Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[daxx]

5 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

Why do they even need a Queen for the freaking Multiverse? And Is this happening while Regina’s past-version is with Henry in the Disenchanted Forest?

This Show is literally the worst  garbage I’ve ever had the misfortune to watch. If I could recreate Zelena’s Time-portal, I would tell myself to stop watching at the end of 3A. 

You wouldn’t want to miss the 3b finale though, ending there would have been acceptable.

[Free]

5 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

Why do they even need a Queen for the freaking Multiverse? And Is this happening while Regina’s past-version is with Henry in the Disenchanted Forest?

This Show is literally the worst  garbage I’ve ever had the misfortune to watch. If I could recreate Zelena’s Time-portal, I would tell myself to stop watching at the end of 3A. 

It makes even less sense than OuaT's usual screw ups, the multiverse doesn't need to have any ruler whatsoever, not to mention it comes out of nowhere with no build up whatsoever just to force a bad wish fulfillment fantasy fan fiction.

[Rumsy4]

45 minutes ago, daxx said:

You wouldn’t want to miss the 3b finale though, ending there would have been acceptable.

I know. But 3B is when light magic shot out of Regina's backside. I might even sacrifice the 3B finale to avoid that. 

12 minutes ago, Free said:

it comes out of nowhere with no build up whatsoever just to force a bad wish fulfillment fantasy fan fiction.

Very apt for this Show, then. :-p

[rogvortex58]

Does this mean Emma has been merged with Wish Emma this whole time? She said she had all her memories. Even when she woke up.

So she’s both Henry’s and Wish Henry’s mother? That’s messed up.

Edited May 7, 2018 by rogvortex58

[Writing Wrongs]

So I found the call sheet and spoilers on one forum and got caught up reading people's comments. A lot of people really hate JMo.

[tabularasa]

Why do they hate her?

[RolloTomasi]

There’s a small but very, very vocal group of anti JMo people (seriously, it’s the same names that pop up with this over and over, it’s exhausting) that pile on her for EVERYTHING she says, does, or wears. There’s different reasoning depending on the day - she’s racist, she’s homophobic, shes in the closet, she’s unprofessional - but the real issue is that she wasn’t as effusive about a non-canon ship as Lana was. 

[rogvortex58]

I really couldn’t care less what they think.

[Mabinogia]

34 minutes ago, RolloTomasi said:

There’s different reasoning depending on the day - she’s racist, she’s homophobic, shes in the closet, she’s unprofessional

I don't really like JenMo (don't hate her, just find her extremely blah and highly overrated) but where the hell does that stuff even come from? I have never seen anything racist, homophobic or closeted! How do people even come up with that?

There are fans, which, I think most of us here are (or at least were at one point), and then there are fanatics who take it way too far. At least here the mods try to stop it for the most part.

[Shanna Marie]

17 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

I have never seen anything racist, homophobic or closeted! How do people even come up with that?

Because, clearly, the fact that she's not actually in a relationship with Lana in real life proves that she's racist, homophobic, and closeted, and because of this, she's the reason the producers didn't make SwanQueen a thing. At least, that's the way it sounds from some of these people.

Edited to add: It's not just the SwanQueen faction that go nuts with this. There's also a group of rabid CaptainSwan shippers who decided they really wanted that relationship to also happen in real life, never mind the fact that Colin is happily married and a dad and that Jen is friends with his wife. Jen had to do a few Twitter smackdowns about respect when she couldn't Tweet about any interaction with Colin without fans blowing up the responses (and tagging her, which is gross), squeeing about what they thought she and Colin were really doing. So that made some of that faction turn against her, too, like she was the reason they weren't a couple in real life.

I was going to hold out hope that the Queen of the Universe thing was part of all the wackiness that would subsequently be cleared up, but they did say the ending was in the place it began, and that's probably the coronation, so ugh. There's something wrong with the "happy ending" of a story being the villain -- even a reformed villain -- getting the goal they had as a villain. A reformed villain can get a happy ending, but it needs to be something entirely different from what they were going after when they were a villain. Otherwise, they didn't really learn or change if they still want the same thing they wanted as a villain. I guess that's why I wasn't too bothered about Hook becoming a sheriff. When he was a villain, he was a lawbreaker and disregarded laws, so it works for me (in the absence of developing anything else) for him to end up on the side of the law. I would have had a problem with him getting to happily go about being a super-successful pirate. Part of Regina's hatred of Snow was because the people didn't acknowledge her as queen, no matter how much she terrorized them, and they were loyal to Snow instead. So there's a big problem with the ending being Regina getting what she wanted when she was a villain. That was the problem with the "Queen" stenciled on the door, as well. Her happy ending needs to be her being content with what she has, with having a reasonably normal life and people she loves -- and the emphasis needs to be on her love for them, not their love for her.

Edited May 7, 2018 by Shanna Marie

[Writing Wrongs]

1 hour ago, tabularasa said:

Why do they hate her?

Some people think she's stuck up and rumors of her not wanting to work with some people on set.

[Rumsy4]

I think some former fans completely turned against her for deciding to not stay on for Season 7. When idols fall, that kind of thing. I came across some rants that sounded a bit unhinged. 

Plus she also earned some anger for canceling all her con engagements last year. 

The other seems to stem from resentment against vocal JMo fans who have been harassing the new cast and attributing their own anti-S7 and anti-Lana opinions to her.

Edited May 7, 2018 by Rumsy4

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, Shanna Marie said:

I was going to hold out hope that the Queen of the Universe thing was part of all the wackiness that would subsequently be cleared up, but they did say the ending was in the place it began, and that's probably the coronation, so ugh. There's something wrong with the "happy ending" of a story being the villain -- even a reformed villain -- getting the goal they had as a villain.

The thing is, is that even her "happy ending" anymore? Was it ever? I kind of don't think that was really Regina's dream, to be ruler. I thought Regina's whole thing was about being loved/liked/wanted/welcomed, not being kept out of everything. It was one of the most relatable things about her, that she felt like she was on the outside of this great group of people looking in all the time but never really invited. I thought she had created Storybrooke not to be mayor but so that her past was erased and they didn't all hate her for the shit she'd done. It was the ultimate do over.

It is a really weird choice, IMO, for her. I'd more have assumed her big moment/happy ending, would be everyone cheering her on as she married her True Love of the Season after heroically saving them all from certain doom, not being crowned emperor of all things everywhere. Eh, shows you that this whole mess was never about love in the first place. It was always just about power. Pfth

Edited May 7, 2018 by Mabinogia

[superloislane]

2 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

I was going to hold out hope that the Queen of the Universe thing was part of all the wackiness that would subsequently be cleared up, but they did say the ending was in the place it began, and that's probably the coronation, so ugh.

There is a spoiler that Emma/Hook/baby come in late and say 'Sorry I'm late' which is what Regina said in the pilot showing up at Snowing's wedding. So yeah they're doing that...

[KingOfHearts]

It's crazy how they write Regina's character. For most of S7, she had nothing to do and she might as well have been wallpaper. Now, all of a sudden, she gets the TLK to break the curse and she's being hailed as Queen of the World. None of it has anything to do with the rest of the season. Here I thought Regina was beyond self-gratification and wanted to help others. At least in 3B, where she pulled light magic out of only God knows where, she had some relevance because Zelena was her sister. It made some thematic sense for her to be the one to take her down. But here? I can't believe I'm saying this, but I would have preferred Henry and Jacinda's kiss to break the curse and Henry being the hero of the finale. (Since this whole season has been about his aspirations to have his own story and guilt over not being able to save his family in the first place.) If you're going to pick a bad plot, at least follow through with it.

Edited May 7, 2018 by KingOfHearts

[rogvortex58]

Oh well. At least her happy ending doesn’t come at the expense of other people’s finally.

It’s not like she had to cast a curse this time. I also doubt that Tiana, Merida or Elsa are going to have to pass rule of their kingdoms down to her. They still have their own people and land to take care of.

Edited May 7, 2018 by rogvortex58

[KingOfHearts]

That's weird. Blue, Grumpy, and Granny are all in photos, but they're not listed as guest stars. Same thing happened in the Flower Child episode with the nymph mother and the mean girls.

I don't see how the Wish Henry flashbacks won't be offensive. He's orphaned because of Regina.

Edited May 7, 2018 by KingOfHearts

[Rumsy4]

6 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

I don't see how the Wish Henry flashbacks won't be offensive. He's orphaned because of Regina.

I know, right? But it will end with Wish Henry paying obeisance to the Queen Mother of the Multiverse. 

[KingOfHearts]

13 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

I know, right? But it will end with Wish Henry paying obeisance to the Queen Mother of the Multiverse. 

The writers really didn't think things through with the Wish Realm. If you say it's fake, that creates a ton of problems for not only S6, but S7. Sorry, Alice - your dad is a hologram. It's like an episode of Star Trek: Voyager - a haphazard perspective of moral ramifications. 

We just saw how much Regina looooves her son, confirmed by another TLK. Now we get to see what killing his Wish version's grandparents and leaving him without a family will do. She's definitely mother of the year.

Edited May 7, 2018 by KingOfHearts

[CCTC]

6 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

The writers really didn't think things through with the Wish Realm. If you say it's fake, that creates a ton of problems for not only S6, but S7. Sorry, Alice - your dad is a hologram. It's like an episode of Star Trek: Voyager - a haphazard perspective of moral ramifications. 

The sloppy thing about the wish realm inconsistency, is not that there were consistencies in later seasons, but they already had a major inconsistency in the very episode it was introduced.   Regina is the one who was causal about killing the fake Charmings because they were not real, and then failed to return to the son she loved so much because she was enchanted by seeing Robin who she eventually brought back with her.  She certainly did not treat him as if he was not real, even though she had no problems murdering other people in that realm.

[Free]

1 hour ago, KingOfHearts said:

It's crazy how they write Regina's character. For most of S7, she had nothing to do and she might as well have been wallpaper. Now, all of a sudden, she gets the TLK to break the curse and she's being hailed as Queen of the World. None of it has anything to do with the rest of the season. Here I thought Regina was beyond self-gratification and wanted to help others. At least in 3B, where she pulled light magic out of only God knows where, she had some relevance because Zelena was her sister. It made some thematic sense for her to be the one to take her down. But here? I can't believe I'm saying this, but I would have preferred Henry and Jacinda's kiss to break the curse and Henry being the hero of the finale. (Since this whole season has been about his aspirations to have his own story and guilt over not being able to save his family in the first place.) If you're going to pick a bad plot, at least follow through with it.

 

It's like they tacked on an old Regina fulfilment fan fiction on to the final episodes when they had to rush wrap everything.

From this season alone, she went from running a bar as Roni to the ruler of the realms at the end without any build up whatsoever.

21 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

We just saw how much Regina looooves her son, confirmed by another TLK. Now we get to see what killing his Wish version's grandparents and leaving him without a family will do. She's definitely mother of the year.

She's apparently even more than that at the end of the series according to the spoilers for some reason.

Edited May 7, 2018 by Free

[KingOfHearts]

40 minutes ago, CCTC said:

The sloppy thing about the wish realm inconsistency, is not that there were consistencies in later seasons, but they already had a major inconsistency in the very episode it was introduced.   Regina is the one who was causal about killing the fake Charmings because they were not real, and then failed to return to the son she loved so much because she was enchanted by seeing Robin who she eventually brought back with her.  She certainly did not treat him as if he was not real, even though she had no problems murdering other people in that realm.

She couldn't bear to kill Wish Henry, but Wish Snowing is fair game. Yeah, okay.

[companionenvy]

Beyond all the other objections I have to it, Regina being Queen of all Worlds is just narratively bizarre. Let's pretend that Regina actually had the brilliant redemption arc A&E thinks it gave her. In that case, maybe, maybe I can, morally speaking, buy her ending up as queen, under very different circumstances and with very different intentions. Shanna, I take your point that generally, redemption means not going back to a version of your old life, but whereas Hook really couldn't have been a "reformed" pirate, in theory Regina could have become a good queen.

The problem is that even then that would still only make sense if this were a show about Regina, in which her arc took priority and characters like the Charmings were pretty much disposable. But Regina was never more than one of the leads in an ensemble show whose primary lead was Jennifer Morrison. Given that, even if I were sincerely invested in Regina's transformation and wanted her to get a happy ending, I'm just not sure why we should want her to become the biggest winner of all winners at the expense of other characters whose journeys we've followed - and other characters with WAY more of a title, morally and literally, to precisely the position she now holds.

Whatever other issues I had with 6.22, it was Emma-centric and since Regina was being acknowledged as queen of Storybrooke - which doesn't have royalty--it didn't bother me all that much. Again, accepting it requires ignoring how botched Regina's redemption arc was, but it wasn't actually giving her massive power. In the context of a land without royalty, the dwarves bowing to her and putting "queen" on her door was as much a joke as anything else; it was essentially a signal of acceptance that played off of her past. It also didn't raise any questions of right to rule, since there's no particular reason that Snow and David would want or feel obligated to assume what will presumably now be an elective position as mayor of a small town in Maine because they had been (well, sort of, in Charming's case) hereditary royalty in the EF.

The scenario being outlined above is very different. First of all, to the extent that - because it is bringing back the old characters -- it serves as a finale to the show as a whole, having everyone show up as guests to Regina's party undermines their stories. If it were Henry's coronation, that would make total sense; its a passing of the torch to the next generation. But even if I accept the ridiculous premise that Snowing and Emma are best buds with Regina, having them there mostly to prop her happy ending does, to me, retroactively cheapen their roles in the narrative, especially as Regina's role winds up being queen of all queens. While I haven't watched much of S7, I've been following fandom closely enough to get the sense that it makes at least as little sense as a finale to the reboot, the premise of which was Henry going off to find his own story. Again, the obvious and narratively fitting conclusion would be for HIM to wind up as the ruler of one of the realms. Giving it to Regina is frankly bizarre - as was giving her the TLK with Henry ,which by rights should have gone to either Jacinda or, better yet, Lucy. 

But then there's also a practical problem. Regina became Queen in the first place by usurping the throne from Snow in what was apparently a hereditary dynasty. So...she has literally zero right to the position. Even if Snowing, Emma and Henry are willing to cheerfully resign all right to the crown, they really shouldn't be willing or able to abdicate the claims of Lucy, 9-year old Neal, and Emma's infant daughter, all of whom would be next in line. Even if we take the Charming family completely out of the equation, why should the crown go to Regina rather than, say, Granny? Even if we buy her as redeemed, Regina was a horrible queen with no right to her title. On what logic do some of the same people she's victimized wind up acclaiming her their sovereign if there's literally almost anyone else who wants or could plausibly take the job? 

Of course, I know what logic: TS; TW. 

[Kktjones]

I have never been happier with my decision to stop watching at the end of S6. They just couldn't resist one last chance for everyone to bow down to Regina (even Wish Henry who was effectively orphaned by her). I have NO desire to see Snow & Emma once again kiss her ass and tell her how wonderful she is. In fact, this ending pretty much ruins S1 for me. I can't imagine sitting through all of Regina's horrible and evil behavior knowing that not only does she never get her comeuppance, but that the series ends with her canonization. Just give me all those gifs of Emma and Hook with their baby and I'll be happy to skip the rest.

[Shanna Marie]

1 hour ago, companionenvy said:

But then there's also a practical problem. Regina became Queen in the first place by usurping the throne from Snow in what was apparently a hereditary dynasty. So...she has literally zero right to the position. Even if Snowing, Emma and Henry are willing to cheerfully resign all right to the crown, they really shouldn't be willing or able to abdicate the claims of Lucy, 9-year old Neal, and Emma's infant daughter, all of whom would be next in line. Even if we take the Charming family completely out of the equation, why should the crown go to Regina rather than, say, Granny? Even if we buy her as redeemed, Regina was a horrible queen with no right to her title. On what logic do some of the same people she's victimized wind up acclaiming her their sovereign if there's literally almost anyone else who wants or could plausibly take the job? 

That's pretty much where I was going with the idea that Regina shouldn't be allowed to be queen as her happy ending. It's not so much that she can't be queen anywhere, even if she's a good queen. It's that she doesn't get to be queen of these people since she murdered the last king and took Snow's throne from her. A redeemed villain's happy ending shouldn't be to be given the thing she took through her villainy when she was a villain. I might be okay with her ending up as a queen if, say, she met some widowed king and married him and made a new start in a new land, and this time she vowed to be a good queen and a good stepmother. But she can't be queen over all these people, and doing that effectively ruins the entire series.

4 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

The thing is, is that even her "happy ending" anymore? Was it ever? I kind of don't think that was really Regina's dream, to be ruler. I thought Regina's whole thing was about being loved/liked/wanted/welcomed, not being kept out of everything.

In that case, she already got her happy ending at the end of season six, when she was part of the big family gathering at Granny's. Actually, she got that back in 3B when she was included in all the family dinners at Granny's. That reversed the oh so sad moment when she cried because her victims didn't invite her to join them for dinner.

[Inquirer]

It's hilarious how at the start of the show, A&E said "ultimately the last happy ending will be Emma's" but now it's "we saved Regina's happy ending for last".

Quote

Whatever other issues I had with 6.22, it was Emma-centric 

True, and as was discussed earlier on the thread, her final big heroic moment of letting Gideon stab her in order to save both him and Light Magic would have been great, (and in its own context it arguably still is great), had it not been for the show's screwy morality about how heroes shouldn't fight back and how much Emma was made to suffer because of her doing good. 6x22, for all of its many, many faults, would have been a better conclusion than this, which just feels like the worst kind of fanfiction.

Edited May 8, 2018 by Inquirer

[PixiePaws1]

I think A&E are vindictive arseholes. They blame the audience that left for the s7 failure instead of the  crappy...everything...they did to destroy their own show, which drove a lot of us away. I think they have a special loathing for CSers that left. Even with their permanent  Regina-boner..they know a significant portion of viewers are only interested in seeing CS plus 1 and Snowing. By putting that one scene of the CS family in the Regina arse-kissing scene...it is a very special FU to those who love the characters that the vicious bitch insulted and shat all over.

Now, if I wrote that scene..Granny would walk in right behind Emma..then jump out and shoot Regina between the eyes while shouting..'Take your lasagne and shove it up your arse!'

Edited May 8, 2018 by PixiePaws1

[KingOfHearts]

1 hour ago, PixiePaws1 said:

Now, if I wrote that scene..Granny would walk in right behind Emma..then jump out and shoot Regina between the eyes while shouting..'Take your lasagne and shove it up your arse!'

It's always been my headcanon that Regina stole Granny's lasagna recipe just before Owen and Kurt had dinner with her. It's been her "specialty" ever since.

Edited May 8, 2018 by KingOfHearts

[Domenicholas]

I have so many questions about how the fusions are going to work.

1. What's going to happen to characters who are dead in one world, but alive in the other? Will Pan and Cruella come back to life? Will Snow and Charming die?

2. What's going to happen to characters without a counterpart, like Alice, Robin, Gideon, and more? Will they disappear, or will their relationships just be co-oped by existing characters (e.g. Alice is now the daughter of Real!Hook, Robin and Roland are the children of Wish!Robin, etc...)

3. Do the fusions only refer to the main universe and the Wish Realm, or every single conceptually singular characters? Will Jacinda!Ella and Ashley!Ella fuse? Red Queen!Anastasia and Stepsister!Anastasia? Hansel!Jack and Jacqueline!Jack? That sounds like a mess, but this is OUAT.

[Shanna Marie]

On the bright side, it looks like Jacinda and Lucy will be trapped in glass balls for a good portion of at least this next episode, if not going into part 2, so in that one respect, they do seem to have been listening to the audience.

[KingOfHearts]

We've got an infinite multiverse, but only the Land Without Magic, the Enchanted Forest, the Disenchanted Forest, and the Wish Realm have any relevance or "merging". There's really no reason those 4 realms should be connected, other than random chance. They should just glue together the entire multiverse while they're at it. Don't stop there. I want Chinese, French, Italian, Russian, Polynesian, Martian, and Wild West Cinderella all merged into one.

Edited May 8, 2018 by KingOfHearts

[andromeda331]

17 hours ago, PixiePaws1 said:

I think A&E are vindictive arseholes. They blame the audience that left for the s7 failure instead of the  crappy...everything...they did to destroy their own show, which drove a lot of us away. I think they have a special loathing for CSers that left. Even with their permanent  Regina-boner..they know a significant portion of viewers are only interested in seeing CS plus 1 and Snowing. By putting that one scene of the CS family in the Regina arse-kissing scene...it is a very special FU to those who love the characters that the vicious bitch insulted and shat all over.

Now, if I wrote that scene..Granny would walk in right behind Emma..then jump out and shoot Regina between the eyes while shouting..'Take your lasagne and shove it up your arse!'

 

I agree. They never have and never will admit or realize they destroyed their own show. ONCE easily could have ran into ten seasons. They changed everything to focus on Regina (and Rumple) fans complained and they left. They kept doing more and more Regina. Ratings continue to fall. Season six with TWO Regina. Still failed to move the ratings up. But nope. They will still insisted it was the audience.  Who they'll give one final FU to them while giving Regina absolutely everything they can think of.    

Edited May 8, 2018 by andromeda331

[KingOfHearts]

7 minutes ago, andromeda331 said:

I agree. They never have and never will admit or realize they destroyed their own shown. ONCE easily could have ran into ten seasons. They changed everything to focus on Regina (and Rumple) fans complained and they left. They kept doing more and more Regina. Ratings continue to fall. Season six with TWO Regina. Still failed to move the ratings up. But nope. They will still insisted it was the audience.  Who they'll give one final FU to them while giving Regina absolutely everything they can think of.    

Here's a thought, A&E - maybe audiences like heroes. Maybe that's why they're the protagonists 95% of the time. People do not watch shows based on Disney brands to see "progressive" villains protagonists. There's darker shows with darker subject matter to cover that. But this is the show with Tinkerbell and Disney princesses. This is not Penny Dreadful.

[CCTC]

4 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

This is not Penny Dreadful.

Even in Penny Dreadful, they did not decide Dracula was misunderstood at the end of Season 1 and bring him into the fold the next year.

I remember thinking back when I was watching season 1 really looking forward to see how Regina would get her comeuppance.   I never dreamt she would be reformed.

12 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

Here's a thought, A&E - maybe audiences like heroes.

They also like to see the villain to eventually pay the price.  I remember thinking back when I was watching season 1 really looking forward to see how Regina would get her comeuppance.   I never dreamt she would be reformed.

[Inquirer]

1 hour ago, CCTC said:

Even in Penny Dreadful, they did not decide Dracula was misunderstood at the end of Season 1 and bring him into the fold the next year.

Well to be fair, that's because Dracula wasn't in Season 1. He was in Season 3 (the last season).

[Rumsy4]

This spoiler has killed what little rewatch potential this show had. 

[KingOfHearts]

6 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

This spoiler has killed what little rewatch potential this show had. 

I can just imagine Regina being in the last frame. Her image will forever be ingrained as the closing of the show.

REGINA winks at camera.

REGINA (VO): "See, I did get my happy ending. They all fell for my long con. Suck it, ABC."

Edited May 8, 2018 by KingOfHearts

[CCTC]

6 hours ago, Inquirer said:

Well to be fair, that's because Dracula wasn't in Season 1. He was in Season 3 (the last season).

That's right - season 1 ended up being some other vampire   At the time of season 1, since Mina Harker was a victim, I assumed the master vampire was Dracula.  I forgot Dracula actually came on in season 3, which I  barely remember (loved the show, but it got a bit off track as well). 

Aside from Regina being crowned Queen of all things, the whole merging of realms seems a bit too complicated for the time they have left.  In two episodes they need to introduce WishRumpleas the big bad, he has to quickly do something that will threaten all realms, the heroes will flounder, they will have to make a rash decision to merging all the realms,, they will have to fit in all the cameos, and they will have to have time adoring Regina at the end.   I suspect it is going to seem rushed and not make a lot of sense.  Too bad, I would love to see Caryle really get some good time to dig his teeth into being the big bad, but in the end, his reign of terror will probably be like the other villains - illogical, fast, and in the end thwarted quickly in a two minute scene.

Edited May 8, 2018 by CCTC

[Rumsy4]

24 minutes ago, CCTC said:

they will have to make a rash decision to merging all the realms

Maybe Regina is the one who comes up with this 'brilliant' plan, and that's why they crown her Queen of the Multiverse. Because you know--if not for her, they would all be living Happily Ever After decades ago. Oh, wait...

[Mitch]

13 hours ago, Domenicholas said:

I have so many questions about how the fusions are going to work.

1. What's going to happen to characters who are dead in one world, but alive in the other? Will Pan and Cruella come back to life? Will Snow and Charming die?

2. What's going to happen to characters without a counterpart, like Alice, Robin, Gideon, and more? Will they disappear, or will their relationships just be co-oped by existing characters (e.g. Alice is now the daughter of Real!Hook, Robin and Roland are the children of Wish!Robin, etc...)

3. Do the fusions only refer to the main universe and the Wish Realm, or every single conceptually singular characters? Will Jacinda!Ella and Ashley!Ella fuse? Red Queen!Anastasia and Stepsister!Anastasia? Hansel!Jack and Jacqueline!Jack? That sounds like a mess, but this is OUAT.

You've already thought more about this then the writers!!!

[Rumsy4]

It doesn't sound like the characters themselves will fuse (talk about awkward). This sounds more of a Jekyll/Hyde situation where if you killed Jekyll, Hyde also died. 

[Mitch]

Are we sure this spoiler stuff is true...(I don't look at any other Once stuff but here...) and if it is..does Regina rule over the LWOM..(which is DIFFERENT from OUR LWOM...) and if so..how do all the people in the world feel about that??? Trump and Putin agreed to it and are bowing down to Regina, whose only experience is running a medieval like kingdom and a small town in Maine that really didn't need anyone to run it as the Curse did it??? This is stupid even for this show so I can't wait to watch it..and then read all the raves the FB posters will say about it!

[Inquirer]

6 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

Maybe Regina is the one who comes up with this 'brilliant' plan, and that's why they crown her Queen of the Multiverse. 

That's exactly what it is - one of the call sheets flat-out says "Regina has brought all the realms together".

[Souris]

1 hour ago, Inquirer said:

That's exactly what it is - one of the call sheets flat-out says "Regina has brought all the realms together".

Does that have to be literal, though? Could it be metaphorical? As in "Regina has brought people from all the realms together to witness her coronation?" Like bringing the family all together?

[companionenvy]

I'm also stuck on the logistics of the realms merging. At minimum, it seems like it would be really odd to have multiple iterations of the same people existing in the same realm. But if our Rumple can kill himself to kill Wish!Rumple, does that mean that if Whook gets killed in a sword-fight somewhere in the EF, Hook Prime is going to drop dead in Storybrooke? Or is there a proximity factor, where it somehow only matters if you're actually physically close?

And does the realms merging include the LWOM that contains Storybrooke and Hyperion Heights? If so, how does that work - outside of those two small pockets, almost no one has any idea that magic exists. 

[KingOfHearts]

I really don't like Rumple sacrificing himself to save Hook. The writers are trying to be poetic, but Rumple is going to be forever hailed as a hero for it. He doesn't care about saving Hook - he just wants to get to Belle. Hook (and possibly WHook) is going to have to owe his life to Rumple for as long as he lives. Also, Rumple's dodged death so many times that for him to go out like this is pretty anticlimactic. He's the Dark One to end all Dark Ones, the very reason this show's premise even came to exist in his universe. His "heroic sacrifice" is going to make me gag. He already did this at the end of 3A, and that was to save everybody. 

[Rumsy4]

1 minute ago, KingOfHearts said:

He already did this at the end of 3A, and that was to save everybody. 

Even then, I’m sure he thought of noone beyond Belle and Neal. Henry at the most.

If he kills WRumple to save the Multiverse, it still seems like he’s only doing it so he can gain some karma points and be reunited with Belle. 

How can he even be killed by crushing his own heart? I thought only the Dagger could kill Dark Ones. 

[KingOfHearts]

33 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

If he kills WRumple to save the Multiverse, it still seems like he’s only doing it so he can gain some karma points and be reunited with Belle.

He'd be a goner if this were "The Good Place".

[Inquirer]

1 hour ago, KingOfHearts said:

I really don't like Rumple sacrificing himself to save Hook. The writers are trying to be poetic, but Rumple is going to be forever hailed as a hero for it. He doesn't care about saving Hook - he just wants to get to Belle. Hook (and possibly WHook) is going to have to owe his life to Rumple for as long as he lives. Also, Rumple's dodged death so many times that for him to go out like this is pretty anticlimactic. He's the Dark One to end all Dark Ones, the very reason this show's premise even came to exist in his universe. His "heroic sacrifice" is going to make me gag. He already did this at the end of 3A, and that was to save everybody. 

No, he doesn't die to save Hook - Hook isn't anywhere in the finale except with Emma at the end. He dies to save WHook and Tilly, and just them.  The real Hook won't owe him anything or hail him as a hero. 

I actually think we oughta wait and see how it plays out - it could be that there truly is no guarantee he'll be reunited with Belle without the whole Guardian thing happening, and that by killing himself this way he's taking a huge risk, but is taking it because he really does care about Wish Hook and Tilly. 

But I agree that even so, it still lacks the effectiveness of his 3A death. They really should have kept him dead after that.

Edited May 8, 2018 by Inquirer

[KingOfHearts]

13 minutes ago, Inquirer said:

No, he doesn't die to save Hook - Hook isn't anywhere in the finale except with Emma at the end. He dies to save WHook and Tilly, and just them.  The real Hook won't owe him anything or hail him as a hero. 

Hook and WHook are merged, so if one dies the other does too.