S06.E13: Fubar

[CheshireCat]

Quote

The Cody boys embark on their most dangerous job yet; Andrew commits the original sin that destroyed the family.

Air date: Aug 28, 2022

[Craigcodybazhate]

I think Craig gets killed. I watched the movie and I think the show will stay with some of the stuff in the movie. J faces off with Pope. I think Derean gets away. I guess the writers have been similar to the movie script just changing a few things around. 
 

I think they will give us a message crime don’t pay so these characters we’ve been rooting for. I don’t think they get away with it. 

[MoeBird]

4 hours ago, Craigcodybazhate said:

I think Craig gets killed. I watched the movie and I think the show will stay with some of the stuff in the movie. J faces off with Pope. I think Derean gets away. I guess the writers have been similar to the movie script just changing a few things around. 
 

I think they will give us a message crime don’t pay so these characters we’ve been rooting for. I don’t think they get away with it. 

It was pointed out at the end of last week's discussion (too late to respond) that I was mistaken about Craig not killing anyone.  I completely forgot that he killed the men who kidnapped Nick.  But, to quote Arnold Schwarzenegger from True Lies, "they were all bad." 

Still, I agree, Craig will be killed.  If the character took a life, their life will be taken in the finale. 

Where I have to respectfully disagree with you, is that the series has been "similar" to the movie, "just changing a few things around."  In the movie, J is a good kid trapped by a wicked family.  Smurf's even alive at the end of the movie, and not nearly as sinister as she's portrayed in the series.

In the movie, Pope is the out-of-control psychopath.  In the series, J is the evil, diabolical and cunning psychopath who is willing to take the life of any human being, innocent or otherwise, who gets in the way of destroying his entire family ... for greed. 

[Craigcodybazhate]

Agreed mo bird well pointed out. Although I disagree that smurf from the movie was evil and ruthless she tells the lawyer to kill J and has cops try to go Murder him. I think she tells Ezra do it. And he says do you want to go that way? 
 

Movie Pope was way more psychopath but that strangulation was similar to Catherine in the T.V. Show. 
 

in the movie J goes back very calculated but to get justice. 
 

And yes Craig did a kill. But it was a justified killed as those guys kidnapped his son and beat up Ren so they got what they deserved. Also they shot Deran you could argue it was self defense. 
 

we will see who gets away. 

[Chick2Chic]

I enjoyed the finale. Not perfect but it went by quickly. Only thing I was hoping would happen but didn't was an Adrian appearance. 

J was all about getting revenge for his mother as he told Pope in the pool scene. I didn't think he would take Penny out that coldly but I knew she wasn't going to join him one way or another. J didn't get a happy ending unless his HEA was solely the decimation of his family for how they treated Julia but HEA was never truly in the cards for J even with the success of his plan.

Craig getting Omar'd as his exit. Deran holding him on the cliff as he died was well done and a tearjerker. Deran promising to help Renn and to raise Nick like his own son was 😢.

Pope burning down the house was fitting too. Too much bad stuff and memories there. Pope dying as the house burns down worked for me too. He let J go cause of his own get of not being strong enough and going with Julia instead of choosing Smurf. 

Smurf really was an irredeemable monster. As soon as she saw Julia and Pope bonding over the baby, she dropped Julia back off in the drug den. I may need to go watch J kill Smurf again after how vile she was towards Julia in the car. Baz's brief appearance wasn't much better. TPTB obviously changed the timeline to make her younger with her pregnancy to make Baz the definite dad of J (even tho the show had Smurf IIRC kinda confirm it already I think in S3). I do wish we'd gotten one more ep if only to explain how Smurf ended up putting Julia in an apartment and paying her rent / utilities til the days Julia OD'd. 

[Chaos Theory]

This entire show has been leading up to the confrontation between Pope and J and it all really comes down to two lines.

Pope: "You are who you are and you did what you did."

J: "You could have saved her but you didn't."

And yes Julia deserved way better from Smurf the mother of the year but J murdering an innocent girl does not make him the hero of the story plus there was that lawyer he murdered back in season 3.   So it was essentially two monsters yelling at each other....which I appriciate.

I thought it was fitting Pope burned down the house.  

I like to think Deran went to that place he went with Adrian back before season 1.  I forget now where it was but back when he was in the closet and he ran away to be happy and gay and away from Smurf.  That is where I am thinking he went.  

Edited August 30, 2022 by Chaos Theory

[Kristi800]

What did Pope think was going to happen when kept Julia at the house? Sheesh. He should have just let her go. The end would have been the same but without the full heartbreak of him bonding with Julia. 

You could tell that Baz had already had enough of Smurf and being in the gang - bring in $60K get $5K in return. By then, though, he was too far in and beholden to Smurf. Not saying he's a saint, which he isn't, but by the time he was able to make a choice, he'd seen too much and couldn't leave any more than the Craig or Deran or Pope. Pope was not cut out for "civilian life" in any way. 

I don't know if I'd been rooting for the guys to get away, but glad that Deran will be able to get away and see Adrian and help Renn & Nick. Yeah, you knew Craig wasn't going to make it. I hope he does a better job than Billy or what Craig had been doing. At least Craig had been trying to get clean. No one's exempt from Smurf's easy drugs.

[MoeBird]

The finale wasn't as bad as I thought it would be.  Having low expectations made it more enjoyable.  The acting was superb, especially Weary's (Deran) and Hatosy's (Pope).

I'm not happy the writer's let J make it out with his life, let alone with the money.  I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, but J didn't deserve to live, especially after killing Penny.

I couldn't get past Smurf's hair, though.  Dark roots were definitely NOT in style back then.  There is no way a fashionista, like Smurf, would have ever let her roots grow out like that.  How hard would it have been for wardrobe to get Smurf's hairstyle straight?  Certainly, any woman on the set over the age of 40 should've known better.

[Bulldog]

That gas can must have held a lot more fuel than it appeared that it did. 

I wonder if EB was even asked to make a cameo flashback appearance. 

Overall, not a bad finale.  Certainly better than most of this season has been.   

[Artsda]

I get why Pope saved J, because he didn't do the saving when Julia was pregnant with him. He did nothing but follow Smurf's orders instead of supporting and doing something for his sister and nephew. So he saved him now instead of letting him die in the pool. BUT I really wish J would have died. He deserved to die too, and instead he gets to live with all the money? He better hope Deran never crosses his path.

Deran's good bye with Craig and promising to raise his son as his own was so sad. I always thought the best scenes/writing was the family together and to watch 2 die was sad. Pope burning down the house was fitting after all that has happened there.

[LoveLeigh]

It was not a bad episode but as a finale episode it is not memorable. It is just another episode. I liked this series. I am glad I stayed for the duration. 

[arachne]

I don't understand how Deran can help Renn and Nick. Other than those diamonds, he has no money that I'm aware of (J took it all) and wouldn't he be a fugitive now? I guess it's one of those eternal loose ends.

Did anyone else catch the drink J gave Penny? Vodka and cranberry, Smurf's go-to beverage. 

Strange as it sounds, Pope was the only Cody with any kind of moral center, as twisted as he was.

I'm glad I persevered to the end of this series, but I'm just as happy it's over. Now I can focus on House of the Dragon -- another f*cked-up family.

Edited August 29, 2022 by arachne

[Craigcodybazhate]

I’m really at a loss of words. I was literally screaming throughout the finale. I’ll have to rewatch again for sure. 
 

I don’t respect J a snitch getting away with it and the Money. He killed his uncles he killed Penny. 
 

Money is one thing but taking life and destroying your uncles is another. 
 

He could’ve took that money and let them get away. Then you go you know what he got us we’ll get the money back. Pope probably would’ve been like cool. But you call the cops that’s snitch blitch move. Then you run.  Like y’all can say what you want but J did Cody dirt to. 
 

Killed an innocent lawyer cause he wanted Smurf’s money. Killed Penny cause she didn’t want to go with him. 
 

you kill an innocent girl who left her husband for you. Who transferred all that money to you and gave up her career. 
 

it’s brilliant writing. Penny was cool with it until she put two and two together and realized that J had his uncles set up to get killed because of greed for his want of money. 
 

I called it for the face off with Pope it made sense. Those two are the protagonist they were gonna have a face off head up. I knew Pope would let him leave and save him. That’s the writing. 
 

Pope was dying his last thing he was gonna do was let that baby live for Julia because that was his last deed and it was going to be a good deed. 
 

all the audience wanted the get back to let J drown but the selflessness of Pope was to let J live with the money 5 million is for the life that J didn’t get even more for the life Julia didn’t get his twin. 5 million don’t pay for the trauma. 
 

but the writers set us up with the flashback to make us understand why Pope had to jump in that pool and pull J out and let him escape why he freed him. To give him that money and let him start over. 
 

after showing Smurf take Julia to the drug den which was giving her the loaded gun and pulling the trigger sending her with junkies not allowing her to get sober with a pregnant kid. She needed to let that kid be healthy. She let Julia get high and pushed it. Pope had the choice to help her take her to rehab the choice would be him on his feet in the street. 
 

Pope saying Julia tried to make him normal was him telling J that he was doing it for Julia it was his apology. 
 

but you see Pope didn’t snitch and call the cops and say J put the whole plan together and kill Penny cause he’s not a snitch. Popes a real one. 
 

J gets no like in my book. Why??? Snitch ? And why kill Penny???? A innocent girl who ain’t got nothing to do with this. 
 

here’s the question would you be happy with 1 million and your girlfriend Penny who would leave with you and you have peace of mind. Key word Peace 

or would you rather have 5 million being alone with no one looking over your shoulder. J chose the ladder and now he’s alone with 5 million. Hope it was worth it. 
 

Craig Deran powerful stuff those two were always close. I liked them showing them as kids fighting in the pool and showing them now. Great writing Deran and Craig at the beach. Deran will do right by Craig. Deran did everything to get his brother out of there. It sucks a kid shot Craig. Derin didn’t kill the kid not sure J would’ve done the same thing as we saw what he was ready to do with Lena. 
 

They were that close to Mexico but the writers weren’t gonna give Craig that ending just like the movie. The proposal with Ren was the giveaway. Then him saying J set them up. 
 

[anonymiss]

I respect they gave them endings they "deserved" instead of doing fan service and pandering like a lot of finales. But it was so not fun and of course not feel-good. What a depressing ending. Glad Pope saved J but he shouldn't have gotten to slide. Julia wasn't completely innocent, either, as a bratty kid. She didn't deserve that but a lot of kids are actually innocent and get abused. She once had everything and snotted off to her mom every chance she could get.

[Craigcodybazhate]

And now the comedy!!!!

Damn how long does it take for Js trifalin ass to drown?????? I’m like damn still in the water Hugh??? I’m sure that felt like 2 minutes he was in there in water tied up???? Really??? He should’ve been drowned. 
 

another one Penny is really gonna stay there and have drinks with this dude who she just realizes is a stone cold murderer. ???? Would be a good idea to take a drink from this guy. Nothing suspicious about that???? 
 

if she wanted to play it off she could’ve been like she’s cool with it and then just said at the airport she’s not traveling with him and went home and had him locked up. So that’s what would’ve really happened but this is a T.V. Show. 
 

or she would’ve just left with the cops. 
 

the one girl who trusted J he killed. 

[Craigcodybazhate]

I wanted Pope to choke Js ass out and whack him right there I was hoping Pope didn’t pull J out the pool. Like no leave him in there. 
 

the consequences are J should’ve died in that pool because he set his uncles up to get killed. That was what J put in motion he would be in figi or wherever with Penny if he did right by his uncles. That was what J did that’s his consequences. Pope saved J. 
 

as for Julia why should the uncles have to pay for that? They were all controlled by smurf. They didn’t tell Julia to put heroine in her arm. They didn’t hurt J when he came there they took him in. 
 

smurf didn’t take him in. His uncles did. Plenty of times they could’ve killed J watch the other seasons. So I don’t respect what he did. 
 

All of that shlit should’ve ended with Smurf. 
 

They tried to show Craig saying she’s not getting my room. He was a kid. That’s not a right for him have to be killed for it. 
 

they sale it as they all ate steak while Julia starved and shot up. But they took him in. Smurf didn’t let her in. You saw what she said to Pope. 
 

He tried to speak up and say she needed rehab. More then Baz did. The baby daddy. 
 

the flucking kid had mental health he was trying the best he could. What’s the original sin that he did? All that was smurf. 
 

I get giving J his motivaton of why he did what he did. But that doesn’t justify him being a cold blooded murder killing innocent people. But setting up his uncles. 
 

you getting mad at a 12 year old Craig? What’s he supposed to do go on the street? 
 

im just having issues with why they let the guy survive who killed innocent people. Lawyer Penny. You just feel for Penny when she’s like she’s not coming what was that? When she realized the guy she was gonna leave town with isn’t the guy she thought he was but a physco. 
 

Pope killed Catherine who he thought was a snitch. Who else did he kill that was innocent????? Who?????? Thugs criminals??? Ripped Pete’s eye out. Pete was a piece of shlit who killed Baz. 
 

you wanna be real about it. J started banging the girl who killed his dad Baz and gave her an apartment. 
 

J murdered innocent people and got the kingdom. Deran killed no one. Craig killed a child napper and Pope killed to protect the Cody’s. So the character J was portrayed as a kid lead by his convict uncles when in fact that kid was the convict who terrorized his uncles. They let him live when Deran wanted to drown him. And that’s the payback they get. 
 

Julia got torture Smurf gave her nothing treated her like dirt. That doesn’t mean her brothers deserved that. 

[anonymiss]

Really wish they had 2 hours. Was so rushed.

[Craigcodybazhate]

Pope had the best lines of the series finale. 
 

That speech in the house that messed me up. When Pope said they’re going to be alright. It’s a brother telling his brothers they are going to be alright knowing they aren’t going to be alright. 
 

it’s leadership him telling Derain get your shlit together helping his scared brother I’ma watch this episode 15 times. 
 

the shootout Pope doing it all for his brothers. They did it for him. He protected them. 
 

craig would’ve made it out if he kept that bullet proof vest on if they didn’t see that kid. 
 

Craig was a flawed character but tried to fix who become that was why we saw Vince so much this season. 
 

Billy came back to give Derain the final warning. And you just go nuts for Derain when he says I trusted J it was me. Sorry. 
 

and Pope pulls him together. Pope was the protector of the Cody’s protected his brothers got them out. And then freed Julia’s Son showing empathy. Powerful writing. 
 

Viewers having hate in thier eyes for J that was me I admit. And Pope having love getting him out the pool the anger saying let him drown the love pulling him out. 
 

Js last words to his uncle she loved you she always loved you. 
 

this episode had John Wells written all over it and he directed it. 
 

Sean Cassidty can he get some kind of statue what a performance. 
 

Baz and we saw why Baz wanted to burn smurf $60,000 job and $5,000 in his pocket now he saw why Julia was skimming. 
 

Tough episode. Damn they gave us the shootout and the tough dramatic drama. 
 

Mo Bird you were right on some stuff props to you. 
 

Tear this episode up more we need more of your perspective. 
 

Penny scene with J was like all J did to get to this point it was all for not. That was he realized he would not be happy. 
 

Pope said it best they took him in. And he took them out. Why’d you come? 
 

just all around felt like a movie. Should’ve been two hours. It was rushed. 
 

Does Derain look for J or Ren first? What about Lena??????? So much could’ve given us more or a spin-off. 

Edited August 29, 2022 by Craigcodybazhate

[anonymiss]

J coming out the "winner" at the end, but at the cost of turning into a monster like Smurf herself (and OD'ing Penny like how his mom died) reminded me of the Conficious quote: "Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves.” J looked dead inside, despite being in paradise.

Edited August 29, 2022 by anonymiss

[Dowel Jones]

For a finale, that had more loose ends than Cher's hair.  I'm sure glad the flashbacks spelled out in detail everything that was wrong with the family, because we sure didn't know this in the first five seasons.  

I would have been happy to see J drown in the pool and then Pope fire off the house, only to die beside the pool.  As it is, the US Marshals Service would pair up with Interpol for a worldwide manhunt because finding Penny's dead body there would be clue #1 about J.  Unless he had a strong plan for escape with false destinations and passports, his face would appear on airport cameras and he would be trackable.  Justice in this case might be to freeze all his millions of dollars and leave him destitute in whatever country he landed in.

[Craigcodybazhate]

In response to what you just wrote didn’t J look like he was in a prison while in paradise all the girls swimming in the pool no connection to him. Just sitting by hisself on the throne looking into the pool nothing. 
 

no uncles no Penny I noticed how the writers and director final shot gave us a pool but this pool wasn’t a Cody pool. This pool was J by himself. 
 

all the con killings got him by hisself. 
 

Penny gets to him. When she says you did all this? You planned all this? It’s the first time J thinks about actually having a consequence to what he did. Cause Penny isn’t jumping at leaving with him. 
 

I can just tell you as a viewer watching when Penny pulls in the driveway it just didn’t seem like she was going to leave with him. It just didn’t feel like she wanted to go with the plan. Like she still felt like something was off. 
 

we go with the symbol of the eyes. J can’t look in the eyes of Craig and Deran as he’s going to fluck them over. 
 

Penny looks in his eyes she doesn’t need him to say he set them up. She already knows it. What a scene. 

Maybe the cash in the bag was the only cash he could get cause the account would be frozen maybe that cash was the get away money. Just in case. 

[Craigcodybazhate]

Please all of you give your scenarios I enjoy reading such a powerful episode great to unpack. 

[Craigcodybazhate]

But real talk they couldn’t have any more getaway rides??? Like where was the get away rides? I mean back up rides? Like they couldn’t get Vince and crew to leave some bikes? Or Derans bartender he fired? They couldn’t call anybody else? Ren’s guys who had her baby? Like the only call to make was J??? Even Billy. I just found that puzzling like nobody could’ve swooped them up. 

[Chaos Theory]

Wasn’t the opening scene of the pilot J sitting next to his dead over dosed mother?    So it is kinda fitting the closing scene of the finale is J sitting next to an empty chair.

His revenge gained him nothing.

[Raja]

2 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

For a finale, that had more loose ends than Cher's hair.  I'm sure glad the flashbacks spelled out in detail everything that was wrong with the family, because we sure didn't know this in the first five seasons.  

I would have been happy to see J drown in the pool and then Pope fire off the house, only to die beside the pool.  As it is, the US Marshals Service would pair up with Interpol for a worldwide manhunt because finding Penny's dead body there would be clue #1 about J.  Unless he had a strong plan for escape with false destinations and passports, his face would appear on airport cameras and he would be trackable.  Justice in this case might be to freeze all his millions of dollars and leave him destitute in whatever country he landed in.

With Craig being killed similar to Omar on The Wire that show brings me to San Diego County not wanting to have an open homicide and just putting Penny's murder on Pope. While it is possible that a wounded Andrew didn't clean the scene before setting the house on fire by everything shown about his OCD he wouldn't miss the evidence in the trash that J sloppily left.

Of course there is the greater conspiracy to get justice for the deputies killed in the jail break, but Deran and not J would have the arrest warrants out for him. But sitting at a resort without an extradition treaty, probably in Indonesia how long does $5 million USD last you? 

[sugarbaker design]

9 hours ago, MoeBird said:

The finale wasn't as bad as I thought it would be.  Having low expectations made it more enjoyable.  The acting was superb, especially Weary's (Deran) and Hatosy's (Pope).

Agreed.

8 hours ago, arachne said:

I don't understand how Deran can help Renn and Nick. He has no money that I'm aware of (J took it all) and wouldn't he be a fugitive now? I guess it's one of those eternal loose ends.

I make up my own loose ends.  Deran finds an overdosed Renn, he then takes her money and the baby, just like Smurf took a teen-age J, and flies to whatever country Adrian is in, and forms a new family.

6 hours ago, Craigcodybazhate said:

all the audience wanted the get back to let J drown but the selflessness of Pope was to let J live with the money

It wasn't selflessness that drove Pope to let J go, it was guilt.  

5 hours ago, Craigcodybazhate said:

Pope killed Catherine who he thought was a snitch. Who else did he kill that was innocent????? Who?????? Thugs criminals???

If killing his niece's mother wasn't enough, Pope also murdered Catherine's parents.  He burned their house down.  Smurf did order him to do it, but Pope isn't a loyal Irish setter, he's a human being with volition and agency.  He's been a monster for a while, looking for redemption.  I think he got it when he sacrificed himself so his little brothers could get away.  That was my favorite scene.

3 hours ago, anonymiss said:

J coming out the "winner" at the end, but at the cost of turning into a monster like Smurf herself (and OD'ing Penny like how his mom died) reminded me of the Conficious quote: "Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves.” J looked dead inside, despite being in paradise.

Absolutely.  I loved that tableau, J fully clothed, sitting, not laying on a pool chair, just staring, just existing.  This is J's hell.

[Whimsy]

3 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

I would have been happy to see J drown in the pool and then Pope fire off the house, only to die beside the pool.  As it is, the US Marshals Service would pair up with Interpol for a worldwide manhunt because finding Penny's dead body there would be clue #1 about J.  Unless he had a strong plan for escape with false destinations and passports, his face would appear on airport cameras and he would be trackable.  Justice in this case might be to freeze all his millions of dollars and leave him destitute in whatever country he landed in.

When Pope first started pulling J out, I thought he was going to let J live but leave him tied up to the chair so the cops could come and arrest J.  He'd be alive, but paying for his own crimes. 

They couldn't freeze his millions.  I guarantee he moved that to an off-shore account.  He probably DID get alternate identification, but the fact that he didn't even change his appearance means he didn't really care. 

6 hours ago, anonymiss said:

I respect they gave them endings they "deserved" instead of doing fan service and pandering like a lot of finales. But it was so not fun and of course not feel-good. What a depressing ending. Glad Pope saved J but he shouldn't have gotten to slide. Julia wasn't completely innocent, either, as a bratty kid. She didn't deserve that but a lot of kids are actually innocent and get abused. She once had everything and snotted off to her mom every chance she could get.

I don't think that's entirely fair.  I don't think she got what she did from Smurf because she was a brat.  She was a brat because of how she was raised.  She was trying to be her own person, make her own choices but Smurf was right there to force Julia to her will every time.  I think Julia WAS completely innocent.  Even if she was a habitual drug user, who could blame her with Smurf as a mother.  Smurf didn't care about Julia because she couldn't control Julia with her "womanly wiles" (a phrase I hate, but that was laid on thick the whole series). 

1 hour ago, WatcherUatl10 said:

I liked the bleached blonde look on Smurfette. She was already becoming Barkinesque. J was stupid to have hung around that long. For all his planning, he left too many possibilities unaccounted for. That said, I was sad at the end that J didn't see Renn or Deran reflected in his sunglasses, ready to take him out for his part in all of it.

I also thought J was stupid to stick around for so long, but he was trying to get away scott-free and not be a fugitive.  He thought he was smarter than everyone else and once the cops questioned him they would believe that he didn't have anything to do with it and he would be free to travel however he wanted. 

37 minutes ago, Raja said:

With Craig being killed similar to Omar on The Wire that show brings me to San Diego County not wanting to have an open homicide and just putting Penny's murder on Pope. While it is possible that a wounded Andrew didn't clean the scene before setting the house on fire by everything shown about his OCD he wouldn't miss the evidence in the trash that J sloppily left.

Of course there is the greater conspiracy to get justice for the deputies killed in the jail break, but Deran and not J would have the arrest warrants out for him. But sitting at a resort without an extradition treaty, probably in Indonesia how long does $5 million USD last you? 

Call me slow, but I didn't understand what all the cleaning up was about until I just read your comment.  J thought just picking up some bottles and trash with his uncle's fingerprints and throwing them in his own trash bin was enough to get rid of evidence?  bwaahahahhaha.  Idiot.   I also thought the money they were all splitting was so stupid low and they were all like "we'll never have to work again!"  Even the $5million, unless invested, isn't going to last J long.  And, as a fugitive it's not like he can invest it. 

17 minutes ago, sugarbaker design said:

Agreed.

I make up my own loose ends.  Deran finds an overdosed Renn, he then takes her money and the baby, just like Smurf took a teen-age J, and flies to whatever country Adrian is in, and forms a new family.

It wasn't selflessness that drove Pope to let J go, it was guilt.  

If killing his niece's mother wasn't enough, Pope also murdered Catherine's parents.  He burned their house down.  Smurf did order him to do it, but Pope isn't a loyal Irish setter, he's a human being with volition and agency.  He's been a monster for a while, looking for redemption.  I think he got it when he sacrificed himself so his little brothers could get away.  That was my favorite scene.

Absolutely.  I loved that tableau, J fully clothed, sitting, not laying on a pool chair, just staring, just existing.  This is J's hell.

I agree with both of the statements I bolded.  I really would like that for Deran.  Out of everyone in that messed up family, Deran was the most innocent.  He still made some very bad, very criminal, choices but he tried hard to get out.  He tried to make his bar a legit business.  He wanted to just live happily with Adrian.  He was the baby of the family and I feel he just got dragged along.  Again, I don't feel he was not responsible for a lot of the choices, but out of everyone that I would hope would get out and make an actual life for himself it was Deran. I wish we had seen where he had ended up, even though he said he was going to go to Renn and Nick. 

I also liked seeing J just sitting there, fully clothed by the pool and miserable.  He was so hellbent on revenge that he didn't think of the consequences in the end.  He hurt a LOT of innocent people along the way.  He doesn't deserve any happiness.  I hope he burns through all that money while sitting miserably and eventually just rots and dies.

[TooMuchRealityTV]

I had to suspend my disbelief a little to believe Pope would have made it out of that house in the desert with the cops outside alive. I mean Kevlar protects the chest, but not the head, legs.... But it wasn't a terrible finale. The J/Pope confrontation has been coming for awhile. It seemed fitting to see Pope come back to deal with J, but ultimately let him go. The flashbacks actually worked for this episode in that we see Pope's own feelings of responsibility for that happened to Julia and J. And of course burning down the house before he dies is a perfect ending to Pope's arc.

So I guess J's father really will remain a mystery. It seems Julia herself wasn't sure.

Craig was never going to be world's best family man, so I should have seen his proposal last week as sign they were killing him off. Still it was sad seeing Derran with him in the end. Those two were closer to each other than the other brothers. I imagine after losing Adrian and his brother Derran is going to be sad lonely man.

I was surprised J got away with everything. But I guess he'll never enjoy it, which is the trade-off.

[Raja]

17 minutes ago, Whimsy said:

I also thought J was stupid to stick around for so long, but he was trying to get away scott-free and not be a fugitive.  He thought he was smarter than everyone else and once the cops questioned him they would believe that he didn't have anything to do with it and he would be free to travel however he wanted. 

Call me slow, but I didn't understand what all the cleaning up was about until I just read your comment.  J thought just picking up some bottles and trash with his uncle's fingerprints and throwing them in his own trash bin was enough to get rid of evidence?  bwaahahahhaha.  Idiot.   I also thought the money they were all splitting was so stupid low and they were all like "we'll never have to work again!"  Even the $5million, unless invested, isn't going to last J long.  And, as a fugitive it's not like he can invest it. 

I agree with both of the statements I bolded.  I really would like that for Deran.  Out of everyone in that messed up family, Deran was the most innocent.  He still made some very bad, very criminal, choices but he tried hard to get out.  He tried to make his bar a legit business.  He wanted to just live happily with Adrian.  He was the baby of the family and I feel he just got dragged along.  Again, I don't feel he was not responsible for a lot of the choices, but out of everyone that I would hope would get out and make an actual life for himself it was Deran. I wish we had seen where he had ended up, even though he said he was going to go to Renn and Nick. 

I also liked seeing J just sitting there, fully clothed by the pool and miserable.  He was so hellbent on revenge that he didn't think of the consequences in the end.  He hurt a LOT of innocent people along the way.  He doesn't deserve any happiness.  I hope he burns through all that money while sitting miserably and eventually just rots and dies.

I guess J. just wanted to get past the initial fugitive search. That nobody set up to watch the Cody house afterwards was plot armor like Craig and Deran taking off the armored vest to do a quick convivence store robbery was plot armor in a different sense.

Wasn't Craig sending seed money to Ren in Thailand? Assuming Deran made it to Mexico and somehow got himself to Asia it would be Ren, assuming she didn't relapse, taking care of Uncle Deran, not the other way around. J. at least has money to spend and presumably is not taking a job away from a citizen so immigration, wherever he might be, might look the other way to his just staying. $5 million might not seem that much when talking about pro athletes and movie stars compensation but yearly that is about 40 years of working income for me.

In the end J walking away free does play like many a bad guy movie from decades past. And I didn't get my dream ending of Pope getting captured as I think he alone among the Cody's could survive prison life, again and perhaps get treatment.

[SassyCat]

I was glad to see J sitting there empty and alone with the lounge chair next to him in paradise not holding Penny who he planned to be there with. He was as bad as Smurf with his cold dead heart. I wish he remained at the bottom of that pool. He blamed people who were themselves, children under the thumb of Smurf who ruled over their every action in their controlled life. J knew that... he could see that as clear as day, yet he chose to continue to blame them for his and his mothers life because he was as greedy as Smurf and refused to let go of his hatred even after seeing the way she had them all completely under her twisted control. Smurf deserved her bullet to the head, while his uncles did not deserve what he did to them. 
Smurf dumping her very pregnant daughter on addict row was so very cruel. Julia had overcome her addiction physically while locked in the bathroom all those days and literally begged her mother for help in a rehab. What mother would do that to her offspring? She was not only heartless, she was sadistically cruel and unforgiving. A true monster. Her grandson J took after her more than her own children. 

Penny was a fool to accept that drink from someone she finally saw for who he really was. Especially since he now knew she was not on his side at all and refused to continue on with him. She saw what happened to people who were in the way of his greed. She knew she was a witness to it and therefore now, a liability to his future. She should have gotten into her car and drove away as soon as she realized she wasn't going to join him in his crime spree. He would have just killed her with his bare hands in the driveway if she tried though, I am sure. 

Craig said to Deran while he laid there dying to take the diamonds and use those to start a new life with Ren and Nick. So hopefully Deran did have enough to get a start in Thailand. I guess they had some diamonds stashed somewhere that J didn’t know about. Craig had them when he talked to Ren and asked her to marry him. All in all, a very sad ending. 
 I hope J’s boring ass never finds true love and contentment in his lonely empty life. 
I’ll be sad not to see the two hunks Craig and Deran are, on my screen anymore (on this show).  That’s the saddest part. 

[Raja]

The problem of Smurf being brought to J's justice was at that moment she was trying to commit suicide by her baby Andrew instead of whatever pain Mother Nature had in store for her with the cancer.

[iMonrey]

Well that was sad. Some excellent acting all around, and interesting that the same two Cody boys who survived in the movie survived in the TV series. I don't like Deran's chances though, he has no money and he's a fugitive for life. I appreciated the bookend of J sitting there all alone, the same way the show started. 

Does anyone else think that Penny was supposed to be a substitute for J's mother? She bore a superficial resemblance to Julia, and it occurs to me that maybe J saw her as someone he could save, as opposed to his mother who he failed to save. And when that became impossible he had to put her down just like he did to his mother. 

The flashbacks really drove home Pope's motivation for saving J, but it's still a shame we had to endure so much of them these past three seasons because ultimately they just robbed us of time spent with the grown Cody boys. I think the show did a good job bringing us full circle at the end, but the Leila George vanity project really marred these last three seasons, if not ruined them altogether.

[Chaos Theory]

In a way they all did get what they wanted and not what they deserved.

J got his revenge but now sits alone dead in paradise.

Pope got redemption for the only sin that really matters to him.  His original sin of abandoning Julia.  Yes you can make the argument that he was a mentally Ill kid who didn’t really have a choice either and that Smurf wasn’t actually going to let him go but it is a fun argument to make on what might have happened if he had gone with Julia.   Could he have kept her clean?  Would Julia have been able to keep Pope from his darker impulses?  

Craig got to protect his son  and keep him away from Smurf and the family business.  He has a chance at a normal life even with a drug dealer for a mother because he has…,.

Deran who has always wanted out of the life.  He gets to finally and completely walk away with no guilt.  And only one promise to keep.

Edited August 29, 2022 by Chaos Theory

[Jazzy24]

I stopped watching this show years ago but kinda kept up with it. 
 

It makes me sad about the ending all the characters got. When I first started watching J was my favorite character. I wanted better for him. I even liked the brothers and Baz(a little bit)

But I don’t like this ending at all. Ugh… 

[cinsbythesea]

Halfway through the finale I was wishing they could dig up Smurf and kill her all over again.  What an awful human being she was.   As much as I loved Pope - I think the only way this could have ended was him dying - and hopefully in death he finally got the peace he never had in life, thanks to his mother (and I use that term loosely).   It was heartbreaking to see Craig die in Deran's arms but those two were so close that it was only right that Deran was with him till the end.   Deran has now lost the two people in the world who meant the most to him - it would be great if they did a reunion show down the line so we could see how Deran has fared - and hopefully for Deran to give J what he so richly deserves.  As for J - I hope he's miserable and alone for the rest of his days because that's what he deserves.  The ending shot of him all alone in a beautiful location was perfect.  I hope he has Groundhog Days that find him alone like that every single day.  At some point, even a coldhearted person like J has to ask himself was it worth the $$.

I'm going to miss Animal Kingdom and the Cody boys.  Great series, great cast.  Thanks for six years of entertainment!

Edited August 29, 2022 by cinsbythesea

[Laurie4H]

Judging by J’s reaction after he poisoned Penny it seemed like he really did love her.  I don’t think she would have said anything.  
I don’t feel J or any of the Cody men were complete sociopaths.  That’s why I feel the show and characters were interesting.  

[Dowel Jones]

13 hours ago, Bulldog said:

That gas can must have held a lot more fuel than it appeared that it did. 

It was probably that special TV gasoline that blows up in the tank and lifts a car 20' in the air after a simple car crash.

3 hours ago, TooMuchRealityTV said:

I had to suspend my disbelief a little to believe Pope would have made it out of that house in the desert with the cops outside alive. I mean Kevlar protects the chest, but not the head, legs....

The general incompetence of the various LE agencies has been a hallmark of this show.

1 hour ago, Raja said:

The problem of Smurf being brought to J's justice...

It wasn't clear to me until this episode that he killed her out of revenge rather than necessity.

[Crashcourse]

I thought it was a decent finale.  Loved Pope burning the house down.

Yes, J looked sad and lonely, but I still think he's a creepy little bastard.  I hope he's seen spending money, and he gets robbed and murdered in his hotel room.  

I just wish they'd added another 15 minutes to show if Deran made it out alive, and if he's with Adrian and/or Renn and Nick.    

[Lone Wolf]

3 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

12 hours ago, arachne said:

I don't understand how Deran can help Renn and Nick. He has no money that I'm aware of (J took it all) and wouldn't he be a fugitive now? I guess it's one of those eternal loose ends.

I make up my own loose ends.  Deran finds an overdosed Renn, he then takes her money and the baby, just like Smurf took a teen-age J, and flies to whatever country Adrian is in, and forms a new family.

I had exactly the same thought as @Arachne, but I chalked it up to Deran just saying something to make Craig feel better.  That said, maybe in that moment he meant it, but I think realistically it might not be as simple as he made it sound.

13 hours ago, Bulldog said:

That gas can must have held a lot more fuel than it appeared that it did. 

I thought that when he was able to randomly splash it from one end of the house to another without it running out; forget about how quickly and ferociously the house went up.

13 hours ago, MoeBird said:

I couldn't get past Smurf's hair, though.  Dark roots were definitely NOT in style back then.  There is no way a fashionista, like Smurf, would have ever let her roots grow out like that.  How hard would it have been for wardrobe to get Smurf's hairstyle straight?  Certainly, any woman on the set over the age of 40 should've known better.

This is a good point.  I think the writers felt the need to move her along the path of evolving into the Smurf that we saw in the first seasons.  I noticed that she started cleaning up (clothes and makeup) pretty much from the time that they moved into that house, and short of cutting her hair there wasn't much left to complete her metamorphosis.

Not for nothin', but when Young Pope took the sandwich in to Julia he didn't bring her anything to drink.  I realize she was in the depths of withdraw or whatever but what was she supposed to do, slurp water out of the bathroom faucet?

Not gonna miss this show at all.  As I've said, it was fun to snark on but I didn't really like any of the characters.

[Joimiaroxeu]

What an odd way to rescue Pope. He could easily have been killed when the bus flipped over, not to mention the other prisoner who wanted to kill him.

What was up with Smurf's platinum blonde hair all of a sudden? Trying to make her look more like Ellen Barkin's Smurf? Meh. (BTW, there's a farewell video on Twitter from the cast and there is a brief shot of Ellen. Better than no recognition of all, I guess.)

TMW the Codys realized J had fcuked them over but good.

Heh, Penny was the worst liar under pressure.

I wonder if J had always been planning to kill Penny or if he only decided to do it after she said she wouldn't go with him? Either way, it was pretty naive of her to take a drink from him. She should've left immediately.

Come on, how did Pope manage to kill two cars of cops on his own? While actively  bleeding?

Young Pope never stood a chance. Smurf messed him up completely. And Smurf was just going to let her impending grandchild die or be born an addict while she groomed Craig and Deran for the life of crime. At least karma eventually came for her.

I didn't feel sorry for Deran but it had to be rough knowing Craig was dead, Pope was likely dead too or recaptured, and J was in the wind with all the fruits of their criminal labor.

The ending wasn't really satisfying for me. The season was full of red herrings and plot points that didn't pay off. Craig and Deran didn't even know why J sold them out, except to assume it was just for the $5M.

Oh well, it's been real, fellow Animal Kingdom watchers.

[Craigcodybazhate]

All some great comments on the show. I just feel like it’s so ironic that smurf was always talking about family and look how she treated Julia?

This season I didn’t know how ruthless Smurf was. It really puts it into perspective in those flashbacks.  
 

I like taking a deep dive into this show. I think last season was showing why smurf did what she did. 
 

And maybe somebody can talk about this more. Mo Bird I’m looking at you. Lol. 
 

in the flashbacks last season Smurf looked like a caring mother. I wouldn’t say good mother but caring mother. Smurf was always like I’ll do anything to protect my babies. Where are my babies? She was moma bear. I point to the guy she takes Oceanside from. When he kidnaps Julia and Pope because of smurf not paying him. We see smurf go ape shlit. Doing whatever to get her kids. Killing the man. We see her motivations with Pam. Being a woman you gotta be hard. We see how she reacts to bank robber who has the gambling problem when he wasn’t watching the kids. So it’s like Smurf wants money but she’s doing good. She takes in Baz from his stripper mom. Doesn’t kill her after she told Oceanside guy about the plan to take over his operation. 
 

Then this season we see the monster of Smurf and that all goes out the window. She now could care less about her kids Julia and Pope. Cause if she cared about Pope she would let her son deal with his mental health and let him get help. He was on the right path at church at the youth group actually talking about his thoughts she took that away from him. Skateboarding that he enjoyed she took that away from him. 
 

It was fitting when he got so excited to go to the movies with Julia and Baz. Something that would be ordinary to you and me any kid then. That was so happy for him. Then she goes help me count money. Any type of kid childhood Pope was seeking was taken away by Smurf she didn’t allow him that. He didn’t want the hookers cause he still wanted to be a child. 
 

as for Julia she just threw her to the wolves but I think it started at that department store when she gave her the car. Julia wanted to do it normal teen job college Sats and flucked up as this is smurf with her money could’ve sent her to college San Diego state nice job and she would’ve been fine. But Smurf wanted her kids with her. 
 

When you see where Smurf came from that’s what she wanted but when Julia wanted her own thing she couldn’t handle it. So she drove her out. That Smurf self hate. 

Edited August 29, 2022 by Craigcodybazhate

[Craigcodybazhate]

Smurf’s last season she tried to have her redemption Billy coming back. And she had her moments with Pope but we saw who she really was. We saw how she lied about how highly she spoke about Julia it was all a facade. 
 

and we can talk about Catherine all we want but watch that season Pope was smitten with her all over her just like Julia and when Smurf sees that she pounces. Pope needed that structure to function and she couldn’t let that happen. 
 

I see Pope as a guy who was doing all he could to protect his family. His loyalty was to his mother Smurf he was confused locking Julia in the bathroom I thought let her go!!! But he was trying to get her to kick drugs he cared and why let her go out and get high again??? I thought the writers were clever having Pope tie up J hold him at the house like he did Julia but he let J go. 
 

but more of the show is starting to make sense when you look at it. 
 

I think Js punishment was him looking at Pope what he did to them. He didn’t want to have him look him in the eye. But Pope saying yeah I’m in control you did this. No heat. Your gonna take this with you. 
 

Pope having empathy for dead Penny. No well this chick did just swipe all her money. It was to J why????? Why disappointment me. Like why her???? You just kill her???? 
 

and it’s been talked about Popes justified kills but he said it right there Pennys innocent why J? All the season these two have been at it Pope telling J to get rid of her. I thought one of the best parts of the season was Pope asking J for advice on his date with Amy. Pope looked so happy there. 
 

it was like the first time those two could share in innocent bro advice and company of each other. 
 

Very fitting that those two would have that face off. Just as I stated. But this whole season was about Pope doing it different even the snitch at the skatepark. 
 

the cop in the motel room. And J at the pool. Pope had to tell J Penny wasn’t right. That ones on you. That’s not about smurf. 

16 minutes ago, Craigcodybazhate said:

All some great comments on the show. I just feel like it’s so ironic that smurf was always talking about family and look how she treated Julia?

This season I didn’t know how ruthless Smurf was. It really puts it into perspective in those flashbacks.  
 

I like taking a deep dive into this show. I think last season was showing why smurf did what she did. 
 

And maybe somebody can talk about this more. Mo Bird I’m looking at you. Lol. 
 

in the flashbacks last season Smurf looked like a caring mother. I wouldn’t say good mother but caring mother. Smurf was always like I’ll do anything to protect my babies. Where are my babies? She was moma bear. I point to the guy she takes Oceanside from. When he kidnaps Julia and Pope because of smurf not paying him. We see smurf go ape shlit. Doing whatever to get her kids. Killing the man. We see her motivations with Pam. Being a woman you gotta be hard. We see how she reacts to bank robber who has the gambling problem when he wasn’t watching the kids. So it’s like Smurf wants money but she’s doing good. She takes in Baz from his stripper mom. Doesn’t kill her after she told Oceanside guy about the plan to take over his operation. 
 

Then this season we see the monster of Smurf and that all goes out the window. She now could care less about her kids Julia and Pope. Cause if she cared about Pope she would let her son deal with his mental health and let him get help. He was on the right path at church at the youth group actually talking about his thoughts she took that away from him. Skateboarding that he enjoyed she took that away from him. 
 

It was fitting when he got so excited to go to the movies with Julia and Baz. Something that would be ordinary to you and me any kid then. That was so happy for him. Then she goes help me count money. Any type of kid childhood Pope was seeking was taken away by Smurf she didn’t allow him that. He didn’t want the hookers cause he still wanted to be a child. 
 

as for Julia she just threw her to the wolves but I think it started at that department store when she gave her the car. Julia wanted to do it normal teen job college Sats and flucked up as this is smurf with her money could’ve sent her to college San Diego state nice job and she would’ve been fine. But Smurf wanted her kids with her. 
 

When you see where Smurf came from that’s what she wanted but when Julia wanted her own thing she couldn’t handle it. So she drove her out. That Smurf self hate. 

Edited August 29, 2022 by Craigcodybazhate

[Craigcodybazhate]

8 minutes ago, Craigcodybazhate said:

Smurf’s last season she tried to have her redemption Billy coming back. And she had her moments with Pope but we saw who she really was. We saw how she lied about how highly she spoke about Julia it was all a facade. 
 

and we can talk about Catherine all we want but watch that season Pope was smitten with her all over her just like Julia and when Smurf sees that she pounces. Pope needed that structure to function and she couldn’t let that happen. 
 

I see Pope as a guy who was doing all he could to protect his family. His loyalty was to his mother Smurf he was confused locking Julia in the bathroom I thought let her go!!! But he was trying to get her to kick drugs he cared and why let her go out and get high again??? I thought the writers were clever having Pope tie up J hold him at the house like he did Julia but he let J go. 
 

but more of the show is starting to make sense when you look at it. 
 

I think Js punishment was him looking at Pope what he did to them. He didn’t want to have him look him in the eye. But Pope saying yeah I’m in control you did this. No heat. Your gonna take this with you. 
 

Pope having empathy for dead Penny. No well this chick did just swipe all the money. It was to J why????? Why disappointment me. Like why her???? You just kill her???? 
 

and it’s been talked about Popes justified kills but he said it right there Pennys innocent why J? All the season these two have been at it Pope telling J to get rid of her. I thought one of the best parts of the season was Pope asking J for advice on his date with Amy. Pope looked so happy there. 
 

it was like the first time those two could share in innocent bro advice and company of each other. 
 

Very fitting that those two would have that face off. Just as I stated. But this whole season was about Pope doing it different even the snitch at the skatepark. 
 

the cop in the motel room. And J at the pool. Pope had to tell J Penny wasn’t right. That ones on you. That’s not about smurf. 

[iMonrey]

Quote

Deran who has always wanted out of the life.  He gets to finally and completely walk away with no guilt.  And only one promise to keep.

I agree with the post upthread that Deran was probably just saying what he knew Craig needed to hear. He's got no way of getting to Singapore much less anywhere else. It bugs me that we don't know what will become of him, but they sort of left that up in the air in the movie too.

It occurred to me he might be able to just go back to his bar and pretend that he had nothing to do with the prison break, but they probably recognized him when he and Craig took off on the motorcycle. 

I did find it hard to believe the cops weren't surrounding the Cody house the minute the jailbreak took place though.

Quote

I couldn't get past Smurf's hair, though.  Dark roots were definitely NOT in style back then. 

I think it was just a way to shorthand the time jump, they needed her to look different some way. (Notice young Baz finally got Scott Speedman hair.) Julia wouldn't have been pregnant until around 1998 or 1999, and we haven't really seen enough of little Deran and little Craig to immediately recognize they were bigger. That said, since they gave little Craig a line, they might have done a better job finding a kid who looked more like Ben Robson. 

[sugarbaker design]

Since they started the Smurf flashbacks, I always thought we'd get the scene of Smurf getting that tattoo that's featured in the opening credit sequence.  Guess not!

[Lone Wolf]

3 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

What was up with Smurf's platinum blonde hair all of a sudden? Trying to make her look more like Ellen Barkin's Smurf? Meh.

To go full Barkin they'd have had to make with the Botox and lip injections. I used to get a lot of snark-mileage out of how frozen her face was and how she could barely wrap those fish labia around the mouth of a beer bottle. 

[iMonrey]

Nice series wrap-up video:

I never get used to hearing Ben Robson and Finn Cole speak with British accents.

At least the flashbacks were informative to this episode. It opened with Julia and that boy hopping over the fence; later, we see Pope hop that exact same section of fence when he's coming for J. The Cody compound is pretty secure, they've got a gate and a camera, this must be one weak spot only the Cody family knows about.

I also appreciated the way the scene cut back and forth between young Pope agonizing about leaving Julia and present day Pope agonizing over letting J drown. 

The thing is, that's not the last they ever saw of Julia. We know from the pilot that J met his uncles at least once when he was little. So at some point Julia was back in their lives, but we'll never know the whole story on that.

[Craigcodybazhate]

Yes good point 

it was Pope deciding the fate of Julia all over again. J is Julia’s son that’s Julia “J” the whole scene in the car I’m going to name him Josh. 
 

that’s Popes mind going back and forth. The car deciding to go with Julia come with me Pope her begging him. Him getting out the car as he’s going to go with her standing thinking about it and then deciding to go with Smurf 

Back to present day Him going back and forth looking at J thinking revenge let him drown. That’s smurf and thinking pull him out the water that’s Julia. Before he chose Smurf today present day he chose Julia. So the writing is brilliant it makes sense when you think of it. 
 

first thought is your thinking is that’s not Justice wait let him drown and then you watch it and you think wait that’s for Julia Pope actually accepting her and helping her her son. She was pregnant J was there when she got out the car and forced in the drug den. 
 

so Pope telling J this time I got you. I’ll pick you up I won’t let you fall. 
 

J just should’ve let Penny go. But Penny chose her fate when she made that wire transfer. 

[Triviatrish2]

22 hours ago, MoeBird said:

It was pointed out at the end of last week's discussion (too late to respond) that I was mistaken about Craig not killing anyone.  I completely forgot that he killed the men who kidnapped Nick.  But, to quote Arnold Schwarzenegger from True Lies, "they were all bad." 

Still, I agree, Craig will be killed.  If the character took a life, their life will be taken in the finale. 

Where I have to respectfully disagree with you, is that the series has been "similar" to the movie, "just changing a few things around."  In the movie, J is a good kid trapped by a wicked family.  Smurf's even alive at the end of the movie, and not nearly as sinister as she's portrayed in the series.

In the movie, Pope is the out-of-control psychopath.  In the series, J is the evil, diabolical and cunning psychopath who is willing to take the life of any human being, innocent or otherwise, who gets in the way of destroying his entire family ... for greed. 

I completely agree with you about the difference between the movie and the TV series.  Movie Pope was a horrible, horrible person, and Janine was no where near as bad as tv Smurf. J didn't go into that family with the same plan as tv J.  Also, it seemed to me that J may have been strangling Janine, in the last scene to the movie, she was hugging him, and her arms started to fall.  Maybe, I just read too much into it.  Also, Am I right, that Deran is the only Cody that never committed a murder?

[sugarbaker design]

I forgot to mention when Pope commandeered the car from the stunt guy in the commercial!