S01.E06: The Sound of Her Wings

[Meredith Quill]

Quote

Feeling a bit rudderless, Morpheus shadows his hard-working big sister, who offers him advice and encourages him to reconnect with an old acquaintance.

[PurpleTentacle]

When Death told Franklin that she'd see him again soon, I said out loud "Aw, poor Franklin." I'm not sure if we were supposed to know that she was death at that point, but come on, she was wearing an Ankh.

The story with Dream's friend was sweet. Hopefully they can see each other a bit more often than every 100 years from now on, but maybe for an Endless that is like every weekend for us.

So Desire was behind Dream's imprisonment? After half the season is done we are getting something like an actual plot. 😆

Very enjoyable episode overall.

Questions: Shouldn't Dream have seen his sister when Constantine's girlfriend died? He next to her afterall.

Death said that she knew that the people who captured Dream where trying to capture her. How does she know and when did she find out? Why didn*t Dream ask?

Also has Dream just forgotten about the Nightmare still walking around. I guess he hasn't interacted with him for a hundred years and might have forgotten. Then again, that doesn't seem to be that much time for him and wouldn't his assistent have told him, that he showed up in Dreamland? You'd think he wouldn't be so aimless at the beginning of the episode if he still had that job to do.

[starri]

I'm impressed that they melded two issues of the comic that are very tonally different into an episode that was so cohesive.  I was a bit close to tears at certain points during the first half, particularly the bit with the baby.  

[Affogato]

23 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

When Death told Franklin that she'd see him again soon, I said out loud "Aw, poor Franklin." I'm not sure if we were supposed to know that she was death at that point, but come on, she was wearing an Ankh.

The story with Dream's friend was sweet. Hopefully they can see each other a bit more often than every 100 years from now on, but maybe for an Endless that is like every weekend for us.

So Desire was behind Dream's imprisonment? After half the season is done we are getting something like an actual plot. 😆

Very enjoyable episode overall.

Questions: Shouldn't Dream have seen his sister when Constantine's girlfriend died? He next to her afterall.

Death said that she knew that the people who captured Dream where trying to capture her. How does she know and when did she find out? Why didn*t Dream ask?

Also has Dream just forgotten about the Nightmare still walking around. I guess he hasn't interacted with him for a hundred years and might have forgotten. Then again, that doesn't seem to be that much time for him and wouldn't his assistent have told him, that he showed up in Dreamland? You'd think he wouldn't be so aimless at the beginning of the episode if he still had that job to do.

In the comic she is left in a final dream. Either way, though, you can wank that dream was taking care of the work, for once.

[Fukui San]

Some people care about spoilers and seeing things in the right order. And some people, like me, skip right to what I know will be my favorite one. Dessert first. You never know when Death will give you a visit.

Back in college, I showed my non-comics girlfriend two issues of Sandman to sample. I choose the two exact issues which comprise this episode. I thought they showed the breathtaking scope and point of view and potential of the comic as the most effective selling point in a standalone manner. My girlfriend's reaction was "This is OK, but not for me." Fair enough. The relationship did not last.

Purple Tentacle, you should know that this is being pretty faithful to the original comic, which means that plot, as it comes, will come meandering and sideways and random. 

Quite impressed by the adaptation of this property that I always assumed was unfilmable. Here's to proving me wrong.

[MissL]

The fact that Dream seems to genuinely care for his sister adds another layer to his refusal to make a deal with Burgess. Not only does he not want to talk to the mortal who imprisoned him no way is he giving up a beloved sibling to that puny human. 
 

Made me like him a bit more when he comes across as a whiny brother in a foul mood trying to get his sister to feel sorry for him.

[paramitch]

I've found the first half of this season oddly detached, a little showy, and often cold. Especially the last episode, which I felt was a perfect, cruel little horror story. But it ultimately felt shallow to me.

Not this one. Oh, man. Just gorgeous. This was stunning. Complex, compassionate, thoughtful. A beautiful balance of kind Death & endless hunger for life.

The journey of Death and her sweet, warm handling of each person's moment, life, awareness, and loss was so moving. I will never get over the baby. "Sorry. This is all you got." And yet she made it all okay. And I loved her instantly believable, familial relationship with Dream. You instantly saw why he remained silent for a century, why he protected her forever. Of course he would -- Death is the best person in the universe. And Kirby Howell-Baptiste was superb and so warm in the role.

And the way it ultimately ended with the scales deeply tilted toward life, and friendship, was so moving to me.

I know these stories are separate in the comic(s), but the juxtaposition I thought was really brilliant here. On the one hand, Death. Which is necessary (and how lovely and warm was his sister?). On the other hand, life. And this one man who wanted to live so very much -- and I loved that he wasn't a good man, and frequently made privileged, even cruel choices. As mankind did (and does).

But in the end his friendship with Dream, I felt, redeemed him, softened him. I loved their final meeting, both admitting after all the centuries, "We are friends."

It's my favorite episode so far, for so many reasons. I watched it twice ASAP.

Edited August 8, 2022 by paramitch

[millennium]

56 minutes ago, paramitch said:

I've found the first half of this season oddly detached, a little showy, and often cold. Especially the last episode, which I felt was a perfect, cruel little horror story. But it ultimately felt shallow to me.

Not this one. Oh, man. Just gorgeous. This was stunning. Complex, compassionate, thoughtful. A beautiful balance of kind Death & endless hunger for life.

The journey of Death and her sweet, warm handling of each person's moment, life, awareness, and loss was so moving. I will never get over the baby. "Sorry. This is all you got." And yet she made it all okay. And I loved her instantly believable, familial relationship with Dream. You instantly saw why he remained silent for a century, why he protected her forever. Of course he would -- Death is the best person in the universe. And Kirby Howell-Baptiste was superb and so warm in the role.

And the way it ultimately ended with the scales deeply tilted toward life, and friendship, was so moving to me.

I know these stories are separate in the comic(s), but the juxtaposition I thought was really brilliant here. On the one hand, Death. Which is necessary (and how lovely and warm was his sister?). On the other hand, life. And this one man who wanted to live so very much -- and I loved that he wasn't a good man, and frequently made privileged, even cruel choices. As mankind did (and does).

But in the end his friendship with Dream, I felt, redeemed him, softened him. I loved their final meeting, both admitting after all the centuries, "We are friends."

It's my favorite episode so far, for so many reasons. I watched it twice ASAP.

I can't improve on ^ so I will merely say ditto. 

Dream had a quality in this episode that reminded me of The Little Prince, visiting planets and observing the ways of men, learning as he goes.

As an English major who was compelled by my professor to memorize and recite the first eighteen lines of the Canterbury Tales in Middle English as a course requirement, I was amused to see Geoffrey Chaucer defending his interest in bawdy tales told in taverns.

[rhiamon]

12 hours ago, paramitch said:

I've found the first half of this season oddly detached, a little showy, and often cold. Especially the last episode, which I felt was a perfect, cruel little horror story. But it ultimately felt shallow to me.

Not this one. Oh, man. Just gorgeous. This was stunning. Complex, compassionate, thoughtful. A beautiful balance of kind Death & endless hunger for life.

Yes. This was the episode that really made me realise how really into this show I actually had become.

Not to say I didn't like the previous episodes but they didn't grab me instantly. The very beginning was interesting, while somewhat confusing, and I struggled a bit with how fast  everything seemed to be moving with the Roderick, Alex, Ethel and John part of the story - but now it all started to make sense for me. I'm completely without Sandman history so didn't know what to expect beyond some genre TV. The dreamlike tonal changes are really working for me at this point.

[paramitch]

14 hours ago, millennium said:

Dream had a quality in this episode that reminded me of The Little Prince, visiting planets and observing the ways of men, learning as he goes.

As an English major who was compelled by my professor to memorize and recite the first eighteen lines of the Canterbury Tales in Middle English as a course requirement, I was amused to see Geoffrey Chaucer defending his interest in bawdy tales told in taverns.

That is a beautiful way to describe Dream here -- like the Little Prince! That's perfect. There was an innocence and openness to Dream in this episode -- presumably because he was with someone he genuinely loved -- that he has previously not shown us before. I really loved that.

Oh, I loved all the literary in-jokes too! Chaucer, Marlowe, and Shakespeare! So much fun.

2 hours ago, rhiamon said:

Yes. This was the episode that really made me realise how really into this show I actually had become.

Not to say I didn't like the previous episodes but they didn't grab me instantly. The very beginning was interesting, while somewhat confusing, and I struggled a bit with how fast  everything seemed to be moving with the Roderick, Alex, Ethel and John part of the story - but now it all started to make sense for me. I'm completely without Sandman history so didn't know what to expect beyond some genre TV. The dreamlike tonal changes are really working for me at this point.

Me too -- it helps that we are meeting people that I find it easier to care about. It's an interesting progression. 

[Sbeetle]

21 hours ago, millennium said:

As an English major who was compelled by my professor to memorize and recite the first eighteen lines of the Canterbury Tales in Middle English as a course requirement,

I had to do this in my junior year in high school for English Lit! I think I can still recite the first 4 lines. 
 

Anyway, I like that Death is shown as the opposite of what tales like Dickens show us. Of course you need a comforting and kind face when it’s your time. Brilliant. 

[millennium]

27 minutes ago, Sbeetle said:

had to do this in my junior year in high school for English Lit! I think I can still recite the first 4 lines. 
 

I can remember only two:

Whan that Aprille with his showers soote

The droghte of March hath perced to the roote

It was an entire course on The Canterbury Tales.   You know, I had friends who majored in finance, pre-med, etc.  They may own expensive cars and beautiful houses today, but you can bet the Chaucer reference in this episode went right over their heads.

Who's laughing now, eh?  😂

[bilgistic]

I had to memorize it in 12th-grade honors English, and I went on to get an English degree. I just made it through eight lines in my head. I'm currently unemployed as of eight weeks yesterday.🙃

What a useful skill, indeed.

[Zuleikha]

I was nervous about this episode because the reviews have been so great, but it lived up to them. 

Kirby Howell-Baptiste's Death was different than I envisioned graphic novel Death. I pictured Death as sunny or even bubbly. Here she was warm and grounded. But I thought it worked very well. She definitely came across as the perfect steadying presence to guide people post death. I am still salty about the lack of goth makeup, though. Death's iconic look isn't just about aesthetics... part of Death's character is the contrast with that punky 80s goth and the personality.

I've previously seen the actress in the Good Place, and there's something so fun about seeing an actor be such a different character. I'm looking forward to seeing Mason Alexander Park tackle Desire after seeing Park play Gren in Cowboy Bebop. We had such a brief glimpse in this episode but so far, so perfect. 

The actor who played Hob Gadling was so good that I had to find out who he is... only to find out that he's basically acting royalty! 
 

Edited August 10, 2022 by Zuleikha

[thuganomics85]

As soon as I saw that this was the highest rated episode on IMDB, I figured it was going to be one to remember and it certainly lived up to that expectation!  I could tell that the story was probably taken from two different comics, but I thought they actually did an excellent job at making it feel natural to have these two stories told together and blending them together really worked.

Always great seeing Kirby Howell-Baptiste and I think her version of Death might be one of my favorites out there.  I loved how her Death had a warmth to her that you normally don't see and how she actually cared about the people whose lives she had to take and wanted them to have at least see one friendly face before their time was up.  It was refreshing to see and I like this kind of take (while not quite the same, a somewhat close comparison for me might be Julian Richings version on Supernatural, who was colder, but approached it as more of a business transaction instead of just being evil and enjoying it.)  I also liked the focus on her relationship with Morpheus and see that they seem to have a bond that is different from the rest of the siblings.  You can definitely see why he never even considered using her to be released, because he cares for her in ways that he doesn't with others.

I had a feeling that I knew how the deaths were going to play out, but it still got me misty-eyed.  From easing us in with the older man which was sad but once can easily tell themselves that "he had a long life, at least", and then going all in with the young man who just got married, poor Franklin, and, yep, that poor, poor baby.  Death's job is not an easy one, but I'm glad she is doing what she can to make it better.

And then came the stuff with Hob: an immortal that Morpheus meets with every one hundred years to see if he is ready to finally die.  At first, it was just fun watching everything change each century (especially Sandman's hair!), but I was surprised how much I ended up enjoying the duo, rooting for them, and the satisfaction of hearing Morpheus finally call him a friend.  Hell, he even smiled!!  Wasn't not expecting to get as emotional as I did.  The actor playing Hob did a great job and I see that he is totally Sir Ben Kingsley's son!

The Johanna Constantine appearance was fun!

So, it looks like the mysterious individual from last episode was none other than Desire, who is responsible for Morpheus' capture.  Hmm, I wonder what is going on with that?

Excellent episode!

[Black Knight]

6 hours ago, Zuleikha said:

Kirby Howell-Baptiste's Death was different than I envisioned graphic novel Death. I pictured Death as sunny or even bubbly. Here she was warm and grounded. But I thought it worked very well. She definitely came across as the perfect steadying presence to guide people post death. I am still salty about the lack of goth makeup, though. Death's iconic look isn't just about aesthetics... part of Death's character is the contrast with that punky 80s goth and the personality.

Death is all those things - sunny and bubbly and warm and grounded.

It's important to remember that while Death was and is embraced by the goth community, she was not intentionally conceived as goth. She does happen to fit the goth archetype of "perky and sensible," along with her brother who fits the other goth archetype of "lonely and brooding." But, as someone who isn't actually goth, she's not always going to fit perfectly in that box. She's other things too. As is Dream.

[Zuleikha]

2 hours ago, Black Knight said:

It's important to remember that while Death was and is embraced by the goth community, she was not intentionally conceived as goth.

Death's visual look was consistently goth, and her personality has always been sunny. Per an interview I read back in the day, her look was inspired by a waitress that Gaiman met.

There is no reason wardrobe for the show couldn't have styled Kirby Baptiste-Howell to look obviously goth. It was a choice, and one that I think was a bad one. 

[Bruinsfan]

This was by far the best episode so far imho. Not a surprise given the source material, but I'm really glad the adaptation knocked it out of the park.

On 8/5/2022 at 12:02 PM, PurpleTentacle said:

Death said that she knew that the people who captured Dream where trying to capture her. How does she know and when did she find out?

Just a bit of speculation (I don't recall if the issue is ever touched on in the comics), but Roderick Burgess and likely all the other people involved in the summoning attempt died quite some time ago. Even if they didn't volunteer the information upon meeting Death, she seems to know quite a bit about the people she collects.

[Chicago Redshirt]

One of the things that the TV series has raised in my mind: 

Why did Dream's family not come to his rescue? Or Dream's subjects, other than poor Jessamy?

With the benefit of knowing about the Endless from the graphic novel, I think I have my answer there. 

But with the Corinthian having figured out where to find him almost immediately after Dream was captured, with Jessamy having tracked down Dream back in the 1920s ish time frame, and with all the people involved in his capture having dreams (at least some of which should leave clues as to where Dream was and what they'd done to him), it seems like there should have been more rescue efforts over the course of a century.

[Anela]

This was my favourite episode, so far.  I haven’t read the comics, but I like Neil Gaiman.  This reminded me a bit of one of my favourite shows (Dead Like Me), and the friendship building between the two men. That ending made me smile. :)

[HelloooKitty]

This was a beautiful and haunting episode. 

[tennisgurl]

I have been really looking forward to this one, combining two of my favorite comic chapters, and as I am currently looking around trying to remember where I left the tissues, it absolutely lived up to my expectations. Combining a story about Death going about her business and a man who chooses life for centuries is a great way to explore the themes of the importance of both life and death. Death is probably the most famous character to come out of Sandman, and Kirby Howell-Baptiste did an amazing job portraying her warmth, compassion, and empathy towards every human she guides into the next world. I have loved this whole show so far and I so impressed by its faithfulness to the comic, but this one really took my breath away. It was a haunting, poignant, and a beautiful meditation on the bittersweet nature of living and dying, finding the wonder in both.

Death's gentle warmth as she goes about her day was so moving, both heartbreaking and heartwarming. Everyone from the elderly musician to the baby in their crib, everyone gets someone to smile, hold their hand, and tell them that its alright, they aren't alone. Poor Franklin, I knew as soon as Death said his name before he introduced himself that he was on her list. I think the baby and the guy on his honeymoon got me the most, they were all so sad but with a gentleness to it, especially with the quiet sound of wings as Death takes them to their next stop. I loved her talk to Dream about how her job is hard, but its an important job, one where she gets to comfort people when they most need it, and its not like she's on her own. 

Like I said, I love the symmetry of combining our first meeting with Death and the story of Hob, it really was a brilliant idea to put those stories together. I adore that they took the typical "man cursed with immortality begs to end his existence" trope that you see so often in fantasy and turns it around. Even when things are bad, he wants to keep going to see what's in store next, life is an amazing ride that he doesn't want to ever get off of. Sometimes things are good, sometimes they're bad, sometimes you make terrible mistakes, sometimes you learn to be better, you learn new things, you forget them, you take the good and the bad because life is worth it. 

This episode did a lot to humanize (for lack of a better term) Dream. He clearly loves his big sister who loves him in return, she teases him while giving him some good advice, calling him out on his attitude, and we see that he did form a real friendship with Hob, even if it took him awhile to admit that friendship was what it was. Its in line with what Death told him, the Endless, as powerful and ancient as they are, exist to be there for people, and being with them does them good in return. Seeing him with Death makes him feel so much more relatable, there are no airs of superiority or being a leader, he's just with someone he loves who loves him back. 

Lots of little bits to love in this episode, like how in every time period in the pub people are talking about the same things, the glimpses of Chaucer, Marlowe, and Shakespeare among other historical jokes, and the cameo by Johanna Constantine. Although, Johanna, maybe next time you threaten someone who you think is the devil, bring some more firepower than two guys with knives. 

[Jynnan tonnix]

Episodes like this remind me of why it is that I'm a fan of Neil Gaiman's work. To be honest, a good measure of it ends up being a bit more disturbing than I prefer, but his limitless imagination and his evocative use of language keep me going back to check out a lot of his work. That being said, I have never seen the graphic novel(s?) that the Sandman is based on. 

This episode was just beautiful, and I hope there are some more to come with a closer feeling to this than the previous one. Like others, I am still waiting for anything like a cohesive plot to tie all these ends together, but I also suspect that, knowing the way my mind works, I'll probably miss the entire point and need someone to spell it out for me. That's OK, too, though...sometimes I just enjoy the journey without straining my brain to understand it all. 

[MissLucas]

Coming into this with zero Sandman knowledge (and loving it) I wondered if Hob's name is significant since it sounds like a play on Job who also got to be the subject of a supernatural bet (so to speak). And because I'm shallow: Dream should have kept the 18th century hair.

[DoctorAtomic]

On 8/7/2022 at 12:33 PM, MissL said:

Not only does he not want to talk to the mortal who imprisoned him no way is he giving up a beloved sibling to that puny human. 

I forgot that Dream wasn't the object of the capture. That's a fair argument, but I still think you do what you can to get out of the bowl and figure it out later. 

I got the Chaucer reference! Obviously, 'Will'. 

I would have been the same - chimneys! Wow! And we blow our noses! So much to see. I didn't buy that he totally lost his fortune, but I guess losing the wife and son turned him to despair, but he still kept on.

I wasn't expecting Constantine to reappear. It sounds like there were some easter eggs in the dialogue for the comic readers. 

This was a lot of fun. Like 2 episodes in one. 
 

Edited August 17, 2022 by DoctorAtomic

[DoctorAtomic]

What year was it when they met at the 'new inn' at the end? Because the last time was 1989, when Hob was 'stood up'. It's clearly not 2089. I can buy that Hob went every so often just hoping Dream would show up at the new place. A few minutes more context would have worked.

I thought Hob would have bought the tavern to keep it. 

[jacehan]

2 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

What year was it when they met at the 'new inn' at the end? Because the last time was 1989, when Hob was 'stood up'. It's clearly not 2089. I can buy that Hob went every so often just hoping Dream would show up at the new place. A few minutes more context would have worked.

I thought Hob would have bought the tavern to keep it. 

It’s current day, whenever this takes place (2020 or 2022 or whatever). The show implied that Hob bought the bar after the old bartender made the comments about how people with money can do whatever they want, and he was there because he was running the place.

[Fukui San]

I think the implication was that Hob couldn’t buy that exact building but bought the next one over and opened the successor bar in the hopes that Dream would find it. Dream finds the closed bar first and sees signs pointing to the new bar. 

[JustHereForFood]

I cried a lot during the first part of the episode. Touching and a bit scary at the same time.

The other half was also great and as others have said, they tied together nicely. I found Dream rather arrogant in that meeting in 1889, interesting that that happened just before his imprisonment that definitely made him see things in new light.

On 8/5/2022 at 7:02 PM, PurpleTentacle said:

Questions: Shouldn't Dream have seen his sister when Constantine's girlfriend died? He next to her afterall.

I thought the same as I watched that episode.

[SevenStars]

1 hour ago, JustHereForFood said:

I cried a lot during the first part of the episode. Touching and a bit scary at the same time.

The other half was also great and as others have said, they tied together nicely. I found Dream rather arrogant in that meeting in 1889, interesting that that happened just before his imprisonment that definitely made him see things in new light.

I thought the same as I watched that episode.

Death did mention that she is not always there for everyone. And I assumed she wouldn't be there knowing they were after her. 

[DoctorAtomic]

I didn't catch that the guy bought the bar. 

[PurpleTentacle]

On 8/19/2022 at 4:58 AM, SevenStars said:

Death did mention that she is not always there for everyone.

No, she said that she doesn't come for all of them and then mentioned the old lady we saw talking to Constantine and Dream's friend. Both immortals. She absolutely presonally comes for everyone who dies.

[Which Tyler]

On 8/21/2022 at 9:32 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

No, she said that she doesn't come for all of them and then mentioned the old lady we saw talking to Constantine and Dream's friend. Both immortals. She absolutely presonally comes for everyone who dies.

The counter to that, is that we see her for about half an hour - and she walks 5-6 people through their deaths.
Meanwhile approximately 3,000 humans died without her (and how many billions of non-humans?).

Elsewhere, we "know" that the personification of Dream isn't present whenever anyone dreams, just that dreaming, and sleep per se go haywire if the personification is out of action for a century. There's no hint that desire is personally present every time anyone feels desire for anything, or despair, or...

Elsewhere in literature, we know that Gaiman and Pratchett were personal friends, who influenced each other significantly; and we know that Pratchett's anthropomorphic personification of death explicitly isn't present for every death; just enough of them to keep things running smoothly (and again, that when he's out of action, things go to pot).

Taking all of that together with Death's own words about not turning up for everyone - I'm happy to go with the theory that death (with a lowercase d) happens to everyone (eventually including Hobb, Hettie and various deities and even the endless), whether or not the personification of Death (with a capital D) is present.

Edited August 22, 2022 by Which Tyler

[Chicago Redshirt]

One thing that the Netflix series made me wonder about: why Dream's family and subjects from the Dreaming didn't do much to help rescue him.

[Which Tyler]

2 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

One thing that the Netflix series made me wonder about: why Dream's family and subjects from the Dreaming didn't do much to help rescue him.

Because he's a douche?

[PurpleTentacle]

15 hours ago, Which Tyler said:

The counter to that, is that we see her for about half an hour - and she walks 5-6 people through their deaths.
Meanwhile approximately 3,000 humans died without her (and how many billions of non-humans?).

I assume she is in a ton of places at once and/or time moves weird for her, because otherwise that isn't possible, it's true. But they made it pretty clear that she is there for all who die.

15 hours ago, Which Tyler said:

Elsewhere in literature, we know that Gaiman and Pratchett were personal friends, who influenced each other significantly; and we know that Pratchett's anthropomorphic personification of death explicitly isn't present for every death; just enough of them to keep things running smoothly (and again, that when he's out of action, things go to pot).

This is pretty clearly not the Discworld death.

15 hours ago, Which Tyler said:

Taking all of that together with Death's own words about not turning up for everyone

Like I said, that comment was clearly specifically geared towards the immortals.

[Which Tyler]

5 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Like I said, that comment was clearly specifically geared towards the immortals.

And yet - it's also clear that the immortals will die
“When the first living thing existed, I was there waiting. When the last living thing dies, my job will be finished. I'll put the chairs on the tables, turn out the lights and lock the universe behind me when I leave.”

So either immortals aren't living things, or they die... eventually.

Incidentally, I see nothing from the show to suggest that Hob or Hettie are immortal, just that Death has chosen to allow them longer on earth. In the case of Hob, this is specifically stated.

Clearly, there's room for more than 1 interpretation, not a matter of "I'm right, and therefore you're wrong"

[DoctorAtomic]

I'm surprised she doesn't have a staff. Divide up the planet by region and ease up the workload. 

[SevenStars]

2 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I'm surprised she doesn't have a staff. Divide up the planet by region and ease up the workload. 

She might, like Death. I have not read the comic but I wonder if they explore more of Death's realm. 

[Chicago Redshirt]

1 hour ago, SevenStars said:

She might, like Death. I have not read the comic but I wonder if they explore more of Death's realm. 

The Sandman series does not really explore more of Death's realm. Death had at one brief miniseries, but that also does not show Death's realm.

[jacehan]

I was thinking about how some of the things in the timeline stretch credulity by keeping Dream's capture in 1916 but moving his release forward 30 years, like the ages of Alex and John. But on the other hand, I think it really improved the Hob story to have Dream not actually show up in 1989, but to have Hob still wait for him, and for Dream to still show up when he's free.

[Fukui San]

On 8/23/2022 at 11:48 AM, Chicago Redshirt said:

  Hide contents

The Sandman series does not really explore more of Death's realm. Death had at one brief miniseries, but that also does not show Death's realm.

We do see Death’s realm once in the comics.

Spoiler

Orpheus visits it. It looks incongruously like a modern flat, even though it’s set in Ancient Greece, which breaks Orpheus’ brain. Shitty one bedroom apartment a young person would have. Fishbowl, clothes on the floor, etc. He has to ask her to change to a more time appropriate look which she does. She changes outfits to something costumey and her realm to, like, energy ripples iirc.

[Chicago Redshirt]

I stand corrected. 

[calvinshobbes]

Death should have been present at Roderick Burgess’ death on the show in episode 1 in the basement. She clearly would have seen Dream locked up. She is shown to be able to interact with earthy objects like the soccer ball so she clearly can intervene if she wanted to rescue Dream. Yet the show has to ignore this plot point. 

[SevenStars]

2 hours ago, calvinshobbes said:

 Yet the show has to ignore this plot point. 

I agree, Death and the others could have saved Dream. But I'm not sure if it's a plot point or a part of the story the writers are waiting to explore. 

[Bruinsfan]

The designs and sigils on the floor were meant to trap Death, so maybe she couldn't reach across them to free Morpheus? Though he should have seen her, at least.

[Ottis]

On 8/22/2022 at 12:28 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

One thing that the Netflix series made me wonder about: why Dream's family and subjects from the Dreaming didn't do much to help rescue him.

This is what I kept asking from the moment Death said she was worried about Dream. If you are so worried, what were you doing for 100 years? I assume this will be answered at some point.

That said, I loved this episode. Forget the show's plot, this provided much food for thought around what it means to be alive (Hob), and what it means to die (everyone else). It made me think about death IRL for a while, and the question asked, why do people fear it? I assume it is mostly because people don't want to give up what they have, not knowing what may be next. The one person who looked like she was ready to die in Death's various visits was the drug addict in the woods - she had had enough. But most others can't believe it, and some even focus on the mundane (your flight info?) when faced with their own death. Hob, meanwhile, is in love with just being alive. Beautiful.

Still, I can't believe no one calls the cops on Dream as he wanders around in all black with an overcoat, unsmiling and stalky, during days nice enough to swim.

On 8/16/2022 at 10:33 PM, Fukui San said:

I think the implication was that Hob couldn’t buy that exact building but bought the next one over and opened the successor bar in the hopes that Dream would find it. Dream finds the closed bar first and sees signs pointing to the new bar. 

I liked this touch of reality. At first I thought Hob would buy the original site from whoever was developing it, a la Bruce Wayne buying the bank to save Martha Kent's house, but what was done was done and instead he had to buy a place down the street. Nice.

On 8/5/2022 at 11:02 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

When Death told Franklin that she'd see him again soon, I said out loud "Aw, poor Franklin." I'm not sure if we were supposed to know that she was death at that point, but come on, she was wearing an Ankh.

If we didn't know by then, then as soon as she said she would see him again soon and looked sad we were to know!

Edited August 26, 2022 by Ottis

[Ottis]

On 8/16/2022 at 8:16 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

What year was it when they met at the 'new inn' at the end? Because the last time was 1989, when Hob was 'stood up'. It's clearly not 2089. I can buy that Hob went every so often just hoping Dream would show up at the new place. A few minutes more context would have worked.

I think Hob, missing his friend, was there every day, just in case. he had the excuse of running the place as a business, it looked like. That was also nice. 

[supposebly]

I'm still watching although I'm not terribly engaged. Dream walking along Death like a sulky Goth teenager was kinda hilarious.

I keep wondering, what WERE his siblings doing while he was imprisoned? Was it the plan of Desire to imprison him all along?  

I liked Hob. I think it takes a lot to keep living and enjoying it while everyone around you dies. That's clearly not how he sees it by now. I liked that he wasn't a perfect character, he went with the mores of the times profiting from slavery and not terribly concerned about that woman. Wasn't he grading papers when Dream showed up at the end? Although I did assume he bought the new place. Doesn't mean he has to run it.

On 8/5/2022 at 11:02 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

So Desire was behind Dream's imprisonment?

But wasn't Death supposed to be imprisoned? Or did Desire turn it around on Burgess, so he caught Dream instead of Death?

On 8/10/2022 at 1:49 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

But with the Corinthian having figured out where to find him almost immediately after Dream was captured, with Jessamy having tracked down Dream back in the 1920s ish time frame, and with all the people involved in his capture having dreams (at least some of which should leave clues as to where Dream was and what they'd done to him), it seems like there should have been more rescue efforts over the course of a century.

This is where I'm really lost. Even if Desire wanted him and not Death imprisoned.

That's some garish makeup there on Desire.

[DoctorAtomic]

1 hour ago, supposebly said:

But wasn't Death supposed to be imprisoned? Or did Desire turn it around on Burgess, so he caught Dream instead of Death?

On 8/10/2022 at 1:49 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

Charles Dance said he wanted to trap Death to for her to return his son that was killed in the war. It looked to me that Dream just got caught on accident.