DkNNy79

[NausetGirl]

Bill and Jen hit the ground running as parents.  They are going to make mistakes.  All of us parents have. 

 

Those kids had a really rough start in life.  You don't overcome that in a few months.  It can take years. We only see a small peek at their lives.  I know it was their choice to do a tv show.  But maybe we don't see all the times the crackers go back in the pantry.  I'm just sayin'. 

 

Yes, this occurred to me as well. I sincerely hope there are times when food is taken back to the pantry, and toys are taken away from Will. But since all we see are the situations in which Will gets his way, that's all we can think. I'm wondering if Bill and Jen are hesitant about being firm with Will because they're being filmed? I know we're not supposed to care what other people think, but come on - everyone really does, at least to varying extents. They might be concerned about being called out for being too severe - even if they weren't...

[ZoloftBlob]

I think Will is behind children his age by about 1 or 2 years. I am surprised that the school put him in a class with other children his age. It must be very hard for him. He isn't as mature as most 4 year olds. Maybe he would have fit in better and had more fun, if he was in Zoey's class.

 

Depends on the school's philosophy towards inclusion. Some schools prefer to have kids, even with special needs, to be kept in relatively same age groups so that the kids with different needs can see and model age appropriate behavior. Mind you, I don't know if one is better than another but thats why most schools have moved away from putting all the special kids in a self contained classroom.

[NausetGirl]

Depends on the school's philosophy towards inclusion. Some schools prefer to have kids, even with special needs, to be kept in relatively same age groups so that the kids with different needs can see and model age appropriate behavior. Mind you, I don't know if one is better than another but thats why most schools have moved away from putting all the special kids in a self contained classroom.

 

Completely agree - having a "special needs" child in any classroom can be a wonderful and enriching experience for even very young children. The special child may start out as a curiosity to the other kids, but with the right handling and support from teachers, principal and families, ends up as an accepted and valued member of the class just like everyone else. I've personally witnessed incidents that have made my eyes leak - many times. You haven't lived until you've seen a five-year old smile and pat the hand of a "special" little friend while sitting on the floor during story time. This is, IMO, the very best way to teach tolerance and compassion.

Edited December 18, 2014 by NausetGirl

[Foghorn Leghorn]

You have to know that was my second thought right after why is he pilfering in the pantry right after "breakfast."  TLC has to love every time the viewers get completely involved in a scenario they have created. 

 

Interesting but sad to think the kids and Bill and Jen are being exploited by the network.  Time for Bill and Jen to have a more active role in what happens on the show so it doesn't derail their parenting.  They know they don't want meltdowns on camera so they know Jen will take the easy way out so TLC wins again.  

Edited December 17, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[NausetGirl]

I think Will is behind children his age by about 1 or 2 years. I am surprised that the school put him in a class with other children his age. It must be very hard for him. He isn't as mature as most 4 year olds. Maybe he would have fit in better and had more fun, if he was in Zoey's class.

 

I think Will would definitely regress if placed in Zoey's group. He needs to be in a group of children closer to his own age so he'll learn to imitate their behavior. Although I must say I might have delayed school for WIll until his speech was more fluid and clearer. That would go a long way to helping him with the other kids in his classroom. He seems to be doing well speech-wise - maybe it wouldn't need to be a long delay. Start him by second semester - February maybe? I'll add also that if Will was mine, I'd want him to be evaluated by a school psychologist as well. I'd want his/her input on whether Will should start kindergarten next September.  Hopefully Bill and Jen have done that, or are looking into it.

Edited December 18, 2014 by NausetGirl

[NausetGirl]

I noticed this too, and I felt bad for Jen.  She's just not lovable in the same way as Bill is, she has all that nervous pressured speech.  You never see the kids cuddling with Mommy the way most kids would.  It makes me feel sad. 

 

She's also the one parent who at least attempts some firm discipline now and then. Of course the kids like Baba better. And who knows? Maybe it's going to be OK. They can laugh and cuddle with Baba - and get straightened out by Mom. As long as Bill and Jen back each other up in the parenting department, it might work.

[CPP83]

I think there are a slew of other reasons why Will struggled starting school that have nothing to do with how the other kids are or aren't accepting him or befriending him. He very well could be actively keeping away from them because they're strange kids he doesn't know.

 

Personally my first thought is that he's just sad.

 

He's separated from his parents and his sister, his three best friends in his head, the people he spends most of his time with day and night, the ones he travels with, eats with, plays with, sleeps with, but now he's around all these new people, it's a period of adjustment that every kid would go through and their unique experiences and adjustment periods will vary on a case by case basis.

 

I don't think anyone has had the exact same experience with school, regardless of age or development or even language skills.

 

From what I've seen of him Will appears to be the sort of kid that takes time getting used to things, he doesn't just automatically go right or left, he'll ponder and consider his options.

 

Just as Zoey had an easier time, there's no way to guess how your kid is going to react to something or someone new.

[Snow8585]

I hope they have multiple locks and even a security camera on the pool area. If Will decides he wants to go to HIS pool ("MINE"), they may have difficulty stopping him at some point. We have seen in previous episodes, he can pull furniture over to where he can push the elevator buttons and get into places in the house( like the pantry) when they are not looking. If Will manages to get into the pool area and into the water, I worry that Jen and Bill may not be able to get him out of the water. Is the Nanny around all the time?? Worse, suppose he attempts to dive into the pool in an area that is not deep and he hits his head or hurts his back?  I have certainly read a lot of tragic stories about little kids in pools. Bill mentioned that Will could be a bit of a daredevil in the pool. Despite what Jen and Bill say to the camera, they are having a great deal of trouble getting him to understand boundaries including pool rules.

[Libby]

I understand that it's easier for Bill and Jen if the children are in high chairs. However, babies use high chairs, not preschool children. I would love to let my grandchildren use sippy cups until they are twelve, but it's not appropriate. The same goes for Will and Zoey in high chairs. Difficult or not, they have to keep these children moving along.

[BitterApple]

If Will is truly having all these developmental issues (speech, food hoarding, lack of potty training, defiance, etc.) due to the orphanage, then quite frankly, he doesn't need to be on tv. Mileage varies, of course.

 

This is such a bitchy thought, but when Jen related the story about Will crying for his parents, I wondered if Will was really only crying for Bill and the teacher said it was both parents to spare Jen's feelings. If I was in that position, it's what I'd do.

[CPP83]

I understand that it's easier for Bill and Jen if the children are in high chairs. However, babies use high chairs, not preschool children. I would love to let my grandchildren use sippy cups until they are twelve, but it's not appropriate. The same goes for Will and Zoey in high chairs. Difficult or not, they have to keep these children moving along.

 

 

 

I don't see how using a highchair some of he time is going to affect these kids at all.

 

Will and Zoey know they have to get in their car-seats when they ride in the car, they have a special seat in their house for eating in at times, they aren't being dressed in onesies and given bottles and pacifiers like actual babies. 

 

Zoey and Will have limitations due to being little people, so do their parents and that doesn't just go away because they reach certain ages.

 

Right now Zoey and Will are still fairly young, they're still in diapers for the moment so I don't think that they can be kept to the milestones that average children their age reach for the time being. They need what they need specifically and Jen and Bill are dealing with things, I feel, in a very responsible way.

 

I don't think there is anything wrong on making things easier on themselves as parents whenever they can, but on the flip side Zoey and Will have needs that go beyond the average two or five year old and Jen and Bill have to attend to those as well as raising these kids age appropriately.

 

I believe they juggle a lot with trying to ensure that Will and Zoey are learning and growing and maturing while tending to their ranging issues as they go along.

 

Just like seeing Jen and Bill being able to enjoy riding around with the kids in their special cars solely because of their sizes.

 

No other average sized parent could actually ride side by side their child in one of those things, and Zoey and Will were having a blast with their Mommy and Daddy being able to join them in the fun on their level, on their terms. Even Bill said that at the end of the segment.

 

Imo it goes both ways with them, they have to make adjustments with their children based on size and strength but it also can be a positive and I think that those positives surely outweigh the negatives. 

Edited December 18, 2014 by CPP83

[Jellybeans]

What I saw was parents being parents and kids being kids.

Again, fish are involved.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Will is sucking his thumb more instead of less!!!   

[Equinox]

I feel strongly enough about some recent discussion that I feel the need to speak up. I have a special needs child. Intellectually he is intact but physically and developmentally he is way behind. He is three. He is in a school district run classroom for children with all kinds of disabilities or delays. There are several classrooms in the district divided by age.

Due to their stature and delays both Zoey and Will probably qualify for a similar program. Classrooms like my sons' have therapy incorporated into the school day. One of the teachers is a speech therapist. Physical therapy and occupational therapy take kids out for one on one time. The main teacher is certified in early childhood special education. The goal of the program is to prepare the children for mainstream kindergarten when they turn five or six.

I can certainly see the Kleins simply calling their kids' program "school". I seriously doubt the children are going to a commercial preschool, partially because their children would need special services. Both of them!

[mojito]

 

It’s been said that when it comes to the delicate art of “parenting” the most judgmental are those that do not have children.

Adeejay, you were reading my mind. I don't think supporting arguments of your own childhood are necessarily convincing as you know how times distorts the memory, and chances are you got away with things from time to time as well, and your parents probably made loads of mistakes, too.

[Snow8585]

I hope I am wrong, but i think Will is going to really struggle in school. Will was very clear when he said NO SCHOOL when Jen asked him about school and she looked surprised when he said NO when she asked if had made any friends. He said I Want DADDY. Maybe this is ,at some level, a reality check for Jen and Bill. Bill said he thought his son would essentially take the classroom by storm and just the opposite is going on. I recently read a medical journal article which unfortunately made me think of Will. Studies have shown that untreated sleep apnea can cause brain damage in kids and result in a lower IQ. I am not saying that this is the case with Will BUT the Kleins were very open in sharing with viewers the extent of Will's severe sleep apnea which had gone untreated until they entered the picture. So sadly, there could be a lot more contributing to his troubles in addtion to dwarfism.

[Fostersmom]

I have often wondered if they would have been approved for 2 dwarf children to adopt had they not had a modified home and full time nanny. There is no way, NO way, they could care for these kids on their own. Physically, they could not keep them safe or tend to their needs. If that was a factor, what happens if one loses a source of income, or a parent dies. If they lose the nanny? I am not saying the kids would have been better off in an orphanage...but can the 2 of them alone, or separate care for these 2 kids? I do not think they can.

 

And this is exactly why Amy Roloff lived in fear the state was going to try to take her kids away when she got pregnant. Bill and Jen could easily be two little people with very average jobs and little people children born naturally. Should no one without a high paying job and zero physical difficulties have kids? Life is a series of what ifs. NO ONE is guaranteed the life they start with is the life they end with. People lose jobs, people lose spouses, and people suffer catastrophic injuries every single day, and yet they manage to go on and survive. Based on your theory, no one should marry or have kids because god forbid a car accident happens and kills the breadwinner and leaving the other parent permanently disabled. Think about the children! Who is going to raise the children safely? The horror!

[Barb23]

NausetGirl - Maybe you could elaborate on this with your experience and do you agree? My son's preschool teacher explained that in the 3 yr old class, the children play side by side without too much interaction between them. In the 4 yr old class, they interact with each other, make friends, include & exclude others in a group, etc. I guess the difference is due to age.

I wonder if Jen & Bill explained to Will & Zoey's classmates about the differences in them, explaining how they walk differently, may need help in doing things, using the step stool, etc. I remember in one of their first episodes, Jen & Bill visited a classroom & explained their conditions to the students. I don't remember why they were invited, but Bill seemed to make everyone feel at ease in his explanations, even throwing in some jokes.

[MissT]

Changing the subject off the kids for a bit.  Did anyone else notice that Jen's mom looks like she had a little work done - if you know what I mean?  Her hair is different and her face looks a bit tight. 

[Snow8585]

im guessing she had botox on the forehead and maybe a chemical peel on her face to tighten skin and reduce wrinkles. maybe more but im not a doctor.

[Barb23]

IIRC, on Dont be Tardy, Kim & Kroy's oldest son KJ who I think is around 4, still sits in a highchair, as well as the 2 yr old. KJ is a big kid & it's funny when he scoots himself around it in. It's not like he jumps in the younger one's chair to play around, he's been shown eating in it. I think that is more strange. With Will & Zoey, since their chairs are much lower to the ground, I think of them as toddler chairs, not high chairs & don't see any problem.

[NausetGirl]

I feel strongly enough about some recent discussion that I feel the need to speak up. I have a special needs child. Intellectually he is intact but physically and developmentally he is way behind. He is three. He is in a school district run classroom for children with all kinds of disabilities or delays. There are several classrooms in the district divided by age.

Due to their stature and delays both Zoey and Will probably qualify for a similar program. Classrooms like my sons' have therapy incorporated into the school day. One of the teachers is a speech therapist. Physical therapy and occupational therapy take kids out for one on one time. The main teacher is certified in early childhood special education. The goal of the program is to prepare the children for mainstream kindergarten when they turn five or six.

I can certainly see the Kleins simply calling their kids' program "school". I seriously doubt the children are going to a commercial preschool, partially because their children would need special services. Both of them!

 

As an educator, this sounds like a terrific program. Even though I'm sure there is information we don't know about Will and Zoey - and this is as it should be - this type of program sounds ideal for them and is what they are - hopefully - enrolled in currently.

[4leafclover]

Here we go again on certain topics--at the risk of opening up THAT can of worms again, I must ask why people think Will is not yet potty trained?  Did they see a glimpse of pull-ups again to put everyone in a tizzy?  And how do we know that Will is in a class of children his age or in a class of children a bit younger?  I haven't heard either Bill or Jen make a comment on that (however, I'm not saying they didn't, just that I didn't hear it). 

[NausetGirl]

NausetGirl - Maybe you could elaborate on this with your experience and do you agree? My son's preschool teacher explained that in the 3 yr old class, the children play side by side without too much interaction between them. In the 4 yr old class, they interact with each other, make friends, include & exclude others in a group, etc. I guess the difference is due to age.

I wonder if Jen & Bill explained to Will & Zoey's classmates about the differences in them, explaining how they walk differently, may need help in doing things, using the step stool, etc. I remember in one of their first episodes, Jen & Bill visited a classroom & explained their conditions to the students. I don't remember why they were invited, but Bill seemed to make everyone feel at ease in his explanations, even throwing in some jokes.

 

I don't have teaching experience with three-year olds, but from what I remember from college training and psych courses, the side-by-side play is referred to as "parallel play" and as your son's teacher said, is very typical for that age. The kids are very happy playing "in close quarters" but completely independently, and peaceably too. There may be very little talking going on, although all the children are usually very observant of what each is doing. Four-year olds are definitely more socially-aware and  a little braver, for lack of a better word, and speak to and interact with their classmates much more. They're "bustin' out" as one of my principals used to say.

 

If Will and Zoey are the only "special needs" children in their respective classrooms, I think it would have been great for Bill & Jen to visit the classroom and do exactly what you described.  And maybe they did.  Anytime I had a special needs child in my class, I always encouraged parents [if it was possible] to come in a day or so before their child was to start and tell the kids about him/her.  The tricky thing was explaining enough about the new student without making it a big production and getting the children TOO curious.  I wanted them to be understanding and compassionate but I did not want them feeling sorry for the child.  Keeping things simple and matter-of-fact usually worked best.  Mostly I stressed that we are ALL different in different ways, that people the world over are all different too. We all look differently, we all have different things we're good at, we all have things we need help with or need to practice to do well, we all like different things.  But there are TWO ways in which ALL people everywhere are the same.  We all want to be happy and we all want to have friends.  I never saw the episode when Bill & Jen visited a classroom but IMO, both of them are extremely well-spoken and I think they might have a similar tactic when speaking to little kids.  I thought Bill was terrific when talking to an older child at that playground in San Francisco where he took Will & Zoey one day during Jen's simulation conference.

Edited December 18, 2014 by NausetGirl

[NausetGirl]

Changing the subject off the kids for a bit.  Did anyone else notice that Jen's mom looks like she had a little work done - if you know what I mean?  Her hair is different and her face looks a bit tight. 

 

Yes, she looked different to me as well. I was noticing eyes - and an all-around tighter or stretched appearance.

[BitterApple]

Changing the subject off the kids for a bit.  Did anyone else notice that Jen's mom looks like she had a little work done - if you know what I mean?  Her hair is different and her face looks a bit tight. 

Whatever she had done, I'm not feeling it. I know most people love Judy, but she irks the crap out of me. I didn't like the way talked to Kate at the CPR class when she ordered Kate to reposition herself over the dummy. Hopefully Kate gave her a "bitch, I don't work for you stare." She just comes off as a bossy control-freak to me.

[Absolom]

Only going two hours a day sounds like a private pre-school program to me.  What they talked about sounded like a standard back to school day for all parents. 

[eributterfly]

As far as the goldfish go, I think they should have taken from him as soon as she saw he had them. He wasn't supposed to eat them so why even let him hold on to them. I think they are still in the mindset of letting them have whatever they want but, now they say they are choosing battles and is it a battle worth fighting. They are learning but, I do think unfortunately Will is becoming a brat, the language he used in the pool and telling Bill to stay out and sit over there and it was his pool and they just laugh it off. Something even as small as that needs to be addressed so Will will know that is not the proper way to speak to his parents. It seems they still want to be friends with their kids and I still disagree with that relationship, especially when your kids are still getting to know you as parents. Also, Jen said that she never wants her kids to be bored, I maybe confused and this may have been on last weeks episode, I apologize if it was, but kids will get bored, it's life but, that is good, it will force them to entertain themselves and find things to do on their own. As far as Will crying for daddy at school, I agree with Jen, in that he may compare school to the orphanage and thinks he maybe left and is scared of that. As long as they reiterate everyday if necessary that they will be back everyday and they are never leaving him it will be ok. I can't remember Zoey having similar problems, but school probably isn't anything like her orphanage.

[eributterfly]

  

And this is exactly why Amy Roloff lived in fear the state was going to try to take her kids away when she got pregnant. Bill and Jen could easily be two little people with very average jobs and little people children born naturally. Should no one without a high paying job and zero physical difficulties have kids? Life is a series of what ifs. NO ONE is guaranteed the life they start with is the life they end with. People lose jobs, people lose spouses, and people suffer catastrophic injuries every single day, and yet they manage to go on and survive. Based on your theory, no one should marry or have kids because god forbid a car accident happens and kills the breadwinner and leaving the other parent permanently disabled. Think about the children! Who is going to raise the children safely? The horror!

Unless the state can find a situation I which the children are unkept or being neglected, short stature or not the kids wouldn't be taken away, especially if the kids were placed there with short statured parents in the first place. When Will was adopted they didn't have a nanny but she was hired soon after. I have thought about this myself because obviously there are things that Bill and Jen can't do alone with the kids and need help and as Bill always says they pride themselves on being independent. I seriously doubt that Jen has ever gone out alone with Will and Zoey, it's just not safe for the three of them. Bill maybe. I can remember an episode with Jen wanting to spend mommy Will time but, her mother came along. Judy clearly stated that Jen doesn't need me to tag along but that she was honored to be invited. Just for her to say that proved to me that she needs help. Then when I saw all of the yoga gear and pads they had to load in there, there would have been no way Jen could have handled that alone with Will. But it seems that they don't want to admit that they need help. I don't see it as a sign of weakness but just their reality. I am disabled and need a scooter to go grocery shopping and I park in the handicap spot, I am not ashamed it just is what it is. Obviously, injuries can happen in life that may cause you to have problems caring for your children but, they already had these disabilities prior to adopting and were still granted their kids. If Bill were forced to be in a wheel chair I doubt China and India would come running back to collect the kids. His issue is more of being a burden on his family who are already little.

[Micks Picks]

I really am uncomfortable about the fear that comes from someplace about the kids being fearful of going back to the orphanage.  They may not have had such a terrible time.  At any rate, I doubt that they remember any of it at this point.  I don't see that being an excuse for psychological adjustment right now regarding pre-school and so on.  The other life may only be a foggy feeling by now, and bringing it up may in fact be harming them.

[CPP83]

Whatever she had done, I'm not feeling it. I know most people love Judy, but she irks the crap out of me. I didn't like the way talked to Kate at the CPR class when she ordered Kate to reposition herself over the dummy. Hopefully Kate gave her a "bitch, I don't work for you stare." She just comes off as a bossy control-freak to me.

 

 

I've always thought that Judy has a certain way of speaking that often comes off as being bossy and direct even if that might not be her actual intention, though there have been times I was pretty darn sure it was, heh.

 

Her tone rarely changes despite her mood or the situation which is what adds to that implication, imo. She always sounds so steady and self assured, as if she's always directing and controlling the proceedings.

 

It was nice to see Kate again though, they're quite lucky to have her.

 

 

 

Goldfish-gate:  We don't know if production called Will over and gave him those goldfish.

 

 

 

From what I saw it appeared that Will only got into the pantry due to an unsecured baby-gate while Jen and Bill were preparing to leave. Personally I wondered if perhaps he wasn't happy with his breakfast that morning, heh, and decided he wanted something else to enjoy. 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Whatever she had done, I'm not feeling it. I know most people love Judy, but she irks the crap out of me. I didn't like the way talked to Kate at the CPR class when she ordered Kate to reposition herself over the dummy. Hopefully Kate gave her a "bitch, I don't work for you stare." She just comes off as a bossy control-freak to me.

 

Judy is obnoxious and very controlling!  I can see where Jen gets some of her annoying character traits.  They both give off the air of entitlement and it became very apparent to me when they were working with that interior designer for the house.  

Kate already had her CPR as that was a prerequisite in being hired in the first place.  Judy was playing to the camera, oyvay the drama!  And I wished Jen would have shut up during the training the 2 ladies were attempting to do but Jen kept inserting her comments?  Control, control, control!  

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Someone asked if Jen was already in the pantry when Will scored the goldfish bags but she wasn't.  She was packing things up and heard Will in the pantry and went in to find him helping himself.  He made it clear to her when she tried to take them from him they were MINE.  Even for the school pic sitting on the desks she tried to hold them NO MINE.    

 

Jen and Bill are often preoccupied with the agenda of filming and Will knows no one is picking a battle during that time so give him an opp and he is taking advantage of it.  Nice thing is he takes one for his sister!

Edited December 18, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[Absolom]

Viewership is dropping.  Some of the drop could be due to the holiday season.  1.995 M viewers and a .5 rating this week. 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I really am uncomfortable about the fear that comes from someplace about the kids being fearful of going back to the orphanage.  They may not have had such a terrible time.  At any rate, I doubt that they remember any of it at this point.  I don't see that being an excuse for psychological adjustment right now regarding pre-school and so on.  The other life may only be a foggy feeling by now, and bringing it up may in fact be harming them.

 

I think falling back on the orphanage all the time for issues that may or may not be normal is getting old.  We know Will had a great time at the orphanage and loved playing with the other kids.  The kids have primarily been with adults jet setting the world and have had little time to be kids.  Hell they likely think of their parents as playmates and friends so why do they have to go somewhere else.  They kept saying Zoey did well, still surprises me, she is the shy one and Will goes happily off with his speech therapist and I think he even told them GO.  LOL  I think they were creating some drama where there really was nothing out of the ordinary going on.  

[Bellalisa]

They are not going to stick him in a class with younger kids! That would be admitted to themselves and the world that his development is delayed. They do not think it is. If they stick him in a class with younger kids it is going to look like it is because of his dwarfism. And they want them included. 

 

A lot of preschools allow 3 and 4 year olds to come not being potty trained. it just depends on the school. I cannot imagine changing will's diapers though- that must be horrible.

 

When Jen was in the pantry and said NO Put it back- that is when she should have ended it. She told him no and did not follow through. After that it was over. Saying - Okay you can hold it but don't eat it? yeah right.  He really is a little food lover. He took those m and ms and now he took snacks out of the pantry. I guess its normally locked up. He loves his food!

Edited December 18, 2014 by Bellalisa

[Foghorn Leghorn]

 

Will told Bill to sit down with him in DC and Bill politely declined.

 

I remember that and I thought Will was including Bill by asking him to sit with them and Bill said no because of his back he explained.  I thought the situations were quite different in their intent.  Will didn't want Bill in his "POOL MINE!"

[Wouldofshouldof]

I know they couldn't think of everything when trying to take the first day of school pic but since Zoey insisted on using the step stool like a desk I wish they had turned it around the get the picture. Then she would have been facing forward.

I told Bill to just take the picture of Zoey's back, but he didn't listen  :)

 

My favorite picture of my sons is on my computer desktop - we're high up in the Rockies and they're sitting in Adirondack chairs looking out over the view.  Both of them were in teenage snits and refused to turn around for the camera, so I took it of their backs and the beautiful view.