S09.E06: Jill Says Yes To The Dress

[starfire]

I'm guessing that the Duggars probably didn't have to pay a dime for the plane tickets to DC, the princess treatment, or the wedding dress and that it was all comped by TLC and/or the wedding shop.

 

Here is info about the $500 "princess treatment" at the shop Jill went to:

http://www.avalaurennebride.com/#!become-a-princess/c115s

Some pics of Jill at the shop:

http://www.avalaurennebride.com/#!albtlc/c2de

[BitterApple]

Thanks for the info, starfire! It still seems like a huge waste of money to me, but if that's what people are into, more power to them!

[Fuzzysox]

Does anyone know the actual cost of the dress?

[Micks Picks]

Thanks for the link to the shop and the dress.  I appreciate it.  I didn't like the dress at all, unfortunately.

 

A niece of mine got married this year and had the most beautiful gown I've ever seen.  Don't know what it cost, but the style was fantastic.

[overbooked]

Re: the dress looking snug-fitting in the shop but looking looser on the wedding day--I think they had to go a size larger in order to make the added-on bits look OK. If it fit as snugly as strapless gowns usually fit, the built-up bodice would look loose in comparison. I agree that in the wedding photos the dress definitely looked a little big around the waist and, overall, made Jill look larger than she really is.

[TobyBelle]

For $500, I think they all should've gotten a facial and spa treatment too.  And a goody bag to take home. It was nice to see her gussied up with trying on the dresses. It helped with "seeing" how she could actually look on the wedding day.

 

I thought the dresses looked snug on her too, but that could've been because she had the extra layer of clothes underneath. Plus she had those clips holding the dresses tighter on the back.

[truthtalk2014]

 

I thought the dresses looked snug on her too, but that could've been because she had the extra layer of clothes underneath. Plus she had those clips holding the dresses tighter on the back.

Or maybe she lost weight from the time she was fitted.  She was probably worried and a bunch of nerves, thinking of how many children she had to produce so quickly- hoping she ovulated on her honeymoon- as not to lose another whole month.

[Missy Vixen]

As for the dress shop, good God, Michelle, your daughter is getting the princess treatment at a bridal salon. You can't do better than an ugly ass shirt and shapeless denim skirt? You are an embarrassment.

I think she managed to find something worse, but I'm sure we're not allowed to discuss it until later in the season. ;-)

 

My favorite part of the entire episode, besides Jana's holding yet another child she didn't give birth to on her lap so its mother could eat: MEchelle's frantically trying to work up a tear or two during the "I bless you" speech. Uh-huh.

[Missy Vixen]

NikSac & Mickpiciks: can I be the 3rd sister? I agree with both of you. What is all the hoo-haa about shopping for a gown.

I'd like to be the fourth sister. I'll bring champagne.

 

I saw my dress in a photo spread in BBW magazine. Yes, it's true. It was a gorgeous ballgown made of duchesse satin with a dropped waist, minimal hand-sewn embellishments and a chapel train. I ordered it from JC Penney and had it altered to fit. I still love it. I am still so glad I did not ask anyone else to go dress shopping with me.

 

I can't imagine what kind of hell that "Duggar girls" shopping trip might have been if the cameras weren't present.

[lottiedottie]

For $500, I think they all should've gotten a facial and spa treatment too.  And a goody bag to take home. It was nice to see her gussied up with trying on the dresses. It helped with "seeing" how she could actually look on the wedding day.

 

I thought the dresses looked snug on her too, but that could've been because she had the extra layer of clothes underneath. Plus she had those clips holding the dresses tighter on the back.

Could you imagine what would happen if one of the Duggars got a massage? How defrauding!

 

Wedding gown shopping for me involved going to a bunch of stores with my BFF and then finding a dress on the sale rack at the very last one.  I think shows like SYTTD have changed the way some women shop for a dress, I think.

[Hpmec]

Missy Vixon, I assume you mean by "something worse" her hideous mother of the bride dress - or rather Kelly Bates' dress altered beyond all reason for extreme "modesty." Someone needs to sit J'Chelle down and give her the sad news that after all those pregnancies, there is nothing about any of her body parts that would defraud anybody.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Hpmec

[Mrsjumbo]

I lived out of state. I found a dress I loved in a bridal magazine. I made an appt with a store that carried the dress, flew home & drove my mom to the store. Tried the dress on & it was just too heavy & beaded, not like it looked in the photo. Tried on 2 more dresses, the store was closing. I just picked one. No speeches, no tears from mom.

In hindsight I should have gone alone to David's Bridal. I felt rushed with my mom & picked a dress I didn't love. And being the early 90's it had the puffed sleeves, lace front, etc.

I'm going to have it cut up & made into a christening gown when I have grand babies. No future bride would want it.

[Micks Picks]

Oh goody, Mick, Nik, Barb & Missy with a bottle of champagne.  The non-shoppers, in my case I Love Jeans.

[msblossom]

What I think she wanted to hear was something that couldn't have been read to any other Duggar daughter. Something special about HER, the way Anna, probably Joy and even Jessa's notes were. But Michelle didn't talk about the day she was born, the first time she talked, or a memory she would always cherish of them together - she just did the scripted blah blah blah, like the adult voices on a Peanuts special.

Regarding that scene in the DC bridal shop, it is interesting and sad that Michelle is so clueless about connecting with her own children. And I found it a little odd, not in a bad way, that Jana didn't say much that was personal to Jill or maybe it was edited out? I think she said something to the effect that she was a very caring sister -- which is something that could have been said of any of the older girls, except Jessa. It must have meant more than the way it came across because Jill walked over and gave Jana a big hug.

Edited October 1, 2014 by msblossom

[Fuzzysox]

I don't think they are each other's best friends like Jill claimed. Seems like they are jealous of each other and take advantage of each other's shortcomings. Jana had resentment plastered all over her face in the bridesmaid epi.

[GEML]

The Jill/Jana dynamic is an interesting one, isn't it? There was the comment made by Jill, when talking about being MofH, about how Jana has always been there for her and taking care of her and Michelle, it's been that way your whole life.

Then the hug at the bridal shop for a pretty tepid and generic comment.

I get the impression that part of Jill's "romantic" nature is making certain things seem like more than they are. I think a lot of things are clearer to us, as outsiders, (and while a lot is producer driven, you can't hide everything) but she (Jill) simply chooses to believe that Michelle and she have a close mother/daughter bond, and she and Jana are "best friends," etc.

[Jynnan tonnix]

I bought my wedding gown at either David's Bridal or something similar. It was 1985, and I don't recall whether they were in business back then. But, at any rate, I went in with a budget of about $300-400 and tried on a few things off the rack. I do remember that there were a few "Gone With The Wind" style dresses that looked really nice on me, but since I already had a very similar style gown which I'd bought the year before for some occasion or another, I went with a fairly simple style with a V-neck, 3/4 bell sleeves and a bit of lace. I wasn't all that bothered about finding the dress to end all dresses...I just wanted to look nice, and, back then, at a size 6 (which is equivalent to something like a 2 in today's sizes, but that's another issue), I could pretty much wear most things right off the rack and have them look OK.  I think the one I picked ended up being on sale for something a bit under $200...And as I recall, the only alteration I really needed was having the gown shortened a bit.

 

My daughter got married 3 years ago, and since her wedding was very small (about 20 people in my mom's backyard), and since we lived some 1500 miles away, she sent me photos of 5 different dresses she had tried on at David's Bridal, and told me which she preferred, which was one I thought she looked very pretty in, and that's all there was to it. I didn't get to see the dress in person until the day of the wedding. And she did look beautiful in it. As she most probably would have in any of the others.

 

I don't get why the whole thing needs to be such a production.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Jynnan tonnix

[NausetGirl]

Don't forget his campaigning for certain candidates when he was younger makes him a political expert. I am surprise more candidates are not seeking his expertise. *sarcasm inserted*

 

Too bad all his "expertise" can't get any of his candidates elected!  PS - we need a sarcasm font!  Anyone working on this?  :>)

[Barb23]

Missy Vixon, I assume you mean by "something worse" her hideous mother of the bride dress - or rather Kelly Bates' dress altered beyond all reason for extreme "modesty." Someone needs to sit J'Chelle down and give her the sad news that after all those pregnancies, there is nothing about any of her body parts that would defraud anybody.

Just because this is the only episode I can't wait to see, they probably won't show Michelle getting her dress. Was it shown what shoes she wore? Oh, but how did I forget. She is the MOTHER OF THE BRIDE so it may be an hour episode with her reminiscing about her & Boob's wedding & renewal because we haven't seen it enough. Then as filler, they can show a recap of Josh & Anna's wedding.

Do you think we'll see the guys picking out their suits? Will we get to see them buying the reception supplies at Sam's/Costco? What else is left to show us? And to think we'll have to see the same thing next season with Jessa. Ugh!!

[Almost 3000]

Too bad all his "expertise" can't get any of his candidates elected!  PS - we need a sarcasm font!  Anyone working on this?  :>)

Here's some sarcasm for you: Michelle saw no problem with open toed shoes at a wedding for followers of a guy with a foot fetish.

[lottiedottie]

I bet Jessa's wedding will barely get a passing mention. She's old news. She's not the first Duggar girl to get married and by the time her wedding rolls around everyone is going to be totally over Duggar wedding planning (because they are dragging Jill's wedding out like crazy) so no one is going to give a shit about Jessa. There's nothing interesting about her wedding with Bin.

[Mrsjumbo]

I bought my wedding gown at either David's Bridal or something similar. It was 1985, and I don't recall whether they were in business back then. But, at any rate, I went in with a budget of about $300-400 and tried on a few things off the rack. I do remember that there were a few "Gone With The Wind" style dresses that looked really nice on me, but since I already had a very similar style gown which I'd bought the year before for some occasion or another, I went with a fairly simple style with a V-neck, 3/4 bell sleeves and a bit of lace. I wasn't all that bothered about finding the dress to end all dresses...I just wanted to look nice, and, back then, at a size 6 (which is equivalent to something like a 2 in today's sizes, but that's another issue), I could pretty much wear most things right off the rack and have them look OK. I think the one I picked ended up being on sale for something a bit under $200...And as I recall, the only alteration I really needed was having the gown shortened a bit.

My daughter got married 3 years ago, and since her wedding was very small (about 20 people in my mom's backyard), and since we lived some 1500 miles away, she sent me photos of 5 different dresses she had tried on at David's Bridal, and told me which she preferred, which was one I thought she looked very pretty in, and that's all there was to it. I didn't get to see the dress in person until the day of the wedding. And she did look beautiful in it. As she most probably would have in any of the others.

I don't get why the whole thing needs to be such a production.

Everything is a big production nowadays. Asking someone to prom, getting engaged, going wedding dress shopping- must be big productions now with people filming so they can put it on YouTube. Everyone wants their 15 min of fame. Edited October 2, 2014 by Mrsjumbo

[cmr2014]

 

I bet Jessa's wedding will barely get a passing mention. She's old news. She's not the first Duggar girl to get married and by the time her wedding rolls around everyone is going to be totally over Duggar wedding planning (because they are dragging Jill's wedding out like crazy) so no one is going to give a shit about Jessa. There's nothing interesting about her wedding with Bin.

 

Someone posted a while back that there was a scene at the kitchen table where Jessa said to JB "I AM marrying him!" or something to that affect (I didn't see it). It made it seem like maybe this Bin / Jessa thing is not really a JB match at all. He certainly doesn't appear to like him

 

Jessa has mentioned that she's "not that into" weddings, and that she'll probably use a lot of Jill's decorations. I wonder if some of this is just damage control. JB doesn't want her to marry him, and she's not going to get the princess treatment that Jill got, so she wants to get it out there that it's because she doesn't want it.

 

Obviously, that's all wild speculation, but the difference in treatment between Derick and Bin is night and day.

[NausetGirl]

 

Wedding gown shopping for me involved going to a bunch of stores with my BFF and then finding a dress on the sale rack at the very last one.  I think shows like SYTTD have changed the way some women shop for a dress, I think.

 

SYTTD - and all those other TLC wedding shows TLC - The Wedding Story, Four Weddings, Big Fat Gypsy Wedding etc etc ad nauseam - has certainly been a factor in all these technicolor Normandy Invasion weddings we see nowadays - but I really think the over-the-top interest and coverage in Princess Diana's wedding [1981] started it all off.  And of course the 80s were a decade of prosperity and excess, and so it continues...  I'll say it again.  GETTING married is no reason at all for a blowout.  I done trapped myself a man!!!  No.  But STAYING MARRIED - now that IS an accomplishment.  One that calls for gifts and a big wonderful party, if the couple wants it.  Only in America do we throw the graduation party before the "students" have passed the course...

[GEML]

Ever been to an Israeli wedding? Or an Indian one? Or a Chinese wedding? Or an Ethiopian?

Americans are far from the only culture that plans lavish, expensive even garish over the top spectacle because two people decided to make their couple hood official.

[lucille66]

Some observations I had in this episode:

-Why the heck is Jana holding baby Marcus at the ladies' brunch instead of Michelle. She's the grandma who doesn't get to see her "grandbabies" very often because of distance. I see no loving connection or grandmotherly excitement from this woman. 

-Also, the other two grandkids are stuck in the corner of the room instead of at the table. They probably had their own little table set up, I understand that. But Grandma Duggar has her back to them in most of this scene. 

-At the bridal gown shoppe...The sisters had meaningful and sisterly words for Jill. You could really sense the closeness JoyAnna has towards Jill, and I was glad she wanted to let Jill read her words instead of say them. That was a emotional and touching moment. 

-Then...last, but definitely not least, it was Mama's turn. Ok, I'm sure she meant every word she read to Jill, I have no doubt. But attempting  to squeeeze out those tears....I wasn't buying that. I didn't see any actual tears from her like I did from all the others. She'll do anything to puff herself up and prolong her time in the spotlight. 

- When Jill was modeling the wedding gowns, Michelle went into "modesty patrol" mode. She said all the ooo's and ah's but the look on her face was more like, "She won't be defrauding anyone with this dress, will she?"  Her face actually looked robotic in some of the scenes.

- Anna, who was holding Marcus, was sitting next to Michelle. At one point Marcus was reaching for Michelle's hair, and she looked a bit perturbed about it because it was throwing her off her groove of wedding dress "approving". Instead of just taking him and setting him in her lap, you eventually see him standing in front of her on the floor. I understand that she was looking at Jill and the dresses, but you can give your baby grandson a little bit of attention. It looked to me the Mechelle wanted that kid away from her. I'm surprised she didn't grab him and plop in Jana's lap to get him away from her. I wonder if she got around to reminding Anna about blanket training.

[GEML]

I actually thought Anna had gone to some real trouble to make the whole experience nice to Jill (including "fruit kebabs" at the brunch showing that she didn't need the farmer's market woman to show her how....). You figure when Anna married Josh there was no fancy dress shopping or hair styling and certainly no big fancy house to move into. But I think Josh and Anna take real pride in their own lives and having accomplished something on their own and having a relationship and family as real and as loving as any Jill could hope to have. Anna's note to Jill was thoughtful and sweet, and she, out of everyone, seemed very delighted to be included in the bridal party.

It was nice to see SOMEONE for whom this "season" of Jill's life and "purpose" isn't "bittersweet."

[msblossom]

Jessa has mentioned that she's "not that into" weddings, and that she'll probably use a lot of Jill's decorations. I wonder if some of this is just damage control. JB doesn't want her to marry him, and she's not going to get the princess treatment that Jill got, so she wants to get it out there that it's because she doesn't want it.

I just see Jessa wanting to make her own mark by going out of her way for a less traditional/different wedding just for the sake of "irony". <snerk>

She thinks she's cute and forging her own path by wanting to serve ice cream vs cake, by "burning" the dinner rolls, not measuring ingredients when cooking, and choosing leather flip flops with her bridesmaid dress, etc. That's my perception anyway.

Edited October 2, 2014 by msblossom

[graefin]

-Then...last, but definitely not least, it was Mama's turn. Ok, I'm sure she meant every word she read to Jill, I have no doubt. But attempting  to squeeeze out those tears....I wasn't buying that. I didn't see any actual tears from her like I did from all the others. She'll do anything to puff herself up and prolong her time in the spotlight. 

- When Jill was modeling the wedding gowns, Michelle went into "modesty patrol" mode. She said all the ooo's and ah's but the look on her face was more like, "She won't be defrauding anyone with this dress, will she?"  Her face actually looked robotic in some of the scenes.

 

I am convinced that Michelle has some sort of serious affective disorder. Meaning, she doesn't experience normal emotions like the rest of us. It would explain her coldness toward her kids and grandkids. Maybe (ha) she's even a narcissist.

[msblossom]

I am convinced that Michelle has some sort of serious affective disorder. Meaning, she doesn't experience normal emotions like the rest of us. It would explain her coldness toward her kids and grandkids. Maybe (ha) she's even a narcissist.

Agreed. A long time ago I read somewhere (?) about women who are addicted to having babies, and then when the babies became toddlers the mothers lost interest in the child and longed to become pregnant again. They cited Nadya Suleman as an example. The article said the disordered behavior stemmed from some kind of brokenness in childhood and that the women were fixated on having newborns as some kind of way of fixing themselves.

[GEML]

I don't know about a psychoanalytic diagnosis, but I think there might be a possible case to be made that her body became adapted to the hormones of pregnancy and breast feeding and she felt less like herself when she wasn't pregnant (and likely, with menopause) feels double crummy on a purely physical level now.

[floridamom]

I concur with these posts here. I didn't see any tears from Mama Michelle when she cold-read someone else's heartfelt written speech to Jill either and I was looking for them. I saw them in the other girls too. I also think she has some emotional problems with showing love and affection, sex, Jim Bob, is something else, it's a means for more babies in Michelle's opinion. The theory of her being an emotional wreck right now YES, I agree with that too, I thought she was addicted to those pregnancy and nursing hormones too. After so many babies and year of being pregnant her body has adapted to THAT state being normal for her. Jim Bob doesn't even show any intellectual concern for his wife nor does Mary Duggar. Where is her common sense and why doesn't she suggest these things to Jim Bob and try to get Michelle some help? They also see everyone else in the real world as a bunch of fools, jerks, sinners and heathens. They see themselves as paragons of virtue and wisdom. Sickening.

Now I'm sure that Anna didn't set that table or prepare that brunch/lunch at her house. That lady from the Mom's Recipes company who "showed" Anna how to cook like a human being did it. Such make believe and deception in this show it's lost it's appeal.

I also believe that Michelle doesn't behave like a grandmother, mother or a grown up. For a woman who claims to Looooove her grandchildren and misses them soooo much, she ignores them when she sees them. She has an addiction to pregnancy, not children OR babies, just newborns. It's quite obvious, so Jill shouldn't expect much motherly interaction from Michelle when she delivers. Jill already has more mother experience than Michelle does.

[Chai]

I agree with this. You have to wonder at what having all those children does to both the mind and body. I see her hunched over, and I hope she takes extra calcium and whatever else she needs. Women's bodies are so calcium deficient after having a normal number of births, that she scares me. Someone had mentioned osteoarthritis, which she could very well have. I know I had disc problems from my pregnancies and I didn't have 19 kids.

[GEML]

The reason I figure Anna must have fixed the brunch is that other than a passing camera glance, no attention or comments were made. If someone else or a caterer had done it, we'd know for the comp/publicity.

[flyingdi]

I liked the brunch.  Actual china and silverware!  Oh my!

[Missy Vixen]

technicolor Normandy Invasion weddings

Best. Description. EVER.

 

And I'd also like to mention (since it seems to be okay to do so) that I can't wait for the snark-o-rama over MEchelle's incredibly ugly and tacky MOB dress.

[NausetGirl]

Ever been to an Israeli wedding? Or an Indian one? Or a Chinese wedding? Or an Ethiopian?

Americans are far from the only culture that plans lavish, expensive even garish over the top spectacle because two people decided to make their couple hood official.

 

Thank you GEML - I stand corrected - there are definitely other cultures that overdo wedding celebrations.  Overall my problem is that people don't stay married anymore, so why are we seeing increasingly massive and expensive weddings?  Sometimes for the second time around??  I've spent 1000s by now on shower and wedding presents.  Showers should be phased out entirely unless both the bride and groom have been living with their parents until the wedding, have nothing and really are setting up their own household for the first time - which is why showers got started in the first place.

 

Edited for typos.

Edited October 3, 2014 by NausetGirl

[GEML]

I don't disagree with your overall point! :)

[JerseyGirl]

The reason I figure Anna must have fixed the brunch is that other than a passing camera glance, no attention or comments were made. If someone else or a caterer had done it, we'd know for the comp/publicity.

 

I saw Anna had fruit on a stick, obviously she learned of that from the fresh produce market woman.

[truthtalk2014]

I liked the brunch.  Actual china and silverware!  Oh my!

Yes I couldn't believe it.  And then when they had the salmon, they were using real dishes again and not those God awful cheapest of cheap paper plates that Boob buys by the truckload.

[andromeda331]

Too often I've seen a peripheral person such as a grandma or future in-law keep running her mouth and trying to shut down every dress the bride likes.    

 

You've met my mother haven't you? 

 

My mother still resents the fact my sister-in-law didn't invite her to wedding dress shopping or include her in any of the wedding preparations and it was years ago. I admit it would have been fun to be included but I was never upset about it she was the bride, it was her wedding she could take who ever she wanted to dress shopping. It bugs me when people get upset with the bride over that kind of stuff. Its her wedding let her have the fun. But I also can see why she didn't do either of those with my mother because she's a bulldozer. She totally would take over the wedding plans vetoing all ideas that she doesn't like and spending hours talking you into stuff you don't want or if you do chose something she doesn't like you'll never hear the end of it. I know exactly what I want a small wedding with just family and friends, in the winter. I know the colors, the dress, I'll be wearing nice new sneakers, and I'll be keeping my last name it just suits me. But my mother would bulldoze over all those ideas except the last one I fully expect the only way I'll get the wedding I want is to secretly plan it and get married in secret. Then let her think her version is the real deal.

[floridamom]

The whole bridal gown/bridesmaids dress shopping was annoying to me. Between Jill's hair in the way, that stupid veil always hanging down her back, and the modesty t-shirt/shawl, I couldn't even see the gown or tell where it began or ended. I felt the same way with the bridesmaids, as they had their hair hanging all over the dresses, and those silly fabrics they draped over themselves...couldn't get a good look at those dresses either...poorly photographed and even more poorly done, IMO.

[glowlights]

Some observations I had in this episode:

-Why the heck is Jana holding baby Marcus at the ladies' brunch instead of Michelle. She's the grandma who doesn't get to see her "grandbabies" very often because of distance. I see no loving connection or grandmotherly excitement from this woman. 

 

As the daughter of a bona fide Narcissist I will first preface my comments by saying that I am loathe to throw out the N word too often, because everything looks like a nail when you're holding a hammer. On the other hand... I love that you guys use the term MEchelle. It paints the picture perfectly. And from where I sit, everything about MEchelle screams narcissist. If not to the level of a personality disorder, then certainly many of the traits. Everything towards others is a shallow facade. Loving connection or grandmotherly excitement, as you put it, exists only in the sense of putting on the act of those emotions when it will garner the narcissist some sort of recognition or make her look good. For MEchelle, she wouldn't have been the center of doting grandmother attention by simply holding a grandkid at that luncheon, so it didn't matter to her. That wedding dress excursion would only have worked for her if it were billed as The World Famous MEchelle Duggar Takes Daughter Gown Shopping For MEchelle's Big Important Day As Mother Of The Bride.

 

The comments about hormonal changes are probably on the money too, but imo it was narcissism that created the whole Baby Machine situation in the first place. Narcissists don't typically want to be mothers, they want to have little puppets. Mission accomplished, MEchelle. All my opinion only. I'm not a mental health professional, just someone who grew up under a N's reign of terror. FWIW.

 

Anyway, I am glad Jill was treated to a meal served on real china (seriously! that's pretty special with these folks), but it would be nice if these girls could go gown shopping and have showers, etc. without all the parental controls and hovering family. What a joyless way to get married.

[StatMom]

I'm guessing that the Duggars probably didn't have to pay a dime for the plane tickets to DC, the princess treatment, or the wedding dress and that it was all comped by TLC and/or the wedding shop.

 

Here is info about the $500 "princess treatment" at the shop Jill went to:

http://www.avalaurennebride.com/#!become-a-princess/c115s

Some pics of Jill at the shop:

http://www.avalaurennebride.com/#!albtlc/c2de

Holy cow, they have an actual Princess Treatment package. I thought people were just using that term generically. Wow. And people pay for it. Double wow.