S01.E04: Kokomo

[AimingforYoko]

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Raylan tangles with the Albanian mob; Mansell forms a new alliance; Carolyn lets her guard down.

OK, this felt a little more like the old show. That scene after the shootout with the Albanians and Mansell comes strolling by? Felt some nostalgia, right there.

Terry Kinney as Toma. A classic H!ITG.

[Clawdette]

Terry Kinney as an Albanian chief.  Who'd have thunk it?

Raylan is the smoothest lawman ever.  And, I agree that the episode was stronger without the distraction of Willa.

 

[thuganomics85]

The more Raylan spends time with Norbert/the "rogue" cop who is always bulldozing his way through things, the more you know that he is missing the likes of Rachel and Tim.  As do I, Raylan!  As do I!

Willa's absence was noticeable in a good way, in that it did feel like more was focused on the case and all of the players that are involved.  Toma and the Albanians should hopefully be another good obstacle that will keep everyone on their toes.  I like the idea that Raylan had a chance to maybe get Mansell or let nature take its course, but he obviously was not going to let Sandy's roommate get brutally tortured and stepped in (or to be more accurate, kick down the door.)

Every scene and decision made by Sweetie just makes me shake my head.  He is probably already doomed himself by continuing to go with Mansell's scheme (even if he claims he will totally fuck him over at some point.)  He really is letting greed get the better of him and I don't see a happy ending for him.  Carolyn is treading dangerous water as well, but she strikes me as someone who will skate by: especially since Raylan clearly seems fond of her.

Looking forward to finding out more about who is in Judge Keith David's special book!

[tearsandhysteria]

This was the best episode by far. I feel like the show is picking up steam. Mansell really needs the extra cash to buy some boxers and a  new wardrobe. Seems like he should have been more worried about Sandie's closet since  he stays in her kimono. 

I loved the action tonight. I felt so bad for the roomie. I was happy one guy got taken out. They knew she couldn't have gotten Sandie there any faster and just tortured her out of boredom. 

I didn't understand why Mansell was willing to wound but not kill the man in the first place. If he was going to blow his cover and not get the money, he'd have been better off killing him  rather than knowing they would find out who he was eventually. He knew he wasn't ready to leave town yet. And we know he doesn't mind killing people so I found that hard to swallow. 

[Blakeston]

So Carolyn knows that the Albanians were following her car, and that they were willing to pry Sandy's roommate's teeth out, but she still argued against having a cop car stationed in front of her home that night?

She really doesn't seem to grasp how lucky she is.

[Raja]

4 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Looking forward to finding out more about who is in Judge Keith David's special book!

A classic McGuffin, I doubt if we ever see since the judge's victims are not the case and nobody's searching for it. A last second reprieve for one of the crooks at the end because a lawman sees the book  is possibly in store

[aghst]

4 hours ago, Blakeston said:

So Carolyn knows that the Albanians were following her car, and that they were willing to pry Sandy's roommate's teeth out, but she still argued against having a cop car stationed in front of her home that night?

She really doesn't seem to grasp how lucky she is.

She's not the only one.

Mansell keeps doing stupid things and is lucky he isn't dead yet from the Albanians or the cops simply put him away for life.

He leaves it to Stoner Sandy to get rid of the murder weapon and Sweety gets greedy -- Greedy Sweety -- and doesn't turn the murder weapon over to the cops.

Hina gets the Albanian killed and probably kept Mansell from walking into an ambush.

And Mansell the dumb ass was making a scene at the restaurant, with the Albanians and the cops after him, he keeps making waves.

And now they think they can go around blackmailing people in the black book and just collect the cash.

Tell me Elmore Leonard didn't concoct such a dumb villain.

 

[Raja]

2 hours ago, aghst said:

She's not the only one.

Mansell keeps doing stupid things and is lucky he isn't dead yet from the Albanians or the cops simply put him away for life.

He leaves it to Stoner Sandy to get rid of the murder weapon and Sweety gets greedy -- Greedy Sweety -- and doesn't turn the murder weapon over to the cops.

Hina gets the Albanian killed and probably kept Mansell from walking into an ambush.

And Mansell the dumb ass was making a scene at the restaurant, with the Albanians and the cops after him, he keeps making waves.

And now they think they can go around blackmailing people in the black book and just collect the cash.

Tell me Elmore Leonard didn't concoct such a dumb villain.

 

Almost all Leonard villains, western or crime drama are dumb. Until they're caught or killed they get over by being more willing to do violence Until a Raylan Givens type hero also willing to do violence for good stops them

[Crashcourse]

I thought this was the best episode thus far.

Mansell prancing around like a peacock in those tighty whities. 😅 Did he have the front stuffed with cash?  I doubt that was his real junk. 

Carolyn is beginning to annoy me with her "tough gal" vibe.  She'd better be glad that Raylan's around to protect her. 

Poor Sandy's roommate.  I wonder how many teeth she lost.  She was feisty, I'll give her that.

[tv-talk]

Great ep that really felt like the Justifed of yore. Raylan was Raylan in this one, loved when he talked to the Albanian boss and the Albanian's who were tailing the lawyer. Pure Raylan right there, have missed it.

So they have nothing on Mansell? Were just hoping that he'd get into shootout with the Albanians and either be killed or break some laws so they could bring him in? When Mansell and Sandy drove by there's no reason to let them cruise by unless you have nothing.

Black and blue steak is a crime, though I guess it's popular in that part of the country.

[paigow]

7 hours ago, tv-talk said:

Black and blue steak is a crime,

Like Man Two 8.5 - 25

Well Done is Murder One

[paigow]

13 hours ago, Raja said:

Almost all Leonard villains, western or crime drama are dumb. 

If Boyd, Mags, Wynn Duffy And Limehouse were mashed up together - the result would be a Lex Luthor level antagonist... The assorted minions would remain an area of weakness....

23 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

The more Raylan spends time with Norbert/the "rogue" cop who is always bulldozing his way through things, the more you know that he is missing the likes of Rachel and Tim.

How many shots were fired? Tim would require 2 rounds max..

[Raja]

3 hours ago, paigow said:

If Boyd, Mags, Wynn Duffy And Limehouse were mashed up together - the result would be a Lex Luthor level antagonist... The assorted minions would remain an area of weakness....

Of course the question would be that besides Boyd Crowder, who was introduced killing one of his own minions who was loyal to the racist cause, and was killed off before someone said we have chemistry here let him survive Raylan's point blank shot to the chest. Were the others Leonard characters or TV characters in a Leonard inspired story?

That Leonard did a lot of adapting his own stories for the screen does muddy the memories.

[monakane]

9 hours ago, paigow said:

If Boyd, Mags, Wynn Duffy And Limehouse were mashed up together - the result would be a Lex Luthor level antagonist... The assorted minions would remain an area of weakness...

I hope we get a cameo of Boyd.  Last scene of Justified was Raylan and Boyd talking in jail.  I hope Raylan pays him a visit. Mags stole the show for me.  Margo Martindale won an Emmy for that performance and deserved it.  Whenever I see her in anything else, I always think of Mags.

[isalicat]

12 hours ago, monakane said:

I hope we get a cameo of Boyd.  Last scene of Justified was Raylan and Boyd talking in jail.  I hope Raylan pays him a visit. Mags stole the show for me.  Margo Martindale won an Emmy for that performance and deserved it.  Whenever I see her in anything else, I always think of Mags.

Yes and no, on Margo Martindale. If you watched The Americans its hard to see Mags in her character there - a totally different person, which is one example of how great an actor she is. So we agree on her brilliance, in any case.

This newest ep (Kokomo) was highly entertaining albeit brutal. Having grown up in Las Vegas, this whole scene of competing professional criminal factions is just so wonderfully real - most are pretty much not fit for much else, despite appearances, in my experience (yes, that includes people like Sandy). One just hopes they don't breed.

[Tachi Rocinante]

Good episode - no Willa!

Someone in the costume department doesn't like Ms. Ellis much.  Her work outfits are not flattering at all.

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Almost all Leonard villains, western or crime drama are dumb. Until they're caught or killed they get over by being more willing to do violence Until a Raylan Givens type hero also willing to do violence for good stops them.

And this is just one of the reasons why (to me) Leonard is overrated as an author.  He doesn't always understand the concept of nuance across his characters.

The original series was successful in spite of the source material.

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 Tim would require 2 rounds max..

Just one.

[paigow]

Double Tap to the chest..

 

[pasdetrois]

On 8/2/2023 at 3:02 PM, Crashcourse said:

Mansell prancing around like a peacock in those tighty whities. 😅 Did he have the front stuffed with cash?  I doubt that was his real junk. 

That was the 3rd time they had the actor carefully draped in an open robe and artfully placed to show the goods. It looks like someone took a dump in his drawers. Very bizarre and crass to frame him this way.

His performance is a bit too snarly cartoonish for me.

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Carolyn is beginning to annoy me with her "tough gal" vibe.

I do like the actress in the role.

I've only seen Adelaide Clemens in fresh-faced, innocent roles (Rectify and Under the Banner of Heaven). Sandy takes some getting used to.

Edited August 4, 2023 by pasdetrois

[Crashcourse]

1 minute ago, pasdetrois said:

That was the 3rd time they had the actor carefully draped in an open robe and artfully placed to show the goods. It looks like someone took a dump in his drawers. Very bizarre and crass to frame him this way.

I hadn't been paying attention before because I drifted off to sleep sometimes in previous episodes, so I didn't know he'd done it before. I agree, it is bizarre and crass.

[tennisgurl]

I didn't hate Willa or anything, but not having her around seems like its going to be a very good thing, it feels like now we're really cooking. This actually feels like Justified again, even in a different setting with mostly new characters. Everything with the Albanian's felt like such classic Justified, they always did such a great job at making even minor characters so memorable. 

It has to be weird for Raylan to be stuck as the slightly more responsible cop next to the Detroit rogue cop, he's definately miss Rachel and Tim. He needs a real adult to reign him in! I like the many dynamics here with the Albanians, the cops, Mansell, and Carolyn and Sweets, Raylan is looking to bring Mansell in but is also sort of "if karma in the form of a big ass Albanian man happens to find him" except other people are going to end up being collateral damage. 

Mansell is a fun bad guy but he's such a smug bastard I cant wait for him to get his, whether its Albanians or the cops. He thinks he's running circles around everyone but really he's just dumb and lucky. 

Carolyn is also being rather dumb but lucky, she should take any protection she can knowing there are murderous gangsters who just tortured an innocent woman after her. Maybe the cops or the gangsters should think about hiring Sandy's roommate, she was a real badass, she did not give a fuck. Even after losing a few teeth she was still spitting mad. 

[Tachi Rocinante]

Also, was it just me, or were there cameras and microphone stands plainly visible on the wide shot of the parking garage confession?

[KittyQ]

On 8/2/2023 at 2:00 AM, tearsandhysteria said:

I loved the action tonight. I felt so bad for the roomie. I was happy one guy got taken out. They knew she couldn't have gotten Sandie there any faster and just tortured her out of boredom. 

I agree - I kept saying to myself (and my husband) - what good will torturing the roomie do? Sandie obviously isn't concerned enough to get there sooner. I guess boredom was the answer. 

[paigow]

On 8/2/2023 at 3:50 PM, tv-talk said:

loved when he talked to the Albanian boss and the Albanian's who were tailing the lawyer.

Liam Neeson killed EVERY Albanian gangster....  Local PD is going to start quoting Taken soon...

[Blakeston]

I think the Albanian felt like it would be "weak" to not follow through on his word. He said he would pull teeth if Sandy didn't arrive in 20 minutes, and he wasn't going to back down.

[monakane]

On 8/4/2023 at 1:49 AM, isalicat said:

Yes and no, on Margo Martindale. If you watched The Americans its hard to see Mags in her character there - a totally different person, which is one example of how great an actor she is. So we agree on her brilliance, in any case.

I have not seen The Americans.  I hear that it's excellent and since our girl Margo is in it, I'll be sure to watch.

[isalicat]

7 hours ago, monakane said:

I have not seen The Americans.  I hear that it's excellent and since our girl Margo is in it, I'll be sure to watch.

I would strongly suggest starting from the beginning (in terms of watching The Americans) but Margo is not in the first season, just so you know. Nonetheless, other than Justified, The Wire, Firefly, Andor, Inspector Morse, and a very few other TV shows, The Americans is an extraordinary achievement and actually has a beginning and an ending, which is rare.

[tearsandhysteria]

On 8/4/2023 at 9:23 AM, Tachi Rocinante said:

 

Just one.

"I don't miss."

Edited August 8, 2023 by tearsandhysteria

[bigmag]

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Monday at 07:32 PM

  On 8/7/2023 at 11:44 AM, monakane said:

I have not seen The Americans.  I hear that it's excellent and since our girl Margo is in it, I'll be sure to watch.

I would strongly suggest starting from the beginning (in terms of watching The Americans) but Margo is not in the first season, just so you know. Nonetheless, other than Justified, The Wire, Firefly, Andor, Inspector Morse, and a very few other TV shows, The Americans is an extraordinary achievement and actually has a beginning and an ending, which is rare.

 The Americans is my VERY FAVORITE series of all time, followed by Justified and then Patriot. The Americans is exceptional quality story telling, hitting all the emotions possible over the entire series. Cannot recommend it highly enough.

[peeayebee]

I watched Patriot a couple of months ago, and LOVED IT! I keep thinking I need to do a rewatch.

[bigmag]

22 hours ago, peeayebee said:

I watched Patriot a couple of months ago, and LOVED IT! I keep thinking I need to do a rewatch.

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Good idea!  Now anytime anyone asks me how I'm doing I just nod my head slowly for a few seconds and then say "Pretty good" in a low voice with a hangdog expression. Loved that poor guy!

 

[Jordan61]

On 8/8/2023 at 3:53 AM, tearsandhysteria said:

"I don't miss."

He did miss Boyd when he was running away from Grubes's cabin. (I just binge watched all of Justified before watching this).

[Sweet-tea]

On 8/2/2023 at 2:02 PM, Crashcourse said:

I thought this was the best episode thus far.

Mansell prancing around like a peacock in those tighty whities. 😅 Did he have the front stuffed with cash?  I doubt that was his real junk. 

Carolyn is beginning to annoy me with her "tough gal" vibe.  She'd better be glad that Raylan's around to protect her. 

Poor Sandy's roommate.  I wonder how many teeth she lost.  She was feisty, I'll give her that.

Why is the guy always in his underwear? It skeeves me out. And I wondered the same thing--it looked like he had stuffed his shorts. 

I see  little chemistry between Raylan and Carolyn. Seems forced. 

On 8/9/2023 at 2:02 PM, bigmag said:

 The Americans is my VERY FAVORITE series of all time, followed by Justified and then Patriot. The Americans is exceptional quality story telling, hitting all the emotions possible over the entire series. Cannot recommend it highly enough.

I loved it! I've watched the whole thing twice. Haven't heard of Patriot. Will need to check it out. 

Edited August 19, 2023 by Sweet-tea

[chediavolo]

Why are they trying to romantically involve Raylan and Caroline? There is zero chemistry between them. She is not too street smart, she looks 20 years older than him . And between the wardrobe that accentuates her belly & the horrible wig, not attractive. And again.. no chemistry.  

[wmdekooning]

On 8/2/2023 at 11:27 AM, aghst said:

And Mansell the dumb ass was making a scene at the restaurant, with the Albanians and the cops after him, he keeps making waves.

And now they think they can go around blackmailing people in the black book and just collect the cash.

Tell me Elmore Leonard didn't concoct such a dumb villain.

Re: Elmore Leonard. I'm reasonably sure he didn't, this series may be based on "A Story by Elmore Leonard."

Re: Mansell. I'm getting tired of him as I am the actor Boyd Holbrook Boyd Holbrooking.

I believe this episode is either more Raylan-centric or Raylan is starting to find his groove in Detroit. The Willa thing kinda made me sad even with her surly teenager-ness. Obviously, Raylan still isn't able to do anything else except wait for the call and then go immediately when the call comes to the expense of everything and everyone else...

[Anela]

Why is this guy always in his underwear? 
I see chemistry between them, especially in that last scene.  This was the best episode, so far.  I might put off the rest until later.  I’m just glad I managed four episodes.  It relaxed me.  
I hope someone helps that poor girl to get her teeth fixed.