S08.E03: First Week of School

[NausetGirl]

How true. I was having a problem with my son regressing after being potty trained. I remember my mom kind of blowing me off when I talked to her about it. I called his preschool teacher & got so much insight & guidance from her. Bless her heart, she listened to me cry & babble on about it for an hour. (Looking back it seems ridiculous I got that upset about it. Lol) She told me stories of other mothers who had same the problem with their kids & she gave me suggestions which worked.

 

if I had a little guy who was regressing in his potty training, I'd be upset too. And looking for any help I could get. PS - I remember giving some serious attention to "potty issues" during my college training too. We teachers have a lot of incentive for keeping those pre-schoolers trained - LOL.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Needless to say, it is a very good thing I can't afford Dragonnatuallyspeaking, because I cannot seem to shut the fuck up when I should, and would be embarrassed to see a post of mine that required 3 "page down" clicks to ignore.  :-)

 

 

I have used dragon naturally speaking for quite some time. If you're bored, try it out. I found that I will edit myself a lot more when I have to speak my words. I bet if most of us had to read a post we made 4/5 days ago out loud you'd see what I mean.

 

I used it to draft many, many research papers. I could mentally spew everything I knew on a topic and use the transcript to organize and refine. I used it to make vacation packing lists for my partner, saving me time for our argument later about being 'controlling.' I've used it to help my presentation skills. I recorded myself having a normal conversations with a friend. Using the transcript and some word counters, I figured out I say "Soooo" much too often, soo I'm cutting down.

 

I don't have any sensory issues, so I can't suggest if this is the best solution for any specific problem, but I do enjoy it.

 

Dictanote is a free similar program that works with the google chrome browser.

[NausetGirl]

The throwing the kids seems to be a part of all current pre-school swim classes.  Water safety is the biggest concern.  The swimming classes I think is one of the best things Jen and Bill are doing for the kids.  They seem to have found an awesome instructor. 

 

Agree, Jarrod is incredibly patient and understanding with the kids. The waiting list for his services has to be a mile long by now.

[mojito]

 

I used it to make vacation packing lists for my partner, saving me time for our argument later about being 'controlling.'

And a good argument must be allotted adequate time!

[Jellybeans]

Speaking purely from the viewpoint of a (damaged) child, I'd take a physically disabled parent over an emotionally disabled one any day of the week (and twice on Sundays, Jelly).  Just sayin'.

I sooooo agree. My parents were supposedly normal (LOL) but my mother was very emotionally damaged. I would rather deal with a Jen and Bill type for parents any day.

[walnutqueen]

I have used dragon naturally speaking for quite some time. If you're bored, try it out. I found that I will edit myself a lot more when I have to speak my words. I bet if most of us had to read a post we made 4/5 days ago out loud you'd see what I mean.

 

I used it to draft many, many research papers. I could mentally spew everything I knew on a topic and use the transcript to organize and refine. I used it to make vacation packing lists for my partner, saving me time for our argument later about being 'controlling.' I've used it to help my presentation skills. I recorded myself having a normal conversations with a friend. Using the transcript and some word counters, I figured out I say "Soooo" much too often, soo I'm cutting down.

 

I don't have any sensory issues, so I can't suggest if this is the best solution for any specific problem, but I do enjoy it.

 

Dictanote is a free similar program that works with the google chrome browser.

 

Ooh - you almost had me at "free", wrestlingflamingos, but then I saw "google", "chrome" and "browser: ... and my eyes started glazing over with that dead body stare previously reserved for the ID Channel thread... :  heh

 

Sometimes it really is best to let sleeping dragons lie ....

 

(again, with the 'pick your battles' reference - at least I learned to be consistent).

 

But I'm having a hell of a time trying to keep this post On Topic.

 

Like:  you guys think Jen seems awkward giving affection?  You should've seen my Mum try to learn how to hug & say "I love you", after a truly lovely boyfriend taught me, when I was in my early 20s.  heh

Edited December 21, 2014 by walnutqueen

[mojito]

 

The waiting list for his services has to be a mile long by now.

...for swimming lessons, too!

[walnutqueen]

OMG, mojito - you just won the internet for me today.  A bazillion LIKES and "snap'!

[TEEVEE]

I think the thing is -- like your friend -- most issues are disability specific. If people are concerned about Jen and Bill raising Will and Zoey, how much more concern must have been expressed about the Roloffs rearing three typically-sized children who would have been larger at a very, very young age. 

I get your point, but, Jen and Bill adopted these kiddos. I can only imagine the red tape to become qualified. That is the point I have been talking about. Again, wondering if part of the approval was based on a full time nanny, have a reliable support system. It is my opinion, that without a nanny and the money to modify so many things in their home/cars, they simply would not be able to safely care for these kids on their own. Neither Bill nor Jen can successfully chase them down due to their own physical limitations.

 

The Roloff's had their children and did not have to apply or qualify.

[wrestlesflamingos]

I'm not sure that China and India have the same discrimination rules. I do think the adoption has to be approved according to the standard of that country the child lives in.

[ZoloftBlob]

If parents in general are not periodically tested to see if they can out run or catch their children, then why would Bill and Jen be disqualified as parents for the same. Frankly, people in wheel chairs can't chase their children. Should their kids be given to social services? How about those crippled vets in the Wounded Warriors commercials...does anyone really think that guy that has a huge dent in his forehead and has his daughter saying "sometimes I help daddy walk" is physically capable to stopping that child from running.? Why does he "qualify" as a parent? He can't stop her from running, doesn't that mean his child should be removed from his home?

This isn't a specious example, btw. Bill and Jen legally adopted their children and the underlying theme behind the "Jen can't lift them and neither can stop them from running" is about their handicaps. If the poor fellows with no legs, or missing arms, or giants dents in their foreheads are still allowed custody of their children, I don't see why we are having this constant debate over it.

Unless what is really being said is "people with handicaps shouldn't be allowed to have children" - which typically gets protested but really. I know plenty of parents with less money and more handicaps who do just fine. It's not against the law for disabled people to have children, and plenty of able bodied parents have lapses in judgement and don't get punished for, like say, when they live the toddler in the car. The constant handwringing and disbelief over how Jen and Bill handle the physicality of parenting is becoming offense.

[TEEVEE]

I truly doubt that the qualification process to become adoptive parents was any different for Jen and Bill than it is for average height people. That would be against the law. It's discrimination.

Really? Not meaning to be snarky here, but gay couples in some states still can not adopt. A single gay man can't. Would a single parapalegic or single blind person qualify?

 

Should it not be based on one's ability to safely care for the kids?

If parents in general are not periodically tested to see if they can out run or catch their children, then why would Bill and Jen be disqualified as parents for the same. Frankly, people in wheel chairs can't chase their children. Should their kids be given to social services? How about those crippled vets in the Wounded Warriors commercials...does anyone really think that guy that has a huge dent in his forehead and has his daughter saying "sometimes I help daddy walk" is physically capable to stopping that child from running.? Why does he "qualify" as a parent? He can't stop her from running, doesn't that mean his child should be removed from his home?

This isn't a specious example, btw. Bill and Jen legally adopted their children and the underlying theme behind the "Jen can't lift them and neither can stop them from running" is about their handicaps. If the poor fellows with no legs, or missing arms, or giants dents in their foreheads are still allowed custody of their children, I don't see why we are having this constant debate over it.

Unless what is really being said is "people with handicaps shouldn't be allowed to have children" - which typically gets protested but really. I know plenty of parents with less money and more handicaps who do just fine. It's not against the law for disabled people to have children, and plenty of able bodied parents have lapses in judgement and don't get punished for, like say, when they live the toddler in the car. The constant handwringing and disbelief over how Jen and Bill handle the physicality of parenting is becoming offense.

Again, I am referring to qualifying for adoption. A whole different topic, in my opinion.

[ZoloftBlob]

Why do you think biological parents should be held to a lower standard? It's ok to have several children you can't physically tend yourself? If the issue is safety, and it's constantly impressed on us that all the concern is about safety, why are two dwarf parents who have biological children they can't lift or stop from running into the street *safer* than two adoptive dwarf parents in the same circumstances. Why does this rule apply only to adopted children?

Eta obviously Bill and Jen did qualify for adoption and are the legal parents of Will and Zoey, so it's no longer about adoption standards. They're the parents and people are questioning their eligibility to be parents because of their disability. They aren't different from parents with disabilities who have biological children.

Edited December 20, 2014 by ZoloftBlob

[NausetGirl]

...for swimming lessons, too!

 

Don't think I wasn't aware of the double meaning as I was typing too - LOL!!  :>)

Edited December 20, 2014 by NausetGirl

[Jellybeans]

Eta obviously Bill and Jen did qualify for adoption and are the legal parents of Will and Zoey, so it's no longer about adoption standards. They're the parents and people are questioning their eligibility to be parents because of their disability. They aren't different from parents with disabilities who have biological children.

Thank you so much for this. Is it ok for the Roloffs to conceive and raise their biological normal sized children but the Arnolds' eligibility to be parents be questioned to death?

Did the Roloffs have a Nanny when Amy had kids, if no, why not? Should someone have called CPS on them. ;-) Thing is, all four kids of their kids are grown. Somehow...they made it. I suspect Will and Zoey will too.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Jellybeans

[eributterfly]

Kids who are immature, have problems socially, with their peers. Shouldn't Bill and Jen have thought of this?

I think since Will went from a setting of an orphanage everyday to being an only child getting any and everything he wanted to now having to go back to sharing and being around other kids is difficult for him. I always thought it was a bit much how many toys he had, especially toy cars. They went over board big time, in my opinion. It wasn't necessary, now he has to share and interact and he hasn't done that the entire time he's been with Jen and Bill. A clear example of this was when they were in the park and he had a fit when he saw a little boy heading towards his bike. He has been entitled for too long and now they will have to figure out how to reverse what they have done. I also believe that they maybe in a little bit of denial about the progression of Will. I thought that Zoey was a lot more vocal and clear in what she says. Hopefully that will rub off on Will. There is no doubt that Will understands what he is told it's just his verbal skills that are lacking. Unfortunately, this can force him to be held back or put in special classes because he will be looked upon as not as developed or ready. I am sure that as some point Jen and Bill will know that filming may not be in the best interest for the kids, especially if Will is struggling, it could have a negative effect on his self esteem. I think this needs to be the last season, there really isn't anywhere else to go, they have been baptised, they have gone to Washington, they have searched for Easter eggs, looked at Christmas lights, renewed vows, conquered Cancer, enough already. The one thing I would like to see is Jen taking the kids out by herself, maybe that can be on the series finale...NOT!! BTW, on the little couple Facebook page they are allowing fans to upload a video of a question that may be asked on an upcoming episode, surely another viewer questions special. And of course that was my question, I hope they answer honestly.

[eributterfly]

When Bill pulled the stool out of the box, I thought, "wow that looks like one of the Roloff stools.   Turns out it was.   Small world.

I thought Zoe sitting on the stool like a desk was adorable!

Will they even be able to step up on the stools? I really didn't pay attention but, now that I think about it, Zoeys legs are so short I don't think she can step herself and not sure about Will either. The teachers or assistant will probably pick them up anyway and the teachers can use them to get into higher cabinets.

[eributterfly]

Yes, this occurred to me as well. I sincerely hope there are times when food is taken back to the pantry, and toys are taken away from Will. But since all we see are the situations in which Will gets his way, that's all we can think. I'm wondering if Bill and Jen are hesitant about being firm with Will because they're being filmed? I know we're not supposed to care what other people think, but come on - everyone really does, at least to varying extents. They might be concerned about being called out for being too severe - even if they weren't...

Very good point, I think they are extremely concerned with how they look on camera. I can remember an episode when they first came on the air and they were house hunting and they weren't in agreement. Jen voiced her opinion and Bill his and afterwards she was concerned about how at may have come across on tv. If you notice they NEVER argue on camera, I mean NEVER. To me, is that even possible in a real relationship? I think it's about showing that they are perfect. So now that applies to their kids.

[mojito]

 

Don't think I wasn't aware of the double meaning as I was typing too - LOL!!  :>)

It had crossed my mind.

Edited December 20, 2014 by mojito

[NausetGirl]

Very good point, I think they are extremely concerned with how they look on camera. I can remember an episode when they first came on the air and they were house hunting and they weren't in agreement. Jen voiced her opinion and Bill his and afterwards she was concerned about how at may have come across on tv. If you notice they NEVER argue on camera, I mean NEVER. To me, is that even possible in a real relationship? I think it's about showing that they are perfect. So now that applies to their kids.

 

My own feeling is that Bill & Jen probably DO argue less than the average couple.  This could easily change, maybe even WILL change, but at present I think they fully realize how lucky they were to FIND each other, and how lucky they are to STILL HAVE each other [after what they've been through in the past year].  In addition, they haven't been together for all that long, they are a little older [and maybe a little more mature] than most couples married the same amount of time.  And overriding it all, they truly are a really good match.  When you share a lot of similar views, there's just less to disagree about.  That being said, when it really counts, both speak up for their viewpoints.  It's just that in general, Bill doesn't feel as strongly as Jen does about a lot of things.  I also see them as deferring to each other when it makes sense, when it involves their own "areas of expertise."  For example, when they were decorating the new house.  Let's face it, most guys do not give a flip what colors the walls are.  But when shopping for a new vehicle last year with Will, Bill was very clear in the showroom that mini-vans were not going to be an option.  He did not seem to care at all that they were being filmed.  And you could tell Jen was OK with having lost that round.

[Missy Vixen]

Especially coming from all the childless experts.

I don't have children. I never claimed to be an expert. I think that Bill and Jen are doing their best with a situation most parents will never face -- two kids who spent their lives in an orphanage before being adopted.  One thing's for sure -- they're better off with a set of loving, involved parents with the ability to get the help or resources they need in life than they would be if they were still in the orphanage.

 

Will and Zoey have good days and bad days, just like every other little kid on the planet.

[CPP83]

If you notice they NEVER argue on camera, I mean NEVER. To me, is that even possible in a real relationship? I think it's about showing that they are perfect. So now that applies to their kids.

 

 

 

Perhaps they have an agreement that they try to not argue on camera, that they go and settle matters alone and away from everyone else. Frankly the fact they don't squabble publicly, that they don't get into bouts in front of the cameras is a big reason why I enjoy this show.

 

I don't care to see a couple fighting on my TV screen, it adds nothing to the experience imho. If anything it makes me feel as if they're behaving immaturely. A couple that loves and respects one another even if upset would do their best to remove themselves from the situation, and the lime light, and take care of things one on one.

 

Jen and Bill are a married couple, I would bet my best kidney they argue because they're human beings and not the same person. However I also believe that they love and respect one another, as they should, and therefore they have worked out how they handle those intimate moments of discord or whatever the case may be and it doesn't involve having a camera present.

 

I don't think that it's some grand plan of theirs to appear perfect but private, and to me if more reality couples would show such restraint they'd all be the better for it.

[mojito]

 

Very good point, I think they are extremely concerned with how they look on camera.

Why wouldn't they put their best foot forward? Wouldn't you?

[NausetGirl]

Perhaps they have an agreement that they try to not argue on camera, that they go and settle matters alone and away from everyone else. Frankly the fact they don't squabble publicly, that they don't get into bouts in front of the cameras is a big reason why I enjoy this show.

 

I don't care to see a couple fighting on my TV screen, it adds nothing to the experience imho. If anything it makes me feel as if they're behaving immaturely. A couple that loves and respects one another even if upset would do their best to remove themselves from the situation, and the lime light, and take care of things one on one.

 

Jen and Bill are a married couple, I would bet my best kidney they argue because they're human beings and not the same person. However I also believe that they love and respect one another, as they should, and therefore they have worked out how they handle those intimate moments of discord or whatever the case may be and it doesn't involve having a camera present.

 

I don't think that it's some grand plan of theirs to appear perfect but private, and to me if more reality couples would show such restraint they'd all be the better for it.

 

Agree completely. I think that's what many people, sadly enough, found so watchable about the Gosselins.  Sure the kids were cute and all - but what I think really brought the paparazzi swarming was the screaming.  People were at first amazed, and then actually liked, watching Kate let loose on Jon, at home or in public.  Most people "filter" their behavior when they know others will see it.  Things that would incite an argument at home get stifled for the moment and both parties behave "better" than they'd be inclined to alone.  But the Gosselins carried on most of the time as though they WERE alone.  No filter.  No "Gee, do we really want 1000s of people seeing us this way?"  And now people have sort of come to expect "rumbles" on reality TV.  What the heck?

[Absolom]

One thing I won't find fault with Will for making sure to claim his bike in the park.  There is no necessity to share with strangers in a park.  I'd never expect it of my children brought up in a large city.  You don't know if they want to simply take the bike and ride off with it or what.  I've had to demand my kids possessions back from other kids many times.  I'd worry about Will if he refused to share with people he knows in his own home, but strangers in a park have no good reason to touch or even approach someone else's property without permission in my world views.

[Barb23]

I'd much rather watch Jen & Bill get along than that other show (can't remember name) about the little people couple that had a baby, who I think was an average baby. They showed doing the testing & results on the show. I don't think that gal ever said one nice word to her husband. He just kind of sat there & let her walk all over him. It came across that was just her personality, that's the way she was. One episode, he went out bowling after dinner with friends & she had a fit because she had to deal with the baby by herself. I'll give her a break because she did have some physical limitations that made it hard to lift the baby. But another episode when they visited her home town, she went out with her friends & had a good old time. She made it known she was always the life of the party when she was younger. I'll take the happy Arnold Klein family anytime.

[Honey]

I'd much rather watch Jen & Bill get along than that other show (can't remember name) about the little people couple that had a baby, who I think was an average baby. They showed doing the testing & results on the show. I don't think that gal ever said one nice word to her husband. He just kind of sat there & let her walk all over him. It came across that was just her personality, that's the way she was. One episode, he went out bowling after dinner with friends & she had a fit because she had to deal with the baby by herself. I'll give her a break because she did have some physical limitations that made it hard to lift the baby. But another episode when they visited her home town, she went out with her friends & had a good old time. She made it known she was always the life of the party when she was younger. I'll take the happy Arnold Klein family anytime.

Or, the Roloff's who took the chance to belittle each other behind the other's back, whenever they had the chance.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Honey

[Foghorn Leghorn]

One thing I won't find fault with Will for making sure to claim his bike in the park.  There is no necessity to share with strangers in a park.  I'd never expect it of my children brought up in a large city.  You don't know if they want to simply take the bike and ride off with it or what.  I've had to demand my kids possessions back from other kids many times.  I'd worry about Will if he refused to share with people he knows in his own home, but strangers in a park have no good reason to touch or even approach someone else's property without permission in my world views.

 

In all fairness no one was near the scooter in that handicapped park so the 2 small boys could have thought it belonged to the park that is until Will did his Tarzan yell!!  

Edited December 21, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[Absolom]

They could but I doubt it.  There is nothing wrong in my eyes with a pre-schooler letting people in a public place know that something is his.  I didn't hear a Tarzan yell either.  I just can't see that behavior as a problem.  It wouldn't disturb me seeing it in any young child.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Absolom

[BitterApple]

They could but I doubt it.  There is nothing wrong in my eyes with a pre-schooler letting people in a public place know that something is his.  I didn't hear a Tarzan yell either.  I just can't see that behavior as a problem.  It wouldn't disturb me seeing it in any young child.

That was a situation where I didn't fault Will or the other boys. The other boys' parents should have reminded them they don't take or touch things that don't belong to them.

[Jellybeans]

There are couples who don't argue. Jen and Bill are older, and settled. My s/o and I don't argue either. We're older, settled and taller.

I save arguments for here. ;-)

[Veronique Bette]

Also, because of his speech limitations, Will didn't have the vocabulary to just tell the boys the bike was his so he communicated that to them the only way he could.

 

I'm another person who is glad not to have to see another couple bickering or sniping at each other on screen. I know a couple in real life who routinely do that and it's beyond unpleasant to be around them. They are constantly rude to each other or are making sarcastic "jokes" at each other's expense. I think of them as "the Bickersons". Unfortunately, I have to be around them at certain functions and cannot just change the channel :-)

[NausetGirl]

Also, because of his speech limitations, Will didn't have the vocabulary to just tell the boys the bike was his so he communicated that to them the only way he could.

 

I'm another person who is glad not to have to see another couple bickering or sniping at each other on screen. I know a couple in real life who routinely do that and it's beyond unpleasant to be around them. They are constantly rude to each other or are making sarcastic "jokes" at each other's expense. I think of them as "the Bickersons". Unfortunately, I have to be around them at certain functions and cannot just change the channel :-)

 

Totally agree. I think most of us know at least one Bickersons-type couple, and it is indeed unpleasant to be around them "mid-bicker." And PDAs are often even worse. If I ruled the world, we'd keep - for the most part at least - both the affectionate and argumentative sides of all relationships private.

[CousinAmy]

Aaaah, Goldfishgate. I think Will may have been given the goldfish - or taken them - for snacktime at school. That's why Jen let him take them for later - but being a four-year-old he couldn't resist opening them right away. I definitely would have taken the bag away from him.

I work in Head Start so I have had experience with more than 1,000 preschoolers over the years. I have the "teacher voice" down pat, and it always works. (Think of Supernanny's technique: lower your voice, not raise it, get down to eye-level, and follow through on what you intend to do.)

A lot of our kids are defiant, and won't listen to their parents. But they are well-behaved in the classroom because they know the rules, and the consequences.

I didn't like the way the swimming instructor treated Zoey. Yes, she's tiny and delicate, but she's her own person and her protests should have been respected. I would never drag a screaming child into the water. The instructor should have been much more gentle and patient. He could have played with her in the shallow end, maybe blow some bubbles, take her out, then try again in a few minutes. When a child is in distress don't say, "Oh, you're alright," that invalidates her feelings. Say, "I know you're scared, but we'll get through this together. Now, would you like to try blowing bubbles?"

Sometimes you do have to take a hand or pick up a toddler, but into the water, where she has absolutely no power, control, or choice, no.

Will did pretty well in the pool, but he's being taught to belly-flop, not dive. And is there a ladder for him to get out of the pool safely, not just climb up over the edge? In any case, it looks like he can handle himself around water.

[Fostersmom]

I think the whole pool is only 3-4 feet deep at the most, more of a wading pool than a diving pool. It would be seriously dangerous for him to dive, no one should dive into water that shallow. I know we've seen one end of the pool and it's basically just a set of stairs to walk right out of. There's not really a need for a ladder in that kind of pool, but maybe they should add one for the kids to use at the "deep" end. 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

The pool has steps all across the "shallow" end and at the deepest part the height is Bill's nipples.  I remember that episode.  So no it is not a diving pool for anyone.  I think the goal for Will is to be able to hold his breath for longer lengths of time by having that toy tossed further and deeper so he can stay under longer.  He can certainly find his way back up to air!   Jarod said his body weight alone is not enough to get him to go down to the bottom on his own because of his expanded lung capacity so he pushes him down to succeed.  Jarod has taught Will and is now teaching Zoey how to get out of the water should they fall in, heaven forbid!  There is no ladder so not sure if one is required if anyone can either get to the steps and walk out or get themselves up on the side.  I am sure they don't have pool parties at least yet!  The technique of the kids getting out is one they seem to have mastered, elbow, elbow, knee, knee!  He LOVES the water.  It would be a great way of him losing some weight if he could have more chances to burn off those goldfish!  His belly protrudes and hangs over his suit.  

 

Zoey is another story!  You can pretty much predict the outcome every time she tries something new!  Tears and crying all for naught.  And when a child is crying like that they likely aren't hearing much but those words were meaningless.  I guess it is just our nature to say things like that to keep them moving forward.  I am not sure why Jen didn't  have her suit on and go into that area and let the instructor teach both of them.

 

I know the instructor likely wants to be one on one but Will seems to need a cheering section for everything he does "raise clapping hands and yell yay" over and over!  But maybe Zoey needs a pal and maybe that is why she did well in school as she did not feel alone whereas Will did not have his cheering section so felt isolated and alone.

 

 

(Think of Supernanny's technique: lower your voice, not raise it, get down to eye-level, and follow through on what you intend to do.)

   

Agree, this works, have done it myself.  Jen needs to work on her octave going down and following through but she is almost already at eye level!  Bill doesn't do squat anyway and Zoey is Jen's! 

Edited December 21, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[CousinAmy]

I didn't realize the pool was so shallow. When they installed it, did they have kids in mind? Or was it basically just for cooling off? I don't know if Bill can swim laps, but otherwise I'm not even sure why they put it in. 

 

By "eye level" I basically mean face-to-face. You can call across the room "Will put that down" a few times but if you get no results, you have to go to where the child is, and speak directly to them. I think school will be very, very good for Will if his teachers have a firm hand. He will learn how to follow directions and obey rules. He really needs the socialization that being around other children, and adults who aren't his doting family, can provide.

[Fostersmom]

I think they put it in for cooling off. Jen can't swim, she's said she sinks like a rock, but loves the water, and I believe Bill can barely swim. Given it's Texas and about 120 degrees in the summer, just sitting on the steps or splashing about would be a welcome relief. 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I think they put it in for cooling off. Jen can't swim, she's said she sinks like a rock, but loves the water, and I believe Bill can barely swim. Given it's Texas and about 120 degrees in the summer, just sitting on the steps or splashing about would be a welcome relief. 

 

Bill said he can't swim.  The pool is for cooling off when they grow tired of the air conditioning.  Pools are also great for therapy/rehab and they may have had that in mind for the whole family's future needs.         

[mbutterfly]

Water walking is good. 

[mojito]

 

He really needs the socialization that being around other children, and adults who aren't his doting family, can provide.

If Will sees that he's not behaving like the other kids, they'll eventually let him know he's not.

 

 

Given it's Texas and about 120 degrees in the summer, just sitting on the steps or splashing about would be a welcome relief.

Pools get warm enough in the summer in Texas, I can't imagine how hot that little pool must get, and when you need it most. I'm thinking that there are probably therapeutic accessories that go with that pool (like a treadmill) for low-impact exercise for Bill and Jen.

Edited December 22, 2014 by mojito

[TEEVEE]

Aaaah, Goldfishgate. I think Will may have been given the goldfish - or taken them - for snacktime at school. That's why Jen let him take them for later - but being a four-year-old he couldn't resist opening them right away. I definitely would have taken the bag away from him.

I work in Head Start so I have had experience with more than 1,000 preschoolers over the years. I have the "teacher voice" down pat, and it always works. (Think of Supernanny's technique: lower your voice, not raise it, get down to eye-level, and follow through on what you intend to do.)

A lot of our kids are defiant, and won't listen to their parents. But they are well-behaved in the classroom because they know the rules, and the consequences.

I didn't like the way the swimming instructor treated Zoey. Yes, she's tiny and delicate, but she's her own person and her protests should have been respected. I would never drag a screaming child into the water. The instructor should have been much more gentle and patient. He could have played with her in the shallow end, maybe blow some bubbles, take her out, then try again in a few minutes. When a child is in distress don't say, "Oh, you're alright," that invalidates her feelings. Say, "I know you're scared, but we'll get through this together. Now, would you like to try blowing bubbles?"

Sometimes you do have to take a hand or pick up a toddler, but into the water, where she has absolutely no power, control, or choice, no.

Will did pretty well in the pool, but he's being taught to belly-flop, not dive. And is there a ladder for him to get out of the pool safely, not just climb up over the edge? In any case, it looks like he can handle himself around water.

I think the instructor handled Zooey perfectly. A good instructor can ignore the howling and still be effective, which he was. Being very much involved in swim lessons/team and observing the tot class for many years, there were no alarms going off. It is imperative parent's with a pool get serious instruction going on, and who knows if either parent could jump in and save them.

[mbutterfly]

If Will 't himself see that he's not behaving like the other kids, they'll eventually let him know he's not.

 

 

Good point. From all we can tell, Will has always enjoyed being a people-pleaser. I'm thinking being around other children will be just the ticket for him -- as it is with many, many 4-year-olds. It would actually surprise me if I read that other preschoolers treated either Will or Zoey differently because they are of shorter stature. My experience has been they notice differences with nothing more than curiosity. 

[TEEVEE]

I wonder if they have car seats in all their cars, or they move them around. SNARK. Of course they have car seats for all their cars. Is it just me, or does Bill have a new car every season?

[Bellalisa]

Cousin Amy, when the over 6 foot tall Swim Instructor picked up the crying Zoey I was a little freaked out! I could see how she is now used to little people and now getting picked up by this giant to put her in the pool. 

Anyway she is so cute when she is crying. 

[NausetGirl]

I think the instructor handled Zooey perfectly. A good instructor can ignore the howling and still be effective, which he was. Being very much involved in swim lessons/team and observing the tot class for many years, there were no alarms going off. It is imperative parent's with a pool get serious instruction going on, and who knows if either parent could jump in and save them.

 

Agree.  My nephew is a Red Cross-certified lifeguard and water safety instructor.  According to him lots, if not most, little kids cry and/or scream bloody murder when they have their first swim lessons.  Entirely normal deal, whether or not Mom & Dad are poolside.  If every instructor waited until all kids showed Will's enthusiasm for the water, lessons wouldn't begin until some kids were in junior high - and there'd probably be a good deal more drowning deaths in the country than there are now.

 

Edited to add - PS: my nephew says virtually all kids adjust very well to being in the pool within a few weeks, depending on age. He tells me babies have the easiest adjustment - and kids Zoey's age have it toughest. I guess the theory is that babies basically just don't know any better and adjust easily.  But two & three year olds have had lots of experiences to compare it with and find being in the water so different to what they've known - which seems to make sense.

Edited December 23, 2014 by NausetGirl

[joanne3482]

I think they put it in for cooling off. Jen can't swim, she's said she sinks like a rock, but loves the water, and I believe Bill can barely swim. Given it's Texas and about 120 degrees in the summer, just sitting on the steps or splashing about would be a welcome relief.

 

I live in Texas. I used to do the same thing at my apartment complex's pool which is only 5' deep. It is still refreshing even when the water gets warmish because the water is still cooler than the 110 degrees outside. 

 

I wonder if they have car seats in all their cars, or they move them around. SNARK. Of course they have car seats for all their cars.

 

I think all my friends who have more than 1 car has a car seat in each car for the kids and often the grandparents have a car seat too. It is just too difficult to take the thing out and put it in a new car correctly. They're so complicated these days it is better to keep it hooked up the correct fashion than take it from one car to the next and increase the likelihood they install it incorrectly in the next car.  

[NausetGirl]

I live in Texas. I used to do the same thing at my apartment complex's pool which is only 5' deep. It is still refreshing even when the water gets warmish because the water is still cooler than the 110 degrees outside. 

 

I think all my friends who have more than 1 car has a car seat in each car for the kids and often the grandparents have a car seat too. It is just too difficult to take the thing out and put it in a new car correctly. They're so complicated these days it is better to keep it hooked up the correct fashion than take it from one car to the next and increase the likelihood they install it incorrectly in the next car.  

 

My parents had "grandchildren" car seats too - but only in Mom's car [they never took the kids out in my Dad's pride-and-joy Oldsmobile with dove gray upholstery - LOL]. Mom got both seats in excellent condition [and for good prices] at garage sales, and then sold for them at her own garage sale once the kids were old enough for standard seat belts.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

We have one set and switch cars instead of car seats as they are usually all together.  Other situations are dealt with by exception.  Less work and cheaper!

[BitterApple]

Water walking is good. 

My mom lost 25 lbs. doing water walking at the gym, it's great exercise and easy on the joints.

 

Regarding the car seats, I wouldn't blame them for having a double set, one for each car. Those things are a pain in the ass to keep switching in and out.