S06.E20: The Last Leg

[sasha206]

They mighta made a lame remark or 2.  BFD.  I've heard worse stuff from Joan Rivers or Kathy Griffin.  It was nowhere near the level of awfulness that Veevs spewed.  At some moments Veevs reminded me of Linda Blair possessed in The Exorcist.  The thought of empathy for Veevs gives me a giggle.  Waste of time & effort to me.  Doubt she'd appreciate or want any empathy.

 

Joan Rivers and Kathy Griffins are comedians that make a living off of outrageous remarks.  Heather, Carole, Luann, Kristin, Ramona, et. al., aren't.  They are castmates.  That analogy doesn't quite work for me.

 

For my part, as I've said numerous times, I'm not a fan of hers.  I'm not defending her.  But the ounce of empathy I have for her is based on her being hounded because she didn't go on a trip hosted by a whiny model who can't seem to handle the smallest of issues and perceives everything as a slight to the point that she felt the need to bring medical records with her to justify not going on a trip.  And when she does, she gets an impromptu intervention from people that are just trying to "help her" at a birthday party.

It was meant to be entertainment.

What do you think of Aviva's own pun (her tagline)?

 

There's a big difference between a fat person using self-deprecation and another person deciding it's okay to make fat jokes.  Understand?  If a coworker made a comment about the size of her ass, I'm sure you wouldn't think this gives you license to talk about her fat ass right?  So I wouldn't think it was okay to make a cute pun about someone's disability because well, gee, they make jokes about it!

Edited July 25, 2014 by sasha206

[ScoobieDoobs]

Gang up or impromptu intervention -- call it what you may, I'm just not seeing it.  I can play 6 thousand moments where Aviva has acted so horribly.  She still gets absolutely no empathy from me.  But I am curious how it's gonna go at the reunion & how the ratings will go.  A three part reunion sounds like overkill to me.

[breezy424]

So, just to clarify, this is what happened when Carole said Aviva was nothing.  See video:

 

http://www.christianpost.com/news/real-housewives-of-new-york-season-6-carole-blasts-liar-aviva-over-bookgate-youre-nothing-video-116381/

 

Also, as for Heather saying that the first doctor was wrong, no, she never said or implied that.  What she did say was that they got a second opinion and that doctor said that he didn't think the surgery would benefit Jax.  Heather then stated that, after talking it over with Jax who said he didn't feel his hearing was that bad, they decided to hold off on any surgery for now.  There was nothing said or implied that the first doctor's opinion was wrong.

 

As for the other housewives confronting Aviva about her behavior, I don't believe that Aviva is mentally unstable.  Rather, she is a person who has mental problems.  Big difference.  As I've stated before, Kelly's behavior on Scary Island seemed to be of a person who is mentally unstable (Al Sharpton, her dream about Bethenny).  Aviva's behavior has been of someone who is very calculated and her phobia's, etc. have been used by her when it's convenient.  Treating Aviva with kid gloves isn't the answer.  She needed to be told that no one is buying into her game and she does 'need help'.

 

Lastly, I don't think any of the women think that Aviva's loss of her leg is trivial and understand the trauma that one can have because of this experience.  The problem they have (myself included) is that Aviva's phobias, etc. come and go when it suits her.  I don't think (and Ramona said this) that they would have a problem if she said she's afraid to go to a place far away for an extended time without Reid.  That would be understandable given the fears one may have being an amputee and if somethng happened.  It was about something else (asthma) that came out of the blue.  Aviva is quite capable when she wants to be.  She's also quite self confident (her confrontation with Carole over the book) when she wants to be.    IMO, she's a fake who does need therapy, not someone who needs to be coddled for mental illness.  I think she's been coddled most of her life which is probably one of the reasons she is like she is (plus having a really screwd up father but I have no desire to go there.  And I think think she goes right along with his games).

[sasha206]

My biggest issue with Aviva is not her phobias, but rather with her making excuses for her sexual predator dad.  But I think there are real issues there that probably do make her a very sick person.  Not only has he made inappropriate and also pretty much assaulted women, but he's also made creepy comments about his own daughter.

 

My biggest issue with the ladies is that they want to give her an intervention because she didn't go on a fucking trip (because Munchausen by Proxy).  How about giving two fucks that Sonja gets an erect penis jammed at her and Kristin gets felt up?  'They laughed that shit right off.  

My biggest issue with Aviva is not her phobias, but rather with her making excuses for her sexual predator dad.  But I think there are real issues there that probably do make her a very sick person.  Not only has he made inappropriate and also pretty much assaulted women, but he's also made creepy comments about his own daughter.

 

My biggest issue with the ladies is that they want to give her an intervention because she didn't go on a fucking trip (because Munchausen by Proxy).  How about giving two fucks that Sonja gets an erect penis jammed at her and Kristin gets felt up?  'They laughed that shit right off.  

 

 

I'm sorry I haven't read any/or memorized all your posts. It was an honest question about Aviva's tagline.

 

Which is why I said, "Maybe you missed my comment."  

 

Not sure why there seems to be this undercurrent of nasty right now.  So I'm out.

Edited July 25, 2014 by sasha206

[aradia22]

 

 

I can save you lots of time - they've never made fun of her disability. Maybe you're thinking of Aviva's own tagline: "people say I'm...(something....I can't remember), but they're just pulling my leg!"

Yes they did.  Heather did it while training for the Mudder and Carole did it too...I can't remember when but it was around that same time.  And it was something about Aviva not having a leg to stand on.

Guys, stop it. You're not going to make me watch that damn marathon. ;) My sense is that the comments occurred towards the beginning of the season around the Bookgate fiasco. It's possible they were on the beach but then maybe I just remember a lot of beach scenes at the beginning of the season. Do they ever film when it's snowing? New York can be really pretty when it's snowing. 

 

Also, unrelated, I hate Joan Rivers with a passion. I want to champion good female comedians. She's just not one of them.

[Lola16]

Aviva had her leg revision surgery (removal of calf) at age 26.

 

Aviva also has claimed to have been a model in her 20s, traveling to Europe for gigs.  She didn't meet Harry until after this.  Not sure when all these phobias started.

 

 

eta: Aviva was 26 when she had her revision surgery

Edited July 25, 2014 by Lola16

[LotusFlower]

There's a big difference between a fat person using self-deprecation and another person deciding it's okay to make fat jokes.  Understand?  If a coworker made a comment about the size of her ass, I'm sure you wouldn't think this gives you license to talk about her fat ass right?  So I wouldn't think it was okay to make a cute pun about someone's disability because well, gee, they make jokes about it!

There are lots of variables here, but I think someone who uses self-deprecating humor is, in a certain way, giving liberties. Those liberties only go so far, though, and again, it depends. In any event, I think this subject should be tabled until there's an actual example cited. This has all been based on a hypothetical, which I don't think is fair for the accused!

[ScoobieDoobs]

My biggest issue with the ladies is that they want to give her an intervention because she didn't got on a fucking trip.

 

Was that an intervention?  Cuz I didn't get the impression they all got together & did an intervention -- similar to what they did to Ramona when Lu wouldn't let her out.  If it was an intervention, it seemed pretty tame to me.  Just a lot of eye rolling & giggling.  Mostly, they didn't wanna interact with her.  How is that an intervention?  The actual intervention they did to Moaner was far worse.  So what's the big deal?  

 

Laughing off George's shit was inexcusable.  I won't forget that easily.   The notion of his sexual assaults being hilarious seemed to be pervasive -- extending to everyone involved with the show.  And it begins with Andy Cohen.  Speaks volumes.

 

Also, unrelated, I hate Joan Rivers with a passion.

 

Given that Fashion Police has great ratings cuz of her -- a lot of people would disagree with you, including me.  Anyhoo, Veevs' cracks & sneering snippy comments have been every bit as vicious as Joan's, whether on the show or in her blog.  She seems to be consistent in her ugly, ugly, ugly remarks, so maybe Joannie is a hero of hers.

Edited July 25, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[Pollock]

Luann told Sonja that her beef wasn't with her, but with Harry and why he left her at the party. So that sounds like they left separately.  Now Heather says they all left together, so I'm picturing Luann & Harry in a separate cab, with everybody else following and heading to the same location. I still question Sonja's story of chasing down their cab.  If that's not true, then what are the circumstances surrounding her injury?  Why wasn't she in the cab with everybody else?  I don't believe that Luann had any intention of being romantic with Harry.  I wish we could see all of the footage of them leaving the party.  It is a bit confusing.

Carole stated in her blog that Sonja's injury occured in the club they went after. 

"Sonja may have run through the streets of New York chasing Harry (which, she didn't) but then she fell and sprained her ankle, drunk in the same club with Harry and LuAnn and Heather and Jonathan."

As for the timeline of them living, it remains a mystery and I don't know why the Countess would play along with Sonja's story the morning after stating "I thought you went home" or something to that effect. Or I'm afraid I know : she wouldn't blow her co-worker storyline. See Sonja ! That's a true friend after all !

 

On a shallow note, I'm frustrated they didn't film the after party at the club. Would have been cool to see those five having legit fun.

For once.

Edited July 25, 2014 by Pollock

[breezy424]

Yes.  Very sad to me.  I said long ago that I was surprised that Heather, especially, couldn't understand why Aviva might have major issues.  Heather has spent time with children in a hospital.  Her son has been/will be teased for his differences.  FACT.  I don't care what a raving lunatic you think someone is, if you have one shred of awareness  - which she should - for an adult who grew up with extenuating physical injury/ailment, you'd step away from the crazy at least and not poke it at best.

Carol?  Yeah, it was great that she gave Aviva her leg back.  But then she tells her she's weird and she needs help.  Like Aviva hasn't heard she's weird since she was a 6 year old with a stump for a leg.  Ugh.  They all disgust me. Yes, Aviva, too, for other reasons. When I saw this pic of her, my heart softened a little. There are other pics of her as child that are better but this one got me. The trauma she suffered as a 6 year old would be horrifying.  A pre-teen girl trying to fit in with a disability like hers? Another kind of trauma altogether.  You don't come out of something like that without some major issues.  It's a picture of her at what looks about 10 years old on the side of a pool.

http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-6/photos/before-they-were-housewives-new-york-edition?cid=showmain_highlights#image-187038

 

Actually, Carole did not tell Aviva she was 'wierd' when she gave Aviva back her leg.  She did say that she needed help and that (or this) is not ok.

[sasha206]

Was that an intervention?  Cuz I didn't get the impression they all got together & did an intervention -- similar to what they did to Ramona when Lu wouldn't let her out.  If it was an intervention, it seemed pretty tame to me.  Just a lot of eye rolling & giggling.  Mostly, they didn't wanna interact with her.  How is that an intervention?  The actual intervention they did to Moaner was far worse.  So what's the big deal?  

.

 

Sorry -- really didn't mean a literal intervention. They are at a party and several of them start doing their pyschoanalysis of her.  I  think she's a sick woman who needs real therapy, so real friends in a calm manner giving her examples of why they think she needs help isn't a bad idea.  Her dad being the biggest reason in my mind.

 

Anyway, I've made the same points over and over again so no need to beat the dead horse!  Night all!

Edited July 25, 2014 by sasha206

[ScoobieDoobs]

The big question now is -- are they on the verge of firing Veevs?  Or are they possibly reconsidering?  Sure, she's a difficult employee who does her own thing & routinely refuses to go on the trips, which are a major part of the show.  But her leg-throwing shit kinda has saved the show, hasn't it?  Hmmmm.  That she wasn't on WWHL after the ep aired could be a sign she's toast -- or not.

[LotusFlower]

Actually, Carole did not tell Aviva she was 'wierd' when she gave Aviva back her leg.  She did say that she needed help and that (or this) is not ok.

Right. If Carole had used the word "weird," it would have been a compliment. She has said frequently that she loves weird.

[MatildaMoody]

I've always thought Carole started all the shit at that lunch but I was afraid to come out of the closet on that one. LOL.  Imo, she got the ball rolling and Aviva started going nuts.  Carole tells Heather, HER version of the lunch.  Heather takes it upon herself to investigate and invite her good pal (not) for a pedicure.  (Why? I dunno.  Because she'd believe Carole even if Heather saw it with her own 2 eyes.) I'd qualify that as a poke.  MatildaMoody this is one example of what I consider the poking.  The next day, Heather tells Carole that she went to a pedi with Aviva.  "Did she say anything about me?"  "Yeah, she brought you up." 

 

Um. No she didn't you liar, Heather.  You took her out to dig for info and in your inimitable way, did most of the talking and skewed the conversation to what you wanted to hear.

Then the fight at Aviva's.  Again, imo, Carole starts it.  Once again, Heather gets Carole's version.  Holy hell breaks loose because the bulldog Heather is now in hot pursuit on behalf of her friend.

All the ladies are bowled over, cowed by Heather for the remainder of the season, so her word is king.  And for me, that's where the trouble begins with Carole's side of the story.  I know mine is not a popular opinion but there it is. 

OK. I think we will have to agree to disagree here. 

1. I do believe that Aviva in her sycophantic "I must make up with the women I called white trash as well as make sure that I am on the good side of the women I didn't alienate last season, even though I haven't bothered to talk to them at all between filming" way did ask Carole about ghostwriters, editors, and publishers off camera.
2. I doubt that it was Heather's idea to meet up with a woman that she didn't care for, but whom she also knew had only one foot for pedicures - Aviva was the one to make the joke about the pedicure being half priced after all. 
3. If a good friend told me about some awful gossip that was being spread by a total novice in my industry, I would be just as ride or die as Heather is about it. And if said good friend asked me if she was brought up in the conversation I would totally tell her if she were.
4. Heather and Carole's conversation about whether or not Carole was brought up wasn't in Aviva's presence and really had nothing to do with Aviva - only the things that were said about Carole.
5. The fight at Aviva's was because RAMONA urged Carole to confront Aviva about the things that Aviva had not only said to Heather but had also repeated to Ramona and Sonja with her own vicious spin on it.

None of those things poked Aviva. All of those things were Aviva hoping and praying for drama that would actually revolve around her and doing everything that she could to ensure that they would. The main reason that I believe Carole when she said that Aviva had approached her about helping her find a ghostwriter was the because of the way that it was brought up at the lunch. It was brought up as though it was something that they had already discussed and were ok with discussing on camera. Carole was the one who reacted with surprise, not Aviva. Aviva was hoping that Carole would mention it so that she could blindside her. The same way she was hoping that someone would call her fake at Sonja's "Team Sonja" party. The only difference was that no one did call Aviva fake at the party, so she had to wing it. 

Carole was caught off guard at that lunch and she learned her lesson - as did everyone else - by the time of the finale party.

 

Which is pretty much why everyone was so disengaged with Aviva at Sonja's party. And which is pretty much why Aviva's leg toss was met with laughter even by Sonja's interns and hanger on's.

 

ETA: Aviva should really take lessons from Tamra of the OC. At least when Tamra tries to stir up shit she makes sure that she is in the middle enough that people actually CARE enough to still worry about being her friend.

Edited July 25, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[ScoobieDoobs]

A link was posted in the Aviva thread, but I think it should be posted here as well.  It was posted by Lola16, so thanks should go to her.  It's a story on Aviva at 28 & it's a very interesting poignant read that's difficult not to be touched by.

 

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Zone%3A+I+lost+my+leg+in+an+accident+at+the+age+of+6,+but+I+fought+to...-a060390961

 

I have said several times I feel no empathy for Aviva based on the vile way I've seen her behave on the show.  And I haven't changed my mind on that, but this link tells Aviva's backstory in a very affecting way & shows just how brave she has been.  What I'm so puzzled by is the vast disconnect between the courageous & perseverant young woman described in the story in that link & the horrible screaming nasty shrew we've only seen on the show.

[Mozelle]

OK. I think we will have to agree to disagree here. 

1. I do believe that Aviva in her sycophantic "I must make up with the women I called white trash as well as make sure that I am on the good side of the women I didn't alienate last season, even though I haven't bothered to talk to them at all between filming" way did ask Carole about ghostwriters, editors, and publishers off camera.
2. I doubt that it was Heather's idea to meet up with a woman that she didn't care for, but whom she also knew had only one foot for pedicures - Aviva was the one to make the joke about the pedicure being half priced after all. 
3. If a good friend told me about some awful gossip that was being spread by a total novice in my industry, I would be just as ride or die as Heather is about it. And if said good friend asked me if she was brought up in the conversation I would totally tell her if she were.
4. Heather and Carole's conversation about whether or not Carole was brought up wasn't in Aviva's presence and really had nothing to do with Aviva - only the things that were said about Carole.
5. The fight at Aviva's was because RAMONA urged Carole to confront Aviva about the things that Aviva had not only said to Heather but had also repeated to Ramona and Sonja with her own vicious spin on it.

None of those things poked Aviva. All of those things were Aviva hoping and praying for drama that would actually revolve around her and doing everything that she could to ensure that they would. The main reason that I believe Carole when she said that Aviva had approached her about helping her find a ghostwriter was the because of the way that it was brought up at the lunch. It was brought up as though it was something that they had already discussed and were ok with discussing on camera. Carole was the one who reacted with surprise, not Aviva. Aviva was hoping that Carole would mention it so that she could blindside her. The same way she was hoping that someone would call her fake at Sonja's "Team Sonja" party. The only difference was that no one did call Aviva fake at the party, so she had to wing it. 

Carole was caught off guard at that lunch and she learned her lesson - as did everyone else - by the time of the finale party.

 

Which is pretty much why everyone was so disengaged with Aviva at Sonja's party. And which is pretty much why Aviva's leg toss was met with laughter even by Sonja's interns and hanger on's.

 

ETA: Aviva should really take lessons from Tamra of the OC. At least when Tamra tries to stir up shit she makes sure that she is in the middle enough that people actually CARE enough to still worry about being her friend.

 

I think that this is an important point because a lot of stuff is being attributed to Heather and Carole regarding Aviva. Ramona made mention of the ghost writing thing to Carole and urged a confrontation there. Then at LuAnn's Carole was quite content on interacting with everyone else but Aviva until the two were urged to talk it out. Even at Kristen's clam bake, Carole was more about talking to Mario about his single friends when Aviva came over. After that debacle, Carole stayed far away from Aviva. At some point during this, Heather and Aviva did meet up--first for the pedicure and later at a restaurant. After that argument at the restaurant, Aviva wasn't at Heather's anniversary party; Heather didn't want that drama mama there after all was said and done.

 

Kristen made a big deal about Aviva not going to Montana. When they were in Montana, I believe it was either Kristen or Sonja who mentioned Aviva's asthma followed by Ramona saying that she would call Aviva right then and there. Carole's contribution was to say that she believes that Aviva has Munchausen syndrome, but I don't recall her (or Heather) jumping up to run to a telephone or leading the conversation there. When they got back, Sonja--she of Team Sonja; she who lied about fucking Russ; she who created a sprained ankle story line; she who created a proposal to propose moment with Harry--called Aviva over to tell her all about how the women just couldn't keep Aviva's name out their mouths. 

 

For someone who was supposedly obsessed with Aviva, Carole sure made certain that Aviva's ass wasn't going to be anywhere at her birthday party. I mean, by the time of Sonja's birthday party, Carole, Heather, and Aviva hadn't shared any scenes together. Like, for real. The last scene between Aviva and Carole was Kristen's Fourth of July clambake (and Sonja's Team Sonja party was sometime in September, if I recall correctly), and the last scene between Heather and Aviva was the restaurant shout match. Aviva came up between Kristen, Heather, and Carole only because they knew that Aviva would be at Sonja's party.

 

Once at that party, Kristen brought up Aviva's weight loss. Ramona also made mention of it. Again, two women not Carole and Heather. I think that Aviva sensed that Carole wasn't going to engage, and in order to get Carole to engage she went for Carole's hot button issue--the ghost writing of her memoir. That's why I kind of liked that Heather, in her frustration, was like, "Carole!" (as in let it go. This chick is purposely trying to get under your skin) and Carole dropped it. 

Edited July 25, 2014 by Mozelle

[Neurochick]

FTR, I don't think Aviva has mental health issues other than she is an attention seeking famewhore who wants to be known for #leggate as a vain attempt to keep her spot on the show.

 

 

I agree.  I think Aviva is sick and her disease is famewhoreitus, or mememememeitus.

[andie012]

Could be although so much of her breakdowns seemed manufactured to me. I think that is what confuses me.  In her first couple of RHONY episodes, she seemed very natural and low keyed.  At most, she maybe shit stirred a bit.  But she never struck me as being a put on or really being neurotic.  Then when I think she was viewed as being boring, suddenly the bad behavior starts.  

 

It's just hard for me to believe that the leg throwing woman is *really* the true Aviva and not an "I'm now addicted to celebrity so I'm going to pull out all the stops to stay on this show." 

This.  The following is a quote from Aviva's 5/27 blog and the minute I read it I thought to myself oh, she thinks she needs to decide what is good TV for me: 

Check out my new product Tranquil Day! It is an all natural anti-stress supplement. It chills you out and helps to sleep and is very healthy for you! Don't worry -- I don't take it before filming. . .That would be terrible for ratings!

I decided that day that Aviva was playing a character and bringing the x-rays, doctor's notes, throwing her leg that's all part of the script that she's come up with for the season.  The issue for me is I don't tune into to the Real Housewives so that I can see completely scripted drama (I know it's not all read).  If I want that I'll turn on Scandal, just as over the top but much better acting.

[sasha206]

It amazes me when people that seem to have a great lifestyle like Aviva would rather become a celebrity and act this way on a reality show.  I can better understand a youngster who is hoping that with the fame comes money and they act that way. But she doesn't need the money.

[sasha206]

I agree.  I think Aviva is sick and her disease is famewhoreitus, or mememememeitus.

 

Yes, that makes the most sense to me.

[zoeysmom]

After watching Aviva for two seasons it is rather apparent that she was out for the "shock and awe" that is Aviva.  Was she a truth cannon-no, did she try and wring out the most drama in every scene absolutely.  If she couldn't bring it she enlisted her father. 

 

I do have empathy for Aviva because she advocated and raised money for amputee causes.  I believe at times she was put in the position of being the advocate with the idea to nothing can keep an amputee down to a very realistic set of barriers that precluded her from being able to participate in some activities.

 

The women did make a big deal out of Aviva not going to Montana.  They talked about it at the western wear store, Kristen told Josh about it, they talked about it at the airport, they talked about it in the cars travelling to the resort, they talked about it at dinner complete with their five cent diagnoses on Aviva's alleged mental health disorders, Sonja made a joke about it when she didn't want to go glamping.

 

When the forced Heather/Aviva dinner came up Heather made a point of telling Aviva she was having a party and she would have to weigh in with Jonathan if Aviva could be invited. (Like anyone believes that heather really weighed in with Jonathan.)  Obviously Heather left her dangling so why would Aviva ever want to go to another Heather sponsored event or spend  a week with a woman who was very calculated in publicly advising Aviva of a party and then publicly humiliating her by essentially freezing her out of the event. So Aviva skipped out on The Berkshires and skipped out on the Montana trip.  With Carole loathing Aviva why would anyone expect to her to go?  Should Aviva said, "I am not well liked and I will spoil your trip." Or "I cannot horseback ride, rappel, river fish, take hikes, or get into a canoe as I have not adapted myself to those skills although many of my fellow amputees have been able to adapt to with training."

 

When it came camera time for Carole-she went Aviva's engagement party for George.  Aviva when invited to a charity lunch did what she always does-try and make the event about her.  Granted the one who really misbehaved was Heather but Heather is always given a pass.  When it came time for Aviva to help LuAnn's daughter out with an art show-LuAnn used it as an opportunity to repeatedly call Aviva a liar.  Aviva just had to one up LuAnn in the manufactured drama department.  (A little note of etiquette to LuAnn the woman at the luncheon is a FORMER Miss USA, as opposed to the reigning or current Miss USA, an ex-Miss USA is one who is forced to give up her title.)

 

So the idea that any of these women felt the need to bring up Aviva to Aviva was just a farce and Aviva upped the ante by pulling her leg stunt.  Ramona's wine glass toss and Aviva's leg pitch were the episodes with the highest ratings.  It says a lot about the audience (of which I am a part of) and Bravo's promotion.

[msblossom]

A link was posted in the Aviva thread, but I think it should be posted here as well.  It was posted by Lola16, so thanks should go to her.  It's a story on Aviva at 28 & it's a very interesting poignant read that's difficult not to be touched by.

 

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Zone%3A+I+lost+my+leg+in+an+accident+at+the+age+of+6,+but+I+fought+to...-a060390961

 

I have said several times I feel no empathy for Aviva based on the vile way I've seen her behave on the show.  And I haven't changed my mind on that, but this link tells Aviva's backstory in a very affecting way & shows just how brave she has been.  What I'm so puzzled by is the vast disconnect between the courageous & perseverant young woman described in the story in that link & the horrible screaming nasty shrew we've only seen on the show.

I agree with your entire post and thank you for including Lola16's article on Aviva as I hadn't seen this earlier.

So odd that Aviva has zeroed in on Carole as her number one enemy when she was so enamored by her last season. I think she is lashing out against Carole because Carole is so selective about who she lets in her inner circle in real life and Aviva didn't make the cut. Heather did. Carole *tolerates* the other HWs in a condescending way, but no one but Heather has a real friendship with Carole and I think at one time Aviva thought she was building that with Carole and when she figured that out the ugly came out in her. She didn't want to be condescended to and she went crazy with vitriol when Carole wouldn't help her with publishing contacts for her book. She's been seeing red ever since. I agree that she's using some of it to exploit herself on the show and to secure her position, but I think it comes from a place of genuine hurt and jealousy.

I doubt there's much she can do at this point to redeem herself. She would pretty much have to humble herself and apologize to Carole and tell her the truth -- and Carole would always keep Aviva at arms length and she would have to accept Carole's condescending work relationship -- and that is NEVER gonna happen. I would be very surprised if Aviva is asked back for another season.

[shoegal]

Should Aviva said, "I am not well liked and I will spoil your trip." Or "I cannot horseback ride, rappel, river fish, take hikes, or get into a canoe as I have not adapted myself to those skills although many of my fellow amputees have been able to adapt to with training."

 

 

 

If either one of those was indeed the reason that Aviva did not want to attend, then yes, she should have said that.  Instead she said, I have 30% lung capacity and I should be in the hospital, woe is me, I really really really really really want to go, I should go, but I can't go, do you think I can go, I should go but I can't because here's a doctors note saying it will basically kill me, oh, and remember that time I had Legionairre's Disease??  The problem that the other ladies have with Aviva is that she's a dramatic phony, so yes, playing up the I'm on the brink of death with asthma but I really, really, really want to go just demonstrates that.  I would have much more respect if she would pull a Heather and say, I don't wanna go because I just don't like ya that much!

 

Instead, Aviva makes her not going on the trip the focus of the trip, because again, as Heather said so elegantly, she's just so fucking dramatic!

Edited July 25, 2014 by shoegal

[amarante]

The ladies can't break the fourth wall but the reason why they were pissed at Aviva for missing TWO trips is because that's what they are paid to do. None of the housewives particularly wants to go on these trips because unlike filming at their home base, they are being filmed 24/7 and it's arduous. 

 

These ladies are co-workers for the most part and not friends and I think most people would be pissed at hell if a co-worker were allowed to shirk the unpleasant work functions and for no good reason. And I think, whatever one thinks of Aviva and the rest, almost everyone agrees that there was no medical reason why Aviva couldn't go to Montana.

 

During filming, the ladies did not know that Aviva would be edited out of episodes completely as that decision came during post-production.

 

And let's cut the crap about the ladies actually "hosting", paying for and/or making any kinds of arrangements for the trips as they are completely a decision by BRAVO who decides which lady will be the hostess of the trip - in this case, for whatever reason, Kristen was chosen - probably process of elimination since Heather had already hosted the ladies at her place in the Adirondacks. Sometimes there is a logical reason for a trip - e.g. the trip to London last year was theoretically tied into Heather's business trip but in general, where they go is a product of how much production wants to spend - what kind of product placement deals they can get - and to a lesser extent whether a trip will make good television. Montana being a "fish out of water" scenario IMO as well as a relatively cheap vacation as I am quite sure the stay at the resort was free.

 

I have no idea why BRAVO decided the "fans" of RHNY wanted to see them "glamping" for three or more episodes rather than just provide us with the porn we love - houses, fabulous social events, clothing etc.

 

Bookgate was boring and dragged out WAY too long but at least it was about something genuine as I completely understand Carole's anger at Aviva's downplaying what Carole does and which is an important part of her identity. One can critique Carole's output but Carole is actually someone who supported herself through producing and writing and I don't begrudge her taking that very seriously. And without resurrecting the SAHM debate, Carole was absolutely correct (IN THE CONTEXT OF THE ARGUMENT) that Aviva had absolutely no knowledge of what it was like to actually try to make a living from writing.

 

I'm not sure if it has been settled but Carole did not inherit serious money (or any money from her husband's family). Lee Radziwill wasn't left particularly wealthy after her divorce from Radziwill and, as I recall, Jackie helped Lee out financially. While Carole is obviously affluent by most people's standards, she isn't particularly wealthy and certainly needs income sources. She bought her apartment years ago and so her housing expenses are minimal. I wouldn't be surprised if the house in Los Angeles was rented out and also acquired earlier for a relatively small amount. She got a good advance for the Widows book and now has two years of Bravo salary which is why, IMO, she decided to redecorate.

However, by NY standards, she isn't rich and doesn't really have a lot of expenditures - no children, no car, relatively cheap housing; relatively low entertainment expenses since most would be comped and/or paid for by others. In this, she is like Luann who isn't super-wealthy but also doesn't have to support an extravagant lifestyle.

[zoeysmom]

If either one of those was indeed the reason that Aviva did not want to attend, then yes, she should have said that.  Instead she said, I have 30% lung capacity and I should be in the hospital, woe is me, I really really really really really want to go, I should go, but I can't go, do you think I can go, I should go but I can't because here's a doctors note saying it will basically kill me, oh, and remember that time I had Legionairre's Disease??  The problem that the other ladies have with Aviva is that she's a dramatic phony, so yes, playing up the I'm on the brink of death with asthma but I really, really, really want to go just demonstrates that.  I would have much more respect if she would pull a Heather and say, I don't wanna go because I just don't like ya that much!

 

Instead, Aviva makes her not going on the trip the focus of the trip, because again, as Heather said so elegantly, she's just so fucking dramatic!

If she had said-I don't want to spoil your trip there would have been an outcry that Aviva was being a victim.  It puts the others in a bad place-we don't want to exclude Aviva-except when we do, Heather had already used the real excuse so I do believe that production insisted that Aviva run with a more controversial excuse.  Basically, Aviva is a production Ho, like Tamra from RHOC, she knows she is not well-liked so she might as well be controversial. 

 

They allow Aviva's drama by questioning her excuse.  Had Kristen simply said, "oh asthma-I hope you get better," they would have been short an episode.  I hope after this season's declining ratings they smarten up and get away from the who is going or not going on a party or trip.  I think they need more time with smaller groups of the women together.

[Mozelle]

I agree with your entire post and thank you for including Lola16's article on Aviva as I hadn't seen this earlier.

So odd that Aviva has zeroed in on Carole as her number one enemy when she was so enamored by her last season. I think she is lashing out against Carole because Carole is so selective about who she lets in her inner circle in real life and Aviva didn't make the cut. Heather did. Carole *tolerates* the other HWs in a condescending way, but no one but Heather has a real friendship with Carole and I think at one time Aviva thought she was building that with Carole and when she figured that out the ugly came out in her. She didn't want to be condescended to and she went crazy with vitriol when Carole wouldn't help her with publishing contacts for her book. She's been seeing red ever since. I agree that she's using some of it to exploit herself on the show and to secure her position, but I think it comes from a place of genuine hurt and jealousy.

I doubt there's much she can do at this point to redeem herself. She would pretty much have to humble herself and apologize to Carole and tell her the truth -- and Carole would always keep Aviva at arms length and she would have to accept Carole's condescending work relationship -- and that is NEVER gonna happen. I would be very surprised if Aviva is asked back for another season.

 

I don't think that's what happened. From the first blog of the season, both Carole and Heather talk about how they hadn't seen or talked to Aviva after last season filmed. Well, they saw each other for the reunion months later, but the intervening months between the wrap of filming and the filming of the reunion, plus the months between filming that reunion and when they started filming this current season last year, Carole, Heather, and Aviva were not on speaking terms. Yet, in spite of that Aviva did come to Carole to ask her about writing, and they'd talked about it. There wasn't any "Carole wouldn't help Aviva with contacts" situation. 

 

From the first and second blogs of this season:

 

Carole, 1st blog--

 

Unlike my friendship with Heather, which developed organically both on and off the show, I hadn’t heard from Aviva since we filmed the reunion over a year earlier. I’m not saying I was unhappy about that. Um, I’m kind of not that into her (there, I said it!). But it’s all good because apparently she felt the same way. When I sold my novel the week after the reunion, I got calls from everyone on the show (including LuAnn and we didn’t exactly end on the best terms), except Aviva. Not even a fake "congrats" text from her assistant. And although both Heather and I were very happy for Aviva when she got a book deal, and I offered all of my support, plus contacts, she never picked up the phone once, or sent a text. Nothing.  

 

Carole's 2nd blog--

 

Who Drew First Blood?

I know it's dramatic, but like an extra on Game of Thrones, Aviva told Heather that it was. . .I who drew first blood!

I did? Here's what happened, it's simple. Aviva asked me to vet a ghostwriter for her, a woman her publisher suggested. So I did. During our lunch at St. Bart's I asked her about it, during a long conversation we were having about writing. "Did you end up hiring the writer?" Those are the words that launched Bookgate. I had no idea she was going to lie to me and say she didn't use one. Had she been honest I would have supported her whole-heartedly, as I did when she signed her book deal, and that would have ended what was already an awkward scene.

 

Instead, she said she wrote the book herself. As she described it, it was fun, like "writing a long email." Ouch! No offense to long-emailers but writing a book is nothing like that.

 

As you can see in the scene from my blank stare, I was puzzled. She was lying and I could have said, right then, "That's not true. You went through two writers before you found one who would work with you. Your contract was close to being canceled. . .for failure to deliver." I could have run to everyone else on the show with gossip about her. I didn't. Instead, I said nothing.

 

Let's be clear: Me asking her about a ghostwriter (a woman she wanted to hire, who we had talked about) is not the same as her asking me. I am by profession a writer, she knows that, and she is not.

 

[Neurochick]

It amazes me when people that seem to have a great lifestyle like Aviva would rather become a celebrity and act this way on a reality show.  I can better understand a youngster who is hoping that with the fame comes money and they act that way. But she doesn't need the money.

 

I think for people like Aviva it's not about the money.  She doesn't need money, but what she wants and maybe needs is the fame, that people know who she is.  There are many people today for whom anonymity is the worst thing imaginable.  Many wealthy people don't crave celebrity, they like the idea of going out and nobody knows who they are, for some that's freedom; for Aviva freedom is being a "star."

Edited July 25, 2014 by Neurochick

[Trooper York]

I have to say I have empathy for Aviva. I think it is absolutely true that she should have just said "Hey I can't hike, repel, fish in freezing water, horseback ride and I could only do the Texas one step on the dance floor. So why ruin your trip when you all hate my guts and don't want to invite me to anything and I would just be back in the cabin sitting on the couch anyway. Maybe Kristen should have used her massive intellect to pick a better venue."

 

Aviva is just being a good soldier by making up an excuse that can lead to controversy and fits with her "character." Taking the Tamara route of being an even bigger bitch than she is in real life if that is possible. I bet she was guided to that by production. They do that kind of stuff all the time. 

 

On my show the set up was that I was alone in the store in one episode when customers came in and I was supposed to panic and mutter "I can't wait for my wife to come to handle this." Which is utter bullshit because I run the store all by myself all the time. So I refused to do it. But the producer cut it to make it seem that was what was going on. There were posts of TWOP from customers who had shopped in the store who called it out as bullshit. Production gets something in their head and they run with it. If you let them define you then that is what everyone sees. Some people revel in it like Carole's bullshit "Carrie Bradshaw" nonsense or Heather's Bossy Pants entrepreneur hip hop yo mama-ness. Aviva bought into it and brought the crazy big time. Nobody is as bad as they seem on TV or as good. The truth is somewhere in the middle.

[motorcitymom65]

I'm just asking for an example. On the subject of empathy, I see both Heather and Carole as people with a lot of empathy, and have even shown it, on the show and in their blogs. That's why I'm sure I'd remember it - it would be so out of character.

Bingo. No one on this show has shown more empathy for Aviva than have Carole and Heather as the matter of fact. They were so happy to have her join them in St Barth's. Did they want Reid there? Probably not, but if it meant having their friend there, they were all in. They were overjoyed that she was coming and gave her major props for overcoming her fears. Who wasn't empathetic? That would be the two nut jobs, Ramona and Sonja. They wanted Reid at a hotel, and if that couldn't be accomplished then they wanted to find a bed elsewhere.

I thought folks were too hard on Aviva over that whole deal, but then I liked Aviva and detested the White Trash gals. I thought Aviva went too far, and she was mean, but I got that she was hurt, and I always forgive folks for words said when they are truly hurt. I also thought she seemed truly remorseful at the reunion. I didn't walk into this season prepared to think so little of her, but then I was unprepared that she would decide to hurt and potentially humiliate Carole, who it seemed had been nothing but supportive and protective of Aviva. It was clear to me from the beginning that she was doing this all on purpose for a story line. I don't give a rats ass if these gals want to invent a story, but when they start hurting others in their quest for famewhoredom, they cross the line into Brandi/Tamra/Jill territory.

It is funny that so many are calling for empathy for Aviva. It seems to be the case that folks think her behavior is so off the charts that she must have a mental disorder of some sort that would require compassion or cutting her some slack. I will do this about the same time I cut Brandi and Tamra some slack for their equally horrendous behavior. It is possible that someone can truly just be this evil and/or starved for attention to the degree that they are willing to do anything to get it. They might possess a personality disorder of some sort, but that doesn't mean that I should be judged for not feeling sorry for them.

I also think that folks are forgetting the point of this all - folks who know her on this show claim she is a very different person when the cameras are not rolling. Ramona, who seems to be an advocate for Aviva, said as much in WWHL. She said that she stays in contact with Aviva, just had dinner with her the other night, and loves her. She also said that she is a lovely person when the cameras are not rolling, and that she cannot explain why she is so different when they are filming. Heather agreed, and said Aviva in general is a very nice person, but that she is willing to throw that all aside in order to ramp up her own storyline at the expense of others. This sounds like someone who is making a choice as to how they want to behave, not someone who is driven to extremes by a mental illness.

[ryebread]

Production gets something in their head and they run with it. If you let them define you then that is what everyone sees. Some people revel in it like Carole's bullshit "Carrie Bradshaw" nonsense or Heather's Bossy Pants entrepreneur hip hop yo mama-ness. Aviva bought into it and brought the crazy big time. Nobody is as bad as they seem on TV or as good. The truth is somewhere in the middle.

That's exactly it.  Nobody is as bad as they seem on TV or as good. That goes for every last one of them.     

I also think that folks are forgetting the point of this all - folks who know her on this show claim she is a very different person when the cameras are not rolling. Ramona, who seems to be an advocate for Aviva, said as much in WWHL. She said that she stays in contact with Aviva, just had dinner with her the other night, and loves her. She also said that she is a lovely person when the cameras are not rolling, and that she cannot explain why she is so different when they are filming. Heather agreed, and said Aviva in general is a very nice person, but that she is willing to throw that all aside in order to ramp up her own storyline at the expense of others. This sounds like someone who is making a choice as to how they want to behave, not someone who is driven to extremes by a mental illness.

I'm glad I'm not one of those folks.  I totally get that she is a phony and making the choice to play a role.  Although I think she's probably a little 'touched' due to her life circumstance, I don't think she's anywhere near as crazy IRL as she seems onscreen. As far as Aviva willing to ramp up her storyline at the expense of others, they all do it.  Just not as effectively in the WTF sense.  Which is what Bravo is looking for and what drives up the ratings.  To a point.  The leg toss drove the ratings this week but if we still had 8 more episodes to go, I'd be over Aviva as villain and Heather as Boss of Everyone.

[aradia22]

 

Should Aviva said, "I am not well liked and I will spoil your trip." Or "I cannot horseback ride, rappel, river fish, take hikes, or get into a canoe as I have not adapted myself to those skills although many of my fellow amputees have been able to adapt to with training."

I didn't even consider that. Yeah, that kind of does change the perspective on Aviva not being able to go to Montana. I wonder if she knew how active she would have to be. And even if she didn't, it's no fun to have to sit in the tent all day. 

[ryebread]

Even if she didn't have to sit in the tent all day, why would she want to take a trip when she knows every one hates her guts?  That'd be fun.

 

So I caught a little bit of Kristen and Josh's therapy scene last night. Josh even *sits* like an asshole.  I wanted to grab him by the shirt front, tell him to sit up straight, put his legs together and pay attention to the therapist and his wife.  He sat there like he was at a strip club waiting for a lap dance. 

Edited July 25, 2014 by ryebread

[Chit Chat]

Instead she said, I have 30% lung capacity and I should be in the hospital, woe is me, I really really really really really want to go, I should go, but I can't go, do you think I can go, I should go but I can't because here's a doctors note saying it will basically kill me, oh, and remember that time I had Legionairre's Disease??

With 30% lung capacity, I would've expected to see a much sicker individual.  As others have noted, it would've been a lot easier for her to decline the trip based on the activities, but I think that if she had gone, Ramona and Sonja would've opted out of the strenuous activities (we know they can't seem to appreciate nature in any form or fashion) and found things to do with her.  She wouldn't have had to sit in the cabin the entire time.   Maybe she came up with the asthma excuse so they wouldn't try to talk her into going, since she didn't want to go in the first place. 

[Grneyedldy]

I have to say I have empathy for Aviva. I think it is absolutely true that she should have just said "Hey I can't hike, repel, fish in freezing water, horseback ride and I could only do the Texas one step on the dance floor. So why ruin your trip when you all hate my guts and don't want to invite me to anything and I would just be back in the cabin sitting on the couch anyway. Maybe Kristen should have used her massive intellect to pick a better venue."

<snip>

I see no reason why Aviva couldn't do every one of those activity, if she wanted to. She has a leg for flats and a swimming leg. The only thing that might be tough is the rappelling, but you don't have to be an amputee to pass on that.

As was mentioned upthread and previously, this was a working trip and not a vacation. Did you ever have to travel on your show? I can understand why the other HW feel Aviva wasn't pulling her weight as a cast member.

Edited July 25, 2014 by Grneyedldy

[JakeyJokes]

The big question now is -- are they on the verge of firing Veevs?  Or are they possibly reconsidering?  Sure, she's a difficult employee who does her own thing & routinely refuses to go on the trips, which are a major part of the show.  But her leg-throwing shit kinda has saved the show, hasn't it?  Hmmmm.  That she wasn't on WWHL after the ep aired could be a sign she's toast -- or not.

 

 

This is my dilemma with Aviva. On the one hand, she offered one of the only two water-cooler moments this season has had (the other being Ramona throwing the wine glass at Kristen). And yes, the leg throw was CLEARLY planned by her and possibly production, and Heather very succinctly backed that up with evidence on WWHL -- and I'm pretty sure Sonja was in on it too, judging by the way she was acting throughout the whole thing. (I'm with the girls in not understand the Sonja/Aviva friendship at all, other than Sonja seems to be the kind of person who is your new best friend as long as you kiss her ass enough)

 

But unlike other women who have had similar outbursts on RH shows -- Teresa Giudice flipping the table over, Tamra Barney throwing wine -- Aviva isn't entertaining television. She made me laugh once this season when she said "Ramona, you're such a MEDDLER" at the spa, but other than that, her vibe is full of negative energy. The women dislike her to a point that they are visibly uncomfortable and nervous around her, and as we witnessed when Heather tried to sit her down, she is impossible to confront.

 

She gave us the moment and we can all give her a hand (or leg) for it, but this was supposed to be her redemption season (a la Camille Grammer), and instead she proved to be the worst thing you can be on a reality TV show: A Boring Villain.

[LotusFlower]

I think for people like Aviva it's not about the money.  She doesn't need money, but what she wants and maybe needs is the fame, that people know who she is.  There are many people today for whom anonymity is the worst thing imaginable.  Many wealthy people don't crave celebrity, they like the idea of going out and nobody knows who they are, for some that's freedom; for Aviva freedom is being a "star."

Yes. See: Adrienne Maloof. She had everything a girl could want. Except fame.

[Nanny pants]

I just finished reading Aviva's blog. Ahem...she's no lawyer. She may have a law degree, but she's obviously never worked as one. Aviva gives herself away by the inept way in which she argues. Real lawyers don't grandstand and argue curcuitously. And then...dead give away...she quotes "res ipsa loquitur". This is a phrase all first semester law students learn and recite to one another when they get excited about being in law school. It gets old (and embarrassing) real quick.

As with everything else, Aviva has no depth, no experience; she's just a poser. Any practicing lawyer would simply roll his/her eyes at her.

[motorcitymom65]

I am sure these gals watch the other HW shows to try and ascertain what storylines/behavior makes for a successful season. They would all probably like to be declared Prom Queen on the reunion stage and bask in the glow of knowing they had a good portion of the fans behind them. 

 

I think that Aviva watched the masterful performance that was Brandi Glanville in S3. I detest her, but you have to give it to the gal that she brought it and the fans for the most part ate it all up. I think that Aviva thought she could win the same game: do something terrible to another HW, but find a way to make it not be about the terrible thing that you did, but about the angry reaction from those you had wronged. Brandi was able to do this horrible thing, but it quickly became about the angry reaction from Paul and Adrienne first. Then Mauricio, who was once the only thing some folks liked about Kyle, suddenly became a dick because he didn't have any sympathy for a predicament that Brandi herself was responsible for. Didn't he know she was a single mom? That she had no money? That she was cheated on? Where was his empathy for this girl? Same with Faye, who while being a bitch herself was also 100% correct in letting Brandi know she too was a bitch for doing the terrible thing, and then to Kyle who gets the blame for not stopping Faye from telling Brandi she is a bitch for doing the terrible thing. On and on it went. For. The. Whole. Fucking. Season. Even at the reunion, when we all finally knew Brandi had been lying all season about the lawsuit, folks didn't much care. Because it wasn't about what Brandi did, it was about how everyone else reacted to what she did that had somehow become important. 

 

I think that is what Aviva thought could happen here. She could accuse Carole of something, and the reaction would be such that Aviva could claim to be the victim. She tried it with the whole SAHM deal, but it didn't really stick because it was so easy to understand why Carole was angry. She tried it by acting like everyone was obsessed with her and whether or not she was/was not faking her illness.  She wanted folks to feel sorry for her. All Brandi had lost was a husband and everyone felt sorry for her. Aviva had lost a leg. Surely a leg trumps a husband any day?  At the end it didn't work out at all like maybe she wanted it too.  She won't be the winner of anything on the Reunion Stage.

[jinjer]

Harry says to Sonja that "They told me Luann was leaving alone in a cab and had been drinking, and that I should go with her, so I did."  Smacks of producer intervention.  That they all ended up at the same club dancing is only more evidence of how Sonja's whole storyline was fake, except her breakdown in the Hamptons.

 

I like making fun of Carole's face because IMO she did some weird shit between filming and the filming of her talking head.  If she's messing with her face, then it is fair game. Maybe she got Jill Z's liquid face lift, but she looks like shit.  ITA that her neck in the purse shopping scene is scary looking, and her ass in the nightgown in Montana looked saggy - so not so great.  I think Carole equates skinny with great looking, but she has overdone it.

 

Heather's nose is big, but I like it, and I do wonder if it is smaller than last season.  Her tummy seems bigger than in Montana.  She admitted on Twitter that she didn't like the way she looked on camera last season and did some major working out, and she really looked in shape in Montana.  I don't know what happened by Birdland, either some eating or the dress was just not flattering or Yummy Tummy doesn't work.

 

I think Heather is showing her ass this season.  I thought Carole was an ass last season.  I love the new women - they all have enough flaws.  Even their "We're too cool for a reality show" is a flaw because, hello they are on a reality show and they are dicks.  I think Aviva should stay as a friend of.  No more George.  

Edited July 25, 2014 by jinjer

[Trooper York]

It is easy for us to say that she can do this or that. I think it is possible she has some physical limitations. Maybe that kind of physical activity would be physically painful. There is big difference between standing in a spa pool and fly fishing in strong current. As I recall Heather was swept off of her feet. I don't know the limits of her physical capacity. I am willing to give people the benefit of the doubt.

 

Suppose Aviva organized the trip and she had activities like speaking in complete sentences and spelling bees? Kristen would be perfectly justified in sitting it out.

[LotusFlower]

I am sure these gals watch the other HW shows to try and ascertain what storylines/behavior makes for a successful season. They would all probably like to be declared Prom Queen on the reunion stage and bask in the glow of knowing they had a good portion of the fans behind them.

I think that Aviva watched the masterful performance that was Brandi Glanville in S3........I think that is what Aviva thought could happen here. She could accuse Carole of something, and the reaction would be such that Aviva could claim to be the victim. She tried it with the whole SAHM deal, but it didn't really stick because it was so easy to understand why Carole was angry. She tried it by acting like everyone was obsessed with her and whether or not she was/was not faking her illness. She wanted folks to feel sorry for her. All Brandi had lost was a husband and everyone felt sorry for her. Aviva had lost a leg. Surely a leg trumps a husband any day? At the end it didn't work out at all like maybe she wanted it too. She won't be the winner of anything on the Reunion Stage.

I agree with this. It worked for Brandi not only because of the reasons you stated (her woe-is-me shtick that people fell for, single mom, etc.), but also because she was a fan favorite from her freshman season, and a lot of people liked her. Aviva is similar in her strategizing ways, but the complete opposite in every other way - she is completely unlikeable, and has no fans. She has also been pampered and coddled all her life, so I think she never considered that people wouldn't fall behind her and be on her side when she came up with this plan. Shades of Sonja-like delusion.

Edited July 25, 2014 by LotusFlower

[Rhetorica]

I just finished reading Aviva's blog. Ahem...she's no lawyer. She may have a law degree, but she's obviously never worked as one. Aviva gives herself away by the inept way in which she argues. Real lawyers don't grandstand and argue curcuitously. And then...dead give away...she quotes "res ipsa loquitur". This is a phrase all first semester law students learn and recite to one another when they get excited about being in law school. It gets old (and embarrassing) real quick.

As with everything else, Aviva has no depth, no experience; she's just a poser. Any practicing lawyer would simply roll his/her eyes at her.

Thanks for posting this. She must have heard a Latin phrase and put it to memory for future uses. One doesn't have to be a lawyer to know the term. Res ipsa loquitur was a term my college sophomore students learned for debate.

(note my upturned nose when using the word one)

[MatildaMoody]

 

I'm with the girls in not understand the Sonja/Aviva friendship at all, other than Sonja seems to be the kind of person who is your new best friend as long as you kiss her ass enough

I think that the real reason for the Sonja/Aviva friendship is that Aviva is the only one who has not talked/gossiped about Sonja's financial situation. Sonja is obviously embarrassed about her situation even though she is putting her own delusional spin on it. She was livid with Luann and Ramona - her two closest friends/allies on the show, when they not only brought it to the fore, but made jokes about her financial situation. 

 

Aviva is the only one who has not done that. She hasn't participated in the gossip about that one thing - she may have listened, but she didn't comment, or at least not negatively. That is what Sonja looks for in a friend. She wants someone to help feed her delusional version of reality. Aviva is the perfect person for that.

[Lola16]

Supposedly Sonja's daughter is friends with Aviva & Harry's son.

[sasha206]

Sonja still makes me giggle as delusional as she is.  The comments whether the xray was of her lungs of her boob job was primo.

[Mrs peel]

I don't have any empathy or sympathy for Aviva. She had a horrible thing happen to her as a child. But she had a cushion of wealth to weather that (great health care probably, her parents bought a place with privacy in Jamaica so she could wear a bathing suit in privacy?!?). She had the money to fly to London to be fitted with what has to be a very expensive prosthetic leg. Heck, she has at least 3 of them! And she has money enough to avoid lots of annoying things many people need to deal with.0, and money for therapy if she still needs to deal with the ramifications of a horrible childhood accident. She doesn't get a lifetime pass because she lost her leg.

I think the other women are suspicious of her "issues" because (as others have said), they come and go. I don't know anyone with a true phobia who just "got over it". And I don't really like Carole but she is right that the rich have access to doctors who will prescribe whatever they want. I have both asthma and pneumonia - they look very different. Asthma is diagnosed by self-reported symptoms and a lung capacity test. Maybe Aviva really had/has asthma, but she could fake those tests. And in light of her many changing illnesses, I'm not shocked the other women questioned her (now, I'm not sure I would have gone to the degree some of them did , but...)

And Aviva, you may be able to spell res ispa loquitor, but you failed on the definition. I'd be more appalled at her as a another attorney except just today my manager (also an attorney) blew the "me" v "I" grammar check. And a co-worker, another attorney, referred to something as "very unique." Jeez, I'm not a grammar hound, but those were bad!

I was annoyed at Sonja "hosting" a party until I remembered RW always have an end of season party. Horrible, not surprisingly self-involved speech. Like others I don't think there was anything wrong with her ankle, but more than her "don't we have the budget for new towels", maybe she should spend some bucks to color her roots. She is not a natural blonde and the combo of brown and grey hair at least an inch long at the roots may indicate how bad the finances are. I don't recall her mentioning her colorist as part of the Sonja team?? Guess she wants actual cash rather than a guest spot on the show or a shout out on Sonja's blog.

Can someone find out what company is paying Sonja $10k+ for branding advice? There's a stock I would short.

Bravo - can't you spring for someone to run a spell and grammar check on the blogs? Only Carole manages to avoid mangling the English language.

[maggiemae]

Good grief, Aviva could have participated in the rodeo, dinners, or cheerleading, or canoe ride (in the Berkshires?) And not all of the cast participated in the repelling.

 

Actually it was a cruel joke to have the wheelchair waiting but Aviva decided to seek sympathy for her medical problems as her story this year - complete with dr note, xray and prosthesis.

 

Did she ever expect someone to seriously say "I'm sorry it was not asthma but actually relux - quite a hit with your leg to boot." How about being kinder, joining in as she can on the trips, or being a cheerleader for those that needed a little encouragement.

 

Oh, wait - the show doesn't want fun in a bunch of women getting together and not too much friction.

[sasha206]

I think that the real reason for the Sonja/Aviva friendship is that Aviva is the only one who has not talked/gossiped about Sonja's financial situation. Sonja is obviously embarrassed about her situation even though she is putting her own delusional spin on it. She was livid with Luann and Ramona - her two closest friends/allies on the show, when they not only brought it to the fore, but made jokes about her financial situation. 

 

Aviva is the only one who has not done that. She hasn't participated in the gossip about that one thing - she may have listened, but she didn't comment, or at least not negatively. That is what Sonja looks for in a friend. She wants someone to help feed her delusional version of reality. Aviva is the perfect person for that.

 

I just assumed it was the typical producer driven formula.  One year ago, Ramona and Sonja are in a bitter war with Aviva the next year they "surprisingly" align.  See Gretchen and Tamra.  What are the odds that the two women she called white trash are now her besties?  And if I recall Aviva pretty much told Sonja that thought it was sad to see her downfall -- like she was watching a trainwreck in motion essentially.  Out of all the housewives, she was pretty brutal to Sonja.  Sonja's reaction to Aviva was real and raw, I thought in contrast to her being upset by Harry (read: manufactured relationship). Maybe Aviva isn't dumping on Sonja this season, but she was brutal towards her last season.

Edited July 26, 2014 by sasha206

[MatildaMoody]

I just assumed it was the typical producer driven formula.  One year ago, Ramona and Sonja are in a bitter war with Aviva the next year they "surprisingly" align.  See Gretchen and Tamra.  What are the odds that the two women she called white trash are now her besties?  And if I recall Aviva pretty much told Sonja that thought it was sad to see her downfall -- like she was watching a trainwreck in motion essentially.  Out of all the housewives, she was pretty brutal to Sonja.  Sonja's reaction to Aviva was real and raw, I thought in contrast to her being upset by Harry (read: manufactured relationship). Maybe Aviva isn't dumping on Sonja this season, but she was brutal towards her last season.

That's exactly what I mean. To the rest of us, Aviva was unimaginably awful to most of her cast mates. B.ut, to Sonja, Aviva kissed up to her and had no problem with Sonja and Harry. 

Add that to Sonja having no one besides her interns and the cast to film with, besides the rest of the women. Aviva never brought up Sonja's financial problems directly. Aviva was just there to "listen" to Sonja and that seems to be all that Sonja really wants.Plus, Sonja wanted to use Harry as a part of her story line, and Aviva was the one who could and did keep all of Harry's secrets. 

Aviva and Sonja were the perfect delusional train wreck. Having the two of them rally together was the thing of two opportunistic women teaming up on a reality show, the likes of which we haven't seen since Ramona and Sonja became Ramonja!

[Trooper York]

I have a friend who lost a leg. He deals with a lot of pain. He doesn't talk about it or want your pity. But if he over does it he has a lot of pain. I don't know his pain. I am not a doctor and I don' t play one on TV like Carole.

So I am willing to cut Aviva some slack about not going to Outward Bound. After all this was just about the stupidest trip ever in any of the franchises. Right there with the bus sleepover in the parking lot on NJ and the around the world that Brandi took on Gerard Butler.