S05.E07: Crossed

[poppy-]

Here is my question. Is it wise to eat a fish that was caught with a jacket liner, if that jacket was napalmed?

[CletusMusashi]

If Abraham doesn't have a major sunburn after sitting in the middle of the road all day, I'll call foul. I mean, they should all have sunburns to some degree, but Abe should be like a state fair deep-fried pickle.

He only sunburns on top.

Plus, he can heal next week. All the clarity of this week's episode makes me fear that the cliffhanger is going to consist of nothing but impossible-to-see night scenes.

Edited November 24, 2014 by CletusMusashi

[Misty79]

It felt like the writers lurched from one extreme to the other with this episode, from the previous ponderous episodes focused on a couple of characters to a highly fractured mess that seemed to be all over the place tone wise. This episode sort of answered why they don't do split POV episodes more often. 

 

Beth's scenes again were some of the better ones, to my surprise. There was at least an element of suspense in what she was doing. I don't think the overall storytelling is very good for the whole cop/hospital setup, however. The cops underneath Dawn appear to be the properly nasty guys, but that hasn't been developed very well beyond the focus on the sinister, rapey guy who's now dead. 

 

What was the point of the reverend dude? I just don't care about him at all. I think the trope about how a gentle sort copes with the realities of the ZA is well worn territory for this show and doesn't need to be repeated. 

[lulee]

If Abraham doesn't have a major sunburn after sitting in the middle of the road all day, I'll call foul. I mean, they should all have sunburns to some degree, but Abe should be like a state fair deep-fried pickle.

I've carped and carped about the bad hair this season, but last night bad makeup. The walker make-up is fantastic, but more than Abe not looking sunburned, Eugene's face should have looked like a swollen pile of ground chuck after being slugged repeatedly and falling face-first onto the road.

[JBody]

Shooting the roadrunner/bad Bob's friend was just a sentimental gesture by a Sasha who clearly was not thinking straight. The Sasha we have come to know would nevrt have fallen for the ruse. She's still processing good Bob's death and echoed Tyreese's words and was letting her humanity show through for a bit. And as this show reiterates umpteen million times, the ZA is no place for sentimentalism, "processing" (Tyreese, pay attention!) or anything of the sort --they are luxuries they can't afford. One has to discriminate. Save that stuff for people you trust. I just wish it hadn't been the level headed Sasha whose character had to act stupidly to make this point (a point that has been made so many times before; I suppose they don't want us getting complacent).

[MrWhyt]

If Bob II had been on the up-and-up, Sasha would have shot a walker. Isn't there a risk the hospital hears the second shot?

Sasha's rifle had a suppressor on it, they wouldn't have heard the shots. However they should have heard the shoot out that occurred when the third cop rolled up unexpectedly.

Edited November 24, 2014 by MrWhyt

[Timetoread]

Rick Grimes is one scary-looking motherfucker.

 

Indeed.  Rick needs to listen to his woman.  She brought him a razor and warned him that his face was losing the war.  Well Rick's face is freakin' post WWI Germany.  Please.  Please GOD, give that man a shower and a shave!   Soon he's going to be able to walk amongst the walkers because of the green stink fog surrounding him.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Timetoread

[CletusMusashi]

I think I'm going to start using "Roadrunner" instead of "Bad Bob." Wouldn't it be fun if he never makes it back to the hospital? Every week, we keep seeing like a one or two minute scene of him running around, getting chased by zombies, opening cans of sardines with his teeth, dragging his butt around on the ground like a dog (or maybe against a modern art painting,) trying to get his pants down so he can poop... I'll take the Zombie Apocalypse Adventures of Roadrunner over the FPP Crybaby Hour any day of the week.

Edited November 25, 2014 by CletusMusashi

[ghoulina]

Saving someone's daughter by carrying baby formula through a herd of walkers before you've even met is probably a really effective way of making a good impression. And in the time since, Michonne has proven herself to be extremely capable and reliable.

 

That is a good point. I sometimes forget about that. But Michonne's first introduction to the group was, in effect, saving Judith. She did not have to do that. And it reminds me, Michonne was a mother. She had a young child, and no one else in their group (save Carol) has had the same experiences as she has. Another reason to prefer her holding down the fort. 

 

The situation at the hospital is different than Woodbury or Terminus. They're not at war with these people, and Dawn isn't a delusional megalomaniac.

 

I don't think the situation is that different from their original introduction to Woodbury. Daryl, Rick, etc. first went there because The Guv was holding members of their group hostage. The same basically applies with Grady. Yes, they're holding Beth and Carol under the pretense of helping them (now Beth is working off her "debt"), but CDB ain't that stupid. Daryl saw them hit Carol; that was no accident. And Noah obviously has all the dirt on that place. So they know that there are bad people there, who have taken some of THEIR people - same as Woodbury. And Daryl went in there, crossbow blazing, ready to get Glenn and Maggie back. The way Rick laid it out, they weren't going to burst in and start shooting everyone. He had a quiet/sneak attack approach. And Noah even said if they did it that way the wards would be likely to help out once you armed them. I thought Rick's plan was very good, a lot better than this stupid hostage exchange idea. 

[JBody]

Heeee.  Yes.  The Roadrunner and Noah being hit by the cop car (I just laughed and said come on show, again?  Must you?) provided some unintentional laughs.  And I hate that!  I don't want TWD to make me laugh.  Unless it's intentional.

[CletusMusashi]

Indeed.  Rick needs to listen to his woman.  She brought him a razor and warned him that his face was losing the war.  Well Rick's face is freakin' post WWI Germany.  Please.  Please GOD, give that man a shower and a shave!   Soon he's going to be able to walk amongst the walkers because of the green stink fog surrounding him.

In my opinion, this has a lot to do with how slowly things are progressing between him and Michonne. Most of the group tend to look like they at least were clean, within the last few days, but then got dirty again. Daryl probably scrubs down reasonably often, but he lives such as active lifestyle that by the end of the day he's scuzzy again. Rick and Daryl are both top-tier warriors, but the group is not always at war. So when Rick was resting at the church, Daryl was out working on the car. When Rick was at the prison waiting for his peas to grow, Daryl was out hunting and foraging and carrying a deer back all by himself. That's why Daryl always looks dirty, but still looks like he's been groomed at some point in recognizably recent history. Rick, on the other hand, looks like a homeless man who eats people while screaming about how the CIA is putting mind-control nanobots in our underwear.

I think that when the writers are ready to commit Richonne to the next level, they will telegraph it by showing Rick take some interest in his own attractiveness. 

Edited November 24, 2014 by CletusMusashi

[lulee]

Heeee.  Yes.  The Roadrunner and Noah being hit by the cop car (I just laughed and said come on show, again?  Must you?) provided some unintentional laughs.  And I hate that!  I don't want TWD to make me laugh.  Unless it's intentional.

The Walking Dead meets Looney Tunes.

[JackONeill]

For a cross-over episode they could have Peter Boyle dressed like Frankenstein. 

[40Love]

LOL.  She brings PLENTY to the table.  She's cute.  She's a motivational speaker.  She's clearly the brains of that outfit.  She got rid of Lori.  Judith is all that!

 

Amen! She brings cute for days!! 

 

Noah said Bob2 was one of the good ones.  I can't blame him for trying to escape, I mean he doesn't know they aren't going to just kill him once they get their people back.

 

Good point. And speaking of Bob2... I think it's kind of funny to me that there are so many black men named "Bob" in the Walking Dead universe. Yes, two men within 5 episodes seems like a lot to me. LOL!

 

Besides Bob Marley... it's not really a common name/nickname among my family and friends. We've got lots of Roberts, Robs and Bobbys".. But, my whole life I've only ever met/knew/heard of one black man (besides Marley) named "Bob". And here Sasha has personally met two! heh!

[editorgrrl]

Speaking of Bob2... I think it's kind of funny to me that there are so many black men named "Bob" in the Walking Dead universe. Yes, two men within 5 episodes seems like a lot to me. LOL!

 

Besides Bob Marley... it's not really a common name/nickname among my family and friends. We've got lots of Roberts, Robs and Bobbys".. But, my whole life I've only ever met/knew/heard of one black man (besides Marley) named "Bob". And here Sasha has personally met two! heh!

 

Maximiliano Hernández, who plays Sgt. Bob Lamson, is Honduran. A Google image search for other Bob Lamsons pulls up only white guys, so I suspect the casting call was for a male of any ethnicity.

[PunkyMouse]

Man, y'all are prolific! Finally caught up with the episode and the board. 

 

So, things that made me go hmmmm...

 

1. How did those cops close the car doors with their hands behind their backs and then how did they open the doors so quickly afterwards? There was only one other cop and he was driving. 
2. Did Sasha not get a look at those pavement zombies? How the hell could she believe that Bob 2.0 could recognize his old co-worker Tyler? Nobody had a face left!
3. It's already been addressed, but that whole IV thing bothered me and I'm not even a trained professional. 
4. Being the mother of two gingers I kept thinking "Abraham, you are going to be one giant blister if you do not get out of the sun right now young man!"
5. Beth didn't really bother me as much as usual. But she's still not strong or tough or badass or any of the other superlatives various characters keep spewing to convince me otherwise.
6. It took Maggie one hell of a long time to get that ladder off the truck. Did I really have to watch the entire struggle?
7. Speaking of Maggie, after her single-minded determination to find Glenn after the fall of the prison, she was pretty quick to let him wander off with his new friends.
8. Father Pee Pants, it was just downright cruel not to finish off that walker. Let her finally rest in peace. 

 

Somebody way upthread asked why the group put the organ pipes out in front of the church. It was to impale any random walkers who might try to get into the church.

 

ETA:

 

Amen! She brings cute for days!!

Good point. And speaking of Bob2... I think it's kind of funny to me that there are so many black men named "Bob" in the Walking Dead universe. Yes, two men within 5 episodes seems like a lot to me. LOL!

Besides Bob Marley... it's not really a common name/nickname among my family and friends. We've got lots of Roberts, Robs and Bobbys".. But, my whole life I've only ever met/knew/heard of one black man (besides Marley) named "Bob". And here Sasha has personally met two! heh!

 

I thought the same thing! 

Edited November 24, 2014 by PunkyMouse

[GodsBeloved]

Bob2 is black?

[JBody]

FPP missed the memo that one has "to be cruel to be kind".  

 

Aside: he is irksome because of the (literal!!!) holier than thou attitude he holds around himself, in the midst of humanity's extinction event.  I want him to have his own personal extinction event.  

 

He'll learn.  And if he doesn't he'll die.

[Timetoread]

Rick, on the other hand, looks like a homeless man who eats people while screaming about how the CIA is putting mind-control nanobots in our underwear.

 

ROTFLMAO!  Rick, I love you but yeah, you do.

 

 

I think that when the writers are ready to commit Richonne to the next level, they will telegraph it by showing Rick take some interest in his own attractiveness.

 

Or at least take a bath.  Back during the Claimed days on the road, I had fantasies of Michonne dragging an injured Rick to a bathtub and cleaning him in a sexy nurse kind of way.  Now, Rick's gotten so disgusting that co-ed bathing with him has no sex appeal at all.   You could grow crops in his bathwater.  Hell that firetruck hose would be appropriate for him.

[PunkyMouse]

Bob2 is black?

 

He looked like a light-skinned black man on my screen. Am I missing something?

[GodsBeloved]

He looked like a light-skinned black man on my screen. Am I missing something?

I have no idea if you are missing something. Light skinned black man wasn't my impression is all.

[Timetoread]

He looked Latino to me.  And, as my buddies and I put it, mildly fine.  Too bad he knocked out Sasha so I'm forced to hate him.  But if he gets rid of Beth or Tyrese he'll be back in the running for me.

[PunkyMouse]

He looked Latino to me.  And, as my buddies and I put it, mildly fine.  Too bad he knocked out Sasha so I'm forced to hate him.  But if he gets rid of Beth or Tyrese he'll be back in the running for me.

 

 

Ah. Well I don't know too many Latino Bobs either. :o)

[40Love]

Bob2 is black?

Maximiliano Hernández, who plays Sgt. Bob Lamson, is Honduran. A Google image search for other Bob Lamsons pulls up only white guys, so I suspect the casting call was for a male of any ethnicity.

 

Ahhh.. thanks! He looked like a light-skinned black man to me... My bad! :-) 

[RustbeltWriter]

I'm wondering what's up with Father Gabriel. We did a whole season on the farm with people who had been holed up not enduring the worst of what was going on in the world getting their eyes opened when Rick's group arrived. What differentiates Gabriel from Hershel in this story? There has to be something. I can't believe we would be re-treading the same ground.

[Rosiejuliemom]

Bob2 is black?

 

And why not? It worked in Blazing Saddles.

 

Topic? He looked Latino to me.

[lulee]

Better anagram for the road crew?
 

Rag Met
Gar Met
Tag Rem
Ram Get
Arm Get
Mar Get
Mat Erg
Tam Erg
Tar Gem
Rat Gem
Art Gem
At Germ

 

I'd go with ARM GET (or GET ARM), this being the ZA with rotting bodies. Tara had better keep Abraham and Eugene alive or making an anagram without their vowels is going to be tough.

[Mu Shu]

I don't get the Dawn/cops  thing at all.   She acts like she is in charge yet  has to appease the other cops, yet the other cops don't like/resent her?   Who is really in charge?   Why would they put up with her?

 

Now that that Ray Liotta looking cop is dead,  it would seem a coup would be pretty easy.   You have the three "good" cops, (had) Noah, and Beth and the doctor, at least.   Alternatively, the three "good" cops could simply not come back from a kidnapping adventure.    The whole hospital angle is nonsensical. 

 

My guess is that Tyrese's idea to negotiate the hostages gets him killed, by the Bob cop his own sister was duped by.   BTW, that carpetbagger is running around with his hands tied behind his back in a formerly  densely populated city.    No way he should make it back, but he will to throw a wrench into the negotiations.    Which, BTW, are bullshit.   These people in less than what, 2 weeks time,  have been attacked by the Governor and the Termites.   No way would they trust anyone this soon.      Best laid plans of mice and men and all.    Tyrese will die, and Rick will go full on nutso Rick. 

[JBody]

Yeah that's what bugs about the pacing at times. It seems like forever since the Governor ( a whole year! ) and yet it's been a couple weeks for them.

[GodsBeloved]

And why not? It worked in Blazing Saddles.

 

Topic? He looked Latino to me.

I have no issue if he is suppose to be black. As I said before, Bob being black was not my impression.

[Pete Martell]

I think he may have thought that he wanted to sacrifice himself to make up for his treatment of his parishioners.  Seeing Rick et al take out the Termites may have led to a realization that he is not able to compete in this world.  However, when confronted by a walker, he couldn't just let it happen.  Then again, since he sought out the scene of the Bobecue, he may be trying to get his head around what people are really like in this new world.  I does look like the walkers may break through the window and get a good meal out of Father Pee Pants.   At least that will give him a purpose befitting his profession - feeding the hungry.  Unfortunately that group of walkers will be a little to close to the church for comfort.  

 

I think he just wants to get away. I think he's convinced himself that his self-loathing and helplessness will fade if he's not around people who challenge him, and he can instead just go hide again. 

[Mu Shu]

Oh, and I forgot this:   Dumbass Abraham all catatonic on his knees all episode was ridiculous.   Rosita should have slapped the crap out of him,   and encouraged the others in joining her in retuning to the group.  He dragged the group from pillar to post on the intel of a damn imbecile, and now he punks out?    Get the hell up and head back. 

[Pete Martell]

I'm wondering what's up with Father Gabriel. We did a whole season on the farm with people who had been holed up not enduring the worst of what was going on in the world getting their eyes opened when Rick's group arrived. What differentiates Gabriel from Hershel in this story? There has to be something. I can't believe we would be re-treading the same ground.

 

Hershel was truly deluded about the world they were in. Gabriel isn't. He knows what's going on. And it cripples him, because he knows he's a coward and a failure. Hershel wasn't a coward. The worst you can say is he went off for a day to get drunk. Gabriel will have to completely change who he is.

Oh, and I forgot this:   Dumbass Abraham all catatonic on his knees all episode was ridiculous.   Rosita should have slapped the crap out of him,   and encouraged the others in joining her in retuning to the group.  He dragged the group from pillar to post on the intel of a damn imbecile, and now he punks out?    Get the hell up and head back. 

 

I think she was tempted, but he would have gotten violent with her. When someone is that unpredictable and that angry, it's best to leave them alone.

I don't get the Dawn/cops  thing at all.   She acts like she is in charge yet  has to appease the other cops, yet the other cops don't like/resent her?   Who is really in charge?   Why would they put up with her?

 

I liken it to being speaker of the house. 

 

It's seemingly a powerful job, but it is, at best, cat-herding. It's a job most people with actual power want no part of. So they let Dawn be in charge, and she mostly lets them do what they want. Yet it's never enough.

 

I understand it. The problem is I just don't care very much. When they talk too much about who is or isn't nice or about the power structure, my eyes glaze over.

[paigow]

Here is my question. Is it wise to eat a fish that was caught with a jacket liner, if that jacket was napalmed?

Is it wise to eat something living in non-potable water?

[Lyndy]

Is it wise to eat something living in non-potable water?

 

When you've had nothing but squirrels, toilet water and pocket lint for weeks, I'm guessing you'd risk it. But yeah. I think they're about to find out how fun it is to have diarrhea in a world without toilet paper.

[morgankobi]

I think I'm going to start using "Roadrunner" instead of "Bad Bob." Wouldn't it be fun if he never makes it back to the hospital? Every week, we keep seeing like a one or two minute scene of him running around, getting chased by zombies, opening cans of sardines with his teeth, dragging his butt around on the ground like a dog (or maybe against a modern art painting,) trying to get his pants down so he can poop... I'll take the Adventures of Roadrunner over the FPP Crybaby Hour any day of the week.

Reminds me when Dewey lost the class pet, a hamster still in it's exercise ball, on Malcolm in the Middle. Every so often you would see it roll by, just in the background.

 

I don't think the jackets Rosita and Glen scavenged had been touched by napalm. They were outside the city, and those walkers just seemed stuck by the telephone pole. I did find Glen's reaction to finding fish interesting. Just that little bit led me to believe they haven't been able to find any in quite some time (as in something happened to them).

I wish we could get some more universe-building here and there about stuff like that (like: what about the dogs/cats, what would have happened to the Termites after eating Bob-B-Que, etc.). I want to know more about how this world is/works.

[lulee]

Oh, and I forgot this:   Dumbass Abraham all catatonic on his knees all episode was ridiculous.   Rosita should have slapped the crap out of him,   and encouraged the others in joining her in retuning to the group.  He dragged the group from pillar to post on the intel of a damn imbecile, and now he punks out?    Get the hell up and head back. 

If not for fear of retaliation, I would have smacked him up his Sunny Delight-colored scalp when he knocked that water down and spilled it.

I agree with morgankobi. Those were just garden-variety walkers smushed by a telephone pole, nothing like the melty napalmed ones in the city.

[Rosiejuliemom]

I have no issue if he is suppose to be black. As I said before, Bob being black was not my impression.

 

I didn't mean anything like that. My response was a quote from Robin Hood: Men in Tights. I'm sorry. I saw my opening and I took it. *hangs head in shame*

[Pete Martell]

 Daryl probably scrubs down reasonably often, but he lives such as active lifestyle that by the end of the day he's scuzzy again. 

 

Scuzziness is the least of his problems. It's that awful hair that looks like one of those old sitcom episodes where the father turns the tables on his wacky kids by pretending to be a beatnik.

[Ellaria]

If not for fear of retaliation, I would have smacked him up his Sunny Delight-colored scalp when he knocked that water down and spilled it.

 

I'm done with Abraham. How long was he on his knees staring off into the distance? Who has time for his nonsense?!

[Pete Martell]

The funny thing is I think they were more productive with him catatonic.

[Mu Shu]

Is it wise to eat something living in non-potable water?

Long as you cook it through, it's fine.

[blackwing]

It took Maggie one hell of a long time to get that ladder off the truck. Did I really have to watch the entire struggle?

I think it was to emphasize that here she was struggling to get a ladder down so she could create some shade for Eugene, a man she barely knows.  Meanwhile, here we have big and strong Abraham, who was supposedly his friend, kneeling on the road for hours in a state of catatonia.

 

I'm done with Abraham too.  Wish he'd get eaten.  Still grossed out by him and Rosalita talking about giving him a full body shave.  Yuck.

 

Or at least take a bath.  Back during the Claimed days on the road, I had fantasies of Michonne dragging an injured Rick to a bathtub and cleaning him in a sexy nurse kind of way.  Now, Rick's gotten so disgusting that co-ed bathing with him has no sex appeal at all.

I think the last time he got sort of cleaned up was when he burned his dirty shirt in the fire pit outside the prison.

 

I mentioned it last season and many didn't believe me, but we could see it in one of the "remember when" commercial clips of past season scenes.  The scene was of Morgan pointing a gun over newly awoken Rick, who was lying on the ground with his hospital gown open.  Somewhere in between Season 1 and that shirt burning scene, Rick found a razor to shave his chest.  If it was so important to him to shave his chest hair, why can't he do anything about his head hair and the unkempt beard?  He looks like he stumbled off the set of "Hatfields and McCoys".

[Tippi Blevins]

Better anagram for the road crew?

 

I would have gone with "Meat gr!" because it's what the walkers would be saying/growling if they could.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Tippi Blevins

[CatMomma]

Things I learned from this episode.

 

Despite everything, Rick and company are still stupid.  I assume Noah told them about the men at the hospital continuously raping the female patients. But, hey! They found Bob 2, the one good guy!  Dafuck? 

 

As a poster said on page one, why didn't they take the cop's bullet proof vests?  

 

Father Gabriel is an idiot.  Save the cross?  Why? So you can hang yourself on it?  And, I get that Michonne was trying to get through to him, but save it for someone who isn't a complete hyprocrite.The guy cares more about his stupid church and symbols than he did about actual, ya know, people.

 

Abraham is worthless. At this point, Father Abraham would make a better fighter. I have zero interest in Abe's whiny ass pain. Whoopy-de-doo, he took the water. Maggie, who has lost her entire family (save Beth, who apparently doesn't exist) should have put a bullet in his head.

 

Tara, Rosita, and Glenn were the only characters I enjoyed in this ep.  They were actually smart, by filtering water (thanks, Eugene), and figuring out how to fish.  Maybe they should just keep walking with their yo-yo, fish, and filtered water.

[Pete Martell]

Despite everything, Rick and company are still stupid.  I assume Noah told them about the men at the hospital continuously raping the female patients. But, hey! They found Bob 2, the one good guy!  Dafuck? 

 

I think the idea is that there are "good" cops (per Noah, Bob was one of them, and Dawn supposedly isn't all bad). I just don't think it's been well-executed onscreen.

 

As for Rick, I think he's looked worse than this in the past. In the bts footage on Talking Dead, I was thinking to myself that Andrew's beard looked somewhat trimmed (that and I was wondering if he and Norman both dye their hair now...).

[mla40]

So all of this has only been a week or two since the prison?

They better move things along or Carl is going to be one very manly 13 (?) year old.

[blackwing]

Somebody way upthread asked why the group put the organ pipes out in front of the church. It was to impale any random walkers who might try to get into the church.

I get that, it's like in medieval times or the Civil War when armies would plant stakes angled out so horses couldn't easily get past them.  But what I don't get is that there weren't enough of them, there were only enough to half-protect one side of the porch, the pipes didn't cover the entire steps.  Unless Rick and company added more pipes after they left, and we just didn't see it.

[CatMomma]

 

I think the idea is that there are "good" cops (per Noah, Bob was one of them, and Dawn supposedly isn't all bad). I just don't think it's been well-executed onscreen.

 

My problem is that even the "good" cops stood around and did nothing while so many were victimized. How much can you trust someone who does nothing in that situation? So, yes, I found their trust in Bob 2 incredibly dumb. 

[Pete Martell]

I agree, but I can see why they would trust him enough to where they were being civil to him or might be able to see him as having no choice in the matter at the hospital. It's Sasha letting him wander around that is, to me, awful writing.