S04.E07. Eyes Down!

[Gharlane]

Quote

"Eyes Down!". Micah celebrates a wild 21st birthday at a strip club with Ethan and Olivia. Moriah confronts Lydia about her recent meet ups with Max. Kim moves back home, and she and Barry discuss the future of their relationship.

We see the predictable repercussions of Ethan getting a cougar's phone number. I can totally believe Ethan is naïve enough to not think that he was making her think he was interested.

Kim is now moving back into the east wing of the house. Wait, do they live in a mansion? I was surprised by the size of their house in the establishing shot taken by a drone! 😲Anyhow, Kim "accidentally" lets slip that she and Barry are getting divorced. Yeah, right, Kim. 🙄

Meanwhile, Moriah confronts Lydia about Max in Gainesville, which doesn't seem like a convenient midway point to meet. Whatever. I don't like Lydia.

FINALLY, Micah and his birthday plans! I'm skeptical that these people had a shot every time a guest arrived (I they said they had about a dozen shots at some point) but they seemed to be enjoying themselves. I am not surprised by Ethan's reaction to going to a strip club and not knowing how to use an ATM. I felt sympathetic with Ethan's discomfort. 

Meanwhile, Lydia visits her church friends in Tallahassee blah blah blah. I only cared about the establishing shots and trying to locate the neighborhood.

Lastly, Kim and Barry talk about their relationship and I couldn't care less about these losers. Barry gives me the creeps and I cannot articulate why. 🤔
 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Gharlane
Corrected the episode number.

[Kiss my mutt]

I tuned in when the strip club part was on and turned it off. 

Not today, satan, I guess.  

[CSunshine76]

Lydia met up with Max to forgive him? Huh? And it never crossed her mind that may upset her sister…you know, the one Max cheated ON? There is something very strange about that one. I don’t trust her one bit….I’m not buying her naive act.  

[scorp01]

This episode bored me.  

Too much focus on Lydia for one.  She met up with Max to forgive him?  Twice?  Um, shut up Lydia.  Everything out of her mouth is because of God or the holy scripture or something and I'm just tired of her self-righteousness.  And I don't care about her new friend group that is also uber religious and there to support her.  Blech.

Don't care about Kim and her strange black under-eye eyeliner, or her overdone lipstick lips.  Don't care about Barry or how he feels either.  I did think that it was pretty appalling that Kim decided to tell her 9 year old and the other one (I forget how old she is) all about how she's not in love with their father anymore and she let it "slip" about divorce.  Boundaries, Kim.  

Micah's party, while probably marginally more fun than when Ethan and Olivia turned 21, still didn't look like much of a party except when they took shots when everyone arrived.  Glad at least Micah and Olivia seemed to appreciate the strip club, even though THAT didn't look like much fun either.

[gingerella]

I only watched half this epi last night, I was so bored with Kim and Barry that I had to take a break. Honestly, the 'divorce word' scene was even worse than last week's promo led me to believe. That she 'let slip' about getting a divorce from their father was about the most heinous thing she has done on this show thus far. The fact that she smirked about it afterward made me want to reach into my TV and smack the smirk right off her face. Seriously, you don't talk to your children, let alone your YOUNG children, about how unhappy you are in your marriage. You say things like, "sometimes a mom and dad grow apart over the years....blah blah blah fishcakes" but you don't discuss your marital relationship details with your pre-teen children as if you were yakking it up at a local bar on a girls night out with your pals! Jesus H. Christ, what is WRONG with her? And Barry too, crying in front of the kids about this shit. They are horrible parents who used their stable of offspring to experiment with fundie rules and regs and it's backfired spectacularly on them. It gives me hope that Amber is standing up for what she thinks is right, and speaking her mind. And Cassia and Mercy seem to also be taking a cue from Amber so I have hope that they can be clued in by their older siblings when they're a bit older.

Also, the fact that everyone calls Cassia and Mercy, 'the little girls' or 'the littles'. I find that so demeaning given how many offspring these two had together. It's like making these two last kids less than by never referring to them with their actual names. That said, I found these two youngest girls infinitely more mature than their own pathetic mother.

Lastly, I took a romp through the IG accounts of the older siblings and I think at the end of the day, after all the BS rules Kim forced on her kids, thwarting their social development, she sees the older kids out there in the world living their lives and she's plain old jealous of them. Period, end of story. That is what I think is going on here. She's jealous that she hasn't lived her life beyond her own myopic fundie rules she foisted upon her children, and now she wants a 'life jailbreak'. Sorry hon, you had all these kids and you need to finish raising them, and it doesn't matter if you're not happy, IMO you stick it out until the last kids leave the nest and then you figure out your own life. These kids didn't ask to be raised like this.

ETA: I LOVED Moriah calling out Lydia on her creepy behavior with Max. She's absolutely correct, Lydia has nothing to forgive Max for because this wasn't about Lydia. The truth is probably that Lydia has a crush on Max and she didn't want to not see him anymore, and when Moriah called her out to her face she starts crying about what a terrible mistake she made. If Moriah hadn't called her out I have no doubt she'd still be calling Max to hang out so can repeatedly 'forgive' him. With a sister like Lydia who needs ememies? But as proud as I was of Moriah for doing that, I have to say she looks like crap right now. She doesn't look healthy at all and it's worrisome. Am I the only one seeing this with her?

Edited June 29, 2022 by gingerella

[Mothra]

Maybe Barry could lure Beth back into his embrace if he offered to foot the bill for plastic surgery to turn that frown upside down.  Poor Beth was born afflicted with a mouth that turns down at the ends, giving her a constant sour, dissatisfied face, no matter how happy (as if she could ever be happy) she is.  And she accents it with that terrible lipstick job, so she might respond to the offer of an appointment with an aesthetician.  Opportunities for crossover with Teen Mom but whoops wrong channel.

Lydia should spend more time in her closet talking to the holy ghost.  I think she is angling for Max for herself.  What a shitty sister she is, whether she has Max on her mind or is trying to be The Best Christian in the World (Mrs. Betty Bowers would destroy her with a glance).  She has no business "forgiving" Max--nobody but Moriah, apparently, even knows what he did!

I have to love me some Micah at the strip club.

[bichonblitz]

Oh, Micah. Live your best life!  How often does he fly from California to Florida? That's a long and expensive round trip flight. I guess working is not a priority for party boy Micah right now. The money seems to be flowing.  I do like that he pointed out to Moriah that he's the only one that really broke free to discover a new life while she and Ethan took the safe route and moved together to another state together along with Olivia and her brother but basically nothing has changed with them.  

I'm still trying to understand what Barry did that was so terrible. She keeps saying she gave him plenty of chances to change and he wouldn't do it. Change what, exactly?  Kim has a very strong and controlling personality. She can't sell me on this poor, meek, ignored all the time by Barry schtick. I'm thinking she married young, popped out 10 kids while her husband provided a financially secure life for her until half of her brood moved away and she got bored. Mid life crisis, much?  

[SunnyBeBe]

2 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

Oh, Micah. Live your best life!  How often does he fly from California to Florida? That's a long and expensive round trip flight. I guess working is not a priority for party boy Micah right now. The money seems to be flowing.  I do like that he pointed out to Moriah that he's the only one that really broke free to discover a new life while she and Ethan took the safe route and moved together to another state together along with Olivia and her brother but basically nothing has changed with them.  

I'm still trying to understand what Barry did that was so terrible. She keeps saying she gave him plenty of chances to change and he wouldn't do it. Change what, exactly?  Kim has a very strong and controlling personality. She can't sell me on this poor, meek, ignored all the time by Barry schtick. I'm thinking she married young, popped out 10 kids while her husband provided a financially secure life for her until half of her brood moved away and she got bored. Mid life crisis, much?  

I have my theory of why Kim is done with that marriage.  That’s all I’ll say about it.  A few years ago, everyone was so mystified why a member of my family suddenly moved out of his home.  I told my mom, it’s one of three reasons……it normally is.  

[QQQQ]

Lydia is shifty. But she has no storyline unless she inserts herself into the Moriah/Max drama. I also think she's jealous of Moriah and fantasizes about winning Max's love through constant attention and continued access to cameras.

[gingerella]

4 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

I do like that he pointed out to Moriah that he's the only one that really broke free to discover a new life while she and Ethan took the safe route and moved together to another state together along with Olivia and her brother but basically nothing has changed with them.  

I'm still trying to understand what Barry did that was so terrible. She keeps saying she gave him plenty of chances to change and he wouldn't do it. Change what, exactly?  Kim has a very strong and controlling personality. She can't sell me on this poor, meek, ignored all the time by Barry schtick. I'm thinking she married young, popped out 10 kids while her husband provided a financially secure life for her until half of her brood moved away and she got bored. Mid life crisis, much?  

Great point, but I think this is because Moriah and Ethan are way more damaged and need to be together to support one another while they find their way out in the real world. If it wasn't for Olivia, Ethan and Moriah would still be holed up in Cairo opining about their life. Olivia has forced them to open their eyes and venture beyond their very limited borders, but I think they're still finding their footing so to speak. OTOH, Olivia is more than fine out in the real world and is way more high functioning than Ethan and Moriah.

Word to your post about Mother of the Year, Kim. Remember when Ethan was fighting with them in front of all the other kids, and something was said about Barry and rules or something to that effect, and Ethan shot out with "She (Kim) is the neck that turns your head!" I believe Ethan was speaking the truth in that moment, saying what we all figured, that it was Kim that has created this awful situation, experimenting with her children like they were some science experiment and calling it 'religion'. Bah! She's full of shit. Like I said upthread, I think she's jealous of her older kids living life outside the jail she created and now she wants out too. Tough shit Kim.

[Shelbie]

In different ways I think Kim and Barry are screwing up their younger kids as much as they did their older kids. They are awful parents.

[bichonblitz]

13 hours ago, gingerella said:

If it wasn't for Olivia, Ethan and Moriah would still be holed up in Cairo opining about their life.

Ethan would have been happy to stay in Cairo. He wasn't miserable there. He was miserable with Olivia constantly bitching about it. 

13 hours ago, gingerella said:

Remember when Ethan was fighting with them in front of all the other kids, and something was said about Barry and rules or something to that effect, and Ethan shot out with "She (Kim) is the neck that turns your head!" I believe Ethan was speaking the truth in that moment, saying what we all figured, that it was Kim that has created this awful situation, experimenting with her children like they were some science experiment and calling it 'religion'. Bah! She's full of shit. Like I said upthread, I think she's jealous of her older kids living life outside the jail she created and now she wants out too. Tough shit Kim.

I remember it well. Again, that's why I don't buy her poor ignored housewife spiel. I think Ethan really has her number. Micah and Moriah not so much. They are willing to pretend she's not so bad after all. Now she's going to try to rewrite history with the younger kids. 

[QQQQ]

16 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I have my theory of why Kim is done with that marriage.  That’s all I’ll say about it.  A few years ago, everyone was so mystified why a member of my family suddenly moved out of his home.  I told my mom, it’s one of three reasons……it normally is.  

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Barry is gay.

I think Kim, despite her best efforts, was the catalyst for Ethan and Olivia getting married. They both wanted to prove Kim wrong, but instead of admitting they made a bad match they cut their noses off to spite their faces (very awkward analogy...) and got hitched.

Edited June 30, 2022 by QQQQ

[Ms.Lulu]

11 hours ago, QQQQ said:

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Barry is gay.

I get the vibe he is on the spectrum.  That explains the awkwardness in tense situations, his inability to have normal conversations with his kids, and the fact he is oblivious to how others feel.

[Gharlane]

11 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

I get the vibe he is on the spectrum.  That explains the awkwardness in tense situations, his inability to have normal conversations with his kids, and the fact he is oblivious to how others feel.

I am definitely getting that feeling from Ethan, now that you mention it. 🤔

[Chicken Fingers]

Ethan has said that he doesn't remember his mother ever hugging him. I was noticing that when Kim was having the inappropriate divorce/relationship chat with the youngest girls, and then it was hug and kiss time, the girls acted like it was a novelty to kiss their mother and share hugs. (And then they spent the rest of the segment trying to wipe sticky lip goo off.) 

I probably noticed because I had a narcissistic mother who never showed affection, and I know others who grew up the same way. Narc parents only put on performances. And I notice how both Kim and Barry keep asking the kids to comfort them. The kids exist as accessories and to meet their various needs. 

We need a storyline where Barry, trying to "improve" and save his marriage, visits a plastic surgeon for lip fillers. We need Beestung Barry. 

[Mothra]

I think Kim is envious of the lives she is seeing her children living once they leave the compound.  If they had followed their programming, they would all be Lydias, but there they are, out living real lives, not paying any attention (except not looking at lady parts at the strip club) to the strictures they were brought up to respect.  They are discovering all the things Kim and Barry (but mostly Kim) kept from them, and now she wants some, too.  Suddenly it's OK to eat sugar--think of all the years Kim must have lusted for sweets!  She's a heavier woman who must have dieted like crazy to maintain her weight all those years, and now here are her kids eating sugar and *not* blowing up into zeppelins!  And alcohol!  And fun!

Maybe it's too embarrassing to invite Barry along for her freedom ride--it would be a confession of failure, in a way, for her to suddenly embrace all the things she so rigidly said no to.  Or maybe now, seeing her newly toned body, she feels she can do better.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Mothra

[FizzyPuff]

1 hour ago, Mothra said:

I think Kim is envious of the lives she is seeing her children living once they leave the compound.  If they had followed their programming, they would all be Livias, but there they are, out living real lives, not paying any attention (except not looking at lady parts at the strip club) to the strictures they were brought up to respect.  They are discovering all the things Kim and Barry (but mostly Kim) kept from them, and now she wants some, too.  Suddenly it's OK to eat sugar--think of all the years Kim must have lusted for sweets!  She's a heavier woman who must have dieted like crazy to maintain her weight all those years, and now here are her kids eating sugar and *not* blowing up into zeppelins!  And alcohol!  And fun!

Maybe it's too embarrassing to invite Barry along for her freedom ride--it would be a confession of failure, in a way, for her to suddenly embrace all the things she so rigidly said no to.  Or maybe now, seeing her newly toned body, she feels she can do better.

I think that No sugar rule was for the kids not Kim, I remember Mariah saying that Kim had a candy drawer in her bedroom and sometimes she would sneak some. 

[Meowwww]

On 6/29/2022 at 5:50 PM, SunnyBeBe said:

I have my theory of why Kim is done with that marriage.  That’s all I’ll say about it.  A few years ago, everyone was so mystified why a member of my family suddenly moved out of his home.  I told my mom, it’s one of three reasons……it normally is.  

Same. My bet is affair. Maybe it’s Meri Brown’s (Sisterwives) catfish…

Edited July 2, 2022 by Meowwww

[Salacious Kitty]

On 7/1/2022 at 3:56 PM, Mothra said:

I think Kim is envious of the lives she is seeing her children living once they leave the compound.  If they had followed their programming, they would all be Livias, but there they are, out living real lives, not paying any attention (except not looking at lady parts at the strip club) to the strictures they were brought up to respect.  They are discovering all the things Kim and Barry (but mostly Kim) kept from them, and now she wants some, too.  Suddenly it's OK to eat sugar--think of all the years Kim must have lusted for sweets!  She's a heavier woman who must have dieted like crazy to maintain her weight all those years, and now here are her kids eating sugar and *not* blowing up into zeppelins!  And alcohol!  And fun!

Maybe it's too embarrassing to invite Barry along for her freedom ride--it would be a confession of failure, in a way, for her to suddenly embrace all the things she so rigidly said no to.  Or maybe now, seeing her newly toned body, she feels she can do better.

In addition, I think Kim is rethinking her religion. In the previews for upcoming episodes, she was shown in some behaviors that she had previously publicly denounced. 

[lightninggirl]

On 6/29/2022 at 7:19 AM, Gharlane said:

Meanwhile, Moriah confronts Lydia about Max in Gainesville, which doesn't seem like a convenient midway point to meet. Whatever. I don't like Lydia.
 

As someone who's driven Tampa-Gainesville-Tallahassee-Cairo GA more times than I can tell you, I will say that Interstate 75 makes Gainesville a quicker meeting place. You can take the back roads and meet around Chiefland, but it's actually slower to go the backroads.

[lightninggirl]

Lydia is only crying actual tears because she got called out by Moriah, and Moriah did it in such an even-keeled manner that Lydia probably didn't know how to react. She's probably used to Kim blowing up at her, and Moriah just completely unnerved her. 😂😂

As a former Tampa resident for a decade and also having a former roommate who danced at Mons Venus, I was absolutely dying at the strip club scene. I've been to pretty much all of the strip clubs in Tampa, and it's great to see that the decor has not changed one iota since 1990. 😂😂  None of it bothered me with the exception of Micah rubbing on Ethan in the car (what was that?) and the fact that Micah would even take his generally uptight brother to a strip club in the first place. And Olivia got the best lap dance because women always do! ❤️ Sorry, Micah! 😉

What's the over/under on this Kim-Barry issue being completely contrived? If it is, fuck them for roping the kids in (or not! 😳) on this little bullshit charade. Kim's body language on the swing was at least consistent with what she's conveying to the camera. She's claiming she's "done a second chance ... and a fourth chance," but they're not cluing us in on what precipitated ALL of those chances? Jesus.

[camom]

I'm not a fan of Ethan, but I felt bad for him being dragged to the strip club.  Many people would be uncomfortable in that setting and he shouldn't have been pressured to go.  Good for him for just walking out and not making a big deal about it.

[gingerella]

2 hours ago, camom said:

I'm not a fan of Ethan, but I felt bad for him being dragged to the strip club.  Many people would be uncomfortable in that setting and he shouldn't have been pressured to go.  Good for him for just walking out and not making a big deal about it.

But he wasn't dragged. Micah asked him and he smiled and gave an enthusiastic YES! He onkh started getting cold feet as they gotcloser to the place. 

It's funny how Kim keeps harping on Barry being the reason fie the divorce but all we've heard so far is from him saying that he took her for granted. She never gives details. @lightninggirl I'm with you in this whole thi g being a desperate attempt at a parental storyline, ir story lie if the shoe fits. 

[charmed1]

On 7/1/2022 at 2:11 PM, Chicken Fingers said:

We need a storyline where Barry, trying to "improve" and save his marriage, visits a plastic surgeon for lip fillers. We need Beestung Barry. 

This is the content we need. I didn’t even bother to watch this episode because I’ve fallen asleep on the previous two. But I’m down for a Bad Bitch Barry storyline. 

[Fostersmom]

On 6/29/2022 at 1:48 PM, CSunshine76 said:

Lydia met up with Max to forgive him? Huh? And it never crossed her mind that may upset her sister…you know, the one Max cheated ON? There is something very strange about that one. I don’t trust her one bit….I’m not buying her naive act.  

Yeah, she was totally trying to pick up Max, no matter what religious forgiveness reasoning she was trying to spin. All of the kids are damaged, but she seems the most damaged. Her literally clinging to Ethan when ever she saw him in previous seasons was very creepy. It makes me think there's some very dark things that happened in the home that we've yet to hear.

As for Barry and Kim, I 100% agree that she was calling all the shots for years and IMO he had little to no say in anything. He acts like a guy who was just in awe he managed to get a pretty girl, and he would do anything she said to keep her. He and the older kids act like they were hostages who are just beginning to venture out in the world. 

[Salacious Kitty]

With Kim seemingly backing away from the fundie beliefs, I wonder how this will affect the kids still at home. Lydia mentioned meeting with those girls who were like minded in faith. Will she eventually abandon her prayer closet? And what about Isaac (I think that's his name)? We haven't seen him at all so far. Is he really working a full time job at only 16? What happened to his education, scant as it was? 

Lydia's lunch hour isn't sufficient to educate the 3 youngest girls. They need to be put in public school. 

[Baltimore Betty]

17 hours ago, Salacious Kitty said:

With Kim seemingly backing away from the fundie beliefs, I wonder how this will affect the kids still at home. Lydia mentioned meeting with those girls who were like minded in faith. Will she eventually abandon her prayer closet? And what about Isaac (I think that's his name)? We haven't seen him at all so far. Is he really working a full time job at only 16? What happened to his education, scant as it was? 

Lydia's lunch hour isn't sufficient to educate the 3 youngest girls. They need to be put in public school. 

I wonder about the education of those kids, why is higher education not stressed more for the kids? Do they equate being out in the world and knowing about choices available to you a sin?  Socialization is important let alone learning about the world but I guess if they allowed that the kids would not be under their thumb so easily.  They really don't trust their kids to make good decisions on their own?

[Salacious Kitty]

The whole fundie mindset discourages critical thinking. That's why I am curious where Kim is headed down her road of changes. Are the kids left at home going to be allowed more freedom as Kim finds other things to occupy her time?

[Ms.Lulu]

5 hours ago, Salacious Kitty said:

The whole fundie mindset discourages critical thinking. That's why I am curious where Kim is headed down her road of changes. Are the kids left at home going to be allowed more freedom as Kim finds other things to occupy her time?

Well, we know they can now eat an obscene amount of ice cream with Kim.

[b2H]

On 6/29/2022 at 2:34 PM, gingerella said:

Also, the fact that everyone calls Cassia and Mercy, 'the little girls' or 'the littles'.

My daughter has four kids, 16, 13, 9 and 8.  The 8 and 9 year olds have been the littles since forever.  Not demeaning at all in our family.

[Ms.Lulu]

12 minutes ago, b2H said:

My daughter has four kids, 16, 13, 9 and 8.  The 8 and 9 year olds have been the littles since forever.  Not demeaning at all in our family.

Yes.  My two younger sisters were 'the girls' until one died last year.  Now the younger one, in her 50s, is called 'the baby.'

Edited July 19, 2022 by Ms.Lulu

[Notabug]

15 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

Yes.  My two younger sisters were 'the girls' until one died last year.  Now the younger one, in her 50s, is called 'the baby.'

My youngest sister, now almost 50, has been Baby L- - - ever since she was born and a 4 year old neighbor called her that.  Back when she was dating, she would warn her boyfriends before they met the family that we all called her Baby L so they wouldn't be shocked.

There are far worse things that Kim and Barry have done to their kids.  I think it is fairly common, especially in big families, to categorize the kids.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Notabug

[Back Atcha]

On 7/5/2022 at 12:10 PM, Salacious Kitty said:

That's why I am curious where Kim is headed down her road of changes. Are the kids left at home going to be allowed more freedom as Kim finds other things to occupy her time?

I think Kim wants to escape from all of it and have a free-free-free life.  The life of a single, beautiful, carefree, dancer.  She won't be worrying about her kids much...except to make sure they think only THE BEST of her.  

[Back Atcha]

1 hour ago, Back Atcha said:

The life of a single, beautiful, carefree, dancer. 

CHUCKLE !!!

[applewood]

On 7/20/2022 at 1:39 PM, Back Atcha said:

I think Kim wants to escape from all of it and have a free-free-free life.  The life of a single, beautiful, carefree, dancer.  She won't be worrying about her kids much...except to make sure they think only THE BEST of her.  

That's the impression I get as well. I think she's kind of tired of raising kids and wants her own life. Unfortunately, she still has four(?) minors at home. I wonder if Lydia will do most of the homeschooling from now on. Poor Lydia. She needs more of her own life. She should go to a college or trade school or something.

[Back Atcha]

5 hours ago, applewood said:

Poor Lydia. She needs more of her own life. She should go to a college or trade school or something.

Or a convent ... well, a Catholic convent from the 40s/50s.  Lydia should not continue homeschooling the "little girls."  She's a religious zealot.  She believes in "her" Lord without question--and often without using common sense. I worry that she would instill her unhealthy "devotion" into her siblings.  They will all have a more difficult time "out in the world" than the older siblings are experiencing.

P.S.  I know she has NO association with Catholics; it's sarcasm.

[JayDub1987]

Christ have mercy, Lydia is unbearable. "Sorry Sis, I hung out with your ex who cheated on you because I was 'reminded of Scriptures.'" 

Kim may have lost her grip on most of these spawns, but she clearly destroyed that one. What a whack job.

[kristen111]

On 7/2/2022 at 7:52 PM, Meowwww said:

Same. My bet is affair. Maybe it’s Meri Brown’s (Sisterwives) catfish…

Yeah, I read somewhere, I don’t remember where, that she has a boyfriend.