S01.E09: The Green Council

[Affogato]

On 10/20/2022 at 1:01 AM, Oscirus said:

When has their ever been proof that Targs can control dragons with their minds? They're not starks, they dont have warging abilities.

Of course they have mind contact and control. How else do you imagine they are doing it? Clicker training?

How would Dany stage a three pronged attack? How would Aemond ‘tame’ vhaegar in an evening? Etc. 

of course the process involves a psychic bond of some sort. 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Affogato

[Affogato]

On 10/20/2022 at 12:36 AM, Constantinople said:

Admit it.

Everyone will watching the coronation of Charles III to see if a dragon bursts through the floor of Westminster Abbey.

And an old fashioned police callbox appears outside at the same time. 

[Affogato]

21 hours ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

Speaking of dragons, was it ever mentioned what happened to Laenor's dragon Seasmoke? Did he take it with him on his exile and started telling people "This is just my pet lizard, he is a little big, yes, but I feed him well, haha"? Did Seasmoke get a new rider and if, yes, who? You would think that would be pretty important

If I were writing it he would be far enough away so it wouldn’t matter. He will get rich off his war machine.
 

Eventually rumors wiould circulate of course. 
 

they don’t have internet and cell phones. 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Affogato

[paigow]

1 hour ago, Roseanna said:

What if Christon Cole were a woman and Rhaenyra were a man? A man had had sex with a woman, she had accepted sex only because she had believed that he truly cared for her

The missing variable is the pre-existing boss-employee relationship.

[Noneofyourbusiness]

And a dragon/rider can't bond to another rider/dragon while their current one is alive.

[paigow]

11 minutes ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

And a dragon/rider can't bond to another rider/dragon while their current one is alive.

Inconvenient when somebody calls in sick...

[jeansheridan]

On 10/20/2022 at 7:11 AM, Oscirus said:

Season 2 was a mystical situation and those other 2 are d and d creations, as far as George goes there are no such mental bonds between rider and dragon.

Since it was on the show I will take it as show canon. The books are their own thing. 

[ChicksDigScars]

14 hours ago, magdalene said:

It's a more gender-neutral cuss word in the UK.   Men call men c**t they really don't like. Daemon called Otto the "C" word. To me it is a big no-no when a man calls a woman that  - so one more strike against Criston, lol. He is the douche bag champion.

Yes, I find it less tasteless when a Brit uses it, knowing that the connotation is much worse in the U.S.  Here, it is used exclusively to degrade a woman in the worst way possible. In the U.K. it's an equal opportunity insult. 

Quote

Piloted by Harry The Untitled...

Riding Dyana...or is it Dyaena?

Quote

But who gets the eye patch?  Wills?  Kate?  Anne?

Oh, Andrew, of course. Like Aemond, the second son and next in line to his brother the heir, until the heir's children displaced him.

Andrew is a rapey asshole rather than an evil one, though. Give him an eye patch and a padlocked chastity belt.

Edited October 21, 2022 by ChicksDigScars

[Oscirus]

49 minutes ago, jeansheridan said:

Since it was on the show I will take it as show canon. The books are their own thing. 

If I call the game of thrones show canon then Im also having to accept that some targs are randomly fireproof. NTY to that

[Enigma X]

I think the TV shows are canon to the TV shows whereas the books are canon to the books. In instances like this, I think both things can and have to be true to the different platforms. 

[Affogato]

59 minutes ago, Oscirus said:

If I call the game of thrones show canon then Im also having to accept that some targs are randomly fireproof. NTY to that

That was the result of a magic spell. That makes internal sense since Targaryens not influenced by the spell would not be fireproof. In this show Daemon was seen flying through fire, but I would imagine that there was an airstream of some sort around him because he was flying fast. It was a 'hotshot' move, but not a fireproof one. This may be a long shot, but he is an impulsive sort.

As far as training the dragons without a mental bond, this is just ridiculous. The dragon isn't going to be that sensitive to a puny human squeezing the side of their neck with their thighs. The riders don't carry crops, much less ankhs. They do not use a bit and reins. Voice commands would be hard to hear in flight. flying a dragon would be incredibly dangerous at best, and they are able to give them direction.

People tame dragons they meet as adults, why would the dragon attend to them at all? You might fancy that a new born could be hand fed and imprinted, but an adult you have never seen before? They do eat people and kill people, it isn't a draconian taboo. there don't seem to be occasions of dragons attacking their riders.

Also, if there is no reason, why are the only dragon riders from the specific island? There must be something that sets them apart. Yes, having a baby to bond with would be easier but the heritage seems a strong indicator and people do bond with adult dragons. Also Vhaegar is lonely...why would dragons want to be with people, if not for some kind of bond?

Phoo on George. There is something going on there. It may be dna driven, it may be magical, but this isn't analogous with riding a horse or raising a dog.

Edited October 21, 2022 by Affogato

[proserpina65]

19 hours ago, The Kings Foot said:

A lot of people are embarrassed they liked him early on so they're treating him like he's their ex boyfriend.

I can't really snark on people about that because I've decided that Aemond is my HOTD boyfriend.  Yeah, I know, he pretty much exudes a sense of being on the edge of doing something really heinous at any moment, but what can I say?  Apparently I like a fictional bad boy with swagger, a neat scar and an eyepatch.  (Not in real life, I swear.)

18 hours ago, magdalene said:

I don't agree with the notion that Aemond is the nice, decent brother but I will give him props for trying to protect his sister while Aegon was hiding behind Mommie.

Oh, he's definitely not nice or decent, but as a brother, he's better to Helaena than Aegon is.  Which admittedly is so low a bar to clear that it's practically on the ground.

As far as we've seen, she's the only actual decent one of that family.  A bit weird, though.

17 hours ago, go4luca said:

Once or not, that was the final straw for me.  I absolutely abhor the "C" word.  

Eh, it doesn't bother me, but I get that people have different levels of tolerance about it.  It's certainly a perfectly good final straw to have.

1 hour ago, ChicksDigScars said:

Oh, Andrew, of course. Like Aemond, the second son and next in line to his brother the heir, until the heir's children displaced him.

I was trying to pretend that Andrew had fallen through a sinkhole to 10,000 BC.  Plus, Anne would totally rock that eyepatch.

[MollyB]

22 hours ago, SilverStormm said:

That theory is a no-go as Jacaerys & Lucaerys (and Joffrey who was given an egg as a babe) already have dragons of their own

But has the egg hatched?  Maybe Joffrey could use Rent-a-Dragon until it does. 

[Oscirus]

1 hour ago, Affogato said:

That was the result of a magic spell. That makes internal sense since Targaryens not influenced by the spell would not be fireproof. In this show Daemon was seen flying through fire, but I would imagine that there was an airstream of some sort around him because he was flying fast. It was a 'hotshot' move, but not a fireproof one. This may be a long shot, but he is an impulsive sort.

As far as training the dragons without a mental bond, this is just ridiculous. The dragon isn't going to be that sensitive to a puny human squeezing the side of their neck with their thighs. The riders don't carry crops, much less ankhs. They do not use a bit and reins. Voice commands would be hard to hear in flight. flying a dragon would be incredibly dangerous at best, and they are able to give them direction.

People tame dragons they meet as adults, why would the dragon attend to them at all? You might fancy that a new born could be hand fed and imprinted, but an adult you have never seen before? They do eat people and kill people, it isn't a draconian taboo. there don't seem to be occasions of dragons attacking their riders.

Also, if there is no reason, why are the only dragon riders from the specific island? There must be something that sets them apart. Yes, having a baby to bond with would be easier but the heritage seems a strong indicator and people do bond with adult dragons. Also Vhaegar is lonely...why would dragons want to be with people, if not for some kind of bond?

Phoo on George. There is something going on there. It may be dna driven, it may be magical, but this isn't analogous with riding a horse or raising a dog.

Im not saying that there isnt a mental bond just that theres not a magical avatar type bond where one can control said dragon when youre not on them. If thats the case, then theres no reason to ever ride a dragon into a war since you can control them from miles away.

The first dany incident was magic, the rest werent supposed to happen, even george said that.  Since he had no control over those last 3 seasons but has control here, Id say we cant use the show is the show and the book is the book under those circumstances

[CeeBeeGee]

2 hours ago, ChicksDigScars said:

Riding Dyana...or is it Dyaena?

I love the idea of Diana being reincarnated as a zero fucks given dragon. Burn it all down, girl.

[Oscirus]

 heads up to everybody, episode 10 has leaked online early, so there will be spoilers all over the twitterspear and internet in general so be careful

[Affogato]

18 minutes ago, Oscirus said:

Im not saying that there isnt a mental bond just that theres not a magical avatar type bond where one can control said dragon when youre not on them. If thats the case, then theres no reason to ever ride a dragon into a war since you can control them from miles away.

The first dany incident was magic, the rest werent supposed to happen, even george said that.  Since he had no control over those last 3 seasons but has control here, Id say we cant use the show is the show and the book is the book under those circumstances

It would be interesting if someone took it in hand and explained it.

Yes, it is not the dragonriders of Pern, I don't think there has been any indication anyone can have conversations with the HOD dragons using words, or any indication that the dragons talk to each other, or that they acknowledge one or another among them as being in charge.  Also, not color coded, but I digress. 

We can control many planes from many miles and there are still uses for pilots. Targets look different from up close and personal. Also some of our riders seem to enjoy the excitement. People would want to get information on how the battle is going. Also, fun to ride dragons. Get places faster. Go to the vale, kill your wife and back for dinner. 

[jeansheridan]

5 hours ago, Oscirus said:

If I call the game of thrones show canon then Im also having to accept that some targs are randomly fireproof. NTY to that

Isn't Daemon? He flew through that fireball when he was putting on a show with Laena. It's like warging--some people can, some people can't. Dany and Bran were shown to have extra talents very early on.

Edited October 21, 2022 by jeansheridan

[jeansheridan]

On 10/21/2022 at 10:01 AM, proserpina65 said:

Oh, he's definitely not nice or decent, but as a brother, he's better to Helaena than Aegon is.  Which admittedly is so low a bar to clear that it's practically on the ground.

I am on the fence about him. He was immature with The Strong toast, making digs at his cousins. But the other boy did giggle at him. He has a big old chip on his shoulder but I haven't seen him be evil beyond that fight. He was still relatively young then too. I think he has better control now. I mean he didn't shiv his brother. He must have been tempted!

[millennium]

I spent the whole episode thinking, "Ser Christon.  I hope somebody kills him."  "Otto Hightower.  I hope somebody kills him."  "Larys.  I hope somebody kills him."  "Aegon.  I hope somebody kills him."

And then, just when it seemed my wishes might actually come true -- in grand fashion, I might add -- Rhaenys just flies off rather than incinerating the whole rotten bunch.   I think her soft spot for Alicent saved them all.

Edited October 23, 2022 by millennium

[rhygirl720]

My dragon/Dragon rider take is that it is the dragon reading the human...not the other way around. Dragons are in every canon magical beings. "The dragon is not a slave" Everything a rider does is with the dragon's consent. 

[Ceindreadh]

8 hours ago, millennium said:

I spent the whole episode thinking, "Ser Christon.  I hope somebody kills him."  "Otto Hightower.  I hope somebody kills him."  "Larys.  I hope somebody kills him."  "Aegon.  I hope somebody kills him."

And then, just when it seemed my wishes might actually come true -- in grand fashion, I might add -- Rhaenys just flies off rather than incinerating the whole rotten bunch.   I think her soft spot for Alicent saved them all.

There are soooo many characters whose heads I want to see on pikes before this show is over. 

[Colorado David]

it is so interesting, GoT had what 2 characters we hated, while HotD has several. intentional you think?

[millennium]

40 minutes ago, Colorado David said:

it is so interesting, GoT had what 2 characters we hated, while HotD has several. intentional you think?

I'm not sure.  What makes the abundance of assholes so glaring is the almost complete lack of characters to like.   During this episode I found myself anxious for Rhanaerys and Daemon to learn of Otto's machinations and take action, but not because I like them.   It's just that at the moment they are technically on the side of what's right -- that being the king's decree that Rhanaerys' child sits on the throne.

In GoT, the darker characters were offset by the noble characters -- Tyrion, John Snow, Danaerys (until the final episode, that is), etc.   In this show, there's no one at all to represent the light.   Of the whole lot, the only character I kind of like is Alicent, only because I have a weakness for redheads and she has a conscience (although not enough strength to follow it).

Edited October 23, 2022 by millennium

[paigow]

On 10/23/2022 at 6:49 PM, millennium said:

the only character I kind of like is Alicent, only because I have a weakness for redheads

Feet

[ShannaB]

On 10/20/2022 at 6:03 PM, Oscirus said:

The only realistic reason why shed do that instead of going through the front door is to either kill off team green before changing her mind cuz Alicent was being a good mother or to flip off team green before flying off. Either way it was a stupid thing to do and will have huge ramifications on the future

Rhaenys' bursting through the floor is a ramification of her and her dragon being 'imprisoned' and the rushed coronation.  Green Team made the first move.

[Oscirus]

3 hours ago, ShannaB said:

Rhaenys' bursting through the floor is a ramification of her and her dragon being 'imprisoned' and the rushed coronation.  Green Team made the first move.

Her dragon wasnt imprisoned, she couldve went out the front door. Sure team green made the first move, but that doesnt make her actions less reckless

[Noneofyourbusiness]

On 10/21/2022 at 6:33 AM, Roseanna said:

What if Christon Cole were a woman and Rhaenyra were a man? A man had had sex with a woman, she had accepted sex only because she had believed that he truly cared for her but then he had showed that she wasn't good enough to marry but although he would marry, they could continue the relationship.

Of course she had been naive to believe that sex means love and even commitment. Still, wouldn't she have right to be angry and bitter towards him, at least because he wasn't honest with her *before* seducing her?

On 10/21/2022 at 2:29 AM, Dac22 said:

Criston's mistake is believing that Rhaenyra actually cared about him or what was best for him in that moment.

The thing is, women *are* in Criston's position in this society all the time, and it doesn't necessarily result in her being thrown to the wolves. A king or lord has a mutually loving long-term relationship with a woman whom he can't marry due to their social positions. That's what it's like for every royal mistress in history. Rhaenyra *did* care for him and made that clear. Not being willing to uproot herself and run away from her inheritance, her responsibilities, and her entire life doesn't mean she doesn't care about him and was just using him like I've seen asserted. She wanted to continue being emotionally as well as physically intimate with him.

And given that he was sworn never to marry, the fact that they'd be having an affair and not marrying was already to be taken as read. His proposal was not something she had any reason to expect or should feel bad about turning down, and she didn't lead him on.

So what irritates me about Criston is that because he's a straight man, he thinks he's too good to be in the same situation that countless women (and gay men, who by definition must be the unofficial paramour) are in.

Edited October 26, 2022 by Noneofyourbusiness

[proserpina65]

11 hours ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Rhaenyra *did* care for him and made that clear. Not being willing to uproot herself and run away from her inheritance, her responsibilities, and her entire life doesn't mean she doesn't care about him and was just using him like I've seen asserted.

I saw no evidence that he was anything to her except some fun.

[AshleyN]

Just catching up on this show and my main thought after watching this episode was that Alicent would be a much more interesting character if they just let her be a villain. Or at least more villainous than she is now. As it is, it feels like they're trying so hard to make her sympathetic that the end result is that she just comes across as weak-willed, wishy-washy, and frankly, pretty stupid.

And it's particularly baffling given that it seemed like her whole character arc up until this episode seemed to be laying the groundwork for her heel turn in a way that would make it, if not entirely justifiable, at least understandable, only to back off in the end. We know (from her conversation with Aegon in episode 6) that she's been straight up telling him for years that he's the future king, and her other kids just assume the same. Except it turns out, she's never given any thought to how to actually MAKE him king? She's also supposedly motivated by the thought that Rhaenyra being crowned would make her own sons to dangerous to be left alive, yet is shocked, SHOCKED, at the suggestion that the reverse is also true? I could understand if they had written this as her maybe having some regret or apprehension now that the time has come to go from planning to acting, but having her be so oblivious here feels like Sansa Stark Season 1 levels of political naivete, which just doesn't make any sense for a woman who's been Queen for what, 20 years at this point?

I also really wish that Olivia  Cooke had played her reaction to that last scene with Viserys' with at least a little ambiguity. Because a scenario where she hears what she wants to hear, and grabs ahold of any excuse to justify her actions (especially since Alicent is a character who is guided largely by her own sense of moral righteousness) makes a lot more sense than one where she apparently 100% sincerely believes that the man who has spent literally decades refusing to budge from his decision to make Rhaenyra heir despite a mountain of pressure to do so, and in his very last day on earth put himself through hell (and probably caused his own death) dragging his decrepit ass to the throne just to back her up one last time, changed his mind at the last minute based on nothing more than some doped-up incoherent ramblings. Again, it doesn't make her sympathetic, it just makes her look dumb.

On 10/18/2022 at 12:12 PM, proserpina65 said:

A lot of that has to do with the character actually DOING something, unlike a lot of the other characters for at least the first half of the season.  Inert characters are much less interesting in comparison.

This is a really good point that I feel like people tend to overlook when they fall into the trap of listing off the pros and cons and individual actions of which characters are "better" than others*. It's also what makes it frustrating to me that these writers seem to have decided that the best way to make audiences sympathize with their two female leads is to make them passive bystanders to the machinations of men around them. Even with Rhaenyra, who I think generally is the more compelling character, the biggest criticism of her character (which I agree with) is that, despite the fact that she knows there are people who don't want her on the throne, she seemingly never took any action to secure her own succession.

*Tbh, it takes me back to the unbearable Arya/Sansa stan battles, and all the discourse around why Arya was so much more popular (at least in the early seasons). I always felt like while they're was undoubtedly some sexism involved, people really underestimated how much of the difference in reception came from the fact that Arya, especially early on, was a far more active character than Sansa, which is generally going to make for a more engaging character.

[LennieBriscoe]

Too many characters look alike. Too many characters have similar names. Too many characters have too many Baby Daddies and Baby Mommas. Too many heirs and pretenders to the throne  (I would bet the dubious death-bed declaration was lifted from that of King Edward the Confessor, who promised the throne to both William of Normandy and Harold, or so the future enemies said.). 

I have found this series---with the notable exceptions of me boyo Paddy Considine and the always-welcome Mycroft Holmes, I mean Rhys Ifans---dull as the proverbial dishwater,  humorless, confusing, and colorless. 

Too paraphrase another proverb, the show labored mightily only to produce a mouse. 

[Scarlett45]

“You long not to be free but to make a window in the wall of your own prison.”- Princess Rhaenys gets ALL the good lines. Damn! I wondered where her dragon was and I knew they locked her servants up. 

[Scarlett45]

On 10/25/2022 at 7:51 PM, Noneofyourbusiness said:

The thing is, women *are* in Criston's position in this society all the time, and it doesn't necessarily result in her being thrown to the wolves. A king or lord has a mutually loving long-term relationship with a woman whom he can't marry due to their social positions. That's what it's like for every royal mistress in history. Rhaenyra *did* care for him and made that clear. Not being willing to uproot herself and run away from her inheritance, her responsibilities, and her entire life doesn't mean she doesn't care about him and was just using him like I've seen asserted. She wanted to continue being emotionally as well as physically intimate with him.

And given that he was sworn never to marry, the fact that they'd be having an affair and not marrying was already to be taken as read. His proposal was not something she had any reason to expect or should feel bad about turning down, and she didn't lead him on.

So what irritates me about Criston is that because he's a straight man, he thinks he's too good to be in the same situation that countless women (and gay men, who by definition must be the unofficial paramour) are in.

Yeah. My sympathy ended for Criston episodes ago, when he expected Rhaenyra to just up and leave her life for him, “woah dude the penis isn’t that powerful”. He knew when they slept together she was the PRINCESS and he took a vow never to marry. It would’ve been a different thing if he told her that he couldn’t continue the fling because of his honor and then she tried to blackmail him or threatened to out the relationship- that’s the only way his indignation would be justified. But that’s not what happened. 
 

Criston is the type that feels justified “I’m on the side of right” by constantly doing bad shit. Yes he serves the queen, but that doesn’t excuse his impulsive behavior (like smashing the elder counsel member’s head in). 

Also- I’m surprised they let the Capt of the Kingsguard just walk out of there. I was expecting him to show up at any moment. I anticipate he will be a major player in the future- unlike Ser Cole he takes his oath seriously. 
 

Also- fuck Otto. Yes you made your daughter Queen, but you didn’t prepare her or teach her anything. You stewed division in the realm. Her not wanting her son to murder his SISTER (yes at the end of the day Rhaenyra is sister to all her kids) isn’t a bad thing, kinslaying is cursed in this universe. And Rhaenyra/Alicent could’ve held onto their friendship in some way if Otto wasn’t scheming and constantly trying to divide the family. 

[Roseanna]

On 10/26/2022 at 3:51 AM, Noneofyourbusiness said:

The thing is, women *are* in Criston's position in this society all the time, and it doesn't necessarily result in her being thrown to the wolves. A king or lord has a mutually loving long-term relationship with a woman whom he can't marry due to their social positions. That's what it's like for every royal mistress in history. Rhaenyra *did* care for him and made that clear. Not being willing to uproot herself and run away from her inheritance, her responsibilities, and her entire life doesn't mean she doesn't care about him and was just using him like I've seen asserted. She wanted to continue being emotionally as well as physically intimate with him.

And given that he was sworn never to marry, the fact that they'd be having an affair and not marrying was already to be taken as read. His proposal was not something she had any reason to expect or should feel bad about turning down, and she didn't lead him on.

So what irritates me about Criston is that because he's a straight man, he thinks he's too good to be in the same situation that countless women (and gay men, who by definition must be the unofficial paramour) are in.

The Royal mistresses have an official position and they could be influental. Criston's affair with Rhaenura should have beem secret and his position would have been only that of a bodyguard.

Most of all, Criston was sworn to be *celibate*, so his position was like that of Vestal Virgins in Rome who, just like Criston, were punished with death for breaking their wov.

Criston's later behavior as Alicent's supporter can be criticized, but I don't think it's fair to accuse him for taking his honor *in the beginning* seriously just because the modern audience have morality of other kind.

As for asking Rhaenyra to leave everything for him, isn't that what romantic love is suppose to mean? Just as her husband later did for his lover. But Rhaenyra wanted to have her cake and eat it. 

[Noneofyourbusiness]

58 minutes ago, Roseanna said:

Criston's later behavior as Alicent's supporter can be criticized, but I don't think it's fair to accuse him for taking his honor *in the beginning* seriously just because the modern audience have morality of other kind.

As for asking Rhaenyra to leave everything for him, isn't that what romantic love is suppose to mean? Just as her husband later did for his lover. But Rhaenyra wanted to have her cake and eat it. 

He chose to take the risk of sleeping with Rhaenyra while having if anything a better idea of how risky it was than she did, and I don't buy the argument that he was under any duress or had to fear what she might do if he refused. Maybe with a different princess, but she made no threats (not to mention any accusation would have backfired on her) and he knew her well enough to know that she wouldn't. He's responsible for the state of his own honor. Then he wants to paper over it after the fact and claims he takes it seriously.

No, that's not what romantic love means. It strikes me that people have almost disturbingly unreasonable and unhealthy expectations about the lengths people should go to for romantic love to be "true". She has a life and responsibilities which mean something. Laenor seemingly wanted to leave his life behind, but that doesn't mean everyone does or should. It's certainly not an expectation that either Rhaenyra or Criston had going in. Criston can propose the idea that she drop everything, and he can decide he doesn't want to continue their relationship, but he can't then act like she led him on or did something to him when she turns him down.

Yes, there's some truth to Rhaenyra (an inexperienced teenage girl whose options for romance are constrained by politics) wanting to have her cake and eat it, but in his regret, Criston projects all the blame and guilt for something they did together.

[ICantDoThatDave]

On 10/30/2022 at 6:46 AM, Noneofyourbusiness said:

He chose to take the risk of sleeping with Rhaenyra while having if anything a better idea of how risky it was than she did, and I don't buy the argument that he was under any duress or had to fear what she might do if he refused. Maybe with a different princess, but she made no threats (not to mention any accusation would have backfired on her) and he knew her well enough to know that she wouldn't.

She did to him the same thing Aegon did to that serving girl.

[proserpina65]

14 hours ago, ICantDoThatDave said:

She did to him the same thing Aegon did to that serving girl.

I wouldn't go quite that far, but the initial encounter was most definitely coercion on her part.

[Archangel]

On 10/16/2022 at 7:23 PM, Oscirus said:

Im more wanting to know how the fuck did she know to do that? Was that payment for keeping silent for the Strong business?

In rewatching the series I noticed that in Ep 6 “The Princess and the Queen” when Alicent goes into her room to have dinner with Larys, she takes off her shoes. This evidently has been going on for quite some time. I guess it’s how Alicent gets info or has Larys do whatever dirty work she wants him to do and money doesn’t change hands. Still has an eww factor to it and to me doesn’t make Alicent this righteous character she portrays herself as. I am surprised that Talya doesn’t know about what Alicent & Larys are doing but maybe that will be born out and Talya will work for the White Worm at some point. 

[proserpina65]

On 2/17/2023 at 5:08 PM, Archangel said:

In rewatching the series I noticed that in Ep 6 “The Princess and the Queen” when Alicent goes into her room to have dinner with Larys, she takes off her shoes. This evidently has been going on for quite some time. I guess it’s how Alicent gets info or has Larys do whatever dirty work she wants him to do and money doesn’t change hands. Still has an eww factor to it and to me doesn’t make Alicent this righteous character she portrays herself as. I am surprised that Talya doesn’t know about what Alicent & Larys are doing but maybe that will be born out and Talya will work for the White Worm at some point. 

I rewatched that episode after reading your post.  Yes, she does take off her shoes, but not her stockings.  Then she walks over to the table, which would seem to block any view of her feet.  So it seems less transactional at that point and more "my shoes hurt".  However, it does reflect a certain unexpected level of comfort with Larys and is probably the beginning of that particular quid pro quo relationship.

[Meredith Quill]

On 2/17/2023 at 10:08 PM, Archangel said:

In rewatching the series I noticed that in Ep 6 “The Princess and the Queen” when Alicent goes into her room to have dinner with Larys, she takes off her shoes. This evidently has been going on for quite some time. I guess it’s how Alicent gets info or has Larys do whatever dirty work she wants him to do and money doesn’t change hands. Still has an eww factor to it and to me doesn’t make Alicent this righteous character she portrays herself as. I am surprised that Talya doesn’t know about what Alicent & Larys are doing but maybe that will be born out and Talya will work for the White Worm at some point. 

 

On 2/21/2023 at 3:34 PM, proserpina65 said:

I rewatched that episode after reading your post.  Yes, she does take off her shoes, but not her stockings.  Then she walks over to the table, which would seem to block any view of her feet.  So it seems less transactional at that point and more "my shoes hurt".  However, it does reflect a certain unexpected level of comfort with Larys and is probably the beginning of that particular quid pro quo relationship.

Rather than write out my enduring reaction to this 'arrangement', let me sum up by saying: