Ghosts of Housewives Past: Jill Zarin, Alex, and the Rest

[ScoobieDoobs]

I think back to when Kells first came on the show & remember how she so bugged B & why (to me at least) she annoyed her to no end.  Kelly actually did nothing to her.  But she barely acknowledged her & of course the "I'm up here & you're down there" comment said it all.  Well, we could all relate to how Beths felt being told that.  And who could blame B for going after her as viciously as she did after being told such a vile thing?  I thought what really bugged B bout Kells was she had such an attitude -- that her time as a highly paid model & being married to a famous photographer put her on higher level than most people -- which certainly included Bethenny.

 

Um, now could the same sorta thing happen between B & Carole?  Maybe.  Carole's attitude in her first season was as ridiculous as Lu's.  I could see B calling her out for her bullshit.  Carole toned her shit down a bit last season, but I can see her & Lu becoming ridiculous again.  Actually, I'd like to see Beths calling them both out for this kinda crap, which I can't stand either.  Go get 'em, B!  I'll get my popcorn & watch.  And don't fuckin' interrupt her, Heather, or I'll throw all my popcorn at ya.

[Trooper York]

I think Carole will be a nonentity. Even more so than last season. What's her story line? Last year itwas all about Aviva. Bethenny will just be casually cruel to her and basically dismiss her as beneath her notice.

The real action will be with Heather. I bet Luann jumps in on Heather's side while the Moaner sides with Betts. Sonja and Carole will just be the hangers on getting high in the background. Just sayn'

[ScoobieDoobs]

I guess I didn't see her tweet as a joke and therefore did not see it as offensive or a slap in the face to his family. It read like she was just stating a fact with a rest in peace hash tag.

 

Well, clearly you are a kind person & kind people see the good in others when it may not be there.  B is NOT kind -- she's nasty as fuck.  And she meant it as a nasty tasteless joke.  Dat's Bethenny's sense of humor.  Welcome back, B.  While I haven't missed ya, I did find ya entertaining sometimes so let's see how it works out.

 

Wonder when Alex & Simon are moving to Australia.  She's not doing her vids anymore for The Stir & Simon's Bravoratings site is pretty much dead.  WTF do these 2 do for money these days?  Er, how do they earn a living anyway?

[racked]

To be honest, I don't really know HOW successful it is.  However, I've been lurking her Twitter page because something is going on (or not) between her and her husband, and she's recently launched a line of active wear and jeans.  She's getting lots of exposure on HSN and social media. 

 

That's why I think she's going to use this season as a Platform for Her Brand big time. Because, again, that's what the Hos do.

Ooh trouble between Heather and her cute husband? That might be interesting. Though I like them together, and their kids are adorable.

[ScoobieDoobs]

I noticed that too.  He's been completely erased from her Twitter & Facebook & there's no mention of him at all.  Er, huh?  These are supposed to reflect your life & no mention AT ALL of her husband?  Is this the way it's gonna be on the show?  One thing bout Beths -- she knows exactly how to find your sensitive weak spot & tweak it.  We'll just see how tough Heather is.

Edited October 23, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[ryebread]

I don't think Beth was trying to hurt anybody with her tweet about Oscar.  That said, she seems just so damn unaware of what comes out of her mouth, she didn't realize it might be considered offensive/distasteful/self-serving.  Just like tweeting the pic of herself in Bryn's pajamas.  Or bumping and grinding on stage at a children's cancer fundraiser the other night.  She just goes with what she wants to do, which to some might seem charming and freeing.  And to others, inappropriate. 

 

I think she knew she looked great in that Oscar de la Renta gown. (Yes, she put away the sad panda face and wore it to the ball after all - for humanity, yo.  And it pains me to admit she did look great.) She was going to get up on that stage and grind up against Jamie Foxx whether he knew she was there or not. He looked embarrassed.  The video is now down but loads of pictures.

 

Hopefully the children had gone home by the time she twerked for the audience.  Shrug.  But one thing for sure, she wants everyone to know: she's back, bitches.

 

http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/TGgcTFdwDCO/Inside+the+Angel+Ball+in+NYC/e7XpOfuuX6T/Bethenny+Frankel

 

 

[ScoobieDoobs]

That's not one of Oscar's best, but damn, it does look great on her.  Funny how Jamie looks like he wants no part of her tweeking crap.

 

ETA -- er, if you're over 40, it's tweeking not twerking.

Edited October 24, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[ryebread]

Ooh trouble between Heather and her cute husband? That might be interesting. Though I like them together, and their kids are adorable.

As hard as I think Heather would be to live with, I'd not like to see her and Jonathon split.  I'm thinking about the kids. Unless there's some truly dysfunctional stuff going on in their mystery household, that would be unfortunate. This is speculation.  As of last week, all the pictures of Jon, except 2 from early this year have been scrubbed from Twitter and FB. Today, I noticed in her bio or whatever it's called, it used to say "Wife and Mother, Entrepreneur..." yada, yada.   The 'wife' part is now gone. 

 

She's been on a #girltrip #getaway with Carole to Miraval Spa in AZ all last week.  Who knows. 

[Midnight Cheese]

Oh, no - I like Heather and Jonathan together from what we've been shown.   Hopefully it's just some strange blip or something.  (Incidental to all this but I would really love to go to Miraval Spa.)

 

Those kids in the photo with Bethenny are really cute.  Jaime Foxx looking away while Bethenny engages in her typically subtle moves is hi-frigging-larious.

[bosawks]

Ooh trouble between Heather and her cute husband? That might be interesting. Though I like them together, and their kids are adorable.

Maybe he had an affair with Mario?

I hear everyone is doing him, er, it....

[sleekandchic]

Is this old news? Jason is going to court to prevent Bethenny from exploiting Bryn on the show:

http://radaronline.com/exclusives/2014/10/jason-hoppy-bethenny-frankel-court-bryn-show/

[ScoobieDoobs]

Sheesh, Jason really is showing his true colors.  Being on the show does not have to be traumatizing to the kid, as he's implying.  That's bullshit.  And I don't think Beths is gonna say much bout the divorce or Jason.  She's had plenty of opportunities to do that & hasn't.  I'm sure she's much more concerned bout pushing her shit & trying to stay afloat with the others on the show.  Jason is a fuckin' dickhead.  But Beths clearly luvs her men to be shitty-ass dickheads so diss is the kinda shit that ya gotta deal with if ya luv dickheads.  Wouldn't surprise me at all if she's crazy bout & good buds with Joshie poo.  Ew.

[DeeplyShallow]

Sheesh, Jason really is showing his true colors. Being on the show does not have to be traumatizing to the kid, as he's implying. That's bullshit. And I don't think Beths is gonna say much bout the divorce or Jason. She's had plenty of opportunities to do that & hasn't. I'm sure she's much more concerned bout pushing her shit & trying to stay afloat with the others on the show. Jason is a fuckin' dickhead. But Beths clearly luvs her men to be shitty-ass dickheads so diss is the kinda shit that ya gotta deal with if ya luv dickheads. Wouldn't surprise me at all if she's crazy bout & good buds with Joshie poo. Ew.

Sorry, Scoobie, I have to disagree with you there. While it doesn't have to be traumatizing for the kid to be on the show, it will no doubt have some sort of impact. These two are going through a very public and very very acrimonious split. Jason has no say about what's being discussed, what scenarios will be filmed, etc. As a parent myself, I would be extremely unsettled if my kids were filmed and I had no way to protect them. Bethany has proven herself to be extremely unfiltered and, if I were Jason, I would absolutely be concerned about what was said/done to my kid, around my kid, etc because they are filming a show. Not to mention-there's no control over editing either.

The article says that Bethany's lawyer will point out that Jason had no problem having Bryn film BEA. Well, that was a different scenario. Parents were married, Jason had either some sort of say or knew what was going on behind the scenes with producers or editors. Or, maybe that experience soured him on reality tv. Who knows, but I don't fault him for keeping his kid off of the show. It's a matter of protection (&, I'm quite sure it's a way to stick it to B too, which I also have no problem with, since I can't stand her). It's a way to protect his relationship with his daughter and a way to preserve her innocence. OC's Simon is a dick, but I do agree with him to keep his & Tamra's kids off of the show, for the same reasons I stated above.

[ScoobieDoobs]

You make a good point.  I wouldn't trust Bethenny's judgement for a second.

[MatildaMoody]

Is this old news? Jason is going to court to prevent Bethenny from exploiting Bryn on the show:

http://radaronline.com/exclusives/2014/10/jason-hoppy-bethenny-frankel-court-bryn-show/

I don't buy this article at all. Jason wouldn't need to get a court order to keep Brynn off the show. All he would need to do is refuse to sign the consent form. There would be  no need to go to court have a judge weigh in. Bravo won't film if he doesn't sign. Simon didn't have to go to court to keep his kids off the show. He only had to refuse to sign the consent. Tamra took him to court to try to force him to sign the consent, but that didn't work.

 

This is Radar Online making shit up.

[hottesthw]

I don't buy this article at all. Jason wouldn't need to get a court order to keep Brynn off the show. All he would need to do is refuse to sign the consent form. There would be no need to go to court have a judge weigh in. Bravo won't film if he doesn't sign. Simon didn't have to go to court to keep his kids off the show. He only had to refuse to sign the consent. Tamra took him to court to try to force him to sign the consent, but that didn't work.

This is Radar Online making shit up.

I was going to say, it's not a kid's god given right to be on a reality show just because one of their parents is a desperate famewhore. If both parents don't agree, no show. And let the famewhore lead the fight to change the other one's mind.

[MatildaMoody]

I was going to say, it's not a kid's god given right to be on a reality show just because one of their parents is a desperate famewhore. If both parents don't agree, no show. And let the famewhore lead the fight to change the other one's mind.

Agreed. And, the other reason i know that Radar has to be making this up is because Simon isn't first father to refuse to sign the consent. First season of Atlanta, Lisa Wu's older children weren't allowed on the show because her ex refused to sign the consent. Same is true with Sonja Morgan. 

If Jason were going through the time and expense of getting a court order to keep Bryn off the show, he would only be doing it for publicity as there is absolutely no other need for him to do it.  

[Grneyedldy]

I think it's possible that Bethenny and Heather might get along well. They have so much in common business wise and personality wise. I think they would be more interesting as allies instead of enemies. I'm hoping with Aviva gone, we can do away with the fake team animosity fuckery.

[Trooper York]

This is only a report from a notorious website. Why not wait until Jason actually files something in court before we throw him under the bus.

On the other hand I read that Bethenny causes Ebola. Now that I can believe!

[robroy]

<best Sarah Palin voive> Ya knowww... its funny howse everytime something involves Beth it makes the gossip sites at the speed of light.  And rarely paints her in a bad light.  Hmmm...<end of Sarah Palin voice> 

 

I think the big difference between Beth and Heather is that Heather has actual friends as well as former co-workers/bosses/mentors she is still on good terms with.  To my knowledge Beth has whatever remains of Julie's carcass and an aging dog.  And 'old eggs' girl.  Beth reminds me of an addict I know and a couple of children of addicts- the image becomes more important than the reality.  On the surface Beth is a raging success but when you peer behind the curtain there is not one functional relationship.  Heather might be bossy but she does have family, friends and former business associates with whom she is still close. 

 

Also- going back a page and a half- I think calling Luanne's circus an estate sale is a fair assessment.  She is literally selling off any and everything people want to buy,  She actually has the kitchen cabinetry, appliances, a claw foot tub and the frickin windows listed.  I would think selling off the furniture and dishes would be enough to move it past yard sale but when you sell off items that are physically attached to the home you get the right to name it whatever you want in my book.

 

And I have to say this is why I love Lu- the other broads can boast about independence or go bankrupt to their hearts content.  But our Lu is gonna strip the house down to the studs, make an extra five bucks and carry on as if it is a Junior League meeting.  I have to respect that.  Well that and the fact that she faced the financial reality the minute she and the Count were dunzo.  No long term delusions a la Sonja or need for the ex to keep propping her up a la Kelly.

 

I think it will be interesting to see how things really go down in terms of Ramona's property split.  For all her boasting I have a strong feeling the NYC condo might have been in Mario's mom's name- why else would they have lived with the woman 15 years?  And the house in the Hamptons is probably community property.  Should prove fun!

Edited October 24, 2014 by robroy

[Mozelle]

I think she will have met her match with either Heather or Carol.....at least I hope so

 

I suspect as much. From the clip of Heather and Bethenny on Bethenny's show, Heather isn't afraid to push back on whatever Bethenny is saying. As for Carole, she pretty much treated Aviva like she was an annoyance and only got upset when Aviva went after her career. That kind of treatment is what got Bethenny riled up with Kelly ("How dare you be dismissive of me?!"). 

 

Speaking of, it's also kind of comical that Bethenny was trying to stand up for Aviva (something about how, "Well, she's an amputee who's dealt with trauma so blah blah blah.") yet back on Scary Island when Sonja was like, "You guys, this is for real. There's something wrong with Kelly," Bethenny couldn't stop herself from still engaging with Kelly. 

Edited October 24, 2014 by Mozelle

[WireWrap]

I don't buy this article at all. Jason wouldn't need to get a court order to keep Brynn off the show. All he would need to do is refuse to sign the consent form. There would be  no need to go to court have a judge weigh in. Bravo won't film if he doesn't sign. Simon didn't have to go to court to keep his kids off the show. He only had to refuse to sign the consent. Tamra took him to court to try to force him to sign the consent, but that didn't work.

 

This is Radar Online making shit up.

Or is it that Bethenny has taken Jason to court instead of the other way around? That seems more probable  to me, Jason refuses to sign the release and Bethenny and her Lawyers take him to Court in an effort to force him. Then they leak the story to ROL in an effort to paint Jason as the bad guy. It's not as if ROL would bother to check the facts on this or any other story/rumor they were handed!

[MatildaMoody]

Or is it that Bethenny has taken Jason to court instead of the other way around? That seems more probable  to me, Jason refuses to sign the release and Bethenny and her Lawyers take him to Court in an effort to force him. Then they leak the story to ROL in an effort to paint Jason as the bad guy. It's not as if ROL would bother to check the facts on this or any other story/rumor they were handed!

I don't know. Bethenny is a narcissistic fame whore, but she is also very savvy. She would have seen just how badly that played out for Tamra. If the subject of Bryn being filmed is even up for debate (I personally don't think it is), I think that Bethenny's attorney would either go directly to Jason with a deal, or she would just agree not to film Bryn.

 

I don't think that whether or not Bryn is filmed is going to be as big of a deal as we are speculating.Considering how hard Andy campaigned to get Bethenny back on the show, I doubt whether or not Bryn is filmed is going to be a deal breaker for Bethenny to be on the show. 

 

I do think that this Radar making shit up simply because even if it is as you suggest, it wouldn't help Bethenny's case at all to file papers forcing Jason to give consent and then planting stories about  it. Especially if Jason knows that he is perfectly within his rights to not sign. Bethenny would lose any control she had of the situation and we know her nature just wouldn't allow for that. 

 

And it certainly makes no sense for Jason to file papers to deny Bryn being filmed since all he had to do is refuse to consent to it. It would make him look bad to publicly do such an expensive and unnecessary thing just to make Bethenny look bad. 

[Almost 3000]

I think the issue of Brin's being filmed or in any media was already negotiated in their custody agreement. I can't imagine Jason and his lawyers not foreseeing an issue with parents already having done reality TV.  Frankly, Bethenny probably had it negotiated on her side too. But then neither team of lawyers requested no cameras in divorce court so...

[MatildaMoody]

I think the issue of Brin's being filmed or in any media was already negotiated in their custody agreement. I can't imagine Jason and his lawyers not foreseeing an issue with parents already having done reality TV.  Frankly, Bethenny probably had it negotiated on her side too. But then neither team of lawyers requested no cameras in divorce court so...

Agreed. Both Bethenny and Jason are way too schooled in the Reality TV game for this not to have already been worked out in their custody. And, I just don't think either of them would send this particular story to Radar Online. It wouldn't make either of them look good because it makes no sense.

 

I seriously just don't see whether or not Bryn is filmed as being a major issue. I think Radar Online is doing what it does best. They are making up a story based on speculation about what they know/believe about each of them and hoping something comes of it. 

[WireWrap]

I don't know. Bethenny is a narcissistic fame whore, but she is also very savvy. She would have seen just how badly that played out for Tamra. If the subject of Bryn being filmed is even up for debate (I personally don't think it is), I think that Bethenny's attorney would either go directly to Jason with a deal, or she would just agree not to film Bryn.

 

I don't think that whether or not Bryn is filmed is going to be as big of a deal as we are speculating.Considering how hard Andy campaigned to get Bethenny back on the show, I doubt whether or not Bryn is filmed is going to be a deal breaker for Bethenny to be on the show. 

 

I do think that this Radar making shit up simply because even if it is as you suggest, it wouldn't help Bethenny's case at all to file papers forcing Jason to give consent and then planting stories about  it. Especially if Jason knows that he is perfectly within his rights to not sign. Bethenny would lose any control she had of the situation and we know her nature just wouldn't allow for that. 

 

And it certainly makes no sense for Jason to file papers to deny Bryn being filmed since all he had to do is refuse to consent to it. It would make him look bad to publicly do such an expensive and unnecessary thing just to make Bethenny look bad. 

I don't think her being on the show is contingent on Bryn being on either but it would help soften Bethenny's hard edge and she knows that. Bethenny's popularity took a hard hit  by the end of her spin off and her talk show did nothing to help restore it. I do think Bethenny will try and go around Jason not wanting Bryn on, this is the same woman that tried to get sole custody in the divorce! I also do not think Jason filed anything in court, IF papers were filed, it was by Bethenny trying to using the court to get around Jason refusal to sign.

[MatildaMoody]

I don't think her being on the show is contingent on Bryn being on either but it would help soften Bethenny's hard edge and she knows that. Bethenny's popularity took a hard hit  by the end of her spin off and her talk show did nothing to help restore it. I do think Bethenny will try and go around Jason not wanting Bryn on, this is the same woman that tried to get sole custody in the divorce! I also do not think Jason filed anything in court, IF papers were filed, it was by Bethenny trying to using the court to get around Jason refusal to sign.

 

I think that if they have already made arrangements through their custody agreement, Bryn's being filmed is going to be a non starter.

If they haven't already made arrangements, I doubt that either of them will be willing to go the court route this early in the game - especially since the financial aspects of their divorce are still pending. 

 

I am trying very hard to not let my feelings about Bethenny or Jason influence this belief. I honestly think that they were both too much alike for their marriage to have ever truly worked. I also think that while they both love Bryn, they are also both more concerned about winning both in public and private to make such an amateurish mistake. 

 

If Bethenny really feels that she needs to film with Bryn, she would probably have her attorneys approach Jason's attorneys rather than go directly to court. Granted, my knowledge of Bethenny's inner workings are based solely on what I've seen of her on television. But I also don't believe that she would want to give Jason the impression that she was asking him for something - thus giving him an even bigger upper hand.

 

Since Jason already has the upper hand in whether or not Bryn is allowed to be filmed, there is no way he would risk the public calling "shenanigans" by filing something so unnecessary with the court, since it would be public record.  

 

Personally, I don't think that either Jason or Bethenny are actually good people. That said, I think they are both wanting to be the winner when it comes to the "Whose the better parent" game.

 

And this story from Radar is completely outside of either of them winning. I mean Jason might get some immediate points for appearing to be the concerned father by filing, but the only reason he would have to file would be if he had already given permission for Bryn to film and was now suddenly changing his mind. He or his attorneys would have to know that angle would not play well.

 

I also think that if Jason said no to filming Bryn, Bethenny would let sleeping dogs rest until she saw how her return on RHNY played out before pursuing any other avenues to get Bryn on screen.

 

ETA: I keep reading that Bethenny's popularity took a major hit all over the place. Can someone tell me how that is quantified? I know that there are tons of comments and blogs about Bethenny, but it seems that the really rabid Bethenny fans haven't changed their minds. Is this idea because she couldn't make her talk show work, or is there a way to actually track a reality personalities popularity? Is it possible that rather than losing the majority of her fans, she simply gained more detractors?

Edited October 25, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[Lisin]

Since Bethennyis back I'm going to open a Bethennytopic, lets continue the discussion there. (Not going to move posts yet. I will later). Thank you!

[ScoobieDoobs]

Bethenny couldn't stop herself from still engaging with Kelly.

 

Actually, on Scary Island Kelly kept poking at B & over & over again.  She was relentlessly trying to provoke her & insult her.  As much as crazy Kelly was saying she was bullied (later on), she actually was the one who was acting like a bully.  Sheesh, given her enormous size, & her masculine presence (I mean, is she on male hormones or was she actually born male & the kids were adopted?) and the fact that she was so clearly unbalanced, likely induced by drugs or booze or a combo of both, honestly I'd have been scared shitless to be on the receiving end of the crap B was getting from her.  One thing I'll give credit to B for -- sometimes she just seems so fearless.  Standing up to Amazon lunatic Kelly could not have been fun or easy.

[Mozelle]

Actually, on Scary Island Kelly kept poking at B & over & over again.  She was relentlessly trying to provoke her & insult her.  As much as crazy Kelly was saying she was bullied (later on), she actually was the one who was acting like a bully.  Sheesh, given her enormous size, & her masculine presence (I mean, is she on male hormones or was she actually born male & the kids were adopted?) and the fact that she was so clearly unbalanced, likely induced by drugs or booze or a combo of both, honestly I'd have been scared shitless to be on the receiving end of the crap B was getting from her.  One thing I'll give credit to B for -- sometimes she just seems so fearless.  Standing up to Amazon lunatic Kelly could not have been fun or easy.

Answering in Bethenny's thread.

[HunterHunted]

I think the Watch What Happens Live Secrets Revealed revealed why Jill will never be asked back. Apparently during her one on one with Andy, she secretly tape recorded the interview and shopped it around afterwards.

[nenya]

I've been on a binge while getting stuff done, so have been half watching the episodes. 

 

All I can say is I am so glad Jill was gone. She was okay in season 1, tolerable in season 2, but in season 3 I just really didn't like her. It wasn't just her, but she was the one who stood out the most. I hated how it became all about her. Like when Bethenny's father died, Jill's first response was all about herself. Why didn't anyone tell her, why didn't she know, who can I text to spread this around? She never let anyone get in a word, and really did act like a high schooler (Alex's conversation with her). I think that, and the end of season 2, were my least favorite LuAnn seasons as well, so I'm so glad she mellowed out afterwards. I think Jill really did let the fame get to her head. 

 

She also seems so needy. I mean, I like my friends, but we all have a lot going on. I don't even call my boyfriend 4x a day. And I think Simon called it when he said she wants someone to be the underdog. First it was Bethenny, then it was LuAnn (post divorce, probably needing more friendship), and there was a little bit of Kelly in there too.

 

Although, if I have to rank it, Kelly would be my least favorite. She is so unintelligible. How did she graduate from Columbia? It is not wonder she only has 3 second conversations with people, anything more than a hello probably makes them run away. I just looked her up, and now she's getting an MBA. This is nuts! I guess she is better at expressing herself in person than on the show. 

[FozzyBear]

I've been on a binge while getting stuff done, so have been half watching the episodes.

All I can say is I am so glad Jill was gone. She was okay in season 1, tolerable in season 2, but in season 3 I just really didn't like her. It wasn't just her, but she was the one who stood out the most. I hated how it became all about her. Like when Bethenny's father died, Jill's first response was all about herself. Why didn't anyone tell her, why didn't she know, who can I text to spread this around? She never let anyone get in a word, and really did act like a high schooler (Alex's conversation with her). I think that, and the end of season 2, were my least favorite LuAnn seasons as well, so I'm so glad she mellowed out afterwards. I think Jill really did let the fame get to her head.

She also seems so needy. I mean, I like my friends, but we all have a lot going on. I don't even call my boyfriend 4x a day. And I think Simon called it when he said she wants someone to be the underdog. First it was Bethenny, then it was LuAnn (post divorce, probably needing more friendship), and there was a little bit of Kelly in there too.

Although, if I have to rank it, Kelly would be my least favorite. She is so unintelligible. How did she graduate from Columbia? It is not wonder she only has 3 second conversations with people, anything more than a hello probably makes them run away. I just looked her up, and now she's getting an MBA. This is nuts! I guess she is better at expressing herself in person than on the show.

I always wondered about Kelly and school too. Maybe she's more crazy and sheltered than straight up dumb.

[nenya]

FozzyBear, because I obviously have no life, I did a little more research. She is doing their online program.

 

I wonder if she is just better at writing. Maybe she has a learning disability or something, so trying to get something out on the spot is difficult for her. That also might be why, on Scary Island, she brought over a pad of paper and told everyone to write it down. I know her talking head said it was so you could crumple it up and throw it away, but I wonder if part of is that she needs to time to formulate her thoughts.

 

Maybe she got away with it at school because her coursework was mostly essays, and she can get away with it in an online class for the same reason. 

 

But most of her behavior in the Scary Island episodes was, well, just scary. 

Edited November 18, 2014 by nenya

[jinjer]

On the WWHL special they went after Jill twice - once with a poll where Jill lost to Ramona.  Apparently she went nuts and went looking at everyone's computers and challenged the results - apparently one carrier wasn't getting through  - she still lost, but not by a landslide.  And the second time when Andy interviewed her after she was fired and she secretly taped the whole interview.  I think Jill is done on Bravo.  

[FozzyBear]

FozzyBear, because I obviously have no life, I did a little more research. She is doing their online program.

I wonder if she is just better at writing. Maybe she has a learning disability or something, so trying to get something out on the spot is difficult for her. That also might be why, on Scary Island, she brought over a pad of paper and told everyone to write it down. I know her talking head said it was so you could crumple it up and throw it away, but I wonder if part of is that she needs to time to formulate her thoughts.

Maybe she got away with it at school because her coursework was mostly essays, and she can get away with it in an online class for the same reason.

But most of her behavior in the Scary Island episodes was, well, just scary.

I could see that. Some of the issues with Kelly has always been that she's a literal person to the point of almost not being able to have a conversation. She really has no sense of humor and no ability to read sarcasm or irony or even metaphor. She's also a pretty black and white moralist with basically no empathy. She may be able to sympathize or feel bad for someone, but she can't seem to see things from another point of view. I'm doing an online master's and i can see the format maybe being a good fit for her. It is more literal and formal than a brick and mortar classroom. Edited November 19, 2014 by FozzyBear

[nenya]

I could see that. Some of the issues with Kelly has always been that she's a literal person to the point of almost not being able to have a conversation. She really has no sense of humor and no ability to read sarcasm or irony or even metaphor. She's also a pretty black and white moralust with basically no empathy. She may be able to sympathize or feel bad for someone, but she can't seem to see things from another point of view. I'm doing an online master's and i can see the format maybe being a good fit for her. It is more literal and formal than a brick and mortar classroom.

 

I think you called her exactly. It was definitely shown over and over on the show. She couldn't get Bethenny's joke about stomping on the grapes (where did she think wine come from?) and kept going on about it not being the 70s and and the feeling fest at the slightest display of emotions. I wonder what will happen when her daughters come of age? Right now, sure it's fun to have mommy talk about hair and cute outfits. But what happens when they want to talk about something real? Actually, her kids probably are that age now, I hope that she has more empathy towards them than she displayed on the show. 

[archer1267]

I actually got Kelly's "Free to Be You and Me" reference, having grown up in the 70s and having that Marlo Thomas album. It was touchy feely before there was a word for it. (Like, there was a song about a boy who preferred to play with dolls, and was teased mercilessly…but hey, Grandma understood that his nurturing side should be encouraged, and bought him a doll of his own. The song ended happily.) And I can see why she would think Bethenny's huffing "You can't handle the truth!" was actually an Al Sharpton impression. The women acted like she was losing it for not getting the Jack Nicholson reference.

 

I can also understand being in a pack of women who are cross-talking and yelling at each other and feeling overwhelmed. I'm thinking of a reunion show where she was trying to express a thought, and kept getting interrupted. Finally, Andy gave her the floor and told everyone to keep quiet. She said her piece and then smiled and said, "See? When I can talk and not be interrupted, it's perfect." I would say that Kelly gets "lost" in a group but then I think of her 1:1 conversations with Alex (where she was aggressive) and she really does know how to channel her inner Mean Girl.

 

I'm not at all discounting the above comments about how Kelly processes information, but think she also just prefers to relate to men. She gets validation from them, and doesn't feel competitive with them.

[KFC]

I think you called her exactly. It was definitely shown over and over on the show. She couldn't get Bethenny's joke about stomping on the grapes (where did she think wine come from?) and kept going on about it not being the 70s and and the feeling fest at the slightest display of emotions. I wonder what will happen when her daughters come of age? Right now, sure it's fun to have mommy talk about hair and cute outfits. But what happens when they want to talk about something real? Actually, her kids probably are that age now, I hope that she has more empathy towards them than she displayed on the show. 

 

From that one little snippet of Kelly discussing Playboy with Teddy and Sea, it seemed like they didn't really rely on their mother for much emotional guidance anyway, heh. She was talking down to them about what Playboy was and their feelings about her appearing in it, and one of the girls made some sarcastic-but-loving "yes, mom, we know what this means, and it's fine" remark and of course Kelly misunderstood the comment and thought the daughter was insulting her. (She wasn't.)

[FozzyBear]

From that one little snippet of Kelly discussing Playboy with Teddy and Sea, it seemed like they didn't really rely on their mother for much emotional guidance anyway, heh. She was talking down to them about what Playboy was and their feelings about her appearing in it, and one of the girls made some sarcastic-but-loving "yes, mom, we know what this means, and it's fine" remark and of course Kelly misunderstood the comment and thought the daughter was insulting her. (She wasn't.)

Kelly is definitely an odd one. I'll admit she bugged me from the get go, but I kind of get annoyed by child-adults. I also think she very self centered and can be quite cruel. On the other hand, I'm not sure it's on purpose. The way she is with people, she sort of acts toward them. Like she talks and has emotions in the general direction of other people, but she doesn't really interact much with others. I'm thinking this is developmental, not just being bitchy since Kelly herself doesn't seem to know the difference.

Edited November 19, 2014 by FozzyBear

[KFC]

Yeah, in retrospect, her presence on the show annoyed me more than even Jill. She had the tragic combo of being dismissive of those she found beneath her AND not being very good in a verbal tussle. Hell, even with Jill you could at least understand what the hell she was talking about when she'd turn her bedazzled raygun on Alex.

[CatMomma]

 

FozzyBear, because I obviously have no life, I did a little more research. She is doing their online program.

 

I'm not disparaging online courses. Hell, I did it before pursuing my masters.  But, Columbia Extension school has open enrollment.  It's not at all the same as actually attending Columbia, where their academic requirements for admission are extremely high.  

 

So, yes, she did attend Columbia, but I think people are amazed because they assume she had to meet certain requirements to attend.  When, really, all she needed was the money to pay for it. Plus, they have limited degree programs and are usually much easier classes.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Um, is this one running outta dough or what?

 

http://pagesix.com/2014/11/29/kelly-bensimon-flies-coach-during-thanksgiving-flight/?_ga=1.265638607.1578229990.1340949624

 

Once the child support dough dries up, she better consult Sonja on how to get by.  Er, is she still just "enjoying her life"?  Fuckin' loon.  Future ain't lookin' too good for crazy Kells.

[vrocotamy]

I could see that. Some of the issues with Kelly has always been that she's a literal person to the point of almost not being able to have a conversation. She really has no sense of humor and no ability to read sarcasm or irony or even metaphor. She's also a pretty black and white moralist with basically no empathy. She may be able to sympathize or feel bad for someone, but she can't seem to see things from another point of view. I'm doing an online master's and i can see the format maybe being a good fit for her. It is more literal and formal than a brick and mortar classroom.

 

I'm normally loathe to do armchair diagnoses, but I think all the characteristics you point to are signs of a schizotypal personality disorder on Kelly's part, or a similar personality disorder with similarities to schizophrenia. Kelly, in other words, is on the milder end of the "spectrum" of schizophrenia. She has the quasi-psychotic episodes, magical thinking, paranoia, inability to empathize, "constricted affect", and inconsistent thought processes (manifested in incoherent speech) to a tee. My other hunch is that she self-medicates with stimulants, whether it's cocaine or Adderall or what, and that her psychic break on St. John's was exacerbated by withdrawal. I just watched the Season 3 Reunion and listening to Kelly talk is like watching static on an old-time TV. There's something wrong with her beyond eccentricity or shyness. It's commonly said that you have to have a personality disorder to be on the Real Housewives, but most of them are fairly banal narcissists with a streak of delusion. The only other HW I'd place in Kelly's category of psychological disturbance is Danielle Staub.

[Sun-Bun]

Um, is this one running outta dough or what?

http://pagesix.com/2014/11/29/kelly-bensimon-flies-coach-during-thanksgiving-flight/?_ga=1.265638607.1578229990.1340949624

Once the child support dough dries up, she better consult Sonja on how to get by. Er, is she still just "enjoying her life"? Fuckin' loon. Future ain't lookin' too good for crazy Kells.

I've always wondered how exactly Kelly has managed to live as well as she has for a dried-up former model who merely juggles various little vanity jobs the way she does.

How much does the odd TV hosting job/random fashion book release/occasional modeling assignment/self-penned magazine article/former jewelry line really pay?

Child support checks from Gilles must pay decently, but how much dough is a well-known fashion photographer really worth? Not to mention her daughters are both teenagers now, so the checks will dry up in less than 5 years...then what??

She did have to sell her Hamptons home a few years ago, so maybe she invested that money well and is able to get by on various residuals and maybe former spousal support/her divorce settlement, but still, it ain't cheap living well in Manhattan and she ain't out there proudly hustling for extra paid writing work like say, Carole Radziwill.

I've often wondered if her fabulous downtown loft is paid for or a rental as well---it's gotta be worth a pretty penny, being that it's a 2 bedroom/2 bathroom stunner where she lives with her daughters. I'm guessing Giles bought it for them long ago since she's reportedly lived there for so long and he supposedly has a place in the same loft building?

But her lifestyle/mindset has always been a bit of an enigma to me---not to mention the fact that she's apparently never had another long-term relationship or marriage after Gilles.

I find her supposed mental issues both fascinating and frightening; she apparently never quite bounced back from the former adulation of hot young model-turned famous photographer's muse/wife and her social/fashion connections are dwindling along with her youth/good looks. Very appropriate that she could get lost in the land of Sonja Morgan delusions if she's not careful and doesn't plan her estate/earnings accordingly.

It's also astonishing that someone who seems as daffy and "off" as she is actually graduated from college and has written several books.

[vrocotamy]

I've always wondered how exactly Kelly has managed to live as well as she has for a dried-up former model who merely juggles various little vanity jobs the way she does.

How much does the odd TV hosting job/random fashion book release/occasional modeling assignment/self-penned magazine article/former jewelry line really pay?

Child support checks from Gilles must pay decently, but how much dough is a well-known fashion photographer really worth? Not to mention her daughters are both teenagers now, so the checks will dry up in less than 5 years...then what??

She did have to sell her Hamptons home a few years ago, so maybe she invested that money well and is able to get by on various residuals and maybe former spousal support/her divorce settlement, but still, it ain't cheap living well in Manhattan and she ain't out there proudly hustling for extra paid writing work like say, Carole Radziwill.

I've often wondered if her fabulous downtown loft is paid for or a rental as well---it's gotta be worth a pretty penny, being that it's a 2 bedroom/2 bathroom stunner where she lives with her daughters. I'm guessing Giles bought it for them long ago since she's reportedly lived there for so long and he supposedly has a place in the same loft building?

But her lifestyle/mindset has always been a bit of an enigma to me---not to mention the fact that she's apparently never had another long-term relationship or marriage after Gilles.

I find her supposed mental issues both fascinating and frightening; she apparently never quite bounced back from the former adulation of hot young model-turned famous photographer's muse/wife and her social/fashion connections are dwindling along with her youth/good looks. Very appropriate that she could get lost in the land of Sonja Morgan delusions if she's not careful and doesn't plan her estate/earnings accordingly.

It's also astonishing that someone who seems as daffy and "off" as she is actually graduated from college and has written several books.

 

If Kelly has schizotypal or even schizoaffective personality disorder, as I strongly suspect, as opposed to full-blown schizophrenia, it's not terribly unusual that she graduated from college (albeit in the "general studies", adult education format) and has worked (albeit bouncing from job to job.) My quasi-estranged aunt (she lives one town away from me and only pops up every few years to ask, seemingly irrelevantly, about dentistry or pet care) is quite a bit like Kelly. She has the black-and-white thinking, paranoid delusions, magical thinking (delusions of reference), obsessive tendencies, extreme literalism, and inability to empathize that Kelly displays. Nevertheless, my aunt has graduated from college and graduate school, and has worked variously as a computer programmer, public health inspector, and governmental health policy researcher. It takes about 15 minutes of talking to my aunt about non-work-related life to realize that she's mentally unbalanced (she moves constantly and believes her landlords are trying to poison her, etc.) People on the schizophrenic spectrum, even if they cause extreme suffering to themselves and their loved ones, can function fairly well on paper. I suspect Kelly was closely managed within the fashion industry, and relies on that support network in order to land her little "vanity jobs." Gilles, her industry contacts, and likely her parents have insulated her from having to deal with life responsibilities in an unmediated way, and so she's been able to lead life (to our knowledge) without having to seek psychiatric help. Any breakdowns she's had have been kept out of the public eye by her support network. I also wouldn't be surprised if she self-medicates through drugs, and the full psychotic break on camera was brought about by withdrawal.

 

I do believe that the St. John's breakdown we saw was only about 10-20% as frightening as it really was. Bethenny was likely correct in saying that airing it unedited would have terrified viewers (in addition to breaking down the narrative of the episode.) If Bravo had aired Kelly's psychotic break in its entirety, they would have been (rightly) accused of not doing enough to protect the other cast members from Kelly or protect Kelly from herself.

Edited December 2, 2014 by vrocotamy

[ryebread]

She did have to sell her Hamptons home a few years ago, so maybe she invested that money well and is able to get by on various residuals and maybe former spousal support/her divorce settlement, but still, it ain't cheap living well in Manhattan and she ain't out there proudly hustling for extra paid writing work like say, Carole Radziwill..

Carole proudly hustles?  I can't find any evidence that Carole has written anything lately except her Bravo blog.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Child support checks from Gilles must pay decently, but how much dough is a well-known fashion photographer really worth?

 

 

Oh he's certainly worth in the millions.  He's no billionaire, but he's done well.  Keep in mind, he's worked for many decades as a top photographer, maybe not for Vogue, but other top fashion mags.  But yeah, if she's really gonna be "enjoying her life" in a high way, she just doesn't have the kinda dough to spend endlessly on Birkin bags & luxury travel.  I suspect that's what she has been doing & the cash is startin' to run low.  Is it the Manhattan lifestyle dat's dryin' her cash up too?  Nah, I don't think so.  It's this "enjoying her life" crapola.  She's probably spending way too much on stupid shit & spending more than she can afford to & just being generally stupid with her money -- cuz well, she's an idiot.

 

Gotta, say she really rubbed the wrong way with that fuckin' stupid idiotic line that she's just "enjoying her life."  Why is that, Kells?  Cuz the operation to cut off the penis you were born with was somewhat successful?  I mean, really -- who in the fuckety fuck is going along (after 30) just trying to enjoy their life?  Other than a completely self-absorbed waste of shit like Paris Hilton.  After she said that shit bout enjoying her life, I so fuckin' wanted B to verbally beat the hell outta her.

I can't find any evidence that Carole has written anything lately except her Bravo blog.

 

 

I thought she has a regular column with some magazine.  Anyone know?

[Sun-Bun]

Carole proudly hustles? I can't find any evidence that Carole has written anything lately except her Bravo blog.

I follow her on Instagram and thus get more regular scoop on her daily doings, but she does freelance writing/articles for various magazines/websites, she's working on yet another book(this one is a collection of essays), and she's recently filmed a few upcoming beauty campaigns and commercials.

All I'm saying is that I get more of a go-getter vibe from her than from Kelly, especially since she's been refreshingly frank about her reasoning for doing the show: "I'm a single woman with bills to pay."

Edited December 1, 2014 by Sun-Bun

[vrocotamy]

I've been on a binge while getting stuff done, so have been half watching the episodes. 

 

All I can say is I am so glad Jill was gone. She was okay in season 1, tolerable in season 2, but in season 3 I just really didn't like her. It wasn't just her, but she was the one who stood out the most. I hated how it became all about her. Like when Bethenny's father died, Jill's first response was all about herself. Why didn't anyone tell her, why didn't she know, who can I text to spread this around? She never let anyone get in a word, and really did act like a high schooler (Alex's conversation with her). I think that, and the end of season 2, were my least favorite LuAnn seasons as well, so I'm so glad she mellowed out afterwards. I think Jill really did let the fame get to her head. 

 

She also seems so needy. I mean, I like my friends, but we all have a lot going on. I don't even call my boyfriend 4x a day. And I think Simon called it when he said she wants someone to be the underdog. First it was Bethenny, then it was LuAnn (post divorce, probably needing more friendship), and there was a little bit of Kelly in there too.

 

Although, if I have to rank it, Kelly would be my least favorite. She is so unintelligible. How did she graduate from Columbia? It is not wonder she only has 3 second conversations with people, anything more than a hello probably makes them run away. I just looked her up, and now she's getting an MBA. This is nuts! I guess she is better at expressing herself in person than on the show. 

 

As Bethenny accused her of during the Season 3 Reunion, fame really got to Jill's head. It took over Jill's head. I think Jill is a perfect cautionary tale for those women considering becoming Housewives. Prior to RHONY (and in early seasons), she seemed like a fairly nice, normal middle-aged housewife of means, albeit one with a dramatic, pushy, materialistic, and self-absorbed streak. By Season 3, she'd fully drunk the Bravo Kool-Aid and come to believe she was the rightful fan favorite and was the linchpin of the show's dramatic action. Out of jealousy, he went against the true fan favorite and former friend Bethenny, against producers' advice, believing she was serving a vital function for the show - as she, of course, saw herself as its permanent center. Jill, in the process, lost her respectable fanbase. She then got fired and will probably never get over it. Jill made a fool of herself (and made herself persona non grata at Bravo) by taping her WWHL One-on-One and trying to sell it to bloggers, hoping it would vindicate her, not realizing there's nothing to be vindicated.* Appearing on cable TV opened this unquenchable thirst for fame that seems to have annihilated Jill's dignity, self-respect, and grip on reality. For the rest of her days, she'll likely never come to terms, entirely, with being fired. Her desire for fame is now her life. I feel sorry for her husband and daughter.

 

Admittedly, there are other Housewives whose appearances on the program have helped them ruin their lives. But Jill is remarkable because her appearance on Bravo didn't bring to the forefront or exacerbate existing issues - like Kim's alcoholism and Taylor's grifterism/abusive marriage on RHOBH or the affinity for white-collar crime and sleaze of virtually the entire cast on RHONJ. Jill's self-ruination through Housewives seems to be solely due to the megalomania and delusion she developed while on camera for four years.

 

*Apparently, Jill was going to film a guest spot on the last season of RHONY, but Ramona advised against it and production quickly realized it was a bad idea.

Edited December 1, 2014 by vrocotamy