Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[HoodlumSheep]

I'm kind of happy, cause they kinda sort of answered two of my questions (which I'm sure plenty of other people asked as well, but it still makes me feel sort of special). I asked about the red queen in 4b, and if there was an upcoming character death (except i didn't ask if it was 'major'). I'm still hoping Sidney bites the dust. GE needs to be freed from Once, unless if it involves flashbacks.

I think A&E will try their best to squeeze in Anastasia (red queen), even if it's for a small cameo. Anastasia was my absolute favorite character from Wonderland, and one of my top characters for the entire Once Universe.

The Netflix to Hulu+ comment made me chuckle. I'll take it.

[Rumsy4]

I guess we won't be seeing who Hook traded his ship to this season, if there won't be flashbacks to the missing year this season? Boo... 

 

I wonder if Lily is going to end up being one of the three villains of 4B, making it Emma's fault she turned into one? That would be so on par for the course in this show. :-p

 

They should just shut up about Graham. 

 

They have the last moment of the show planned. How wonderful! *sighs heavily*

Edited November 1, 2014 by Rumsy4

[legaleagle53]

They have the last moment of the show planned. How wonderful! *sighs heavily*

 

Yeah, because that worked out so well on How I Met Your Mother.

[HoodlumSheep]

They have the last moment of the show planned. How wonderful! *sighs heavily*

I have high hopes for the last episode. It's pretty much the only hope I have left for this show, even though I'll still be entertained and watching when it ends with Snow hooking up with Whale, Emma going to new york, and Captain Charming running off together to go on adventures with an occasional camp out in the woods with Robin Hood.

I honestly find myself chanting (not out loud obviously),

"If they can make a fantastic ending for Wonderland, they can do it for Once."

[legaleagle53]

The problem, though, is that having the series finale planned out this far in advance doesn't take into account the way the story and the characters evolve over time.  How I Met Your Mother had the final moments of its final episode planned (and even filmed) before the pilot had even aired.  As a result, nine years later, we ended up with a finale that was totally illogical by that point because of the way the story and the characters had evolved over that time.  It was such a jump-the-shark moment that it forever turned viewers off any other shows that those producers might come up with in the future.

 

Wonderland's finale worked because it was supposed to have a limited run of only one season.  It was therefore easy to plan a finale early on that was a logical and satisfying way to end the show.  With a show whose run is indefinite (such as OUAT), that becomes much more of a liability if the producers aren't willing or able to modify their advance planning.

Edited November 1, 2014 by legaleagle53

[retrograde]

The "major character death" is definitely the most interesting thing in there, at least if we take it at face value (though of course they may be using a very liberal interpretation of "major" or it's a "death" that isn't really a death, which are both entirely likely). Robin? Belle? Those are really the only two major-ish characters (and Robin isn't major, but I bet the writers would describe him as such) I can think of that are expendable. They simply can't kill Emma, Snow, Charming or Regina. They don't seem to know what to do with Rumple, but I can't see them offing him (unless the actor somehow gets out of his contract). Hook seems very popular, and killing another of Emma's love interests would be too much and also kinda pointless. I guess Henry has to stay around. 

 

i'd happily see Robin or Belle die, especially if it propels Regina or Rumple to full-blown evil again. I don't think they will ever make Regina 100% evil again, so if it happens, my money is on Belle. 

[stealinghome]

I'm betting Sidney is not long for this world and they're using a very liberal definition of "major."

[InsertWordHere]

 

Will Emma ever confront Regina (Lana Parrilla) for killing Graham (Jamie Dornan)?

Horowitz: First of all, she doesn’t know that Regina killed Graham. If you look back at season one, before Emma believed, when she talks to Henry (Jared Gilmore) about the aftermath of Graham’s death, she says what the autopsy was, which was an aneurysm. She still believes that.

Kitsis: She believed it at the time, and then things have happened.

Horowitz: She actually doesn’t know that Regina was behind it. That’s never been something that has come up. If it did, I’m sure she would take issue with it.

I'm not sure if I should talk about this here or in the media thread, but since it's a spoiler question I guess it belongs here.

 

This directly contradicts what they said post-Season One about a scene they filmed that had Emma blaming Regina for Graham's death. It turned out it was a deleted, unreleased scene, and thus not canon so I won't take any hypothetical Emma/Regina confrontation over Graham as a retcon, not that I believe it will ever happen. My issue is that A&E didn't realize or recall at the time they talked about that scene that it wasn't in the actual canon. That means they wrapped season one with the intent that in-show, Emma knew Regina murdered Graham. They have had two seasons and 5 episodes to remedy the issue. I don't mean they have to have Emma find out about Graham, but it should be clear in the canon of the show that she doesn't know. It should be treated as some big "what's going to happen when Emma finds out the truth" hook for the show, but it's not. It's a non-issue. We constantly have to play this ridiculous guessing game over what characters know or don't know (what do Snow and David know about Neal, do any characters besides Hook believe or even care that Rumple murdered his first wife etc) and it's getting extremely tiresome. This is supposed to be the stuff good drama is made of, but this show ignores the wealth of character-driven drama they could mine in favor of trite, repetitive "plot twists" every.damn.time.

[RadioGirl27]

Everytime A&E open their mouths about Graham they make things even worse.

About the possible death, they said major character not regular character, so it can be almost anybody, except Regina, Snow, Emma and Henry. I hope is Robin and that makes Regina go crazy. But it would be something like when Charming was dead for a minute in 3B, but this time with Hook.

When they say the have the last episode planned, I think it is something along the lines of "they go back to Enchanted Forest" but nothing too detailed.

Edited November 1, 2014 by RadioGirl27

[KAOS Agent]

 

We constantly have to play this ridiculous guessing game over what characters know or don't know...and it's getting extremely tiresome.

 

I find it particularly interesting that Eddy and Adam weren't even on the same page with regards to this situation. Eddy's answer sounded more like he was seeing the problem with how they have framed this Emma/Regina situation and was trying to explain it away while Adam just stuck to Emma doesn't know and he doesn't care because it ruins his vision of Emma the Life Ruiner/St Regina. However, the audience's knowledge of what happened makes Regina's hypocrisy and her treatment of Emma so much the worse to watch. That the show doesn't acknowledge it and the showrunners don't seem to understand it (or at least, I don't think Adam does) is a major problem. And it's a problem that's not limited to Emma/Regina.

 

Their lack of understanding of a need for long term consequences for actions/plot twists is astounding. It makes me much less interested in the show because a great plot twist needs follow-up with actual consequences or why should I care? Killing Graham was supposed to be this huge game changer, but it was pretty much forgotten two episodes later. Regina locked Belle up for 30 years, but Rumpel's attempted revenge lasted one episode. Nothing to get excited about. It's sort of like where Robert is teasing that everything goes to hell for Rumpel at the end of 4A. Okay, so what? Belle leaves him for an episode? Does he die again? Looking further ahead, there is quite a bit of intriguing backstory built up for Maleficent, but I have zero optimism that her story will be treated decently at this point.

[kili]

They have the last moment of the show planned. How wonderful! *sighs heavily*

 

It worked for the Harry Potter series. If it is sufficiently vague like Henry reading the book to his grandchildren (zoom out of the modern looking room and he's in a castle), then it could work.

 

The "major character death" is definitely the most interesting thing in there, at least if we take it at face value (though of course they may be using a very liberal interpretation of "major" or it's a "death" that isn't really a death, which are both entirely likely). Robin? Belle?

 

I suspect it is Hook and that he's only believed to be dead. They've been doing too much construction on the Hook/Emma relationship for nothing to happen. They are having him be her port in the storm. He's always there to retrieve a box, or check out the electrical situation or check out a vault. He's there to give her a hug or a kiss when she needs it. I can see Adam and Eddie totally loving pulling the rug out on Emma (and have her experience what she did to Regina - sigh - no I don't see it that way, but A&E clearly do). A&E don't usually spend this much effort building something up unless there is a pay-off. Emma will need somebody to do something and go to phone Hook and start crying.

 

I think the three clues are that we are going to get a major death,  we see Lily again and the hunt for the book's author takes us out of Storybrooke. I think that the theory that the hat spits out people in the World Without Magic with a star birth mark is correct. Hook sacrifices himself and gets hatted. Everybody takes the hat from Rumple. 4A ends with people believing he is dead. We might get a scene of Hook doing something in our world if they want to give us a twist like 3A.  The hunt for the author leads out of Storybrooke (for Reasons, only Emma and Henry can leave. Perhaps Snow because Regina could leave when she cast the curse. Maybe Charming can too since he shares a heart. Regina may be able to leave for Reasons) and they run into a Hook who does not recognize them.

 

Either that, or Charming gets hatted and Snow knows he's still alive somewhere because of the heart thing. Maybe both Hook and Charming get hatted and they can bond  over their star birthmarks.

 

Something with Lily happens. Restoring Hook/Charming's memory also restores Lily's memory/magic and she is a big baddy. Maybe it happens when she is totally in a different part of the world and she makes her way to Storybrooke.

[HeimrArnadalr]

"Last moment of the series" is probably a black screen with the words 'The End' on it.

[kili]

"Last moment of the series" is probably a black screen with the words 'The End' on it.

 

Shouldn't it be "And they lived happily ever after"?

[sharky]

Yea, I'm not worried about the last moment planned out. They did the same thing for Lost and I liked that finale so it's not necessarily a bad thing. I think maybe many of us were scarred by HIMYM.

[YaddaYadda]

I don't really know how you can have the finale planned so long in advance, but in the case of HIMYM (and I didn't watch the show but read about how pissed everyone was), it might have been a case of the series lasted 9 years. 

 

A&E probably have an idea how everything ends.  I mean they were planning on killing off Charming right off the bat and Hook was supposed to be what a 3-4 episodes character and I'm sure Neal was supposed to still be alive and from what I read, Belle and Rumple weren't even supposed to fall in love.  So yeah...

 

Beyond that, we hope so, we hope so, we hope so, WE HOPE SO!

 

Character's death this season, all signs seem to be pointing to Hook.  Between the monster comment, being trapped under DQ's massive icicles and the comment about being good at surviving (that's not a first time comment) and Rumple telling him he'll owe him until he basically dies...yeah.   Once's deaths are not GoT deaths.

Edited November 1, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[HoodlumSheep]

I'm betting Sidney is not long for this world and they're using a very liberal definition of "major."

That's what I was trying to hint at when I asked my question, who knows what the other people were thinking if they asked a similar question.

Sidney or the snow queen will probably die, although i don't know if they'll kill Elsa and Anna's aunt, so she's more likely to be trapped/sealed away somehow.

I don't think having an ending planned is a bad thing. We don't know if A&E have it all planned out frame by frame, or if they have more of a general idea of what they picture that last episode/scene to be. Yes things can evolve to the point where the planned finale would make no sense, but for his show? It's all about everyone getting their happy ending. A few characters could have flip flop sides again by the end or a couple more people might die but for Once I don't think the characters will have evolved to the point where a seemingly planned ending wouldn't still work.

Also, with the Wonderland finale I was aiming more at the quality of it. I balled like a baby (don't judge me). It was just so perfect.

[retrograde]

I guess there is also a pretty good chance someone major "dies" but is brought back to life with TLK. In which case, Emma, Hook, Regina, or Hood are all the most likely suspects. 

[ShadowFacts]

The Wonderland ending was wonderful, indeed. That show didn't meander around much, it had a beginning, reasonably clearly delineated plot and flashbacks, all leading to a satisfying end.

I also remember the Gilmore Girls creator had her ending scene planned from the beginning, and that was just a general setting/conversation that pretty much defined the girls' relationship.

[myril]

Is there going to be a major character death this season?

Kitsis: I hope so

 

He hopes so? Am I the only one thinking, that is some twisted, messed up way to put it?  Killing characters is cool, is drama, is fun, something to look forward too? I mean, I get that as writer one wants to write interesting stories, challenge the characters you've created, put them on the edge and beyond, and death, killing a character they have a connection with is a way to do that, still this phrasing of Kitsis makes me cringe.

Edited November 1, 2014 by katusch

[FurryFury]

I'm almost sure it's either Sidney or a Disney Death (with the most likely victim being Hook). Probably even both.

[RadioGirl27]

He hopes so? Am I the only one thinking, that is some twisted, messed up way to put it?  Killing characters is cool, is drama, is fun, something to look forward too? I mean, I get that as writer one wants to write interesting stories, challenge the characters you've created, put them on the edge and beyond, and death, killing a character they have a connection with is a way to do that, still this phrasing of Kitsis makes me cringe.

Sometimes I'm amazed that they are paid writers. There are many way to word that maybe someone is going to died and keep it ambiguous, without sounding so creepy.

Since 4x1, with the monster comment, it's pretty obvious that something is going to happen to Hook. My only doubt it's if it's going to be the cliffhanger or if it would happen before the season finale and we would have a TLK, act of true love or magical tears (like in Tangled) to revive him.

[l star]

I wish we could just leave Graham in the past. I am probably biased because I wasn't as involved in the series when he died but I thought it was all very clear. Regina killed him. No one else knows. I suppose they could bring his murder up again but why? He was a 7 Ep character. Emma had one kiss and maybe a crush with him. I think Emma wanting to be Regina's friend is stupid too but there are plenty more current reasons. Like the fact that Regina doesn't want to be her friend.

Since as far as I've heard, they didn't have Jared film any scenes for the end I can live with them knowing what they want. Unlike HIMYM, they can still adjust the dialogue even in a predetermined scene to reflect the current characters.

Would a dwarf count as a major character? They are very well known characters for Disney. Of the mains, my vote is Belle. Unfortunately I don't think Robin or Hook will die anytime soon. Their dead loves have been too much a part of their stories to kill another this fast. Belle on the other is hand is useless. Which character, besides Rumple would really care if she died? And he has already chosen power over her more than once.

[InsertWordHere]

I actually am not that fond of Graham and don't view him as an important character, so this isn't coming from a place of bitterness that the character is gone, but over the manner of his death. This should be important. It's the worst crime Regina has (successfully) committed in Storybrooke and it shouldn't be something that no one knows about. That is my issue. Even if I was a fan of Regina, I would still say this, just as I want Hook's (or Rumple's, but I'm not a fan of his either) major moral failings (although I'd guess my opinion on those failings might vary greatly from his critics' opinions) to be out in the open.

About the spoilers, I'm still thinking there's going to be another game changer at the end of 4A.

Edited November 1, 2014 by InsertWordHere

[YaddaYadda]

About the spoilers, I'm still thinking there's going to be another game changer at the end of 4A.

 

Probably another curse since the writers can't come up with something original. 

[Jean]

 

another game changer at the end of 4A

Well they haven't had one since S1 finale so maybe they're about due. Not that that game changer led to anything good for the show.

 

I wonder if A&E gets irked that people/media won't let Graham go. Seriously ruins their rhetoric of the biggest victim ever with the shiny halo right? It's probably killing them that they can't even use their lame logic of how the rape never happened cause we didn't see it onscreen. Good thing Jamie Dornan is now too big for this show or else they would have him come back and we'd see that Graham victimized the poor poor soul sucker. And you know the media will keep asking them questions about Graham just so they can throw Dornan's name in the article for hits.

 

There's another interview with Robert on givememyremote. Nothing new or spoilery. Just a sound bite about how he never wants Rumple to do the right thing because it would mean the death of his character. I think that's a fair assessment since the last time he did the right thing with Pan, Rumple did "die." Robert's been a lot more vocal this year hasn't he?

[Shanna Marie]

I wonder if A&E gets irked that people/media won't let Graham go. Seriously ruins their rhetoric of the biggest victim ever with the shiny halo right? It's probably killing them that they can't even use their lame logic of how the rape never happened cause we didn't see it onscreen.

They should have expected it since the current plot line with Regina pretty much mirrors what she did to Emma in throwing a wrench into a promising relationship before it could get going. Except Regina did it on purpose deliberately to keep Graham away from Emma and Emma was saving a life. But I don't think the writers have realized that they created this symmetry in letting Regina suffer what she's done to other people. Of course, her pain is the worst pain ever.

 

My vote is on Hook for the major character death, probably due to falling foreshadowing anvils. But I don't think he'll be dead long enough for Emma to feel his absence. I think she'll manage to save him with her magic, and that will be what gets her over the fear that she'll hurt people with her magic.

[MadyGirl1987]

I don't really know how you can have the finale planned so long in advance, but in the case of HIMYM (and I didn't watch the show but read about how pissed everyone was), it might have been a case of the series lasted 9 years. 

That was not it for me. I thought it was the fact that it seemed forced. A lot of retconning and forcing to make it fit the ending they wanted, with no thought to what we had seen throughout the seasons. For example 

They kept showing, time and time (and time and time and time and time) again what a bad fit Robin and Ted were only to show them going back to each other.

They also 

spent SO MUCH time on Barney and Robin, making their freaking wedding the focal point of the final season, only to have them divorced about 15 min into the finale.

 

Can you tell I am still bitter about how the show ended? That said, I would think many shows have an idea where they want to end up, even having the last scene planned. That is just good storytelling. I think where it becomes a problem is if there is inflexibility and refusal to change if the story evolves to a point where that no longer makes sense. For example, if A&E want the ending to be the characters enjoying their happily ever afters, that would be a satisfying ending to a story about fairy tales and flexible to make it fit wherever the story ends up.

[stealinghome]

That said, I would think many shows have an idea where they want to end up, even having the last scene planned. That is just good storytelling. I think where it becomes a problem is if there is inflexibility and refusal to change if the story evolves to a point where that no longer makes sense. For example, if A&E want the ending to be the characters enjoying their happily ever afters, that would be a satisfying ending to a story about fairy tales and flexible to make it fit wherever the story ends up.

Co-signed. I actually do think it's a good idea to know where you want the series to end before you start writing--and given that we all know (and have always known) that OUAT's end is going to be all the principals getting their happy endings, I don't think we're going to have a problem here where the show outgrows one ending that the creators force. I also do think that whatever their other faults, Adam and Eddie are somewhat willing to course-correct and let the show evolve when it's clear something isn't clicking (Tamara&Greg, Nealfire and Emma/Neal).

 

The show's big problem, imo, is that Adam and Eddie have never bothered to come up with a good plan for those multiple seasons in between the middle and end. They don't really have a solid plan for any of the characters, not even Regina and Rumpel--at this point, both characters have whiplash from the "are they/aren't they redeemed?" stuff. Most of the characters have been either stagnant or keep replaying the same emotional arc over and over again because the writers just haven't sit down to think through long-term character arcs for them.

[scenicbyway]

I think Hook is the "death" this half season. Colin hasn't been filming as much. Hook hasn't been seen in scenes we'd expect him to be there for, like the big reunion on Main St. Adam said he was writing to the Empire Strikes back music when Han Solo is frozen in Carbonite. I could see freezing Hook and Emma having to save him or perhaps he's hatted and Emma goes after him just like he did in 3.11. I hope we don't have another failed TLK between them if Hook loses his memory...

[RadioGirl27]

We already knew this, but title for episode 11.

 

 

I think Hook is the "death" this half season. Colin hasn't been filming as much. Hook hasn't been seen in scenes we'd expect him to be there for, like the big reunion on Main St. Adam said he was writing to the Empire Strikes back music when Han Solo is frozen in Carbonite. I could see freezing Hook and Emma having to save him or perhaps he's hatted and Emma goes after him just like he did in 3.11. I hope we don't have another failed TLK between them if Hook loses his memory...

It seems he's been shooting in studio quite a lot, but yeah I'm pretty sure it's him. OUAT version of Hook seems to be inspired in:

- Han Solo: frozen in carbonite, saved by Princess Leia.

- Flynn Rider (Tangled): dies and is saved by the magic tears of Rapunzel.

- Westley (The Princess Bride): Buttercup thinks he is dead, but he is not. Later, she accepts to marry Humperdinck to save him.

So, yeah, it seems pretty obvious that, at some point, Hook is going to "die" and be saved by Emma. If it's not this half season, it would be later but we know how much A&E love this kind of parallels.

Edited November 1, 2014 by RadioGirl27

[Souris]

I think that the theory that the hat spits out people in the World Without Magic with a star birth mark is correct. Hook sacrifices himself and gets hatted. Everybody takes the hat from Rumple. 4A ends with people believing he is dead. We might get a scene of Hook doing something in our world if they want to give us a twist like 3A. 

 

That is an interesting theory that would fit. Star on the hat = star birthmark. I wonder if the people who are sent to our world would remember what happened?

 

I'm utterly convinced it's Hook who will "die." I'm trying not to worry it'll be a permanent death, because I think that would be a huge mistake (and a total dealbreaker for me). I’m mostly worried that it will be the cliffhanger for the midseason break, which would be TORTUROUS.

 

I have a few theories. He could get saved with a TLK (though I think it's too soon for the show to want to do a TLK with them) or magic tears. Maybe Hook will sacrifice himself, and that act of sacrifice will end up saving him, a la Anna in Frozen. Maybe he will be sucked into the hat (“true love is the greatest magic of all”) and Emma will jump in after him as he did with Zelena’s portal. He said he would follow her to the ends of the world or time; in a sense, death is the end of time. He didn’t know if she would follow him as he would her; that would let him know she would. I would enjoy an ep inside Hat World with Emma encountering trapped magical beings as she tries to save Hook and find a way for them to escape. Heck, maybe she could meet up with Maleficent and make a deal for her to help them in return for Mal being freed, too.

 

A particularly evil way he could be revived: via his hand. Perhaps there is enough “life essence” in his hand that Emma could reattach it (or force Rumple to, or Regina, since the show always has to make Regina be the one to “fix” things) and that essence could revive him.

 

Now, that would come with a serious drawback: Hook would revert to the Hook at the time the hand was severed. We’ve already seen the effect it had on him, which could have been foreshadowing. So 4B would involve Emma trying to get him back to the hero side of things and fall in love with her all over again. In a way, that would parallel Charming trying to get through to Snow after she took Rumple’s forgetting potion. Perhaps Emma would end up putting herself in harm’s way to save Hook, which would open him up to her love for him — and if the hand actually is cursed (I don’t trust Rumple that it isn’t), a TLK could then break it.

 

I could even imagine he revives after the hand is reattached, Emma kisses him, and he replies with something like “Well, thank you, lass. Who are you?”

 

I'm not saying I'd like that latter storyline, because UGH, but I could see it happening as a way for them to push the reset button and slow down the Captain Swan happy ending. I feel like A&E probably want more angst there for awhile.

[KAOS Agent]

I know that there are a lot of people who want true love's kiss for Captain Swan, but I'm not one of them. This is the only couple on the show that didn't have an immediate love connection and I really, really like that. I do not want them to go from first date to true love's kiss. Please just no. I fully believe that something is going to happen to Hook, but I'd much rather it be something like falling through a portal or something and Emma following to make sure he's not alone. It doesn't require her to declare undying love (honestly, she's not there), but it does allow for a demonstration of caring. And just so we're clear, this show is not killing off Hook. He's immensely popular. What are they going to do, kill off Hook and replace him with Robin? Can you just imagine them killing off Emma's boyfriend and replacing him with Regina's soulmate?

[stealinghome]

So 4B would involve Emma trying to get him back to the hero side of things and fall in love with her all over again.

Ugh, if the writers are reading this, please no. I had enough of one of Captain Swan running around after the other like a puppy in 3B. Booooooring to the nth.

 

Of course, that totally means that that's what we're getting, doesn't it? :\

[Souris]

What are they going to do, kill off Hook and replace him with Robin? Can you just imagine them killing off Emma's boyfriend and replacing him with Regina's soulmate?

 

With this show, anything that is pro-Regina is imaginable!

[Rumsy4]

I think Marian and the SQ are definite goners. But I don't think either of them can be called major characters. They most likely do mean Hook, and it will be temporary. Emma will save him, and he will be free from his life-debt to Rumple. I don't think any of the other regular or recurring characters are expendable. 

[Emma]

http://www.zap2it.com/blogs/once_upon_a_time_season_4_the_snow_queen_emma_family_business_shared_past_magic-2014-11

Short article with a couple quotes from Jen about tonight's episode.

[Long Days Night]

That is an interesting theory that would fit. Star on the hat = star birthmark. I wonder if the people who are sent to our world would remember what happened? (End quote)

Would have been great story if flashbacks showed Snow Queen was once hatted, which put her in the world w/out magic, which is how she ended up as Emma's foster mom. She could have recognized Emma's magic and leveraged that somehow to get her own power back and sent home, leaving Emma with one more abandonment story in the process. But I guess since we know she comes through the portal door, that's not going to play out.

[BoPeeps]

Well, we have a lot to look forward to! Whether it will make most of us happy campers is always highly debatable with A&E.

 

I'm guessing that Belle's possible control issues with the dagger AND The Snow Queen will ultimately have something to do with her mother's death. Even though the spoilers show her in an actual cliff hanger with Anna, there has to be some kind of maternal angst connection there between Belle's mom and the Snow Queen. I mean, isn't there ALWAYS a maternal angst connection on Once??? I am actually happy to see Belle get some plot to bite into even though she is far from my favorite character. This might shift the momentum in her favor. Rumple is pretty much shit out of luck but I would never consider him down for the count. With the self-proclaimed *it is going to be very bad for Rumple in 9 and 10* comments from Carlyle, we know there are a few episodes to build up to the pitch line for the cliffhanger.

 

The Frozen story, I think has been portrayed well so far. Especially with the deliciously cool calm, collected and lethal Snow Queens intro.

 

In spite of all the more *emotionally* dramatic ship-type fan obsessions right now, the actual plot lines being teased and developed with the Hat, Emma's past and Hook's possible/probable death or life suspension are getting back to the meat of the story telling. Henry and Regina? The author of the book. Oh gees. Yeah, well. they obviously and inevitably will be there until they come bursting forward in the second half during the Maleficent appearance. And we have yet to define why Will is snarkily present. But at least they have hinted at some juicy tidbits for him as well.

 

All things considered,( and most of the aforementioned drama queen ship-motivated fighting on social media aside), this is being molded into a rather interesting direction.

[RadioGirl27]

 And just so we're clear, this show is not killing off Hook. He's immensely popular. What are they going to do, kill off Hook and replace him with Robin? Can you just imagine them killing off Emma's boyfriend and replacing him with Regina's soulmate?

Actually, yes, with A&E at the helm of the show, I can totally imagine it. ;-)

But, no, Hook is not going anywhere. Both the character and the actor are far too popular and loved.

Edited November 2, 2014 by RadioGirl27

[KingOfHearts]

 

But, no, Hook is not going anywhere. Both the character and the actor are far too popular and loved.

Plus he's the network poster child and sex symbol representing the show. The ratings would take a nosedive just from the drop in marketing appeal. But if he does get nearly killed with Emma saving him, then another of my S4 predictions has come true. It's eerie how accurate they've been.

Edited November 2, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Jean]

another of my S4 predictions has come true. It's eerie how accurate they've been.

You know the show is in complete dumps when you can tell what's coming on a show that prides itself so much on twists and surprises.

I'd like to point out too that I called DQ was Emma's foster mom before she even appeared onscreen and before we got the filming spoilers of her in the real world and the proof is on this thread. Psychic or what? Lol

So the reason Emma's magic goes haywire is DQ succesfully pushed some button of hers. Like how she was trying to teach Elsa. Why is she so invested in having these 2 fully develop their powers? Maybe they're the key to unlocking the hat. Rumple just thinks sucking in enough magical people will charge it up but it's looking for specific people?

[KingOfHearts]

 

 

You know the show is in complete dumps when you can tell what's coming on a show that prides itself so much on twists and surprises.

I'd like to point out too that I called DQ was Emma's foster mom before she even appeared onscreen and before we got the filming spoilers of her in the real world and the proof is on this thread. Psychic or what? Lol

I laid out my predictions before they even began filming S4. I knew Regina was going be over Marian after two minutes and that she'd start hanging out with Henry. I knew Marian was going to enter some imminent danger and that Regina would save her life. A lot of this show is so darn predictable, probably because the writers never have the guts to do anything risky. Hard to believe this show is inspired by Lost.

 

 

Why is she so invested in having these 2 fully develop their powers?

 

Either she needs their collective power to achieve something like unlocking the hat as you said, or she's just using them as replacement sisters, or both.

Edited November 2, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[maryle]

Hook falling into the hat can have some meat . (new world) 

But this Robin is absolutely  inable to wear Hook' satchel.

Even A. and Eddy can believe  that OQ and CS are egal in term of storytelling or popularity.

So Hook died and Emma save him. The only unknown is how tlk, act of tl...

 

Me: I like the falling into hat thing, return to be a pirate and she must kiss him. Chezzy but evething is at this point.  So embrace  the cheezy.

[Shanna Marie]

I had a horrible terrible thought. Someone please tell me this is total crazy talk.

 

So, after this whole arc about Emma and Elsa having something in common in not being able to control their powers, and Emma being afraid of hurting someone with her powers, plus whatever her history is with the DQ, in the final confrontation, she'll fail, and Hook will be cursed/apparently dead/dead/Mostly Dead, with Emma sobbing over him. And then Regina will swoop in, use some unprecedented magic to defeat DQ, then save Hook, proving she's Emma's superior in every way, able to do magic no one has been able to do in saving someone from death, plus, unlike certain other life ruiners who separate people from their loved ones (never mind that Cora was lying to Leopold, that Snow was trying to make it possible for Regina and Daniel to be together and that Emma was reuniting Marian with her family), Regina actually saves Emma's loved one. All hail St. Regina!

 

It'll never happen, right? Right?

[Rumsy4]

It'll never happen, right? Right?

 

Um... Now I'm petrified... 

[Emma]

Ugh. I read that then went into the living room and flipped the table. Righted it and then flipped it again.

FML. That sounds like something they would do.

[YaddaYadda]

It'll never happen, right? Right?

 

Don't take this personally, but I really don't like you right now.  I think I might give up on the show altogether and I might join twitter to see A&E get roasted over the coals for this one.

[Shanna Marie]

I'm hoping that by putting it out there, that will make it not happen. Or we can all print it out and burn it ritually. Maybe it was just me trying to scare myself as I got ready for a Halloween party.

 

But I swear, if they spend half a season building up Emma's role in the conflict only to have her be beside the point while Regina swoops in yet again, I may have to be done with this show, and in a very public way. It might even be worth joining Twitter or writing the network. I'll start raising legions of minions to swarm them. In the immortal words of Bugs Bunny, of course, you realize this means war.

[KAOS Agent]

Elsa will be the ultimate hero of this arc. No matter how much love A&E have for Regina, the Frozen crew will be the victorious ones in this tale. I wouldn't worry too much about that.

[BoPeeps]

"It'll never happen, right? Right?"

 

OK, I will be brave enough to say it.

No, it'll never happen (grin)

And I will stick by that story until the series finale in a few years (grin)