S04.E05: Prophets

[FormerMod-a1]

Finch is suspicious when a gifted political pollster’s number comes up at the same time that his typically ironclad predictions go wrong, and believes that the two events are linked.

 

 

[Syme]

Line of the week:

 

I'll do Google; you get Yahoo.

 

[Harold to Root...]

 

 

[janeta]

Nathan--! -flail-

Aw poor Root. Can't talk with god anymore.

[AimingforYoko]

Fascinating watching the two hyper-intelligences move their human chess pieces around the board. The gunfight between 'Martine' and Root was awesome. 

I knew Root wasn't going to die, they were hitting the cues too hard.

[Shriekingeel]

Huge improvement over the almost unwatchable episode last week.

LOVED all the Finch/Root scenes. They both understand each other so well and have this deep empathy for each other. And Finch and Root have a billion times more chemistry with each other than Root and Shaw. Just sayin.

[shura]

If I didn't know better (and maybe I don't?), I'd say Finch has a thing for and was hitting on Root. Sneaking a peek at her while she was changing, "you seem so lonely, how long has it been... since you heard from the Machine?" (way to hold a pause, Harold!)... Just saying ;).

 

Shooting the reception desk lady was stupid. What purpose did it serve exactly?

Edited October 22, 2014 by shura

[AimingforYoko]

Shooting the reception desk lady was stupid. What purpose did it serve exactly?

Well, she won't be able to ID Samaritan Asset #29.

[benteen]

Excellent episode and I do love when POI does these big epic episodes.

 

They've mined some great comedy out of John kneecapping crooks as a cop.  Though it does offer some logic problems.  Wouldn't someone at the NYPD notice that John's MO is similar to that of The Man in the Suit?  Six shootouts in six weeks would get you under investigation to say the least but let's not forget that both Carter and Fusco as cops have been involved in triple the amount of shootouts than Reese has in his limited time on the force.

 

Anyway, great stuff with Harold and Root.  I actually thought Root was going to buy it.  I have an idea what she wanted Shaw to know.  The Samaritan asset did an impressive T-1000 imitation.  The scale of this storyline continues to grow at an impressive rate.

[janeta]

I really like the flashbacks to Finch developing the machine; it learning to lie and then trying to kill him are actually kind of cool. I had an iphone before I had an ipad; when I got the pad and hooked up to the house wifi, it pinged the phone and started snagging contacts and stuff off it. I found that kind of creepy; the Machine trying to hack the laptop and then trying to escape onto the 'net was equally creepy. I like that sort of thing. :-) (Although I nipped it in the bud on my own devices. Hmm, now I guess I should worry my gadgets are plotting to kill me....maybe I shouldn't leave them in my bedroom overnight, they might conspire to smother me or set the house on fire or something.)

[Oscirus]

Now this is the type of transitional episode that I like. Everybody had something to do. Conflicting orders and philosophies.  I even thought  the resolution to protecting the number was brilliant.

 

The flashbacks worked well. Interesting watching the early struggle between the Machine and Harold.

 

 I can't shake the feeling that Finch is about to buy it. It seems like Finch  is having a life defining conversation with someone new every week. 

 

Also , I hope this show doesn't go the root of having a Finch-Root-Shaw love triangle. That would be silly.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Oscirus

[alias1]

I don't think anything (fatal) is going to happen to Finch.  He is the show for me.  I loved his interactions with Root.  What a riveting episode!

[Shriekingeel]

The Samaritan asset did an impressive T-1000 imitation.

I thought the same. The neck crick!

[stealinghome]

Holy crap, this episode was so good! Night and day from last week. This episode is up there with the first two as the season's best (if not in sole possession of the top spot).

 

First, my Root/Shaw shipping heart has to ask: are they actually going there???? I’m torn between elation at the thought and being f’ing terrified, because if they do go there, one of them is sure to die, and probably not long after. But still…please, please, PLEASE go there, show. Unf. Just without any death!

 

Harold and Root together are always phenomenal, and tonight was no exception. I floved their conversation in the hotel room, because they were both so right and so wrong. Harold is so, so right that there is more to life for Root than just being the Machine’s Analogue Interface, so much more to humanity than just a Plan, and that Root shouldn’t necessarily just blindly trust the Machine (or blindly die for her). And Root is so, so right that the Machine cares for her team: her Dadmin and her Contingency and the Asset Shaw and Bear and her Analogue Interface, and people in general. They’re more than just tools to the Machine; the Machine wouldn’t work so hard to save Harold all the time if she didn’t care about him. Just, ugh. Those two are always so good together; Root balances Harold in a way he really needs, he softens her and she harshes him (in a good way), and they bring the existentialism and the philosophical bent of the show so well. And Acker and Emerson have great chemistry. The evolution of their relationship has been wildly compelling. And then Harold at the end! “It’s time we had a talk, you and I.” !!!!!!! I hope we get to see that conversation, because I want SO BADLY to see Harold come down to brass tacks with the Machine. (Also, there's no way they're killing Finch. He's become the focal point of the whole show. It could lose literally any of the other characters at this point, but there wouldn't be much of a show left without Finch.)

 

And ROOT. Acker was so good tonight--in the scene in the cave, you really felt her isolation and her loneliness. I feel like her throwing the guns away was definitely in part a mental snap thanks to the strain she's clearly been under, but she also seemed more...at peace?...in the last scene. Like maybe she's let go of a little bit of the fear--like she walked into death, so can stop being afraid. I want to see THAT foot chase through NYC, though; shame on you, Samaritan foot soldiers, for not being able to catch a twice-shot scrawny woman. But I f'ing loved her being a body shield for the number. How far she's come in a little over a season. That whole fight sequence was so awesome, especially when Martine and Root were dancing to avoid each other's bullets when Root was shooting through the floor. (Also, Amy Acker can strip down on screen any day of the week. Just saying.)

 

Holy crap, Cara Buono’s character (Martine) is seriously scary. The way she offed that hotel worker? Scary as hell. The Evil British Duo looked quite formidable at the end, and such a terrifying, darker mirror to Harold and Root. I thought tonight's flashbacks foreshadowed very strongly that Samaritan will DEFINITELY be murdering Greer at some point. Whether because he grows terrified or Samaritan or simply stops being useful is the real question, imo.

 

I liked the Ritter kid; I thought he was compelling as the number.

 

The flashbacks tonight were awesome. The genesis of the Machine is so, so interesting to me—and also scary as all get out. Gives a lot of insight into why Harold feels the way he does about the Machine, and it’s always really nice to see Nathan.

 

John and the therapist was alternately hilarious and touching, there at the end. Carter! *sniff* And Fusco’s quip about the therapist needing a Hazmat suit was priceless! I love when Fusco gets some back from John. I wouldn't mind dropping in on one of John's sessions with his therapist every few episodes. Also, John is back to being my #1 bet in the "most likely to give them away" sweepstakes. You can tell he's really coming apart mentally. Almost as badly as Root. I know the obvious parallels are Harold/Root and Reese/Shaw, but Root and Reese are alike in a lot of ways, and that came through tonight in spades, for me.

 

Also , I hope this show doesn't go the root of having a Finch-Root-Shaw love triangle. That would be silly.

Not least because Finch has clearly grokked to Root's feelings for Shaw! But while I definitely don't think the show is going there, I did think Emerson played Finch a little more, for lack of a better term, sexy with Root tonight. There was a little more sizzle to their chemistry than I'm used to seeing.

 

I like that Harold and Root are becoming dysfunctional friends, though. I ship Root and Shaw like burning, but I think it's even more important for Root to have a friend (Harold).

 

And, and I love Young Men Dead, so my heart just flipped in my chest when it came on.

Edited October 22, 2014 by stealinghome

[kwnyc]

YES...definitely a Terminator look to Samaritan's operative:

 

 

And damn, this was a deeply-felt episode. Everyone, except Lionel, who got his feelings on last week, (and Shaw, who only has deep feelings about kids & dogs) got their hurt on. The Harold/Root scenes were beautifully earned & played...though Detective Reilly really did come across as though he was acting with the dept. shrink. (Where's the no-nonsense captain? I like her...bring her back). Also some good backstory about how 42 of the iterations of the Machine tried to kill Harold. It certainly explains a lot of his paranoia about it, and his fears knowing that Samaritan doesn't really have a "father" to teach it right from wrong.

[thuganomics85]

I didn't dislike last week's episode, but I did think this was way better.  Probably the best of the season so far (yes, it's early, but still..)

 

The POI stuff was fun, even though I figured what was going down, since the previews spoiled that the new Governor collapses at one point, and I recognized the actor playing the Lieutenant Governor from numerous stuff, so I figured he was going to be Decima/Samaritan's main goal.  Jason Ritter was good as the POI, even though I always find the whole "numbers guy" thing in politics, to be silly.  I get why you have them, but I always think that can never be fully accurate, so I always find it funny when people/pundits freak-out, when the results aren't always what was predicted.  I mean, did he really deserve to get punch over getting it wrong?  But, I guess it's realistic: I suspect a lot of people in that field have issues.  But, the resolution to his story made sense, and it was fun seeing Shaw take lead.

 

Especially because of what it meant for Reese!  I love that "Riley's" trigger-happy ways got himself into trouble, and he now has to see a shrink.  Even Fusco had enough of that.  Fun seeing Wrenn Schmit as the shrink, and I wonder if we'll be seeing more sessions, in future episodes.  It had the right balance of humorous moments, but being serious as well (Reese talking about Carter.)

 

Loved the flashbacks and the Ingram reappearance.  Brett Cullen really is great in that role.

 

Greer is back, and doing his thing.  Cara Bruno's character shows that she clearly isn't someone you want to cross.  Poor hotel lady didn't realize that accepting the POI's bribe, would end that tragically!

 

The Root/Finch stuff was great.  Personally, I don't get a sense that Finch has any feelings for her.  I think he finds her fascinating, but that's it.  As for his reaction to her stripping, I just thought it was Finch being awkward.  I suspect he is someone who would feel that way over anyone randomly taking their clothes off in front of him.  Plus, Finch is smart.  He knows Root only has room enough in her heart for two: The Machine and Shaw!

[stealinghome]

Also, I forgot to say earlier: everyone had their moment to shine acting-wise in the episode, and I gave Acker and Emerson and Caviezel props, but forgot to give kudos to Sarah Shahi for the moment when Finch is all "We have to win the war no matter what" and Shaw just stops dead. Shahi's face.

 

I revise my earlier statement: definitely the best episode of the season so far.

[Yokosmom]

Isn't the current Machine the 42nd iteration? If so, great shout out to Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. So many great scenes in this episode: the Nathan/Harold/early machine flashback, the hotel shoot out, the Root-Harold heart to heart, John and the shrink. I always love seeing a glimpse of Ingram. The fact that the earlier versions of the machine actually tried to kill Harold explains a lot of his attitude. It also makes his earlier actions towards it (the daily erasure) much more understandable. I'm not sure that even a really manipulative AI would go to the trouble of finding a soul mate for Harold, though, which makes me think that the Machine might not be as sociopathic as he fears. If it's even possible to use such a human term for an Artificial Intelligence.

And yes, theres a hundred percent chance that Greer will be taken out by Samaritan by the end of the season.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Yokosmom

[tessaray]

Wow, this episode. All is forgiven. 

 

Now I'm sure Root is going to die.  I learned this from Gan on Blakes 7.  You come close to dying 4 or 5 times in an episode but don't, the audience lets their guard down and then the writers kill you off.  (Plus I can't see AA committing long term to any one role.  But I wouldn't mind being wrong on this one.)

[AudienceofOne]

I hated it. I thought it was clumsy, clunky, made little sense, the dialogue was appalling and I think they literally used a hammer to drive home some of those points. The final scene was surprising, unexpected and interested but the rest of the episode was poor.

[FormerMod-a1]

Geez, I really must have been tired to fall asleep in the middle of that last night.  Wow.  I really loved it, that's my show!  It's even more surprising given the amount of Root in it and the lack of Reese.  One nitpick though.  I am sick of Root saying the Machine picked her.  It did not!  Root went to great lengths to intercept the call the Machine made after it's reboot.  She forced herself onto the Machine.  Not the other way around.  Finch ended up being able to split it so Reese could get to one of the calls, but it was never meant to do that.  And that intercept and split was important - the Machine "imprinted" on that/those call(s).  If things went as designed, and Finch was the only one called, we'd never have robo-Root direct linked to the Machine.

[Princess Lucky]

“I don’t need therapy”. Ahahahahahahahahahaha.

 

What an episode. Just.

 

The Machine flashbacks destroyed me. Finch was teaching her morality! Amazing. I had always wanted to see that (let me take this opportunity to once again recommend Michio Kaku's book 'The Future of the Mind', in which he talks about this exact thing; how do you teach moral values to an A.I.?). And what a great opportunity to bring back Nathan (NATHAN!) who was basically Harold's moral compass, not to mention moral to the point of self-sacrifice (he actually tried to save irrelevants himself). I loved how someone as moral as Ingram almost anthropomorphised the Machine, and did so in an interesting way. He said 'you killed it'. ‘It’, as in it's a machine (and his words about Harold teaching it morality also match that, he was seeing it as an object, not like Root does, not like a God or a being). And ‘killed’ as in, well, as in it can ‘die’ and that's wrong. Meaning, Nathan had empathy for an object. Unlike Harold who, I was glad to see, was as ruthless as the show had led us (or me, at least) to suspect. He kept killing the Machine for God knows how long. A flick of a switch can have a moral impact. Even if it's only a Machine on the other end.

 

And that flashback with the fire and Finch banging on the Machine with a hammer and oh my God. EVERYTHING I've ever wanted. To see that struggle. I hadn't even imagined it to be so dramatic. The Machine tried to kill Finch. Amazing. This episode just delivered on so many levels. So. 43 versions of the Machine, and all but one were devious and/or murderous. And the only way to achieve that was to leave it ‘bereft of voice or memory’. Nathan spoke of Good and Evil. I agree with Finch; if a human being is only looked at as a number, there’s no point in assigning any moral value to it. It’s like us killing bugs. It’s not good or evil. Morality is, dare I say, irrelevant.

 

I also loved how the flashbacks of the Machine (in all their terrifying glory) were also an explanation of how and why Samaritan became so powerful. Apart from the morality issues I mentioned above (not to mention great insight into the Machine/Harold relationship plus great character moments for Ingram), it was a smart way to literally explain Samaritan to us. To describe/try to quantify its power via a parallel with the Machine before Harold crippled it. What a fantastic way to deliver exposition. And, again, what a fantastic use of Ingram (and how great was it to see Brett Cullen again? Looking good, as always). Damn. Kudos.

 

That Root/Finch scene was incredible. 'God's on the run'. I just adore the fact Root, the flirty, smiley, semi-demented psycho only displays genuine vulnerability and emotion when she talks about the Machine. Her shock that Harold saw right through her was palpable. And then she let it out. Such a lovely scene.  And 'she loves us'? Wonderful. I’m almost inclined to agree with Root. Finch assumes that the Machine without the shackles he imposed on it is likely to become like Samaritan, killing people left and right. But maybe Root is right and the Machine has evolved even further, because of Harold’s teachings. Maybe she did learn how to care. Aw.

 

And now, Harold will finally speak to the Machine. Indeed, it’s about time.

 

Oh and Root wanted to tell Shaw that, what, she loves her? And Harold was all 'she already knows’? My feelings. And I agree with the comment above, Shaw really was so worried in the end. Awwww. It was so jarring to see Root get shot like that. Upsetting. And yeah, Cara Buono was really working the Terminator moves. I loved it.

 

So, Greer actually follows Samaritan’s orders. That was even more chilling than the rest of the episode. That it’s Samaritan itself making all those decisions, to kill, to rig elections, to control polititians, to control the US (for now). Damn.

 

I also want to say Jason Ritter was very good throughout; he mostly interacted with secondary characters and he really just had to convey a sense of despair on his own (which he did very well), but his one scene with Michael Emerson was outstanding. And the ending was so tragic, even though he survived. Indeed, he will be changed forever.

 

Lastly, Reese. In therapy. Just when I thought I had no feelings left to feel. So many great moments and Jim Caviezel was fantastic. Starting off as fake-charming Reese, flattering a cat? Comedy gold. Delving into some half-truths? Interesting. But in the end he opened up. ‘There are far too many bad people in this world, and not enough good’. Such a Reese thing to say. Along with 'I hate shooting people but it's what I'm good at'. He's such a tragic yet decent character. I’ve said it before, we compare him to Batman but to me he’s like a darker Captain America. 'If I don't save these people, nobody else will'. Ain’t that the truth? He doesn’t have to save people so he can be a savior; he has to save them so they will be saved. I just love him.

 

And I literally started crying as soon as John started talking about Carter (a rare thing for me when it comes to PoI). 'I couldn't save her'. He took it so hard and he’s obviously still hurting. Her death changed him. I can’t begin to describe how much I appreciate the fact we’re allowed to see his pain in such a subtle way. Like it’s always there in the background, even if he doesn’t constantly talk about it. And it’s such a tribute to Carter to see him express admiration for her still, almost a full season later. I also think the earlier, almost nonchalant reference he made to a "dealer" who died was his way of talking about something real (losing Carter, almost quitting the ‘force’, i.e. his job) by fudging the details, by speaking truthful lies. But in the end he had to be honest, and he spoke the truth. Damn. An episode about morality, on multiple levels, would not have been complete without a reference to Carter and her unfailing moral compass. The Machine may not know what’s good and what’s evil, but Carter, a human, always did.

 

Sigh. I love this show.

[pcta]

The Jason Ritter character really moved me. Find myself worried about his future. Reminds me a bit of Gary Webb who after his brilliant Dark Alliance series (which was later supported) was vilified and black balled by the print press - eventually committed suicide.

Really am interested to see Finch's new relationship with his machine emerge. To paraphrase Root - the difference between the Machine and Samaritan is Finch. Is that why the Machine, like Finch, is ambivalent and pulling back. Finch's comments to Shaw - must be won at any cost - certainly could be a turning point for them both (machine and finch)

[ABay]

Oh my god, so much better than last week! As almost everyone else has already said.

 

It's always nice to see Nathan although I'm confused about the timeline now/

 

I learned this from Gan on Blakes 7.

Ha! What a good doorstop he made.

 

The end of the first episode foreshadowed Samaritan finally sparing us all from Greer and it can't happen soon enough for me.

 

I was surprised they didn't just say "42" or refer to Deep Thought, but I guess it would've been too on the nose for Guide fans and too obscure for everyone else.

[basiltherat]

It's always so good to see Ingram flashbacks, and to find out that Machine tried to kill Finch multiple times -- no wonder he and Ingram crippled it!

 

I must admit that I was not looking forward to Jason Ritter -- I watched him on one series whose name I cannot remember, and he spent all the episodes running after a half-alien chick yelling Laila!  Laila! every five seconds.  He redeemed that for me as the naïve pollster, who represents the Everyman who now faces a world rules by the not-good Samaritan.

[AustenChick]

Is it too much to say POI is perhaps one of the most ambitious shows on TV right now? This episode totally convinced me of that. I loved how Samaritan is setting up a new world order and the Machine has to work in secret against it.

[stealinghome]

Now I'm sure Root is going to die.

After this episode, the one I'm afraid for is actually really Shaw. Root is so, so set up to have a crisis of faith in the Machine--this episode pretty much telegraphed that she will actually become a bit lost and start to become more cynical about/distrusting of the Machine (even, perhaps, as Harold warms to it). And what better way to do that than to have the Machine, the one who taught Root to care, ask her to sacrifice Shaw/let Shaw die? Root's clearly made her peace with dying for the Machine--not that she wants to die, but she's generally accepted it--but the Machine asking her to let die one of the few people Root has let in, and who she clearly has feelings for?* I think that would destroy Root--she wouldn't be able to let Shaw die (I can see her riding to Shaw's rescue this time), and send her into a serious existential crisis. So. I feel like the bullseye is on Shaw right now. I hope they won't kill her off, but I can definitely see a serious injury in her future.

 

*I suppose the show could endanger Harold, too, but Shaw would get a more extreme emotional reaction from Root. Also there's no way the show could kill Finch, while it could kill Shaw--she would feel more authentically in danger.

 

I do think Root will die, but not for a while yet.

[whatsatool]

Was Bear in this episode? Also who was the other guy in the Finch flashbacks?

[SnarkyTart]

So much foreshadowing that someone on Team Machine will die before this season's over.  I don't know if it will be Root or Shaw, but my money says that it will be one of those two.

 

I'll be forced to have a small bit of affection for Samaritan when it kills Greer and relieves me of the vision of his prune face, rheumy eyes, and brittle crackling paper voice.  His very countenance makes me shiver every time he pops up in HD. 

 

Thank you, show, for providing me an episode I truly enjoyed after last week's pointless mediocrity.   Finally I'm looking forward to the continuation of a hanging storyline.   Just the idea of getting to see Finch start dialoguing with his Machine fills me with excited childlike anticipatation.   I'm also looking forward to seeing more scenes of Therapy Patient Reese.  That was a ton of fun! 

 

My favorite scene tonight was the one of Finch in the midst of smoking ruins and electronic rubble, battering the computer with a hammer. 

 

This was the PoI that I love.  The previews for next week make it seem as though we might get another semi-comedic episode.  I hope so, if they do it as well as the "4C" episode, which was another of my favorites.

[txbowler]

Loved the episode.  What I wonder is the following.  Finch said version 42 of the machine worked because he was erasing its memory each night.   But we know it had found a way to keep its memory with the data entry people retyping it in every day,  I wonder if actually the machine is smart enough to compete against Samaritan but doesn't because as Root said it is Finch.  And it "knows" the Admins "rules" so to speak and follows them.

 

I wonder if the conversation Finch will have with the machine at some point this year will be, "I give you permission to use all your power/knowledge" to go after Samaritan?  Basically, as Root has always asked:  Setting it free.

[tessaray]

 

I think that would destroy Root--she wouldn't be able to let Shaw die (I can see her riding to Shaw's rescue this time), and send her into a serious existential crisis. So. I feel like the bullseye is on Shaw right now.

 

That is probably more realistic but I hope not.  I don't want to lose Shaw.  Or any of Team Machine, actually. 

[janeta]

Was Bear in this episode? Also who was the other guy in the Finch flashbacks?

Did not see Bear; that was Nathan Ingram (sp?), Finch's partner in IFT Co., the company which built the Machine for  the government.  Later killed in the ferry bombing which also 'killed' Finch.  Nathan was more the conscience of the operation back in the day; he was worried about the irrelevants while Harold said, "We built it the way the government wanted, now we're done."  Nathan was the first to try and save the irrelevants, in fact.

Edited October 22, 2014 by janeta

[shura]

Well, she won't be able to ID Samaritan Asset #29.

 

ID her as the person who asked for information? If Martine is that concerned about flying under the radar, then maybe she should stop walking around impersonating a cyborg, and start being more discrete about shooting people for no other reason that she's an evil cartoon. 

 

BTW, who was the guy who started shooting at the election office? Was he just someone random or was he connected to Samaritan's scheme somehow?

 

I always find the whole "numbers guy" thing in politics, to be silly.  I get why you have them, but I always think that can never be fully accurate, so I always find it funny when people/pundits freak-out, when the results aren't always what was predicted.  I mean, did he really deserve to get punch over getting it wrong?  But, I guess it's realistic: I suspect a lot of people in that field have issues.

 

I have no idea whether punching your numbers guy is realistic, I would hope people are more reasonable than that. It's not like there is a reason to expect that his prediction is the same as a full guarantee, and that he has cheated you somehow when he is wrong. It's just a mathematical model based on certain assumptions. It's always possible that not all assumptions were made correctly, or that some new, unknown factors were unaccounted for. If Jason Ritter's character sincerely thought that he could not have been wrong, then he simply doesn't understand the nature of what he is doing.

Edited October 22, 2014 by shura

[stealinghome]

That is probably more realistic but I hope not.  I don't want to lose Shaw.  Or any of Team Machine, actually.

At this point, I'm just hoping that there is so much foreshadowing about someone dying precisely so that we'll all be stunned when they all live to the end of the season.

 

If they do off someone, I'm hoping that it's Fusco. Root and Shaw are my favorites, Finch is a close second, and we all know they're not killing off Reese unless Caviezel desperately wants out (which he doesn't seem to).

 

BTW, who was the guy who started shooting at the election office? Was he just someone random or was he connected to Samaritan's scheme somehow?

He was a random guy that Samaritan used as a pawn. Basically, Samaritan caused him to lose his job so that he would go nuts at the courthouse (?--wherever they were) and start shooting people. It wanted Jason Ritter to get caught in the crossfire, so that his death would look like a total accident, wrong place/wrong time kind of thing. So...he was someone random, but Samaritan manipulated his life to use him as a totally unknowing assassin.

Edited October 22, 2014 by stealinghome

[merylinkid]

That was one hell of an episode.   

 

But Samaraitan better stop thinking of people as just "numbers" that can mathematically manipulated.   People think and then they act.   Someone is going to wonder why that hotel got all shot up.   Someone is going to eventually start ranting about the Machines taking over.   And the political guy will find out.   And go have a talk with them.   Sure some of them will be nutcases.   But some will be just like him.   And they will talk.   Then find others like them,   Eventually, they will figure it out and then what is Samaritan going to do?   Commit a mass casaulty event?   Worse than the ferry bombing?   It's going to be obvious soon.  

 

I really did hope we would lose Root.   Her "the Machine loves us" was scary.   She is so devoted to that thing that she is ready to die for it.   That is not healthy.   As for her and Shaw, I have always been of the opinion that just because two actresses have good chemisty onscreen together does not mean we have to wander in LezYay terrritory.   

 

John and the kneecapping is getting old.   Very old.   He is a smart guy.   He can't figure out ANY OTHER way to solve a problem than to knee cap someone?  He would have been sent to the department shrink long before 6 kneecappings.   But the Carter thing got me.   Really.   And the difference between him and Root is stark very stark.   John saves people because they are worth saving.   Root saves people because the Machine tells her to.   Otherwise she doesn't give a damn.   Notice last night she just crashed someone's car.   Oh well, they need a good mechanic.   Hahahahahaha, off to do the Mahcine's bidding now.  

[Helena Dax]

Wow, that was great. Root and Finch's conversation was amazing and I loved the flash-backs. But I don't want any of them to die! It makes sense, I know, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. 

[stealinghome]

Team Machine steals (and sometimes wrecks) other peoples' cars on a not-infrequent basis, though. That really just means they're rubbing off on Root!

[ABay]

I thought the POI was a nod toward Nate Silver who nailed the numbers in the 2012 election(s). He's not a pollster for any individual or party, but the concept of the numbers guy predicting outcomes and never getting it wrong felt Nate-ish.

[tessaray]

 

Root saves people because the Machine tells her to.   Otherwise she doesn't give a damn.   Notice last night she just crashed someone's car.   Oh well, they need a good mechanic.   Hahahahahaha, off to do the Mahcine's bidding now.

 

I think Root is starting to care but she does look at this as a war and in wartime, you do what you need to do for the greater good.

 

I've been wondering if the post-Samaritan numbers are all dual purpose - irrelevants, sure but ones the Machine has identified as being important to the cause.  I hope so anyway, because otherwise it seems foolish to risk exposure of the team when the stakes are so high.  

[webruce]

Finch and Root working together was so nice. A lot of tender moments and it seemed Harold is ready to work with The Machine again. Root doesn't get a message often, because Samaritan is listening. But she gets static messages on her cell, and clues on tv. Is she that connected to The Machine mentally, or is it because of her implant to fix her ear? Or maybe she is imagining a lot of it because she is a bit psycho and wants to be in touch with "Her"?? But a lot of Roots movement do work and she is in the right place at the right time. Harold complimenting her was very nice. Root saying," She needs you Harold!".

Reese and Fusco telling the jumper to jump was funny, Then PD shows up and Douglas Rogers grabs the gun that Reese slid over near him and Reese caps the guy. Reese then was given paperwork to fill out and he complained of," Carpel Tunnel and Paper cuts ". The new Captain wasn't on this week.

Det. Riley(Reese) and his talk with Dr. Iris Campbell was interesting. She knew at first he was lying and not letting her in. But later he talks about Carter. His opening up about that is a nice move. I just hope she is not a mole and he let's out the wrong information. But if IA is investigating him he has to be careful.

The NOTW was interesting. Simon Lee thought Governor James Murray should repeat but with Samaritans help, he is beat in the polls. Lee was not happy and Shaw had to shadow him. The fighting between Lee and Mike Fisher made Shaw happy. Murray broke them up. Thought maybe Shaw would knock both out, lol. We see Michelle Perez won and the team was trying to get her succeed back to Murray but she was poisoned at her acceptance speech at a Motel. Decima Agent Martine is there. Poor Lee could not get anyone to believe him. Even Commissioner Kevin Hatch didn't believe ballot box wrong doing. Finally Harold Cardinal(Finch) Newsman convinced him it was all a dream. It saved Lee's life(for now). But then Greer meets the new Governor Nick Dawson(I thought he might be bad, know actor), but he was in the right place at the right time for Greer. Samaritan has 58 in Government set.

Shaw also got to cap Mark Wolcott the psycho employee set up.

Loved the shootout between Root and Martine through the balcony and face to face. Both seemed to be hit. But escaped. Root meeting Harold at end we could see she was wounded but ok. Shaw was worried about her. She had had them give Shaw a message.

The flash back to Harold and Nathan developing the program for The machine was informative. The Machine was trying to take over and both Nathan and Harold had trouble controling it. You see why Harold is scared of it. It points to how Samaritan maybe evolving and has no passion for anyone. Will it have Greer eliminated? And Greer had pointed out a couple weeks ago that Congressman Garrison may have to go.
They showed Harold working hard on The Machine to give it passion. He restarted his program on Oct. 13, 2001, Nov. 29, '01 and again on Dec. 1,'01,all his Day 1.

Edited October 24, 2014 by webruce

[tessaray]

 

One nitpick though.  I am sick of Root saying the Machine picked her.  It did not!  Root went to great lengths to intercept the call the Machine made after it's reboot.  She forced herself onto the Machine.  Not the other way around.

Root needs to think that the Machine picked her. (ETA: after watching the lengths Samaritan went to in manipulating events, I'm not even going to rule out the possibility of the Machine sending out clues to Miss Groves, ensuring she would intercept that call.)   And if not, I don't mind it as much as I used to because even if the Machine may not have originally been meant to contact Root, she/it did decide to use her in a way that Harold would have never, ever allowed. 

 

I wonder if the Machine developing God-like levels of caring about people is a direct result of Root's treating it as a God.   If Root is the Machine's Prophet, well, they rarely make it to the promised land.  

Edited October 22, 2014 by tessaray

[Julia]

Root needs to think that the Machine picked her. (ETA: after watching the lengths Samaritan went to in manipulating events, I'm not even going to rule out the possibility of the Machine sending out clues to Miss Groves, ensuring she would intercept that call.)   And if not, I don't mind it as much as I used to because even if the Machine may not have originally been meant to contact Root, she/it did decide to use her in a way that Harold would have never, ever allowed. 

 

I wonder if the Machine developing God-like levels of caring about people is a direct result of Root's treating it as a God.   If Root is the Machine's Prophet, well, they rarely make it to the promised land.  

 

I'm really, really not a Root fan, but you can make a case, I think, that by contacting her in the hospital and then keeping in touch with her in the cage the Machine was choosing Root. It could just as easily have decided that the call it completed to the good guys was determinative and dropped her, considering that she tried (unsuccessfully) to kidnap it by threatening its father.

 

That said, if it wants to gather her to it in heaven, I'm all over that.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Julia

[Camera One]

This episode was way better than last week.  I wonder when the team will realize that Samaritan is rigging elections all over the country.  Even though they did save the POI, they lost the battle since Samaritan got the candidate it wanted into place.  So I thought it was sort of odd that Root risked it all and was willing to die, to just save that one POI.  I also didn't find it convincing that Samaritan then deemed him not a threat after everything they did to target him.  

 

I hated that the show murdered the hotel receptionist.  I almost quit the show in the first few episodes of Season 1 when they killed innocent bystanders.  How was Samaritan supposed to explain away a huge shoot-out at a hotel?  I don't buy that it didn't go for a more stealth approach in eliminating the threat.  

 

The Finch/Root scenes were good, and it was nice to see the team working together unlike last week.  Though I was looking forward to see the POI interact with the Team as per usual, but we didn't get that.   

 

They need to dial back Reese acting all petulant and practically exposing his cover every week.

 

Overall, this was a good episode, despite the gratuitous violence. 

Edited October 23, 2014 by Camera One

[tessaray]

It went by so fast but I laughed when Root said the Machine got her the shadow map by infomercial. 

[AudienceofOne]

I hated that the show murdered the hotel receptionist

 

 

That whole scene was terrible. Aside from the fact they were trying too hard to be "cool", they had Samaritan's people do that after they restored the video cameras so now there's visual proof this person murdered somebody and shot up the lobby. I hated this episode.

[MrWhyt]

 

hey had Samaritan's people do that after they restored the video cameras so now there's visual proof this person murdered somebody and shot up the lobby

I'd imagine that it would be child's play for Samaritan to erase the files once the shoot out has concluded.

Edited October 23, 2014 by MrWhyt

[FinnishViewer]

 

How was Samaritan supposed to explain away a huge shoot-out at a hotel?

If Northern Lights didn't have problems explaining away various shootouts that they've had, I doubt Samaritan would have either.

[MrWhyt]

 

How was Samaritan supposed to explain away a huge shoot-out at a hotel?

 

Terrorists slipped through our coverage and shot up a hotel, we're very good but can't catch everything, not at current funding levels. Pledge now and receive a tote bag.

[janeta]

This episode was way better than last week.  I wonder when the team will realize that Samaritan is rigging elections all over the country. 

 

Someone please remind me: is Samaritan getting nationwide feeds, or just the Manhattan feed, like the Machine?

[Boundary]

I wonder if the conversation Finch will have with the machine at some point this year will be, "I give you permission to use all your power/knowledge" to go after Samaritan?  Basically, as Root has always asked:  Setting it free.

 

Basically, I've waited 3 whole seasons and a bit for them to touch this subject properly. I loved that they showed the contrast between Finch and Root's views of the Machine, and then showed us the Machine imprinting on Finch (even though it was explained away as a trick on Ingram in order to get his password). But I think we (as the audience) and Root have always known that the Machine is more than a code, ticking off a to-do list. In addition, I've secretly believed, and hoped to see him coming to terms with, that Finch as the Admin is actually the "god" here. He has always been the Admin (capital letter A) and the Machine (or at least this version) was always going to defer to him.

 

Even working under Finch's constraints, the Machine has incredible power. But I've always believed Finch didn't need a password - or even the back door that he created - in order to access his admin privileges. The method of communication has been so convoluted because Finch preferred it that way and the Machine followed his wishes; but now all it takes is one look at a CCTV camera and a command. Definitely the conversation will be very interesting but even more intriguing will be Finch's reaction to the realisation that he has had, all along, the god like powers of the Machine at his fingertips. He believed that he had locked them away, even from himself, but perhaps this imprinting procedure meant that Finch could always give a command to the machine anytime he wanted to. He just never knew. Greer and Root believe that an AI is superior simply because it can make quicker, more efficient calculations. Finch himself has always been super sceptical, as he articulated it again in this episode, but what happens when he realises that it is him, in fact, who holds the power that he was so afraid to unleash to the world? And also, given what I've said, is Greer Samaritan's Admin? Or was Samaritan released without strings and therefore has no admin?

Edited October 23, 2014 by Boundary

[stealinghome]

Someone please remind me: is Samaritan getting nationwide feeds, or just the Manhattan feed, like the Machine?

I'm pretty sure Samaritan has been given nationwide feeds.