S05.E25: Summer Daze, Summertime Sadness

[BitchOnWheelz]

I really wish Jenelle would have chosen adoption, Jace does not deserve this.

I would like to see Dr. Drew play a montage of Jace's heartbreak for Jenelle, Nathan and Barb.  They need to see what they're doing to this innocent child.

[GreatKazu]

Is Nathan delusional thinking he is a goo role model?

Can I steal this from you? I am sure you meant to post "good" but I love "goo" better. It fits that asshole. He is a goo role model. All gooey and sticky, just like shit on one's shoe. Yep, that's Nathan.

 

Oh dear, I left off last night with the whole Kail and Javi matter and couldn't proceed because I was mad as hell. Still am.

 

Kail dresses better while she is sitting at home, with all those layers of clothing all over her than when she goes out to dinner with her guy. She looked as if she was dressed to go wash dishes at that restaurant.

 

OMG poor, poor Jace. If you all need someone to call, just give me the info of who needs to be called and I will do it! That shit needs to stop. What is the number for CPS?

 

It's not just Barb, Nathan and Kail who need their asses kicked. MTV needs it as well. This is not Jersey Shore or that fucking Kardashian show where the grown-ups shit all over one another for a paycheck. There are children involved here!!! My gosh, this is insane. My heart aches for Jace. I wanted to just pull him through my tv screen and tell him he is not at fault for what is going on around him. Jace most likely feels  he is at fault for the adults fighting. Even when Nathan was making a point about getting custody of Jace back (has hell frozen over?), in Jace's presence, it ends up with a big blow up. What the hell, man? 

 

The most profound things said on last night's show, aside from Cory spilling the beans on Leah, happened when the children spoke. First, the girlses with saying they wanted to be with their daddy. Then there was Jace when that beautiful conversation flowed from his precious little mouth while sitting in the backseat of that bio girl's car. I was waiting for the harps and angels to appear. That scene was so powerful!! Of all the ranting and raving that has gone on this show, those few moments of clarity from that child spoke volumes. That child is smart! And his life is being wasted with a bunch of yahoos who can't get their shit together. Sorry Barb, I just can't with you anymore. As Jace sought some affection, you pushed his little head away because YOU, just like your daughter, had to give that goo fucking turd Nathan, your attention.

 

Look at Nathan real good. That is Jace in 10 years. *shivers* 

 

I will be back to give my thoughts on Leah and her insecure spouse.

[ghoulina]

am rally upset with MTV for exploiting it. Someone on that set could step up and say something about getting him out of the room. Take him for a walk, etc. Or threaten to stop filming and end their contracts if something better isn't done for the child. They do not have to do things that way. I was so upset last night I couldn't continue to watch those parts.

 

I really don't know what shelf someone has to put their soul on to be able to stand there and film this crap. I wouldn't be able to do it. 

 

It was heartbreaking when Jace was crying and Barb asked him twice "What's wrong, Jace?".  Get a clue people.

 

They're all really completely incapable of empathy. Anyone with a thought outside of themselves would be able to see why Jace was upset. Did she think he stubbed his toe? Couldn't reach the cookies? The kid is sick and tired of people screaming in front of him, of people leaving, of being the last thought on anyone's mind. Oh God, this is breaking my heart.....

[sandwoman]

Here's a "bonus clip" of Barb and Jace setting up the party: http://www.mtv.com/shows/teen_mom_2/all-by-myself-bonus-clip/1080790/video/#id=1730903

It's still pretty damn heartbreaking and Barb ... Barb has Problems. She shouldn't be bashing Nathan to Jace (even though I really hate Nathan) because Nathan for all intents and purposes is Jace's stepdad. The way Jace scampers after Barb and climbs the ladder, desperate for physical contact, it reminds me of this psych experiment with baby monkeys. One monkey had a "cloth mother" and one had a "wire mother" (both just dolls). The way Jace snuggles up to Barb and she pays no attention to him, she's like those artificial mothers. She's there but she's not giving anything back. Sadly Janelle is an even worse alternative. The whole situation is like an advertisement for why adoption is a better option for some young mothers than keeping a kid that no one has the emotional resources to love.

[ghoulina]

Did I hear Leah correctly when she said "I'm stressed out, so I'm taking some time off?"  I'm pretty sure that the tanning salon doesn't have a leave of absence option.  She for sure quit her job.

 

Plus, what a luxury to just be able to quit your job when you're feeling stressed. What about the people who HAVE to work their JOBS are what stress them out???

 

 

I thought he was telling LEAH not to cry or he would be pissed. It just goes back to his insecurities. If Leah cries over Cory, she somehow still loves him. He's in his right to feel the way he feels, but it doesn't mean that he has to be a bully. He really comes off as abusive.

 

Hmmmm, I thought he was saying it to Aleeah, because she was asking them to stop fighting and was getting real whiny with her voice. But you could be right, and yes - either way it comes across as almost bullying. People should be allowed to have feelings and cry if they need to. 

 

I would like to see Dr. Drew play a montage of Jace's heartbreak for Jenelle, Nathan and Barb.  They need to see what they're doing to this innocent child.

 

At this point, I have no hope for any of them. I imagine they'd be zoned out thinking of how wronged THEY have been the entire time, and then give some trite BS response to Dr. Drew. He'll move right along, saying how he's never seen them all in such a good place. And Jace will continue to suffer. 

[BitterApple]

It boggles the mind that Barb's first instinct was to call Nathan and fight. Never mind the clearly devastated and sobbing child right in front of you. No, fighting with your loser daughter's loser baby daddy was more important. Barb and Jenelle have such a sick, co-dependent relationship. Jenelle has used and abused her mother for years and she's STILL more important to Barb than poor Jace. The whole mess is just disgusting.

[BitchOnWheelz]

 

Between Barb threatening to send him somewhere else if he doesn't behave and Jenelle letting it be known that he's priority #4 or #5, this kid has got to feel SO unwanted. My heart is just breaking for him. All the adults in his life are all about their own issues, and just brush him aside like he's a buzzing fly. Jenelle and Barb have yet ANOTHER fight in front of the kid, mom storms out (when Jace was clearly looking forward to helping set up for the party....but does anyone think about him?), and he's standing there in tears. So what does Barb do? Call Nathan to scream and curse some more! Put down the mother flipping phone and console the poor child! For the love of God. I feel like I need to start a Kickstarter campaign - "Hugs for Jace". She kept asking, "what's wrong?" like it was a mystery why the child would be crying. Oh, I don't know....maybe because all this drama makes him feel scared and uncertain and he's basically emotionally neglected. Gah, they all make me sick.

And this is the way they act ON CAMERA!!!  I can't imagine how they behave in private.

[lilmarysunshine]

OK....I guess I'll stand alone. lol   I did not think it was out of bounds for Kail to ask that of Jo and I thought it was pretty crappy of him to deny it. :::ducking:::  I was reserving judgment, though, because I did wonder why they would schedule it that way. But it seems like it probably involves her "job" and so she didn't pick the dates and had no choice.

 

Now the disclaimer:  I can't really blame Jo, either, though. I think in a perfect world, the dad would say "You know what? He'll have fun on that trip. We can celebrate Father's Day with my family some other time this summer. Just please don't make a habit of this."  To me, that really would be putting the kid first because I think Isaac would enjoy that trip. But, alas. I think Jo's world is not perfect. I think Kail is super aggressive with her ex and I can see why he wouldn't give in. I think it would be nice for Isaac to be able to celebrate with his dad, though, and go on a trip with Kail and Javi.  I can understand his reticence with giving an inch to her because she takes too much anyway.

 

Nathan is one of the creepiest people ever. Jace really drew the short straw with families. Poor kid.

Edited September 11, 2014 by lilmarysunshine

[BitchOnWheelz]

MTV was furiously doing damage control after the episode with the dogs... What about Jace?

[SlothLoveChunk]

To me, it's clearly evident that both Barbara and Jenelle suffer from the constant need for drama. Much like Jenelle seeks out horrible men to become dependent on, Barbara seeks out drama with her daughter and everyone her daughter knows and NEEDS her daughter to be dependent on her. It's probably how Barbara was raised, and Jenelle is just continuing the cycle. If Jenelle doesn't OD in the next 10 years, I can guarantee that when she's 50, her looks are gone, and she's raising Jace's kids (horrendously at that), she'll seek out fights with Jace's baby momma's and Jace himself.

They both thrive on abuse and drama. It must make them feel wanted or something, because I just don't get it.

[fliptopbox]

I love how MTV's version of damage control was a quick voice-over. We haven't even seen the dogs since that episode. Are they ever allowed out of their garage prison?

 

Seriously I'd love to talk to their neighbors. I bet they have some great stories. Or heartbreaking ones..

[BitchOnWheelz]

 

She shouldn't be bashing Nathan to Jace (even though I really hate Nathan) because Nathan for all intents and purposes is Jace's stepdad.

Nathan will be posted on Jenelle's wall of relationship failures before Thanksgiving.  Not a step-dad because Jenelle is not a MOM.  I think someone needs to bash Nathan in front of Jace so he knows that men shouldn't act the way he does.

[fliptopbox]

And I am sure as soon as Nathan is gone for good Kaiser Roll will take a permanent trip to Memay's house. Poor Barb. She really doesn't deserve all that shit. She's not mother of the year, for sure, but at least she's doing something. Jace's basic needs are being met, even if his emotional ones aren't.

Edited September 11, 2014 by fliptopbox

[Kellyee]

 

OK....I guess I'll stand alone. lol   I did not think it was out of bounds for Kail to ask that of Jo and I thought it was pretty crappy of him to deny it.

In theory, I agree with you. Father's Day and Mother's Day are ridiculous Hallmark holidays, and people who are coparenting outside of a relationship should be flexible. It would have been nice if Isaac could go on vacation with mom and Javi and then come back and have time with Dad.

 

But I don't blame Jo for one simple reason: If the tables were turned, Kailyn would be screaming and hauling him into court just for asking. She keeps a complete double standard. For that reason, it is safer for Jo to stick to the court-appointed schedule. In most custody agreements, mom gets Mother's Day and dad gets Father's Day. If Jo gives Kail any slack, he'll be visiting his son on the other side of the country in no time.

 

In a previous episode, Kailyn admitted that she doesn't correct Isaac when he calls Javi "Dad", but she would not tolerate it at all if Isaac ever called Vee "Mom". She wasn't even sorry to admit that. She feels totally justified. Kailyn didn't inherit her mom's alcoholism, but the selfishness doesn't fall far from the Mommy tree.

[BitchOnWheelz]

Who else is a horrible employee for posting on the Teen Mom 2 forum while at work?  I know I'm not the only one who's going to hell.

[BitterApple]

lilmarysunshine, I'd be inclined to feel sympathy for Kail if she didn't have a history of being disagreeable and undermining Jo at every turn. I'm just sick of her and Javi acting like their time with Isaac is paramount while Jo is only entitled to whatever scraps they feel like dishing out. If the situation were reversed and Jo told Kail he and Vee were taking Isaac on vacation during Mother's Day, she would have flipped the fuck out and let everyone know what a horrible person Jo was. It's hard for me to take her side in any of this.

Edited September 11, 2014 by BitterApple

[BitchOnWheelz]

lilmarysunshine, I'd be inclined to feel for sympathy for Kail if she didn't have a history of being disagreeable and undermining Jo at every turn. I'm just sick of her and Javi acting like their time with Isaac is paramount while Jo is only entitled to whatever scraps they feel like dishing out. If the situation were reversed and Jo told Kail he and Vee were taking Isaac on vacation during Mother's Day, she would have flipped the fuck out and let everyone know what a horrible person Jo was. It's hard for me to take her side in any of this.

Exactly.  This is the reason there are custody agreements... because it's in the child's best interest to have equal time with both parents.  Because relationships between split parents are relatively unstable, boundaries are important.  Custody orders are only as good as the parents who follow them.  MY SD's mom seems to feel that her relationship, as the mother and custodial parent, supersede's my husband's relationship with his daughter.  Kids have the right to a relationship with both parents and a custody agreement gives children legal rights to that... mother & father.

Edited September 11, 2014 by BitchOnWheelz

[lilmarysunshine]

lilmarysunshine, I'd be inclined to feel for sympathy for Kail if she didn't have a history of being disagreeable and undermining Jo at every turn. I'm just sick of her and Javi acting like their time with Isaac is paramount while Jo is only entitled to whatever scraps they feel like dishing out. If the situation were reversed and Jo told Kail he and Vee were taking Isaac on vacation during Mother's Day, she would have flipped the fuck out and let everyone know what a horrible person Jo was. It's hard for me to take her side in any of this.

I agree with that.

 

But I do think....if it was *really* about Isaac, that they would work it out. I know that is difficult when you're dealing with difficult, irrational people (which I'm no Kail fan - I think she was dead wrong to move Isaac away from Jo).  The truth is, though, that Isaac loses. He can have a family BBQ on any day. I might have more sympathy for Jo if he expressed that reservation to Vee, that giving anything to Kail will just embolden her, instead of just that is his day. To me, the thing to suggest is "Well, can I have him on Mother's Day, then?"  He can have a family BBQ that day, too.

 

It would also give us an idea of how Kail would react. lol

Exactly.  This is the reason there are custody agreements... because it's in the child's best interest to have equal time with both parents.  Because relationships between split parents are relatively unstable, boundaries are important.  Custody orders are only as good as the parents who follow them.  MY SD's mom seems to feel that her relationship, as the mother and custodial parent, supersede's my husband's relationship with his daughter.  Kids have the right to a relationship with both parents and a custody agreement gives children legal rights to that... mother & father.

I absolutely believe in a father's rights. I've been a Kail hata for a long ass time because I think she's worked hard to undermine Jo's relationship with Isaac. Read through my posts. 

 

But the truth is that Jo is keeping Isaac from going on vacation* because he's insisting on that Hallmark holiday. If Kail and Javi purposefully scheduled a vacay on Father's Day, I wouldn't even question Jo's decision. But it sounds like that is the only time they can go because it involves Kail's work situation. So...yeah....it sucks for Isaac.

 

* If they are going to be gone and it is not Jo's time, who is going to keep Isaac while they're out of town? Javi's parents, I guess?

[GreatKazu]

Posting while at work - the boss is "taking time off". He must be stressing over shit like Leah. Must be nice.

 

 

 

To me, the thing to suggest is "Well, can I have him on Mother's Day, then?"  He can have a family BBQ that day, too.It would also give us an idea of how Kail would react. lol

 

Props! That would be similar to killing two birds with one stone. That would have certainly given the opportunity for Kail to show her true colors. We know she would fight tooth and nail to have Isaac on Mother's Day, but for her to actually say the words, would be the icing on the cake. The rest, I don't agree with as I will note below.

 

Don't you just love how she will put on the tear machine when she drops Isaac off with his dad in next week's episode? Of course she will cry and boo hoo because she won't see her child for six weeks. Cry me a fucking river, bitch. You made the choices and now, you must deal with the consequences. I think Kail needs people to feel sorry for her and by crying, she will try to make Jo look like a bad person for daring to have his child during his court-ordered time.

 

 

If Kail and Javi purposefully scheduled a vacay on Father's Day, I wouldn't even question Jo's decision.

Kail knew since February of her schedule and the whole vacation situation. Why did she wait until the last minute to ask Jo? That is the shit that reeks. Kail has shown how she is sneaky and doesn't tell Jo anything, until she is forced to. Remember how she didn't tell him she was getting married until the last moment? Remember how she told him after the fact that she was moving to another state? Kail is one sneaky and conniving bitch, period. She even stole her mother's television.  I don't trust her. As someone else pointed out, she may not be an alcoholic like her mother, but she sure learned how to be manipulative like Susie.

 

Didn't Kail say she never drank before? She mentioned last night having drank Moscato wine in the past.

 

Did anyone notice how Baby Lincoln grew? In one scene he seemed younger than he did when he was sitting on the bed alone. MTV editing monkeys.

Edited September 11, 2014 by GreatKazu

[Chicken Wing]

But I do think....if it was *really* about Isaac, that they would work it out. I know that is difficult when you're dealing with difficult, irrational people (which I'm no Kail fan - I think she was dead wrong to move Isaac away from Jo).  The truth is, though, that Isaac loses. He can have a family BBQ on any day. I might have more sympathy for Jo if he expressed that reservation to Vee, that giving anything to Kail will just embolden her, instead of just that is his day. To me, the thing to suggest is "Well, can I have him on Mother's Day, then?"  He can have a family BBQ that day, too.

 

Having a custody arrangement, and deciding who gets the kid when and for how long and agreeing on as fair a situation as possible to that end, is working it out. Not working it out would be the one parent taking the kid and keeping him 365 days a year with nary a phone call. When you have a family dynamic where one parent lives in one state and the other lives in another state, and the kid splits his time between the two per a schedule, then everyone is sacrificing in some capacity at some time or another. Because that's life. Isaac would love to see both of his parents every day. Both Kail and Jo would love to get to be with Isaac every single day. But they can't. They can't have everything all the time. They have to compromise, and they did when they set the schedule in the first place.

 

Isaac would lose out either way. Either he spends Father's Day with his dad and the rest of the Riveras and misses out on a fun trip to the beach with his mom, or he goes with Kail to the beach and misses a fun barbecue day with his dad and the rest of his family in New Jersey. It would be lovely if he could be in both places at the same time, but he cannot, and apparently Kail's vacation falls on that day, period, and Father's Day is Father's Day, period. Technically, yes, Jo can have a family barbecue any day. Kail can also take the kids to the beach any day, too. But this is Father's Day - not just a day that Jo was scheduled to have Isaac, but it's Father's Day.

 

And as said earlier somewhere, if she was asking to borrow Isaac for any other day out of Jo's six weeks, he probably would have been fine - maybe they'd compromise by having the six weeks end one day later to make it up. But she was asking for Father's Day. That's stupid. I doubt Kail and Javi purposely scheduled their trip for Father's Day - most likely they were not actually in charge of when they were allowed to take vacation - but them's the breaks. Sure, it sucks that the way the scheduling worked out means that Kail will be going on her family vacation without one of her kids, but you know what? Sometimes life just works that way. Things don't always happen exactly the way you want, and you can't get everything you want when you want it. It's just the way it is. That's what you have to deal with, so she ought to suck it up. Kail is trying to have everything both ways, and that's not fair, and Jo absolutely should not have to sacrifice more than he has to for that.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Chicken Wing

[GreatKazu]

I forgot to add, that "Hallmark" day comment, just doesn't sit right with me.   Father's Day and Mother's Day have always been special days to me and my siblings. I am sure it is special to a lot of people. I know it is special to those children who no longer have their parents under one roof. It is not as if it is Valentine's Day. To me, it is about Jo spending it with the child he truly loves and has fought a long and hard battle with someone who tried to keep him away from his beautiful child. Jo deserves to have his son by his side on that day, out of all the days of the year. Kail has the benefit of having Isaac for a lot more time than Jo, even though she bitches about it far too much. I bet Jo would love to take his child off her hands for more time than he gets.

 

the truth is that Jo is keeping Isaac from going on vacation

The truth is, a judge and Kail agreed to it. That is why they sign the documents and the court signs and formalizes the agreement so that these kind of situations don't occur where parents are playing tug-o-war with the poor child.

Edited September 11, 2014 by GreatKazu

[lilmarysunshine]

I'd rather have a beach vacation than an afternoon family BBQ, particularly when that BBQ really can be any day Jo has him. Just sayin'.

 

Not discounting custody arrangements but it sucks for the kid when his parents can't be reasonable adults. In this, I mostly blame Kail. I think Jo is so used to dealing with her that he rightfully distrusts her but, at least short-term, his kid (I'm not talking about Kail) is missing out on an opportunity.

[JerseyGirl]

Was the "beach" Atlantis in Nassau Bahamas or the Delaware beaches????

 

I think that Jo could have set aside Father's Day for the Sunday before or after if it were Atlantis.  That's a once in a lifetime trip and if Kail was going for some convention, she would never be able to afford to go again when the kids are that age.  If so, Isaac really missed out and shame on Jo for being selfish.  

[lilmarysunshine]

 

 

 

The truth is, a judge and Kail agreed to it. That is why they sign the documents and the court signs and formalizes the agreement so that these kind of situations don't occur where parents are playing tug-o-war with the poor child.

I don't care about Kail's feelings. I care about Isaac's. There are people out there with custody arrangements who negotiate things that come up and do it like adults and kids win. I understand with Kail it is difficult and that's why I'd give Jo a pass. But in theory? I think it sucks for kids if their days are set in stone and adults can't AGREE to amend them in minor ways. ("You have him during my work picnic. Can we switch weekends?" - I have known of divorced parents who do that kind of thing all of the time and the kid is better off for it.)

 

If my kids had obligations on Mother's Day, I'd get over it and celebrate some other day. You can celebrate Mother's Day any day. Plenty of people who work holidays live that way. Divorced parents have to learn to do that all of the time. There's only one Thanksgiving. There's only one actual birthday a year.

[SPLAIN]

I'd rather have a beach vacation than an afternoon family BBQ, particularly when that BBQ really can be any day Jo has him. Just sayin'

The point is, Isaac is a child who doesn't know Father's Day from a day at the beach. He is a kid who will have fun no matter what day of the year it is. It is not what you or I would rather do, but a child just wants to have fun whether it means being at home with dad playing with his cars or going to the park and play with other kids while the adults have a barbecue.

 

Having been through the same situation, I can honestly say there are parents who do ignore the court order and make different arrangements. However, this is Kail, and court orders were made for people like her who will ask for an inch and instead take a foot. Yes plenty of parents circumvent custody arrangements, and I think it is great when both parents are giving in to each other's needs and being able to make changes at a moment's notice. Kail, as mentioned by a member above, has shown she is a hypocrite when it comes to Isaac. It is okay for Javi to be referred to as "dad", but don't let Vee be called, "mom". If Kail cannot see the hypocrisy in that or even compromise for something such as how Isaac refers to the adults in his life, then anything else is not up for compromise.

 

It would be nice to see Jo relent and show he is the bigger person in this situation, but I hate how it is being referred to as "just a barbecue" when in reality, it might be the day that all of the Riveras are together and that may not always be the case on "any other day". I know in my family we can all get together on specific holidays because everyone is scattered around different parts of the state. Kail can't understand that family dynamic because she has no family other than her mother. She has cut off everyone else. Why deny Isaac the opportunity to be with many members of his family simply because she is able to live her life without hers?

[Chicken Wing]

I'd rather have a beach vacation than an afternoon family BBQ, particularly when that BBQ really can be any day Jo has him. Just sayin'.

Not discounting custody arrangements but it sucks for the kid when his parents can't be reasonable adults. In this, I mostly blame Kail. I think Jo is so used to dealing with her that he rightfully distrusts her but, at least short-term, his kid (I'm not talking about Kail) is missing out on an opportunity.

 

The thing is, the barbecue doesn't just "happen" to be scheduled that day. It's not just because they have plans that day. It's Father's Day. It's important to him. It may be one of those not-a-real-holiday holidays, but it matters to a lot of people and for many it's a major family day, as is Mother's Day. Kail wasn't asking for Isaac to skip going to a barbecue; she was asking for Isaac to skip being with his dad on Father's Day. I think Jo was very reasonable to say no as reasonably as he did when Kail so ostentatious to even ask. And like I said, if it were any random day that they just happened to be having a barbecue and Kail wanted to have Isaac back for a day out of Jo's time because her family is going away on a trip and she would like him to be a part of it, that would be a whole different thing. Then I would think Jo was being unreasonable and even selfish for keeping Isaac from going on a fun trip just because it happened to be on his scheduled day. ("My day! You can't have it! Nyah!") But again, it's not just a random day. That's the whole point. It's not just a random day. As special and important as Kail's plans are to her, so are Jo's to him. They both matter. But they already agreed that this day was Jo's, and the actual day does matter to him. Maybe next year Kail and Javi can work out their schedules so they don't make big plans with the kids on a day when one of them isn't even going to be there. I gotta side with Jo on this one. As a side note, though, I have a feeling that if Kail hadn't been such a raging hosebeast about their custody scheduling all this time and hadn't fought with Jo so much about how much time he should get with Isaac, Jo might have acquiesced on this one. But since their history went the way it did, he didn't and shouldn't because (a) he fought too hard to get a fair and reasonable amount of time with his son, and (b) Kail has given him very little reason to think he can give an inch and she won't take a full mile, so it's probably in everyone's best interests to stay within the boundaries they agreed on.

 

On a personal note, I would rather go to the beach than a barbecue with my family, but that's because my famly is annoying.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Chicken Wing

[spidermiss2426]

Singing Jace is so sad-- I agree with everyone who has said that.  Back when I was a child-- starting at around age seven-- I was depressed and suicidal and it went unnoticed (although considering what my parents were dealing with, I don't blame them for not noticing) and one of my many coping mechanisms was singing to myself like that.  So when I saw poor Jace doing it... I about died.  I don't even want kids, but I want to drive down to myrtle beach (I live only a couple of hours away) and get him myself and raise him.  I'd give him more love than he is getting right now.

The situation with Jace reminds me of a friend of mine in Jr. high school-- my friend Jeremy was always being yelled at by his Mom for really nothing-- and not just normal parental kind of yelling.  Being called a bastard through yelling at the top of her lungs in front of me for not taking out the garbage even though she didn't ask him type yelling-- she told her four year old daughter that "I can't wait until you go to school next year because then I don't have to look at your face".  Anyway, Jeremy went to the mental hospital for a few years.  What will happen to Jace by the time he is a teenager?

[mrsh]

Leah is a huge piece of shit, she's obviously high on something for her to fly off the handle at Cory like that. Germy needs to take several seats and stop talking crap about Cory, all the drama Cory is going through is what Germy will go through when he and Leah divorce in a couple of years.

Kail was wrong to even ask Jo about the vacation, but this is Kail so I'm not surprised. She looked like she wanted to hulk smash Jo when he said no, but was trying hard to control herself. Javi is an ass, enough said.

I want to adopt Jace and give him hugs and love and attention. My heart hurts for him, I really think he's a sweet kid but that's being stped out of him by the trio of idiots that are raising him. I hope CPS gets involved, and gets him out of there.

Chelsea is doing great. Aubree is adorable, I love her husky voice.

Adumb gets balder and more gross looking with every episode. His girlfriend looks rode hard and put away wet, like a huge walking STD.

[lilmarysunshine]

He is almost 5, right? He's not one or two. My kids would have picked a beach vacation (assuming several days of fun) over a single day with dad and grampa playing cars. Maybe they're just not sentimental. ;-)  As far as we know, Jo's family is local to the general area and they see each other fairly often.  It wasn't even planned yet. He told Kail that but then told Vee that was what he was thinking about doing. If he ever wants her to be flexible, he's probably out of luck. (Was probably out of luck, anyway. But this way Isaac would have had two cool things in the summer.)

 

And I actually thought she handled the denial pretty well, considering. She said she feels like she's always fighting with him and even said she's always been the one to initiate the legal stuff. Javi was the one who was out of control. He has just turned into a punk, acting like he's Dad #1 and Jo's Dad #2.

Edited September 11, 2014 by lilmarysunshine

[Chicken Wing]

Adumb gets balder and more gross looking with every episode. His girlfriend looks rode hard and put away wet, like a huge walking STD.

 

Both of them just make you want to take a big step to the side as they walk toward you lest they accidentally brush up against you.

[DangerousMinds]

This episode made me come out of hiding and post. I am a stepmom and have seen my DH go through so much of this stuff that it really makes my blood boil.

 

First, Kai: I don't even know what went through her head when she decided to plan a vacation during Father's Day. I truly feel that if she had planned any other time during Jo's 6 week time he probably would have agreed as long as he could make up the time. I don't understand mother's who don't feel that Father's Day is important when they would throw a huge fit if Mother's Day was ever taken from them. If Kail thinks Isaac will be upset about not getting to go on the vacation then he will be upset with his mom (not his dad) for scheduling a family vacation while he was at his dads. Common sense Kail, you don't have it.

 

 

 

I got the feeling that Kail and Javi had to wait to find out when his vacation would be - I don't think they had any choice in the dates. They had plans to vacation at the beach and Isaac loves the beach, I think kail just figured it wouldn't hurt to ask Jo. When he said no, I think she handled it well. Javi, on the other hand . ..  .

 

None of this bothers me much after seeing the horror that is Jace's life.

[lilmarysunshine]

I got the feeling that Kail and Javi had to wait to find out when his vacation would be - I don't think they had any choice in the dates. They had plans to vacation at the beach and Isaac loves the beach, I think kail just figured it wouldn't hurt to ask Jo. When he said no, I think she handled it well. Javi, on the other hand . ..  .

 

None of this bothers me much after seeing the horror that is Jace's life.

Yeah....I think it had to be those days. She bugs me in a major way but I don't think she'd go on vacation when Isaac couldn't go unless they had no choice about the dates. Maybe I give her too much credit. But she's not like Jenelle and seems to enjoy mothering her kid and not looking for reasons why she can't be around him.

[Chicken Wing]

I got the feeling that Kail and Javi had to wait to find out when his vacation would be - I don't think they had any choice in the dates. They had plans to vacation at the beach and Isaac loves the beach, I think kail just figured it wouldn't hurt to ask Jo. When he said no, I think she handled it well. Javi, on the other hand

 

That's what annoyed me the most. Javi. Why is Javi all up in Kail and Jo's business, anyway? Why does he always act like Isaac belongs to them and they're doing Jo a favor or something by letting him see his son? He's all, well, Isaac should be with us, this is his home, we are his home, he should come on the vacation with us. Sigh. Shut up, dude. Kail and Jo were surprisingly mature about the situation, which shocked me, for both. Jo could have acted more offended but he didn't, probably because he's perfected the art of responding to Kail with the minimum amount of words necessary to avoid any type of confrontation. Kail could have made a bigger deal when he said no but she didn't, probably because she knew it wasn't really a fair request and she already anticipated him saying no because it's understandable that he'd say no, so it was hardly a big shock or anything. I like that they are both at a place where they realize the fighting gets them nowhere so they're just not even going to bother. But here's Javi coming down on Kail for not fighting more, for caving to Jo, blah blah blah. It would have been awesome for them if Jo had said yes, but it was perfectly reasonable for him to say no and that's what he did, so that's that. Shut up and worry about your own kid, the one you're holding in your arms as you're speaking, and stay out of it.

 

 

 

And I actually thought she handled the denial pretty well, considering. She said she feels like she's always fighting with him and even said she's always been the one to initiate the legal stuff. Javi was the one who was out of control. He has just turned into a punk, acting like he's Dad #1 and Jo's Dad #2.

 

Yes, this. I too appreciated how self-aware Kail has been about all the things she's fought with Jo over in the past, and it's almost always because of her starting it. She's over it. Besides, what is she going to do? What does Javi want her to do? Take Jo to court and accuse him of having the audacity to follow their custody schedule exactly the way they agreed to?

Edited September 11, 2014 by Chicken Wing

[DangerousMinds]

Right?! Kail didn't have a decent dress or a skirt and a blouse she could have thrown on? She looked like she'd lost quite a bit of baby weight, so she had to have something in her closet that would have fit her.I

I found myself shaking my head that this was the first time either had ever ordered wine in a restaurant (or anywhere), and knew nothing about wine. They just seemed so young, which they are. But they had no problems jumping right into the lifelong commitment of marriage, having a baby, and buying a house. All before either ordered their first drink in a restaurant. So different from me or anyone I've known.

[SPLAIN]

The horror with the whole Jace matter...words just fail. I wish I could post here the anger that built up inside of me last night. I am now real sad. I am an adult and I could not handle what I was watching. I cannot imagine how that child felt. My heart is filled with so much pity, and if there was ever a time I wanted to hit someone, it was last night. Except, I wanted to smack three people - Nathan, Barb and Jenelle.

 

I got the feeling that Kail and Javi had to wait to find out when his vacation would be - I don't think they had any choice in the dates. They had plans to vacation at the beach and Isaac loves the beach, I think kail just figured it wouldn't hurt to ask Jo. When he said no, I think she handled it well. Javi, on the other hand . ..  .

Yes, there was mention about Javi having to find out if he could even have time off. At least, that is my recollection. They did go to Atlantis in Bahamas. It was planned since February 2014 per Kail's Twitter.

 

I think Kail, by now, has gotten over this issue and is not as big an issue as it seems to be here.

 

When Cory mentioned their child having missed her therapy appointments, it made me wonder if this was possibly why the insurance company is holding off on approving the chair. I know in real time she did get the chair, but going by the timeline on the show, couldn't the insurance company have received information from the therapist via medical records and billing about the missed appointments, especially if the insurance company is paying for those visits? I remember years ago when I needed physical therapy, I was told upfront to not miss any appointments without a doctor's approval or else my insurance may stop paying because they feel there is no point in paying for something if the patient is not doing their part.

[housewifecrazy]

I got the feeling that Kail and Javi had to wait to find out when his vacation would be - I don't think they had any choice in the dates. They had plans to vacation at the beach and Isaac loves the beach, I think kail just figured it wouldn't hurt to ask Jo. When he said no, I think she handled it well. Javi, on the other hand . ..  .

 

None of this bothers me much after seeing the horror that is Jace's life.

 

 Do we know this? I might have missed it because the show last night was irritating me so bad that I skipped a lot but did they say they didn't have a choice on when their vacation was? In the 15 years of working both DH and I have always been able to schedule our vacations whenever we wanted.

[whydoiwatchtv]

When Jace launched into his little rainbow song, my heart just shattered like a glass balloon. Barb may have saved Jace from Jennele, but it is not good enough for him. His entire life has been fights and his mom being a piece of shit. The rest of the people are trying, like Kail, Chelsea and Jo. Adam will always be a loser father. But Jace, sigh. I feel like his chances of a normal, loving life are about gone. :(

[GreatKazu]

didn't have a choice on when their vacation was?

 

Kail was going to Bahamas for some Scentsy get-together. So, whether Javi could go with her or not, was the issue she was referencing, I believe. He needed to get approval for the time off. Kail would go no matter what, but probably wanted to make it a family affair. It was their second honeymoon.

 

I do agree Kail handled the situation the way it should be handled - she asked and was turned down and pretty much just shrugged her shoulders to the issue and tried to move on. Javi on the other hand, just like Cory, gets pissed when their women don't push their exes into demanding more of them. Kail did bring on that herself. She battered it into Javi's thin head into believing Jo is at fault for everything that doesn't go their way. Now, she is dealing with the consequences of that behavior. I applaud her for being able to try to change things around and take ownership of her past behavior. She will now have to undo the damage she created with Javi.

[DangerousMinds]

Nathan will be posted on Jenelle's wall of relationship failures before Thanksgiving.  Not a step-dad because Jenelle is not a MOM.  I think someone needs to bash Nathan in front of Jace so he knows that men shouldn't act the way he does.

That's all Jace has seen from men, except probably Mike, who doesn't seem to be around anymore. Starting with Andrew, Keefer, Gary, Courtland, now Nathan. All the same.

Edited September 11, 2014 by DangerousMinds

[ghoulina]

I can't really blame Jo, either, though. I think in a perfect world, the dad would say "You know what? He'll have fun on that trip. We can celebrate Father's Day with my family some other time this summer. Just please don't make a habit of this."

 

I think the last part would be the problem. Kail has a history of taking advantage. I bet Jo thought if he gave an inch this time, Kail would take a mile next time.

 

But the truth is that Jo is keeping Isaac from going on vacation* because he's insisting on that Hallmark holiday.

 

The thing is, Jo might not see it as a "Hallmark" holiday. It might be very important holiday in his family. I get that Kail apparently had a "work" obligation during this time and decided to kill two birds with one stone, but that's not Jo's fault and she is the one that was hell bent on having a custody agreement set in stone. Now she needs to abide by it. Jo gets 6 weeks during the summer, and given the 3 hour drive, I think Isaac might enjoy that 6 weeks uninterrupted.  

[PlanetSassy]

I felt like Janelle had wised up and started seeing Nathan's true colors. I'm glad she called Nathan out for his uninvolvement with his daughter. But, it is absolutely unforgivable how she talks about Jace as though he isn't there, and ignored him when he was telling him he's there to help her.

When they arrived at Barb's house there was an opportunity for a bonding moment between mother/daughter...until Barb ruined it by screaming. I hate everything about the people fucking up Jace's life.

Did Corey's dad mention that Corey has the girls Fri-Mon? Is that every week? If so, why would he be expected to pay child support at all? And Leah can go to hell for allowing Germy to say such hateful things about Corey, like "Fuck him", in tje presence of the girlses. They adore Corey, and I'm really seeing Leah as more and more unfit. I hope Corey DOES get full custody.

Again, Kail yells at Isaac for doing kid stuff. What kind of controling lunatic yells at a kid to put a stick down, on a playground!? I don't blame her for asking bout Father's Day, but she should have come prepared to offer a comprimise. However, she accepted and expected Jo's response. Javi can fuck off, and just wait till Kail asks to take Lincoln with her on Fathers Day.

That being said, a "family vacation" that far away when its just parents with their infant seems like more trouble than its worth. A Scentsy convention at Atlantis...give me a break! Common sense alludes these people.

I loved that Chelsea was able to just laugh with her group, at Adam and his girlfriend.

[DangerousMinds]

And I am sure as soon as Nathan is gone for good Kaiser Roll will take a permanent trip to Memay's house. Poor Barb. She really doesn't deserve all that shit. She's not mother of the year, for sure, but at least she's doing something. Jace's basic needs are being met, even if his emotional ones aren't.

And that's exactly what the overburdened CPS system would say.

[BitterApple]

Regarding vacation time, it depends where you work. Some places go by seniority, others are pretty loosey-goosey as long as vacations don't create manpower or scheduling issues. I don't think Kail had a choice when to do the trip because it was arranged through Scentsy.

 

I've been to Atlantis and it's pretty awesome, so in a way it does suck that Isaac didn't get to go. However when Kail brought it up to Jo, it seems like she had the mentality where she knew it was a long shot and he'd likely say no. Javi was the one who was butt hurt over it.

And that's exactly what the overburdened CPS system would say.

In my state CPS won't do anything unless there's physical abuse, sexual abuse or drug activity in the home. Otherwise a kid's shit outta luck.

[NikSac]

In my state CPS won't do anything unless there's physical abuse, sexual abuse or drug activity in the home. Otherwise a kid's shit outta luck.

 

Same here in California. Heck even then they don't always have the capacity to do anything. I've known of kids in horrible situations where CPS has been called numerous times but haven't been able to do anything because it wasn't bad enough (yet). It's heartbreaking.

[lilmarysunshine]

I thought the same thing about the sticks. What little boy doesn't pick up sticks in a playground? Bizarre things she gets on him about. Real stick in the mud!

 

I will give props to Jo, too, for how gracious he was about Lincoln. He didn't have to even acknowledge him. Seems like maybe he and Kail are maturing some. She still bugs and I think she is very aware of how she's portrayed. But I do think there is some genuine growth from both of them.

Edited September 11, 2014 by lilmarysunshine

[DangerousMinds]

Yeah....I think it had to be those days. She bugs me in a major way but I don't think she'd go on vacation when Isaac couldn't go unless they had no choice about the dates. Maybe I give her too much credit. But she's not like Jenelle and seems to enjoy mothering her kid and not looking for reasons why she can't be around him.

Definitely - they all look great as parents compared to Jenelle!

[Lemons]

Here's a "bonus clip" of Barb and Jace setting up the party: http://www.mtv.com/shows/teen_mom_2/all-by-myself-bonus-clip/1080790/video/#id=1730903

It's still pretty damn heartbreaking and Barb ... Barb has Problems. She shouldn't be bashing Nathan to Jace (even though I really hate Nathan) because Nathan for all intents and purposes is Jace's stepdad. The way Jace scampers after Barb and climbs the ladder, desperate for physical contact, it reminds me of this psych experiment with baby monkeys. One monkey had a "cloth mother" and one had a "wire mother" (both just dolls). The way Jace snuggles up to Barb and she pays no attention to him, she's like those artificial mothers. She's there but she's not giving anything back. Sadly Janelle is an even worse alternative. The whole situation is like an advertisement for why adoption is a better option for some young mothers than keeping a kid that no one has the emotional resources to love.

Thanks for the clip.  Barb is gruff, no doubt about that.  But I think with some counseling, she can be made aware that Jace needs more.  Barb just doesn't think.  I was happy to hear her say "what a good boy!" for helping her. 

 

Oh yeah, Nathan thinks Barb is too old to play with Jace?  Janelle is the laziest bitch on the show.  She comes into Barb's house and lays down because of the long drive.  She lays down after feeding the dogs. Half the time Janelle is shown, she is flat out on the couch And there's Barb, moving furniture. 

[poeticlicensed]

WTF is Scentsy? Sorry, I feel like I'm out of the loop. 

[Lexie]

Leah: I think the reason why Corey is only paying 200 a month is because he has the kids four days out of the week.  That was an interesting tidbit that Jeremy's father shared.  Corey probably stepped up and took the girls more because Leah is out of her mind right now and they came to that agreement.   Why should he pay Leah when he has the kids at least half the time?   Leah probably makes as least as much as Cory since she has money from the show.   I can see Corey's arguement there.  He pays for Ali's health insurance, 60% of the medical costs, and child support,  plus has the kids four days out of the week, and Leah is still bitching?  Pure speculation but I think that what is going on there is

A) Leah and Jeremy have somehow pissed through all of Jeremy's money and the Teen Mom money too.   Weren't they buying that washer and dryer on a maxed out credit card?   How do they not have 3000 or whatever it was if he makes such big money and she gets money from mtv?  

B) They fight like cats and dogs over said no money problem, so they want to point the finger at Corey and deflect the problem so they don't have to actually work on their fucked up marriage where they harp and bitch and get smacked in the face with raw bacon.  

 

Kail:  Typical asshole attitude problem, even though Jo was being nice.   What the fuck is Javi's problem.   Does he not comprehend that Jo has an order saying that he gets Father's Day?    Does he think they went to court just because, and none of that is relevant now?   So stupid.  

 

Jenelle:   Gross.   So so gross.   Jenelle has ZERO plans on ever having Jace, Jace will never be as important as whatever guy she is with, and she can't even put her own selfish nonsense aside and tell her kid sure, she would love to decorate with him.   Barb is no prize but at least Jace doesn't have to live with Jenelle and Nathan.  I don't know why Barb even allows him to go over there since Jace is afraid of Nathan and thinks he's mean.   Too bad nobody is willing to step up and better Jace's quality of life.  

[lilmarysunshine]

Thanks for the clip.  Barb is gruff, no doubt about that.  But I think with some counseling, she can be made aware that Jace needs more.  Barb just doesn't think.  I was happy to hear her say "what a good boy!" for helping her. 

 

Oh yeah, Nathan thinks Barb is too old to play with Jace?  Janelle is the laziest bitch on the show.  She comes into Barb's house and lays down because of the long drive.  She lays down after feeding the dogs. Half the time Janelle is shown, she is flat out on the couch And there's Barb, moving furniture. 

Cracks me up these girls in their early 20s who whine so much about being "tired" when either pregnant or with young kids. I had a decade+ on them having kids in my mid to late 30s and whined about half as much.