S01.E02: Alouette

[nodorothyparker]

Airdate 09.17.23

Quote

Daryl, Isabelle, Laurent, and Sylvie face trouble on the road. Isabelle remembers the day the hungry ones appeared. Laurent struggles to fit in.

 

[cdnalor]

So I'm thinking a lot of French people will be "practicing their ing-GLISH" whenever Daryl is around or there's a lot of dialogue in a scene.  That's gonna feel awkward after a while.

Of course the zombaby turns out to be Laurent who's, let me guess, special blood just might hold the secret of a cure.  Hmmm, seems familiar...

 

[nodorothyparker]

Today's episode art.

 

[Straycat80]

This was a good episode. I’ve always liked the flashbacks to pre-ZA. I’m glad pedo guy got what he derserved 

[Brown44]

So teenage Jesus is the Nuns nephew that survived a pregnancy from her mother who was bitten.

The jacket she was wearing there is no way that deep a bite would have gotten thru.

And you got to hand it to the producers they are not gonna stop till they get a kids on there own storyline to work. The small things in the OG WD, to Worlds Beyond to what's being done in Fear WD, this is the 1st time I think it worked.

So far I'm liking the show.

Edited September 18, 2023 by Brown44
Miss spelling

[txhorns79]

Quote

I’ve always liked the flashbacks to pre-ZA.

The subway, and seeing the train come in as the walkers spread from one car to the other was terrifying. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

8 hours ago, Straycat80 said:

I’m glad pedo guy got what he derserved 

Was he a pedo? I didn't get that, unless I missed something. I did get selfish jerk, and broad American stereotype. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

Overall, ok episode. I liked the flashback stuff much more, the nun is turning out to be an interesting character, and she's played by a good actor for a change. The part with the kids reminded me of a Star Trek episode and was a little tedious until the end. I knew Daryl wasn't going to die in the zombie moat, but it was still a good watch. The "storm the castle and fight a baddie" part has been done so many times on this franchise. Laurent is still annoying. 

7 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

The subway, and seeing the train come in as the walkers spread from one car to the other was terrifying. 

Agree, that was one of the scarier shots this universe has shown. Well done. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

19 hours ago, cdnalor said:

Of course the zombaby turns out to be Laurent who's, let me guess, special blood just might hold the secret of a cure. 

I know this is exactly what's going to happen, but even with this pseudo-science, how TF does that actually work? Why would he have a cure just because his mother was bit just before he was born?

I know, I'm just being silly. 

[nodorothyparker]

The flashbacks to the breakdown of the ZA were really well done, maybe some of the most effective we've seen across any of the franchise. The train speeding by was legitimately terrifying, and I like that for once they didn't skip ahead over the incredible chaos as it unfolded.

As soon as they introduced the pregnant sister, you could see where that was going from a million miles away. It was still pretty effectively done, though, especially as you realized how early it was in the ZA that the priest already knew and was preparing himself but Isabelle didn't when she had that split second of hope "oh look she's moving again." The logical part of my brain that has been pregnant and knows how all that works is thinking wait, the kid has been getting everything from her placenta during the whole time she's been breaking down/changing/whatever. Surely, the zombie virus also crossed the placenta too. I mean, didn't any of you see Dawn of the Dead? But I get that it's now a part of modern zombie lore that survivors believe bitten mothers pass on immunity/a cure. So we're doing this.

But so the convent just decided to raise the kid as the most special to ever special messiah and didn't happen to mention oh hey, that one nun over there you're so fond of is your aunt? Okay. I'm mostly just befuddled by yet another case of people deliberately choosing to infantilize kids living in such a dangerous wasteland. It's one thing to try to protect them from the worst and ugliest things, it's another entirely to pull the "oh, he went to live on a nice farm/er, he's off eating apples" when you know exactly why Daryl let the mule go on a kid almost as tall as you are. But apparently even in France, horses and mules grow on trees.

I didn't pick up on the pedophile thing with the guy in the castle either, but I admit I'm not catching every word with some of the accents and the subtitles aren't always great. He was the broad stereotype of every ugly American, right down to prominently mentioning that he was from Texas. I did snort though at Isabelle's dismissive answer to the question of how "Father Daryl" has been there awhile and still doesn't speak any French. "Oh, he's an American," and everyone nods.

1 hour ago, Superclam said:

I knew Daryl wasn't going to die in the zombie moat, but it was still a good watch. The "storm the castle and fight a baddie" part has been done so many times on this franchise.

But never with literal castle and moat. That alone was almost worth all the drama over deciding to shoot and set this series in France of all places.

Mork and Mindy!

[Mr. Sparkle]

27 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

But never with literal castle and moat. That alone was almost worth all the drama over deciding to shoot and set this series in France of all places.

I'll give them credit for using the scenery to its fullest. 

[OoohMaggie]

To all the animal lovers, there is a graphic scene at just about 35 minutes involving one of our four legged friends, again, I know some like to bypass these scenes.

It wasn't as good as E1, it still looked great but started reverting to a bit of the old same old. They could have done so much better with the attack on Schloss Adler, Daryl's no Burton or Eastwood.

I think her Scottish partner may be making an appearance in Paris and I'm glad Sidekick Nun makes it at least that far.

It does make a nice change to see Daryl leaving a community with as many people alive as when he entered it. 

A lot could be riding on E3, we're swapping the countryside and few characters for the city and what looks like many, I hope they don't revert too much to the old ways.

The train was a good touch and reminded me of the Tom Cruise War Of The Worlds, when the train flew past and was completely on fire.

Altogether a solid episode but was left just a little wanting

 

Edited September 18, 2023 by OoohMaggie

[Straycat80]

3 hours ago, Superclam said:

Was he a pedo? I didn't get that, unless I missed something. I did get selfish jerk, and broad American stereotype. 

Why would this creepy man have a young boy locked up in a room? Why was he keeping him alive? That he was a pedo was the only reason I could think of. 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Straycat80

[Mr. Sparkle]

Definitely a strange situation. Anyway, he won't be doing that again! 

[iMonrey]

This was an OK episode but does the timeline work? How far into the zombie apocalypse are we? Hasn't it been about 15 years now? It doesn't seem like any of those kids would have been born before it took place, and yet I swore the Head Girl said the kids there were at school when the outbreak took place and their parents never picked them up. Laurent was born just shortly after the outbreak and seemed older than most of those kids. And how old is he?

Also, a community of feral kids is kind of an overdone trope, no matter how well it's done. 

That said, the flashbacks were pretty good and this episode really demonstrated there is no need for Tattoo Face in this story. It was doing just fine until he popped up again at the end. 

2 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

But so the convent just decided to raise the kid as the most special to ever special messiah and didn't happen to mention oh hey, that one nun over there you're so fond of is your aunt?

Yeah I see no logical reason why Isabelle needs to keep that from him.

Also, this is starting to feel WAY too much like The Last of Us, with Laurent playing the part of Ellie. Both born to infected/just-turned mothers, now possibly possessing The Cure? That seems like too much of a coincidence.

I think it would have been more interesting if Lily's baby just came out a zombie. Have we ever seen a zombie baby before? A zombie baby would be cool.

[Boofish]

Another solid episode.

The subway scene reminded me of Train To Busan. If you are a super fan of the zombie genre, this is a must watch. IMHO the best one of any I have ever watched and I have watched quite a few.

Add me to the list of people who didn't see anything to indicate old dude was a pedo. I need to re-watch to see how they knew each other and how he found her in the street. I should have paid closer attention to the beginning.

As an American in Paris, I can attest to the fact that 95% of the people I encountered spoke English very well. Not only did they speak English they were helpful and kind. I'm always taken aback by American's who think the French or rude or snobby. I did not encounter 1 person who was rude to me. Now the lady in Italy at the airport who was selling sandwiches is a story for another day ... 😂. My husband and bestie still laugh to this day at how mean that lady was to me for no reason.

[nitrofishblue]

I admit that so far I have enjoyed this story line. Maybe the writing has been a bit better than the "Fear" story line, I don't know. At least so far it has kept my interest for the full time instead if me changing stations looking for some thing better. Hope the trend continues. Right now the writers strike has left slim pickings for anything new. I have DVR'd over 200 episodes of Stargate SG-1. That is my most most most favorite series!!!!!

[OoohMaggie]

3 hours ago, Straycat80 said:

Why would this creepy man have a young boy locked up in a room? Why was he keeping him alive?

I could well be mistaken, but wasn't the boy part of the team who first attempted to raid the castle? Another member was seen shuffling around the moat. The American being the low life that he is, was probably keeping the boy hostage to use as blackmail with which to procure more stuff or for trade in the future, if he was a paedo, I think the kid would have shot him in the head at the first opportunity.                                                      

Edited September 18, 2023 by OoohMaggie

[rmontro]

Another good episode.  And was fairly light on villains, which I appreciate.  Helps that Daryl is so likable, must be the rough exterior with the heart of gold.  

On 9/17/2023 at 11:56 AM, cdnalor said:

Of course the zombaby turns out to be Laurent who's, let me guess, special blood just might hold the secret of a cure.  Hmmm, seems familiar..

That's possible, although I don't know why that would work, or why they think that might be.  I guess it could have something to do with natural immunity.  But if he represents a potential cure, that doesn't bode well for his survival.  They're not going to risk their zombie universe.

[gutbuster]

"I lied to you about the medicine so I could get a horse. I'm sorry, that was wrong."

"You shouldn't have lied about that"

"But you told them I was Father Daryl. And you lied about the horse. And she lied about why those other kids never came back."

"...well, yeah, but-"

Tonight on Walking Dead, I learned that Lying is Wrong and the messiah is learning how to whine about never getting to do what he wants.

Edited September 19, 2023 by gutbuster

[maystone]

11 hours ago, iMonrey said:

This was an OK episode but does the timeline work? How far into the zombie apocalypse are we? Hasn't it been about 15 years now? It doesn't seem like any of those kids would have been born before it took place, and yet I swore the Head Girl said the kids there were at school when the outbreak took place and their parents never picked them up. Laurent was born just shortly after the outbreak and seemed older than most of those kids. And how old is he?

Also, a community of feral kids is kind of an overdone trope, no matter how well it's done. 

 

Isabelle told Daryl that she'd been there 12 years; we know she and Lily rolled in on Evening#2 of the outbreak, so that makes Laurent 12.

Lou (the Head Girl) was one of the little kids whose parents never made it back. She said they've been adding orphaned/abandoned kids they've found over the years. This wasn't a feral colony; this was a structured community initially led by adults until the last one died. I really liked Lou, and I was pleasantly surprised at how NOT children-of-the-corn like this whole segment was presented.

Oh,and a throw-away line from the Mother Superior when Isabelle and Lily appeared at the convent in their very nice car, let us know that the young girl racing toward the entrance was Sylvie (later the only other nun to survive the gun battle) hoping it was her parents come to take her home.

I really liked this episode, even more than I liked the first one. As everyone else has noted, the fall of Paris flashbacks were excellent. Did it seem to anyone else that the zombies were turning much faster here than they were in the States? And moving more quickly, too? Not at World War Z (the movie) speeds or 28 Days Later speeds, but brisker than our guys. There's a reason Kirkman called them Walkers and not Trotters. The ones in the subway car were really active. And yes, shout-out to Train to Busan!

I'm enjoying the relationship between Daryl and Isabelle. It's . . . adult. I think Isabelle is a well-written, nuanced, beautifully acted character, and at least so far, the actors are playing well off each other.

[Nashville]

On 9/17/2023 at 10:56 AM, cdnalor said:

Of course the zombaby turns out to be Laurent who's, let me guess, special blood just might hold the secret of a cure.  Hmmm, seems familiar...

 

Excuse me, please, but Z Nation’s lawyers would like to have a word with you….

[OoohMaggie]

I can't believe old petrol head left this behind 😱

Edited September 19, 2023 by OoohMaggie

[seacliffsal]

Well, one thing has never changed in the Walking Dead universe-the unnecessary killing of horses and now mules.  I hate it each and every time.  I do not hold high hopes for the horse they are currently using (and who was living nicely at the castle before they took him away...).

Other than that, I am still enjoying this show.  As with the first episode, I would not have minded if they spent a second episode with the children.  But, I am happy that the colony of children survived meeting Daryl and his posse.

[iMonrey]

22 hours ago, nitrofishblue said:

I admit that so far I have enjoyed this story line. Maybe the writing has been a bit better than the "Fear" story line, I don't know.

That's a pretty low bar.

11 hours ago, maystone said:

Isabelle told Daryl that she'd been there 12 years; we know she and Lily rolled in on Evening#2 of the outbreak, so that makes Laurent 12.

So according to this timeline, we are 12 years into the ZA. But does that match up with what TWD established? I thought we were further into it than that. And this couldn't have taken place some time in the past, because Daryl is there.

[candall]

We'll never forget you, Buttons.

[Nashville]

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

So according to this timeline, we are 12 years into the ZA. But does that match up with what TWD established? I thought we were further into it than that. And this couldn't have taken place some time in the past, because Daryl is there.

So that puts this show about two years after World Beyond, correct?

[Boofish]

On 9/18/2023 at 1:23 PM, OoohMaggie said:

I could well be mistaken, but wasn't the boy part of the team who first attempted to raid the castle? Another member was seen shuffling around the moat. The American being the low life that he is, was probably keeping the boy hostage to use as blackmail with which to procure more stuff or for trade in the future, if he was a paedo, I think the kid would have shot him in the head at the first opportunity.                                                      

The children went to take back what the American in the castle stole from them. He started it if I recall correctly.

The timelines have caught up on Fear and this one. Fear was supposed to be a prequel but squashed that idea when Morgan came on the scene. Lil Mo, Judith and Laurent should all be the same age which puts them all in the same timeline. Based on Mo's birth in Fear she might be 1 or 2 years younger but not much more than that.

I loved the scene when the kid immediately latched on to Daryl. That was just so sweet to me because children do that to me sometimes and it just warms my heart. Not the part where I obviously look like their kind granny but the other part where they feel safe 😂

[OoohMaggie]

2 hours ago, Boofish said:

The children went to take back what the American in the castle stole from them. He started it if I recall correctly.

He did indeed, he stole from the local village and community.

[kevvoi]

23 hours ago, seacliffsal said:

Well, one thing has never changed in the Walking Dead universe-the unnecessary killing of horses and now mules.  I hate it each and every time.  I do not hold high hopes for the horse they are currently using (and who was living nicely at the castle before they took him away...).

Other than that, I am still enjoying this show.  As with the first episode, I would not have minded if they spent a second episode with the children.  But, I am happy that the colony of children survived meeting Daryl and his posse.

The amount of resources that would have been needed to keep horses alive as domesticated animals in the zombie apocalypse makes Daryl's actions so wasteful (as opposed to wild horses - which at least would be freer to run away). The nuns would have needed to keep the horse (and probably horses - as it would be more cost effective to have more than one) safe in as zombie-proof as possible enclosure and fed and watered when it was all many of the communities we have seen were barely capable of keeping their people fed. Isabelle and Sylvie should never have let Daryl drive the cart into a village street too tight to turn around in nor should they have let him just let the horse loose (especially with an animal smart enough to know not to go further due to the danger!)  

[BasilSeal]

Late to the party here but so far That Daryl Show is shaping up well. both this and Dead City have been a marked improvement on some of the dross that late period TWD churned out.

This is visually effective and as with DC they've remembered what people actually watch the show for, the set piece zombie action sequences like Daryl in the moat of  zombies.

So, on to the episode itself. Having had this decade's bath in the last episode, then got nearly everyone in this newly found functioning post apocalyptic community killed in time honoured TWD fashion, Daryl and the nuns on the run set off cross country with The Special Child™, who it turns out is not only annoyingly precocious but was also born after his mother had been bitten, so, maybe that's why he's special? eh? They're heading for their leader who will help the special one achieve their destiny but first must traverse the broken post apocalyptic wasteland ...

Hang on, isn't this the plot of The Last of Us?

Blatant rip off aside, another decent episode, the flash back to pre Fall Paris was particularly effective, especially the scene with the subway train, (but again this imagery is ripped off from other zombie films).

Then, at last, they finally meet a group of survivors who are pleased to see them and aren't batshit crazy. The school children  have a healthy functioning community, no dead parents locked in the basement, no weird cultist beliefs for some reason, they don't want to kill Daryl and eat him, just decent people trying their best to survive and making a decent fist of it, it's only taken 12 years to find them.

Daryl did kill another horse in the process but this is TWD, so that's kinda standard by now.

some interesting ideas that weren't fully explored like the American who'd been stuck in france since the apocalypse started and didn't know what was happening at home but over all, solid stuff.

Nun on the run's stringy haired boyfriend looks like a resourceful chap, i'm expecting him to turn up again, and i'm going out on limb here but i suspect he won't be pleased to see them.

[iMonrey]

23 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

This is visually effective and as with DC they've remembered what people actually watch the show for, the set piece zombie action sequences like Daryl in the moat of  zombies.

I would argue that only the die-hard fans who stuck it out 'til the bitter end watch the show for the set piece zombie action sequences. The millions who abandoned the show around Season 7 were watching for well written character stories. If all you want is cool zombie shit there's Z Nation or a host of other zombie stuff. 

So far this show is telling me the kind of story that got me hooked on TWD in the first place - a smaller story about a smaller group of people trying to survive in an apocalyptic world. I even liked the first three seasons of Fear before the dumb reboot.

Once TWD turned into a show about big communities and turf wars and cartoon villains, I was out. Same with Dead City - just another cartoon villain to fight. Yawn.

That's my issue with Tattoo Face here. We don't need that shit.

[tennisgurl]

Could this franchise please stop killing so many of our four legged friends please?! I'm still traumatized from that first horse eaten on the mothership. 

I really liked this second episode, its continued the atmospheric feel of the first episode, whoever the cinematographer is really deserves a raise, no matter how much they're making now. There are so many great shots, it really has this feeling of desolation that made the first few seasons of TWD so memorable. 

I really liked the flashbacks to Paris before and during the first wave of the ZA, that subway full of zombies was legitimately scary. 

I was pleasantly surprised that the kids collective wasn't a secret cult or cannibals or feral children, they were just a bunch of nice normal people trying to make it. The kids being enraptured by Mork and Mindy was adorable, as was the kid latching onto Daryl. It all felt like a calm before the storm. 

I really like Isabel, she's really interesting and she and Daryl work really well together. They have a very grown up sort of chemistry that I found lacking in a lot of TWD. Not too surprising that the messiah child is her nephew, we all knew that when we saw that her sister was pregnant.

[Iguessnot]

Two episodes in and I'm really enjoying this series. Although Daryl is the bait for this series, the show created storylines and assembled a strong cast that work well while keeping Reedus in the narrow lane he's able to function in.

[heisenberg]

SInce they announced the spinoff I have been making jokes about Daryl crossing the Atlantic ocean.  Turns out they made it in a very good way.  I can't wait to find out about the rest of that part of the story.

[millennium]

I liked decadent disco Isabelle so much better.  Anywhere they're playing Blue Monday, that's a party I want to be at.

On 9/18/2023 at 7:07 AM, Superclam said:

I did get selfish jerk, and broad American stereotype. 

He could have been plucked from any number of episodes of TWD.   The look on Daryl's face said, "I've met you a hundred times before."

On 9/18/2023 at 8:39 AM, nodorothyparker said:

But never with literal castle and moat. That alone was almost worth all the drama over deciding to shoot and set this series in France of all places.

Totally agree.   France is the star of this show.

On 9/18/2023 at 8:39 AM, nodorothyparker said:

Mork and Mindy!

If just for a second you imagine it through Daryl's eyes, all the shit he's seen and lived through, all the horror and tragedy ... and then, suddenly, there's Robin Williams.  IMO, nothing the TWD universe has ever done before has so powerfully evoked the world that was lost more than that clip of Mork and Mindy.

On 9/18/2023 at 10:14 AM, OoohMaggie said:

They could have done so much better with the attack on Schloss Adler, Daryl's no Burton or Eastwood.

Where Eagles Dare!

On 9/18/2023 at 8:39 AM, nodorothyparker said:

As soon as they introduced the pregnant sister, you could see where that was going from a million miles away.

It didn't occur to me.   I was too busy dreading that the baby would die inside her, then eat its way out. 

 

[OoohMaggie]

On 9/27/2023 at 7:22 AM, millennium said:

Where Eagles Dare!

That dining hall scene is still one of the best in cinematic history 😁

Edited September 28, 2023 by OoohMaggie

[For Cereals]

I still hate the “chosen child” trope but I may need to adjust my stance on children in the ZA/AA. Maybe only non-American children are allowed to be seen and heard.  I liked these self-sufficient children and mostly liked the English children in Invasion (still not enough to keep me watching that mess of a show).  I am enjoying this spinoff.  I still haven’t finished NY.  I may just read the threads for anything pertinent.  I could only watch World Beyond on ffwd.

[dely]

On 9/20/2023 at 11:51 AM, BasilSeal said:

This is visually effective and as with DC they've remembered what people actually watch the show for, the set piece zombie action sequences like Daryl in the moat of  zombies

I respectfully disagree with this.  I watch for the world building and how the series tries to answer the questions of how far would you go/what would you do to survive and to protect your loved ones.

There isn't nearly enough time spent working on either of those answers for my liking but it's enough to keep me coming back.

The excessive gore, violence, dead animals (RIP Shiva) and cartoon - lather, rinse, repeat - villains are why, IMO, the good gawdess invented fast forward! 

[BasilSeal]

On 10/20/2023 at 3:11 AM, dely said:

I respectfully disagree with this.  I watch for the world building and how the series tries to answer the questions of how far would you go/what would you do to survive and to protect your loved ones.

There isn't nearly enough time spent working on either of those answers for my liking but it's enough to keep me coming back.

The excessive gore, violence, dead animals (RIP Shiva) and cartoon - lather, rinse, repeat - villains are why, IMO, the good gawdess invented fast forward! 

TBF i prefer the world building aspects myself, the problem is, and i think the rest of  your post bears this out, is that TWD in the past haven't been very good at the world building stuff.

They weren't very good at making their villains motivations make sense, invariably TWD villains are bad guys who do bad things because they're bad. characterisations are often vague, and individual characters often behave in ways that contradict  their earlier actions, just to drive the plot

The world building aspects don't always make sense and are vague on detail but invariably none of this matters because all of it gets destroyed due to reasons and bad choices and it's back to square one for more rinse an repeat misery porn.

I think the standard of writing for TWD over the years has been mixed and this is in part down to the origins as a comic book. Kirkman's main theme was how the characters reacted to the impossibly grim situations and choices presented to them by the apocalypse, everything else is just secondary. now that may be ok for a comic book but in the TV series, especially as the show runners expand the universe to a long running franchise, you need a bit more than just this, and the writing has always struggled to achieve this.

In the early seasons of Fear i think they made a better shot of having more coherent narratives and themes, but after season 3/4 they bottle it and reboot as a show that is more cartoonish like the main show, Fear has gone downhill since, rapidly, the final season is dire.

My point was that what they've always been good at, even when the other stuff has been wanting, is the visual rendering of the apocalypse and the set piece zombie action. Daryl twatting zombies with a mace in the castle moat o r wrestling with super walkers in the arena is what they've always done best. 

I do think though that they've  upped their game a bit with the other aspects of story telling in both this series and Dead City. there's a very good supporting ensemble cast in this show and all the main characters are both believable, interesting and consistent.

Watching TWD for the world building has been something of a triumph o hope over experience over the years, i do think though that our patience may finally be about to pay off.