All Episodes Discussion

[iMonrey]

Quote

What does it matter if her DNA was not on the wood chips. Only the two of them had access to the washing machine and he's dead! 

Yeah I think that sort of cinched it for me. I can see the jury needing more but from what Dateline was able to show that the jury didn't see, taken all together it was pretty damning against her.

[AZChristian]

Can someone refresh my memory?

Was she tried just for murder?  Was there a charge of conspiracy to commit murder, too?

If she hasn't been tried for conspiracy, they could always hit her with that if they gather a bit more evidence.

And I agree with those who thought it was strange that the cops did a welfare check and didn't find a living person in the house.  Might she have been hiding from them?  

[howiveaddict]

In this day and age, jurors put most credence in DNA evidence.  Her DNA might not have been on the wood chips because she wore gloves.  I also found it odd that the police missed the wife in the house. She must not have been home earlier. At most, she would have come down when she heard people in her house. Also, wouldn't her daughter look for her?  It seems the police must not have checked the yard at all. You would think, with a missing person, they would make sure he wasn't laying in the yard, dead of a heart attack.   Very strange case.

[TVbitch]

@howiveaddict, the show specifically said that the mom HAD been home and locked in her room when the police were there for the welfare check. 

[Mondrianyone]

The police work, at least in the initial welfare check, was clearly pretty slipshod.  If they'd checked every room in the house, they would've found her.  I can't believe that wasn't a line of questioning by Josh.

[Lizzing]

On 4/18/2020 at 8:20 PM, TVbitch said:

Who loves a house to the point they are willing to stay in it with a spouse they hate so much they are constantly having to call the police and must sleep in a locked room?

Clearly this couple watched The War of the Roses and took it as a primer on how to handle a divorce, and not a cautionary tale. 😁  The show explained that the son ran around with a GoPro when around his mother because he wanted to keep a record of her insanity, but I wondered if that was also why the "you're stupid" conversation with the neighbor was recorded on a cell phone, the one neighbor kept the damaging voice mail, and the other neighbors had doorbell cameras.  Plenty of people have Rings and the like to prevent theft, sure, but in all those "Fear Thy Neighbor" episodes on ID, the cops never can do anything unless they have video evidence of one neighbor harassing another.  Were the other neighbors suspicious of the wife and/or the family that had the cops called so often and decided documentation was good precaution?

But yeah, it seemed like the prosecutor rushed the case.  Were there no wire taps and other investigations into communication between the wife & the contractor?  That wasn't mentioned (though I do know Dateline leaves out salient details frequently).

 

 

[hookedontv]

OK, at least I wasn't the only one who watched this episode (I think it was called "The House"?) and thought to myself "What did I just watch? I need more answers, I would have asked so many more questions." That family was so strange I don't even know where to start. Why didn't the daughter tell the cops during the welfare check that her mom lived there too? Why didn't they check to make sure she was OK? I guess it wasn't her responsiblity to help with the poor dogs, they said there was pee and poop all over as if they hadn't been let out at all.

Was the dad's car home? Was the mom's car there? 

The mom was so strange during the questioning in the kitchen. If someone told me a dead man's body was in my yard, I would immediately ask if it was my son, my ex-husband, what have you. She was just sitting there all bewildered.

And I found myself sitting on my couch all bewildered, wondering if finally, quarantine brain finally kicked in as I couldn't understand what was going on. 

[Pie Girl]

Could the grandparents of JJ and/or Tylee assert “grandparents visitation rights” which would legally require Lori to reveal the whereabouts of the kids?  If she refused, at least there would be another reason for keeping her ass in jail on additional charges and an even higher bond. 

[Tabbygirl521]

8 hours ago, Pie Girl said:

Could the grandparents of JJ and/or Tylee assert “grandparents visitation rights” which would legally require Lori to reveal the whereabouts of the kids?  If she refused, at least there would be another reason for keeping her ass in jail on additional charges and an even higher bond. 

I think they tried something like that - am trying to recall. I don’t know how much grandparents have in the way of rights, unfortunately. This is a horrible case and no one seems to have any leverage to get this piece of crap to comply. 

[iMonrey]

"Before Daylight." Wow, what a sordid case. I'm fairly convinced that the cop is guilty of murdering Jesse. I think there are other suspects but the evidence against Steven Rios is compelling. What really sold it for me was the arm hairs found around Jesse's neck area. That's pretty damning, and I don't buy the defense's arguments that they might have been left over on the bedding from a week earlier. 

I think the Rabbi's son is suspicious too but there's really nothing to link him to the crime, and I think a witness saying they saw someone crying nearby is a red herring. It's a college campus, there are emotional kids all over the place. 

I guess I feel kind of sorry for Steven Rios if he isn't guilty, but . . . I think he is. I feel sorrier for his ex-wife. 

[saber5055]

49 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

"Before Daylight." Wow, what a sordid case. I'm fairly convinced that the cop is guilty of murdering Jesse.

Same here. Since the cop was having sex with Jessie during his work/patrol time, did anyone think he might have killed Jessie earlier in the night, then went to the station to have beers on the roof (!) with the other cops? Even his wife said "Late night?" when he got home at 5:30 a.m. His car must have been a common sight in the neighborhood. I wonder if he went to Jessie's in a marked cop car or unmarked. I'm guessing unmarked. Anyway, I didn't hear anyone on this episode suggest that alternate timeline.

For the cop to threaten suicide first with a shotgun, then by jumping off of a building ... not exactly a stable personality for a cop. That's what got me, although maybe police in Columbia don't handle anything more pressing than speeders or drunk college kids. I wonder what the cop cleaned up while he was "guarding" the crime scene.

I was surprised Jessie didn't share the cop's name with his online friend or anyone else. I'm guessing he suspected the cop of being married well before he started talking about turning him in. While Columbia is a liberal college town, it's smack in the middle of a hard-core red-neck Republican state. Another reason for the cop to hide his secret life.

[Annber03]

I'd heard this story on another show once, but there were a few things about it that were new to me here-like Stephen guarding the crime scene. I don't remember that being mentioned in the other episode that covered this case. That's certainly...interesting. Whether he's innocent or guilty, as noted in the episode, he shouldn't have been there (though, of course, if he'd tried to explain that to his colleagues, that would've likely required him having to tell his fellow officers about his relationship with the kid, so... Might've been a better option than the way the other officers did find out about the relationship, though). 

2 hours ago, saber5055 said:

While Columbia is a liberal college town, it's smack in the middle of a hard-core red-neck Republican state. Another reason for the cop to hide his secret life.

They made mention of that aspect of things in the other episode about this case ,too. Notably how Jesse stood out with his more liberal opinions on the political climate of that time, and the administration that was in charge then and whatnot. But yes, it's also very easy to see why Stephen needed to keep this relationship a secret, too. 

2 hours ago, saber5055 said:

For the cop to threaten suicide first with a shotgun, then by jumping off of a building ... not exactly a stable personality for a cop. That's what got me,

Agreed. On the one hand, I can definitely see his suicide attempt being the desperate act of a man who's terrified about the fact that his secret is now out, and he's under suspicion for his lover's murder, and all he's worked so hard for in regards to his career and his family is surely over one way or another. All that guilt/shame/judgment he's wrestling with is crashing down on him, and he sees no other way out. 

But on the other hand, the whole thing with the rooftop was so dramatic, to where it almost kind of seemed like he was trying to angle for some kind of insanity/mentally ill defense (it didn't seem like he needed much convincing to come down, after all). I dunno, I just feel like if he really was that suicidal, he would've just taken his gun and shot himself right then and there, or would've just gone straight to the top of any building and jumped off, or something. Waving around a gun and then going to a rooftop to threaten to jump, it just all seemed a little over the top. 

As for the fact that he had no evidence of the murder anywhere on him, I guess my argument would be that he is a cop. He would be aware of all the necessary steps a criminal takes to cover their tracks. 

All of that being said, the other suspects mentioned here were new to me, too, and I think they gave some valid reasons to wonder about them, too. Especially the rabbi's son. After all, as we've seen numerous times on this show, just because people say they saw somebody somewhere, that doesn't mean that's true or accurate. 

Yeah. It's a strange, sad story the whole way around. I feel bad for Jesse's mom and Stephen's family. 

[Ohmo]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

"Before Daylight." Wow, what a sordid case. I'm fairly convinced that the cop is guilty of murdering Jesse. I think there are other suspects but the evidence against Steven Rios is compelling. What really sold it for me was the arm hairs found around Jesse's neck area. That's pretty damning, and I don't buy the defense's arguments that they might have been left over on the bedding from a week earlier. 

I think the Rabbi's son is suspicious too but there's really nothing to link him to the crime, and I think a witness saying they saw someone crying nearby is a red herring. It's a college campus, there are emotional kids all over the place. 

I guess I feel kind of sorry for Steven Rios if he isn't guilty, but . . . I think he is. I feel sorrier for his ex-wife. 

I'll admit, the chef and the rabbi's son make me think, but the bruising on Jesse's back fits with the chokehold, and so does the arm hair. Even if the cops didn't test the chef's knives, he still left them in plain sight in his bedroom, and he offered up that detail, along with the fact that he had sex with Jesse.  Stephen was caught lying about his behavior.

Jesse's premonition about living a short life sent chills down my spine.  To know that at 7 AND verbalize it to your mother...wow.

[Ohmo]

Another thing that makes me believe it's Stephen.  The episode repeatedly mentioned that Stephen didn't own that specific type of knife.  It seemed like the episode was specific with that phrasing.  However, Stephen didn't have to OWN that knife.  He was a cop. He could get hold of that type of knife, whether he owned the knife or not.

That knife is very different from a kitchen knife. As for the rabbi's son crying. He probably was if Jesse had just broken up with him.

[Ohmo]

OMG...his poor mother.  From a Dateline producer in the Dateline twitter feed.  To think he had been spared his premonition, but then he was murdered years later...

Jesse was 16, he almost died in a horrible car accident. was in a coma for several days. But miraculously he survived. His mother thought that was his brush with death. She told us it made the news of his murder even more devastating than she could have ever imagined.

Twitter

Edited April 25, 2020 by Ohmo

[Annber03]

Oh, damn :(. 

[saber5055]

1 hour ago, Ohmo said:

Stephen didn't have to OWN that knife.  He was a cop. He could get hold of that type of knife, whether he owned the knife or not.

Oh yeah, good point that wasn't mentioned on the show.

[TVbitch]

What the fuck was with those moments when the interview subject is sitting in the dark, then one light comes on, then another, then a third to light some little scene. OMG, those were so cheesy! If I was giving an interview about my dead loved one, I would have refused to do that nonsense. 

[Annber03]

3 minutes ago, TVbitch said:

What the fuck was with those moments when the interview subject is sitting in the dark, then one light comes on, then another, then a third to light some little scene. OMG, those were so cheesy! If I was giving an interview about my dead loved one, I would have refused to do that nonsense. 

I was wondering about those scenes, too! Just seemed a weirdly dramatic touch. 

[saber5055]

37 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I was wondering about those scenes, too! Just seemed a weirdly dramatic touch. 

I was wondering about those too. They were real WTF moments.

[howiveaddict]

I think it was the crime writer or the defense attorney that said that the witness didn't recognize the rabbi's son by his picture, because it was his high school year book picture.  He changed a lot since then.  Wasn't he fairly young? I doubt he changed that much.  

I think Stephen did it also.  We had a case years ago, where I live, where a married cop killed his girl friend, then set the house on fire.  Part of why he was caught was a camera on a nearby bank.  Wonder if there were any CC cameras around where Jessie's body was taken?  It seems like that is a standard way to catch criminals in the British dramas I watch.

[thejuicer]

I think the crime writer had a crush on Stephen. 

There was just so much compelling evidence against Stephen. The hairs, the DNA under his fingernails, the damning affair and motive. Sometimes it was brought up Stephen had no other marks on him or how could he do it without a murder weapon, etc. He is a cop with training and he was at the scene of the crime!! This is not normal circumstances. 

I tried to keep an open mind but I really didn't think Zev had anything to do with it. "Someone saw a young man crying by the crime scene" is not evidence.

[biakbiak]

1 hour ago, howiveaddict said:

picture, because it was his high school year book picture.  He changed a lot since then.  Wasn't he fairly young? I doubt he changed that much.  

Yeah he was 19.

[Court]

Like y'all, I'm convinced Steven did it. The arm hairs and the choke hold seal it for me. The lack of evidence also does because a cop will certainly know how to cover his tracks. 

 

I agree, he could have murdered him earlier in his shift and then went back to the station for his alibi. 

[Lizzing]

I'm in the camp that Rios did it.  If he choked Jesse out, like the police instructor demonstrated, he could have slit his throat without much blood on him (Rios).  As for other suspects, chefs often use non-serrated blades and Rabbi's sons don't know how to get away clean from a murder scene without any DNA.  

And, because snark is king in these parts, someone should investigate Jesse's friend for murdering Ave Maria.  My dogs howling at the moon are more on key.

[Irlandesa]

Sometimes we crave complicated answers and I think that's what the defense was hoping for when they tried to focus on the other "suspects". 

I don't think there was any evidence that the rabbi's son was gay or that he had a sexual relationship with Jesse, right?  The defense's strategy was trying to repurpose Stephen's story (backed by a lot of evidence) which was being used as a motive and make it the rabbi's son's motive without much evidence of that dynamic.  Same with the chef.  He had a relationship with Jesse and everyone knows the prevalence of intimate partner violence--once again Stephen's motive applied to someone else. 

They were trying to make suspicion happen where the only one to truly act suspiciously and obviously dishonestly was Stephen.

The physical evidence and motive was the clearest and most straight forward with Rios. 

[MsJamieDornan]

4 hours ago, thejuicer said:

I think the crime writer had a crush on Stephen. 

Nothing she mentioned would have changed anyone's mind. 

[Ohmo]

11 hours ago, howiveaddict said:

Wonder if there were any CC cameras around where Jessie's body was taken?  It seems like that is a standard way to catch criminals in the British dramas I watch.

It was 2004. I don't think cameras were as prevalent then as they are now.

7 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

The physical evidence and motive was the clearest and most straight forward with Rios. 

The comment from the first jury did have merit.  One of the jurors said something like, "If it wasn't Stephen, who else could it be?" I think this case was at that point.  Not every criminal case is going to have a confession or evidence that flashes as obvious as a neon sign. Jurors do have to think and put information together.  They have to make inferences, and the reality is that those point to Stephen, not Ed (the chef) or Lev (the rabbi's son).

The defense also made a big deal about the sheets, but it also pointed out that Jesse and Stephen were intimate. Even allowing for the idea that cleanliness often varies between men and women, certain things probably happened in that bed (and I'm not talking about hair.)  I have a difficult time buying that Jesse would not have washed the sheets.  It is much more likely to me that Jesse pulled the hairs out of Stephen's arm during a struggle.

[iMonrey]

20 hours ago, Ohmo said:

Jesse's premonition about living a short life sent chills down my spine.  To know that at 7 AND verbalize it to your mother...wow.

This isn't the first time a murder victim has told friends and/or family they prophesied an early demise for themselves either. Eerie how some people seem to know that.

Quote

 agree, he could have murdered him earlier in his shift and then went back to the station for his alibi. 

I don't even think Rios's defense attorney (in his 2nd trial) believed he was innocent. One of his arguments was "Why would he have gone to visit Jesse so late when he usually visited him much earlier?" Ummmm . . . to kill him? 

[JudyObscure]

Jesse certainly was a cutie and I can believe his friend's description that he was bright in every sense of the word, so I wish I could ask him, "Why on earth would you tell a man that you intend to ruin his whole life by telling first his wife and then his boss all sort of things that will ruin both his marriage and his career?" 

I wonder if Jesse's online friend or his mother warned him not to do that?  I think Stephen did it and nothing excuses his actions, but why did Jesse think he needed to out Stephen like that?  If Jesse was trying to shame Stephen from sort of holier than thou moral ground he might have checked his own life style where lovers literally met each other coming and going. 

 So sad.  I really liked his Kentucky mom.

[saber5055]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

I think Stephen did it and nothing excuses his actions, but why did Jesse think he needed to out Stephen like that?

We were told Jessie repeatedly asked Stephen about his life but Stephen wouldn't tell him anything, he only wanted to talk about Jessie and Jessie's life. After a while, in a relationship, while at first it's flattering, it gets suspicious. Jessie might have wanted a more permanent relationship with Stephen ... "Why can't we go to dinner together, go to the movies together, why don't you stay over for the weekend Stephen."

We've had discussions here about lying by omission (if you don't tell someone something, is it a lie?), so for Stephen to not tell Jessie he was married (to a woman) and had a child, that's being dishonest in a relationship. Jessie might have felt hurt and betrayed. What couple breaking up after being lovers doesn't think of saying and/or doing something hurtful to the person he/she once loved.

Whether Jessie would have actually done anything or said anything to anyone about Stephen being married, we will never know.

My question: Where Jessie's body was found, was that by/outside his apartment or someplace else? At the beginning of the episode, it was mentioned the major blood was somewhere else besides under Jessie's body.

ETA: It's interesting that Jessie never revealed Stephen's name to anyone, even to his mother or online friend. Maybe if Stephen knew that, Jessie would still be alive.

Edited April 26, 2020 by saber5055

[MsJamieDornan]

4 hours ago, saber5055 said:

My question: Where Jessie's body was found, was that by/outside his apartment or someplace else? At the beginning of the episode, it was mentioned the major blood was somewhere else besides under Jessie's body.

I think they said 200 feet or maybe 200 yards from his apartment??

[Blissfool]

9 hours ago, Ohmo said:

 I have a difficult time buying that Jesse would not have washed the sheets.  

I'm not. He was a young college guy. 

6 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Why on earth would you tell a man that you intend to ruin his whole life by telling first his wife and then his boss all sort of things that will ruin both his marriage and his career?" 

I think Jesse was kinda of a jerk.

- Threatening to out people and calling it a joke. This is really serious and could cause emotional distress, suicidal thoughts, or in this case, murder.

- being too detailed with his sex conversations with his mom. I bet he got a kick outta shocking her.

- talking back to the officers when he was arrested. 

Edited April 27, 2020 by Blissfool

[Dr.OO7]

"12 Minutes On Elm Street" reminds me of an AITA thread with the answer to the question being ESH.

The kids families deifying them was infuriating--"two precious kids"?! They broke into the man's house and had done so SEVERAL times before! And his sister whining about how he was never going to get to meet her children. Well, maybe he would have if he hadn't, you know, BROKEN INTO SOMEONE'S HOUSE!

That said, I don't know what to think of the shooter either. If that had been me, I'd have been too terrified to even shoot anyone, much less be as calculated and rehearsed as he was, and he shot the girl far more times than necessary.

Edited April 27, 2020 by Camille

[Tabbygirl521]

7 hours ago, Camille said:

"12 Minutes On Elm Street" reminds me of an AITA thread with the answer to the question being ESH.

The kids families deifying them was infuriating--"two precious kids"?! They broke into the man's house and had done so SEVERAL times before! And his sister whining about how he was never going to get to meet her children. Well, maybe he would have if he hadn't, you know, BROKEN INTO SOMEONE'S HOUSE!

That said, I don't know what to think of the shooter either. If that had been me, I'd have been too terrified to even shoot anyone, much less be as calculated and rehearsed as he was, and he shot the girl far more times than necessary.

I’ve seen this case covered elsewhere so I gave this Dateline a miss because I find it so infuriating. The old man definitely set those kids up and planned to murder them. But the kids were horrible nasty little brats. I get that their families miss them but boy, it’s frustrating that apparently no one finds any fault with any of their behavior.m, or acknowledges how they were playing with fire.  I can ALMOST understand the old guy snapping - except he didn’t really snap. I cannot understand why he didn’t call the police except part of me kind of can...

Edited April 27, 2020 by Tabbygirl521

[Dr.OO7]

20 minutes ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

But the kids were horrible nasty little brats. I get that their families miss them but boy, it’s frustrating that apparently no one finds any fault with any of their behavior.m, or acknowledges how they were playing with fire

No, they were "precious kids". (Eye roll) The family completely glossing over their actions is mind-boggling.

They weren't walking up the driveway or knocking on the door because they were lost or their car broke down. They weren't even coming up the driveway with the intent to burglarize as they'd done before (at which point, shooting them would not have been justified). They were in the man's house. Whose to say that they wouldn't have harmed him upon realizing he was home?

[saber5055]

16 hours ago, Blissfool said:

- being too detailed with his sex conversations with his mom. I bet he got a kick outta shocking her.

She could have said she didn't want to hear about that stuff, keep the TMI to yourself. So I'm saying no kicks, not shocked. And lots of kids are smart asses, even to cops. Old people too. Watching one episode of a real-life cop show will teach you that.

[iMonrey]

Quote

I think Stephen did it and nothing excuses his actions, but why did Jesse think he needed to out Stephen like that?

One of the interview subjects said that Jesse broke it off with Stephen (sp?) as soon as he found out he had a wife and kid. It's possible Stephen kept coming around anyway, and that Jesse finally had to threaten to out him to his superiors to get him to stop.

[UsernameFatigue]

I am not convinced beyond a reasonable doubt that Rios was the killer. I have forgotten already, but wasn't there a reason why they never looked at the killing possibly happening before the time that Stephen ended his shift and was on the roof with the fellow cops? There must have been a reason that the prosecution stuck to a very narrow window  of time, when it actually did raise reasonable doubt if the jury wanted to go in that direction. I remember the coroner saying the murder was just before dawn but I can't remember why she said that. 

I have no problem believing that Jesse didn't wash his sheets. I remember a case from a couple of years ago when a 20s something young woman was murdered. There was semen from at least three different guys - but I think it was actually 4 - was found on her sheets. And Jesse had DNA from two different guys under his fingernails. Also when Steven was left guarding the body, why would he not make sure there was no evidence left on the body? Not sure how hard it might have been to see the hairs, but why not take advantage of guarding the body? Also I thought they said the hairs were on his chest, not on his neck? 

I do remember the first time this case was covered,  vaguely, but don't remember the retrial part. In any case I can't find any more info regarding the trial which may have convinced my beyond a reasonable doubt that Rios was the killer. 

 

Edited April 27, 2020 by UsernameFatigue

[Irlandesa]

On 4/25/2020 at 2:45 PM, Annber03 said:

Whether he's innocent or guilty, as noted in the episode, he shouldn't have been there (though, of course, if he'd tried to explain that to his colleagues, that would've likely required him having to tell his fellow officers about his relationship with the kid, so... Might've been a better option than the way the other officers did find out about the relationship, though). 

He didn't have to explain why he wasn't there.  IIRC, in the episode they said he volunteered to guard the crime scene.

2 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

And Jesse had DNA from two different guys under his fingernails. Also when Steven was left guarding the body, why would he not make sure there was no evidence left on the body? Not sure how hard it might have been to see the hairs, but why not take advantage of guarding the body?

He wasn't guarding the body.  He was guarding the crime scene. And I'd imagine walking up the body with some soap and wash cloth in hand might look a little suspicious.  We don't know where he was but guarding the crime scene might have given him the opportunity to make sure there was nothing of his left in Jesse's home.

There were two DNA samples underneath Jesse's fingernails but only one of the matches was straight forward about his relationship with Jesse.  Sure, I guess the chef could be playing the biggest con job by being very upset by the death, super helpful in the investigation and having no apparent motive all while actually being the killer but I still think the preponderance of evidence leads to Stephen.

On an aside, I guess this week's theme was "I have more sexual partners than you do" with Jesse's story on Friday, the repeat of the polyamorous minister and the repeat of the wife who had affairs while her husband was away in the military.

Edited April 27, 2020 by Irlandesa

[Annber03]

11 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

He didn't have to explain why he wasn't there.  IIRC, in the episode they said he volunteered to guard the crime scene.

Oh, I know he chose to be there. I just meant that if he had chosen to excuse himself from guarding the crime scene, as some in the episode said he should've done given his personal connection to Jesse, that could've had people wondering and asking questions, too, thus potentially risking him having to admit there was a personal connection in the first place. 

[biakbiak]

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

Oh, I know he chose to be there. I just meant that if he had chosen to excuse himself from guarding the crime scene, as some in the episode said he should've done given his personal connection to Jesse, that could've had people wondering and asking questions, too, thus potentially risking him having to admit there was a personal connection in the first place. 

I believe the point was that he apparently volunteered to guard the crime scene which was something he wouldn’t have to do so he went out of his way to involve himself.

Edited April 27, 2020 by biakbiak

[MsJamieDornan]

I was wondering if the cop broke it off with Jesse? And thats why Jesse threatened to tell everyone about the relationship. Maybe Jesse didnt always tell the whole truth to his mom and friends.

 

Also, the cop stopped by Jesse's during working hours to have sex? Didn't anyone notice his car parked there on several occasions ?

 

[saber5055]

On 4/27/2020 at 3:16 PM, Irlandesa said:

We don't know where he was but guarding the crime scene might have given him the opportunity to make sure there was nothing of his left in Jesse's home.

And a reason for his DNA to be in Jesse's apartment and around the crime scene, something I didn't think of until reading this post. The DNA under Jesse's fingernail was a little harder to explain, however.

[Lsk02]

2 hours ago, saber5055 said:

And a reason for his DNA to be in Jesse's apartment and around the crime scene, something I didn't think of until reading this post. The DNA under Jesse's fingernail was a little harder to explain, however.

Weren’t they arm hairs pulled out by the roots found near Jesse’s neck, though? That seems like more than just random hair shedding while at the scene to me. 
 

I don’t know how long DNA typically stays on someone’s body after they’ve been close. Would it be possible for the DNA to still be under his nails a week after they had gotten together?

[saber5055]

22 minutes ago, Lsk02 said:

Weren’t they arm hairs pulled out by the roots found near Jesse’s neck, though? That seems like more than just random hair shedding while at the scene to me. 

Yeah, of course. I doubt the cop realized he left major DNA during the murder. If the hairs weren't on Jesse and the DNA under his nail, rando DNA from the cop -- if any were even found -- could be explained by his "guarding' the scene. It just didn't work out for him.

And who knows if Stephen was even thinking that way. I'm just supposing as a cop, he would be aware of not letting anyone into a crime scene so as not to goof up or add DNA. Hey, it's just a thought!

[cooksdelight]

Tonight’s episode:

 

[Irlandesa]

I guess this frees up two hours for me.  I know there are updates to this story since it first aired but I don't need to see this for another two hours.

I'm sure it'll get boffo ratings, though.

[cooksdelight]

They interviewed her oldest son, who became pretty much estranged from her. Also the children’s grandparents, Charles’ parents. And a lot of different police, news writers, lawyers. 

Lori’s a nut, she will most likely use an insanity defense.

[AryasMum]

1 hour ago, cooksdelight said:

They interviewed her oldest son, who became pretty much estranged from her. Also the children’s grandparents, Charles’ parents. And a lot of different police, news writers, lawyers. 

Lori’s a nut, she will most likely use an insanity defense.

I’m over women who drag their children from man to man to man, exposing them to any and all abuse, and then walk away, or let them be killed, to keep said man.